Linux HATES Me - Daily Driver Challenge Pt.1
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- Опубліковано 12 тра 2024
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This is part 1 in a series where Linus and Luke migrate their home workstation to Linux. In this episode, each decides which Distro they'll use, and then tries to run a game on it.
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CHAPTERS
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0:00 Intro
1:07 Choosing a Distro is Confusing
4:27 Linus' Distro Choice
5:16 Luke's Distro Choice
6:04 OS setup
13:44 Linus tries Manjaro
17:08 Luke Games
17:55 Linus Games
19:19 Conclusion
20:20 Pop!_OS Explanation - Наука та технологія
NOTE: The issue I had with Pop!_OS has been fixed for some time now. After the fix, a broken package should never be able to uninstall the desktop unless you specifically work around it. -LS
Pog
hope manjaro does not cause more problems to him, like to me 2yeaes ago :)
And thought it was linus's fault
He might've dropped the ssd or something
XD
That’s cool
Can we get an "Anthony Reacts" series of him reacting to this series?
This.
I'm sure he'll be just as confused as all of us about how Steam uninstalled Linus's desktop environment, haha.
This.
we need this!!
I totally agree
Of all the things Linus is able to drop, i never expected that he would drop and entire linux distro.
Got Em, lmao
Lol. Well at least for once, you can't REALLY blame him for the core issue which was faulty dependency management, unlike Linus' other....drop habits.
While you can argue that it is a users responsibilty to know what he is doing, this goes against the grain of what Apple preaches for MacOS: The distributor of software is responsible to ensure that the user can't make any dumb choices. Giving the user the option to remove his desktop environment on a supposedly beginner friendly OS is...not great foresight. This inherently contradicts a bit of Linux philosophy that says that the user is allowed and free to do whatever he wants as he bears the ultimate responsibility for his system.
@@iamtheusualguy2611 Bro he wanted to install steam, pressed install and it deleted his GUI
Yeah, if something asks you if you're really really sure, type do as I say, I don't care about the warnings, disable the safety, on Linux, that is usually a sign that you should reread and rethink what you are doing. Interessting though that pop os can't even install the Steam deb without that kind of bullcrap.
@@iamtheusualguy2611 it does say don’t proceed in the terminal and that’s why there is a long message to agree to whatever it is you are doing. That message is basically a message of saying you’re about to jump off a cliff don’t do it and Linus did a somersault
At first I was really confused why Linus had to type "Yes, do as I say!", because in my 5 years using Linux on my Office Laptop I can't remember ever having to do that, especially for a seemingly simple install. It took only a few moments to realize why though.
explain pls, i was wondering
@@frenkie_musicokay, this is a well known issue, it’s to do with some old packages that steam required.
Basically, steam listed as a dependency a very old package, that replaced a package that was a dependency for a whole bunch of more modern packages. Namely the desktop and window manager, login screen, display server and graphics drivers - and a whole bunch of graphical packages that relied on those desktop packages went with it because they didn’t have a desktop to run on.
“Yes, do as I say” was put up as a really clear warning, so that no one can just speed through the warning without thinking I should check that message.
Linus didn’t realize that the message applied to him, as he’s been a power user on windows for a long time.
tl;dr, linux cli warnings are there to be read!
@@frenkie_music He deleted his whole entire system
@@frenkie_music If you read what the message says right before asking for his confirmation you'll realize the system was going to, for whatever reason, going to remove pop-desktop and related packages, which means he was deleting the whole graphical interface of the system. After doing it the rest of the system was probably fine as far as I can tell, but Linus would have no way to interact with it all other than through the command line.
Yeah I see okay, thanks@@theviniso
What shocks me is that Luke had few to zero problems with Mint, but Linus broke his system with an apt command.
Was it broken? He never ran "startx" (to start the GUI). I'm wondering if the GUI may have still been installed, Pop OS! was just set to boot in Terminal.
@@names_are_useless At 10:38 you can see that it removed GNOME Shell and GDM. So yeah unfortunately it uninstalled the whole GUI.
Also, even if it had just disabled GDM, that still counts as "broken" to someone coming from Windows.
My only Problem with mint is that After Installation it needs an Update for Internet but you don't instantly notice the isue.
Why is it a shock to find out that linus doesnt know all that he pretends that he does?
He removed every package for the gui. @@names_are_useless
"Yes, do as I say!" - famous last words
"Uninstall your entire computer"
Linux: Yeah sure.
Linus: Wait a minute, did something go wrong?
@@AURON2401 well, at least he got steam installed
That's usually why I prefer to not lead people to manjaro/endeavour instead of just properly understand the system and how to maintain it
Big warning there and all, but that's quite a fail from the package maintainer(s).
This is why Linus need so much employees to research. I know the experience. I have developed a fear at this point whenever the "packages to be REMOVED" list get too long but still...
Missed opportunity to call this series “Linus vs Linux”
smh
The real Linus has that problem too.
what bout Luke
Linux Tech Tips
What about Luke?
Linus: Documentary level camera movement
Luke: Blair witch Project
Haha, i love the contrast between Luke casually trudging along with a little uncertainty, but no issues. Then cutting to Linus where things are going a little crazy until the GUI is nuked XD
Tbf it makes no sense that a steam install would remove critical packages
that's Linux for you
It was a bug but why didn’t he read the warnings?
@@wilh3lmmusic because its a wall of text in the command line. No normal user is reading that.
@@vinson3725it’s really not, I’ve been using ubuntu linux for 5 years now on like 5 or 6 different computers. “sudo apt install steam” is usually the first thing I do when I install ubuntu on a new computer and it’s always been a one step process. Linus had some funky shit going on.
Linux doesn’t give you huge walls of text as a warning in the terminal unless something has gone horribly wrong lol.
Mint is the best distro, that's the truth
Luke: "that wasn't really a challenge"
Linus: **reinstalling OS**
Difference between Chad Linux Mint and Soyboy distros like Pop! OSAnd Manjaro.
The only issue Luke even showed with his was something super simple to fix too he just didn’t know where in the settings to look
I mean, one guy used linux for two years as a kid and the other one... is Linus
Linus: I'm going to ignore the text on the screen then blame the OS
Pop OS: "Okay then buddy"
@@malcomreynolds3306 If installing a game results in the OS showing a button that says "self-destruct [y/N]" and I have to say yes to get my game installed, that's on the OS. Windows hann't shown be a self-destruct button in years.
@@malcomreynolds3306 It's entirely PopOS's fault. Why was Steam even hooked into those OS dependencies? PopOS fucked up big time - they broke it, they fixed it, just not in time for Linus' run of it. This shit needs to be detected pre-release, NOT when it's in production.
Linus did nothing wrong. The GUI Package Manager should've just worked as advertised, didn't, and this is the havoc it can cause.
Hot take, derived from painful personal experience: better to bork a system a mere 15 minutes into the installation process than to bork it after 15 days.
Been there, done that. He speedran learning the "Slow down and read what packages are being removed" lesson.
Or rather don't use Linux because it's garbage
@@kvin9210 It's not garbage lol. It is definitely behind Windows on the desktop market but dominates every other aspect
This is why you install Timeshift or equivalent. Fuck up your Wayland? Just jump into a tty and throw everything into hard reverse.
