Kemper vs Quad Cortex vs Helix (you can't tell the difference!)
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- Опубліковано 4 лис 2022
- Kemper Profiles: tonejunkiestore.com
Helix Presets: tonejunkiestore.com/helix-hx-...
QC Captures: neuraldsp.com/cloud/p/9b7f731d-801b-43db-b4c9-60e5828490cc
Can you tell these digital units apart? We put the Helix, Kemper and Quad Cortex against each other and see how close we can get them to sound. The results...nearly Identical!
It's incredible how after years Kemper's tone is still top notch
Good tone are timeless
After taking deep dives on this for as long as this has been a topic of discussion, playing in a church for 20 years, playing in a gigging band for 5 or so years, and mostly enjoying my time playing in the closet by myself. I can with 100% confidence tell anyone new to this… buy what you can afford, find a tone you enjoy, and just play. The most expensive Dumble amp, 59 Les Paul combo sounds different than the second most expensive Dumble/Les Paul combo. Sooo guess what, every algorithm will sound slightly different and even if they sound the same, there’s the guy that’s too smart for the room that says “well it feels different”. DIFFERENT TO WHAT?!?!? The Tube amp or the other modeler? Answer… both, of course it feels different, an old tube amp with tons of sag feels less tight than a modern high gain amp. So freaking what, buy what you can afford, dial in a couple of great tones, or buy a tonejunkie pack from any of the lesser expensive modelers and get used to the way it feels, then guess what, when you go from what you sound good on to a $10,000 vintage tube amp, you’ll probably hate the way it “feels” because it’s not what you’re used to.
Play what you have, everything sounds good in the hands of a good guitarist these days.
Great advice and one of the best I have read👍
Words of wisdom. People spend to much time deciding which gear to buy, instead of focusing on the craft of becoming a better musician.
i only hear advice from wise ppl like you, i believe u played for 20 plus yrs, thanks so much for the wisdom
@@juankrodriguez1506i actually try to split my practice time evenly between practicing and finding and purchasing new gear/guitars 😂
@@bryannicholson7111 Honestly, I can't disagree with that method (I do that myself 🤣 ) but I've been playing for years. When I started I had a $100 acustic, then moved to a $300 Ibanez+zoom 505 II, and had that for about 4years. By the time I bought proper gear, I could get good sound/tone out of most things. 😎
Thanks for doing this HW! You’re the reason why I got my kemper !!
I purchased a Kemper 4-5 months before QC came out and I was like "shoot, i'm so unlucky, I should have waited" and "newer means better" and stuff... While watching this video I was sure that C was the Helix and I also knew that I liked A a bit more than I liked B so I expected that A would be the QC. It is really a very very pleasant surprise that A is the Kemper and I am very glad that I can sleep in piece at last 😂 Thank you so much sir 😄
You were sure "C" was the Helix because he basically told us in the middle of the test that it was.
They’re all cool. I’m in the market now to buy one. QC and Kemper are top of my list.. the only reason I’m leaning towards QC is future facing… the underlying hardware is levels above kemper.. which doesn’t matter so much now, but as the tech progresses and QC keeps updating/unlocking more of the power of the underlying platform, Kemper’s underlying platform/hardware prob won’t be able to keep up at some point.
A & B were excellent, and C was harsh or odd to me from the start.
Thanks for all your work!
As a HX Stomp owner and longtime Line 6 fan, I was so amazed by the 3.5 update. The new cabs are so amazing in comparison to the old. I’ve always used either yours or DH IRs until I matched one of yours yesterday! Line 6 really leveled the playing field
Came back to this video after really tweaking the new cab in Helix. Yes, the new cab really does fantastic, I can produce the same tone with when I use DH Ir.
At age 84, and after playing for 75 years, I'm glad my ears are no better than they are. I couldn't tell the difference in any of the three. Would be happy with any one, though I have a Kemper (plus several tube amps as well).
Great video man! I thought first sure you were switching what A B and C were and were gonna spring that on us at the end! I'm pretty new to this world so this is much appreciated
It shows how fortunate we all are. What an amazing, inspiring, and easy to be creative time to be alive! Great vid, thanks!
This is the video Anderton’s needed to make. Only through the first clip and they are all indistinguishable. Well done HW!
No doubt Andertons screwed up something in their video.
