The vast majority of his videos' visual content consists of still images with simple fade transitions. I honestly can't recall anything more fancy than outside the intro, which almost anyone could likely whip up in a day at the absolute max if they knew what they were doing. I presume that it's deliberate to make up for all the research.
@@helltrigger87 Staff or not, releasing multiple research-heavy videos per week is no small feat. Most channels requiring a similar amount of research per video publish far less frequently.
Obviously, like many things on the internet, there must be a crew behind it. This person may be just the person who reads and the information may have been given to him. We have no way of knowing it.
Agree. His videos somehow turn what might otherwise be dry into something incredibly interesting and valuable. If anyone knows of anything remotely close, pls share.
Taiwanese companies have their fair share of poaching talents too. Around 2009-2014, Tokyo grew increasingly worried about the trend of retired japanese engineers popping up and rejoining the labor market in Taiwan. Lots of these japanese engineers worked in renesas, toshiba dram, national electric, and others.
@@seph9980 well i guess this explains the TSMC delimma, the young and talented want to climb up the ladders whereas the old and valuable are occupying the high rank positions, hence the renegades. tbh, it is good for the competition and for the world.
Liang is an unsung hero of semi-conductor physics. He single-handedly advanced IC industries and spat on the face of monopolies. His efforts would be remembered by all as the one of the reason why we have these technologies today.
As long as DEI and ESG initiatives stay away from Liang, his work will be okay. But As soon as Liang is forced to globohomotize and forced to be inclusive, everything he works for will go to shit.
When I worked in Shanghai, Liang used to frequent the "semiconductor starbucks" in Zhangjiang semiconductor port. An informal hangout place for peope who worked in the Shanghai semiconductor scene at the time. I have no way to confirm if everything he was saying about TSMC is 100% true, but he was very salty, nearing personal animosity about his seniors allowing "rot" from quid-pro-quo promotions to take root, and "circle hiring." As for what he spoke of his remuneration at TSM, he have certainly went for a hyperbole, unless he meant he was getting "less than 100k" in a month. The disaster with Liang has certainly made TSMC to correct since then. PG35-38 RnD staff salaries got more than doubled, and they toned down on hiring for senior posts from outside.
wow they hire outsiders... stick it to the locals and shocked when one of their own geniuses(who they walked all over) who has a conscience, wants to spread the gospel of Semi-Con science to other competitors . (shocked pikachu face)
On the other hand... those are exactly the kind of word-barfs you hear from people who do not get promoted due to personality issues. I happen to be "one of those people". But rather than bitch about it I've simply accepted that only certain kinds of people should be on my team, and that I should never be put in a position where I have to be "the considerate fatherly type" to make things go smoothly. I don't do smooth. I do effective. People on my team must naturally prefer extreme directness bordering on the outright blunt. "Yes" means "Yes", "No" means "No" and "This approach sucks" does NOT mean "You're a failure as a human being and I hate you now so please go and hang yourself". It means "This approach sucks. We must find another. Any ideas?". The upside is that my team is never late. We get frequent bonuses and extra days off, and our personel turnover is practically zero. People either ask to be transfered within the trial period of three months, or they stick around forever. And management has gotten increasingly good at figuring out who's a good candidate for my team. In return for never advancing I've gotten my own little kingdom. Upper management stays out of my hair, and I stay out of theirs. It's a win-win for everyone when not-at-all-people-persons acknowledge their shortcomings and just collect the other blunt/weird/awkward rejects and make a team out of them. And it can come as no surprise to anyone that in the tech fields there are quite a few who somehow traded social skills for technical prowess.
TSMC accusing the employee of being disloyal after they pushed him out. What did they expect? I’ve seen this time and time again at tech companies. 5% of employees do all the work and they’re usually antisocial and the first to get fired during lean times, then get constantly harassed by their former colleagues for help because they can’t do the job without them.
That's not just a tech company thing. I see that way more in government work, there are quite literally people coming at work, sleep and then only starting to work 3 hours after they were already in, meanwhile if you are actually productive and worth a damn, and finish your work way before your shift ends, you will have the privilege of getting more work, while your colleagues just do pretty much nothing and "look busy". And here's the kicker, if you do all the work for the day before the end of the shift, and then simply stay there and do nothing while not "looking busy", maybe talking a little bit to your colleagues. You will get a referral, because "perception is reality" Which in short means just look busy even if you are doing nothing at all. Which by the way this phrase is a butchering of: In the absence of facts, perception is reality, keyword: in the absence of facts. So yea the guy was just a stupid idiot. You think it's bad in private companies? You're completely wrong, most of them are looking for some kinds of results, because companies are driven by profits, so they actually want you to be productive or gtfo. I agree with your general sentiment though.
Can we talk about how guys at the absolute superstar level of chip R&D, who have impacted the entire world with technology advances, are paid 1.5M? There are youtubers who actively lower the intelligence of viewers and get paid much more. 1.5M is entry level chump change for CEOs. Goes to show that even the very best engineers need representation. Technical intelligence seems to have a lot of hubris attached that precludes engineers from thinking they need help, but clearly engineers are terrible at compensation negotiation.
Sounds like you could make a killing starting up a talent agency for technical creators, get a semi-union or actual union formed after signing a decent percentage of possible star employees, hold out for big bucks contracts commensurate with the billions in revenue/profit that their work product enables, take your standard 15% agency cut and leverage your social IQ and negotiation skills to make as much or more than those with a high IQ/technical aptitude while skipping having to get a PhD while working full time night shifts...
