Hybrids cost more than ICE vehicles and will need main battery replacements as well. I will stick with my reliable fuel efficient ICE vehicles that any mechanic can work on.
@richardmichael59 True, if gasoline remains the primary fuel. But it will be phased out. 120°+ summers in the Southwest, droughts in the Northeast, massive wire fires in the West, increasing tornados in the Midwest and instant-on Cat 5 Hurricanes on the Gulf and Atlantic Coasts wil bring a crushing end to gasoline, as prices skyrocket and then finally a ban shall come. I won't live to see where that all ends, but my grandkids will live it. I'm not a self-centered, selfish man. I put the future of all kids first. My personal preference don't meat a thing... "For the greater good". 😄
Right away, the video starts with something totally (to me) unbelievable. That someone would buy a car without knowing or even asking how much recharging would cost. I test drove an EV recently, and that was the very first question I asked. Hey, it's no different than buying a gas-powered car, people want to know the most basic cost of owner a vehicle, any vehicle, the MPG, or the cost of recharge.
@@cesargarza1393 Of course they do. What I was trying to say is that most people pay $6,000 to $8,000 per year on payments and insurance. If you add $200/year onto the total cost of what most people are spending on their car, the $200 doesn't make much difference.
@samjam2376 why do you ask such stoopeed questions? Are you genuinely stoopeed or have zero understanding of how gov influences market trends through incentives and/or restrictions. Does the government force you to buy food???
Based on my experience, I agree with your video. I leased a Mach-e Premium, AWD, extended range for 3 years. I estimated that my extra costs associated with driving an EV were $2,000 per year. I live in Quebec where electricity is cheap. I only drove 15,000 km per year. I did more road trips than the average person, maybe 10 a year. These road trips ranged between 500 km and 2,000 km. The cost of public charging kept going up while I owned my ev. This trend will continue and at some point they will also start adding taxes to maintain the roads. The ev driving was a good experience and believe it is the future, but for my use case I will wait another 5 years before driving another ev.
@@melomane01 You made a big financial mistake. With the same money you paid for the 3 years leasing (a financial behaviour typical to the average broke person) you could've bought a beater, like a used self-charging hybrid (a financial freedom seeker behavior).
Thanks for the informative video. People should always check with their insurance company before buying an EV. I checked for the Tesla Model Y and for several larger, higher level ICE 3 row SUVs. The smaller, less luxurious Tesla was at least US$2000/year more expensive than any of the ICE vehicles. Just the higher insurance more than negates any fuel/maintenance savings.
Cyberbeast is around $106,000 with autopilot before taxes and insurance is $15000 per year in Los Angeles (YMMV). Six years of ownership is $90,000 just for insurance. Add other fees and it may not be logical !?
Not to mention it looks ugly as hell. That stainless steel body will show all kinds of stains (water stains, scuff marks etc.) It should look like a beaten up truck after a week unless you polish it everyday! What a waste of money!!!
Love your channel it is fair and realistic! I reserve judgement on any EV's; in part because I see issues and concerns where I question any real environmental gain in using them. I am older and tend to keep cars 30 plus years. I have one that I owned for 50 years now. My 2001 Honda Insight at 470K took less than $5000 in repairs and to maintain in it's life. I maintain my vehicles and another daily driver is a 1996 Honda Accord EX, it has cost less than $6000 in it's lifetime. I am educated; but, worked in body shops my lifetime even through grad school. I also farm grew up on one. My 96 Accord I use like a truck and think nothing of taking a calf to the vet in the back seat. I trust it enough to drive it cross country. An EV for me is not an option closest public charger is 31 miles away. At the farm my electric is maxed out; EV charging isn't an option.
Yeah that sucks, especially for those without the knowledge to build your own Solar charging station for under $10K, which would work beautifully in a farm. In fact, one can easily argue that the maintenance costs to get an ICE to 470K (not repairs) will pay for the whole solar farm or at least a great portion of it. This being said, I still encourage people to buy ICE vehicles because EVs are not for everyone, like in your case, and the ICE industry needs all the support they can get.
@@ElMistroFeroz I have the knowledge to build my own solar system the first one I did was in 1982. However, on a farm in south central Pennsylvania things are much different. One isn't looking at feet between buildings, it is by mile. Moreover, I built a structure for solar on my farm. A friend of mine has been working in the solar business since the 70's. I was getting everything I needed at cost and installed. She did the engineering study and found I would need two acres of solar panels to supply my needs. However, during the two darkest months production would be quite limited I also operate a water service that has a huge electric demand. I do some systems here with solar; but, there are limits. When I gave my cost for the 2001 Insight it included everything, even oil changes. Hope your EV is that effective my battery is still alive and well, no interventions will yours be?
@@wayneott5990 Wow, I find it really admirable you were able to take a gas vehicle to 470K miles with $5K. This being said, one thing most people don't realize is that we're still in the transition phase where EV owners are or have been ICE owners, so we also have first hand knowledge of that technology and what it takes to run an ICE vehicle that far. From oil/filter changes to going really easy on the brakes and not getting scammed by the average mechanic that always claims you also need new rotors. Timing and all other belts. Transmission, exhaust, tune ups, and this is assuming the car never broke down once. And most importantly - time you'll never get back. Just out of curiosity, I'd like to know how you managed to maintain that car without it falling apart on just $5K, and what NIMH battery chemistry lasts 25+ (life expectancy being between 3-5 years). As an EV owner I'm used to people making claims without realizing the limitations of ICE technology is common knowledge these days, but I won't make any assumptions. And yes, my EV battery is doing great. After 8 years and 107K+ miles, it's barely broken in because as opposed to lead acid batteries, they are rated to last beyond 15 years if you take good care of them (at the degradation curve I'm going, 20 in my case at least). I was going to address your solar comment but that's an even bigger can of worms to open, but to summarize, it's evolved exponentially the past 5 years, let alone 40+! Edit: Insight Battery is actually NiMH not lead acid, which is estimated to last up to 150K miles and recommended replacement 3-5 years.
