Samantha is a beautiful representation of a person bridging the wisdom of the Mystic and the discernment of the Scientist. We need people like this today who are bringing the two world view together to mingle. Thank you so much Nate and Samantha, this was an AWE inspiring conversation. So looking forward to reading her book when it releases. And thank you to Michael Garfield at Future Fossils podcast who first introduced me to Samantha's work and inadvertently to this podcast as well.
Minute 38/39. Dear Nate, seldom do I hear left brain-dominant language on your podcast and certainly not from you. Your work is nothing short of a weekly spiritual triathlon. The love, courage, authenticity, level of nuance, quality, comprehensiveness, critical/analytical+pratical thinking, open mindedness and stamina you show are phenomenal! Next to the specific insights I gain from your podcast you succeed at keeping it at an emotionally bearable level, which keeps me coming back. My gratitude and respect. I wish you good health and a long life.
PS; in a biblical sense, your work seems way more like that of a Nathan than that of a Jonathan. And your last name isn’t far from Greenfields, as it may very well mean or apply to “green enclosure”. How appropriate for your message! 😅
A highly intelligent, articulate and even poetic speaker. I looked at other video talks by Samantha and they have very few views. Hopefully this interview will enlarge her platform.
It seems to me that Humanity is currently neck-deep in externally-infused mythology (religion) rather than the reality that surrounds us all.. I was absolutely dumbfounded that Nate Hagens did not recognize himself as a spiritual person, yet in my own limited mind, he and the Great Simplification is the very embodiment of spirituality! I am floored. absolutely floored.
I've heard good things about psychedelics like LSD, Psilocybin Mushrooms and their health benefits, I also heard it helps one get through addiction and depression. I'm just wondering where or how I can get my hands on them cause I'll love to give it a try, I'm passing through a state of terrible depression lately and it's killing me
In the LSD experience, we are aware of being more our self and less our self (and this can be actualised, moment by moment during the trip) then we're ever capable of experiencing without the mind expansion that LSD provides us. The work that is done, (that is; mentally spiritually emotionally) is so “individual" a thing, but the final effect can be understood and acknowledged amongst the community of others who have taken a trip on LSD. I think that makes sense, I tried to say it in a way that others who haven't taken LSD may understand. I hope I was successful.
This statement Samantha made is critically important, and is supportive of my own view that we really need a process-relational theory of value: "Putting life at the center and orienting towards the care and continuity or the beauty, abundance, and continued biodiversity of the process of life." Also this: "...thinking of all of these things as relationships...attending to relationship is the primary competency of the next stage of civilization."
Thank you, Samantha, As one of the 20% you are singing the song of my soul..❤ And thank you Nate, I am relatively new to this podcast. I think you are doing brilliant job and your contribution is invaluable.
Sorry i'm just commenting from the hip here because this is sooo good..Nate... You keep referencing the "jedi scouts" concept from time to time..in this interview you have found a jedi mistress. I would follow her lead my friend..she truly stands on the path, holding the gate open and ready to be the last one across the bridge. What a great guest.
It has long been my understanding, that if we can not feel the sacred and connect with it, we can not start fixing the meta crisis. It's not sufficient by itself, but it is the first requirement. Seek it out and you will find it. Something higher than ourselves, something that puts us into a proper context within the universe, is the only thing that will allow us to defeat the moloch traps, the multi-polar traps. Having a shared sense of the sacred is the only thing that will cultivate enough trust between us to do so. If we don't trust each other, moloch wins. It's also a win-win, because having a sacred core will make for a happier life for yourself and those around you. So you either save the world and be happy, or you'll just be happy.
One of the most disturbing aspects of the present moment is that, in an age of immense scientific maturity, our cultures are still operating on the naive intellectual "software" that was conjured up thousands of years ago by Iron Age goat herders! Samantha Sweetwater's sincere and sensible inquisitiveness stands in stark contrast to the entrenched dogmatism that is smothering much of contemporary human endeavor. If her approach was more universally adopted there would be a lot more Nate Hagens and Samantha Sweetwaters in the world
Return to an indigenous/sustainable lifestyle while you still can. I suspect you don't know what you are typing about? When this all breaks down, (and you live that long) you may be able to survive!
Samantha's statement, unanswerable questions leading her to the realm of mystery and that in wanting to know things led her to deciding to try to come to know through feeling, really struck me. To know the natural world and being a creature among other creatures is something I've tried to connect with through feeling and acting on feeling my whole life. I've written songs about animals and nature and have painted lots of wildlife and forest paintings and have turned my large garden into a wildlife oasis. I recently was part of a choral performance where all the songs were about migratory birds. The people in my small hippy community really get this. It would be awesome if mainstream society could awaken to this most important connection. They need to be shown how to care and the multiple ways to care that appeal to different personalities, and to learn that it can be fun and rewarding, not just be told that they should care.
The part where he says he doesn't connect with her words in his mind but feels it in his body is an embodied example of inter subjectivity. She, and woman often in general, speak with is in their mind, which is what they FEEL. Intellectually we are trying to wrap our heads around what she is thinking , how do her thoughts arrive there, but she is compassionately dominating us with her intuition. It takes a certain type of faith do dedicate oneself to harmonious language of a new type, in this case, the language of nature outside of the industrial worlds value systems. So as she speaks you are witnessing embodied dedication to her own body, feminine wisdom and cycles bro. As men we then have to contrast and answer that.
It’s all about healing oneself and hence to grow knowingly from this learning of life’s challenges in a positive way Then with support of peers of life challenging experiences we can go deeply into another opening of spiritual well-being growth With indigenous teachings which bonds elders with stories of Wisdom for our future generation 🕊💖
What a meaningful and beautiful conversation! Thank you both. Samantha is amazing at explaining these complex concepts and I know they will stick with me…enlifenment, awareness of awareness, continue to continue amongst many others. I also very much agree that bringing the social contract to the table can lead to very disappointing outcomes. Let’s hope that by taking Samantha’s advice to focus on relationships more people will become inspired to act.
I’ve tried listening to this three times now. 1. The first time: I could barely get through the first 15 minutes. Major eye roll. 🙄 2. The second time: I got almost halfway through and thought, wow this beautiful privileged brilliant woman is the way to get through to Nate’s designated 1500. 😂 3. The third time : everyone needs to listen to this three times 🎯
The arc of the universe bends because we are pressing on it. Perhaps the best use of our time here is to gain an awareness of the effects of the agency we wield and to learn how to be careful to use our powers for good and not evil. Thanks for sharing this conversation.
Am I the only listener who feels lost? It's like I'm listening to someone speaking a different language at times. This is the first podcast in this series I just can't understand.
That's because the woo woo types like this woman, make stuff up, and spend too much time on feelings. It's all rubbish to hide deeply held insecurities.
If you listen really closely, you can usually translate a lot of this babble and jargon into something fairly banal, but which at least still makes semantic sense. Other times it can be pretty much ??? But it's true, the people who occupy this little sphere of society and academia essentially have their own language. I don't think it's an accident that it's so incomprehensible and esoteric. That's the artifice of it. Frankly I find it fascinating. And the jargon and the buzzwords and the obscure, seemingly irrelevant references and tangents are oftentimes almost dazzling. But mainly it's the sheer verbosity. The word salad. And she can certainly hold her own in that dept. And Nate was occasionally matching her in that regard. But I honestly wonder what these people are going to do when there's no more food on the shelves. And that's a serious question. "Enlifenment' may be all well and good, but there will little time or patience for such vanities when the crunch comes....
TGS always brings together great guests! I like the technical and resource talks like 80% of the men here. This interview was kinda woo-woo for me but glad I listened and learned from it. The divide between men and women's viewpoints in the West seems to have reached a point where collaborative progress on any issue is very difficult and we now have a messed up power struggle. I fear the coming election season could be a disaster with more atomization of the sexes. Finding a middle ground is important. This needs to be approached with humility. Men could puff out there chest and say look what we've created! But, now the downside of overshoot is evident and we see we are in a bind. Women as well as men participated in the abundance. Samantha seems to imply that women are more into relationships and men more into things. If men are now stepping up and accepting responsibility for the deterioration of the physical side of Earth could women today , with their proudly boasted superior skill set for relationships, accept some similar responsibility for the deterioration of the gender relationship situation? Venus' realm. This is one of the first things to solve in TGS for what we want things to look like post-bottleneck. The sad fact of our disappearing birthrate reveals no hope for the future. We need hope. Concrete visions are starting to form for next phase. What will a gender peace treaty look like? It will not look like today's battlefield that's for sure.