There's also Silverblue, which prevents most common fuckups and makes rolling back the others extremely easy and reliable.
Source: I fucked up Wayland with a poorly placed rm -rf
@@_colonial_ I feel like there's a galaxy brain meme out there that proceeds from cp (or dd) -> rsync -> timeshift, where the punchline is: "ansible."
That is to say, in a world where I'm already abiding by the 3-2-1 rule for backing up data, I really don't care about rolling back bad changes to my OS as much as I care about reconfiguring my system from scratch.
I think the biggest positive force behind upcoming Linux gaming compatability is the Steamdeck. While making your game Linux compatible in the past was a nice feature, the Steamdeck actively incentives developers to do so as part of their standard development process.
I'm loving the steamdeck pushing the envelope with Linux
10 months later and it's looking soooo much better. Once you realize the power of ProtonGE + Steam Launch options, gaming on Linux is better than Windows, full stop. The caveat is that you have to work a little for it to perform that well. If you just install and run, it performs about the same as Windows.
I've got a 10th gen i5 with UHD630 graphics and it can run games with 1080p @50-60fps output that it should NEVER be running. MGS5, Far Cry 3, Dark Souls 2, all at high settings. Wayland is incredible for anyone that doesn't need +60fps. Every frame is perfect, so there's no need for VSync.
Meanwhile Hogwarts Legacy is using "Steam Deck Verified," which essentially means "Linux Verified," as a marketing tool. It's insane how far it's come.
@@proctoscopefilms I pretty much play all of my games on Steamdeck🎲 at this point, so it has definitely worked out.
I'm generally not an early adopter of new hardware, but I have zero regrets for preordering the Steamdeck.
@@infin1ty850 me too! I set up a steambox with that laptop and I can't stop using it, even though I have another, way more powerful computer. I think some of that is the SteamUI user experience. SteamUI and the PlayStation XMB menu are the best console UIs I've seen.
@@proctoscopefilms Steambox? I'm not familiar with that, I'll need to check that out.
I switched from Windows to Pop_OS! last year, and while my overall experience has been positive, one of the biggest frustrations has come from the fact that it was advertised as an easy experience, but then wasn't. These weird little bugs, like the one Linus had, would crop up and I'd have to spend hours on forums to try and fix it. I have a high tolerance for that kind of bullshit, but I have friends who don't. They would have definitely given up and gone back to Windows. If Linux is going to become a viable alternative to Windows, and break Microsoft's hold on PC gaming, projects like Pop_OS! need to be able to live up to their own hype. I genuinely look forward to the day when they can.
I always recommend Linux Mint. I've never seen anyone recommend Pop!_OS* for beginners... or anyone. I mean the ridiculous name itself should be a huge red flag: these are the people designing and developing the OS.
Pop isn't nearly as popular (read: tested) as other Linux OSes, so you're going to run into more issues.
@@encycl07pedia- They all have these sort of problems, stuff just stopping to work and weird little bugs. Mint had my wifi become "unavailable", the magnifier stopped working and all sorts of annoying weird stuff. A reinstall is the only thing that fixed it. Mint has however been the best one I've tried so far.
@@lmnts556 Sounds like you had a failed or half update. Unfortunately a lot of Linux family software uses dependencies and while that in theory works great, one bad update and your dependencies fail and thus the program fails. It definitely happens, but I have had hardly any issues with Mint (Xfce).
I have had issues with Steam regardless of which OS I used. IMO, it's a Steam problem, likely a result of having such a huge codebase and trying to act like an OS inside another OS.
@@encycl07pedia- Maybe' I'll keep trying as I like the Linux idea, it is definitely interesting and intriguing and the shell is fantastic. I find myself using bash more than the regular shell in windows. I'll probably use both tho, they seem good for their own little things.
Just use Linux Mint and you'll never meet these issues what PopOS has.
Apt removing the entire desktop environment for the installation of Steam is a true Chad move, the developer who programmed is having a great time watching this.
not atp fault. conflicting package requirements and unresolved dependicy trees.
thats why linux as a desktop OS sucks
@@woswasdenni1914 That's not "Linux" bro, that's either Apt or stuff fucked up inside of Pop!_OS
@@WolfVidya dependencie hell, im happy taht arch based linux have less of this problem but still encountert similar issues in my 5years of linux
I daily Arch and never got any issue even closely related to that... Main problem is that Linux doesn't do hand holding
@@woswasdenni1914 That would be Aptitude's fault then, because Pacman on Arch-based distros and Arch refuses to install anything with unmet or outdated dependencies
The way that luke was hyping it up, I almost thought he was going to do something like Arch, Gentoo, or Linux from scratch. And then he said Mint and I almost died laughing.
I use mint btw?
This is also what he was afraid of hardcore Linux people hahah
nerd
Watching Luke or Linus trying to figure out Gentoo would have been absolutely crazy. Not that I'd be any better at it.
@@astronova6150Where do you think you are?
I spent an hour trying to figure out how to change the monitor orientations before I just swapped the cables. You win this round, Linux.
In Gnome and KDE you can just drag the displays around in the display configuration setting.
The first part where Linus talks about how confusing it is to choose a distro based on those tech review sites has annoyed me so much over the years. They make no sense, and resemble 0 consistency most of the time.
Pretty much an accurate representation of Linux in other words.
Yeah, like bro just pick Debian or Ubuntu wtf. Any other important thing can be installed/customized afterwards.
So true! Its the best and worst thing at the same time that there are so many distros.
Unfortunately there are a lot of blogspam sites. It’s best to just pick a popular well supported distribution and call it a day.
Why I suggest to anyone who wants to run linux to test drive many different distros and pick the one that best works for them. I use linux daily and still to this day run different distros and try new ones out just to see what they are all about. I find that is the fun of having many options, but do understand how confusing it can be to someone who is new to linux and just wants something that they can boot up and run without having to mess around all that much
Had a legit panic attack at "Yes, do as I say!" -- that warning as meant as the safety breaker to prevent newbs from tripping over what happened but much love guys, no hate. we have a ways to go and this is not discouraging :)
That warning needs to be worded substantially better imo. It is way to easy for a casual to not understand.
Do you know what he did wrong there? Really curious.
Why did `sudo apt-get install steam` brick the install though?
@@leophan2198 It pretty clearly stated it was removing a lot of stuff, including the GUI (not sure why it would remove all that to install steam, but seems to be some kind of conflict). This is why the GUI failed and the CLI made him type the silly phrase. It was supposed to make him realize that he doesn't actually want to do that, but clearly it failed.
Good end user demonstration of not reading the warning at all, and just typing yes :D
(Otherwise no idea what went wrong to get to that state)
my favorite part was when linus typed "Yes do as i say" to "Remove pop_os gnome"
When people don't read the stuff they do and the system asks "Dude, are you absolutely sure?"
@@smzig it was a bug that is now corrected
My favourite part is when he tried to install Steam on a fresh image and it said "hahhaa fuck you"
@@Ryan-093 Thats what we call "Ready for gaming"
To be fair, that would assume the user knows what "Gnome" means and tbh no "normal" user would expect fricking Steam to uninstall the Desktop!
The word customization written in comic sans literally made me put my head in my hands and rethink all my life choices.
Yeah, pretty much.
*Linux first boot*
Linux: "Papa, is that you?"
