Why People Might Not Get You - The Deepness Divide - INFJ Perspective
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- Опубліковано 8 гру 2018
- Welcome to episode 1 of 'Clayton Gets Deep While Sitting on a Comfortable Chair'. I've been doing a lot of thinking lately about how a deep thinker can communicate with somebody who just isn't naturally as deep. I've come up with an analogy that helped clarify the situation for me.
Clayton is an INFJ that likes to get deep. Have a questions? Post it in the comments.
The thing you said about parents not understanding your level of deepness totally resonated with me as an INFJ. It’s painful to always feel a lack of connection with those you love the most.
thanks for the comment and yes I agree.
Jon Burleigh at this stage , loneliness might bring that communication skill , as vulgarisation ; use the simple word attributed to that specific feeling of yours so you can really be followed out .. i’m actually working on that.. Then there is that inner harmony that we need so we can keep things going forward in our very intimate life. You shall love music i bet ^^ or reading. Writing is also a way to bring order , so we can relate each time with events* positively ; assuming the learning that we’ve had. It’s a matter of making our own determinism within our own chaos.. all we need is fresh air , harmony and stuff like that !
Find others to love like plants, trees and animals maybe a friend or two. Come to terms that most humans won’t get you but occasionally they’ll will
X&X i guess it is a matter of time , as an observer.. toward self acceptation then annihilating everything that wrongs your true self..
INFJ Parent here.
Always getting everyone else's point of view...mine is too deep lol
I'm an INFJ, I'm introverted, deep, deep thinker, Seems like I can understand other ppl easily, but others have a Very Very Difficult time understanding me. It's frustrating.
salonika... that sounds about right ;-)
Yep, that's it ....Have to admit to having developed an aversion to the very word "friend" and especially, "my friend".
I agree with you 100%. I love when I talk to people who get it!! So easy and rewarding....the rest takes to much energy.
Right
Very frustrating
I feel like I was accidentally assigned to the wrong planet. It's increasingly frustrating.
Same -- ENFP
which planet do you think you were supposed to be assigned to? I get your comment.
I think earth is unfortunately just particularly fucked up rn so i get u but in my opinion its more like i wish i could transfer n be done on this dump lol guess better luck next life 😅😐🤐
I have said this exact thing SO many times!!!!! And usually, everyone looks at me like I’m crazy!!!! Thank you so much for getting it!!!! ☺️🤗
I've said this so many times too! Hilariously true. At 62, I'm finally embracing my INFJ-ness and presently loving lockdown in the US; living blissfully alone for the past year. So many healthy things to do / learn and so little time. 😅
"You think too much....." I remember hearing that so often as a child from my peers. And I was like "wtf you can think TOO much?" lol
An INFJ once told me I think too much !!! ENFP
I heard/hear that too along with you are too nice. Very perplexing but I translate it to they can't think that hard, will get a headache😁 and they feel some kind of way for not being too nice.
hahahaha and I remember my mom used to say I'd get sick from thinking too much - But I just got a little lonely mom, just a little lonely...
I still here this as an adult, from adults. But kids, they're open to it, they still have their imagination so I try to guide them through the deep thinking process, help them visualize and never stop questioning why.
Letters to Sumin.... I was told the same... along with "you FEEL too much". Thinking and feeling too much?? Take that away and there would be nothing left of me...
I think the word "why" defines us
Truthseeker literally thinking of that yesterday, wow i can’t believe i just saw this. Haha how crazy is that
@@zstiles3366i think it is a need to know that drives us
Welll... the problem is this WHY is aimed at others, but can't be fully aimed at themselves. Thus the real problem with understanding may lie with you not understanding yourself and your own motivations and errors, while the others actually do. Thus the arrogance is often there, but substance - sometimes not.
As a child I couldn't stop asking why. Why this and why that constantly asking why till the day I drove my parents crazy. I stopped asking why for everything..... aloud
@@NJ-wb1cz it is the curiosity factor. You ask a question and are now curious what the answer is. You like learning things that intrest you, it is a passion.
Being an INFJ I have found has been extremely painful. It is extremely lonely and alienating. I describe it as swimming inside a pool and listening to others on the deck frolicking. You can consciously go up on the deck to have fun but you are constantly aware of being somewhere else. You are watching yourself interact. All my life my mother would constantly say, "Why do you analyze things so much? Stop doing that. It's not so complicated." Thank you for this video Clay. It is soothing.
I like your analogy
You notice how INFJ’s use their hands a lot when talking, like simply saying what we think or how we feel just doesn’t convey it enough...
Girl, interrupted right!
Yes, we throw our whole body into it.
Words are limiting, for sure
OMG yes... I’m having revelations right now
Wow!!! It’s like you took the words right out of my mouth!!! I am a 15-year middle school science teacher and my students laugh at me so often because I knock things off my desk while I’m teaching from swinging my arms and talking with my hands! 😆 I just get so excited and passionate about the things I understand that I want them to get too! The simple words and verbalizations of spoken language just don’t due the truth justice! So limiting....
It’s all so much bigger than our words can convey....
(Even that doesn’t sound right....lol 💗🤪)
I'm in my mid twenties, and my inner monologue for the past few years: "Either something is fundamentally wrong with human society, or something is fundamentally wrong with me." It's painfully comforting to hear the same sentiment, in a slightly different wording, coming from someone else. I thought I was the only one...
INFJs will know what you mean through intuition, even if you're not explaining something completely.
+
I think we all enjoy listening to a deep thinker. This is the right setting to do so :)
I just feel sad that very few people are deep thinkers.
Birds won’t let the fish be a fish. Flying jerks.
"Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid."
Sounds like an ENFP comment lol
Birds are beautiful and fun to watch, but once they start pressuring me for closeness, I get annoyed... very annoyed.
They shit on them too 😬😂
I am a fish and most of my friends are silly tweeting birds. But I am a people-pleasing fish so I regularly swim up to the surface to engage in a conversation with the quacking ducks and pretty peacocks. If I try to go too deep or philosophical, my friends fly off.
