A Critique on Sonic Mania Plus
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- Опубліковано 5 чер 2024
- After all my criticisms with the original release of Sonic Mania, how well does the game fix these issues in 2018's Sonic Mania Plus?
I break down my points in these four main segments, timestamped for your convenience.
00:00 Introduction
04:11 Free Content Part 1 (Major Changes)
12:57 Free Content Part 2 (Minor Changes)
16:49 Paid Content Part 1 (Mighty and Ray)
26:44 Paid Content Part 2 (Encore Mode)
41:10 Conclusion
Twitter: / telekinesticman
Discord Group: / discord
Video Credits:
Images, music and video footage from:
Sonic Mania (2017) and Sonic Mania Plus (2018) - along with marketing material, Sonic Unleashed, Sonic 3 & Knuckles, Sonic 2 (Mobile), Super Mario World, Super Metroid, Sonic the Hedgehog 2 (Game Gear/Master System), Knuckles Chaotix, Sonic Heroes, SegaSonic the Hedgehog, Sonic Mania Adventures (online video series) and Sonic Art Assets (CD, 06)
Japanese Sonic font by StudioPEP on DeviantART - www.deviantart.com/pepverbsno...
Sonic 3 Colour Palette and Sonic 3 SFX by Steve (BalenaProductions)
Sonic 3&K Checkpoint by mrgrassman14
Speedrun footage by Xandre - • Sonic Mania Plus (PC) ...
Super Mighty mod footage from Hortinus - • ✪ True Super Mighty & ...
GIF from Sonic the Hedgeblog on Tumblr - www.sonicthehedgeblog.com/post...
Thanks to my brother Keid for letting me use your camera, and Steve for your help with the thumbnail. - Ігри
I agree with ya on the Encore palettes. Whoever was in charge with those palettes must’ve *really* had a thing for brown and dark green.
HOW DARE YOU SAY THAT
SHUT UP SHUT SHUT UP AND SHUT SHUT UP SHUT SHUT
WRONG
FALSE
INCORRECT
Tails being afraid of the lighting at 7:38 is such a nice touch. It would have been even better if he would jump and hug Sonic like in the anime movie.
Just watched the full OVA recently, with the original Japanese dubs and English subtitles. I enjoyed it quite a lot, more than I expected really. Some things don't get as much explaining or proper exposition as they could've, but you can still understand what's going on pretty well.
The animation is just charming, the scenery is quite beautiful as well, everything is pretty cheesy and stuff but hey.
In the end, though, there were some things I found quite interesting, like the setting for Freedom Planet in itself, the way it explained the Land of the Sky's floating islands was quite clever, the Land of Darkness being not so ruined as you'd expect (apart from the amount of Badniks and traps), alongside with the ruined cities sinking in the ocean was interesting to think about, and I can't help but think about these Warp Points, since the games didn't have any, apart from the Giant Rings and the Warp Points from the Hidden Palace and Sky Sanctuary, which are an entirely different thing. But then, a bit later, I saw an image of a sketch of an island, West Island, from the development of Sonic 2. That sketch had names of many cut Zones, like "Olympus", "Blue Ocean Zone", "Rock World Zone" and, guess what, "Warp Point Zone"! Could it be that it was an obscure reference to that?
All I saw was water. Is this the wrong timestamp..?
@@mr.incognitoyt2235 Go back a little bit
14:33 This one change fixes one of my biggest problems with the last stage, which was that I always would die in the boss fights because of the lack of time. This has made me finally go back to beat the last stage.
i feel if mighty had a coloured shell for super mighty, it should be a golden shell
That's actually a pretty cool idea, I would have liked that a lot more.
0/10 no Spongebob
Uh yeah but Sally was in it soooo
Balenaproductions gwhehgrghp nevvcecdrdddsYUjpplppppplp
@@dajjaahsmith7781 are you actually okay? do you need help?
Balenaproductions lmao
Dang he has a point.
Nah, I had an issue with Ray sprite too when I first played the game.... I hope they scale him down in the eventual Sonic Mania 2 Episode 1.
Ha
Please don't go there....... We all want to forget sonic 4 exists.
@@mr_indie_fan 3 Years Later
Don't worry they somehow screwed it up with the classics.
Mania 2?! Ooooohhh about that...
It still pisses me off SEGA seems to intentionally be too scared to try new concepts that are actually cool. Ray and Mighty not being given actual super forms pisses me off. Make Mighty a golden form or turn Ray purple. It would be so cool.