Linus: "No, I'm the other one"
Linux: "Oh, ok..."
*Linux proceeds to die dramatically*
😂😂
*proceeds to die after talking about our sponsor, Glasswire.*
Legendary comment
That was perfect mate actually laughed at that, startled the shit out of my wife lol.
well you are not wrong
Linux dad also linus, but the other one
These video series needs an "Anthony reacts" to every one of them.
He needs to narrate it like a nature documentary
100%
Definitely want this! But honestly we kind of already get this from the comments.
This REALLY needs to happen. It would be great!
Agreed!!
I feel like since the Steam Deck has been released, we need a Linux gaming followup (since the Proton compatibility layer has been improved by leaps and bounds). You could pretty much use any Linux distro with the ProtonGE and Wine compatibility layers, and have a great gaming experience. It's actually wild.
Lixus looks like a good idea just because steam deck is a gaming console only, the second you actually try to use it as a pc it's just as trash as the rest of linux os's
@@guotyr2502What an ignorant thing to say.
@@TheXipherZero nice no argument, go back to sleep
@@guotyr2502 What argument? You made an ignorant statement without any supporting commentary and I simply provided the rebuttal comments like that deserve.
Now if you had talked about WHY you think that the state of the linux desktop in 2023 is crap (Especially in relation to proprietary desktop environments), there may be something to discuss. But, just throwing out that the linux desktop experience is trash is fairly pointless and not especially useful for anyone.
Now all that being said; I use most systems out there and feel that properly configured linux DE's are generally superior to both Windows and MacOS mostly due to consistency and workflow. This of course is a personal opinion, but I can happily supply the reasons why if there is interest.
@@guotyr2502 Instead of calling you "ignorant" I'm gonna ask you to elaborate on what you mean. I've switched to Linux completely and I haven't had a situation where I needed Windows at all.
To anyone wishing to try Linux: go for it, but it's a good idea to pause and consider the meaning of messages like "You are trying to delete the following essential packages..."
And I'm here with experience with both MacOS and Linux to say to not try it and just get the by far more superior operating systems, windows!
@@arlieproductions4794 Windows is great for certain people. You're a gamer who loves COD Zombies and has a clone trooper profile picture. You will definitely have a better time on Windows.
@@encycl07pedia- This is very correct
It's because on windows you always get urgent messages and stuff all the time, so your brain learns to just ignore the warnings and proceed. On Linux when you get a warning it's because its very serious, especially on the terminal, but your windows brain thinks its normal and then you nuke your DE.
@@Perseagatuna The problem was the system didn't just warn him, it outright STOPPED him. He was denied and then briefly researched the CLI solution online and probably never read more than 2 words outside the actual commands to copy.
UAC alerts may be common, but that's because it's calibrated for durnrnies like Linus who will run executables at elevated privileges without a second thought.
I think the thing that Linus's experience makes abundantly clear is that when you're choosing a Linux distro, what you're really choosing is the people that maintain your package manager/app store. This is way more important than any silliness about desktop environments and should probably be communicated to new users better, and in a way that's easy for them to understand.
"Don't choose the new distro that has about two people maintaining the upstream repositories" is a statement that's obvious to anyone who's used Linux in a professional or enterprise environment, but seems lost on most enthusiasts and is completely not communicated to new users.
Yeah, as I said earlier, Anthony should have picked the distro for them, and they should have made this a challenge about that distro specifically. Trying out "linux" as a whole makes about as much sense as "trying out bread".
@@seeibe the point is trying to get the experience anyone coming to this fresh gets. Demonstrating the utterly shitty experience a new user gets is at least part of the point. And part of that experience is trying to work out everything from what a distro is to how to install it and get it to work with your hardware.
@@zoeherriot That's what I'm saying. Nobody "coming to this fresh" should just pick their own distro. That shouldn't really be part of the experience, and the fact is being communicated as such is a part of the reason nobody wants to use linux.
@@seeibe I see your point - but isn't that the issue? I mean, in not sure what the alternative is given the Linux community is predicated on choice and freedom. I think that Linus's point was interesting that one way to circumvent that issue is to read articles to help make a choice - but all the articles were bad... there's a ways to go.
@@seeibe How do you suggest someone you know... chooses a distro? Linus looked at resources online as well as his prior knowledge which all nominated popOS as a good choice.
Linux: "Install Steem!"
OS: "Yes, uninstall essential packages?"
Linux: "YES!"
OS: *A s y o u w i s h*
Basically yes. :D
The best thing about linux is that you can tell the OS to do whatever you want.
The worst thing about linux is that you can tell the OS to do whatever you want.
This should not be possible when installing Steam. This is the problem Linux has. Normal user don't read this long messages and say "yes do it". Linux is still not simple to use for newbes.
@@martinharnisch7398 that was true weeks ago. Pop os fixed this bug super quick. It's not possible again.
@@martinharnisch7398 but this is only fixed in pop os as far as i know. On other distros you could have this problem.
Live cds are one of my favourite parts of most linux distros it's super useful for whenever you mess something up or need to do some heavy drive management
no chad would ever dislike someone for not being good at something, that kind of behaviour would immediately strip someone of their chadness
wow, it hasn't even been a day and Linus is already distrohopping
As well any new user should. When you're starting off from zero there's a lot of ground to cover then.
@@1pcfred Honestly any new user should just pick one of the most popular best maintained distros... there's only like three of them.
@@deedoubs arch, Gentoo, or android.
I remember installing 5 different distros in a single day because reasons, LUL. I use Arch BTW
@@deedoubs probably. Following the path less traveled can be an adventure too though. Watching Linus was like spectating at the smash up derby. He's like only one of them.
I was physically hurt watching apt slowly disassemble Linus's desktop environment after he tried to install steam
It was the best thing ever tbh 🤣. Install to brick
That would really hurt a Linux Nerd Herder!
it's pretty fast tbh
apt is the reason I despise Debian. Pacman all the way
I need this video combined with Intel Arc.
30 day Linux Daily Driver on Arc HAHAHAHA
The Pain Package
@@twandepan intel has great drivers on linux, im 100% that arc would be a way better experience than nvidia
@@sixunity1171 Oh really? Maybe it won't crash the PC in the first 60 seconds after all
@@twandepan sometimes i run games using my integrated intel graphics just because they are way more stable lol
@@sixunity1171 interesting
An interesting thing I discovered by accident is that if you want to wipe a Linux boot drive to install a different ISO, you can connect it via USB adaptors to an android cellphone, and you'll get a prompt to reformat the drive, when Linux and windows both stated they're not able to do exactly that.
As a result, I was able to recover the use of a drive I had mistakenly made into a boot drive... And I discovered this purely by accident. 😂
What prevents you from formatting it from Linux/Windows? Should just be a visit in the drive manager.
@@Gramini I know I'm late but for some reason windows just refuses to format boot drives. It just fails with no explanation. Happened to me multiple times. Linux formats it with no issues though.
@@yorimirus Oh, thanks for the information. That's a classical Windows moment I guess.
Also better late than never, especially when answering questions or providing details :)
@@Gramini Glad to have been of help.
This is literally the most anticipated and hyped up video of the year for ltt
I see you too regularly follow WAN Show.
Well yes
Already watched it on floatplane a few days ago.