You are so funny!
I laughed out loud!
Thank you very much!!
Feels so good to laugh!
I will the exact same way as you do! 🌷🙏🥰
I believe u 👍 👌 🙆♂️
Yes same!!!
All of my friends are fish because I only have a few ,all of my acquaintances are silly tweeting birds😊
Today I told my friend about my need to connect with people. Explaining it elaborately.
She responded with: “Yeah I also wanna network and go to business seminars and stuff”
I was so disappointed she took such a shallow take on it. Sometimes we just have to accept that it is what it is.
This perfectly explains my social interactions with 99.9% of the people I talk to. And it's not even that they're all the way shallow they're just not as deep as I am :/. When I get deep around the people I'm surrounded by they think I'm crazy.. that's how shallow they are oof
TERRI JOHNSON
Can't stand it. It gets lonely as hell.
Word to G
TERRI JOHNSON this happens to me too I get deep when talking to people also I get passionate i get looks like I’m crazy or too intense.
😒 Have you ever even considered that other people may simply _feel_ what you're trying to say and don't need to _say_ it in excruciatingly primitive and verbose detail? That they would rather build on that foundation and use it implicitly in other topics and expect you to just feel that as well, and engaging in your "deep" conversations is like humoring a toddler who philosophizes about how soup and water are both wet with an air of superiority. It may be fun, to a point, but it quickly becomes boring.
@@NJ-wb1cz It seems we have a bird in the room.😸
Your analogy is spot on! I took the Myers Briggs personality assessment as well and found out according to the test I am an INFJ too. I am drained easily when I am with extroverts. I have to drink to mirror their mood. There was a meme I saw on Facebook that seemed to speak to me on how I have always observed human behavior. - Beneath every behavior there is a feeling, and beneath each feeling is a need. And when we meet that need rather than focus on the behavior, we begin to deal with the cause, not the symptom. When I do attempt and open up with others, I study and psychoanaylze people's behavior in attempt to find what makes them tick. People say I over think and should just take things for what they are. I can't do that because there is a subconscious need to dig beyond the superficial to see who the true authetic person is. It can come very intense and intrusive to extroverted types.
I totally agree, your words really resonate with me & my experiences 😊
I hate black extroverts, dragons & cannibals!
Lorena L Exactly
The irony being I find extroverts to be intrusive in their constant social interactions with me. Why bother talking to me if you have nothing to say, yanno?
@@supamundane I get that. I am trying to get past my selfish introverted tendencies to welcome small talk and try to maneuver it into something interesting. I think its the emotion and tone that get to me, personally. My husband is an extrovert and animated (I know..lol) he loves anime and sometimes I want to give them a chance. There are deep story lines in some of them. But the over acting, whining, crying, yelling in them drives me up the wall! Even as an INFJ, I hate displaying emotion such as anger and sadnesses. I tend to repress a lot. I am not clingy or needy and am content with my own company. Does any other INFJs feel the way I do?
INTJ here - My mom in her 70's setting around a campfire this summer with all her children decides to tell us all how she thinks of us. She tells my sister how big her heart is, my brother how good of a father he is etc.. and my other brother how hard of a worker he is etc... she gets to me and pauses for about a minute and says "you're just deep". Thanks mom, although I have a successful career and family and I'm a likeable person, I'll take that as a huge compliment! My mom is an INFJ btw. Great video as well and good analogy.
More Payne... Chances are, you're not 'always' very likeable. As an INFJ, I adore INTJ's... so smart and as deep as I am, ..but... they can also be emotionally unavailable at times and that can be misjudged as coldness...something you're not. INTJ's imo are amazing people, you just can't take it personally when they shut you out... they just need some time alone once in a while. My Dad was an INTJ and now my partner is too.
I think it's the best compliment, and I'm starting to see things a bit differently now. So glad for this post and all the others here.
As an INFJ I don't think I would have kept that so short 😬
You are AWESOME. X 👍🏻
Duuuude gotta find an ENFP!! They dive deep and then go up for air. They are brilliant so they can apreciate the depth that we offer, they are empathic so they have a good idea of how we are doing, and they have a beautiful ability to help us see our deep thoughts with fresh eyes. They are a balm to the INFJ soul. ❤️
Thank you for swimming with me today, Clay. INFJs need more penguins who know how to dive a bit. In the meantime, I'm going to manage my expectations of birds better.
The most beautiful thing is when that fish realizes it does have wings, it’s a flying fish. 🙌🤝
Black Massk44 I love that analogy!
I love this
I had the thought of penguins that can swim down to visit you.
Its like you found your way into my mind and articulated my entire social experience. I say about 3% of what I think and the other 97% is so carefully vetted, organized and curated from a mess of collected data, that when i am asked my opinion on something my response stuns the person who asked it of me. And i can feel them immediately regretting involving me in the conversation... because I often disagree with them and I dismantle their entire belief system using logic and evidence. Then I feel like an asshole and am tempted to feel like theirs something wrong with me.
That’s exactly how they want you to feel or “that’s your uncle talking” you’re an outlier one of the universes prototypes don’t ever take sides with anyone that can’t understand or begin to consider a concept that would make the world too spooky and implies potentially people who are different with possible spooky abilities why would someone make a monumental decision of “yes this is the steady state of the world and they believe in “Reality” who’s version? What do they think they know about it someone once in 2002 predicted Obama’s presidential election I heard him speak at the same time never having heard him before I clearly stated that is going to be the man that will come after “W”...