Yeah, I personally don’t think Encore Mode is canon, it’s just an extra side story, Mania Adventures are definitely canon. Also, I think the reason why Angel Island is in the ocean is because the power of the Phantom Ruby being activated on Angel Island discharged the power of the Master Emerald, causing it to fall back into the ocean.
That could be the case, but the fact that all of that stuff isn't explained clearly in-game is where my issue lies. The Classic games where always very clear, you couldn't really get confused with how simple the plots were, but Mania feels like it turns a simple narrative into a confusing one simply through poor conveyance.
@@telekinesticman
Whether Sonic Mania Plus [Encore Mode] or Sonic Mania Adventures is canon actually doesn't really matter. Aaron Webber confirmed in a live steam that took place before both Plus and Ep. 5 came out that you can just pick the one you prefer.
I was expecting/preferred for Mania Adventures to serve as a prelude to Encore Mode. . .but I guess having two scenarios on what happens after Classic Sonic's return from the events of Forces for fans to pick from is kinda cool.
@@johnr.deluca4258 its more easily explained by mania adventures and idw being the canon to forces and not the main classic or modern sonics. so encore mode immediately happens after mania w no forces in between.
You are an excellent youtuber. I really hope this gets more attention than your last Mania vid.
Thank you so much! I hope so too.
7:01 this one was so close to being good. Considering the boss is a dude who uses a bike why not use it in the transition where sonic takes the bike and uses the ramps in the areana to try and make a jump towards metallic madness. That would make more sense than what’s going on here
My quick little take: The thing that makes Mania so awesome overall is its level design. Every level is massive, has a great flow, makes great use of the characters’ abilities and doesn’t arbitrarily halt you or hinder your pacing. Mania’s level design is so great and consistent it makes the whole game outshine 3&K. Say what you will about 3&K being original, some of its levels had major design issues (Marble Garden, Sandopolis, Flying Battery) that Mania either lacks or don’t have as presently.
When I was young, I never got past Carnival Night, due to a lack of time and a faulty save feature. Heck, I never actually got to play the 1st Act, I just reached it! That being said, I have a big gripe with Marble Garden. I like the Slope Rollers, and the Spinning Tops are ok, if a bit finicky. But the amount of spike traps in this Zone is just too much! Not so much in the amount of them, but in their placement! Regular spike traps, surprise motherf*cker spike traps, fake spike traps that have bullets coming from their sides, bubble spiked badniks, those stupid, goddamn morningstars, I hate those things! They're just right in front of you after a speed section! Why?! Why would they do that?! WHAT WERE THEY THINKING?!
sandopolis is my guilty pleasure
Since I got Plus day of release, I didn't realize at first that a lot of the changes in this update weren't limited to the Plus DLC. I didn't realize the base game had updated quite a bit, and that we only got what we got with the DLC.
I have a theory that the Phantom Ruby is another universe's version of the Master Emerald, and it warps to avoid being used (it clearly has an intelligence to it). Its alien version of Chaos Energy disrupts the Chaos Energy that keeps Angel Island afloat, but not to the same degree, causing it to float down rather than crash down (thus explaining why Eggman beat Sonic to the punch - He'd notice minor fluctuations in altitude far before Sonic would. Meanwhile a crash... Is pretty obvious)
This also explains how at Egg Reverie, it is able to disable the Super Mode after the fight ends. It's now free from Heavy King and Eggman both trying to use it for powering themselves/their machines, so it was able to recharge itself rapidly - possibly even converting energy from the Chaos Emeralds - and flee again to avoid being used, accidentally dragging Classic with it
If I am right on this, however, then they could have REALLY told that better in an opening cinematic. Perhaps show what looks like an end game fight between a Rust Coloured Super Sonic and an Eggman with a full head of hair or something. Sonic's super form ends and we see odd looking versions of the emeralds zoom to Eggman, extract the Ruby from his grasp, and zap it, making it blink to full colour then warp away, leaving the alt. Sonic confused
And then cut to us seeing the odd effect cover Angel Island and the island starting to slowly lower
Half assed and thought of this intro on the spot but it at least is a sight better than how they showed the narrative
Nice theory, but there is _absolutely_ no indication of that being the case. From what I understand, the comics (or some other source, I know I read it somewhere) say that it's some kind of gem made to interfere with the powers of the Chaos and Master Emeralds. You should look into it more yourself, since I'm not entirely certain/clear on it.
i like your headcanon
26:35 I feel the same, but I want her to play similar to sonic advance 1, or at the very least, a tweaked sonic advance 1. Like she can’t speed dash, but she can super peel out and roll in a ball when she is on the ground, but can’t jump in a ball, and has to use her hammer.
really old video but something I keep thinking about mighty that would've been super cool is if his stomp attack functioned the same for flat surfaces, but very steep sloped surfaces you could maintain your momentum from the attack, unfortunatley it feels kind of jarring when I try to do that on surfaces that are 90° and you just stomp the ground, maybe it would've been broken but I definetley not as broken as ray for sure
I want a 3d sonic mania with new levels, I personally want utopia to be that just with entirely new levels and all 5 playable characters.... a man can dream, great review my guy. You and some call me Johnny are my favorite sonic tubers. Keep up the good work.