Small quibble - IBM did commercialize their Cu interconnect tech and Transmeta used it at the 180nm node in 2000. If memory serves me, it used aluminum for M1 and Cu for M2 or perhaps M3 and up. IBM's move to silicon on insulator and other events meant we needed to shift to other fabs - eventually settling on TSMC's 130nm process for the Efficeon.
@@Asianometry no worries. I REALLY appreciate your videos and insight since I'm not as involved with chip design now. I have a funny story about one of the problems we had with IBM's copper process at fab 9.
Yes they did. And even AMD was using Cu interconnect (ahead of Intel) during that period, though i can't recall where AMD license their Cu interconnect from.
wow, I learned a lot from this video. I never heard of most of these people. Even though my family is from Taiwan, I've never heard of any of them talking about these TSMC super stars
I'm pretty sure you're half joking, but the way I see it, as long as one is contributing more to the civilization than is taking from it, that's far better than most people can say for themselves. Also, it's about perspective. For example, in the movie, "Amedeus," Salieri was upset at the gods for giving him just enough talent to be able to understand Mozart's genius, but wasn't himself a genius. Salieri could've been extremely happy that he was given that much talent, compared to the 99.9% of the rest of the people, but he chose the other direction. Balance in all things is important.
Part of it is interest, and part of that is confidence, and part of that is having positive experiences at trying similar stuff, and part of that is how good you were at them, and part of that is how fundamentally able you are, so to say that it's all down to that is pretty silly. There are always a lot of non-fundamental kinks to iron out, like addictions, bad influences, and a lot of wrongly negative experiences to forget and replace. And, no matter how able you are, there's always value you can gain with your actions.
I honestly stumbled on your videos by accident, and have thoroughly enjoyed! This video was especially good, I really enjoyed the comment at the end, it's not the machines that matter, but the people. A great piece of advice!!! Keep up the good work! :D
What a fascinating documentary that was narrated brilliantly, rivaling Ken Burns in my opinion. You made watching UA-cam a great experience. Thank you.
This was amazing, no idea the history was so complex. Loved the final line, it's not about the million dollar machines, it's about the people. If the US wants to regain manufacturing prowess in semiconductors, we'll need that same drive, from the top R&D scientists to the process technicians.
amazing video. thanks for telling this story in such a way it's still understandable for not so technical people, but without leaving the technical things aside, which I aspire to understand more and more. greetings from Argentina.
Jon, this might be your best episode yet. Loved all the characters in this story. It's sometimes easy to forget there are actual wizards and geniuses inside these companies. More of this!
Great info. Though it’s HARD to follow when two or more names are said often. You should use a pyramid or something with their names, faces and positions so we can follow.
Its amazing how scientists that literally make or break whole industries get paid only 300k. Athletes and celebrities get that kind of money to wear some clothing for an hour or whatever.
That was only in China. God knows why he wanted to work there after being in Taiwan and South Korea. The video says he was getting at least a million a year in Taiwan and $20 million in other compensation. I'm sure he was getting paid handsomely in S. Korea. It clearly wasn't the money that made him jump ship to China.
@@chrimony $1 million annually and $21 millions in other compensation (over the 17 years of service with TSMC) isn't that much for a person of his stature.
For them to get paid millions, the price of everything you buy will have to rise. Sports and entertainment make money through advertising and endorsement....something other tech jobs can't benefit from
I have infinite respect for these wonderful people, considering everything I've been able to get computers to do for me, none of it would be possible without them, or at least not as quickly.
Lol legend! "Oh, just a quiet lecturer position... but the students are your competitors, and on their campus." Yes, bad faith move, but definitely ballsy.
Microsoft did the same thing. Poaching people from other companies and giving them a totally unrelated job title. But then they have daily meetings with those poached people to 'get their input' or 'bounce some ideas' off them.
@@rulofmg he was unhappy at TSMC because he felt unappreciated. There must be some truths in it because TSMC changed their attitudes towards their employees and increased their salaries almost doubled.
the “home town” discount - Less money but you control the industry - which would you take ... work on the bleeding edge or work at intel or ibm and make a little more
In the very early days of my career, I read the following in the San Jose Mercury News: "Great engineering beats great sex". Having tried both over decades, that statement is definitely true. How do you create a life with meaning? Are you defined by your creations or by your possessions? Remember a quote from Fight Club -- your possessions can possess you.
tbh though, it's still a lot of money, like way more than enough to have a good life even if he fully retire after he retired from TSMC at this point, i don't think he's in it for the money. There's a thrill of knowing you're being valued and that you're doing nigh impossible feat of engineering
Love your analysis and love your insights. Would love to see your take on COMAC, C919, and its future in the aviation industry as a competitor to Airbus and Boeing.
C919 is in its infancy. It uses Rolls Royce engine. Just like high speed rail and earth digging machine, Kuka, Chinese first buy the engine, disassemble it and re-create a better machine. C919 cockpit is newer and better as compares to those of Airbus and Boeing, same as Chinese earth orbiting space crafts, no wires exposed, neat, and newest wiring or fiber optics etc... China uses the world’s largest tunnel boring machines to build incredible mega projects ua-cam.com/video/nfkOwGi4QdQ/v-deo.html
I just commented on another one of your videos. I heard nassim taleb say if you want to write something relevant that will be read in 10 years, make it something that can be read 10 years before as well. I always thumbs up your videos. I haven’t seen this one yet. I’ll probably watch it in 10 years if it’s still here too.
As the old Chinese saying goes: When there are no more birds in the sky, the bow is stored away. When there are no more cunning rabbits, the running dogs are cooked. Liang must know it too. How he is going to steer away from that fatalistic end could be the biggest challenge of his career at SMIC.