Dynamics.
Super awesome comparison HW! I could notice some subtle differences but could not positively identify one amp over the other.
Good job my friend ! That's a comparative ! Bravo
I only guessed the Helix when I heard the clean neck vs. dirty bridge cleanup comparison at 6:53. Until then, I marginally preferred what turned out to be the Kemper even though I incorrectly suspected it was the QC - but they were so close, and until then, so was the Helix. Fascinating
That’s interesting. I had the same experience (thought the Kemper was the QC, and slightly preferred the tone). They’re super close though.
I’m still learning about digital stuff but one thing that has remained consistent about these blind demos is that my ears always pick the kemper.
I thought B was usually the brightest but had no clue what to make of that. C was my favorite generally. I had no clue throughout but bottom line is this: I'd be happy with any one of these.
That’s how it’s done! Food for thought! 🖖🏼👍🏼
Great comparison! Would be very interesting to compare DI captures for the Kemper and the Cortex and having the reference sound in there would be enlightening. The Helix is a different thing. And i agree that reamping for this kind of comparison is the best way to go, as long as you dial in all the units with the same gain amount.
Ok, so just watched it and I truly did know the differences. A. Kemper. More mid, fatter sound, lest string separation, less clarity. B. QC. Just in general more clarity. The big difference is the string separation. Every string rings out even when overdriven. C. Helix. Thin sounding. To much high end. Sounded harsh. Didn’t clean up well in the last test. That was what I heard. I ain’t lying HW! :)
Not to brag, but I knew that A was the Kemper as soon as I heard the first clip. I wasn’t sure about the other two, but I know the Kemper sound very well. Unfortunately the answers were posted in this video, so there’s no way for me to prove that I’m not lying. Then again, I know I’m not, and that’s enough for me. Great comparison!!
Please, please, do a follow up on this video with addressing the compression/ fullness differences on the high gain models. With studio flat monitors I can hear a difference. Sounds like the Helix would benefit from compression on low mids, maybe on a seperate path. Maybe a compressor after the amp like many do. Be our hero! Great video anyways!
Great comparison! Thank you so much!
Wich exactly guitar do you use for the first clean tones? Love this jaguar-style ☺️
HW, if you'll want it, it would super to hear the same comparison but using drive pedals into them, and big verbs as well. Also it would be lovely a high gain comparison. Btw the new Helix tone matched IR are outstanding, really improved the sound
Proud to say I got them right ! Helix seems to have the least low-end dynamics (responding to palm mutes and such), and Quad Cortex the most.
For a while I use to always think it in a which unit was best. Older I’ve got I have realised the person dialling it in matters the most. Someone good can make any unit sound good. It’s all about what unit works for you.
Holy crap, I liked A on every clip the most and I was sure it was not the Kemper. I own a Kemper and this makes me happy. B was second best to me and C last.
This is a great video. I had a feeling that C was the helix - wasn’t sure just had an inkling - but I own one and have been using it a lot for over 3 years. What made me really think that was the slight breakup on the neck pickup with the volume rolled back. It doesn’t always clean up that well (depending on a lot of factors obviously)…. My experience with the other two units is minimal but all three sound excellent. Thanks for the great content.
Yea, because he told you that "C" sounded different than the other two.
in my opinion they are really close and suttle eq. in band context you cant notice the diffrent. so choose which plattform you like the most :D
i played alot your worship presets and helped me alot to get a good tone for sundays.
do you bring new packs/songs?
Do an A, B, C, D, next where you add the amp as the 4th to compare. All the Internet "experts" claim they can always pick the real amp, yeah, right!
Also, I agree with you, in the Plexi, C began to sound different, not bad, or worse, just a little different.
Outstanding showdown, keep them coming!
Cool! I liked C the least but thought it was the Kemper. I have a helix and a quad cortex and loveeee them. Helix is legendary.
Thanks for the interesting comparison. I also find most overdrive pedals can be tweaked to sound almost the same. Do you plan to get into IK Multimedia's Tonex capturing system?
Fantastic comparison. Never come across your channel before but somehow did. I am subscribed now 😊
I have just got to the reveal part. So before I continue, my guess is C is Line 6 as the last examples where C was the most different it had a sparkle of fizz to it. Let’s see if I am right or wrong.