For Sonic 3 & Knuckles, the 4:3 aspect ratio doesn't bother me in the slightest, but the lowered framerate, due to hardware limitations feels bad at times. It's one of the few things holding it truly back, when compared to modern 2D games that have no problems running at a steady 60 FPS at all times. If a remaster for S3&K is ever done, even the mere upgrade to a solid 60 FPS would be an instant purchase for me, with nothing else changed to it.
Did you never consider spin dashing into metal sonic Kai? A lot easier when you do that, and feels more satisfying that you had to think a bit more to get it
Yeah don't really know why I never did that too much. Definitely works well for the Drop Dash but if you're playing as anyone else it's a little tricky.
It's counterintuitive. Spin dash requires stopping, but giant Metal Sonic creating bottomless pit behind him is not something that motivates to stop.
@@Gnidel I never had problems spin dashing with the boss I was able to time it perfectly so never got just by the hands
I realised that might work while watching this review, and I'll try it next time I play this boss. I think Death Egg Robot muscle memory kicked in and jumping to hit the weak spot just felt natural even though I kept bouncing to the left and dying.
I ended up cheesing the boss by accidentally getting Tails to hit it multiple times for me.
good video, keep it up. really wish i had more to say
2 YEARS LATE SQUAD WHERE YOU AT?!!!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
Looking back they could have reworked the original final phase for metal sonic by having eggman bring back his giant death lazer, where it insta kills. He could slow down & laugh everytime you get hit by metal sonic as a nice way to balance the insta kill lazer.
I agree with you on most things but somethings I wanted to see is the mania team bring back mighty’s old wall jump, along with another reference to sonic 3 & k for stardust speedway. Where the transition could be eggman throws a small bomb at the gang at the end of SS act 2 to make them blast off into hydrocity. Theres more but those were the main 2 I was hoping.
Honestly,
Angel Island is the only normal looking level in encore mode
It's not that hard to understand the spider boss. It's intangible after you knock it around until it starts climbing again. Hit Robotnik's capsule specifically into the spikes (meaning, bump into him after he's high enough to be knocked into those).
Good review ^^ But I really don't agree that the game was "rushed" I mean, it got a pretty big delay and got a pretty big update/DLC months later. So they had a good amount of time, heck I'm pretty sure SEGA gave them more dev time then they did the devs who worked on the Genesis games. I think the real issue was low budget/really small dev team. I think they probably should have had more devs working on the game and a bigger budget. And I think we will get that in a Mania 2 ^^
I agree in a way, but every single Sonic game off the top of my head has been rushed. Or at the very least, its *felt* rushed. I think that's more my point. I definitely agree that a bigger budget could have helped, which is what I really hope happens with Mania 2.
@@telekinesticman Yeah, btw your pretty good at this youtube thing ^^ Keep it up and in a few years, you'll be pretty big ^^
@Rangez That's fair, but I'm curious as to what games you think weren't rushed at all? Or didn't feature any elements that were clearly cut down and half-baked, with lots of missing content left behind somewhere, somehow? Every main-line Sonic game (from the top of my head) has had extremely strict deadlines due to SEGA's insistence on the Sonic games being annual releases, often for the holidays. Ever since Sonic 1 these games have been made really quickly - it's a miracle that Sonic 3&K turned out the way it did considering the INTENSE crunch periods the development team suffered through.
One thing I wish we could have is play as Mighty and Ray. They just seemed like good buddies, even before the Sonic Mania Adventures mini episodes.
(Also I'll watch the rest of the video, but after work, because you know... responsibilities.)
Good video, but watching it in a post-Superstars world is crazy. Mania 2 was basically just a given, and for a damn good reason. The idea that the dream team split up and we got Sonic Superstars and Penny's Big Breakaway instead of an all-new-zones Mania 2... this truly is the bad timeline, isn't it...
I’ve always wondered why mightys ground pound doesn’t keep his downwards momentum on slopes
Time limits are a staple that need to stick around (you can have your no time limit option but The defaulf should be ON)
I'm interested as to why you think that. I don't really see the need for them, they feel like arbitrary limits on how much you can enjoy exploring these environments. As long as the option is there then I'm happy enough, but I don't feel the need for them to exist at all in the first place.