Yeah, they did get into that a little bit. My thought would be that if the crunch is coming, that women better brace themselves. Because there's no power struggle, women do what men allow them to do. And only in a doomed, insanely decadent society, not to mention a terminally unsustainable one, would women ever get to even dream of enjoying such personal indulgence and autonomy as they do now today. When times are tough we will revert to the mean. It has nothing to do with women's lib in the abstract, it just becomes Darwinian at that point. So I hope western women have enjoyed their fifteen minutes. Personally I feel like they've squandered this rare privilege. Women were supposed to take down the patriarchy, and bring, I don't know, something good to the equation, after they were given the keys to the kingdom. Or that was the feminist narrative. And yet society couldn't be any more nuts, and ruthless, and loveless, and as far as our ecological situation, the ante has only been upped, and the last fifty years, pretty much from the time of Gloria Steinem up to the present day, marks our most voracious years of profligate resource devouring. So it's not women's fault as such, but it was really just a wealth transfer. And a zero sum game. Women were merely granted more access to the trough, and which seems to have only hastened our demise. So it really doesn't matter if men accept responabilty for anything. They run the earth. And always will. Though you never know, with the transhumanism thing supposedly coming down the pike, maybe women can like, augment their bodies somehow and become cyborgs, and level the playing field. And then male dominance would finally be at an end. But I wouldn't count on it....
I appreciate the compassionate message presented here, but can't go soft and fuzzy, when I look around me and know what is happening! I'm seeking and living a more sustainable (indigenous) life.... trying not to buy and consume. Have the best Life y'all!
What was soft and fuzzy about that? She very brilliantly represented the scientist and mystic perspectives in this talk. Not to mention much practical understanding of the complexity of these times.
After years of listening to and engaging with Nate and his guests, this would be the first guest that I can't maintain patience with. The concepts and ideas were fine but I tired of taking the scenic route to get there.
A lot of people won't get this. But the secret is to realize that there is science and there's also this. Subconsciously we all as humans use both. in reality there is always the many senses connection, and in that there are always conscious sense limits but subconscious and even unconscious sensing. Deep sleep states are just one example. Accessing memories is always somewhat subjective in how we happen to be remembering (recreating, interpreting).Scientific studies also help, removing objectively some of the personal biases and guesses. But trying to live in pure science, fact based, or so called is a pretty empty and removed ongoing existence. Check and observe that which appears or is embodied existence, yes, but don't thereby miss the everyday life existence. It's pretty lonely out there without it. Both observe and feel it. By the way, if you think that there are exact body boundaries, explain (and observe) what happens with every breath, where does your invisible steady "outbreath" go? And notice just as one example,
Wonderful discussion! Thank you. There is so much awe and beauty in the natural world. I pity people caught up in techno, digital, virtual lifestyles, but we all have different nirvanas and spiritualities. It's easy to imbibe the instant gratification of reels and Netflix that tickle our monkey minds that gravitate to the new and different. But, I have always found more happiness in the outdoors be it wilderness, tame park, or my backyard, playing, meditating, napping, gardening, birding, botanizing, hiking, biking, swimming. It is a gift to find joy so easily. Preserving nature has always been my calling along with snooping on the lives of non--human others.
Breaking pattern is the key. The door is our attention. The opening itself is the future we create through ritual process or the act of doing and believing in it. Appreciate y'all 🙏 🕊️
Could be patterns broken means more energy necessary to fix / find solution, whatever the problem and the attention that its focused on after patterns broken.
I can not even begin to express how wonderful this was....thank yiu so much fir ha ing Samantha on. ...I want to thank her...for being in the show . But also...for being who she is. I could totally relate to almost everything she discussed ..and have been traveling that kind of path ..for many years..pretty much. I could grasp her ability to MESH spirituality with science..
"If we oriented toward creativity that is actually generative for the biosphere and got nuanced in cycles of death and decay and destruction. I mean that's a very deep exploration of what circularity could really be. "
As Nate and Sam acknowledge, there is no way the eight billion humans can be part of the plan at the center. So after that there is little other than comparisons and contrasts, of chasing moments of repose. There are no answers other than to ultimately sit back and watch as the tsunami inundates each of our coastlines. Homeless we shall all be.
her book available LATER? I need this book NOW :-) Nate, I know this is not a YT channel about politics, even less about political news. But Gaza. The suffering. Our blindness. This does not bode well for our futur emergent societies. In your already too long list of questions for your invitees, and for yourself, add this few more: "What are your thoughts about the suffering of civilians in the middle east ?" "Observing the repression from the elites toward the multiple popular manifestations denouncing this suffering, people wanting peace, a better world, etc... how alternative consciousness, alternative governance, alternative policies can even emerge?" "Does unbridled empathy crush you emotionally in a world of wars? In a world of depraved destruction?" Bonjour du Québec.
Countries that don't go to war, or have very good history of being peaceful. I know, it could be India and everyone who has been there knows this. Great podcast 👍🏻 I always have been saying to myself since last 10 years in order to understand humans, "all brains on this planet are have different expectations from the world"
What a wonderful episode! Samantha needs to come back! It’s hard to pick a favourite guest but I would say she is right up there with Art Berman and Daniel “S” for me. I’m curious how you get the gender data? Does UA-cam share everyone’s gender? That’s interesting. I am part of the 20% and love your podcast and often share it with friends and family if both genders. Thanks Nate ❤
I tried. I tried to keep an open mind on this one. But I found it impossible to sense make beyond the warm fuzzy woo. I was reassured that it wasn't just me when Nate made his comment about not understanding part way through. I'm sure it resonates (gives a dopamine hit) for some, just not this little black duck.
After listening to this conversation for the 3rd time, I feel that it is the most poignant and pertinent encapsulation of contemporary "reality" that I have EVER heard. It stands in stark contrast to the political and religious mythology that is now simultaneously suffocating and dismembering "life" on Earth. The evidence of that assertion surrounds us yet homo sapiens en masse fail to recognize the errors of our ways. Perhaps there is a Darwinian process at work. The Earth is a miraculous place that We the People might not be suited for or unworthy of. It is so sad.
Dynamite podcast, btw. Communicating new ways of being present to experience -- what Samantha and others like her refer to as "embodying," or "tuning," often requires a re-tooling of language and meaning. What sounds like babble isn't always babble -- it's new ideas for which we don't yet have words trying to be born into the stream of recognizable communication. In that respect, it might be useful to consider the possibility that evolution can be seen as moving forward in a transformational process that is spiral, and conceptually fractal in nature. Transformation, and the process of evolution as it appears to me, engages in iterative development, but it is not locked into being governed by patterns of the past. In a broad sense, the insertion of a new concept can trigger new forms, just as the spontaneous mutation of a gene produces unanticipated changes in biological forms and behavior. Genuine transformation at a human level requires opening ourselves to what is unknown -- that which we don't know we don't know -- and allowing ourselves to retune by steeping our mind and perceptions in the realm of intuitive imagination: developing our intune-ition as Samantha refers to it, by being readily willing to experimentally embrace possibilities that may never have occurred to us before. While in hindsight transformation can appear to proceed along a recognizable progression of experience and learning, a predictable path of cause and effect, it is frequently catalyzed by a demand for what fulfills a pressing need for something other than what has gone before... something that has never existed before. As has been said in various ways, it's folly to assume we can predict future outcomes as inevitable events with any degree of success: "In life, understanding is always the booby prize." If this episode is indicative of the general direction this podcast will be moving in for the time being, I'm all for it. Thanks, Nate! Your podcast is a steady beacon of clear and interconnected thought in a time of seemingly ever increasing murkiness. P.S. And count me as female -- if you're counting.
