The GameFi Cycle - Why all Play To Earn (P2E) games die
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- Опубліковано 2 чер 2024
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There are 4 main reasons that play-to-earn games usually follow a particular rise/fall cycle:
- The money isn't sustainable
- The games aren't fun
- Human psychology of varying incentives
- They may not need to be on a blockchain
What are your thoughts on this topic?
Scam alert: I will never contact you. Don't look up the tokens mentioned in the comments (they are scams). Be very skeptical in the comment section. Be safe
Would you like to fix the "Play to Win" typo around 2:30 ? 😀
And the bad cut take at 5:23?
What are your thoughts on Cornucopias?
Can you do a video on unicrypt?
literally every post in the comments section is a spam bot
Not die, but meta is change, new P2E game will take place
We are already in the big crash, Inflation is a catastrophe. This CPI report is a colossal failure. To bring the housing market to a halt, the FED will have to pull all the stops. The unfortunate issue is that other markets are being decimated. If you want to stay green, you have to rely on a lot of diversification. Currently up 14% and being careful. Still a better deal than leaving it in a savings or checking account yielding 0-1 percent interest.
Inflation is gradually going to become part of us and due to that fact any money you keep in cash or in a low-interest account declines in value each year. Investing is the only way to make your money grow and unless you have an exceptionally high income, investing is the only way most people will ever have enough money to retire.
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This was an excellent video describing not just the problem with PTE but also the psychology behind how this functions.
Wow, you absolutely nailed so much of what I've been contemplating - and in such a concise way with excellent examples. Will definitely share this!
I think the way you're presenting Play2Earn is more the mindset of you play the game for no reason other than to solely earn tokens. I fully agree on this being a horrible business model and completely unsustainable because it's just flat out not fun.
But I do believe that there's different types of "Earning", as an example if you have a blockchain card game you don't earn tokens you earn the cards. The cards are then yours to trade and sell on a free market just like a real physical card game like Magic the Gathering. Card games are a perfect opportunity to create a successful P2E business for somebody because the Game Company can sell new packs and then also take a small percentage of the fee of trading/selling your card to another player.
I have to disagree with your stance on blockchain cosmetic items not being necessary and potentially being harmful to the games company over just selling the item in their own personal games store. If we use League of Legends as an example, LoL's had tons of skins that have gone away never to be acquired again. People have sought after these skins so much as to even purchase accounts for thousands of dollars that have the skin since they're not transferable. Imagine if that skin was a transferable NFT and someone purchased it for $2000~ 5 years after it released every single person involved in the transaction is happy because the seller made a tremendous amount of profit, the buyer got the skin he wanted on his own account and the games company could have taken 2.5% of the transaction and made an extra $50 off the sale on a virtual skin they sold years ago.
MMO's also have the perfect capabilities of being an extremely good use case for Blockchain tech because people want to purchase others gear.
Anyway good video and good discussion
Hey great comment 🙂
Special rare skins in League will be available on some special occasions, also the only but big difference is they build League, Dota, CSGO,... as fun first games, they focus on the fun and sustainable game environment, tournament, community,... to maintain the retention rate first. Meanwhile, I would say every gamefi projects is built around financial system, not the game itself, got your point tho.
Axie was actually fun, I did not earn anything in axie even though I was an early adaptor because I keep spending all my earnings on new axies to keep making new builds. The problem was that the p2e model kept interested players out and only lured players that are not really gamers.
Axie was fine, the problem is they didnt limit their SLP, and the manager just hire player to EXTRACT the SLP(its possible even with trash team) everyday the manager got full load of cash while the player dont, its ruin the economy and start the downfall of axie
Luckily i earn money from this and got my ROI at late 2021, i feel sorry for the late newcomer who get their money stuck
Absolutely agree , I was not an early adopter but seriously considered playing to grow my bag of Axies - I am not a gamer and would have been playing for return - SO glad I didn't as I would have been filled with regret.
This video is an absolute slapper. I work in Web3 gaming and P2E and you nailed all the issues I know we are up against. We're learning more every day about how to advertise in-game effectively, and the "fun to play" aspect is always a challenge, but your comments on varying incentive are a great point!
What gaming company do you work for?