I sensed it or taped into a stream of conciseness flowing backwards in time I didn’t have a right brain subconscious epiphany that is one of a plentiful high quality high resolution years out pretty much spooky events that surround many of us. I predicted that a person would who was not famous would be sitting in a chair with exactly who was famous guests and the show was the self loathing Bill Maher it was 2.5 years before and witnessing a life time of family friends strangers and enemies who have been turning instinctually a tour group once asked me to guide included to take over the tour because of my obvious PhD in the place when I had never heard anything about it before or studied it before I just trust my feelings. Probably should have been less verbose but it’s been 5 days since I have actually slept longer that I stay up the night is almost usually peaceful but it’s the waking dreams in the neither world that is where I am deeply in the subconscious continent yes I must leave you now yes all of you... beware I can’t feel past 2020 either I die or something is coming I am going to turn to Salted penguins or maybe everyone else is going to be become more and except they are not just evolving into other no there are people who have been keeping secrets like how 1800-1900 was actually several hundred years it’s been weird waking up in a world where you would never see the outside of a mental insanity zone/hospital. It’s just dangerous to think that there are adults who run the world bullshit it’s newton gravity hypothesis who was 26 Bohr 27 quantum structure einsteinrelativity 26
From one fish to another, thanks!
I'm a cuttlefish.
This is why I love studying Greek Philosophy. I think it’s important to question everything. I mean, that’s how we’ve evolved as the human species. I don’t understand why people do not have that “sense of wonder”. It can be quite isolating when you can’t relate to the whole of humanity. So, when you are able to make those unique connections with others it can be exhilarating. I did enjoy the metaphor of the fish and bird.
You need to make a comeback. We need more INFJs of your caliber providing videos. I am tired of the 5 things INFJ... Or, perhaps the reason for this video answers my own questions as to why there aren't as many others...
Hey thanks for the encouragement. I decided recently i would try to hit it a bit harder and make more videos. I have a list of about 20 topics. I'm just finishing up the first one and will post it soon. Thanks :)
@@ClayArnall i know the feeling. I have even gone as far as completing all videos, but trying to figure out what to put out first, lol
@@ClayArnall Just please, no top ten INFJ... :)
@@HALFAMAZINGTV I low key want one now.
"Why did I make this video? I dunno..." 😂 (You're mannerisms are hilarious!) You made it so the we INFJ fish can stop drowning all the birds of the world! They just can't get that deep and life gets easier for us once we realize and accept this (it made my life easier!). The awareness will change our expectations and demands of others. Great video. Thanks.
As a teenager I always felt different from my peers. I love discussing literature and people like Abraham Lincoln while girls my age wanted to talk about the cutest boy in the hood and whether their hair looked good or their jeans were tight enough. I didn’t care much for those things. I ended up retreating myself and putting my inner thoughts in writing. I didn’t realized I was an INFJ at the time. To this day, I still loose people with my deep thinking talk. But at least I know I am not necessarily crazy. But oh to find someone to connect with at your level.. you are always hungry and yearning... the only people you can often connect with are people twice my age. Guys find me intimating and weird. Thus, I have given up on finding a man to even date as I find them either too boring or too insecure to hold an intellectual conversation...it’s the common story of most INFJs out there.
These videos are gorgeous and are excellent content. You're a brilliant creator. No idea why you're not over 6 figures in views. It will happen one day. Please keep going!
AccessKelly yeah probably because I made a video like every six months ha :) But thank you, I’m going to try to make one per week.
Because there is not that many of "us".
Nail on the head, thank you. Now I hope some birds watch this but it’s probably too deep
As an INTP I see the INFJ as the turtle and a lot of people around them and in general being the birds. Being the most extroverted introvert they appeal to both birds and fish. Thank you, I didn’t understand why it was hard for INFJ’s to open up but this makes a lot of sense. The only time I feel lonely is when around a lot of people I can’t relate to. Keep doing what you do INFJ’s, us fish appreciate the depth of your minds and emotional intelligence just as the birds appreciate your social skills and ability to be in the present.
I like turtles 😂
But all jokes aside: I really have "turtle eyes" in a washy green colour. My partner always jokes about it. I still have not found my right type, but I know for sure that I'm an intuitive person in a " mostly sensors " family, what you said about families is so true.
Actually everything you're saying makes totally sense, so don't worry. English is not my native language, but not only was your wording well understanable, your insights also were kind of familiar.
These comments make me feel like I'm not losing my mind when I say no one understands me..I truly hate being a infj
It is no better as an ENFP btw. Ne dom followed by Fi makes for an interesting life.
"Wise men carve the loneliest paths;
fools are always finding each other."
~ Valus
I am an INFJ also. I find the great divide in conversation and interests for me is not with the extroverts but with people whom have a variation of the sensing function in either their driver or co-pilot functional stack. It’s kind of a resistance to talk about anything deeper than restaurants and places they have been. I am married to an ENTJ and it is also hard for him to not be bored with where the conversation goes with the higher sensor types. Luckily we both love to talk about deeper parts of life. Like our faith and present day humanity. When I meet another intuitive my conversation is energized and time passes by so quickly. I think it’s that not in all cases but many intuitives feel misunderstood and alien and. When they find deep thinkers like themselves it’s just heavenly.
ha yeah, I've said that before as well: everybody just wants to talk about the weather, their house, what we just ate and what we're going to eat next :)
Exactly, it's such a rare pleasure to find some other deep thinkers / intuitive types. As we're by far the minority, it's important to pick the people we spend time with very carefully.
@@ClayArnall I was in such a conversational atmosphere this week. No one can go where I go when I pick up the thread and take it deeper. It's not that they won't follow, its THEY CAN'T FOLLOW. They just can't and that's just how it is.
can confirm, it's heavenly when you find them
This is about sensors versus intuitives, mostly, no? But from an intuitive-biased perspective. Some "fish" occasionally jump out of the water into the air. If one fish jumps into the air more than the other fish, that fish will think, "Man, I'm really good at flying!" while the bird thinks, "You call that flying?!" Meanwhile, the fish takes a personality test in which is asked, "I am good at flying. Agree or disagree?" The fish exuberantly selects "strongly agree" and the result is the test types the fish as a bird. 😅 Everyone peacocks their inferior functions sometimes.
Introverted functions will lend themselves to that feeling of isolation from the outside world though. Especially if you're stuck in an Ni-Ti loop (or, say an Fi-Si loop for an INFP). Introverts may be harder to get to know, but not all have that "depth" once you do.