I am still confused by battery life. Supposedly batteries are much more reliable over the last 5 years, then why hasn’t the warranty been improved? It is not pleasant being one of the out of warranty battery failures.
No third party battery insurer or provider offers extended warranty beyond 10 years from in-service date. Tells us how long they think battery packs will last without failing.
One major expense not mentioned are frequent tire rotations. At least for Teslas, which are intentionally made with the wheels slightly tilted for handling, leading to uneven wear.
Dear Tesla owners, I know it’s possible to have an EV cross country road trip. And it saves money if you can charge at home. For the rest of us, life is complicated enough and don’t want hazle to plan or remember to charge. I also know battery failure rate is not high. But some of us want the peace of mind of gas and hybrids. No need to plan the stops, no need to remember to plug, no need to worry the cold, don’t want to think about the small possibilities of battery replacement or fires. Just drive and fill up in two minutes at the next gas station around the corner, or the next exit, not 75 miles later. Peace of mind. Get it?
Btw when I’m on a road trip I want to eat and visit the places I want, not limit by where Tesla chargers are. I’m not saying EV are not good cars, just not yet. A few years later when the charging can be done in 5 min and charging stations as many as gas stations now. Then it would be a good time to buy with peace of mind.
Seems reasonable with battery technology increasing. What about the ICE car after 10 years though? Probably looking like maybe 10 or 20% residual value.
People think they save on gas by buying an electric car only to find out that it costs a FORTUNE to replace the battery when it goes bad. I say this because it happened to my neighbor who got rid off his Tesla at a GIANT LOSS after finding out how much it would cost him to replace the battery. Additionally, knowing that you must take your electric car to the dealership only, to get it fixed or serviced will create way too much anxiety because you will need to pony up major cash each time you do so and the dealer will give you the longest shaft available with a big smile also knowing that you simply do not have any other options. One of the worse things in life is NOT HAVING OPTIONS!!! Why would you like to put yourself in such a situation????
@@mikej238 That is true. If you live in Europe, where you need shell out $6 a gallon for gas, and distances are lot shorter and everything is lot more smaller and cramped comparing to the US, then yes, it would worth taking the risk by getting an electric car.
@floridaoutdooradventures8981 Don't have to live in Europe. Gas is expensive in much of NORTH America. If I lived in AZ, had 3 kids one of my cars would be an EV, no public transit and electricity is cheap. .Driving 3 kids around puts miles on quick. Distances are far......places in Canada gas is 6 bucks also. You can't make generalizing statements about cost recovery .
I live in rural U.S. and own an EV... most of what you said here is clearly from someone who's never used one as a daily before. I have... and none of what you said is a concern. The least of my concern is the battery.... Huge warranties and failure rates are miniscule. I have two friends with older Teslas over 300k miles and on the original battery still. In the insanely high majority of cases the battery will outlast the car. I've even taken it on massive road trips... zero issues. Most of the downtime to charge (20 minutes or so every few hours) was eaten up by using the RR, stretching and getting a snack. Someone else commented that the people that are the most opinionated are the ones that never had one, and he's spot on.
As a 70 year old single retired teacher I'm going to be doing some car camping and easy travel so I'm tooking to buy a new SUV pretty soon. I'm considering: The Toyota Highlander is going 4 cylinder turbo, which may mean a little more power and slightly better gas mileage, but since it may be heavy on a little 4 cylinder engine probably more expensive to buy, more expensive to repair, and less durable. Then there is the Honda Passport which has a 6 cylinder engine so more reliable, but it has a timing belt which at present costs about $1500 (USD) to replace at about 100k miles. A v6 means less mileage too, and the 9 speed transmission in the Passport has a history of problems but may be ok now. Any thoughts? Should I consider a hybrid? Cheers! BTW, your channel is such a great service for people, thanks! Anyone have any thoughts?
EVs are great if you have a close commute. Go across the country, and good luck with charging consistently. I would say that hybrids are more preferable, since you are not saddled with battery costs down the road. Owned several hybrids and can say that they are the better choice.
There are EV charging stations, literally, every 75 miles or closer on every major US interstate; I10, I40, I70, I90. I95, I75, I5. Going across the country is absolutely not a problem. Have you really ever driven an EV?
@@DonaldMains the answer is no they have not. I love when people who have never owned nor driven an EV try to explain to me how they work (or don’t work).
If you pull permits and do your own wiring, the inspector will ensure you've got it right. Given how easy it is easy to add a single circuit it doesn't seem like anybody should be shamed into hiring a professional electrician if you are comfortable working in a breaker box.
In my previous home, electrician had to drill through CMU wall into the garage, under the house, not something I have the equipment for. Charged me $1600 for the privilege.
I wouldn't call it shaming to hire a professional. It may be easy for you, but others certainly wouldn't see it that way. And given the risk of severely hurting yourself or even burning your house down if you do it wrong, I could never endorse diy to everyone.
I did just that what you don't recommend - did my own electrical (50 amp braker, 60 amp cable and nema 15-50 plug) and bought a $250 amazon charger (32amp) b/c my car max is 30amp charge (PHEV). I did the same plug at my old house, lets you swap chargers later but if I go bigger than 40amp I would need thicker cables and bigger breaker. My service is 200amp.
@@sterobloc6645 If your Mazda is perfectly serviceable, then don't replace it. But if you're in the market, compare that Tesla to a new ICE car of similar price. If you have a good working car, there's no need to get a new one, EV or ICE.
@@ToughOnionsI just compared some similar priced ICE cars like Volvo and Lexus and all insurance companies came out about $1000 per year more for the telsa model 3 AWD. Not everyone gets insurance quotes before they take the plunge but it will probably significantly chip away any maintenance and fueling savings quickly.
Depreciation is likely related to expensive repairs and battery replacements. Non early adopters know the facts so fewer want used EVs. Until there are extended battery warranties to 16 years or OEM battery packs available at reasonable costs, I will keep my ICEVs and HEV for now.