Man, working for these companies sounds miserable. These top engineers that steer the whole companies success seem to get paid peanuts. I suppose the company would rather pay lawyers to enforce a non compete agreement than to try and give them the money they're worth and compete with others for highest salaries. This is the main reason I dislike non compete agreements, it stops companies from competing for top talent because they can just pay the lawyers a fraction to go after an individual instead.
$340,000 is peanuts for someone who is largely responsible for a whole company's success. That's how much software engineers in the US at big tech companies make with a few years of experience.
@@eyeborg3148 that's fine for general engineers that work under these guys, but these top guys are literally generating hundreds of millions for the company and are irreplaceable. They should be in the top .01% of salaries in the world. Instead they sign their life away to a non compete when they're first hired and are at the mercy of shareholders even if they find all these breakthroughs later in their career.
This is a very interesting subject but you just don't where to begin when you wanna learn more so thank you for these videos gonna check out the whole Playlist later in chronological order
Probably one of the most under rated channels on UA-cam. Well researched and extremely well presented with none of the irrelevant and misleading stock footage which is too common.
thanks for attention to this. managers and shareholders of couple of semi firms appropriating fruits of labor done by brilliant mind. also, end product manufacturers like apple benefit in billions. not forgetting some free-riding colleagues and rivals competing in politics instead of talent and ideas. really requires excellence and character to persevere all that. sadly, this is not work he can do alone without these distractions. unlike e.g. science/math, here a lot of infrastructure is required to try implementing designs, etc. people like that flexible enough to continue but rigid to fight nonsense are the driving force of progress. companies obfuscate specific names, but history needs to know such heroes
I was attending US collage in the early 1970's and read that many Taiwan Chinese scientists suffered discrimination and migrated to China in order to continue their scientific work.
Asianometry, thanks for the video. I would love you see you do one on YAGEO sometime! I know passive components are not quite as interesting as chips but I think it could be considered equally important.
Great video and very interesting, this reminds me of other industries, once you reach a certain level you better get your elbows out or you will get run over no matter how good you are. You'll never reach the top being the humble nice guy.
I find this series absolutely fascinating, particularly since the authoring a member of the culture, rather an outsider. The pronunciation is excellent.
Jon, I want to take a second to tell you I really enjoy your channel; thank you very much for helping us understand the semiconductor industry and its many moving parts.
I sharpshoot your content like I do my own (adult) children's work. It occurs to me that I don't praise your work like I do my own children's work. I'm a big fan. You're doing really good work. 👍
I think all the credit and recognition goes to the folks who actually burned the midnight oil and did the keg work not just orchestrate it behind a cozy desk.
Great story, told well. Of all these geniuses, my admiration for Professor Hu is greatest. It’s too bad he is not well known outside of engineering. TSMC may have to start spinning off some of its best younger people by funding startups. There are needs for revolutions in optical chips and interfaces.
Some time ago I read an opinion piece about who are the brightest people in the world. The three top peoples cited included Israeli Jews and the Taiwanese. This did not surprise me. An important note however is that intelligence is not static. It grows with the right exercise and a conducive environment. I guess brains need to be geared to engineering and science rather than politics and social competition.
Liang is not for money to go to SMIC,. According to WangXing (founder of Meituan, billionaire) said, Liang donated all his salary in SMIC to a scholarship fund.
The way you turn information-packed videos into beautiful stories is Amazing. Have you taken classes on storytelling? Cannot wait to support you in the future and I am glad to see your channel consistently hitting the views it deserves.
I live in northern California not far from Silicon Valley. Fierce competition and even paying what I would call bribes to foreign companies was normal. The whole attitude was, "Go, go, go." Many of those guys became kajillionaires from their early stock awards. I bought a pair of headphones the other day because they had a 50-hour battery life after just 2 hours of charging on the computer. I thought that was pretty amazing since I remember the days of the original computers that were not portable. All the devices we personally use are going to grow at an astonishing rate over the next few decades. President Biden said we're investing $50 billion in new chip manufacturing, so I guess the industry is still thriving. People who worked for Hewlett-Packard and Lockheed were keys to our past growth in this field.
HP not so much but lockeed most certainly was and so many other players have played an important role like IBM, Intel, the national labs like los almos, Brookhaven, the list goes on and on, and yes the growth in technology is not slowing down any time soon as it’s continued it’s pace of growth since the very inception of the first transistor in the 50’s and than the first IC… there is so much room and technology to be invented/reinvented/discovered that the landscape only looks to be open to continual growth
Thing is... The US doesn't have the human resources to produce chips cheaply and competitively, TSMC still won't bring their leading edge to the US factories, and the wage in Taiwan is vastly cheaper than in the US, there is also a lost generation of students who understand hardware manufacturing since software has been where the money is for quite some time.
Government backing is always for out-of-date industries and tech -- consider NASA working on that obsolete old-fashioned SLS rocket, entirely expendable, same lift capability as the 1960s Saturn V, $1B for one launch a year. Compare it to Space-X, then weep for the incredible waste of talent and time. When I saw that news about Biden backing the chip industry, my first reaction was wondering what was replacing whatever it is subsidizing. My best guess is it will be like SLS -- old fashioned, expensive, and late. A 5nm fab in five years. I'd almost bet on it.
"Take away my people, but leave my factories and soon grass will grow on the factory floors……Take away my factories, but leave my people and soon we will have a new and better factory." Andrew Carnegie. Thats why it is important to keep the people.