@@steyn2g935 Puli Token
And all it takes is exploring what it means to be able to put data and compute on chain with BitcoinSV
I cannot over emphasize the importance of being an experienced trader to make good returns off the crypto space, else you'd join the group that call it a gamble.
Those that understand the market trends always seem to be a step ahead and apply adequate measures to stay secure no matter the situation.
There are way too many information out there, its hard to know which to get into that will be suitable for you.
Would appreciate any assistance to get started, thank you.
You can get in touch with, Emilia E Arias.
You can find her on the net.
Trying to earn some extra income and this comment came in handy.
Thanks 😊
I just searched and found her web blog and I've reached out hoping to get a response soon.
Like always, Super video, good contents and the analogies are top. The reasons you listed especially the 4th one is the one that I consider the most obvious. Keep it up. Thanks for making understanding things easier.
Glad to have you back uploading, been a while but great quality as always 🙏
I remember there was one dude on Reddit who played Stepn. After the Stepn coin crashed, he had to run 11 miles every day for a year just to break even lol
@Aaron Bennett 𝗪𝗵𝗮𝘁𝘀Ap±𝟭𝟳𝟬𝟳𝟯𝟬𝟵𝟬𝟲𝟬𝟭 no you send me first
Appreciate your thoughts on this subject. I'm intrigued by the Metaverse and blockchain-based games, but there are a lot of reasons I suspect they're bubbles. You raise excellent points for consideration.
Great video, considering I am working on a Play and Earn Game. The whole idea is to keep funds coming in from several sources. One key I am looking at is treating it as a pay as you go game. This will allow players to continue to play and earn and even potentially earn more as sponsors are added to the mix.
Totally agreed , I think the biggest issue is the second one , most Blockchain games are not real games but just financial terms. It's impossible to make every player earn but if the game is good enough some are willing to pay and have fun. I have friends make a living by playing WOW for years.
getting money to play is a bonus or an incentive
just by curiosity how do earn a living by playing wow ?
@@andrecarcausto2740 If your a pro gamer that's how
great points especially #4- games don't need blockchain-- this is also true for 90% of the crypto projects out there, that want to use a decentralized blockchain instead of a centralized database. They are trying to put a square peg in a round hole, or as you say; "cars on a submarine"
In times where close to every Crypto related channel is a scam (see BitBoy) this channel really stands out.
The investment model, is the way to go. Purchase assets that cash flow, as the game becomes popular you have ads and merit based earnings
I’m right
$CWAR. Imagine if you could qualify for a home loan from playing a game.. imagine credit card companies clambering for your usage as a member.. imagine in game sponsorships from companies that fit the players profile. Imagine that subscription model working now. 5.00 a month.. With the team bringing in the value to the players.
That was a first important step of you understanding "bitcoin only".
"Blockchain's" dont have any usecase except for money. All other ideas have bad incentives and aren't dezentralized.
The fortnite model is pretty good, especially the support a creator aspect
I had an NFT to something called ice poker. It was also play to earn. They had daily challenges that made the game tedious and not fun. Their token also kept lossing value after about 2 months. I told them that they need to have challenges that don't make the game boring, like win a hand 4 times. Instead of things like get a 3 of a kind 4 times. It also seemed to me that they rushed out to make the game instead of thinking everything thru. The game needs to be fun and developed not created as a play to earn these games seem like they were created backwards. Earing money should not be the priority, that should come secondary to the game actually being fun.
Yes but if you don't earn in the game then you might as well play a normal non-blockchain game.
Right..Decentral Games (DG) changed their model since then. There's p2p cash poker on-chain now, and also free play. Free play is the P2E part of the business (primarily a way to increase user acquisition). The other sources of revenue pay out the p2e players (e.g casino revenue, ad revenue, eth/polygon node revenue, secondary sales, etc...)
Counter strike skins are the perfect example of how blockchain can benefit the AAA studio, the skins can infinitely be sold in the secondary market and appreciate in value, and Valve collects a portion of every transaction in the process, making one skin a forever possible source of income.
Welcome back ser! Great video as usual. Opened my mind to a newer perspective regarding blockchain games when you mentioned how it does work but doesn't mean it has to be on there.
Totally agree.