Probably worth noting that all types with Se inferior or PoLR (INFJ, INTJ, INTP, INFP) will likely feel very disconnected from the "real world" around them. And likely misunderstood as a result, in this world where sensors far outweigh intuitives and our society values sensing.
Oh you brilliant woman!!!
What is sensing vs intuitiveness ? I am new to this.
Yes that does play a role. Intuituves explore ideas and sensors are practical. It's moreso abstract vs concrete that makes someone deep. Introverts are more abstract and extroverts are more concrete.
It can be really hurtful (as a fish) to connect with a bird on one subject and then be confronted with the reality of how incompatible you actually are when you become familiar.
It is hard to get all of our needs met. The need for depth is seldom found for myself either and I am an ENFP. Sometimes I discuss these things with sensors. They find it entertaining at least. Apparently ENFPs can be good storytellers. I wonder how many times I lose my audience.
I'm three years later to this video but I have to say how much it resonates with me. I've been called "analytical" since childhood. I always have said that I get unfulfilled by shallow conversation. Bored. I consider someone a good friend if they can go deep with me and also aren't afraid of my tears, as I wouldn't be afraid of theirs. When it comes to relationships, it's quality and not quantity. Thank you for having this channel ✨✨✨✨
Completely agree. Awesome insight! Thank you for the metaphor.
Being married to a bird when you’re an unrealized fish is rough because when the fish learns to swim freely the divide gets bigger unless changes and awareness are made.
I have those same thoughts about craziness and sanity... especially when you are such a minority thinker growing up with birds with mental illness. I am constantly doing sanity checks on myself... obsessively. We enjoy our own company but when we meet another fish it is like EUPHORIA! We swim a little higher.
What I also find interesting is how I can mirror high or low energy (it rubs off on me) but if someone is TOO high energy or too much of a “bird” then it can sink me lower than I was previously, not bring me higher. I think this is because our battery life gets drained faster with super high energy people. Kind of like having the roaming feature on your phone all of the time which drains the battery faster. We are awesome listeners and can go pretty deep into some dark places with people but people who need constant attentiveness, validation, and feedback are overwhelming to deal with for extended periods of time.
Anyways, had to learn to let some birds fly as, for some reason they gravitate to us fish, and find more fish or turtles otherwise, life gets pretty depressing.
It must feel lonely sometimes being a fish a married to a bird but don't be discouraged. It doesn't mean it can't work! If God brought you together maybe the differences between you, although painful at times, could help sactify you both. Don't give up... I am married to a turtle. I need those fish in my life and You Tube videos like this to help not feel so lonely and crazy : )
Marie Grace Thank you for the encouragement!!
Great depth analogy Clay. It really resonates. A few ideas streamed in while watching here in the UK, so here they are:
#1. “You will never be fully understood”. And it’s not another person’s job or role to understand us. Seem to recall hearing this on an old Wayne Dyer audio, and I’ve found it very freeing to adopt.
#2. Since I have a strong proclivity to go ultra deep - and I recognise most others don’t - the fun for me often comes from keeping a conversation topic “light” while at the same time ‘going deep’ with different communication styles. Find it helps elevate a conversation from being simply meaningless small talk babble drudgery, to a purposeful process of skill development and mastery.
#3. This applies especially to family members - I resolved a long time ago to simply keep conversation light and playful with them (if that’s where they typically hang out). I find it far more rewarding to see them have fun and leave feeling good (vs. dragging them into my own deep waters). In keeping with #2, it’s also an opportunity to hone my “light talk” models/systems/processes.
#4. Finally, I do have a few good friends who share the “deep” gene. Plus, if I want to indulge more, a good book/audio/video is never far away.
Right, enough of my waffling... Thanks - keep up the great vids.
Excellent video, mate. I’ve drowned a couple people too. You only do it to the ones you love.
thanks. That's true isn't it. You wouldn't even bother if you didn't care about the person.
Love the way you put the concept of deep thinking into a picture. This idea caused a major problem in my life that I had to overcome. I found the solution in a book by Eric Hoffer 'True Believer'. Eric Hoffer pointed out that knowledge separates people. People come together when they work together toward a common goal or are forced to work together.
I'm a Fish bruh. Lol 🐟
I Love this analogy man. It really comes down to a lack of RESPECT and UNDERSTANDING in our society today. They just can't let us be.
Clay, thank you for teaching me about the "birds." Now I realize they simply cannot swim in deep waters. I'm fine with a couple of fine fish! 💜
I am 54 years old and only realized 2 days ago, that I am an INFJ (further proven by taking a personality test). I have always felt like an outsider and have not met anyone else like myself. It took me until my college years that I realized there was nothing wrong with me and I was even more deep and intelligent than many others. As I grow older, I have become cynical of humanity and think we are doomed as a species, as I see too many birds not taking things seriously. As a fish, I recognize I am a perfectionist, but lately, I don't want to go to the shallow water, tired of getting lonely for the deeper seas. Very good analogy, by the way, Clay Arnall. I am a bit depressed from this as I am realizing that my personality type is rare, which explains why I feel so alone. Explains so so very many things. I promise to not let this go to my head and become more cynical, but at least I know I am not crazy. Thanks so much for this video.
I’ve been trying to figure out an analogy for this for so long, reading, and searching things like “are some people unable to process deep abstract thoughts?”. As a kid I was told there was something wrong with me and just in the past year I’ve been trying to understand that it’s really completely normal. Some people don’t think very deeply and that’s okay, we need them to keep us near the surface so we don’t sink too deep into our own thoughts. But we also need people who will venture the deep end with us, and I’m still trying to find those people. I appreciate you making this video because it gives me hope that there are several people like this and I just need to find them.
So much of this applies to us INFP's as well! Thank you.
And ENFPs
Great video! All INFJs love analogies! That's why Jesus spoke in parables - because he knew that anyone who was deep would get him and those who were shallow would never last. That's why he was a "fisher of men" - Thanks again Clayton.