I have owned 2 electric vehicles in Brazil for 7 years and I am very satisfied! a Tesla and a Volvo And I bought a Tesla charger! I save around 70% if it were a combustion car! Apart from the maintenance which is cheaper!!
Satisfied with the ownership or the cost? This was about the cost, And if you sold them, how much did they depreciated? I have a diesel car and it depreciated ~2,300$ a year, I have the impression electrical cars depreciate much more
No way I’d consider an EV. Double the price of an ICE vehicle, colossal depreciation, extremely limited charging network, and useless for long range and winter driving. Back in 10 years.
@@billyrock8305 I paid $31.5k USD, after credits, for a new Tesla Y weeks ago. The equivalent ICE; Ford Escape, Honda CRV Toyota RAV were about 35k. Charging stations are literally everywhere.
@ The average EV is $25,000 CDN more than the average ICE vehicle. Try charging your EV driving from Sudbury to Winnipeg in January at -30c. There is none. You’re literally putting your life at risk. 💀
As we do not drive very much (2-3 times per week total of 60-100 miles), so most of the time the car is parked in the garage.. What is the the point of break even point of mileage vs time used, comparing the EV energy use while parked versus the ICE vehicle which does not use enerygy while parked. What is the energy use of an EV just sitting there? It isn't essentially zero like an ICE car. Is it worth the increased electricity cost? A similar question would be how much energy would be used leaving your car in an airport parking lot for 2 weeks?
My son bought a Tesla Model 3 in 2019. He currently has 95K miles on it and only has replaced tires! We have a 2023 Tesla which cost us $120 for 4K miles this year level 2, off peak at home! Great video BTW!
And the charging times? What about the costs? It might be easier just to purchase a hybrid and get there faster. Oh, I know about EVs brother, glad you asked!😅
Based on real life data, the self-charging hybrids are the best of both worlds (most reliable and lowest TCO, according to Consumer Reports, ISeeCars and CarEdge), while the PHEV are too close to the unreliability and huge TCO (Total Cost of Ownership) of the BEV.
@ I have an Avalon Hybrid and I love it. Probably best car I have owned. Rated at 43/44 mpg, but I often get 46-49. Engine needs to be serviced at every 5K miles and change air filter to battery about 20K. No problems at 35K miles. Around 50K I’ll change inverter coolant.
Actually, there is a cost work up to, Fear, Uncertainty, & Doubt, that the tech companies know sew well. They seem to be propagating a disposable society. And rather successfully I might add. So your Break Out Another Thousand paradigm works equally as well for EV's as it does for boats. I see some of the comments come from the lower 49th, where EV's may be suitable. They are not ready for prime time in the great white north ! But all in all, you did manage to cover most of the bases !
Very well done as usual Shari. Bought a used 2020 Chevy Bolt last Dec. for $14K. Got the $4k used tax credit. Liability insurance. Electricity is very cheap in North Dakota so we've been saving a lot of $. 3 modules in the battery went bad this summer. Was covered by warranty. They replaced the whole battery. There was an open recall on the vehicle entitled something like, "software update to prevent the premature failure of the battery", so hopefuly they finally got the programming right. I'll probably sell before the battery warranty is up. I don't think $10K was a bad deal in this used car market and would suggest people to consider a used EV after someone else has taken most of the depreciation. I honestly don't know how I would go back to gas. Would like something bigger of course. Kept my 2002 Buick Park Avenue with 285K miles. Just won't die and cheap to fix. The Buick gets around 30mpg on the highway, and the Bolt has been around 8 times cheaper in the summer. We know it doesn't have a heat pump so it will not be as good in a ND winter. Be well all.
@@stevensauvageau8827 actually a heat pump would not be an advantage in a ND winter. Heat pumps provide an advantage in cool weather but when it drops below freezing they really don’t provide a benefit.
Thank you! With a new battery, I'd probably keep the Bolt, but it would definitely be a great buy for someone if you trade it. That Park Avenue sounds like a gem btw!
Hmmm... I'll get a 2019 Honda Civic sport, manual transmission for about $20k US. Get an extended warranty and have a good mechanic look at it first. What is the environmental cost of making the EV battery? Also, there is an environmental cost of producing electricity and transmission. More than a standard car battery, that I could replace myself, for $200 from Costco. You went over the other cost. I would love to do a 2015 VW TDI, manual, but they are getting a little long in the tooth.
Good summary and nothing that makes me go screaming into the darkness. We're in the process of buying an EV and the one key element I am waiting on is the insurance premium. I'll know that once we get closer to the purchase time.
I would simply dump the EV if the batteries are done and buy a new one than replacing it with new batteries if I were to own an EV, but the fact is I am not buying the EV at all.
Got nailed on my MYLR for depreciation.. basically I need to pay $10K to ditch it an get something new.. I'm disillusioned with Tesla and want to get F150 Lightning FLASH
As always you provide an easy to understand analysis of the EV issues. We purchased an EV in 5/23. We have 40 thousand miles on it. We have a charger in our driveway. Our State gives a generous $2,500 discount at purchase and payed to install our charger. We qualified for the $7,500 tax credit. The company makes frequent improvements via wifi. We have taken a few thousand mile trips with no issues charging becasueTesla has plenty of charging centers on the East coast. But if we were in an apartment without our own charger going to a charging station would be a headache. For anyone at all hesitant get a plug in hybrid. Thanks
I’ve been saving so much money with my EV for the past 5 years and 105,000 miles. 1. I did not have to buy an eEV charger. I had an electrician install a 240 volt nema plug (same as for a dryer) for $400 (already had updated my panel because I was worried about fire risk) 2. I charge mostly at home. When I do charge at public chargers it’s for road trips and I end up spending way less money on gas. 3. My tires last the normal recommended wear periods because I don’t drive like a maniac and use regen braking that not only keeps the tires from wearing but my pads and rotors are still like new at 105k miles. All of this is hyperbole, meant to get views and attention in order to pay for his new electrical panel which you should frickin’ do if it’s 60 years old. Come on man!!!!!😮
I bought my friend's 12 CT200h for less than $4,000 USD. Gasoline is like $900 a year. I want a long lasting EV, not something that can be shot in Year 12 or sooner.