I view the world very differently from most others, so no surprise I have some issues, but up until about 59 minutes I could generally go along with something like most of it, but at around 59:20 Samantha gets into the idea of purpose within ecosystems - and I find that notion dangerous in the way she has formulated it. I can sort of agree with aspects of it, in that cooperation in a foundational principal for the survival of complexity, so that there will be cooperative (and competitive) aspects to organisms within ecosystems, and such things can appear to be very close to the idea of purpose, and there does seem to be an important distinction, which becomes critical when it comes to talking about people. My definition of life is "systems capable of searching the space of possible systems for the survivable". Search has an aspect of freedom, of going beyond the known and the explored, that is foundational to this definition of life; and the survivable aspect imposes degrees of responsibility appropriate to the degrees of freedom claimed. Humans and our ability to use complex language, bring two things to life that did not exist previously. We bring entire new domains of algorithms of search, most of which are very much faster than the traditional genetic method of replication with variation and differential survival in different contexts doing most of the sorting. Not only does language allow us to create new ways of doing things very quickly, and to rapidly transmit them to other members of our species; it also allows us to rapidly develop technologies capable of altering environments to meet out needs. At another level, language allows for the emergence of new levels of systems/awareness; patterns of being that are not possible without language. Our usual awareness is one such, and seems to be bootstrapped into existence by a declarative statement in language, but that is a topic for a different discussion - as it too is deeply complex. The huge "fly" in this "ointment", is that evolution has strongly biased our neural networks to prefer simple certainty over complex uncertainty. We have multiple levels of systems within our sensory systems and our neural networks that subconsciously simplify down the complexity that is demonstrably present in reality, such that what seems real to us an individuals is already a grossly simplified version of whatever reality actually is. We then go on to further simplify that. And we wonder why our scientists and engineers don't often get things right first time. On top of that we build language with nouns and verbs that invite us to classify anything remotely resembling our archetypes as being exactly those, which hides deep levels of subtleties and distinctions. When it comes to the evident depths of complexity present in living systems, it is clear to me, from 60 years of study, that no human mind can possibly deal with all the complexity actually present in even the simplest of living organisms, let alone anything as complex as a human being, or an ecosystem. So we all, understandably, have to use our simplistic models; the huge issue is, that we tend to treat those simplistic models as "TRUTH" rather than accepting that they are simplistic models. The more simple and foundational the model, the less likely anyone is willing to challenge it. So we, as humans, do not have a "purpose" in the complex ecosystems. We do have a role in ensuring their survival, as our own survival is predicated on their survival in ways very few have much idea about at present, and that is another deeply complex subject. We are an entirely new form of life, in a sense, that is based upon the old forms of life, but is capable of search across entirely new domains of systems and strategies and modes of thinking and being. Right now, we are not demonstrating sufficient awareness of the need for cooperation in diversity, to have a high probability of survival. We are like children, with very simple ideas about the complexity of our existence. If people understand evolution at all, it is usually in terms of competition, rather than looking much more deeply into the complexity actually present, and seeing the foundational role of cooperation in the emergence and survival of all levels of complexity. And that is really hard, there is a great deal of complexity present, and few people have either the interest or the capacity or the time to delve deeply into that complexity and emerge on the other side with useful simplifications. Cooperation is foundational to the survival of complexity, all levels, all domains, demonstrably, and even at its simplest, that is complex. And for cooperation to survive, there must emerge evolving ecosystems of cheat detection and mitigation systems. Right now, it is arguable that cheating systems dominate most of the political, economic, educational and religious institutions on the planet. Some are clearly and obviously cheating at relatively low levels, others are cheating at much more abstract levels, and if in doubt, if it is not supporting cooperation in diversity, then it is cheating! Samantha mentions games theory, and most of games theory is predicated on closed systems, and zero sum games. We are actually in an open system, and we are exploring boundary conditions far faster than any single human can possibly comprehend. If we are to survive this, then the vast majority of people need to be able to appreciate that any level of competition that is not firmly based in cooperation is equivalent to cancer in our bodies - it may seem to be going very well for the cancer cells (competing agents), right up to the point that everything dies. Our monetary systems are no longer fit for purpose, and are now actually generating existential level risk in the secondary, tertiary, and higher order incentive structures that they promote. Fundamental reform is urgently required. So I deeply get the "spiritual" need for acceptance and cooperation; and it is actually deeply more complex than the idea of "purpose" typically embodies. If we are to survive as a species, then we must be able to accept the need to cooperate in diversity; the alternative strategy of all out competition has such a low survival probability that it is, to all intents and purposes, zero. The incentives of the military industrial complex are a direct threat to all life on the planet, but they are not alone; the risks from big Pharma, or from big Oil, or big Finance, are almost as great. We have to stop using systems that only value scarcity, and start assigning real value to the abundances that we actually need. And it is deeply more complex than that, and that is a very good place to start.
54:46 Tadzio Mueller: "when factoring in climate change, the arc of history is short and bends towards fascism" ... Rather than long and bending towards justice.
Розумна жінка.. Нажаль, мало хто зумів зрозуміти хід її думок, судячи з коментарів. Хід її думок, як мультиплікатор. Щоб розуміти таких, як Нора та Саманта, необхідно мати хочаб одну частину їх досвіду. Це справді було непросто. Початок розмови, був дуже обнадійливим і я навіть подумав, що це саме те про що я колись просив, тебе, Нейт. Особливо коли ти намагався, спрямувати розмову, згадавши про Ґріра. Але все закрутилось в іншому напрямку... Недарма українська народна приказка каже: "Чоловік голова, а жінка - шия" :)
Thanks, good coversation. I have a book on Native Califronians; the author mentions a museum display with a sign, 'Resoures were abundant.' The book (and I concur) goes on to say, if resources were abundant, the population would grow, and soon resources would not be abundant. I mean let's face reality. The book goes on to document the declining size and quantity of abalone and other shells in the middens. Sound familiar? Ecological intelligence is possible, but only because Homo sapiens can conceive of ecological reality.
On being more intentionally relational: "simply asking someone how they are" isn't going to do it because we've become socially programmed to answer that automatically and mostly dishonestly. I suggest, if it feels true, to instead make a statement about what it's like to be with that person, such as: how nice to see you, or it feels good to be with you. Or check an assumption you are noticing in them: you seem sad/ happy today.
Nate hit the nail on the head with his suggestion that we were never big enough to have an impact on the biosphere before. Aside from deep history/hunter-gatherer times maybe (who knows), we were never all that "aligned with the biosphere". And that shouldn't be all that surprising because as one of many species we also merely evolved to increase our fitness. Other animals aren't aligned with the biosphere either, they eat the biosphere or get eaten, in that respect we are not all that different. The issues is not that we failed, or that we are a plague/virus, or that we are corrupted/morally compromised or any of that moralistic nonsense... the issue is that we were to succesful. Usually when a species gets that succesful, that creates new evolutionary niches that get filled in by other species that can prey on that species and knock it down a peg. We however kinda broke the evolutionary game by evolving cultural evolution. Where other animals are stuck randomly evolving adaptations by gene mutations over many many generations, we can just intentionally pass down information from one person to the next. We are playing the game on a whole other level, in this respect we definitely are different. Ideologies/mythologies/religions get created around certain ways of life, and those are enabled by how we get the necessary energy for our survival. Maybe this is a bit to simplistic, but ideas are usually not the cause, but rather a consequence of what ways of live were possible at any given time in history. This focus on ideas as the cause, and therefor also as the solution for our current predicament is misguided. Indigenous ideas aren't going to save us because they were developed for a world that doesn't exist anymore... We are not going to change the world by changing our ideas first, we are rather going to change our ideas when the world changes, when we have to.... This is the issue I have with where this is going. The analysis is fine, but it's not going to work as a societal solution... that allways has been the problem with these counter-cultural left/green movements, it's fine as a lifestyle to combat feelings of alienation/disconnection, but it won't solve our problems at a societal level.
You think? I have a hard time imaging anything less applicable to hard times than whatever this lady is babbling about. I'm not even sure it qualifies as analysis. This sort of desultory jibber jabber is fine and dandy when times are flush, but not so much when they're lean. Quite obviously. I suppose all's I can say is if and when things get really rough, which presumably is what we're all worried about and dreading.... people like this will just be swept away. And that will be the end of that. So there's some sort of bitter irony on a UA-cam channel dedicated to raising the alarm - about the impending metacrisis!!! That someone so ineffectual and effete, so totally, so exquisitely, a veritable poster child of the 'carbon pulse', would be someone we would ever turn for anything at all in times like these. These are the kind of people you run from. Nevertheless that was a thoroughly enjoyable listen, I suppose for morbid reasons....
