I always measure to center of obstruction, place mark on conduit at that exact point, then I multiply the height of the obstruction by 2.5 and take that number and go that distance off both sides of the original center mark, and then I use the push through method, first bend on star (22 degrees), second bend on notch (45 degrees) third bend on arrow (22 degrees).
Would that be 3/16s per height of obstruction per inch of rise four shrinkage? Then add that to the center of obstruction Mark? Then 2.5 times height to get the outside marks???
The shrinkage on a 3point saddle is 3/16" for every inch of rise. Never mind I should keep watching until I comment. I use the notch and bend a 45 and 22.5 on the arrows
Depends on the degree of saddle. You can do a 45 deg center bend and 2-22.5’s. Or a 30 deg center bend and 2-15’s. If you wanted you could even do a 60 degree center bend and 2-30’s. It’s the angle of bend that determines the shrinkage per inch of saddle/offset.
Yes, the only thing I would add to this is to find shrink you use the formula shrink= angle/120. Example 30/120=.25 1/4” per inch of height Ex 2: 45/120= .375 3/8” per inch of rise Obstacle is at 20” off the end and 3” tall. Then make center mark at 21 1/8”
EXCELLENT JOB working those camera angles. This is way clearer than watching my instructor in trades school demonstrate this in front of a class of 30 people. Thank you Dustin!
is it just me or does anyone wonder if that bend would of ended up coming out right ? Where he initially made his center mark ( I think it was 57'') and then did all that calculating just to still have the same initial center mark defeats the purpose. The point is and please correct me if I'm wrong... is for the center mark to to be past 57'' after doing the calculations so that after the shrinkage occurs it ends up being back at 57''. Hope i explained my doubt right
Thank you for posting this Im ~1 1/2 year into this trade and have always worked in industrial setting where we run only rigid, aluminum or stainless depending on if its a wet area or not. So ive always used a power bender except for when its time to bend saddles, which i struggle with. After watching your video it looks like i am overbending
Dude, you add the shrink to the center mark. If the center of your obstruction is at 57", and you don't add the shrink to that, your center bend won't line up with the center of the obstruction. You have to add that 1/4", or whatever the shrink may be with the degree of bends you are using, to that center mark. So your center mark would be 57 1/4" to account for shrinkage. In your example, it doesn't matter because you can move the obstruction to be perfectly center.
@@awood965 same way, depending on the degree of bends you are using. But no one cares on a 4 point saddle because you can't really tell if you're a 1/4" off of center. It's very noticeable on a 3 point saddle, however.
I always measure to center of obstruction, place mark on conduit at that exact point, then I multiply the height of the obstruction by 2.5 and take that number and go that distance off both sides of the original center mark, and then I use the push through method, first bend on star (22 degrees), second bend on notch (45 degrees) third bend on arrow (22 degrees).
Rubbing alcohol / isporopanol dissolves permanent marker/Sharpie. I learned that one in college chem lab, and have used it many times since. I've even seen people use hand sanitizer (usually ethyl alcohol/ethanol, the same as drinking alcohol) to dissolve Sharpie. Lots of organic solvents dissolve it, since it's really not so "permanent" at all
I think I got it guys… the reason he went 10” from the center mark, is because if you were bending at 45º from your center marks your return bends would be split between 2,1/2 for 1” and 5 for 2” but he’s bending at 22º which means A & B are split between 5” from center mark and he’s going over 2” So 5x2 : 10. From center mark, You’re welcome 😅
Angles were not discussed, so measurements made little sense to me. For ever inch add a quarter for shrinkage, why? Why didn't you state what height you had to clear?
I’m a ElectricianU fan but the info in this video could have been explained better. I’m not sure why he used a 1/4” of shrink per inch of rise when a 10 degree bend has a 1/16” of shrink per inch of rise. So since he had to clear a 2” obstruction the distance from the end of the conduit to the center of the saddle bend would be whatever that theoretical distance is plus 1/8”. The shrink itself is derived from your outside bend angle and not your center bend angle.
I wonder if it's easier to think of it as an offset so if you need your measured clearance just to add the shrinkage of your 1/4" on both sides so you can scale it to other bend radi. So like 45 and 22.5 is going to be 2x offset calculation plus shrinkage?
hand sanitizer/alcohol/pvc cleaner will happily take the sharpie off, just be careful since it's flammable and will eat many surfaces. and of course, the best trick for most everything sticky, stuck, stained is WD40!
Going over your sharpie mark with a fresh sharpie makes a good sharpie eraser too. Just write over your previous mark and immediately wipe it away. Poof, gone!