12 years for a total life of a car to actual final disposal is SAD. ICE cars do lose up to 70% value over this time but typically remain road worthy and may help save environment by reducing the manufacturing footprint and the waste dump. Not so EVs,
I came out with about $250 per year savings with an EV over a similar priced ICE. EV Insurance increase was very noticeable over an equivalent ICE. Eats up the maintenance savings quickly.
@@krisevon Not true for the best ICE cars (my Miata ND2 RF and Suzuki Jimny are very strong examples for my fact-based claim). And they will run for decades, unlike the short-lived electric appliances.
@ I guess we will know in 10 years. Plenty of telsa model S cars have 10+ year old batteries that I fine and the tech is even better now so the idea of a short lifetime EV are overstated.
@@krisevon The polluting, unreliable, huge TCO, dangerous, impractical etc. EVs will last max. as long as their batteries. Definitely far less than an ICE or a SCH.
I thought that the charge point charger was the best overall but surprised about emporia!!!! Let me know what you think about the charge point if possible??
Take it easy, Pinocchio! The replacement hybrid battery cost (labour included) on my 2019 Lexus UX 250h F Sport would be €3'200. My hybrid battery is guaranteed for 10 years/175'000km by Lexus and is working very well, but I got curious after such stupid claims and I asked for this quote from my dealership. This cost is offset by the fuel savings in a tiny bit over 3 years for me (driving it only about 16'000 km/year - we have other 3 cars, total driving is about 43'000 km/year). Moreover, the price "difference" (because there are more features on the hybrid) vs. the inferior ICE variant (UX 200) is almost €3'000, easily covered by the fuel savings in less than 3 years. Thus, in about 6 years there is a break-even in cost - the remaining years till the hybrid battery dies (an estimated life for it is about 14 years) is a huge bonus. Add to that the acquisition price (34% off the MSRP) - that low because of the long negotiation on that "used" car (2-months old, with 1989 km on the odometer) and the deal was and is amazing. The self-charging hybrids are the best of both worlds, having the best reliability and lowest TCO (according to Consumer Reports, ISeeCars and CarEdge).
What you and no one ever addresses are the insane human and ecological costs of mining the lithium, cobalt and the other heavy metals it takes to make batteries not to mention the mega tons of cancer causing chemicals used in the process . Also the storage capacity of the batteries always diminishes over time no matter how good the battery technology gets. There is also the cost of tire replacement where these tires coast twice as much as regular tires and last 1/2 as long. There is the damage caused to the roads because these EV's way almost twice as much as an ice vehicle. So many people do not report the full story.
It would be a much better/believable argument if you were to offer sources of your information rather than just parroting complaints you have read from others. Do as the moderator does and give real world sources not just hearsay.
Comment regarding home charging that it is useless is not correct. I have charged at home for six months and it works perfectly fine regular 120 W and 12 Amps. Stop adding to the misinformation about EVs. In the US, you can get a tax credit for installing home chargers.
Comment regarding home charging that it is useless is not correct. I have charged at home for six months and it works perfectly fine regular 120 W and 12 Amps. Stop adding to the misinformation about EVs.
You are Canadian Quote Canadian costs /Data first . Then cater to U.S.market. Be proud to be Canadian . We are not the Red Headed Step Child of the U.S.
It is so profitable to learn from your expert advice on the not so apparent things that one is planning to get an EV. Thank you! Salute!
How about annual registration fees ? EV's are 3 to 4 times of ICE depending on your state/province!
2x in Alberta
You are reaffirming my decision of going Hybrid, instead of EV. 👍
Hybrids cost more than ICE vehicles and will need main battery replacements as well.
I will stick with my reliable fuel efficient ICE vehicles that any mechanic can work on.
@richardmichael59 True, if gasoline remains the primary fuel. But it will be phased out. 120°+ summers in the Southwest, droughts in the Northeast, massive wire fires in the West, increasing tornados in the Midwest and instant-on Cat 5 Hurricanes on the Gulf and Atlantic Coasts wil bring a crushing end to gasoline, as prices skyrocket and then finally a ban shall come. I won't live to see where that all ends, but my grandkids will live it.
I'm not a self-centered, selfish man. I put the future of all kids first. My personal preference don't meat a thing...
"For the greater good". 😄
Another fantastic video, Shari. 👍
Glad you liked it! Thanks!
Right away, the video starts with something totally (to me) unbelievable. That someone would buy a car without knowing or even asking how much recharging would cost. I test drove an EV recently, and that was the very first question I asked. Hey, it's no different than buying a gas-powered car, people want to know the most basic cost of owner a vehicle, any vehicle, the MPG, or the cost of recharge.
Here in Texas the government has an extra $200 yearly tax just for owning an EV. That alone made me forget about EVs here.
$1200 per year for Nissan Leaf State of Colorado.
That’s because of their gasoline taxes and because an EV doesn’t use fuel, so the state loses the tax on that. The gas tax goes to repair your roads
Compare $200 with what most people spend on car payments and insurance per year. This cost is nothing.
@@stevensauvageau8827 ? EVs also have car payments and insurance.
@@cesargarza1393 Of course they do. What I was trying to say is that most people pay $6,000 to $8,000 per year on payments and insurance. If you add $200/year onto the total cost of what most people are spending on their car, the $200 doesn't make much difference.
When was the last time government forced you in to anything that saved you money long term?????
Did not know Musk was in the government, but he wants to be!
@robertduklus6555 when did the government force people to buy cars, any cars?
@samjam2376 why do you ask such stoopeed questions? Are you genuinely stoopeed or have zero understanding of how gov influences market trends through incentives and/or restrictions. Does the government force you to buy food???
@samjam2376 astounding lack of understanding of how govt incentives and/or restrictions influence marketplace.
@samjam2376 when does the government force you to buy food?