Just heard the reveal and I pleased I got it right but it was more of a gut guess than a defo I know it is Line 6 for sure. I think it was that slight extra fizz like I mentioned above.
Btw was this the new 3.5 firmware or not on the Line 6?
I bought a Kemper a few years ago and it’s by far the best piece of music gear I’ve ever purchased. I couldn’t hear a difference between it or the Quad Cortex. A slight difference with the Helix, but you throw it in a mix and it becomes negligible. All great pieces of gear.
Do you think the Kemper’s profiles have improved over time? I tend to feel newer profiles sound better than those captured with early versions of the operating software.
Dude your collection :o That 72 LP Special is so beautiful! Don't get me started about that fullstack...
they sound super similar, but I actually like B the best followed by C. if I were to buy one of the three though I would definitely get a used Helix as you can find them at reasonable prices!
There’s definitely a lot used because it’s pretty bad. The $3200 Kemper is stiff and just as bad. This guy makes money off both those profiles. If he’s making the quad sound bad, it’s on purpose. He can’t sell profiles for the quad. As a huge amp and pedal lover I have to say I passed on the quad 3x I was so unhappy with the other modelers. Then I saw a few PROS use the quad at a HUGE concert. The UI is great. Needs no pc. It feels like an amp and sounds great. I heard this guy post a profile of the quad. He can’t make it sound very good. I wonder why? Hmmm 🤔
@@Utubewrk123 PROs also use the Helix and the Kemper, neither of which sound bad. Maybe the Quad Cortex sounds a little better (maybe), but it certainly doesn't sound a lot better.
Damn, these sounded way closer than they did on the Anderton's episode. On the first one I really couldn't tell much of a difference at all. So damn close to identical. Once you started adding more gain, the Helix did start to sound... brighter maybe? Airier in the high end? Sorry, describing these things is not something I'm very good at. By the end I was pretty sure C was the Helix, but I did have the benefit of just listening to this comparison on Anderton's. The first two were so damn close all throughout. I guessed that B must be the Cortex because it sounded the tiniest bit darker to me, but it was just a guess and I wouldn't have been surprised at all if I was wrong and it was just my mind trying to hear a difference. If I didn't know you were switching devices, I never would have guessed they were different at all. I do think there is a difference, but it's so small it really doesn't matter.
Really, they all sounded so great. I think when deciding between these three you really need to look at price, features, and how easy it is to dial in a tone.
They did sound different to me. Now, which was which, I had no clue. Kemper sounded best to me, then QC, then Helix. Slightly more ‘real’ and lively sounding from A thru C to me. I don’t have any of these units, so I have no bias and simply listened.
You CAN’T tell!! People in the audience won’t be able to tell either! It’s us gear nuts that make a big deal about all this!
I liked everything A was doing. I preferred C over B on all of them except on the last clip
hi HW,i'm italian,from venice,just a question... i could try Kemper stage and QC and i preferred kemper,only thing i didn't like the distorted sound. i even bought from you few patches. so,could you tell me please wich configuration you have been using for this video? i wasn't able to obtain the same sound😔😔😔 thank's in advance for your reply
Can you leave a link for that 68 Marshall on the Kemper? I might already have it from you guys, but that strat sounds so good.
one of the best comparisons I have seen in the last years! Very accurate observations! Keep rocking!
Great comparison. Any plans to release presets for the fractal world?
Was that Les Paul Special a custom order? Looks like the shape used for the Jack Cassidy bass.
Great job thanks for your work. They all sound good but Quad Cortex sounds best to my ears. Question: Have you ever tried the ISP Technologies - Theta Pro DSP guitar effects processor? I have been using guitar effects processors for 17 years. Owned many but my go to for Pure Tone for me since 2018 is the Theta Pro DSP. This unit has a Pre & Post EQ which allows fine tuning to acheive desired tone. My setup is stereo XLR out to FOH, 2 mission engineering pedals (Volume & Wah), Parker Fly Deluxe guitar (rewired front pickup to single coil). I have received many compliments during live gigs being I don't use an amp on stage. Theta Pro has their signature decimator circuit in this unit as well to transparently eliminate any 60hz hum from a single coil. I play Rock, Pop, Funk, Disco, Ballads, etc in a weekend working band and the Theta Pro covers it all. Very interested in your thoughts on the Theta Pro DSP.