Yep. We’re a victim of our own success. Every once in a while a creature becomes so dominate that all others have to be at its “mercy”. That’s the situation in our present predicament. Except in our case we have broad agency. We can act in ways that now involve choice to not only to survive but to assist the Living Planet in a responsible manner. Let’s do that work now with joy and vigor.
At a societal level we need to consume way less and start thinking about how to lower population and energy consumption. But the forces of capitalism are mighty and I don’t know what will stop them voluntarily.
@@dermotmeuchner2416 You said it. Probably nothing. Unfortunately there are some seriously grim possibilities when it comes to massive and sudden population reduction that it would be unseemly to discuss in mixed ocmpany. You can see them on display in the war in Gaza.....
@@Joeyjojoshabbadoo I guess I was thinking more generally about 'counter-culture left' this guest is an example of, maybe not what she is saying here specifically. Put it this way, even if we would solve all of our material problems, a lot of people probably still would feel aliened/disconnected in this world because we evolved to live in small close tribes wandering in nature all the time. What you often see advanced as a solution in these counter-culture left circles is returning to the land, to community, to a simpler way of life closer to nature. I think that can maybe work as an individual solution, for some to combat these feelings of disconnect, but I don't think it can solve our 'material' problems in a world of 8 billion people. I agree BTW that you only get to focus on these kind of problems in a world affluent enough to not have to care about more basic things, and that there is something deeply ironic about all these people railing against the system that gave them the opportunity to spend time and energy on these issues in the first place.
I love her reference to Ken Wilber, he states we live in flatland. Essentially our projection is away from being human. Just sit and look at what we have created, the systems are insane and counterproductive to the biosphere we are destroying. It’s all linked, that is why Steve Keen’s study on economic history is so pertinent. Imagine the world if we followed the physiocrats ideology, we could possibly living in such a different way where the source of wealth is the pure amazement of the Mother Earth rather than a dopamine hit of the artificial profit related system we have created.
Congrats on being just as close-minded as the worst climate deniers out there. Respectfully, I would ask you to shut your mouth and open your third eye and take some DMT, LSD and THC @@stevealdrich2472
This lady is obviously a grifter. Or a charlatan or whatever you want to call it. Peddling spiritual heroin for liberal women, and that's how she pays the bills. I guess ladies like this and Nate run in the same circles, which is not terribly encouraging. And so why not have her on, it couldn't hurt. But her gibberish is probably not going to connect too well with the more typical citizen who's worried about, you know, societal collapse. But there's only so many Simon Micheauxs to go around I suppose....
At the end felt this conversation wouldhave been better as a round table discussion, theme "Life at the Center" with guests Samantha Sweetwater, Vandana Shiva and Nora Bateson, as it was I’m afraid it did nothing for me, or know where spirituality fits in with the biophysical, poly and metacrisis facing us as a solution🤔
Indeed. I'm not sure what ladies like this are gonna do when the crunch finally comes, and the ride is finally over. But I ain't sharing my food with her.....
Nate, as some of your conversations have highlighted the need for a new religion, a prime candidate would be the Eco-Theology of Michael Dowd. Sadly, Michael is no longer with us. But he had already created a huge media legacy which brought together many people from varying backgrounds around the world who share his vision.
Did you just suggest a new religion? And you're serious. I like to think this raising of the alarm is a desperately necessary thing, and a good thing of course. We have the techno prowess now with the internet to spread the word at lightning speed, and hopefully people can become galvanized! While religion, who's only enduring legacy would be it's peculiar ability to herd people into large groups, where they get lost in the overwhelming presence of the crowd, and use dogma to steadily eat away at the reliable perception of their eyes and ears, exploiting their fears, uncertainties and innate vulnerability, quietly demanding submission, eventually getting the congregation to the point where they manage to seriously consider that 2+2 very well might = 5. And finally, if everything's clicking, its adherents will have replaced their own natural vigor and courage of mind and spirit, with some form of either soulless piety, or alarmingly ecstatic worship. And again, submission. And you're suggesting we start a new religion. Yeah, I pretty much figure we need to go in the polar opposite direction of more religion. Which is most definitely one of the defining factors that got us here in the first place. This could be our chance to finally break free from it! That's one of the exciting parts of this inevitable calamity....
I prefer the science-focussed discussions that enable me to triangulate and check assertions to enable me to decide whether I trust the person making the assertions or not. This discussion was a bit too Deepak Chopra for me....a bit too lacking in concrete ideas and references..
8 billion self-organizing systems (people ) wake up each day, breathe (our contribution to the planet) and strive to do no harm while managing our waste.
When the whale was about to become exterminated oil came out of the ground to save them. Now our love of the whale will save us from oil. And we won't know it until later.
Evolution is a story of the sequence of 'Adjacent Possibilities', at all levels; societal, individual mental, individual and species genetic, inter-cellular, intracellular, biological and biochemical. atomic and subatomic, with each on its own timeframe.
Good use of the Right Brain when observing that all nations and tribes have a sort of ancient "Ten Commandments" relating to their place in Nature (which the actual Ten Commandments do not deal with - but Genesis does, and so do many other sections of the Bible). And that these rules arose when humans first started to observe that it was all too easy to exhaust the natural resources available to them - this happened at different epochs for different regions of the Earth, but nearly all these "Codes to Live By" were constructed long before Year One AD (CE). But both participants then revert to Left Brain "Power of Positive Thinking" mode - I suppose it is hard not to, for all of us. I think Dr McGilchrist does underline that essentially, the Right Brain is gloomy and "negative" and the Left Brain is optimistic to a delusional degree - simply because it cannot look at the Bigger Picture by itself, and often refuses to obey any attempt by the Right Brain to assist it in looking at the Bigger Picture. "We can go to the Moon!!!!" "To do what, pray?" "Buzz off, Right Brain, with your negativity ....... ". Etc. There is no left v. right connection with gender, nor with studying the Arts more than the Sciences. Nor with playing house instead of dismantling machines or dissecting caterpillars. Indeed the Sciences (especially Maths and Physics, but all the Sciences) are very obedient to the right brain provided they have not become stifled by Mammon, Moloch, Baal, and other pagan deities into using only the left brain. The same is true of Nathan the Prophet, all the Old Testament Prophets, Jesus, St Paul, all the Apostles - in short, all the foundational texts and messengers of Judaism and Christianity. The Bible is an endless litany of right-brain prophets of doom warning Kings and Nations and Emperors and Scribes and Pharisees to try and look at the Bigger Picture, or Doom will ensue. Sometimes a King or two pays heed - but mostly, no-one does. So Doom duly ensues. The OT record tallies precisely with the rise and fall of giant civilizations in the Middle and Near East, and less gigantic ones too, squabbling in the shadow of the giants. It is nonsense to suppose that only non-Abrahamic spirituality favours the right brain - instead, ancient history is littered with examples of non-Abrahamic religions that were misused by the left brain and the misuse caused civilizational collapse. Including Greek, Roman, Mayan, African, Norse, and Asian gods. Not to mention Easter Island's ugly gods. Although monotheism is less full of OVERT human sacrifice, Judaism and Christianity (and Islam) have also been misused from the very start - the Old Testament records serial Israelite misuses from Genesis onwards; and the misuse of Christianity started almost as soon as it swept to power in around 300 A.D., but the record is not neatly available as in the OT. Still, a lot of Christian priests now, in 2024, believe that things started to go wrong almost immediately after the death of Christ and his first Apostles. Which is kind of par for the course when it comes to human conduct down the ages and around the world. The original biblical guidance of how to live sustainably is still there, throughout the Bible - but the Churches ignore most of it, not surprisingly, or there would be no donations would there? Now the Churches are chasing the Pink Pound, piling folly upon folly. We all know where it will end, if we study the rise and fall of civilizations (including "indigenous" ones - hallo, we were all "indigenous" once). Just get ready for the inevitable, and stop trying to avert it. Future generations of humans may or may not survive - but there is little we can do to ensure their survival now. We must just watch and pray. And talk of course - which is why this channel and many others are important, despite not being any practical USE. Since when did words have to be of practical USE? That is a typical left brain fantasy. A fork or a spade or a computer have to be useful. Words do not - but they are the province of the left brain, and the left brain imagines that words do need to be of some practical use, with measurable results. It is only in poetry and songs and occasionally drama and other forms of fiction, that the left brain will let go of its fixation that words have to be useful. Religious texts count as poetry. They are clearly not fiction, though many allege they are. The Holy Koran is actually presented as Poetry by a Poet - which it is. However, it has rarely been used properly since it was composed - what a surprise ..... not.