Based on my experience, I agree with your video. I leased a Mach-e Premium, AWD, extended range for 3 years. I estimated that my extra costs associated with driving an EV were $2,000 per year. I live in Quebec where electricity is cheap. I only drove 15,000 km per year. I did more road trips than the average person, maybe 10 a year. These road trips ranged between 500 km and 2,000 km. The cost of public charging kept going up while I owned my ev. This trend will continue and at some point they will also start adding taxes to maintain the roads. The ev driving was a good experience and believe it is the future, but for my use case I will wait another 5 years before driving another ev.
@@melomane01 You made a big financial mistake.
With the same money you paid for the 3 years leasing (a financial behaviour typical to the average broke person) you could've bought a beater, like a used self-charging hybrid (a financial freedom seeker behavior).
Excellent analysis
Thanks for the informative video. People should always check with their insurance company before buying an EV. I checked for the Tesla Model Y and for several larger, higher level ICE 3 row SUVs. The smaller, less luxurious Tesla was at least US$2000/year more expensive than any of the ICE vehicles. Just the higher insurance more than negates any fuel/maintenance savings.
Cyberbeast is around $106,000 with autopilot before taxes and insurance is $15000 per year in Los Angeles (YMMV). Six years of ownership is $90,000 just for insurance. Add
other fees and it may not be logical !?
Not to mention it looks ugly as hell. That stainless steel body will show all kinds of stains (water stains, scuff marks etc.) It should look like a beaten up truck after a week unless you polish it everyday! What a waste of money!!!
So I talk to owners of EV cars (some are friends) and they don't tell me about all these hidden costs? Ok, I see.
Love your channel it is fair and realistic! I reserve judgement on any EV's; in part because I see issues and concerns where I question any real environmental gain in using them. I am older and tend to keep cars 30 plus years. I have one that I owned for 50 years now. My 2001 Honda Insight at 470K took less than $5000 in repairs and to maintain in it's life. I maintain my vehicles and another daily driver is a 1996 Honda Accord EX, it has cost less than $6000 in it's lifetime. I am educated; but, worked in body shops my lifetime even through grad school. I also farm grew up on one. My 96 Accord I use like a truck and think nothing of taking a calf to the vet in the back seat. I trust it enough to drive it cross country. An EV for me is not an option closest public charger is 31 miles away. At the farm my electric is maxed out; EV charging isn't an option.
Yeah that sucks, especially for those without the knowledge to build your own Solar charging station for under $10K, which would work beautifully in a farm.
In fact, one can easily argue that the maintenance costs to get an ICE to 470K (not repairs) will pay for the whole solar farm or at least a great portion of it. This being said, I still encourage people to buy ICE vehicles because EVs are not for everyone, like in your case, and the ICE industry needs all the support they can get.
You sure beat me by a lot: Only 26 years with my Lexus (which is still really great).
@@wholeNwon You made a wise choice and it is paying off, so good to hear!
@@ElMistroFeroz I have the knowledge to build my own solar system the first one I did was in 1982. However, on a farm in south central Pennsylvania things are much different. One isn't looking at feet between buildings, it is by mile. Moreover, I built a structure for solar on my farm. A friend of mine has been working in the solar business since the 70's. I was getting everything I needed at cost and installed. She did the engineering study and found I would need two acres of solar panels to supply my needs. However, during the two darkest months production would be quite limited I also operate a water service that has a huge electric demand. I do some systems here with solar; but, there are limits. When I gave my cost for the 2001 Insight it included everything, even oil changes. Hope your EV is that effective my battery is still alive and well, no interventions will yours be?
@@wayneott5990 Wow, I find it really admirable you were able to take a gas vehicle to 470K miles with $5K.
This being said, one thing most people don't realize is that we're still in the transition phase where EV owners are or have been ICE owners, so we also have first hand knowledge of that technology and what it takes to run an ICE vehicle that far. From oil/filter changes to going really easy on the brakes and not getting scammed by the average mechanic that always claims you also need new rotors. Timing and all other belts. Transmission, exhaust, tune ups, and this is assuming the car never broke down once. And most importantly - time you'll never get back.
Just out of curiosity, I'd like to know how you managed to maintain that car without it falling apart on just $5K, and what NIMH battery chemistry lasts 25+ (life expectancy being between 3-5 years). As an EV owner I'm used to people making claims without realizing the limitations of ICE technology is common knowledge these days, but I won't make any assumptions.
And yes, my EV battery is doing great. After 8 years and 107K+ miles, it's barely broken in because as opposed to lead acid batteries, they are rated to last beyond 15 years if you take good care of them (at the degradation curve I'm going, 20 in my case at least).
I was going to address your solar comment but that's an even bigger can of worms to open, but to summarize, it's evolved exponentially the past 5 years, let alone 40+!
Edit: Insight Battery is actually NiMH not lead acid, which is estimated to last up to 150K miles and recommended replacement 3-5 years.
I am still confused by battery life. Supposedly batteries are much more reliable over the last 5 years, then why hasn’t the warranty been improved? It is not pleasant being one of the out of warranty battery failures.
No third party battery insurer or provider offers extended warranty beyond 10 years from in-service date. Tells us how long they think battery packs will last without failing.
I live in the San Francisco Bay Area and my electric rate during off peak hours is 31cents/kwh. I don't save any money relative to buying gas. 😢
firstly ev cost more to buy
One major expense not mentioned are frequent tire rotations. At least for Teslas, which are intentionally made with the wheels slightly tilted for handling, leading to uneven wear.
That's not exclusive to Tesla at all.
Tire wear was mentioned
Those knowing that tyres' rotation is highly desirable are not buying BEV clunkers.
@@mikej238 Tire wear was mentioned when for acceleration/weight. Uneven tire wear is a different thing.
@@ElMistroFeroz who f cares?