That and Luke's pregnancy! 🤰 Probably triplets
True
linus might have achieved a new world record in the linux implosion speedrun any%
This channel is called Linus Drop Tips for a reason.
I dunno, Full Linux implosion speed runs are a fairly competitive category.
@@troylambert1601 This wasn't even a full implosion, more a 7/10 implosion. You haven't seen a full implosion until you've accidentally wiped the network and USB drivers.
@@jamesm5787 runs sudo rm -rf /
@@pentasteve9723 It was some uninstaller that went nuts, but yeah, that's pretty much how it went.
just got my framework laptop and i'm challenging myself to use linux as well,, very excited to see what it has in store for me
As someone who never used Linux before and then daily drove Pop for about a year, you did fine. It took me 3 tries to actually install it (because I'm not at all computer savvy, so that's 100% on me, not on either Linux as a whole or pop!_OS), but being fairly bad at computers in general it was a fun experience. I learned a lot during that year, there was a lot of new things, and problems, to experience when you've used only Windows for 30 years but with googling and asking friends, I actually managed to do everything I usually do on a computer, including gaming.
Holy crap, I miss Luke on LTT. Glad he's doing what he's doing now, but it is cool seeing him on a classic challenge-type series.
Now we just need Max back and the world we be a better place
@@LanceMabu we need Nicky V
@@fadelpw511 It's Nicky V, your mother's favorite house guest
@@fadelpw511 Nicky V ftw!!!
i mean you can watch the WAN show if you want more of luke
At the very end of this there needs to be a live stream of Anthony breaking down everything he would have done
Oh my god yes. Please.
I thought they had said they were doing that? Maybe it'll be a separate video...
Yeah i am sure he would be disappointed in pop OS aswell. My experience with Linux has been similar. Can't install shit from app store and i hate using sudo apt get for everything. And even then some shit doesn't work AND a lot of them don't auto update. Even windows XP was more user friendly than ubuntu 21.
They keep working on their UI making it fancy and giving pretty animations but won't figure out a simple way to Install and update apps which works across all distros 🤦🏼
@@rph_redacted I mean you could use arch which has solid package handling (i.e software setup) as a core feature.
There is always an option in linux if you prefer something
That's actually such a good idea. It'll give new users a place to find out common problems and how to fix them
I understand most the issues here, I really do! Even thought I've used Linux for years now, I do understand Linus' issues. Being used to Windows for decades and then using something like Linux where you aren't used to using a command line as often, you can easily bork system if you arent reading everything.
True, but a large portion of his arguments boil down to "too much choice is confusing," and "there's a learning curve." "Too much choice" isn't a bad thing. If you don't like the amount of choice you have, just go with a default option. Nobody is forcing you to use every inch of linux's freedom. Also, everything has a learning curve. Just because something's hard to learn doesn't make it bad, or worse than an easier to learn system. The only difference between windows and linux in terms of learning curves is that most people grow up with windows, so they don't notice the learning curve. If they grew up with Linux, they wouldn't notice the learning curve either. Also, as someone who was a windows user for 17 years until yesterday, windows was not easy to learn. Settings are broken into "settings" and "control panel," and almost every time I wanted to access a setting I had to look up how to do so because windows 10's GUI is so confusing to navigate. Their search function is garbage as well. I tried to search for exe files by name, and even after typing out their whole name, they still wouldn't show up. Also, completely installing anything is impossible without using powershell or manually combing through directories, as vestigial files are left behind, even when using uninstallers. Some apps (windows media creation tool, an app that does not come standard with windows 10) is literally impossible to uninstall, and won't even show up under "programs" in settings or "control panel." Any windows user who complains about linux not being user friendly is delusional and needs a reality check. Mint Cinnamon has been the easiest, most user friendly OS ever, and you have complete control over your system. All apps can be completely removed using terminal commands, and cpu, gpu, and ram usage was significantly reduced.
At the very end of this, there needs to be a live stream with Anthony breaking down everything he would have done
ooooo, I like that idea
YES
Golden Idea
I think they might've hinted at something like commentary on the process by Anthony.
That's not the point.
apt : "This will remove pop-desktop and gnome-shell"
linus: "YES"
i do like how later he admits he "didnt read" the displayed info ... lets face it in any Linux installation process it displays so much potentially serious information that many of us basically ignore ... each install i skim through the warnings and look briefly for red flags but its a rare occasion that ill read and check all of it
A bug offering to delete OS sneakily while installing steam.
@@unholydonuts just the graphic shell. The OS was still functioning pretty well and cand be fixed by reinstalling the graphic shell. Windows has done similar stuff in the past (letting a certificate expire which caused multiple windows apps to be unusable)
@@joshuapritchard575 "This should NOT be done unless you know exactly what you are doing!" and "You are about to do something potentially harmful" should be a red flag to anyone, not to mention people are too reckless using sudo commands
@@OmegaGamer04 I stand corrected. You were right, the os just didn't have a desktop to go to, which can be reinstalled.
I personally started with ubuntu gnome, which I used because my 10+yr old pc just couldn't handle windows 10 any longer. First thing i noticed was the difference in openness... like omfg the fact I could turn things off if I didn't want it running even if it killed my system and not get "you don't have permission" was fucking amazing. In the end though, I settled on manjaro gnome, even customized it how i liked it after using XFCE for a bit- since I liked the XFCE pop out menu. Frankly, ubuntu I found was.... well to say the least it was very restrictive for me after finding manjaro. The user friendliness as a new user, the access to things like snap/flatpak/aur/community apps etc as well as being gnome i can use gnome extensions- which is fun to combine with opera which can use gnome extensions. Some people may not like snap/flatpak but I do have a few apps that are only existent on those, and are a must have for me. Otherwise I would love running something like... i forgot the name of it but it was something something dragonized.
i think the main things that made manjaro gnome perfect for me was the aur/snap/flatpak/gnome extensions, as well as using a gui installer for apps making it easy to search for apps across all sources. The sheer openness as it being linux, hell even the file system lay-out was beautiful to me.
It has been an experience learning linux over the last few months though, and a fun as well as frustrating one at that. I can't begin to tell you how many things i've managed to fuck up/fix in the last 3 months lol. To think that all this started with me one day messing around with stuff on windows, figuring out i was essentially attempting to run linux on windows, then just googling "is linux better than windows?" as well as "which is the best version of linux for newbies?" from there it has been hundreds upon hundreds of google searches.
I have a new computer now with the latest Nvidia GPU. I chose the "recommended" option for drivers in Linux Mint. They didn't work. I did a web search about it, but I could clearly see my pc was not using my GPU. I just went to Nvidia, chose the graphics card and OS, downloaded it and then realised it was between the options that I could have chosen. I did this and everything went perfect. Just a reminder for people that always follow the OS "hint".
I choose the raccommended driver and it works fine. 3060 ti btw
I feel like we’ve been hearing about this series for a year on the wan show
This episode has been out on floatplane for a couple weeks now (none of the others so far) So I’m assuming they waited for the challenge to over internally to put out the videos on UA-cam
she fancied that she saw a still 🥧🍰🎂🍪🍩🍨🍧
The huntsman was just passing🤽♂️🤼♀️🤼♂️🤸♀️🤸♂️🏍🏎
was nothing that she would 🙄🤗😍😄
This comment thread is cursed, so many spam in here
I just realized I hadn't seen Luke standing for years, as they're only sitting during WAN Shows, LOL.