Hi Nate. Sorry to piggyback this video’s comment section but have you heard of Roger Hallam? A UK activist. I’d love to hear a discussion between you two
What a load of crap. For the first time watching The Great Simplification videos I have been unable to get to the end of a discussion. Hopeless attempts to glorify mysticism and subjectivity to a plain where is sits alongside science. No, sorry, not for me. I don't deny, or reject the existence of a spiritual / mystical domain, but any attempt to 'braid' it with science and subjectivity is a fools errand.
I like the direction but i wish it wasn’t contaminated with pop psychology and intersectional feminism. Some of these ideas are not wisdom. However, i will try to separate the wheat from the chaff.
I really enjoy Nate saying he doesn’t understand what she says when she injects strange gnostic metaphysics. He is responding to her charisma, most likely. Not the profundity of her word combination.
I think the solution is to re-orient to infinite time horizons. Once you do that, everything else must be repaired. If the analysis includes biophysics.
Humans must become the worshipers and stewards of life on Earth..We won't do that on our own, because that consciousness is light years away, we are indoctrinated, have unrealistic expectations, and our priorities are literally insane, but we will be forced into that position because of the consequences of our behavior, because of necessity..Such a monumental change will be a rebirth, a reordering of everything we do, think, and what motivates us..Rebirths are painful, and becoming the worshipers and stewards of life on Earth can only be the calm after the storm..And I think humanity has had this rebirth many times before, on small scales, but we really do have the long term memories of gold fish, both in our everyday lives and in our history..No goldfish were harmed in the production of this comment. We know why almost all of our civilizations and empires have failed but we repeat the same obvious mistakes anyway..Either we will mature as a species after our next world war/economic/ecological disaster or we will kill ourselves off, and take most complex life with us..
I couldn't make it through this one Nate. Major eye-roll... This woman is a charlatan. I get it, we all want to feel good and hang out with half naked hippies in tropical retreat centers. As with so many others, follow the money. Profiteering from helping corporate executives feel good about themselves does not equal wisdom. Not sure how this helps us. I love your show, don't lose your focus. Beware the sexy gurus...
I called her a charlatan too and my comment was immediately deleted. There are many charlatans working this sector of the economy, but In this case it's just so glaring. Still, it was fascinating listening to this lady talk for ninety minutes. What with all the buzzwords and the jargon on full display. She even giggles every so often, like the true manufactured, post-flower child, well-credentialed late-capitalism eco-doom hustler she appears to be. I honestly wonder where these people come from, and how their lives even evolved to this point. This is not what one grows up aspiring to become. But, you know, everyone's gotta eat....
This speaks to failed, flawed privilege, in that "private law" is the DNA of each unique living entity. By failing to recognize that "privilege" in every "other" we disconnect from "continuity".
I’m not an evolutionary biologist but I would assume humans wiped out all the megafauna of the new areas they migrated to out of Africa and didn’t co evolve with because we were essentially taking the place in the ecology of the megafauna, kind of like this ecology ain’t big enough for the two of us type thing, we couldn’t co exist in harmony with the megafauna so one had to go and we wiped them out so a new sort of homeostasis of the ecology could take place
80% Of this channels followers being men is no real show of bias for this channel specifically as much as it seems to be a preference for men to be regular youtube viewers so your audience pool potential starts out heavily skewed towards the male audience. Samantha's reply however also applies to a seeming male preference for longer form videos.
@@madraven07 Clever. But we all likelier than not get to go together. Plus I know I am going to die. How about you? Are you special such as being able to violate the laws of nature and get rewarded? I think that was what bumblebee was about.
Samantha - i started at the beginning and tried to listen to this podcast again. I took notes and kept a record of your phrases. No flow, too verbose. I challenge you to represent women and ask to debate with someone like Robert Sopolsky. He would be very polite if he even accepted your request.
The world is so beautiful and sacred, I remember watching a video of an elephant that was eaten alive for 3 days. That happens to billions snd trillions of sentient beings every single hour. Spiritual and mother Gaia. Give me a break. All that you are trying to save isn’t worth saving and will eventually be destroyed by a solar event, a meteor, a dying star and so on.
Thanks, Nate. For sure, one of your better looking guests. Sweet. Unfortunately, I could not resonate with Samantha. If I may throw some light on the question of what are humans for? Humans are biological organisms harbouring a soul. The soul grounds to earth and connects the human to the ever-growing ALLgorithm in space. It is our single purpose to align with our soul and make it master of our mind. If that occurred, all will be fine. Listen to your heart, Nate and you become spiritual automatic.
80% male - climate change is a thermodynamics conjecture - ie abstract/ 'objective'. Whereas 'but I like my car' is feelings. You can see who is winning.
Samantha is a beautiful representation of a person bridging the wisdom of the Mystic and the discernment of the Scientist. We need people like this today who are bringing the two world view together to mingle. Thank you so much Nate and Samantha, this was an AWE inspiring conversation. So looking forward to reading her book when it releases. And thank you to Michael Garfield at Future Fossils podcast who first introduced me to Samantha's work and inadvertently to this podcast as well.
She's nice to look at but the bulk of people just don't get beyond hand-to-mouth ideology. It comes down to the math of dummies vs. thinkers.
Minute 38/39. Dear Nate, seldom do I hear left brain-dominant language on your podcast and certainly not from you. Your work is nothing short of a weekly spiritual triathlon. The love, courage, authenticity, level of nuance, quality, comprehensiveness, critical/analytical+pratical thinking, open mindedness and stamina you show are phenomenal! Next to the specific insights I gain from your podcast you succeed at keeping it at an emotionally bearable level, which keeps me coming back. My gratitude and respect. I wish you good health and a long life.
PS; in a biblical sense, your work seems way more like that of a Nathan than that of a Jonathan. And your last name isn’t far from Greenfields, as it may very well mean or apply to “green enclosure”. How appropriate for your message! 😅
A highly intelligent, articulate and even poetic speaker. I looked at other video talks by Samantha and they have very few views. Hopefully this interview will enlarge her platform.
You're kidding, right? Maybe not.
It seems to me that Humanity is currently neck-deep in externally-infused mythology (religion) rather than the reality that surrounds us all.. I was absolutely dumbfounded that Nate Hagens did not recognize himself as a spiritual person, yet in my own limited mind, he and the Great Simplification is the very embodiment of spirituality! I am floored. absolutely floored.
Our religion is money, and turning things into money. We are running out of things.
I believe you are correct, as hope is the very essence of spirituality.
Settle down little frog 🐸
I've heard good things about psychedelics like LSD, Psilocybin Mushrooms and their health benefits, I also heard it helps one get through addiction and depression. I'm just wondering where or how I can get my hands on them cause I'll love to give it a try, I'm passing through a state of terrible depression lately and it's killing me
[Adamsflakesx]
Ships psychedelics
@@userconspiracynut how can I reach out??
Is it Instagram?
Yeah, he has variety of stuffs like Mushrooms, LSD, DMT, MDMA even the chocolate bars
In the LSD experience, we are aware of being more our self and less our self (and this can be actualised, moment by moment during the trip) then we're ever capable of experiencing without the mind expansion that LSD provides us.
The work that is done, (that is; mentally spiritually emotionally) is so “individual" a thing, but the final effect can be understood and acknowledged amongst the community of others who have taken a trip on LSD. I think that makes sense, I tried to say it in a way that others who haven't taken LSD may understand. I hope I was successful.
This statement Samantha made is critically important, and is supportive of my own view that we really need a process-relational theory of value:
"Putting life at the center and orienting towards the care and continuity or the beauty, abundance, and continued biodiversity of the process of life."