I got confused. I thought you were doing a 30 degree bend cuz you just double the height of whatever object your bending. Then i got lost when you were bending. I still dont know why you chose tear drop on the middle, and which was was the correct way. And then chose the arrow on the other side
Shrink is calculated by Shrink = angle/120 Example 30/120 = .25 Add 1/4” per inch of rise to center mark Ex 2: 45/120 = .375 Add 3/8” per inch of rise to center An obstacle 3” tall and 20” off end. Center angle at 45 degree. Center mark would be 21 1/8” off end. As a note shrink does not change the height of the bend. That is calculated when using multiplier associated with center bend
my pro tip to your pro tip to OP ...pro tip is you can ether use a little bit of wd40 on sharpie or you can use dry ease maker over top of sharpie...more you know
I believe he's adding 6" because he's bending 3/4" EMT, the lines you center your bender on should be a certain distance from where you want the bend depending on the size of the conduit - 5" for 1/2", 6" for 3/4", 8" for 1"
Im more confused after watching this video. Usually that isn't the case with your tutorials. My suggestion would be to remove this and do it over with more detailed explanation.
You marked the middle and then started putting lines at 10.5. This video was pretty confusing to me. Maybe I missed something, but I don't think going from marking the center to calculating shrink before calculating (telling us how) line 2 and 3 are made is helpful. Unless I missed something.
I'm confused on how you got 4'' and 6''. Your object is 2'' and your degree is 22. Wouldn't the math for the distance be around 5"? If you object is 2'' and you measure out 4'', doesnt that mean the multiplier is 2? Multiplier of 2 is for 30 degree bends right?
Where the fuck did the 6 come from my guy I'm confused AF. I thought you had to multiply by 2.5? Ok I understand if you multiply by just 2, that'll give you your first mark at 4, but where does 6 come from??
He did say it in a strange way but he is trying to say that there is 1/4" of *shrink* for every 1" of *rise* (height of of the obstruction). So, since he has a 2" high obstruction his shrink will be 2/4" or 1/2".
I thought u add 3/16 for every inch of your height? Let’s say I need 3 inches to go over, ? I’d add 9/16 to my 3 inches so that would be 3 inch’s and 9/16 and my sides would be 3 inches times 2.5 and that’s where I’d make my side bends at?
I was gonna get DQ'd at Skills USA Nationals in highschool for unsafe bending doing the same shit this guy is doing on the job. I didn't even finish my project because of the proctors harassing me for the gymnastics I was pulling.
Seems like you was not taught the correct steps and calculations to do a 3 point saddle. 1/4" is the shrinkage and 2 is the multiplier for a 30 degree offset. You were suppose to use two 30 degree bends and one 60 degree bend for your calculations. Instead, you used two 10 degree bends and one 22.5 degree bend to make your 3 point saddle. The shrinkage for a 10 degree offset is 1/16" and the multiplier is 6. It's a 2 inch diameter object so you will have a total shrinkage of 1/4". You need to mark 2 equal distances from each side of your center mark, which will be your multiplier for a 10 degree offset (which is 6) multiplied by 2. So your 2 distances from each side of the center mark is 6x2= 12". The 12" markings on each side of your center mark will be where you do your 2 other bends. If the distance is 4' on one side to the center of your obstruction and 5' on the other side to the center of your obstruction, you need to add your shrink accommodation on both sides which will make them 4' 1/8" and 5' 1/8".
I always measure to center of obstruction, place mark on conduit at that exact point, then I multiply the height of the obstruction by 2.5 and take that number and go that distance off both sides of the original center mark, and then I use the push through method, first bend on star (22 degrees), second bend on notch (45 degrees) third bend on arrow (22 degrees).
Don’t forget to account for shrinkage :)
@@joshhowie4071they did, that’s why they multiplied by 2.5 but its good you brought it up because a lot of people forget that especially newer folk.
thanks boss saved me 10 mins
Would that be 3/16s per height of obstruction per inch of rise four shrinkage? Then add that to the center of obstruction Mark? Then 2.5 times height to get the outside marks???
@@joshhowie4071 if you use this method you don’t have to factor in the 3/16” per inch of rise for shrinkage. Just make sure you do star, notch, arrow.
The shrinkage on a 3point saddle is 3/16" for every inch of rise. Never mind I should keep watching until I comment. I use the notch and bend a 45 and 22.5 on the arrows
Depends on the degree of saddle. You can do a 45 deg center bend and 2-22.5’s. Or a 30 deg center bend and 2-15’s. If you wanted you could even do a 60 degree center bend and 2-30’s. It’s the angle of bend that determines the shrinkage per inch of saddle/offset.