My main logic was people play games for the sake of the game a.k.a it’s fun.
Not because they’re earning from it.
Great to see more content from you Theodore!
The only problem in your analogy is that without a wheel you can’t create a bearing which both submarines and cars utilize
I'm DCAing in AMZSB7 as well. ETH heavier DCA and ALGO. I'm taking your advice and starting Google tomorrow with a 50 dollar purchase and continuing Microsoft and Apple. VTI and VOO on another app and longterm portfolio. Here we go family!
Your channel is amazing 🚀
Hey bro, can you please make a detail video on Market cap,
fully diluted market cap.
volume. circulating supply.max supply.
fully diluted valuation.
please make a complete video explaining these topics.
love from India.
thanks so much for your hard work in showing and teaching us what we need to know about this play to earn games educating us more about Ponzi scheme. i really appreciate your assistance to help improve our finacial freedom and also I feel your overall "not needed - all P2E will die" approach is a bit premature as we haven't even fully built out our layer 1 blockchains, which will later create more powerful tooling for game devs. Way, way too early for this take
Insightful video. I also agree on ad revenue and only having a market place for players to trade among themselves, which is basically most other games that are not on the Blockchain
There's so much spammers on the comments though
I love your channel and how it simplifies complex concepts
Could you do a video explaining EVM?
Would really help.
I'm the lead blockchain engineer at Colonize Mars. Just want to say this video is spot on. Well done and thanks!
I hope you are considering "how" to overcome the obstacles mentioned in this video. I think there is a good use for blockchain in some games but it should support the "fun factor" primarily. The content of this video is exactly why I don't play NFT games.... because they are all dumb and boring right now. However, I play "New World" and people farm gold and sell it for real money. I believe this is where blockchain could help. People will always do such things and Devs get nothing out of it and they endlessly attempt to ban and stop the activity in futility. Devs can implement blockchain into their economy and allow players to sell their gold to each other for real cash (or crypto in this case). However, the problem with this, though Devs are rewarded in small transaction fees, is that the game can become a pay to win model and rewards players that have cash to throw away at the game. Regardless, I have wondered how an in-game economy that is an actual crypto coin would function. I suppose right now it is too tasking to implement such a concept. I also considered NFTs to be weapons and armor that players use instead of it being their actual avatar. Regardless, I hope you succeed in your implementation of play to earn concepts
@@MilVetGaming
Don't wonder. Most Steam games have such functionality. The CSGO skins market is rife with RMT
To the end user, there is no functional difference between a Blockchain hosted internally and a transaction database
How bout the counterpart, you should explain also on what the game needs to succeed in p2e environment
The argument about player motivation changing when the reward structure is shifted from playing to financial is so on point its scary. It would be difficult for a player used to financial reward from enjoying even a well designed play for fun game.
Great video! I'm wondering what the regulations are for apps to accept money from a user and then pay them monetary rewards back. Take StepN for example, could they payout money without using blockchain systems?
the adding wheels to phones analogy was a new perspective, it definitely makes a lot of sense, thanks for sharing your ideas
Wow, very nice breakdown. After watching this I have to go rethink a way in which it would make sense to build blockchain games. An aspect that further diminishes blockchain games is the existence of farming bots which also help ruin the earn aspect of them
Very good points you made. However, a lot of these games have transaction fees when users sell and buy these power ups or in game items. There's also ad revenue for some of them. There is also the spot/futures exchange aspect of their crypto. The key point I think you mentioned is these games must improve on the fun aspect. I consider the crypto play to earn as a concept that might actually work. Imagine playing WOW and everyweek we get some crypto rewarded on performance on our raid and key runs. We are just getting something extra introduce additional pro players to join the game that can make a living whilst playing at the same time.
That's a pretty great video to sum up all the problems with blockchain gaming. I would add your missing a revenue. Transactions with it's game token and the gaming developers collecting transaction fees. Gala Games own L1 network I can see catching these as an example. Also secondary market commission sales or fees.
The only thing that makes a currency demanded is its ability to purchase demanded goods/services. This has nothing.
The blockchain miners club is an NFT project with both utility and sustainability. They are building a new kind of P2E game… PLAY 2 MINE
Backed by over 146 real life Bitcoin miners, BMC is an innovative P2E game that will bring passive income for years…
CryptoKitties is probably a good example of a game that makes sense on the Blockchain, but I agree that a lot of other games are not really necessary there.