Would have been worth the money if Encore had exclusive new bosses
Also on your point about adding new gimmicks to the special stages, maybe they should have added an electric shield that has a timer on it
My only issue with Encore mode getting exclusive content is that I'd rather be playing Mania mode in the first place, so if Encore has a better stage or boss, then I have to sit through a worse version in Mania mode. I kind of mention that in the video but my wording isn't too good - I use the new Act 1 of Mirage Saloon as an example.
Nah, blud thought we were getting a mania 2
Hey. I was wondering if you'd tried out Sonic 3 A.I.R.? I'd be interested in your thoughts. Perhaps a video in the future?
Yeah, I love Sonic 3 AIR! Easily now the best way to play the game. I think it came out a little after this video, but every other time I mention Sonic 3, I use widescreen footage from AIR instead of the original 4:3 version.
Sad to know that it looks like we won't have a sequel to this game
Superstars technically
@@MSPTV_Official Yeah... even if it's not the best sequel
Just as i finish watching this there's a new Mania Adventures episode what the hell
I’m the stardust speedway metal sonic fight, I learned that you could spin dash to hit metal sonic, it makes that boss waaayyyy more convenient
35:39 I don’t know if you know this or not, but Metallic Madness’ encore palette is actually the bad future palette from sonic cd, just like stardust speedway!
I wonder what your preferred moveset for Amy is in 2d Sonic. Anything official or fanmade
43:50 Tuns out the movie was actually pretty good.
The reason why Angel island is in the ocean is because the phantom ruby caused it and when impacted into the island if you read the online Manuel. Also eggman goal is to get the emerald's and use them for his giant eggman robot and brun the world to ground rebuild on top of it in his own image that's where eggman land comes in and he was going to use the ruby to go to other dimensions and conquer it as well. Btw the animated shorts aren't canon.
3:48.
Tbh I prefer the blue color for Classic Sonic’s sprite in Mania Plus, the color blue fromm the mod for Classic Sonic has a bit more purple tilt to it which I’m not a fan of.
spiders aren't bugs you goofball
25:45 no I thought ray looked a little big when I played too. He really should have been smaller. his height is the same as Sonics...
Oh, you love the sunset in green hill?
Well have I got treat for you! See, there's this level which Sega wants you to forget called...*Ahem* SUNSET HILL. Y'know, from games on the advance Sega also REALLY wants you to forget about! 'Oh, Sonic in 2D? YOU MUST MEAN Classic RIghT?! Advance or Rush doesn't exist anymore.'
But then again, neither does the master emerald, Shadow's and Knuckle's chill personality, physics when grinding or just in general really, the Babylon Rouge's or basic integrity... I could go on.
*Rogues. Rouge is a bat.
@Wynn Wilson He spelled Rogue as Rouge, which are two different words with meanings/usage relevant to Sonic. "Rouge" is French for red and is the name of a bat character, while "Rogue" is part of the title of the Babylon Rogues and generally refers to sneaky, dishonest people or someone who broke away from their group.
@Wynn Wilson Not a problem, it's a common mistake. Feel free to blame the French.
20:33 Best part
25:15 Ray is definitely not the shortest character in Sonic Mania Adventures, Tails is. I always kind of liked the fact that, although being so mellow, he isn’t the shortest. His sprite definitely does look way too big though (which is something I very quickly noticed on my first playthrough of Plus). Even though he’s as tall as Knuckles (which already feels off to me), his rounded design occupies much more space on-screen, especially compared to Mighty. It makes him look huge - I’d definitely make him smaller.
I hope you give Sonic Superstars a try when it comes out, and that you enjoy it!!
ooooh my computer is dumb and said this was 4 min before I clicked it
Sonic mania really was its own bubble dang
I personally like their vision of what they were trying to do. We probably didn't get to dee whst sll they wanted to do because games always get rushed out the door before they're usually finished. People wonder why games are buggy it's because the game was never actually finished. So we get patches and updates. Why charge full prices if ganes aren't even done? Sonic Mania Plus was pretty much a batch of dlc. Unfortunately your complaints will stay just that because it's been years and Sega isn't going to spend time on older games when they're moving on to others. I do agree with a lot of whst you said, they did a good job wirh little details, maybe they need to create a new world for Sonic spin fast in..
maybe Encore Mode takes place after Mania Adventures
I liked Mania more than Sonic 3. Which is probably because for me Sonic 3 isn't shrouded by Nostalgia. Sonic 2 was my favourite from the classic trilogy and the first Mega Drive game I owned. But still I consider Mania to be the superior game.