He looks so different in this video. Right?
@@DrBernon Don’t we all with age?
@@RikkSpencer Yes. But it's not that. I see him different compared to the wan show.
*he
You missed this video with Luke
ua-cam.com/video/Ng7PYafct4s/v-deo.html
Having used Linux (formerly Mint and most recently Manjaro) your review is interesting. I like to see what kinds of problems other people manage to dredge up, problems that I somehow managed to sidestep.?.?!.?
Educational.
Ah yes, my favorite Linux distro "Pop exclamation mark underscore os"
When the Daily Driver series ends, I really hope Anthony is allowed to do a series where he goes through clips of all the mistakes and offers solutions. Would also be cool to see him do a Linux gaming rig video or two where he basically walks through all the setup steps so that anyone who wants to switch over to Linux can have a more Windows like experience where you just get what you get and it is ready to go.
up
That is a very good idea
As mentioned by Robbierut, you wont have that Windows experience. Unfortunately on Linux your hardware changes quite a lot the amount of troubles you will have on the way of setup.
Yep, we need someone to at least show what can be achieved. This vid set Linux back a long way for a lot of folk.
THIS!!!
This type of LTT videos is my favourite. Not heavily scripted. No forced expressions. No weird reactions. No dumb jokes. Just Linus and Luke casually filming a tech adventure from their phones. Super nice and relaxing, and definitely fun to watch.
Please make more videos like this.
Completely agreed, I have been watching LTT since 2012 and I really miss their less scripted videos, I feel like maybe 2018 is when they started heavily scripting stuff and making it less human like and more robot like, I still love LTT but please make more like this.
They were genuinely flummoxed here. No acting was required.
Thanks for doing this. I mained Linux for over ten years and my experience with it was basically the same as Linus's far too often, not that I ever inadvertently uninstalled my DE. I hope one day Linux can be as painless as Windows is for me.
I always thought that I was the only one having weird Problems with Linux Mint like my Screen getting no signal after going into standby mode but you guys have way more problems than I ever had!
Luke coming back for this challenge is just a treat for long time watchers, so much nostalgia.
yea I'm confused. does he still work with Linus and the team? what does he do now if not?
@@jessevillarreal00 Luke is in charge of floatplane I think.
@@gigabytetech5509 Yep, he also does the WAN show with linus
I'd prefer ESTER to come back....
Linus's sis n law. She's badass
Luke: that wasn't really a challenge
meanwhile over at Linus.... 😂
not funny
didn't laugh
How Linus managed to wreck PopOS so quickly?
@@viniciusmedinarj By not reading the warning. Here's the full warning in case you didn't read it either like Linus.
WARNING: The following essential packages will be removed.
This should NOT be done unless you know exactly what you are doing!
You are about to do something potentially harmful.
To be fair Luke had experience in using linux as daily drive before while linus only use it for making video
@@hitler69 by typing in “Yes, wreck my machine”
My little sister needed a netbook for school so instead of buying a new one i decided to install lubuntu in a 2011 old laptop of mine, kid you not it was a pain to set up, but everytime i went into a error or trouble there was a tutorial on how to fix it, after an entire day of problem fixing the dual boot and grub i felt an indescribable joy when the lubuntu logo appeared and it booted, to be honest it let me learn a lot, i was happy with the result that pc has never seen so much productivity not even when new with windows 7, and even tho it was not so user friendly to start it let me see the true potential of the hardware. And my sister more than happy even saying she is like Hecker the floopa cuz she nows uses the SO of the pros 😊😂
I had issues after a month or so with pop os package manager as well. Had to add repos and install a lot of stuff that way, then started not being able to install new packages. Worked great for a while, but went back to Ubuntu and windows for my gaming rig
This is going to be an A+ series. Up there with scrapyard wars, Intel extreme upgrade, and mining adventures
As Linux user for more than 10 years, this was pain.
@@Rainaman- I'm also a 10+ year user. But I think it's helpful. Because I'm willing to admit the only reason I'm good at Linux is I've been using it for a decade.
It's not user friendly. That's probably it's biggest problem. Even so-called friendly distros like Pop have their moments.
And then there's just "well I've been using windows for 2 decades I don't know how to do anything else"
and secret shopper
@@Rainaman- Linus: I'm going to ignore the text on the screen then blame the OS
Pop OS: "Okay then buddy"
@@Rainaman- The Linux ecosystem needs to feel that pain in order to know how to be more user friendly
From 02:35 Linus points out a general problem with pretty much all search engine top results (e.g. overly seo-optimized crappy articles). This on it’s own might be a good topic to explore.
Yes i never thought about that..
Google(and some other companies) filter the search results and what you see on the first pages are articles that are guaranteed to not spread controversal speech. That is a huge part of speech and the amount of false positives is a big issue. There are search engines not doing this but I don´t want to get banned for advertising or something.
Pretty sure they have talked about it. 🤔
OMG it's like, "Could you search for something I typed in?!" So much worthless garbage always comes up first and I have to manipulate my searches beyond recognition just to get want I need.
@Ľuboš Mudrák Yeah that stupid woke trash pisses me off as well.
This comes up a lot. In fact, it's why these days I look for answers on UA-cam instead of on the web via Google. Partly, you pay to have a web page but get paid to post compelling video on YT. But also the people gaming the algorithm aren't the ones with the answers I'm looking for, they're the ones with something to sell. Including tech and especially gaming news sites, where editorial/ethical standards are lax and they're more interested you loading the page than reading the article, let alone getting something worthwhile from it. When a good site does appear, a big media empire acquires it and hollows it out.
Switching search engines helps because a lot of SEO is specific to Google. Google's attempts to curate content are much worse than useless.
I will say, for gaming and general use I downloaded Manjaro as for the reasons you stated and tbh even as this is my first linux distro I’ve EVER touched, although slightly difficult, I search through some forums and find solutions relatively quick. I originally installed it on a system with an nvidia GPU, and am actually having a harder time getting Manjaro set up on a Microsoft surface 4 😂😂
Also, running Manjaro only on systems I intend to learn on. I have a windows 11 laptop with gaming components that run pretty much what I want 🤣 but I do game frequently on my Manjaro desktop, just a couple games are completely unsupported on Linux so I cannot even consider trying
UA-cam launched a members section
4:19
“If I want to stay out of the weeds I should stick with something based on Arch” brand new sentence.
Btw, that fun highlight switching in Linus' start menu isnt a *bug*. Microsoft decided, that it should work with game controllers, so if you have one lying on its face with the joystick tilted a little bit, that happens. I was troubleshooting for days because of that a while ago.
Using controller on a PC. You got what you deserved LMAO
@@SuperFlawless2010 There are plenty of games that work better with controllers: racing games, platformers, some action games. If you wanna play Forza on a keyboard that's your prerogative but I'm gonna think you're weird.
@@SuperFlawless2010 Sorry but that's a braindead take. The best thing about the PC platform is the choices you have, including whether to use keyboard/mouse or a controller.
@@SuperFlawless2010 huh?
oh it's a bug alright. it happens to me all the time even when I do stuff with the controller or unplug it etc. definitely bugged even if it's a new feature.