Amazing the cross fertilization between Japan, Korea, Taiwan,China and the USA in technology. The US attracted brilliant minds from Asia to both contribute & to learn with them & then these guys bring the technology back to Asia, set up companies who compete with America. Everybody benefits in a way that couldn't happen if America simply closed it's borders. It is the fruition of globalisation that many seem to be in a hurry to destroy even though they can't live without using the technology in their phones, homes, cars , work .... Where the hell do they think this comes from? These nerds have given do much to the world.
translumination2002 There is none like an American. All those were before Columbus. Now all nationalities of the world (some second generation, while there are n th generation guys, married criss-cross over generations). So a cHinese landed in America can still be American. Biological Cross fertilisation, leads to cross fertilization in ideas too. Engineering is about ideas, while Technology is about skills.
If you want to inspire a young engineer, let Asianometry describe the titans of the modern world with the same tone of a reverential professor describing Pax Romana. This is the EUV of teaching modern history.
You want to hear a depressing fact? All this Game of Thrones fighting with technology that runs so much of the world with billions of dollars at stake - and their salaries are around ~200k. The minimum salary for an athlete for even the smallest of the Big 4 sport leagues in the US is 700k. Granted, his salary did jumped at the end, there's likely more compensation through stocks and other hidden means, but when you watch and see the level of impact and scale invoked in those things, I was not expecting to hear 200k in any form at all.
@@OliverFlinn Brah, nothing I said above is about my salary. My comment is how the video cover so much drama and politics. The sounds like drama you would expect for people fighting over a throne of a country or at least way larger salaries than just $200k (well officially). It's a comment about how it subvert expectations and a bit of opining about what society rewards. Not about what I want to make.
@@OliverFlinn To get mansions, yachts, holidays, women, influence, connections, power, security and prosperity for yourself and your family, and everything else such a brilliant and dedicated genius deserves.
I don't understand how you can possibly produce such information packed videos so frequently.
It's called "staff" dude LOL
The vast majority of his videos' visual content consists of still images with simple fade transitions. I honestly can't recall anything more fancy than outside the intro, which almost anyone could likely whip up in a day at the absolute max if they knew what they were doing. I presume that it's deliberate to make up for all the research.
@@helltrigger87 Staff or not, releasing multiple research-heavy videos per week is no small feat.
Most channels requiring a similar amount of research per video publish far less frequently.
Clones!
Obviously, like many things on the internet, there must be a crew behind it. This person may be just the person who reads and the information may have been given to him. We have no way of knowing it.
I have no words to describe how much your work is amazing .. keep it up .. no channel is even close to your work
Agree, there is just no channel
Asianometry is flawless
Agree. His videos somehow turn what might otherwise be dry into something incredibly interesting and valuable. If anyone knows of anything remotely close, pls share.
Taiwanese companies have their fair share of poaching talents too. Around 2009-2014, Tokyo grew increasingly worried about the trend of retired japanese engineers popping up and rejoining the labor market in Taiwan. Lots of these japanese engineers worked in renesas, toshiba dram, national electric, and others.
Worry doesn't & can't solve Japanese problems of brain drain, do somethings‼️
Taiwan probably offered more amenable labor conditions. Japan has long been known for its punishing work schedules.
@@hananokuni2580 no, it’s just the ability to work beyond retirement age that allowed them to poach the engineers.
@@seph9980 well i guess this explains the TSMC delimma, the young and talented want to climb up the ladders whereas the old and valuable are occupying the high rank positions, hence the renegades. tbh, it is good for the competition and for the world.
@@seph9980 Pretty sure it's both. Young workers cannot cope with the work conditions, let alone a 65+ old retiree.
Liang is an unsung hero of semi-conductor physics. He single-handedly advanced IC industries and spat on the face of monopolies. His efforts would be remembered by all as the one of the reason why we have these technologies today.
true although sometimes geniuses are a pain in the arse to work with .. and this is a classic example.
@@vueport99
Did you worked with him?
And his salary is lower than some celebrity influencers. This guy helps make our world smarter. Influencers make our world dumber. Go figure,
@@TheWotageek He worked for companies that is funded by communist China and create a threat to the free world......
As long as DEI and ESG initiatives stay away from Liang, his work will be okay. But As soon as Liang is forced to globohomotize and forced to be inclusive, everything he works for will go to shit.
When I worked in Shanghai, Liang used to frequent the "semiconductor starbucks" in Zhangjiang semiconductor port. An informal hangout place for peope who worked in the Shanghai semiconductor scene at the time.
I have no way to confirm if everything he was saying about TSMC is 100% true, but he was very salty, nearing personal animosity about his seniors allowing "rot" from quid-pro-quo promotions to take root, and "circle hiring." As for what he spoke of his remuneration at TSM, he have certainly went for a hyperbole, unless he meant he was getting "less than 100k" in a month.
The disaster with Liang has certainly made TSMC to correct since then. PG35-38 RnD staff salaries got more than doubled, and they toned down on hiring for senior posts from outside.
Taiwan has traditionally (and still in many circles and industries) treat r&d like scum so hearing a doubling in salary is a surprise imho.
wow they hire outsiders... stick it to the locals and shocked when one of their own geniuses(who they walked all over) who has a conscience, wants to spread the gospel of Semi-Con science to other competitors . (shocked pikachu face)
On the other hand... those are exactly the kind of word-barfs you hear from people who do not get promoted due to personality issues. I happen to be "one of those people". But rather than bitch about it I've simply accepted that only certain kinds of people should be on my team, and that I should never be put in a position where I have to be "the considerate fatherly type" to make things go smoothly. I don't do smooth. I do effective.