I've been saying it to friends for a year, only way a game can survive is if people are willing to pay2play so that the ones with expensive nft's can play2earn.
A country has no economy if everybody who works in that country sends their salary to other countries... People need to spend cash in your country!
Great video... best explanation yet. 👌 best part.. "blockchain sprinkled on to the game" nailed it..
Great breakdown as always. Thx!!!
You were spot on on everything, tks for such a well made video.
I believe there's room to upgrade the current P2E games so they become more sustainable and fun (eg: imagine a fun game, with advertisement and or subscription, where players can win some money back by being skillful and also by receiving part of the market tax received by the developer)
You see that could be considered an idealistic thinking my friend. Realistically speaking it's not like the game creating companies don't know this stuff, they just want to earn a crap-ton of money in a short amount of time which works with the basic non-P2E games do provide and even the P2E game devs might be short handed in the finance department. I think most of the investors are interested in an asset that cranks-up large sum of profits in a smaller time frame, but P2E does not do that so you can say that it is a bit difficult decision to make when you have to invest in upgrading the already moderately earing game and risk loosing some player base and I think they most of the time have their hands full with the crazy amount of hackings they might have to face. Just think of the normal non-P2E games, they get hacked so many times that it's not even funny now and we are talking about a game that can spill out a whole lot of money if played well enough. The existing games that are there in the market and have been for a long period of time , they can potentially introduce monitory systems in their games but they are not doing it instead the basic game play has started to become biased between the ones paying a lot of money and non paying players........ well that's all I can think of for the moment.....😅
@@vinayakdurgi7703 perfect, i agree with everything you said. There are so many engines, templates and resources today that most devs prefer to create quick/short lived cash grab games.
The only P2E game that has a good longetivity (i believe around 4 years) and is still alive is Splinterlands
Here's the thing....your content is on point when explaining what crypto is and how it works. This opinion piece is a massive deviation from that and I think you should stick to facts rather than opinions.
Counterpoint: much of what comprises crypto today has already been covered, so WBC is attempting to evolve the channel and remain relevant. You have been invited to share your ideas in the forum created by this video. Many people agree with the points made: if you don't, then why not state what is off base and teach the people something?
Runescape also is a p2e game. Any currency you make in the game, you can sell for cash.
So if runescape were to tokenize their gold and take money from all transactions, what would be the difference?
I have been watching alot of your videos and I am glad to see an in-dept review about the game. Hopefully you can also make a review about Monsta Infinite:Tapwar
Thanks for watching
Send a direct msg right away to the above WhatsApp number for more analysis and updates 👆👆.,
DFK is still in development. Hopefully, PvE and PvP will be fun when it arrives.
Very interesting video. The points discussed in the video are totally right. Very useful content!
I can't summarize it better. Really good video friend!
good points but we are still too early in blockchain defi games. a lot can still be formulated to make good defi games in the future with Play and earn aspect in it.
,,I,.
Brilliant analogy with the old man story!!
Making a good game is a very difficult job, even it’s a card game, Blizzard level background needed.
Long way from last video , nice work again
I think for crypto games to survive, they need to change their core concept. P2E is not good because you'll only attract people who only want cash.
It think it's best to change to a Play and Own concept because you actually own the stuff. And make a little money on the side.
So, the devs should focus on making the game fun and say you actually own the in-game items. Instead of getting a big payday.
But again, I may be wrong. I still believe in blockchain games and I like the concept of actually owning your stuff. I think the whole P2E industry needs to have shift in thinking in order for it to survive. Just my opinion though.
Totally, game shouldn’t be play 2 EARN, but instead PLAY and maybe earn. Having ownership of digital assets and real world values of these assets is totally revolutionary and I’m sure it will thrive, but only if it’s well implemented
@@jonathanayotte9736 Yes, that's the thought I wanted to get across. If only they implement the Play & Own concept well, then I think maybe blockchain games will thrive.