Feels good seeing Luke back on the channel outside of the WAN show.
It's great to see Luke back. Sometimes I wish he was on more then I realize other than Linus he is on LTT more than any other host because of the wan show.
@@alexdavis9324 im must glad he put his big boy pants on instead of the leecher he felt like when he started lol, the stories of his "office" attire would have made me and many people i know quit in that setting lol
@@mikeymaiku Can you elaborate on that?
@@mikeymaiku what are you talking about?
@@mikeymaiku you seem not not actually know the real story of how it used to be in the old office house
A few months back I also tried to switch to some form of Linux for the first time. I would think I get along Windows on quite an advanced level and (un/re) installed different versions of Windows many many times. Yet, I was entirely unable to even install the Linux distro on any partition of my SSD.
In manjaro, you have to enable the control in the steam settings, so that the games recognize the control. Settings > Controller > General Controller settings, then just check the option Xbox Configuration Support, in the case of xbox controller, And that's it, just be happy. Remembering that there are some games that recognize them by default, if you notice bugs with the control, try to deactivate the option
"Hi, to install Steam, first we have to uninstall FCKING EVERYTHING"
That does look like the kind of bug that really shouldn't have reached any end user. Glad that the Pop!_OS team fixed it, but judging from other comments, packages nuking the system are common enough to be a "feature" of the distro, like windows' BSoD.
The last time I had a BSoD, it was caused by my 24-pin not being seated correctly. Windows, despite its reputation, does not bluescreen often.
@@Telogor YMMV. Last time I had a BSOD, it was caused by it being a day that ends in "Y".
Should've been just tested before release.
Glad that the Pop!_OS team fixed it,
> Distro advertised as good for gaming specifically
> Apparently they update the main gaming distribution platform package without checking even once if it works from fresh install
> it not only fails to install, it easily breaks the system given some user mistakes
(tho just reinstalling x shouldn't be a rocket science really)
That's a fail so spectacular they should just quit IMO.
I had only one BSOD in last 5 years, that too when I tried to undervolt a CPU.
I like how the video quality tanked when the confetti flew up. It's like Tom Scott, himself was there, laughing as he started kicking the codec's teeth in.
I will be here to remember this moment when they eventually reupload the video to fix that.
@@TH3C001 it's not a video issue, just UA-cam compression algorithms who cannot deal with it.
Same with the dreaded rain in any video game
I have tried to use linux for a bunch of basic tasks and there has always been problems. I have had computers thats only task is to play spotify, the automatic update system getting fucked up, fucking the system up and then i have to go in and fix it. I have never asked a windows pc to play spotify, and fail at that task but linux did.
Its funny rewatching this now as I recently nuked my Mint desktop environment as well! Luckily found a quick fix but it happened in almost the exact same way, so its easy to do if you're not paying attention
I'm not ashamed to say, I missed Luke. So glad to see him back. Really glad you guys are doing this challenge and sharing it with us. Its going to be quite a show.
I like how every time Linus says "GUI" the subtitles say "gooey"
Well that is what he's saying
Meanwhile, in Spanish: _Güi_
Linus playing Cave Story brings me so much joy it's not funny. It's an incredibly nostalgic game for me.
I recently switched to Linux Mint for the last month or so after using windows on my machine since forever. At first it was an absolute train wreck of an experience to the point I was considering going back to windows because my second ssd wouldn’t mount automatically which caused problems for downloading games from steam and it was a gamble anytime I wanted to download a game. It magically fixed itself after I was on the edge of downloading another Distro(it heard me is what I’m guessing and got scared).
But besides gaming, everything’s been a breeze from working to listening to music to using discord. I’m glad that I finally got away from windows. I had been meaning to for the last year after I tried mint earlier in the year but I still wasn’t wanting to go all in since I really liked using gamepass and epic games for its free games but I’ve moved past that and am now a proud Linux user.
sudo: "are you sure?"
Linus: "Yes, do as I say"
sudo: "Alright team, he said Yes, let's show him who's boss. Apt, do the thing"
depressing for such a bad screw up from the pop team to be the first thing many curious users will see in this video
except it did not. He said `sudo apt-get install steam` not sudo apt-get remove popos*`
If you read the first comment of the comment section, you see it’s a bad timing and lack of knowledge about errors from Linus. Some errors/prompts are there to throw big red flags.
@@gamunu.b Exactly, I'm genuinely curious how Linus managed to nuke the system with trying to install Steam? The 'Yes, do as I say' is a big deal for someone who knows linux, but a newbie?
@@aedieal Yes, but I suppose is natural for most (gaming) users to want to install Steam. So, I can't blame him for forcing the install even when the GUI said no. I don't know much about package maintenance, but why would removing the display server be required to install Steam? If the package had worked properly he would have been able to get gaming immediately.
Wonderful - just imagine Linus employees always asking him now on every occation: "Are you sure about this? Then please say 'Yes, do as I say'
This is the most underrated comment in the whole comment section
Or he can just say "sudo" if it's more important than other tasks
@@foreducation408 not any more 🤣
lmao, that'd be funny if this became a inside joke
Why do they seem to be terrified of Linux Gurus, like everyone in the linux communitty that I've met are all reallyfriendly and understanding?
You have been lucky. In my experience, the Linux community is highly toxic.
6:05 I actually had that bug too at random times, it seemed to be some controller connection I believe.
Added note: I'm using linux mint on an old laptop nowadays too to be a server for Klipper (3D-Printing) and Java Discord bot server :D
"Who would sponsor this madness?" - Glasswire! - a product that DOES NOT RUN ON LINUX! HAHA! LOL
To be fair, as someone selling something for Linux, would you want to sponsored a a video of a well known tech reviewer who knows nothing about Linux using it for the first time? It is bound to not go great, because everyone expects it to he as easy as it is for them to use a OS they have used for decades immediately. You especially aren't going to want to review it given how badly it went.
who knows? maybe they're betting on this experiment to end in horrible failure. Linux is great. Linux desktops are not.
@@jtcressy1 i disagree
Android is Linux.
Just a little bit of wine and you're good to go
It's hilarious how luke had fairly smooth sailing while linus had third world war blackout. It's like even windows decided to glitch on him.
I mean, his set up by itself is quite complicated already. Much more that can go wrong.
but gravity glitches for Linus
Linux tends to go pretty smooth on common hardware, but once you get into obscure setups anything can happen
There were some software issues (cave story not picking up controller), and some config issues (his monitor is the default audio output, not the GoXLR, hence no sound), but otherwise it looked like all of Linus' stuff was working.
@@billy65bob Lol we just gonna ignore the whole installing steam DE nuke? Alright alright carry on smooth sailing ahead.
Tried to start using mint a few months ago on my desktop, but when I realised none of my bluetooth stuff worked (keyboard and mouse), my wifi dongle wasn't recognised and neither was my sound card, I just couldn't be arsed to keep it. Bluetooth ended up working, but I had to resynchronise everything every time I booted the computer. I had mint on my laptopt for a while though, and it was much smoother, as everything was recognised automatically. Still I needed too many softwares that weren't available on linux, so it didn't work out for me.
I installed the new Debian release today, and saw there was a changelog entry under apt crediting LTT and System76 for bringing attention to its solver being able to remove Essential or Protected packages.