Dear Tesla owners, I know it’s possible to have an EV cross country road trip. And it saves money if you can charge at home. For the rest of us, life is complicated enough and don’t want hazle to plan or remember to charge. I also know battery failure rate is not high. But some of us want the peace of mind of gas and hybrids. No need to plan the stops, no need to remember to plug, no need to worry the cold, don’t want to think about the small possibilities of battery replacement or fires. Just drive and fill up in two minutes at the next gas station around the corner, or the next exit, not 75 miles later. Peace of mind. Get it?
Btw when I’m on a road trip I want to eat and visit the places I want, not limit by where Tesla chargers are. I’m not saying EV are not good cars, just not yet. A few years later when the charging can be done in 5 min and charging stations as many as gas stations now. Then it would be a good time to buy with peace of mind.
Basically, if you get rid of an EV after, say, 8 to 10 years, it is worth nothing.
Seems reasonable with battery technology increasing. What about the ICE car after 10 years though? Probably looking like maybe 10 or 20% residual value.
What an eye opening information about purchasing an EV cars ! Much to consider. Thanks again Shari!
People think they save on gas by buying an electric car only to find out that it costs a FORTUNE to replace the battery when it goes bad. I say this because it happened to my neighbor who got rid off his Tesla at a GIANT LOSS after finding out how much it would cost him to replace the battery.
Additionally, knowing that you must take your electric car to the dealership only, to get it fixed or serviced will create way too much anxiety because you will need to pony up major cash each time you do so and the dealer will give you the longest shaft available with a big smile also knowing that you simply do not have any other options. One of the worse things in life is NOT HAVING OPTIONS!!! Why would you like to put yourself in such a situation????
Yeah people think a lot of things, but the most opinionated by far are the ones who’ve never owned or even been inside an EV.
Depends where you live, how much gas costs , how much you drive. Not everyone can get gas for 2.75 USD a gallon
@@mikej238 That is true. If you live in Europe, where you need shell out $6 a gallon for gas, and distances are lot shorter and everything is lot more smaller and cramped comparing to the US, then yes, it would worth taking the risk by getting an electric car.
@floridaoutdooradventures8981 Don't have to live in Europe. Gas is expensive in much of NORTH America.
If I lived in AZ, had 3 kids one of my cars would be an EV, no public transit and electricity is cheap. .Driving 3 kids around puts miles on quick. Distances are far......places in Canada gas is 6 bucks also. You can't make generalizing statements about cost recovery
.
I live in rural U.S. and own an EV... most of what you said here is clearly from someone who's never used one as a daily before. I have... and none of what you said is a concern. The least of my concern is the battery....
Huge warranties and failure rates are miniscule. I have two friends with older Teslas over 300k miles and on the original battery still. In the insanely high majority of cases the battery will outlast the car.
I've even taken it on massive road trips... zero issues. Most of the downtime to charge (20 minutes or so every few hours) was eaten up by using the RR, stretching and getting a snack.
Someone else commented that the people that are the most opinionated are the ones that never had one, and he's spot on.
Outstanding video 👏
As a 70 year old single retired teacher I'm going to be doing some car camping and easy travel so I'm tooking to buy a new SUV pretty soon. I'm considering: The Toyota Highlander is going 4 cylinder turbo, which may mean a little more power and slightly better gas mileage, but since it may be heavy on a little 4 cylinder engine probably more expensive to buy, more expensive to repair, and less durable. Then there is the Honda Passport which has a 6 cylinder engine so more reliable, but it has a timing belt which at present costs about $1500 (USD) to replace at about 100k miles. A v6 means less mileage too, and the 9 speed transmission in the Passport has a history of problems but may be ok now. Any thoughts? Should I consider a hybrid? Cheers! BTW, your channel is such a great service for people, thanks! Anyone have any thoughts?
EVs are great if you have a close commute. Go across the country, and good luck with charging consistently. I would say that hybrids are more preferable, since you are not saddled with battery costs down the road. Owned several hybrids and can say that they are the better choice.
I have driven my EV on several road trips with no problems. This is just FUD.
@@mjsabie8517 tesla is better than other ev for long trips.
There are EV charging stations, literally, every 75 miles or closer on every major US interstate; I10, I40, I70, I90. I95, I75, I5. Going across the country is absolutely not a problem. Have you really ever driven an EV?
@@DonaldMains the answer is no they have not. I love when people who have never owned nor driven an EV try to explain to me how they work (or don’t work).
@mjsabie8517 really? Why hassle with waiting for a charge? Let's race coast to coast and see who gets there faster buckaroo?
If you pull permits and do your own wiring, the inspector will ensure you've got it right. Given how easy it is easy to add a single circuit it doesn't seem like anybody should be shamed into hiring a professional electrician if you are comfortable working in a breaker box.
In my previous home, electrician had to drill through CMU wall into the garage, under the house, not something I have the equipment for. Charged me $1600 for the privilege.
I wouldn't call it shaming to hire a professional. It may be easy for you, but others certainly wouldn't see it that way. And given the risk of severely hurting yourself or even burning your house down if you do it wrong, I could never endorse diy to everyone.
@@carhelpcorner I did say "if you are comfortable working in a breaker box."
My neighbors don't even drive there ev's during the cold, snowy winters in my midwest state.
"How bout NO?!" for me.
I drive mine in the cold Midwest winter with no problems.
I did just that what you don't recommend - did my own electrical (50 amp braker, 60 amp cable and nema 15-50 plug) and bought a $250 amazon charger (32amp) b/c my car max is 30amp charge (PHEV). I did the same plug at my old house, lets you swap chargers later but if I go bigger than 40amp I would need thicker cables and bigger breaker. My service is 200amp.
Excellent & informative video!
Thank you!
Insurance: currently paying £329 for a 2 Ltr. 2007 Petrol Mazda 5 . . . . Quote for Tesla EV . . . . £2664! . . . Yeah, I'll go for an EV
@@sterobloc6645 Your Mazda is scrap metal. Compare quotes on a comparably priced car.
@mikej238 NO!. . . The point is my Mazda is perfectly serviceable why should I bother changing. £2664 is around 2 years petrol/gas!