Yes, the only thing I would add to this is to find shrink you use the formula shrink= angle/120.
Example 30/120=.25
1/4” per inch of height
Ex 2: 45/120= .375
3/8” per inch of rise
Obstacle is at 20” off the end and 3” tall. Then make center mark at 21 1/8”
@@Ephesians-ts8ze Exactly. Electrician U apparently doesn't understand this and proceeds to mess up on his tutorial.
From the center mark where did you come up with 10.5 inches both directions for the 10 degree bends?
I was wondering the same thing but he is bending it on a 22 1/2 degree cap he used the multiplier
EXCELLENT JOB working those camera angles. This is way clearer than watching my instructor in trades school demonstrate this in front of a class of 30 people. Thank you Dustin!
is it just me or does anyone wonder if that bend would of ended up coming out right ? Where he initially made his center mark ( I think it was 57'') and then did all that calculating just to still have the same initial center mark defeats the purpose. The point is and please correct me if I'm wrong... is for the center mark to to be past 57'' after doing the calculations so that after the shrinkage occurs it ends up being back at 57''. Hope i explained my doubt right
Exactly. He got Me all confused! You add the shrinkage to that center line right?
Why did you add the 6 inches after the 4 1/2 shrinkage
I was wondering the same thing and was going to ask the same question. He didn't explain where that 6" came from.
Same here
Thank you for posting this
Im ~1 1/2 year into this trade and have always worked in industrial setting where we run only rigid, aluminum or stainless depending on if its a wet area or not. So ive always used a power bender except for when its time to bend saddles, which i struggle with. After watching your video it looks like i am overbending
Just wanted to come & say this worked like a charm using the notch worked perfect !!!
Dude, you add the shrink to the center mark. If the center of your obstruction is at 57", and you don't add the shrink to that, your center bend won't line up with the center of the obstruction. You have to add that 1/4", or whatever the shrink may be with the degree of bends you are using, to that center mark. So your center mark would be 57 1/4" to account for shrinkage.
In your example, it doesn't matter because you can move the obstruction to be perfectly center.
@nikogarcia3249 how does the shrinkage effect your measurements in a 4 point saddle?
@@awood965 same way, depending on the degree of bends you are using. But no one cares on a 4 point saddle because you can't really tell if you're a 1/4" off of center. It's very noticeable on a 3 point saddle, however.
@nikogarcia3249 thankyou sir good info
Thank you so much I was looking for someone else to catch this thought it was just me lol.
There is more than one way to cook a burger 😂
Keep getting your grind on😊.great job.
Where did you get the 6 added inches from?
So the object is 2 inches. 2 inches for every inch so 4 inches. Plus half a inch for shrinkage. Where does the last 6 inch number come from?
I’m also confused about that
That’s where I got lost too.
same
Yep
Same
Good teaching, especially for beginners.. I teach my apprentices the push thru method
I always measure to center of obstruction, place mark on conduit at that exact point, then I multiply the height of the obstruction by 2.5 and take that number and go that distance off both sides of the original center mark, and then I use the push through method, first bend on star (22 degrees), second bend on notch (45 degrees) third bend on arrow (22 degrees).
Pro tip, use a dry erase marker. Ive seen many bends with pencil marks left on it.
i was going to say that also
Pro tip: just rub off the pencil mark with your finger. If it's to high for you too reach then it's too high for you to see it.
Nice
I use whatever I have because I could care less as long as the bend is correct conduit is always dirty no matter what when you buy it.
I don't care either way.
@@davidcooper4385you definitely don’t just sit in your house all day pretending
Thanks Dustin. I’m a super green apprentice and your videos help a lot. Your explanations ate very clear. Thanks
Im pretty sure it goes (and this is how I've always done it)
Step 1? measure middle point
Step 2: ???
Step 3: offset
real
I was wondering the same thing
Rubbing alcohol / isporopanol dissolves permanent marker/Sharpie.
I learned that one in college chem lab, and have used it many times since.
I've even seen people use hand sanitizer (usually ethyl alcohol/ethanol, the same as drinking alcohol) to dissolve Sharpie.
Lots of organic solvents dissolve it, since it's really not so "permanent" at all
pvc glue will as well if the plumbers are around
Or any shit body spray
I had a hater comment typed out about the sharpie and then you brought it up 😂
I’m confused where are we getting 4” if you have a 2” object?
He messed up on that
Why does my center mark never line up i use the notch for my center and it’s always off on one side ? I’m using a 1” Klein bender
Why did you add the 6 inches after the 4 1/2 shrinkage
Apprentice here with local 26 first year. conduit test next week
So 4" for the first inch.