People on my team must naturally prefer extreme directness bordering on the outright blunt. "Yes" means "Yes", "No" means "No" and "This approach sucks" does NOT mean "You're a failure as a human being and I hate you now so please go and hang yourself". It means "This approach sucks. We must find another. Any ideas?". The upside is that my team is never late. We get frequent bonuses and extra days off, and our personel turnover is practically zero. People either ask to be transfered within the trial period of three months, or they stick around forever. And management has gotten increasingly good at figuring out who's a good candidate for my team. In return for never advancing I've gotten my own little kingdom. Upper management stays out of my hair, and I stay out of theirs. It's a win-win for everyone when not-at-all-people-persons acknowledge their shortcomings and just collect the other blunt/weird/awkward rejects and make a team out of them. And it can come as no surprise to anyone that in the tech fields there are quite a few who somehow traded social skills for technical prowess.
@@andersjjensen Me too. " Circle of friends" mentality like mafia.
@@andersjjensen what do ya do?
TSMC accusing the employee of being disloyal after they pushed him out. What did they expect? I’ve seen this time and time again at tech companies. 5% of employees do all the work and they’re usually antisocial and the first to get fired during lean times, then get constantly harassed by their former colleagues for help because they can’t do the job without them.
Yeah, like some of them worked at GFs. And transferred the TSMC Management culture which I think is....
That's not just a tech company thing.
I see that way more in government work, there are quite literally people coming at work, sleep and then only starting to work 3 hours after they were already in, meanwhile if you are actually productive and worth a damn, and finish your work way before your shift ends, you will have the privilege of getting more work, while your colleagues just do pretty much nothing and "look busy".
And here's the kicker, if you do all the work for the day before the end of the shift, and then simply stay there and do nothing while not "looking busy", maybe talking a little bit to your colleagues. You will get a referral, because "perception is reality" Which in short means just look busy even if you are doing nothing at all. Which by the way this phrase is a butchering of: In the absence of facts, perception is reality, keyword: in the absence of facts.
So yea the guy was just a stupid idiot.
You think it's bad in private companies? You're completely wrong, most of them are looking for some kinds of results, because companies are driven by profits, so they actually want you to be productive or gtfo.
I agree with your general sentiment though.
@@alexis1156 We have a cultural word on this: work "wais". Sounds like wise. But it is more to be like work cunningly smart!
The 20/80 rule applies widely to most industries
so damn true
One of the best videos in a long list of amazing videos by Asianometry... thanks.
Can we talk about how guys at the absolute superstar level of chip R&D, who have impacted the entire world with technology advances, are paid 1.5M?
There are youtubers who actively lower the intelligence of viewers and get paid much more. 1.5M is entry level chump change for CEOs.
Goes to show that even the very best engineers need representation. Technical intelligence seems to have a lot of hubris attached that precludes engineers from thinking they need help, but clearly engineers are terrible at compensation negotiation.
Sounds like you could make a killing starting up a talent agency for technical creators, get a semi-union or actual union formed after signing a decent percentage of possible star employees, hold out for big bucks contracts commensurate with the billions in revenue/profit that their work product enables, take your standard 15% agency cut and leverage your social IQ and negotiation skills to make as much or more than those with a high IQ/technical aptitude while skipping having to get a PhD while working full time night shifts...
"1.5M is chump change..."
People do not need to be getting paid more than 2M a year. Idgaf what they do.
I think it's per month, not per year
We pay those who have the biggest impact on history the least.
@@msytdc1577 u mean like a silicon valley start up or venture capital fund....?
Small quibble - IBM did commercialize their Cu interconnect tech and Transmeta used it at the 180nm node in 2000. If memory serves me, it used aluminum for M1 and Cu for M2 or perhaps M3 and up. IBM's move to silicon on insulator and other events meant we needed to shift to other fabs - eventually settling on TSMC's 130nm process for the Efficeon.
My bad, I should have picked my words more carefully.
@@Asianometry gigachad tsmc
@@Asianometry now i can get those gaming fps
@@Asianometry no worries. I REALLY appreciate your videos and insight since I'm not as involved with chip design now.
I have a funny story about one of the problems we had with IBM's copper process at fab 9.
Yes they did. And even AMD was using Cu interconnect (ahead of Intel) during that period, though i can't recall where AMD license their Cu interconnect from.
wow, I learned a lot from this video. I never heard of most of these people. Even though my family is from Taiwan, I've never heard of any of them talking about these TSMC super stars
Most people only know F4
@@bungkusi2432 fakk 🤣🤣🤣🤣👍
These are the people that drive human race forward with uncompromising focus on a singular task.
Good Video.
Thanks for the solid research and clear, interesting presentation.
I feel real bad about myself now. I'm only working the day shift and getting a master's degree. I have no clue how I would attempt a phd
Damn that's it? Your parents must have disowned you!
don't feels bad i dropped out of school when i was 11 and likely gonna grown up working part-time jobs haha!
I'm pretty sure you're half joking, but the way I see it, as long as one is contributing more to the civilization than is taking from it, that's far better than most people can say for themselves.
Also, it's about perspective. For example, in the movie, "Amedeus," Salieri was upset at the gods for giving him just enough talent to be able to understand Mozart's genius, but wasn't himself a genius. Salieri could've been extremely happy that he was given that much talent, compared to the 99.9% of the rest of the people, but he chose the other direction.
Balance in all things is important.
Part of it is interest, and part of that is confidence, and part of that is having positive experiences at trying similar stuff, and part of that is how good you were at them, and part of that is how fundamentally able you are, so to say that it's all down to that is pretty silly. There are always a lot of non-fundamental kinks to iron out, like addictions, bad influences, and a lot of wrongly negative experiences to forget and replace. And, no matter how able you are, there's always value you can gain with your actions.