The only game that is TRULY p2e ready and the bible for all games aiming towards this is, Runescape. A game heading towards coming out as p2e will not attract gamers/casuals, it will have to be free and then figure out a road map of implementing all users to make money from it. People already hate Micros for whatever reason, so what makes you think coming out as p2e will be even better. Until then these big companies (non p2e/new p2e) are going to suck peoples money dry until it happens.
Nice, I am thinking in these terms when I’m developing my augmented reality geocaching RPG
Very well said, thats why i don't believe other content creators still promoting a p2e dead game, they are just sponsored or waiting for pump so they can safely tp out if they are invested in, you are very right that every game cant even sustain funds and always rely on "new players", for to succeed it should excite gamers not only by the earning, by how people enjoys playing it, play to earn is just "bonus" p2e is just a trend because of lockdown if people wants to earn it should be by trading crypto or stocks. more power and very well said.
I like your OLD MAN THEORY.. But for me cypto game is still the next generation game just gave it 10 or more years
While everyone is focused on BTC, ETH or any top alt coin and playing defensive they are missing on quality projects that are about to be launched on CEX. For example AMZSB7 will hit mainstream soon, 10x-20x quite possible even during this bear market but only few people know about this.
I already converted all my ETH to AMZSB7, now I feel like moving all my BTC to ADA as well.
Have you looked into Galaxy Fight club? I'm also looking at Impostors and what that eco system might look like
Excellent content. In my case a real eye-opener, thank you!
Hi... I really appreciate your hard work and dedication and specially making things so easy to understand... Can you pls make a video on ICP....
Play-to-Earn probably not sustainable. Play-and-Earn or Play-and-Own is probably more so where the model is going.
However, I think the magic of web3 gaming will not come from financial incentives, but from the types of games that the blockchain can enable. Like Eternal games that last forever as long as the underlying blockchain exists. Games where all resources are player owned and tradeable. Modular games where players and developers can select maps, features, etc. they want to use without purchasing an entirely new game or DLC pack.
Blockchain in gaming quite literally gives the power to the players. Let me use a real-world example of why this matters. Imagine you and your friends just bought all this awesome paintball gear and go to your favorite spot to play a game. However they make some rule changes that don't let you use the gear you bought!
In the real world, you can quite literally pick up your toys and go play somewhere else. However the other places may be cost prohibitive or too far away to be feasible.
Similar things can happen in a game. Developer nerfs your characters/weapons or no longer supports your favorite maps, or whatever. With blockchain gaming, the items are yours, so someone could just build a new module that supports the gameplay you like and you can take your digital items and go play with that new module instead.
I'm sure there are more examples but that’s what I can think of without additional research.
Do a video about Brewlabs and their Treasury Model! It is connecting real world companies and crypto
This is amazing. Thank you. Can you do a video on unicrypt?
Great content, really enjoyed it.
Bravo! A very well produced video
Another great video. THANK YOU
Great video; clearly articulated points.
I must disagree with your points on why play 2 earn games don't need to be on the blockchain and the main reason is that it allows using a token made for that specific ecosystem which further allows controlling a finite supply, which in the end can help regulate the price in a more stable manner
I used to play nano quake but since they reduced the amount you earn per kill to a fraction of a coin, I lost interest. so yeah you are absolutely right.
I really like your point of view, thanks for the video.
Can all 4 of these models be combined in some way? I think a hybrid model would be cool to see implemented.
8:39 Wao I missed your videos but I like that you take your time all this I know I tell people but you explained it like a god! thanks I play outside the blockchain and earn money or crypto but learn everything your sharing as experiment on the blockchain and the conclusion is here in 12 minutes of quality.
Great video, thanks!
Truly love your candidness, I DCAed today again for BTC AMZSB7 and ETH
1 missing revenue stream missing from the VDO is IAP, in app purchase, for convenient or gacha. Some may call it pay to win but if you do gacha you know it's a pay for a chance to win. Gacha can be a fun way to earn money as long as the dev keep making more content for the game.