I am freaking out how much this guy talks and contemplates about the same things as I do. The look in his face, the gestures, the way he speaks, the frustrations... I have never felt like I can see someone like me trapped in a body of a male. Is that weird? I think that is so weird.
I 100% agree with the first thing literally I never can enjoy going out with people without thinking about something that is so out of the whole thing we are doing,
i am also always have anxiety about the future, i think of this then that and just get anxious for no apparent reason
I'm an INTJ and thinking exactly same. Most people I've encountered in real life are way too shallow. I consequently believed the idea that those people are not only shallow but brainless morons. I found most of my friends over internet. But when I go in real life I feel almost like I don't have any real life friend at all. Btw, those people whom I met over internet are also real people but we can't hang out together in real life. Which is quite bad tho. Well, I assume we have both curse that given naturally for us to not quite fit in and the gifts(strengths) that what make us thrive. I no longer try to get along well with people. I generally say when there's a truth to be told without cowtowing to their bullshits. I can't see that of boldness from birds. They're too scared of what others think.
The part about taking people so deep until they start saying things they do not mean and contradicting themselves is on point. At extreme levels this could potentially be dangerous in a romantic relationship, as it could lead to gaslighting the other person into questioning their sanity.
This deepness divide is something I also experience as an ENFP. It is probably one of the dominant reasons for me listening to and being rather drawn towards INFJs.
I have two INFJ friends and although we are not super close as was the case of the first INFJ I met, they are able to hold space with me much more easily than other types. They seem to understand at least on some level what I feel and how I experience the world. I have also noticed there is more variety in INFJs than is generally believed believed. Some of your ideas suggest people MUST have certain traits and without them you are clearly not INFJ.
I listened to Scott Morgan's channel and was particular impressed in his understanding of ENFPs. He was spot on in his ability to describe how some ENFP behaviours and tendencies arise from our functions.The two hearts of the ENFP was rather an eye opener and does explain my gregarious tendency and at the same time why it might appear we are more strongly into you than you might believe vs. when our hearts have truly opened to you.
One of the new INFJs and in truth I am still not sure she is INFJ because she comes across in not a typical INFJ way. She would be the 14th though I am still not sure. When I first met I wondered if she might be ENTP. If I had to say a reason I might believe she is INFJ is that I seem to be drawn to your type. It goes beyond curiosity, I cannot quite find the word to describe the why of my reasoning here. I feel it has to do with wanting to have the experience of being understood as I feel many of you can hold space for others in a way that practically no one else can do. Carolyn Zaikowski has suggested this is the draw for ENFP towards INFJs.
I have yet to fathom what INFJs would get out of the deal from us.
Contrary to popular believe ENFPs feel a deepness divide as well. I feel this deepness divide comes from being N dominants. Some other ENFPs that have channels have suggested this also. The therapist I work with after a few years of seeing it has gotten used to the rapid processing that I have. Very few can follow it. Several people I have spent time with have noticed this rapid processing and I did not realize this is an ENFP thing. One of my students I worked closely with for over a year said that I am the fastest he has ever seen. He taught Engineering once so must have been around a lot of sharp minds as such his observation is noted.
I do get interesting conversations from time to time but its been over three years now since I have had a meaningful conversation. I think that is the reason I look for INFJs, you seem the type that is most likely where I will find shared meaning.
I feel that you are rather well rounded in your INFJness. It has been suggested that well rounded people are more difficult to type. They are not quite so polarized with their top two functions. There is also an idea that functions are not black and white and that some people present stronger tendencies in one function. I feel my Ne is voracious, it will devour everything in sight in my search for answers to life and the why of all things. I have had to learn to meditate to turn this off. Ne can be a taskmaster at times.
One of the things I remember the most about my first INFJ encounter and she noticed with in herself as well as I did. We brought out the best in each other. I miss this aspect the most, to find again a person that has the ability to unlock my potential and in return I was able to do something significant for them. I suppose that is the truth of why I look for INFJs because you can bring out the best in me.
I wonder lately if lighting can strike twice. It is particularly interesting how I met my first INFJ. I have only told my therapist how it came about. It has an aspect of being predestined.
Along my journey in life, its seems as though deep emotional connections scare people. People are perfectly fine with living life on a shallow surface. Since i love solitude and don’t find myself getting lonely/bored, i am prepared to wait it out until i come across those that i connect with on a heart level/deep emotional level. I’m so glad that i don’t yearn for connections because if i did, i feel like i would just accept anyone into my life/space rather than organically accepting heartfelt relationships into my life. I also want to add that i have crossed paths with people that i connect with on a deep level and the experiences were absolutely wonderful. I trust that these kinds of experiences will continue to show up in my life. I trust this with all of my heart so i won’t worry about it.
I'm a fish and my two closest family members are birds, it's unfortunate.
I love how you use an analogy of a bird and a fish. It's very telling of someone that has Ni function. It's so easy to understand, yet I find for sensors they get the analogy but not exactly the meaning, because there's just this abstract meaning that we want to get across 'beyond the analogy'.
-INTJ
I'm an infj and going through alot of changes in my life. Most recently, I just broke up with my girlfriend last night, whom ended up being a narcissist. I dont fall for women often as I dont get out much, but this is the second time I've been taken by a narcissist - exactly 10 years ago right now ironically enough. She made me feel like I was the crazy one and had me going insane. Mind you, were both 38yrs old and it moved fast. I just can't believe I let it happen again
This puts things in perspective. I have struggled with this concept of friend because I certainly feel like I don't have a lot of "friends" but it is DEFINITELY because I expect friends to bare their inner soul a bit so I can see the gold inside. I only know a couple people who are willing to do this. So many people only present their representative. Their cautionary self that makes sure they are saying all the right things and wearing the rights styles and showing the right photos on their social accounts. And I totally resonate with the loose definition of friend, "oh my friend this" or "this friend of mine" -- really important to allow the definition of friend be a bit changeable. What they really mean is "a person they know".
this is definitely an intuitive / sensor divide. the birds are the sensors. people whose eyes glaze over if you mention spirituality or deeper meanings or conspiracies or anything other fringe topic .