Guess this video is why
As someone, who never watches the WAN Show it is really nice to see Luke again in a video, I almost forgot about him being a great host.
I'm so sad about Luke not presenting anymore
Watch the wan show. Always. it's very entertaining, I promise.
@@realtechhacks i always watch (well technically just listen) wan show when im driving to work. I travel for 3 hours and this is my companion the whole way haha. Best podcast material.
@@Pichipieify I always listen to the podcast format and it annoys me to no end how long it takes whoever from lmg is responsible to put it in that format.
Actually, Linus, by having that issue with Pop and instantly distro hopping, that automatically makes you a top notch linux chad xD
Man's got no time
You know what, if we did this challenge every year with different members of LMG every time then everyone at LMG can familiarize themselves with Linux and maybe Linus can overcome his Linux trauma!
I use Linux (Arch BTW) daily for games and coding and have no problems getting anything to work, I can appreciate that users coming from other OS's would have issues because everything is new and can be a little scary. It is really awesome that you gave it a go. You could imagine that a Mac OS user that has never used Windows would be having issues, installing drivers through WIndows wazards is different than Mac, all the settings is different etc. Great video!
No OS should expect someone to write console commands to install a programme. I have to use Linux for work and I have to do so sometimes and it not only annoys me but it also never works as it should. I'm sure that Linux users don't have that problem or just don't care about that because otherwise they would've switched to Windows or Mac (although I hate Windows 11 too, I'm sticking with 10). I don't want to offend Linux users but I personally (!) hate it, although I'm sure there are advantages but what I mentioned is a heavy disadvantage. Windows is simply more user friendly (my opinion).
@@jobenco5757 Try switching distro. Arch and Manjaro have the AUR so you almost never have issues having to install something. I work using Linux as well as a software dev, even the Jetbrains toolbox was in the AUR. I hope you have more luck in the future and gain more love for Tux the Linux Penguin :D
@@bil4x467 1. I can’t switch distro, it’s the company pc and it’s Ubuntu.
2. It‘s also for software development
3. I use windows personally and can’t remember an installation not working and also can’t remember ever having to use the command line. I‘m fine with using commands (if it worked, it doesn’t though) on Linux but the average gamer isn’t. If you watch this series, which you do because you commented here, you know why.
Respect to Linux users for not having problems for some reason but I never get a single thing to work better than on windows. I‘m doing home office recently and everything works so much better. Linus‘ experience with things not working is pretty much exactly my experience and that can simply not be expected from an average user making windows the more user-friendly option. Simply download something, which is mostly supported on windows but not Linux, and run it by simply clicking it in the downloads tab in the browser itself, hit a accept and a install button and done and working. But on Linux I download another program to support it, then download it there, run some command like -sudo apt… or something like that which has to be found after research on the web and then, it works, sometimes.
@@jobenco5757 I fell for you. I moved away from Debian (which Ubuntu is based on) distros because of issues installing software. Have you tried setting up snap and flatpak? They should work with the software center app and there is a lot of software in there.
this is a good example of how SEO-hungry blog "articles" are annoyingly unreliable in general, despite being at the top of the google results. happens to me whenever i google a broad/general topic, such as "alternatives to [software]".
This almost got me crying because I was trying to find a very specific piece of info for an assignment and got absolutely nothing
Internet search as we know it is dead. It's a pitiful time for information.
I spent days trying every program that shows up when you google "how to make a bootable usb stick". None of them worked. What I needed was one article to say "You need uefi enabled to boot from usb. Do you have uefi enabled on that 8 year old crappy laptop you're trying to update?"
It was Toms. A site I'd have gone to *without* a search engine, as they've been mostly getting it right for at least 25 years.
@Atlas Dankworth I miss the forum results :(
I really hope they go through with this series, because this will set realistic expectation for new/interested users
My personal experience from running Linux full time for several years has been that every year its noticeably better, but for enthusiasts with enthusiast hardware it can be a royal pain, but if you're running similar hardware to what you'd find in an office it'll be pretty smooth. Additionally game compatibility, especially using Wine and Lutris tends to be very hit or miss and what works for most people can entirely refuse to work for you, and lots of strange bugs and crashes that you never know where the issue lies.
Personally, I have a windows Gaming machine then do everything else in Linux to get the best balance because game compatibility is always a hassle at the worst times, but windows is also a hassle at the worst times when you want to do pretty much anything else.
Actually, this is an perfect example what NOT to do, that Linus did.
When the package manager basically scream in your face not to do that, and you continue, then it is an accident to happen.
And it did.
If Linus has known what he did, he would not forced the package manager to install Steam package. And he could as easy reinstalled the GUI.
Yes, Linus is great at administrating MS Windows, because he basically have done that for 20 years or so.
BUT when it come to Linux, he really is a beginner, and should not expect what works in MS Window swill work the same in Linux.
@@AndersJackson It's still a good example of how a regular user will see things. I have users that have to call multiple times a day from locking themselves out of AD or don't know where the start button is. THAT is normal users. This is a hospital btw, doctors...
@@AndersJackson Sounds as if you are putting any blame at all on Linus (even if it's just 1%). It was 0% Linus' fault. These sort of problems are why people don't use Linux; people should not be expected to know anything.
@@AndersJackson this is why I like to use new linux distros in vms. Worst case I just roll back to a working snapshot.
Reminds me of my early days of installing Linux and installing other stuff on that 😮💨
This video gives me those nostalgia feels 🫠
When you tried to install steam, the packages in the warning was actually all the packages of the desktop. So, you've effectively removed the desktop environment. The fix is to run sudo apt-get (desktop name)
"The following will be removed: Pop-Desktop"
Linus: "Yes, do as I say"
LOL
Why steam installer even try to offer to remove desktop?
It took all the dependencies with it too lmao. Bye bye xorg
@@whycheesus pop team made a big mistake, fixed it in an update very quickly but didn't force linus to update after/during installation so he got hit with an insane bug that should not have made it out in the first place
@@notusingmyrealnamegoogle6232 he recorded this before the update from what I understand
"Yes, do as I say" is a gate that's to prevent uninstalling required OS components. If I had to guess, the steam package was set to depend on a version of a library that conflicted with the desktop environment. For example, if it depended on an older version of libpango, and gnome etc wants this exact version, installing an older version is going to remove all dependent packages that will conflict with the request.
Luke: "I'm comfortable getting my hands dirty with grub."
Average person: "Me too, I love messy foods."
Er, yeah. Most modern distros come with grub2 these days.
God, I fucking hate that any distro of Linux breaks so easily. I love-hate Windows too, but I could never have Linux running on any of my relatives computers. Windows nowadays is BUILT to be solid and recover from fatal problems. We all hate the bloat, but it's stable AF and will run in any kind of weather.
If a complete home-user Linux OS where exactly as much money has been spent on developing it as much as Windows, or better yet, Mac OS, we'd have the same well thought out Linux we all want to have.
Linux just isn't there yet. ANY distro is insufficient to daily drive and keeping your sanity at the same time. Windows is a pain and a half, but I use my smartphone exclusively. Less headaches there but no system is perfect.
grub: DO NOT EDIT THIS FILE
*messes with the grub config file for fun almost everyday*
@@filleswe91 yeah speak for yourself there bro. Interesting opinion tho!