I kinda agree for the most part. They have to get the fun part right or people will just don't play. I want to add one more stone uphill tho, which is anti-crypto-NFT sentiment from the mainstream gamers. Crypto game has to be more than fun, but so fun they don't care there is an NFT in it. As an indie game dev, I really like NFT because it's a very cheap way to make a marketplace for in game items, simply because we don't have to. We don't have to make and maintain a marketplace. No security overhead. No transaction traffic overhead. Just add a smart contract and mint an NFT then let the player do their thing. Problem about that is one, the gas is bad. Two, NFT get a bad name from high price. We really have to make them not NFT, but game item that is happens to be an NFT. An NFT costs 40USD is just plain wrong in term of gaming. 40USD can buy a AA game, so why would they choose to buy an NFT unless the game that uses it is so fun they prefer it over that game. NFT should cost like 3USD tops, and that can only work in low gas chain. There are games that do that on BNB but they are not as fun as other games. So, they're on the right track, but there are more work to do.
Excellent video! You know that is well-thought content. Try searching for metarollers and explore their use case.
10:22 it's easy, you take a fee for every play sale and you still earn a lot
What if there was a "crypto pool" it generates 🤷🏾♂️ with a marketplace with a transaction fee in market and no fee for non 2ndary items might that work 🤷🏾♂️
Excellent video man :)
Enjoyed your video. I've recently been learning more about Blockchain games and play-to-earn. I find it P2E unsustainable, as you said.
Have you heard of a newer concept of play-to-rank Blockchain games?
You really nailed the problem. I thought a lot about this in the past and came up with similar points. Thanks for that!
However, I think the argument that P2E games do not need to go on an blockchain is pretty valid for all types of games, right?
You could put code in the NFT that if someone sells the in game item to another player in the in game marketplace the original owner being the game studio takes a cut from it. It still works. Also creating this in game marketplace and creating a used marketplace could entice more players to play the game and that in the end would make more money. Also limited edition items would work. There is a lot there that you never talked about that could make a game work extremely well on blockchain. Even I haven't said everything.
Kinda like how all Free to Play games end up failing because their supported by cash shop items.
The advertisement based play to earn model you propose is basically what all esports games are doing. The top players get to do tournaments where they can win money that was funded from advertising sponsorships.
Great video. What do you think about Legends of Bezogia? It represents the birth of Decentralized Gaming-as-a-Service (DGaaS), do you know anything about it?
You just said everything I couldn’t word right
It goes to show that blockchain technology, which is really a ledger, has no place for games! Ledgers are for accounting related purposes, not video games that can store its points and attributes in the game without a format for the sake of some kind of accounting.
Owning in game unique assets will be HUGE. People spend billions each year on non existent in game assets with zero value... the block chain will allow for ownership of assets making everything you earn in game have a value attached it will create massive economy's inside of games and create massive wealth. Nfts and Gaming is only going to get bigger.
@@grxygxds couldn't have said it better 👏
great explanation skills , thanks for he info
There are games that are being develop under GALA which are fun like spider tank, Mirandus, and many other games which for me your stressing out the beta games of Play 2 earn games. even in Waxp has a ton of fun games. take Big time for example or sandbox. Axie is true that its not fun but you should reconsider your example of Play 2 earn in your videos.
Until P2E figures out you Must have an "open/null zone", this zone is a 100% nft risk reward zone, where you can loose your nft. This creates fun destruction in order to balance the ingame economy. This creates a circular economy within the ingame economy. This "open/null zone" allows 50% of your asset to drop when you die to whoever beat you, and the other 50% is burned.
The other thing P2E Must have is a player created economy. An example would be: You buy a nft to play, that nft is built by another player. That player had to mine, collect, do quests, inorder to collect certain items inorder to craft new nfts, modules, etc. Until crypto games understand this, they will all fail once you have less people coming into the game.
I'm sure this won't happen to Froyo Games since their Gamebox is receiving a lot of good feedback. With their recent Gamebox Beta Access, they are holding a gamebox world cup that will be running for a whole month where 11 winners will be chosen and given a total of 4,400 GEMS to be won
Best P2E model is something simallar to csgo, where the earning part isn't actually the main premise of the game, for a p2e game to be succesfull it needs to first of all you make a good game, and add a economy on top of that
very insightful video!
Perfect 60s from 8:40 - 9:40
Thank you for saying this! It needed to be said!
When I first entered crypto, everybody was selling it as the answer to everything.
This is a much more reasonable explanation as it's "a solution" to a problem instead of the solution to all problems.