Me: Overthinker who is too stressed for casual or even close friendship
Thank you , thank you , and thank you again. I am a fish, have been for 55 years and listening to your video make me fell I’m not alone. I have been in relationship with narcissist and have tolerated a lot of abuse most of my years. I started watching your videos a few days ago and I can say for the first time in my entire life someone knows me without knowing me . I have no friends, maybe have tried to go up the water to meet a bird a few times but then feel more lonely with the bird than being submerge in my deep ocean . Just needed to say thanks .
Very good. They don't get to define what the present moment means. It's legitimate to say, "I'm ripping up underlying assumptions right now in the present moment, thank you very much."
VERY INTERESTING in that you're a friend in thought of this very concept.
After many trials of self-development I often wondered why it appeared as if I was I basically the only person I knew striving to self-actualize in respect to most others. With that in mind, I couldn't understand why I unable to engage in what I now distinguish "surface topics."
I often asked myself "why" was I making such great strides to self-develop, when I felt very solo in effort.
Like you, after stumbling upon the MBTI personality typing test, I tested as an INTJ a few times and felt prompted to re-test and received the INFJ type. While INTJ drew many relations, INFJ is most accurate.
NOW, in line with your video concept, I had the similar analogy (though mine was a derivative of astrological animal totems).
For the 12 signs, there are 4 sets of elements; air, earth, fire & water. My hypothetical examples were on the 3 water signs with consideration to their astro assortments...the sign Cancer: the crab, Scorpio: the scorpion and Pisces: fish. The most mystically- minded water sign and awkward to concretely comprehend is the fish. In my opinion, with respect to mutual innate comprehension, unlike the other two water signs, Pisces (the fish) is unable to completely emerge and thrive on land as in it's own world (water) has its survival needs.
For the sake of brevity, I came full circle with each element & sign a very thorough understanding with the human personality/ecosystem analogy to arrive at your exact with video- themed concept. 🤔😄
#universalknowledge
I can attest that this is the same with INTPs. I'm an Intp, and just recently got to know an infj for the first time. I'm mean not really well, but we have very deep conversations just naturally. My older brother is an INTJ, and we can go somewhat deep but it's much different because my Ti always catches flawed logic from his Te and Fi. So he's more pragmatic and goal oriented but I'm only after absolute truth, which he doesn't really believe in. So we're never on the same wavelength. But I'm comfortable around him most of the time because we don't have to worry about offending each other, shared NT and low Fe. And we have shared humor and inside jokes.
1. That whole question of "is it me who's crazy or is it the world that's crazy?" I haven't asked that question for more than a decade or two...but my "bird" family actually did actually wonder if there was something "wrong" with me, which naturally did cause me to "consider that possiblity" and to spend way too much time trying to be a "bird"... Sad, really....
2. It's easy to have a lot of friends when your definition of "friend" is anyone you've ever been "friendly" with...on the surface that is....which is the entire universe for those "birds". Since you posted this video, you also posted the one about the levels of so called "friendship" which I think totally applies. Most of our friends will naturally be "surface relationships" I think...which I guess is fine if we're not setting ourselves up for disappointment expecting more than that...and of course, all relationships really need to start there anyway. I think if we're very lucky, we will have ONE deep friendship in our life. I think they're kind of uncommon in this modern world.
I like to take time to process things at times, but I love to discuss my processing, and "the why's' with others. If I feel like I am the only one that wants to talk about deep things, then I just adapt really well to the energy that is being given or I may just shut down. Your video is is good at expressing how others have viewed me at times, and why I shut down if no one is interested in what I am thinking on. I do not have any close friends, but I oftentimes want to connect with people on a friendship level, it is difficult to have friends because Myself and others have different definitions of what connection & friendship is. Thanks for the insight!!
Very well done.
You articulated what I've been concluding the past few days. Simply; I'm different and it would be nice to find 1 or 2 like me.
I love your analogy about the bird n the fish. It's really well prepared. Thank you.
I could relate about trying to be friends with the birds n it's wrong. My 20s were waisted to make friends with them n most of it I was left alone because they thought crazy.
I am in my mid 30s now n I have an infj friend for the past 5 months n it feels like we've been buddy for years.
Dude. Explained so much (your analogy). Here's how I see it - people who really don't love knowledge, despise those who do. Why? Well, because it isn't OBVIOUS enough for knowledge to be useful. So society is geared (I think) towards those who don't care about matters of knowledge but rather the results of knowledge (which I believe knowledge itself is the cause of all existence and of all human progress).
Anyways, thanks for sharing!
Hey mate, you are not crazy.....you are just an incredible INFJ......you are unique in your special way.......trust your guts and your own personality........THANK YOU FOR THE INSIGHTFUL VIDEO....KEEP UP THE GREAT WORK, YOU ARE DOING FINE, SUPERMAN🙂👍❤❤❤❤❤❤🙂👍❤❤❤❤!!!!
Wow, Everything that you said is exactly what I've gone through always, I understand why now though your analogy was great with the fish and birds....lol
INFJ is very misunderstood ,for us this theorizing is normal and part of us which is weird not because it's wrong but people they don't thinks the same way and their mind can't even comprehend thinking like that always which you already know..... anyway you're just recommend it and I watched a couple of your videos and I'm subscribed now and I wanted to introduce myself because there's very few people who do you think the same way that I do and when I find anyone that I can relate to even if we don't know each other personally I feel a connection because that doesn't happen in life it's so rare cuz we are so rare.
Loved the video and I'll be watching.
Your insightful
Keep it up
I think we are here for a reason and we are the most misunderstood because we are the rarest but being a deep thinker isn't a bad thing.
It's difficult but up until UA-cam I felt very alone I like watching her videos because you help me know like some others that I'm not even though it might be very lonely LOL
You're not alone ..