@@catsspat How do you take away from civilization? Is contributing to civilization always a good thing?
I honestly stumbled on your videos by accident, and have thoroughly enjoyed! This video was especially good, I really enjoyed the comment at the end, it's not the machines that matter, but the people. A great piece of advice!!! Keep up the good work! :D
What a fascinating documentary that was narrated brilliantly, rivaling Ken Burns in my opinion. You made watching UA-cam a great experience. Thank you.
This was amazing, no idea the history was so complex. Loved the final line, it's not about the million dollar machines, it's about the people. If the US wants to regain manufacturing prowess in semiconductors, we'll need that same drive, from the top R&D scientists to the process technicians.
amazing video. thanks for telling this story in such a way it's still understandable for not so technical people, but without leaving the technical things aside, which I aspire to understand more and more. greetings from Argentina.
Jon, this might be your best episode yet. Loved all the characters in this story. It's sometimes easy to forget there are actual wizards and geniuses inside these companies. More of this!
Great info. Though it’s HARD to follow when two or more names are said often. You should use a pyramid or something with their names, faces and positions so we can follow.
Its amazing how scientists that literally make or break whole industries get paid only 300k.
Athletes and celebrities get that kind of money to wear some clothing for an hour or whatever.
Exactly. Too bad that's how things works.
That was only in China. God knows why he wanted to work there after being in Taiwan and South Korea. The video says he was getting at least a million a year in Taiwan and $20 million in other compensation. I'm sure he was getting paid handsomely in S. Korea. It clearly wasn't the money that made him jump ship to China.
@@chrimony $1 million annually and $21 millions in other compensation (over the 17 years of service with TSMC) isn't that much for a person of his stature.
@@chrimony he is person. Human mind is complex. Only he knows true reason.
For them to get paid millions, the price of everything you buy will have to rise. Sports and entertainment make money through advertising and endorsement....something other tech jobs can't benefit from
Haven't been this quick to an Asianometry video
Same
Same. Feels good man.
Extremely interesting history of the TSMC minds and influences on other semi foundries.
This is quickly becoming one of my favorite channels. I'll hit up the patreon soon my friend. keep up the good work. 謝謝你的重要的工作
I have infinite respect for these wonderful people, considering everything I've been able to get computers to do for me, none of it would be possible without them, or at least not as quickly.
With recent confirmation that SMIC 7nm 2nd Gen is real, it looks like Liang may have provided China its greatest technical achievement in decades.
Lol legend! "Oh, just a quiet lecturer position... but the students are your competitors, and on their campus." Yes, bad faith move, but definitely ballsy.
Microsoft did the same thing. Poaching people from other companies and giving them a totally unrelated job title. But then they have daily meetings with those poached people to 'get their input' or 'bounce some ideas' off them.
bear in mind that he is extremely sour on the tsmc decision, so he did that as petty revenge
@@rulofmg he was unhappy at TSMC because he felt unappreciated. There must be some truths in it because TSMC changed their attitudes towards their employees and increased their salaries almost doubled.
別忘了台積電那邊技術是偷中國浙江的,正如台一吧一子的蚵仔煎,滷肉飯也是偷中國的😏
@@user-urwedfvftgfr228 ?
I appreciate your to the point thumbnails without using emotionally provocative faces and titles.
Very interesting! Wish you tell such stories about tech companies more often. Thank you!
Your videos are themselves ‘leading edge’. Full of facts and insights. Keep up the good work.
I'm surprised these highly talented engineers get paid so little. Very insightful video.
the “home town” discount - Less money but you control the industry - which would you take ... work on the bleeding edge or work at intel or ibm and make a little more
In the very early days of my career, I read the following in the San Jose Mercury News: "Great engineering beats great sex". Having tried both over decades, that statement is definitely true. How do you create a life with meaning? Are you defined by your creations or by your possessions? Remember a quote from Fight Club -- your possessions can possess you.
@@xenuburger7924 fight club is a giant gay allegory.. once you see it.. you cannot unsee it
Their minds are on different level.
tbh though, it's still a lot of money, like way more than enough to have a good life even if he fully retire after he retired from TSMC
at this point, i don't think he's in it for the money. There's a thrill of knowing you're being valued and that you're doing nigh impossible feat of engineering
TSMC has their own version of Fairchildren no doubt. The work is amazing, pls. continue doing so.
Brilliant research, editing, and reporting. Quite captivating.
I consider you "King of the Hill", best and most complex yet simply understood Internet narrator. If anyone deserves Patrion support you do. Kudos.
Fantastic knowledge and insights to the very opaque chipmaking industry in 25 mins ... thank you ... from Singapore.
Impressive story
Thanks for sharing your thoughts with all of us 👍 😀
Incredible work, man! Interesting and telling a great story.
In Thailand, Lubu is Libu. Anger issue, but a super heavy warrior in the battle field.
This is a spectacular piece of content. Simply outstanding
i continue to be blown away by the depth of your knowledge on all your videos
Love your analysis and love your insights. Would love to see your take on COMAC, C919, and its future in the aviation industry as a competitor to Airbus and Boeing.
C919 is in its infancy. It uses Rolls Royce engine. Just like high speed rail and earth digging machine, Kuka, Chinese first buy the engine, disassemble it and re-create a better machine. C919 cockpit is newer and better as compares to those of Airbus and Boeing, same as Chinese earth orbiting space crafts, no wires exposed, neat, and newest wiring or fiber optics etc...