@@filleswe91 just a heads up most linux is not this unreliable, most being the... operative word
I installed Ubuntu, did fall in love with it a lot different than windows, but installed my graphics drivers had to do a nomodeset though to get to the installation but other than that had no issues with linux so far! Will miss some of my games though as not all games are available on linux yet
Looking back, I think this whole Event™ should've been a big wakeup to all of us that Linux's packaging and update ecosystem is fundamentally broken for normies and not ready for prime-time. The idea that updates should be delivered each system component at a time and each normal ass app you use should be installed through the very same system you use to update critical system components seems is so laughably prone to breakage that it's hilarious we ever let "beginner-friendly" operating systems ship like this.
The Steam Deck and Silverblue woke me up to the idea that a system can rely solely on third-party, containerized distribution for content and run a managed, image based update cycle like a mobile device to keep its user sane without compromising freedom. People will write it off as a gimmick for a handheld device but literally having a system that's entirely immune to dependency conflicts, easy to roll back, and can grab one big OTA image to update the core OS separately from installed apps is a big step forward for usability on any desktop platform.
Linus nuking his system while it warns him is just funny, but also very telling about the new user experience
To be fair why should anyone expect that installing a common software would want to completely ruin your System?
@@Mobin92 no I totally understand that, but the output asking him to type that silly string is clearly warning him.. If it was me I would back out of it immediately.
@@Mobin92 I mean, if the goal is to scare people away from Linux then it is working as intended
@@malisa71 And thats good news!
The thing is that Linux and its ecosystem do _not_ close out ways to shoot yourself in the, not even foot, stomach, because it doesn't want to take away abilities from the user.
Sometimes your really do need to do such operations for really advanced stuff. So apt let's you do thing like that if you tell it absolutely assure it you want to.
That said, it probably would be a good idea to not enable this unless a flag was set AND a file in /etc/apt/ had a config setting set to true (though one would need an alternate way because read-only /etc mount is a possibility).
Also, the phrase to repeat really should be something like "Yes, I understand this may break my system, but do it anyways"
Watching Linus uninstall his desktop environment was a little like watching a car crash, you can't really look away. 😅
But the steam package is installed -> Job done xD
Disappointing series of mistakes by the pop team.
The same thing happened to me with a basic kubuntu install. Just "apt upgrade -y" and bam. DE gone. Had to reinstall KDE. There was definitely something screwy in the Ubuntu dependencies for a bit.
The car crash analogy also works since the fault mostly lies on one side, but the other side isn't entirely faultless.
Installing any package shouldn't ever uninstall the entire display server and DE (I don't think there is any good reason for any package to do that except for removing an older version of itself), but Linus should have skimmed the text and seen "WARNING: the following essential packages are about to be removed, this should only be done if you really know what you're doing" or at least the message right above his prompt that warns "you are about to do something potentially harmful" or at the very very least, noticed the prompt was acting funky in asking him to type a complete sentence.
While Linus' assumptions were perfectly fair, the terminal did exactly what it should have with providing a clear warning that you probably don't want to do this and expecting the user to read at least some of what the terminal is displaying and then only proceed after explicit user instruction to do so, and the GUI did its job of going "ehhh, no. here's an error that something is off so you can get help" and not letting him nuke his system. It still shouldn't have tried to nuke his system in the first place, but the safeguards are there and did provide sufficient warning that you don't want to do this
@@Trainguyrom wrong. Packages have dependecies in them. Some dependencies tells that you also have to install these packages so you can use the package you want to install. But hey ALSO tell what package CAN'T be installed at the same time. The bug in the Steam package was the it conflicted with a package the removed, removed the GUI. Probably because the GUI needed that package installed that Steam package wanted to be removed to be able to install Steam.
The Gui package manager refused to install Steam, because of this. Because the used probably don't want the GUI packages be removed.
Linus didn't accepted that, went along and started the command line, told the package manager to install Steam package. The package manager told Linus not to do that, because then some packages that he probably wanted would be remove. Linus told the package manger to shut the f..k up and do what Linus told him, "Yes, do what I say!".
So then the package manager obeyed his master, Linus. Removed the conflicting package, and all packages that depended on them, which resulted in the GUI was removed and the machine booted up in Text mode. If Linus knew what he was doing, he could have installed the GUI and been back up running again. Linus didn't knew what he was doing. Nor when he said "Yes, do what I say!", or when the machine booted up in text.
1) It was the Steam package fault with the dependencies, which was fixed the day after.
2) It was Linus fault that he didn't listen to the warnings, and over ruled the package managers objections.
11:18 "Okay, so we've got the... noh-voo or however that's pronounced..."
*cries in French*
linux mint is hands down my go to recc for beginners. i may have just switched perm to arch 2 weeks ago but ive dual booted linux and used it mostly since 2011. linux mint is made for people who dont use computers. my friends first pc had linux mint on it
if sudo apt install steam nukes the entire desktop environment, it's absolutely hilarious. never seen that
The error that popped up when he was trying to install steam even warned him that it was trying to delete some important "Pop" files, which was the distro he selected...
The reason sudo was needed was because it knew he was trying to delete something he shouldn't really have been and wanted to be completely sure ahaha
Apparently a package error in the Pop shop, which basically means the person maintaining the steam package fucked up dependencies... Whoops
@@Topyy yep...
@@Topyy which is just such unfortunate timing. I literally went through this same process recently and steam installed just fine, but the one time the most popular tech youtuber tries to do it and broadcasts it out to millions and it fails so absolutely bad that it could practically damage the brand for life.
@@RyanWAFFELYoung To be faire, he went the "advanced user path" without actually being one, he popped up the terminal which a newbie shouldn't do.
Luke caring what people think of him. Remember that quote Luke. "When you’re 20 you care what everyone thinks, when you’re 40 you stop caring what everyone thinks, when you’re 60 you realize no one was ever thinking about you in the first place." I'm 55! Haircut looks good Luke.
I know that quote is supposed to be endearing but damn that is depressing lol
OMG... I am more old that I thought.
I barely remember caring about what other thinks.
And I starting to think nobody cares.
I suppose to be 27 not 55.
So true I’m almost 30 and I don’t like that I care what people think, I guess I gotta wait till I’m 40
21 here and been on the "nobody's thinking about me" for the last few years
edit: and I feel really surprised to discover that people care to talk about me behind my back
Yeah its the biggest thing that teens out of high school need to realize ASAP. If its not a close loved one, nobody really gives a shit what you wear or look like. You'll be forgotten in 10 minutes anyways.
this video needs a sequel badly
"This essential packages will be removed..."
Linus: Go ahead man! what could go wrong!
I'm just imagining Anthony leaning back in a comfy chair with a glass of wine and chuckling as he watches this video.
Anthony is a mac user, he knows about Linux well but doesn't use it. Just like me, I use Linux, I know Windows well but don't use it.
I'm imagining him having a panic attack, screaming at the monitor
@@TheCommonSenseForRegularPeople The question is, does he not use Linux _because_ he knows it too well? 🤔
@@Remls it doesn’t matter how well you know Linux, there will be a bug or something that ruins your install beyond repair
@@TheCommonSenseForRegularPeople He's actually a daily Arch Linux user. He confirmed this on twitter. He might just use Arch on his macbook though.