I absolutely love this video! It's extremely validating to us deep thinkers and you came up with an apt metaphor and visual. I also like how you mentioned expectations of friendship and connections. I need to work on managing my own expectations of having very meaningful conversations with 'birds' 😉
Fish here! I m extremely grateful for your video and your beautiful metaphor and your suggestions. Sharing your experience and perception on things really helped and even made me smile. Gratitude!!!
I am 46 and just learned I am an INFJ and what that means. I always thought something was really wrong with me or with the rest of the world. I would feel super alone except that now I have a couple of INFJ and INTJ kids who have grown into young adults and are my friends. LOL! It is painful to feel like nobody understands me. I think that is my deepest craving. Thank you for sharing this part of yourself. It is wonderfully reassuring to know I am not the only one like this! And thanks also to those who have commented. It feels like a sort of support group for deep people!
This whole analogy is something I've always intuitively knew in the back of my mind with my interactions with people. I can kind of read the room and get a feel for how "deep" I can go into certain topics. Sometimes things are just too surface level for me, small talk, talk of sports, a funny slap stick video floating around on facebook that sometimes I can't help but bring the "birds" just a little down to meet me on my level, otherwise I'll die of boredom haha. Of course, I know the limitations, a lot of the time I just go a little deep so not to bore the "birds" or have them begin zoning out.
Clayton says that he thinks it's an introvert/extrovert thing. i do think that introverts tend to be a little bit deeper, but I think if we go into the MBTI, in my experience the biggest determiner ultimately comes down to N vs. S. Typically sensory people live in the moment, intuitive people live in the mind. I find that in my experience, intuitives are much more able to deal with deeper topics. My friend is an ENFJ and I have my deepest conversations with him, so I think intuition is where you'll find the most depth in personality types.
I feel like all 3 are part of each of us. Learning to be what and when is the key. Turtles are like your social self. We either surround with birds or fish. Or mixed up like me. I have friends who I've known forever, who will never meet.
This is dead on bro! Thank you for being there to listen to.
Great analogy in the sense that the birds can dive but fish can't fly for a single second and that is also what I find with these "super deep fish" is lack of versatility.
It's a bit scary that I used a very similar illustration when explaining why I can't become something I'm not and also why I shouldn't have to - for example a super extroverted person, or why I can't stop thinking and pondering about everything. - It's just who I am. But those birds look at a little fish like me and think I'm worthless because I can't fly like them. But so what? You can't swim the way I can right? Why can't the birds just see that they're different from one another and there is no good or bad. It's just different.
Well now when I explained it I realized that maybe it was more different to your illustration than I thought 😂 but anyway. Fish and birds 👍 Let's just appreciate our differences ^^
I love your comment! ❤️
I found your thoughts to be interesting. Because of time constraints, I was playing your video at 1.25 speed and I noticed something interesting.; that you were looking everywhere but at the camera, except for an occasional glance. When you are in deep discussion with another person live, I wonder if you avoid much eye contact with the person. I only recently learned to feel safe with eye contact with people during conversation. Could this be an INFJ trait as well?
I actually noticed the eyes as well. I do that sometimes. (INFJ)
I do that too... it’s not being scared of eye contact - I believe it’s a way of protecting our train of thought when going deep... eye contact can interrupt our thoughts as we absorb others emotions so easily - and when our own thoughts enter a flow state, we really love being in that place, as a result we intuitively avoid eye contact looking deep into our own minds so we can complete the thought processes uninterrupted.
Súper interesting because I’ve been constantly accused over the years of being afraid to make eye contact during a conversation. That describes it perfectly...all about protecting the train (sometimes very long train lol) of thought! 😆
I'm INFJ and eye contact distracts my train of thought too. I've been working on it over the years but it feels so unnatural!
The eyes and the hands thing is because when we conjure some imaging we look away into space to visualize them. The hands in my case form the images while I see them in my mind... The nightmare for interviewers... and other people who think you are nuts.
This video and thread sheds much light on what I've been wondering for a long time! Thank you
Just a few days before my birthday I found your channel. I'll consider this as a bday gift for myself.
- A fellow INFJ. :)
SPRIRITUALITY AND ASTROPHYSICS 2 MAJOR INTERESTS OF MINE WERE I'LL GO DEEP AND LOOSE AUDIENCE (INFJ)
Charles Roy spirituality, politics, organisational theory and group dynamics here - especially connected. I just want to make a mind map to show the layers to the world whilst discussing.
Amazing insight about what really happens to most introverts....did you ever put a camera into my head😁😄
This video definitely made sense!! So happy I found you, it's awesome to listen to someone who gets it!! It adds so much depth to our lives when we can connect with someone in a deep way of true understanding ⚘
Analogy was on the nose! what a help! Everything you said is how I've always felt, brother infj;; Please do more!
i agree with you with dissecting things into its little tiny pieces,, I often wonder beyond what I see.. I don't know why but it's just me.. and yeah,, with friendship.. normal people will consider someone as their friend right away just because they agreed or liked a certain matter.. but for me no,, even if we talked for already years and yet I don't feel any emotional attachment with you,, then I won't and never will consider them as my friend.. I need to have that sense of belongingness and will accept my weirdness which only few people will understand..
You expressed it so well!!:D
I’ve been there so many times…when you’re constantly swimming up to the surface and have no one to dive with…it can be frustrating, depressing…you feel like an outsider constantly. Thankfully when you find a few fish to hang out with, or maybe just one good one to go on those deep dives with, the birds are much less frustrating. When everyone’s needs are met, and no one is expecting anyone to magically grow wings or gills, that’s a good place to be…everyone is at peace with themselves and everyone else.
I loved this video! Goodness, this is me and your analogy of the birds and the fish was quite ingenious!
Ha, ha, deep, twisted and funny - perfect! Make more.
Thank you for this,dont feel alone anymore now to find some fishes.