@@sterobloc6645 If your Mazda is perfectly serviceable, then don't replace it. But if you're in the market, compare that Tesla to a new ICE car of similar price. If you have a good working car, there's no need to get a new one, EV or ICE.
@@ToughOnionsI just compared some similar priced ICE cars like Volvo and Lexus and all insurance companies came out about $1000 per year more for the telsa model 3 AWD. Not everyone gets insurance quotes before they take the plunge but it will probably significantly chip away any maintenance and fueling savings quickly.
Depreciation is likely related to expensive repairs and battery replacements. Non early adopters know the facts so fewer want used EVs.
Until there are extended battery warranties to 16 years or OEM battery packs available at reasonable costs, I will keep my ICEVs and HEV for now.
I have owned 2 electric vehicles in Brazil for 7 years and I am very satisfied! a Tesla and a Volvo And I bought a Tesla charger! I save around 70% if it were a combustion car! Apart from the maintenance which is cheaper!!
Satisfied with the ownership or the cost? This was about the cost,
And if you sold them, how much did they depreciated?
I have a diesel car and it depreciated ~2,300$ a year, I have the impression electrical cars depreciate much more
No way I’d consider an EV. Double the price of an ICE vehicle, colossal depreciation, extremely limited charging network, and useless for long range and winter driving.
Back in 10 years.
None of this is actually true. just FUD
@
Facts matter. Yeah EV’s just don’t have enough to offer…. Yet
@@billyrock8305 I paid $31.5k USD, after credits, for a new Tesla Y weeks ago. The equivalent ICE; Ford Escape, Honda CRV Toyota RAV were about 35k. Charging stations are literally everywhere.
@
The average EV is $25,000 CDN more than the average ICE vehicle. Try charging your EV driving from Sudbury to Winnipeg in January at -30c. There is none. You’re literally putting your life at risk. 💀
@@billyrock8305 I just plugged this into a better route planner. The are plenty of places to stop and charge on this route. I could make it easily.
As we do not drive very much (2-3 times per week total of 60-100 miles), so most of the time the car is parked in the garage.. What is the the point of break even point of mileage vs time used, comparing the EV energy use while parked versus the ICE vehicle which does not use enerygy while parked. What is the energy use of an EV just sitting there? It isn't essentially zero like an ICE car. Is it worth the increased electricity cost?
A similar question would be how much energy would be used leaving your car in an airport parking lot for 2 weeks?
My son bought a Tesla Model 3 in 2019. He currently has 95K miles on it and only has replaced tires! We have a 2023 Tesla which cost us $120 for 4K miles this year level 2, off peak at home! Great video BTW!
That's great to hear! Thanks!
What about depreciation? Will you drive these Teslas into the ground?
And the charging times? What about the costs? It might be easier just to purchase a hybrid and get there faster. Oh, I know about EVs brother, glad you asked!😅
Interested in seeing your comparison to hybrids.
Based on real life data, the self-charging hybrids are the best of both worlds (most reliable and lowest TCO, according to Consumer Reports, ISeeCars and CarEdge), while the PHEV are too close to the unreliability and huge TCO (Total Cost of Ownership) of the BEV.
@ I have an Avalon Hybrid and I love it. Probably best car I have owned. Rated at 43/44 mpg, but I often get 46-49. Engine needs to be serviced at every 5K miles and change air filter to battery about 20K. No problems at 35K miles. Around 50K I’ll change inverter coolant.
I dont recommend anyone getting an ev unless you have somewhere at home to charge . It's just an all-around better experience owning an ev
Actually, there is a cost work up to, Fear, Uncertainty, & Doubt, that the tech companies know sew well. They seem to be propagating a disposable society. And rather successfully I might add. So your Break Out Another Thousand paradigm works equally as well for EV's as it does for boats. I see some of the comments come from the lower 49th, where EV's may be suitable. They are not ready for prime time in the great white north ! But all in all, you did manage to cover most of the bases !
The $25K EV really needs to get out to help this business significantly.
Very well done as usual Shari. Bought a used 2020 Chevy Bolt last Dec. for $14K. Got the $4k used tax credit. Liability insurance. Electricity is very cheap in North Dakota so we've been saving a lot of $. 3 modules in the battery went bad this summer. Was covered by warranty. They replaced the whole battery. There was an open recall on the vehicle entitled something like, "software update to prevent the premature failure of the battery", so hopefuly they finally got the programming right. I'll probably sell before the battery warranty is up. I don't think $10K was a bad deal in this used car market and would suggest people to consider a used EV after someone else has taken most of the depreciation. I honestly don't know how I would go back to gas. Would like something bigger of course. Kept my 2002 Buick Park Avenue with 285K miles. Just won't die and cheap to fix. The Buick gets around 30mpg on the highway, and the Bolt has been around 8 times cheaper in the summer. We know it doesn't have a heat pump so it will not be as good in a ND winter. Be well all.
@@stevensauvageau8827 actually a heat pump would not be an advantage in a ND winter. Heat pumps provide an advantage in cool weather but when it drops below freezing they really don’t provide a benefit.
Thank you! With a new battery, I'd probably keep the Bolt, but it would definitely be a great buy for someone if you trade it. That Park Avenue sounds like a gem btw!
Hmmm... I'll get a 2019 Honda Civic sport, manual transmission for about $20k US. Get an extended warranty and have a good mechanic look at it first.
What is the environmental cost of making the EV battery? Also, there is an environmental cost of producing electricity and transmission. More than a standard car battery, that I could replace myself, for $200 from Costco. You went over the other cost.
I would love to do a 2015 VW TDI, manual, but they are getting a little long in the tooth.
Good summary and nothing that makes me go screaming into the darkness. We're in the process of buying an EV and the one key element I am waiting on is the insurance premium. I'll know that once we get closer to the purchase time.
I bought a grizzl-e ,excellent well built charger for around 3to350$ us
I would simply dump the EV if the batteries are done and buy a new one than replacing it with new batteries if I were to own an EV, but the fact is I am not buying the EV at all.