I've had both the Helix Floor and a Kemper Stage and I've never been able to definitively decide which one I prefer overall. The Helix's flexibility and interface are awesome, but sometimes I prefer the Kemper, but can't decide exactly why.
Feel is better on the Kemper. Tone is basically the same across all platforms at this point (as of 3.5 update)
Kemper for sound...
Wait until you try QC! I've had all 3 and the QC is the winner for me! sounds and feel 🤘
I have both units Kemper and QC amazing machines BUT The Kemper is more organic tone! the QC is the perfect size to be On Tour!
I would rank them in that order too! 1 Kemper 2 QC 3 Helix
Hey mate! Any thoughts on what might have happened in the Andertons comparison? This vid is far more in line with my expectations and experience with both HX and Kemper (haven't used QC yet), the Andertons demo saw some pretty vast differences as I'm sure you saw yourself! We all know these units can sound 99% identical... interested to hear your thoughts, especially as the patch designer!
Yeh man i totally agree
This is a great question, seeing they used the TJ profiles. I noticed the same thing.
Andertons is trying to sell gear this guy isn't. Go back and look at some of Andertons older videos on the Kemper. They went from "not being able to hear or feel any difference" between it and the real amps they (apparently) profiled........ to all the sudden now they can that there's something newer to sell. It's quite obvious what's going on and as someone who owns or has owned a lot of plugins and hardware modelers/profilers: You can't really go wrong with anything made in the last decade or so. It's all good, if you can't get a "good tone" out of one of them you probably can't get a "good tone" out of any of them.
I couldn't say which one was which, but I knew from the first example that C was different. It had a tubbyness in the lower mid. It was closer with the other two but that only to be expected since they are taken from the same amp and the Helix isn't. In mix I doubt I could tell any difference, I am certain most listeners wouldn't.
I knew right off the bat that A was the Kemper. Has that weird upper mid bump - most noticeable with overdrive - that I hated about the Kemper (and could never EQ out of any profile)..
I barely care about the quality of tone these days because the bar is so incredibly high. However, user interface and portability are my main concerns. I love my Kemper but the UI is pretty bad overall. The main reason I don't wanna get rid of my Kemper are that some of the profiles I have probably won't get made again for the QC!
Hey I am with you here, user friendliness and portability becomes the next factor for me when deciding to buy digital modelers nowadays. I had Helix LT, but sold it after finding a smaller Ampero Stomp with same if not better quality of sounds.
I think we’ve reached a point where new units only have marginal tone improvement, the quad cortex and the UA stuff that just came out dont sound miles away from the kemper/helix that came out years ago. Very interesting times.
what UA stuff that just came out?
@@jesseharradine9861 Universal Audio, Dream, Ruby and Woodrow
Ive watched the andertons video which is similar to this ... The one which you made the patches for, the difference there was quite noticable... On your video the difference could be noticed in the dirty tones but by a fine margin.
I couldn't name which was which but I did think they sounded slightly different and had a preference. I usually preferred A, but sometimes C. By contrast I didn't care for B in any of the clips because it had this glassy upper midrange harshness that bugged me. I'm especially sensitive to harshness (which is why I'm not a strat fan in general).
Most of the clips sounded so similar that moving a mic 1/2 inch would affect the tone more than the difference in modelers.
Yeah, pretty much everything sounds great these days. I actually like the Boss stuff too, but the Helix interface is way better than everyone else - easy on device and with computer.
Well done, how come in the vid from Andertons they sounded completely different????
I owned a hx stomp and a kemper at the same time, I always prefer whatever I was playing at the time, if I played the kemper for a while I couldn’t stand the stomp, and when I got used to the stomp I hated the kemper 😂. Guitarists brains are broken
Even if a really good ear can tell them apart a layman's audience would never in a million years. I was amazed how good the Iridium sounded when a band mate was playing my rig while I sat and listened. They are all the same in the hands of the user
I didn’t know which was which, but I liked B, followed by A, followed by C in most examples.
I’ll happily admit I got it completely wrong 😂 but really they all sound great and in the context of a mix there’s no way you’d tell the difference.
Agreed!
On a related note: You worship performance packs for Kemper are great. Any plans to replicate those for the Helix?