6" for the second inch
Would it be another 6" for a 3" saddle?
Measure 16 3/4" from center?
I think I got it guys… the reason he went 10” from the center mark, is because if you were bending at 45º from your center marks your return bends would be split between 2,1/2 for 1” and 5 for 2” but he’s bending at 22º which means A & B are split between 5” from center mark and he’s going over 2” So 5x2 : 10. From center mark,
You’re welcome 😅
Angles were not discussed, so measurements made little sense to me. For ever inch add a quarter for shrinkage, why? Why didn't you state what height you had to clear?
I’m a ElectricianU fan but the info in this video could have been explained better. I’m not sure why he used a 1/4” of shrink per inch of rise when a 10 degree bend has a 1/16” of shrink per inch of rise. So since he had to clear a 2” obstruction the distance from the end of the conduit to the center of the saddle bend would be whatever that theoretical distance is plus 1/8”. The shrink itself is derived from your outside bend angle and not your center bend angle.
@@lazarevic95thanks
@@lazarevic95 because he doesn't know the standard way of doing a 3 point saddle.
How did you add for shrinkage if your center mark never changed.
That’s what I’m thinking, this video was honestly so confusing and he did things the hard , confusing way
@@DylanWalker-h4k glad I am not the only one that was confused as all hell. he didn't measure anything normally.
Way more complicated than it should be bro.. just double the height adjust for shrinkage and 45 degree and 2-22.5 degree and done
yeah thats the way i was always taught.
what do you mean the bend looks parallel to the 22 1/2 line ????????????? should the bend be with the 22 1/2 line ???
As a pre app, these fucking saddle bends are my nemesis. If I could banish them all to hell I absolutely would
Thanks bro been a cool minute since I did a saddle 😂
May I know why you mark it at 6"? The 4" is double the size of the object which is 2". What about he 6"?
Step 1: use bending app that calculates center adjustment, shrink and distance between bends for you.
Step 2: ????
Step 3: make your boss profit
Rubbing alcohol will also remove sharpie.
I wonder if it's easier to think of it as an offset so if you need your measured clearance just to add the shrinkage of your 1/4" on both sides so you can scale it to other bend radi. So like 45 and 22.5 is going to be 2x offset calculation plus shrinkage?
Interesting, but is "amperage" a word?
Working close to that open panel man
It’s no wires in it
yeah you can clearly tell it has no wires feeding either panel. come on now haha
I don't know man you made that very complicated with that fourth extra Mark you canceled out
hand sanitizer/alcohol/pvc cleaner will happily take the sharpie off, just be careful since it's flammable and will eat many surfaces.
and of course, the best trick for most everything sticky, stuck, stained is WD40!
Going over your sharpie mark with a fresh sharpie makes a good sharpie eraser too. Just write over your previous mark and immediately wipe it away. Poof, gone!
I got confused. I thought you were doing a 30 degree bend cuz you just double the height of whatever object your bending. Then i got lost when you were bending. I still dont know why you chose tear drop on the middle, and which was was the correct way. And then chose the arrow on the other side
How’d you get 10.5”
I asked the same question. Why did he add 6 more inches? Where’d that measurement come from
From the start of this video that 57 inches you measured will not be 57 after the bends, right? Because of the shrinkage.
Shrink is calculated by
Shrink = angle/120
Example 30/120 = .25
Add 1/4” per inch of rise to
center mark
Ex 2: 45/120 = .375
Add 3/8” per inch of rise to center
An obstacle 3” tall and 20” off end. Center angle at 45 degree. Center mark would be 21 1/8” off end.
As a note shrink does not change the height of the bend. That is calculated when using multiplier associated with center bend
Other pro tip. If you need to remove sharpie. Get some hand sanitizer. The alcohol will break down the sharpie ink and it will all but disappear
Isopropyl alcohol will remove sharpie with ease. It's the solvent used in the marker to begin with. Wipes right off.
Pro tip just throw more sharpie over it then wipe away immediately comes right off
@@izzywashington5461 then you have more residue.. Using clean cheap solvent is the Pro tip to do things right..
my pro tip to your pro tip to OP ...pro tip is you can ether use a little bit of wd40 on sharpie or you can use dry ease maker over top of sharpie...more you know
Pro tip to your pro tip, sharpie erases sharpie
I've installed dryers in Penn Aluminum
Would you always add 6" for the method he's using?