Also this: "...thinking of all of these things as relationships...attending to relationship is the primary competency of the next stage of civilization."
What a pleasurable, delicious conversation! I felt Samantha as my older (though much younger) soul mate. Thank you all who made it possible
Thank you, Samantha, As one of the 20% you are singing the song of my soul..❤
And thank you Nate, I am relatively new to this podcast. I think you are doing brilliant job and your contribution is invaluable.
Thanks Nate, team and Samantha!
Sorry i'm just commenting from the hip here because this is sooo good..Nate... You keep referencing the "jedi scouts" concept from time to time..in this interview you have found a jedi mistress. I would follow her lead my friend..she truly stands on the path, holding the gate open and ready to be the last one across the bridge. What a great guest.
love this comment. jedi mistress queen for sure.
It has long been my understanding, that if we can not feel the sacred and connect with it, we can not start fixing the meta crisis. It's not sufficient by itself, but it is the first requirement. Seek it out and you will find it.
Something higher than ourselves, something that puts us into a proper context within the universe, is the only thing that will allow us to defeat the moloch traps, the multi-polar traps. Having a shared sense of the sacred is the only thing that will cultivate enough trust between us to do so. If we don't trust each other, moloch wins.
It's also a win-win, because having a sacred core will make for a happier life for yourself and those around you. So you either save the world and be happy, or you'll just be happy.
Yes.
" once you take good out of the world, you can do what you want to the world "
I feel that 49:40
god
I loved this interview!
One of the most disturbing aspects of the present moment is that, in an age of immense scientific maturity, our cultures are still operating on the naive intellectual "software" that was conjured up thousands of years ago by Iron Age goat herders! Samantha Sweetwater's sincere and sensible inquisitiveness stands in stark contrast to the entrenched dogmatism that is smothering much of contemporary human endeavor. If her approach was more universally adopted there would be a lot more Nate Hagens and Samantha Sweetwaters in the world
Return to an indigenous/sustainable lifestyle while you still can.
I suspect you don't know what you are typing about?
When this all breaks down, (and you live that long) you may be able to survive!
???@@johncarter1150
Paul Stamets is also a great guide.
Dude, you should write the little blurbs for her books. 'Cause that was pretty awesome.
Samantha's statement, unanswerable questions leading her to the realm of mystery and that in wanting to know things led her to deciding to try to come to know through feeling, really struck me. To know the natural world and being a creature among other creatures is something I've tried to connect with through feeling and acting on feeling my whole life. I've written songs about animals and nature and have painted lots of wildlife and forest paintings and have turned my large garden into a wildlife oasis. I recently was part of a choral performance where all the songs were about migratory birds. The people in my small hippy community really get this. It would be awesome if mainstream society could awaken to this most important connection. They need to be shown how to care and the multiple ways to care that appeal to different personalities, and to learn that it can be fun and rewarding, not just be told that they should care.
The part where he says he doesn't connect with her words in his mind but feels it in his body is an embodied example of inter subjectivity. She, and woman often in general, speak with is in their mind, which is what they FEEL. Intellectually we are trying to wrap our heads around what she is thinking , how do her thoughts arrive there, but she is compassionately dominating us with her intuition. It takes a certain type of faith do dedicate oneself to harmonious language of a new type, in this case, the language of nature outside of the industrial worlds value systems.
So as she speaks you are witnessing embodied dedication to her own body, feminine wisdom and cycles bro. As men we then have to contrast and answer that.
It’s all about healing oneself and hence to grow knowingly from this learning of life’s challenges in a positive way
Then with support of peers of life challenging experiences we can go deeply into another opening of spiritual well-being growth With indigenous teachings which bonds elders with stories of Wisdom for our future generation 🕊💖
I have heard it said that "if we take care of the oldest dog and youngest baby, everything else will take care of itself." Namaste
Thanks for another great interview!
What a meaningful and beautiful conversation! Thank you both. Samantha is amazing at explaining these complex concepts and I know they will stick with me…enlifenment, awareness of awareness, continue to continue amongst many others. I also very much agree that bringing the social contract to the table can lead to very disappointing outcomes. Let’s hope that by taking Samantha’s advice to focus on relationships more people will become inspired to act.
I’ve tried listening to this three times now.
1. The first time: I could barely get through the first 15 minutes. Major eye roll. 🙄
2. The second time: I got almost halfway through and thought, wow this beautiful privileged
brilliant woman is the way to get through to Nate’s designated 1500. 😂
3. The third time : everyone needs to listen to this three times 🎯
The arc of the universe bends because we are pressing on it. Perhaps the best use of our time here is to gain an awareness of the effects of the agency we wield and to learn how to be careful to use our powers for good and not evil. Thanks for sharing this conversation.
Am I the only listener who feels lost? It's like I'm listening to someone speaking a different language at times. This is the first podcast in this series I just can't understand.
That's because the woo woo types like this woman, make stuff up, and spend too much time on feelings. It's all rubbish to hide deeply held insecurities.
If you listen really closely, you can usually translate a lot of this babble and jargon into something fairly banal, but which at least still makes semantic sense. Other times it can be pretty much ??? But it's true, the people who occupy this little sphere of society and academia essentially have their own language. I don't think it's an accident that it's so incomprehensible and esoteric. That's the artifice of it. Frankly I find it fascinating. And the jargon and the buzzwords and the obscure, seemingly irrelevant references and tangents are oftentimes almost dazzling. But mainly it's the sheer verbosity. The word salad. And she can certainly hold her own in that dept. And Nate was occasionally matching her in that regard. But I honestly wonder what these people are going to do when there's no more food on the shelves. And that's a serious question. "Enlifenment' may be all well and good, but there will little time or patience for such vanities when the crunch comes....
Touché@@Joeyjojoshabbadoo
Good evening Nate and Samantha
Loved all of this.
Truly grateful.
💜
Brilliant woman! So deliberate and thoughtful in both her questions and her answers.
TGS always brings together great guests! I like the technical and resource talks like 80% of the men here. This interview was kinda woo-woo for me but glad I listened and learned from it. The divide between men and women's viewpoints in the West seems to have reached a point where collaborative progress on any issue is very difficult and we now have a messed up power struggle. I fear the coming election season could be a disaster with more atomization of the sexes. Finding a middle ground is important. This needs to be approached with humility. Men could puff out there chest and say look what we've created! But, now the downside of overshoot is evident and we see we are in a bind. Women as well as men participated in the abundance. Samantha seems to imply that women are more into relationships and men more into things. If men are now stepping up and accepting responsibility for the deterioration of the physical side of Earth could women today , with their proudly boasted superior skill set for relationships, accept some similar responsibility for the deterioration of the gender relationship situation? Venus' realm. This is one of the first things to solve in TGS for what we want things to look like post-bottleneck. The sad fact of our disappearing birthrate reveals no hope for the future. We need hope. Concrete visions are starting to form for next phase. What will a gender peace treaty look like? It will not look like today's battlefield that's for sure.
Yeah, they did get into that a little bit. My thought would be that if the crunch is coming, that women better brace themselves. Because there's no power struggle, women do what men allow them to do. And only in a doomed, insanely decadent society, not to mention a terminally unsustainable one, would women ever get to even dream of enjoying such personal indulgence and autonomy as they do now today. When times are tough we will revert to the mean. It has nothing to do with women's lib in the abstract, it just becomes Darwinian at that point. So I hope western women have enjoyed their fifteen minutes. Personally I feel like they've squandered this rare privilege. Women were supposed to take down the patriarchy, and bring, I don't know, something good to the equation, after they were given the keys to the kingdom. Or that was the feminist narrative. And yet society couldn't be any more nuts, and ruthless, and loveless, and as far as our ecological situation, the ante has only been upped, and the last fifty years, pretty much from the time of Gloria Steinem up to the present day, marks our most voracious years of profligate resource devouring. So it's not women's fault as such, but it was really just a wealth transfer. And a zero sum game. Women were merely granted more access to the trough, and which seems to have only hastened our demise.