I'm so thankful I've come across this video! I always think there's something wrong with me because of the way I think about things. Thank you so much for making this video this is soooo enlightening for me.😭♥️
So appreciate the validations from one who truly gets oneself and others with same and similar experiences.
So important to hear that I am healthy being so different.
Since discovering you recently, I am understanding and appreciating both my gifts and my challenges to work with and to work on.
Thank you again.
😂😂i feel like I’m watching myself . I tell these scenarios to my husband and I know he thinks I’m a mess😂
You’ve got something here and it’s you. So tell us about INFJ and the importance of purpose (service to others). Or the review of a book you’ve just read. Or on the ingredients of relationship mastery (see John Gottman for that). For the masculine, it’s about learning the discipline of #mutuality. For the feminine, it’s about recovery practices (gratitude, meditation) and self-advocacy. Keep going, man. You’ve got the #authenticity and #insightfulness down. One conversation at a time. Interviews too. Develop the content and enjoy the experience ❤️🙏✌🏼 -signed, a big fan and another infj (Aquarius). Loved your storytelling skills, just saying. 🎃
I relate SO much to what you were talking about and how you talked about it. I had to laugh half way through because it’s so relevant in my life. Thank you for being you, fellow fish. And thank you for making and posting this video, it makes other fish feel not so alone, including this one.
This was amazing! I've felt this way my whole life. Love the analogy such a great way to explain our differences. I'm going to get my husband to watch this as hes definitely a bird. Maybe it will help him to understand why I cant just talk about trivial things and small talk all the time. Thank you!!
Deep thought and contemplation are usually associated with Ti introverted Thinking and Ne/Ni Extroverted/Introverted intuition so there for the deepest thinkers by cognitive functions would be ENTP/INTP and INFJ which makes sense as Socrates was ENTP and Plato was INFJ in western Philosophy
Plato, a known wrestler, is an INFJ? Wow that really goes against typical INFJ stereotypes, but I guess that's why stereotypes are only stereotypes
@@mutantmacrophage6653 contrary to popular belief INFJ and INTJ are usually more physically Gifted with Se inferior than ENTP and ENFP with Si inferior because for ENTP/ENFP its more difficult to focus on present activity due to Se being in the demon slot meaning Ne is typically sacrificed when fully engaging Se
"Birds dont let the fish be a fish"... 😆👍👍 Oh my God!... I love your explanation! 😊👏❤️
I live with "birds" around me, it was so painful before i discovered that i am infj... 😕
Absolutely bang on! Explained my turmoil so well. I'm not crazy!!!!
Hi to all my fish! Thank you so much for these videos Clay. You are absolutely achieving what most of us want which is making a real impact in a way that matters.
So basically us INFJ's are whales in this picture? I can work with that :) Like your videos and approach to being an INFJ!
True that maybe, but we'd drown if we didn't come up for air. The nature of how the INFJ mind works, especially in light of its success rate at drawing correct inference, tends to make us think we're smarter than we are. But if you're all alone and do not wish to be-- which is very common-- a tension materializes, rightly challenging the aforementioned perception. Truly smart-- which is a world different from just being gifted-- would be to figure out what it is about us that makes us unrelatable. It would also be to accept that finding those things unrelatable is perfectly fine (and a function of personality type in the first place). And then it would be to learn to consciously shut down evidence (to the extent that's possible) of the fact that we possess those unrelatable traits. I'm not saying act or be inauthentic. I'm just saying there's real freedom in not having to be fully ourselves at all times. One of the ironies of the INFJ makeup is that we're so compelled to help other people, and yet among the things we could do which would be most helpful to them is to stop trying so hard to help them. Instead, because they reject us, at least socially, we tend to formulate conceptual frameworks (a very INFJ thing) by which to lessen the blow, and quite often the framework we come up with requires perceiving "them" as our inferiors. Meanwhile, what is it they're rejecting? It's not our ideas. Well, lol, sometimes it probably is, but I mean, think it through. They were rejecting us even as children, long before we had ideas of our own. What they're rejecting is pressure. INFJs are notorious for living in this bubble of constant self-pressure, grueling over things, maybe even obsessing over things, and constantly second-guessing themselves. We register as hyper-conscientious. It's the frowning, the nervousness, and the literal thrashing about that people see and get uncomfortable with. Watch even our host here throughout his video. Pressure. It creeps them out. And there's no reason it shouldn't. We're better INFJs when we see this and, well, stop it. The INFJ cannot, you say? The INFJ can never not strive for excellence. But once the INFJ recognizes that a higher form of excellence and service to other people actually requires masking over all outward signs of pressure, it's something he or she can do. We do not have to frown, thrash, balk, and buckle in conversation. We do not. Nor as part of every human interaction do we have to prove how smart or witty we are or how helpful we can be. We can swim on the surface. We can relax, and blow off some steam.
You wouldn’t happen to be a Pisces would you Clay?
Because I often feel like I’m going crazy when everyone around me is only able to offer surface level interactions.
Ooooooo Shiny.......
Im an INFJ who is also a pisces. Double whammy 😂
Merei Hatanaka Imagine being an INFJ gemini
@@LifeisaBeautifulting I am INFJ Aquarius 5w4 lol
@@LittleMew133 I'm 4w5 lol
@@LifeisaBeautifulting haha why.. as I'm one
It’s frustrating.
They’ll assume you’re shallow because of your extraverted feeling, and will back off as soon as you start playing with abstract ideas in front of them.
They might even call you inauthentic, somehow.
It’s a NEED for me to get deep every once in a while, it’s kind of unfair how some people don’t stand you talking about deep ideas while you’re patient when they’re discussing superficial matters or talking about a deep problem on a shallow level with a narrow viewpoint.
I don’t care much if this sounded arrogant, because as much as I try not to think of myself as a deeper thinker, I always get frustrated when some people just won’t take the time to understand my viewpoint.
Wow,..found this today. Never knew I was INFJ! Now I understand myself better and understand why most people can't keep up or understand me!!! It is a lonely place to be...