I believe he's adding 6" because he's bending 3/4" EMT, the lines you center your bender on should be a certain distance from where you want the bend depending on the size of the conduit - 5" for 1/2", 6" for 3/4", 8" for 1"
Im more confused after watching this video. Usually that isn't the case with your tutorials. My suggestion would be to remove this and do it over with more detailed explanation.
0:26 why did you add 6 inches
The tear drop is intended to be the center of a 45 degree bend
i seen other video where the guy still used the teardrop for a 45 degree bend
Definitely is, first bend: 45° ,second and third: 22.5
He’s listening! 🔥🔥🔥 more practical ☝🏽
If you have isopropyl alcohol it will take sharpie off but if you don't have that, use some hand sanitizer
Cheers for this comment. Told me all I needed to know without watching a 12 minute video in the field
Xlnt video ,seen people bend 22 ,45,22 lol,well done..
Wait he didn't bend to the 22.5 line? I thought you were supposed to bend so it's basically on the center Line of the mark
You marked the middle and then started putting lines at 10.5. This video was pretty confusing to me. Maybe I missed something, but I don't think going from marking the center to calculating shrink before calculating (telling us how) line 2 and 3 are made is helpful. Unless I missed something.
I'm confused on how you got 4'' and 6''. Your object is 2'' and your degree is 22. Wouldn't the math for the distance be around 5"? If you object is 2'' and you measure out 4'', doesnt that mean the multiplier is 2? Multiplier of 2 is for 30 degree bends right?
Excellent demonstration
1ST GRADE PENCIL. BIG FITS IN HAND AND HAS WIDE LEAD.
Where the fuck did the 6 come from my guy I'm confused AF. I thought you had to multiply by 2.5? Ok I understand if you multiply by just 2, that'll give you your first mark at 4, but where does 6 come from??
What about with 1” pipe?
U lost me in 2 min of the video
Facts lol 😂
He did say it in a strange way but he is trying to say that there is 1/4" of *shrink* for every 1" of *rise* (height of of the obstruction). So, since he has a 2" high obstruction his shrink will be 2/4" or 1/2".
😂
man all i heard was “inch inch inch inches inches “ im so confused
I thought u add 3/16 for every inch of your height? Let’s say I need 3 inches to go over, ? I’d add 9/16 to my 3 inches so that would be 3 inch’s and 9/16 and my sides would be 3 inches times 2.5 and that’s where I’d make my side bends at?
Alcohol swabs from the pharmacy also easily erase sharpie. Permanent marker isn't Permanent if you know the chemistry.
If only George Costanza knew about your channel
Significant shrinkage
I WAS IN THE POOL
3 point saddle is my worst enemy 😭
I’m not fond of the aluminum conduit I’ve used. Always changes the color of my hands.
I HATED bending aluminum. It's almost like they manufactured kinks into it, waiting for an opportunity to ruin your whole stick.
Over thinking lol,union boyz i work with measure thier way i do it another still comes out Same bend,UNION sparkys can't troubleshoot lol..
0:34
1:10
1:39
2:14
4:53
5:45
Confusing
I was gonna get DQ'd at Skills USA Nationals in highschool for unsafe bending doing the same shit this guy is doing on the job. I didn't even finish my project because of the proctors harassing me for the gymnastics I was pulling.
Seems like you was not taught the correct steps and calculations to do a 3 point saddle. 1/4" is the shrinkage and 2 is the multiplier for a 30 degree offset. You were suppose to use two 30 degree bends and one 60 degree bend for your calculations. Instead, you used two 10 degree bends and one 22.5 degree bend to make your 3 point saddle. The shrinkage for a 10 degree offset is 1/16" and the multiplier is 6. It's a 2 inch diameter object so you will have a total shrinkage of 1/4". You need to mark 2 equal distances from each side of your center mark, which will be your multiplier for a 10 degree offset (which is 6) multiplied by 2. So your 2 distances from each side of the center mark is 6x2= 12". The 12" markings on each side of your center mark will be where you do your 2 other bends. If the distance is 4' on one side to the center of your obstruction and 5' on the other side to the center of your obstruction, you need to add your shrink accommodation on both sides which will make them 4' 1/8" and 5' 1/8".
way he explains the measurements are confusing. Simplify it with some kind of chart
Im a glazier I have no idea
Took 11 minutes for a 10 second lesson
I must be dumb I didn’t get it
This tutorial is difficult
This is NOT how it's shown per union
Nice bending but to fuckin complicated I’m going to find another avenue for my conductors to travel.
This isn’t right
Not really explaining anything
Lmao I was thinking the same
This is bullshit
You talk too much.
Bullcrap
Your teaching is difficult when doing your measurements
Bro lay off the blow
So so wrong man