Yes and Sooze made 25 more for the kemper that will be out in a few days!
@@ToneJunkieTV Awesome, thanks!
What I notice from these kind of tests from you guys , Helix tends to not have that kind of "thump" that the 2 other models have. Altho, I know for sure in the mix, that kind of things doesn't really matter, they all will sound so similar. But as a guitar player, when play, we can feel it. And when we feel the " feel" from the amp, we tend to play better.
I'm not an expert when it comes to helix, but i think it depends on the preset you are using. Some feel great others don't. But i realized the distance and what kind of mic you are using can make a big difference
I agree
The new 3.50 dual cabs and mic placement makes a huge difference. I found using a ribbon mic on the outer edge of the cone and dropping the high cut to 4 or so, and teaming it with a 57 in the centre adds a nice beefiness to the cab sound.
I know 3rd party QC Captures from sellers are not very slick to distribute yet - but it can work ... be great to see you sell some cool QC capture packs :-)
While I indeed was not able to tell them apart, I did notice a slight difference with option C. Was somewhat surprised to learn it was the Helix 😁
Great demo! It's funny after some 15 years, digital amp users have become cork sniffers of amp modelers 🤣
Which Purple Plexi capture is that in the video? The one on the cloud seems way darker?
Great job though man!
There is an Eq block on one of the footswitches turn that off. I use the eq to make it more mid focused for overdubs and leads etc.
@@ToneJunkieTV Ah yeh in the preset. Got it.
I saw the Anderton’s video and couldn’t fathom how they could possibly sound so different. As a Kemper and Qc owner it just didn’t make sense!
Glad to see all is corrected.
Is this a new capture in the QC or a capture of the Kemper profile?
I didn't know which one was which as you we're playing, but the entire time, I thought C sounded the best. I was even thinking, damn now I need to go out and buy whatever C is lol
Congratulations for the video, I got so used to Kemper that I got it right the first time, for me QC and Kemper are very close in sound, but I still prefer Kemper, Helix sounds very rigid to me although it was similar but you can see the difference between others.
I liked C the least. . I take A and B any day.
Glad I own the QC and the kemper. Can’t wait for the QC marketplace
All I know is I prefered the #2 everytime, I figured the #3 was the helix given the difference when using the marshall and it sounded more compressed, not in a bad way though, I think it actually sounded more "mix ready" than the others that had maybe too much dynamic
I’ve been saying this for awhile now. The top modelers are all great pick the one that suits you for it’s capabilities.
I am watching this after watching the Anderton's video and I am wondering what went wrong cos they claimed to use profiles, captures and settings dialed in by you but there is too much difference in the amps compared to what you have here. I am guessing you might explain this in another video
Is It right to compare three units where two today have free mic placement? And this Is a bruteforce point to improve sound..!? I don't know..
I’m not sure what you mean. All three sounds were made using the same amp setup. The kemper created a profile, the QC created a capture and the Helix IR was Tone Matched to the amp set up.
But so freaking close. Technology rocks!
They sound close. How do they "feel"? And differnece?
Great test. Though you didn't include the original amp sound. Tjiugj naybe you didn't mic uo ypur amp. Anyway I'm happy with my kemper. Ten years of fun with it so far. Years ahead of its time
I always appreciate your videos, HW. I learn from you! I say, choose a modeler and move on. Focus on learning to play the guitar, not the gear!
Unfortunately I knew C was the Helix as I own one (and it was my least favourite from the start) but didnt know which one the others were. A was my favourite though. Time to sell and buy a Kemper?
Yes!
They obviously all sound good. I couldn't hear any noticeable difference. I'm fortunate in that I have really good hearing and a Kemper. I've had a Kemper since V1 of the software, well before Rig Manager and I love it.
Get yourself some new headphones. I immediately heard differences.
3:52 -5:00 case in point why you should focus on hard hitting single note playing to differentiate and compare . Overdriven chords usually have too much harmonic information to easily discern the details . Hitting hard single notes here obviously distinguished C from the rest . Much punchier and more realistic tube like midrange . Obvious
How does the Helix Native software compare to Helix hardware? Are they same?