So it really doesn't matter if men accept responabilty for anything. They run the earth. And always will. Though you never know, with the transhumanism thing supposedly coming down the pike, maybe women can like, augment their bodies somehow and become cyborgs, and level the playing field. And then male dominance would finally be at an end. But I wouldn't count on it....
What if it turns out that life is the meaning of life
“Born to be alive”
Patrick Hernandez reference? @@NancyBruning
ua-cam.com/video/iqjCqAK0eZU/v-deo.htmlsi=WveYtvATIb5v_aBl
Great talk!! This has become my favorite podcast over the past years. Such great conversations.
Same!
I appreciate the compassionate message presented here, but can't go soft and fuzzy, when I look around me and know what is happening! I'm seeking and living a more sustainable (indigenous) life.... trying not to buy and consume. Have the best Life y'all!
She literally talks about living more sustainably and indigenous knowledge in this interview
What was soft and fuzzy about that? She very brilliantly represented the scientist and mystic perspectives in this talk. Not to mention much practical understanding of the complexity of these times.
"Soft and fuzzy" sums up my reaction to this podcast. Pssst - There is no God.
Your guest brought up the human waste sewage sludge disposal dilemma. Please do a podcast on sludge "farming" and the human waste stream.
ooof can we not call it sludge farming though?
After years of listening to and engaging with Nate and his guests, this would be the first guest that I can't maintain patience with. The concepts and ideas were fine but I tired of taking the scenic route to get there.
Yes. "Texture of calm" is superfluous wording. She needs to get to the point. I was irritated.
Get in touch with your feminine energy.
A lot of people won't get this. But the secret is to realize that there is science and there's also this. Subconsciously we all as humans use both. in reality there is always the many senses connection, and in that there are always conscious sense limits but subconscious and even unconscious sensing. Deep sleep states are just one example. Accessing memories is always somewhat subjective in how we happen to be remembering (recreating, interpreting).Scientific studies also help, removing objectively some of the personal biases and guesses. But trying to live in pure science, fact based, or so called is a pretty empty and removed ongoing existence. Check and observe that which appears or is embodied existence, yes, but don't thereby miss the everyday life existence. It's pretty lonely out there without it. Both observe and feel it. By the way, if you think that there are exact body boundaries, explain (and observe) what happens with every breath, where does your invisible steady "outbreath" go? And notice just as one example,
Wonderful discussion! Thank you. There is so much awe and beauty in the natural world. I pity people caught up in techno, digital, virtual lifestyles, but we all have different nirvanas and spiritualities. It's easy to imbibe the instant gratification of reels and Netflix that tickle our monkey minds that gravitate to the new and different. But, I have always found more happiness in the outdoors be it wilderness, tame park, or my backyard, playing, meditating, napping, gardening, birding, botanizing, hiking, biking, swimming. It is a gift to find joy so easily. Preserving nature has always been my calling along with snooping on the lives of non--human others.
Awe inspiring. Allan Watts said " The natural state of man is ecstatic wonder"
Breaking pattern is the key. The door is our attention. The opening itself is the future we create through ritual process or the act of doing and believing in it. Appreciate y'all 🙏 🕊️
Could be patterns broken means more energy necessary to fix / find solution, whatever the problem and the attention that its focused on after patterns broken.
I can not even begin to express how wonderful this was....thank yiu so much fir ha ing Samantha on. ...I want to thank her...for being in the show . But also...for being who she is. I could totally relate to almost everything she discussed ..and have been traveling that kind of path ..for many years..pretty much. I could grasp her ability to MESH spirituality with science..
"If we oriented toward creativity that is actually generative for the biosphere and got nuanced in cycles of death and decay and destruction. I mean that's a very deep exploration of what circularity could really be. "
As Nate and Sam acknowledge, there is no way the eight billion humans can be part of the plan at the center. So after that there is little other than comparisons and contrasts, of chasing moments of repose. There are no answers other than to ultimately sit back and watch as the tsunami inundates each of our coastlines. Homeless we shall all be.
her book available LATER? I need this book NOW :-) Nate, I know this is not a YT channel about politics, even less about political news. But Gaza. The suffering. Our blindness. This does not bode well for our futur emergent societies. In your already too long list of questions for your invitees, and for yourself, add this few more: "What are your thoughts about the suffering of civilians in the middle east ?" "Observing the repression from the elites toward the multiple popular manifestations denouncing this suffering, people wanting peace, a better world, etc... how alternative consciousness, alternative governance, alternative policies can even emerge?" "Does unbridled empathy crush you emotionally in a world of wars? In a world of depraved destruction?" Bonjour du Québec.
Most excellent! Thank you for this awesome interview.
Countries that don't go to war, or have very good history of being peaceful. I know, it could be India and everyone who has been there knows this. Great podcast 👍🏻
I always have been saying to myself since last 10 years in order to understand humans, "all brains on this planet are have different expectations from the world"
If Samantha were half as intelligible as she is intelligent, she’d be a force of nature.
What a wonderful episode! Samantha needs to come back! It’s hard to pick a favourite guest but I would say she is right up there with Art Berman and Daniel “S” for me.
I’m curious how you get the gender data? Does UA-cam share everyone’s gender? That’s interesting. I am part of the 20% and love your podcast and often share it with friends and family if both genders. Thanks Nate ❤
Enlifenment! Repeat, Enlifenment!!
May God help us all....
Samantha glows... We need more people in this world who glow.
A good step is to talk about other creatures as they are alive. Say "them" rather than "it". "friends/family" rather than "things".
Good hair cut Nate! And digging your tie dye!
I tried. I tried to keep an open mind on this one. But I found it impossible to sense make beyond the warm fuzzy woo. I was reassured that it wasn't just me when Nate made his comment about not understanding part way through. I'm sure it resonates (gives a dopamine hit) for some, just not this little black duck.
After listening to this conversation for the 3rd time, I feel that it is the most poignant and pertinent encapsulation of contemporary "reality" that I have EVER heard. It stands in stark contrast to the political and religious mythology that is now simultaneously suffocating and dismembering "life" on Earth. The evidence of that assertion surrounds us yet homo sapiens en masse fail to recognize the errors of our ways. Perhaps there is a Darwinian process at work. The Earth is a miraculous place that We the People might not be suited for or unworthy of. It is so sad.
Dynamite podcast, btw.
Communicating new ways of being present to experience -- what Samantha and others like her refer to as "embodying," or "tuning," often requires a re-tooling of language and meaning. What sounds like babble isn't always babble -- it's new ideas for which we don't yet have words trying to be born into the stream of recognizable communication.
In that respect, it might be useful to consider the possibility that evolution can be seen as moving forward in a transformational process that is spiral, and conceptually fractal in nature. Transformation, and the process of evolution as it appears to me, engages in iterative development, but it is not locked into being governed by patterns of the past. In a broad sense, the insertion of a new concept can trigger new forms, just as the spontaneous mutation of a gene produces unanticipated changes in biological forms and behavior.
Genuine transformation at a human level requires opening ourselves to what is unknown -- that which we don't know we don't know -- and allowing ourselves to retune by steeping our mind and perceptions in the realm of intuitive imagination: developing our intune-ition as Samantha refers to it, by being readily willing to experimentally embrace possibilities that may never have occurred to us before. While in hindsight transformation can appear to proceed along a recognizable progression of experience and learning, a predictable path of cause and effect, it is frequently catalyzed by a demand for what fulfills a pressing need for something other than what has gone before... something that has never existed before.
As has been said in various ways, it's folly to assume we can predict future outcomes as inevitable events with any degree of success: "In life, understanding is always the booby prize."
If this episode is indicative of the general direction this podcast will be moving in for the time being, I'm all for it.
Thanks, Nate! Your podcast is a steady beacon of clear and interconnected thought in a time of seemingly ever increasing murkiness.
P.S. And count me as female -- if you're counting.
I view the world very differently from most others, so no surprise I have some issues, but up until about 59 minutes I could generally go along with something like most of it, but at around 59:20 Samantha gets into the idea of purpose within ecosystems - and I find that notion dangerous in the way she has formulated it.
I can sort of agree with aspects of it, in that cooperation in a foundational principal for the survival of complexity, so that there will be cooperative (and competitive) aspects to organisms within ecosystems, and such things can appear to be very close to the idea of purpose, and there does seem to be an important distinction, which becomes critical when it comes to talking about people.