Got nailed on my MYLR for depreciation.. basically I need to pay $10K to ditch it an get something new.. I'm disillusioned with Tesla and want to get F150 Lightning FLASH
Delusional much? 😂
As always you provide an easy to understand analysis of the EV issues. We purchased an EV in 5/23. We have 40 thousand miles on it. We have a charger in our driveway. Our State gives a generous $2,500 discount at purchase and payed to install our charger. We qualified for the $7,500 tax credit. The company makes frequent improvements via wifi. We have taken a few thousand mile trips with no issues charging becasueTesla has plenty of charging centers on the East coast. But if we were in an apartment without our own charger going to a charging station would be a headache. For anyone at all hesitant get a plug in hybrid. Thanks
Thank you!
I’ve been saving so much money with my EV for the past 5 years and 105,000 miles.
1. I did not have to buy an eEV charger. I had an electrician install a 240 volt nema plug (same as for a dryer) for $400 (already had updated my panel because I was worried about fire risk)
2. I charge mostly at home. When I do charge at public chargers it’s for road trips and I end up spending way less money on gas. 3. My tires last the normal recommended wear periods because I don’t drive like a maniac and use regen braking that not only keeps the tires from wearing but my pads and rotors are still like new at 105k miles.
All of this is hyperbole, meant to get views and attention in order to pay for his new electrical panel which you should frickin’ do if it’s 60 years old. Come on man!!!!!😮
I bought my friend's 12 CT200h for less than $4,000 USD. Gasoline is like $900 a year. I want a long lasting EV, not something that can be shot in Year 12 or sooner.
50 cents per KWh is NOT average that is exceptionally high.
12 years for a total life of a car to actual final disposal is SAD. ICE cars do lose up to 70% value over this time but typically remain road worthy and may help save environment by reducing the manufacturing footprint and the waste dump. Not so EVs,
That's y I m not fan of ev
I came out with about $250 per year savings with an EV over a similar priced ICE.
EV Insurance increase was very noticeable over an equivalent ICE. Eats up the maintenance savings quickly.
@@krisevon Then, if you apply your small savings vs. a big depreciation (a very low resale value), a BEV is obviously a bad financial decision.
@ after 10 years ICE or EV will only be worth 10% so a wash there.
@@krisevon Not true for the best ICE cars (my Miata ND2 RF and Suzuki Jimny are very strong examples for my fact-based claim). And they will run for decades, unlike the short-lived electric appliances.
@ I guess we will know in 10 years. Plenty of telsa model S cars have 10+ year old batteries that I fine and the tech is even better now so the idea of a short lifetime EV are overstated.
@@krisevon The polluting, unreliable, huge TCO, dangerous, impractical etc. EVs will last max. as long as their batteries.
Definitely far less than an ICE or a SCH.
I thought that the charge point charger was the best overall but surprised about emporia!!!! Let me know what you think about the charge point if possible??
Charge point is excellent as well, but emporia is best overall. insideevs.com/features/717724/best-electric-vehicle-chargers-2024/
High insurance cost
Dealerships will screw you.
Also when the battery in hybrids go out it will be an expensive repair bill(20,000 dollars at least)
Just replaced battery on 96 Lexus RX hybrid, $350 parts and labor at dealership.
Take it easy, Pinocchio!
The replacement hybrid battery cost (labour included) on my 2019 Lexus UX 250h F Sport would be €3'200. My hybrid battery is guaranteed for 10 years/175'000km by Lexus and is working very well, but I got curious after such stupid claims and I asked for this quote from my dealership. This cost is offset by the fuel savings in a tiny bit over 3 years for me (driving it only about 16'000 km/year - we have other 3 cars, total driving is about 43'000 km/year).
Moreover, the price "difference" (because there are more features on the hybrid) vs. the inferior ICE variant (UX 200) is almost €3'000, easily covered by the fuel savings in less than 3 years. Thus, in about 6 years there is a break-even in cost - the remaining years till the hybrid battery dies (an estimated life for it is about 14 years) is a huge bonus. Add to that the acquisition price (34% off the MSRP) - that low because of the long negotiation on that "used" car (2-months old, with 1989 km on the odometer) and the deal was and is amazing.
The self-charging hybrids are the best of both worlds, having the best reliability and lowest TCO (according to Consumer Reports, ISeeCars and CarEdge).
Your channel is a true oasis for the mind and soul. Thank you for your warmth and light that you bring into our lives!😝👢🎤
What you and no one ever addresses are the insane human and ecological costs of mining the lithium, cobalt and the other heavy metals it takes to make batteries not to mention the mega tons of cancer causing chemicals used in the process . Also the storage capacity of the batteries always diminishes over time no matter how good the battery technology gets. There is also the cost of tire replacement where these tires coast twice as much as regular tires and last 1/2 as long. There is the damage caused to the roads because these EV's way almost twice as much as an ice vehicle. So many people do not report the full story.
It would be a much better/believable argument if you were to offer sources of your information rather than just parroting complaints you have read from others. Do as the moderator does and give real world sources not just hearsay.
What’s up with all the bots in this comment section?
😂 Right! I had to take a closer look. Somebody's funding the bots. Very strange comments. I recall similar from his past videos.
@@ivanvarykino8202 IKR? It's almost as if they were bought for a different channel altogether and are here on error.
I wish UA-cam would do something about the bots. They are annoying.
Comment regarding home charging that it is useless is not correct. I have charged at home for six months and it works perfectly fine regular 120 W and 12 Amps. Stop adding to the misinformation about EVs. In the US, you can get a tax credit for installing home chargers.
Comment regarding home charging that it is useless is not correct. I have charged at home for six months and it works perfectly fine regular 120 W and 12 Amps. Stop adding to the misinformation about EVs.
Boring
because of that i did choose hybrıd.
You are Canadian
Quote Canadian costs /Data first . Then cater to U.S.market. Be proud to be Canadian . We are not the Red Headed Step Child of the U.S.
@@Nowherenotime I am proud to be Canadian. I only put the US data first because the number of US viewers is 5 times higher than Canadian.