Yeah it’s the same your just using your computers processor rather than the helix’s processor.
i've only got right the kempe, just because i felt the compression, but maybe it was just good luck, they all are deadly close
Did you check ToneX? Advanced captures are sooo much accurate than my profiles… I would definitely buy some packs from ToneX Junkie !!!!
Not yet but I will!
Hi, what about Fractal FM9? Fractal also exists and very well
Had all of them ,yes they can sound identical but what I would say is you have to spend way longer on getting the helix to sound like the others.
I do tend to find the captured stuff always feels more ‘amp like’ than modelled stuff but that is very subjective obviously .
I wish you would have done the Helix 3.50 update released this month for the cab update before doing this video . Still cool video 🎉🎉🎉😊
I have been a Line 6 user for many years.
I am not a genius but I knew C was the Helix the moment he played the sensitivity test. At low gain/volume Line 6 products sound dirty whereas real tubes (or in this case profiled tube amps) add just the right amount of "crispness".
I switched from Kemper to QC recently and it was never about a difference in sound.
My big problem with the Kemper was what I call "the randomness". When I went online and downloaded a Profile pack I felt like I entered my name into the fucking lottery. There are too many factors to consider (guitars used, pedals, speakers, the room the amp was biased in, and the players themselves). You needed the Profile to be close to what you wanted because if it wasn't and you EQ too much, it sounds nothing like a real amp anymore.
I personally needed something that I could plug into and have more control over. QC does that. Not only that but it also has the benefit of superior technology allowing for multiple cabs at once, crazy signal chain things, stereo rigs, multi amp setups...those are sounds that factually the Kemper can't get you.
Doesn't mean the Kemper is a bad unit. But when it goes for the same price as a QC and has 10 year old technology in it and not even half the functionalities, it's starting to show its age. If they ever release a Kemper 2, it needs to either have amp models built in or be reduced in price if it its only gonna do Profiling.
It sounded good 10 years ago..and still does. Kemper has a better ecosystem than QC (e.g., Kemper Kabinet, FX, profile options) and is more "roadworthy". I think Kemper sounds better actually, often times.
Yeah I had no idea which was which 🤷🏽♂️ I would just play any of em.
I had B and C wrong. I am a Helix user considering switching to the QC, but I liked C the most in the last test.
At least on cheap listening devices B is thinner across all. Love A and C. Guessing B is Kemper.
I actually guessed right! I personally felt like A had more clarity and a beautiful bell like tone, I thought it was the kemper and I’m glad I was right since I have a Kemper 😂 I also have a helix and I figured that was C because of the last clip. I have no experience with the quad cortex so I just assumed that was B. They all sound great, but I’d say there is a slight difference, and I’m not even listening through headphones!
Belive it or not my favoritt was A, and it sonded better 😊🎉
Which Purple Plexi Kemper profile was this?
I have really tried to love the Helix. I think it has the best interface. But for my amp (Orange Rockerverb) I just can't get it to sound as good as the Kemper. I think the real tell is how they handle high gain.
It's kind of an unfair comparison. The Kemper is profiling a specific Orange Rockerverb (your Rockerverb), whereas the Helix modeled some other Rockerverb. Obviously the Helix can't sound as good (if good means accurate), because it's "impersonating" a different device.
I know you won't believe me, but I got it on the 3rd clip, on the dirty tone. I couldn't tell any difference on clean tones
I instantly spotted the Helix (I promise I'm telling the truth!) but I had no idea which was the Kemper/Helix on the second clips due to the Kemper/Helix having this high-pitched screech on high-gain sounds which the Helix lacks; the Helix tends to be smoother in the high end, as well as sounding a bit more mid-focused.
It's not really a better/worse thing, it's just different. Both sounded good.
Were these the setups you sent to Andertons? Just curious
No way Andertons used these setups.
Andertons definitely screwed something up with their setup.
I didn't know which was which, but tbh I thought B the Cortex was the best. I'm a kemper owner. I also have helix native. But happy to have both. Now, I seem to have the urge to get rid of my kemper haha
Kemper has a better ecosystem than QC (e.g., Kemper Kabinet, FX, profile options) and is more "roadworthy".
Some guitarists prefer a digital box that sounds more "hi fi ".
Which is ironic because the same guitarists spend years telling us how the rawness f a tube amp is so magical.
The guitarists who prefer hi Fi usually choose the Helix.
The rawness of the Kemper scares them...