China uses the world’s largest tunnel boring machines to build incredible mega projects
ua-cam.com/video/nfkOwGi4QdQ/v-deo.html
I just commented on another one of your videos. I heard nassim taleb say if you want to write something relevant that will be read in 10 years, make it something that can be read 10 years before as well. I always thumbs up your videos. I haven’t seen this one yet. I’ll probably watch it in 10 years if it’s still here too.
Excellent video. Thank you for all your work.
As the old Chinese saying goes: When there are no more birds in the sky, the bow is stored away. When there are no more cunning rabbits, the running dogs are cooked. Liang must know it too. How he is going to steer away from that fatalistic end could be the biggest challenge of his career at SMIC.
Yes. We have all been needing this piece to know.
UA-cam would be nothing without people like you
Man, working for these companies sounds miserable. These top engineers that steer the whole companies success seem to get paid peanuts. I suppose the company would rather pay lawyers to enforce a non compete agreement than to try and give them the money they're worth and compete with others for highest salaries.
This is the main reason I dislike non compete agreements, it stops companies from competing for top talent because they can just pay the lawyers a fraction to go after an individual instead.
Even if you get paid a shitload, they can overwork you. Though it sounds like Liang overworks them if anything.
$340,000 is peanuts for someone who is largely responsible for a whole company's success. That's how much software engineers in the US at big tech companies make with a few years of experience.
@@eyeborg3148 I was thinking the same thing.. Like wowzers!!!
@@eyeborg3148 that's fine for general engineers that work under these guys, but these top guys are literally generating hundreds of millions for the company and are irreplaceable. They should be in the top .01% of salaries in the world.
Instead they sign their life away to a non compete when they're first hired and are at the mercy of shareholders even if they find all these breakthroughs later in their career.
@@breadman32398 I'm agreeing with your original comment...
Amazing story! Super interesting to listen to. Thank you John!
This is a very interesting subject but you just don't where to begin when you wanna learn more so thank you for these videos gonna check out the whole Playlist later in chronological order
Man , your channel is built different . I love how you criticize everything and its give a clear and nice perspective
Maybe he just shares the reality he sees, not trying to criticize or sugarcoat anything.
Probably one of the most under rated channels on UA-cam. Well researched and extremely well presented with none of the irrelevant and misleading stock footage which is too common.
What an amazing documentary! Thanks so much for this!
I know this wont have as much mainstream appeal but this is the best video you ever made
thanks for attention to this. managers and shareholders of couple of semi firms appropriating fruits of labor done by brilliant mind. also, end product manufacturers like apple benefit in billions.
not forgetting some free-riding colleagues and rivals competing in politics instead of talent and ideas.
really requires excellence and character to persevere all that. sadly, this is not work he can do alone without these distractions. unlike e.g. science/math, here a lot of infrastructure is required to try implementing designs, etc.
people like that flexible enough to continue but rigid to fight nonsense are the driving force of progress. companies obfuscate specific names, but history needs to know such heroes
Jon, it's awesome that you continue to pump out such great content twice a week.
I am so Inspired !!! Very grateful for the video.
Let's take a moment to admire dedication and discipline
I was attending US collage in the early 1970's and read that many Taiwan Chinese scientists suffered discrimination and migrated to China in order to continue their scientific work.
Excellent research and presentation that is much better than the top US universities. Keep on it.
now THIS is drama.
geopolitical, career story, and historical drama.
Asianometry, thanks for the video. I would love you see you do one on YAGEO sometime! I know passive components are not quite as interesting as chips but I think it could be considered equally important.
Awesome content!!! Blessings from Canada 🇨🇦 🙏
Incredible work in making this video!
Wow, I really wasn't expecting a quote from an Eagle's song. Thanks for making me doubke-take.
Great video and very interesting, this reminds me of other industries, once you reach a certain level you better get your elbows out or you will get run over no matter how good you are. You'll never reach the top being the humble nice guy.
TheStuffMade
The Peter principle - everyone rises to "his" level of incompetence - sooner or later.
New fav channel ... And on a subject matter that is hidden and omnipresent
I find this series absolutely fascinating, particularly since the authoring a member of the culture, rather an outsider. The pronunciation is excellent.
This channel is one of the emerging gems 💎
This was a really good episode
he is the one create the Hauwei chips
Jon, I want to take a second to tell you I really enjoy your channel; thank you very much for helping us understand the semiconductor industry and its many moving parts.
It would be great if Asianometry could talk more about Lisa Su. I love her.
IBM should of promoted her to be ChairWoman. IBM's great down fall.
I sharpshoot your content like I do my own (adult) children's work. It occurs to me that I don't praise your work like I do my own children's work. I'm a big fan. You're doing really good work. 👍
That video was AWESOME!
👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽
Very informative videos, great work!
great video !! u have put lots of efforts to collect facts and presented it very nicely !!
this was EXCELLENT!!! BRAVO SIR!!!!
Amazing video! So much detailed information ! Thanks
What an amazing story! Love the Lü Bu comparison
I wonder if Liang's coworkers would hear theme music whenever he appears
Great research and concise reporting!
I think all the credit and recognition goes to the folks who actually burned the midnight oil and did the keg work not just orchestrate it behind a cozy desk.
Wow didn’t know you’re family are from Tainan! Made me love your videos more😂
Great story, told well. Of all these geniuses, my admiration for Professor Hu is greatest. It’s too bad he is not well known outside of engineering. TSMC may have to start spinning off some of its best younger people by funding startups. There are needs for revolutions in optical chips and interfaces.