It takes everything the previous three, and Sonic CD did and improved upon it. With the excellent modern pixel art and animation, colours and effects just being icing on the cake. Of course that's just my opinion.
Regardless of personal preferences or which one you played first. If you enjoyed one, you'll enjoy them all.
I like the video but your critiques for the cutscenes especially the little planet and metallic madness cutscenes aren’t that good in my opinion. Like do we need a dragged out cutscene on how sonic went to metallic madness or titanic monarch? No we don’t, the cutscenes are fine the way they are.
12:34
Hol' up, Why is the master emerald purple and not green?🤨
No idea, maybe its encore mode that makes it purple.
Yeah, Rays height is weird. Mighty is also too short, but his sprite is based off Chaotix which is an edit of Sonics sprite, so it's not surprising.
In terms of scaling, Mighty should be around Knuckles' height, and Ray should be taller than Tails, but shorter than the rest.
Their color choices are also odd, but every characters palette is weird.
27:41 :
Both aren’t cannon I think and I didn’t make that up I’m pretty sure both aren’t cannon
Well now I can't unsee giant Ray and I hate it. Thanks.
I know I'm one day late but I'll do it anyway May The Fourth (Fifth) Be With You everyone! 9:15p.m. 5/5/2022
*NEXT PROBLEM...*
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Sonic needs to be put to bed for a awhile. I think there is an oversaturation of Sonic games. Like we never get a break and at times it just feels like the same thing. Sonic Mania was a nice refreshment of the series. But it took years to get a 2D Sonic like the Genesis days. I think Sonic needs new ideas, new enemies and bosses. Add some combat we haven't seen bring back some of the Master System mechanics. But bake Sonic in the oven for as long as it takes, look at Mario Wonder. It was fun as hell and it was awesome.
Id rather have had some different levels, collision chaos and mystic caves etc
surprised comments aren’t jumping down your throat for saying Mighty started in Chaotix
I kinda wish classic amy was in this game
Super Sonic = Yellow
High Tails = Sky Blue
Buster Knuckles = Green
All Mighty = Cyan + White
...Laser Ray? Purple? I dunno.
Why does sonic look like that in gameplay how do i get that is it a mod
Did you watch the part at 3:40?
@@telekinesticman i did but it didnt explain how to get it i havent found even a mod i thought it was a new feature in the game, also love the video
@@abdulazizalabdulkareem1380 the specific colour palette mod I'm using is from my friend Steve (BalenaProductions) but I think he may have taken it down after people were harassing him over simply wanting Sonic to be a darker shade of blue.
no playable amy no sale
Hopefully we'll see her playable in some kind of sequel!
mania plus isn't tied in with mania adventures.
38:36 I disagree. Bonus stages is supposed to be fun... this is annoying.
9:14p.m. 5/5/2022
I just thought he was fine, but now that you've poited it out Ray looks too fcking big! :o
I never actually beat the last special stage legitimately... I found out if I just press W (I play on PC) I automatically go up to the next level of speed.
25:40 you are not insane! They should have spent more time with Ray
you are insane
Why Is Knuckles And Sonic Pallete Changed?
I mentioned at the start of the video that I'm using a Sonic 3 Palette mod because I don't like Sonic's default shade of blue, and prefer the darker tones from the original games.
@@telekinesticman Oh
BIGGEST PROBLEM: TOO SHORT...
If my memory is correct, then this game is leagues better than Sonic 3 and Knuckles
Your memory is not correct. Mania is overhyped.
@@bluecorp8557 I played it a while back, I think it is better as a game. Sonic 3 suffers from having annoying gimmicky super long levels. And yet, despite my issues with Sonic 3, I still find it very fun and replayable.
the color pallet hate for sonic and knuckles is something i don’t understand whatsoever. i like their pallets better
How is it "hate"? Not every point of constructive criticism is hateful.
it's just his preference
I'm a classic Sonic lover, but i'm disppointed with Sonic Mania. 4-minute bosses, 9-minute acts... "the player will land there, let's put a spike or an instant death". Huge levels with too much information on screen and little focus on speed. Also, storyline is pretty bad with the "teleport" argument already seen in Generations. Graphics is awesome, but overall i'm hugely disappointed...
Mighty and Ray are probably the most ugly throwaway bargain bin characters in the entirety of mainline Sonic.
Wow gay
Wow funny
Epic
6
Quit whining so much just cause you don't like it doesn't mean they have to change it or cater to you mate.
um???? do you know what "free will" means?
@@clemenchuu no
This isn't whining, it's constructive criticism. If you really enjoy something, you should be able to point out the flaws so that it could be made better.