Some time ago I read an opinion piece about who are the brightest people in the world. The three top peoples cited included Israeli Jews and the Taiwanese. This did not surprise me. An important note however is that intelligence is not static. It grows with the right exercise and a conducive environment. I guess brains need to be geared to engineering and science rather than politics and social competition.
Liang is not for money to go to SMIC,. According to WangXing (founder of Meituan, billionaire) said, Liang donated all his salary in SMIC to a scholarship fund.
Peng Chen
Prob'ly he was planning for that. He wanted to earn enough money to donate to charities of his choosing. It is perfectly OK.
Sometimes it is better to be an immortal than a billionaire that lived 80 years.
23:39 Young man, you are a very poetic wordsmith, while being funny and an interesting narrator too!
/My Best,
Really enjoying the content, in-depth and interesting. Love it!
Greatly enjoyed this view into TSMC and its titans. Thanks.
The way you turn information-packed videos into beautiful stories is Amazing. Have you taken classes on storytelling? Cannot wait to support you in the future and I am glad to see your channel consistently hitting the views it deserves.
Really interesting! Many thanks for making this.
You could make a movie out of this fascinating story
Dang, this is really interesting story. Thanks for sharing
I love your channel!
Insightful contents, extremely informative and entertaining. Even paying attention to pronounce their names correctly in Mandarin. Tks mate
I live in northern California not far from Silicon Valley. Fierce competition and even paying what I would call bribes to foreign companies was normal. The whole attitude was, "Go, go, go." Many of those guys became kajillionaires from their early stock awards. I bought a pair of headphones the other day because they had a 50-hour battery life after just 2 hours of charging on the computer. I thought that was pretty amazing since I remember the days of the original computers that were not portable. All the devices we personally use are going to grow at an astonishing rate over the next few decades. President Biden said we're investing $50 billion in new chip manufacturing, so I guess the industry is still thriving. People who worked for Hewlett-Packard and Lockheed were keys to our past growth in this field.
HP not so much but lockeed most certainly was and so many other players have played an important role like IBM, Intel, the national labs like los almos, Brookhaven, the list goes on and on, and yes the growth in technology is not slowing down any time soon as it’s continued it’s pace of growth since the very inception of the first transistor in the 50’s and than the first IC… there is so much room and technology to be invented/reinvented/discovered that the landscape only looks to be open to continual growth
Thing is... The US doesn't have the human resources to produce chips cheaply and competitively, TSMC still won't bring their leading edge to the US factories, and the wage in Taiwan is vastly cheaper than in the US, there is also a lost generation of students who understand hardware manufacturing since software has been where the money is for quite some time.
Government backing is always for out-of-date industries and tech -- consider NASA working on that obsolete old-fashioned SLS rocket, entirely expendable, same lift capability as the 1960s Saturn V, $1B for one launch a year. Compare it to Space-X, then weep for the incredible waste of talent and time.
When I saw that news about Biden backing the chip industry, my first reaction was wondering what was replacing whatever it is subsidizing. My best guess is it will be like SLS -- old fashioned, expensive, and late. A 5nm fab in five years. I'd almost bet on it.
HP RD innovation edge slows down not unlike the 80s to early 2000s.
Still thriving? Bro, chips are everywhere! How can this industry not thrive?
"Take away my people, but leave my factories and soon grass will grow on the factory floors……Take away my factories, but leave my people and soon we will have a new and better factory."
Andrew Carnegie. Thats why it is important to keep the people.
Amazing the cross fertilization between Japan, Korea, Taiwan,China and the USA in technology. The US attracted brilliant minds from Asia to both contribute & to learn with them & then these guys bring the technology back to Asia, set up companies who compete with America. Everybody benefits in a way that couldn't happen if America simply closed it's borders. It is the fruition of globalisation that many seem to be in a hurry to destroy even though they can't live without using the technology in their phones, homes, cars , work .... Where the hell do they think this comes from? These nerds have given do much to the world.
translumination2002
There is none like an American. All those were before Columbus. Now all nationalities of the world (some second generation, while there are n th generation guys, married criss-cross over generations). So a cHinese landed in America can still be American. Biological Cross fertilisation, leads to cross fertilization in ideas too. Engineering is about ideas, while Technology is about skills.
Fairdinkum priceless video cobber, thankyou sir.
What I would not give for those lecture notes Liang gave at Sungkyunkwan
Have plan to do a Ben Lin(林本堅） or Robert Tsao(曹興誠）story? would be interesting
If you want to inspire a young engineer, let Asianometry describe the titans of the modern world with the same tone of a reverential professor describing Pax Romana. This is the EUV of teaching modern history.
Lol 100%
You want to hear a depressing fact? All this Game of Thrones fighting with technology that runs so much of the world with billions of dollars at stake - and their salaries are around ~200k. The minimum salary for an athlete for even the smallest of the Big 4 sport leagues in the US is 700k.
Granted, his salary did jumped at the end, there's likely more compensation through stocks and other hidden means, but when you watch and see the level of impact and scale invoked in those things, I was not expecting to hear 200k in any form at all.
@@RhoninFire why would you need a million a month?
@@OliverFlinn Brah, nothing I said above is about my salary. My comment is how the video cover so much drama and politics. The sounds like drama you would expect for people fighting over a throne of a country or at least way larger salaries than just $200k (well officially).
It's a comment about how it subvert expectations and a bit of opining about what society rewards. Not about what I want to make.
@@OliverFlinn To get mansions, yachts, holidays, women, influence, connections, power, security and prosperity for yourself and your family, and everything else such a brilliant and dedicated genius deserves.