My definition of life is "systems capable of searching the space of possible systems for the survivable".
Search has an aspect of freedom, of going beyond the known and the explored, that is foundational to this definition of life; and the survivable aspect imposes degrees of responsibility appropriate to the degrees of freedom claimed.
Humans and our ability to use complex language, bring two things to life that did not exist previously. We bring entire new domains of algorithms of search, most of which are very much faster than the traditional genetic method of replication with variation and differential survival in different contexts doing most of the sorting.
Not only does language allow us to create new ways of doing things very quickly, and to rapidly transmit them to other members of our species; it also allows us to rapidly develop technologies capable of altering environments to meet out needs.
At another level, language allows for the emergence of new levels of systems/awareness; patterns of being that are not possible without language. Our usual awareness is one such, and seems to be bootstrapped into existence by a declarative statement in language, but that is a topic for a different discussion - as it too is deeply complex.
The huge "fly" in this "ointment", is that evolution has strongly biased our neural networks to prefer simple certainty over complex uncertainty.
We have multiple levels of systems within our sensory systems and our neural networks that subconsciously simplify down the complexity that is demonstrably present in reality, such that what seems real to us an individuals is already a grossly simplified version of whatever reality actually is. We then go on to further simplify that. And we wonder why our scientists and engineers don't often get things right first time.
On top of that we build language with nouns and verbs that invite us to classify anything remotely resembling our archetypes as being exactly those, which hides deep levels of subtleties and distinctions.
When it comes to the evident depths of complexity present in living systems, it is clear to me, from 60 years of study, that no human mind can possibly deal with all the complexity actually present in even the simplest of living organisms, let alone anything as complex as a human being, or an ecosystem. So we all, understandably, have to use our simplistic models; the huge issue is, that we tend to treat those simplistic models as "TRUTH" rather than accepting that they are simplistic models. The more simple and foundational the model, the less likely anyone is willing to challenge it.
So we, as humans, do not have a "purpose" in the complex ecosystems.
We do have a role in ensuring their survival, as our own survival is predicated on their survival in ways very few have much idea about at present, and that is another deeply complex subject.
We are an entirely new form of life, in a sense, that is based upon the old forms of life, but is capable of search across entirely new domains of systems and strategies and modes of thinking and being. Right now, we are not demonstrating sufficient awareness of the need for cooperation in diversity, to have a high probability of survival.
We are like children, with very simple ideas about the complexity of our existence.
If people understand evolution at all, it is usually in terms of competition, rather than looking much more deeply into the complexity actually present, and seeing the foundational role of cooperation in the emergence and survival of all levels of complexity. And that is really hard, there is a great deal of complexity present, and few people have either the interest or the capacity or the time to delve deeply into that complexity and emerge on the other side with useful simplifications.
Cooperation is foundational to the survival of complexity, all levels, all domains, demonstrably, and even at its simplest, that is complex. And for cooperation to survive, there must emerge evolving ecosystems of cheat detection and mitigation systems. Right now, it is arguable that cheating systems dominate most of the political, economic, educational and religious institutions on the planet. Some are clearly and obviously cheating at relatively low levels, others are cheating at much more abstract levels, and if in doubt, if it is not supporting cooperation in diversity, then it is cheating!
Samantha mentions games theory, and most of games theory is predicated on closed systems, and zero sum games. We are actually in an open system, and we are exploring boundary conditions far faster than any single human can possibly comprehend.
If we are to survive this, then the vast majority of people need to be able to appreciate that any level of competition that is not firmly based in cooperation is equivalent to cancer in our bodies - it may seem to be going very well for the cancer cells (competing agents), right up to the point that everything dies. Our monetary systems are no longer fit for purpose, and are now actually generating existential level risk in the secondary, tertiary, and higher order incentive structures that they promote. Fundamental reform is urgently required.
So I deeply get the "spiritual" need for acceptance and cooperation; and it is actually deeply more complex than the idea of "purpose" typically embodies.
If we are to survive as a species, then we must be able to accept the need to cooperate in diversity; the alternative strategy of all out competition has such a low survival probability that it is, to all intents and purposes, zero. The incentives of the military industrial complex are a direct threat to all life on the planet, but they are not alone; the risks from big Pharma, or from big Oil, or big Finance, are almost as great.
We have to stop using systems that only value scarcity, and start assigning real value to the abundances that we actually need. And it is deeply more complex than that, and that is a very good place to start.
54:46 Tadzio Mueller: "when factoring in climate change, the arc of history is short and bends towards fascism" ... Rather than long and bending towards justice.
Thank you
Thank you Nate! We always have a "root canal on our calendar", don't we? Sucking our emotional energy....
Розумна жінка..
Нажаль, мало хто зумів зрозуміти хід її думок, судячи з коментарів.
Хід її думок, як мультиплікатор. Щоб розуміти таких, як Нора та Саманта, необхідно мати хочаб одну частину їх досвіду. Це справді було непросто.
Початок розмови, був дуже обнадійливим і я навіть подумав, що це саме те про що я колись просив, тебе, Нейт. Особливо коли ти намагався, спрямувати розмову, згадавши про Ґріра.
Але все закрутилось в іншому напрямку...
Недарма українська народна приказка каже: "Чоловік голова, а жінка - шия"
:)
There's no reason to remain subscribed to this.
What the correct turn?🤔
Thanks, good coversation. I have a book on Native Califronians; the author mentions a museum display with a sign, 'Resoures were abundant.' The book (and I concur) goes on to say, if resources were abundant, the population would grow, and soon resources would not be abundant. I mean let's face reality. The book goes on to document the declining size and quantity of abalone and other shells in the middens. Sound familiar? Ecological intelligence is possible, but only because Homo sapiens can conceive of ecological reality.
On being more intentionally relational: "simply asking someone how they are" isn't going to do it because we've become socially programmed to answer that automatically and mostly dishonestly. I suggest, if it feels true, to instead make a statement about what it's like to be with that person, such as: how nice to see you, or it feels good to be with you.
Or check an assumption you are noticing in them: you seem sad/ happy today.
Nate hit the nail on the head with his suggestion that we were never big enough to have an impact on the biosphere before. Aside from deep history/hunter-gatherer times maybe (who knows), we were never all that "aligned with the biosphere". And that shouldn't be all that surprising because as one of many species we also merely evolved to increase our fitness. Other animals aren't aligned with the biosphere either, they eat the biosphere or get eaten, in that respect we are not all that different.
The issues is not that we failed, or that we are a plague/virus, or that we are corrupted/morally compromised or any of that moralistic nonsense... the issue is that we were to succesful. Usually when a species gets that succesful, that creates new evolutionary niches that get filled in by other species that can prey on that species and knock it down a peg. We however kinda broke the evolutionary game by evolving cultural evolution. Where other animals are stuck randomly evolving adaptations by gene mutations over many many generations, we can just intentionally pass down information from one person to the next. We are playing the game on a whole other level, in this respect we definitely are different.
Ideologies/mythologies/religions get created around certain ways of life, and those are enabled by how we get the necessary energy for our survival. Maybe this is a bit to simplistic, but ideas are usually not the cause, but rather a consequence of what ways of live were possible at any given time in history. This focus on ideas as the cause, and therefor also as the solution for our current predicament is misguided. Indigenous ideas aren't going to save us because they were developed for a world that doesn't exist anymore... We are not going to change the world by changing our ideas first, we are rather going to change our ideas when the world changes, when we have to....
This is the issue I have with where this is going. The analysis is fine, but it's not going to work as a societal solution... that allways has been the problem with these counter-cultural left/green movements, it's fine as a lifestyle to combat feelings of alienation/disconnection, but it won't solve our problems at a societal level.
You think? I have a hard time imaging anything less applicable to hard times than whatever this lady is babbling about. I'm not even sure it qualifies as analysis. This sort of desultory jibber jabber is fine and dandy when times are flush, but not so much when they're lean. Quite obviously. I suppose all's I can say is if and when things get really rough, which presumably is what we're all worried about and dreading.... people like this will just be swept away. And that will be the end of that. So there's some sort of bitter irony on a UA-cam channel dedicated to raising the alarm - about the impending metacrisis!!! That someone so ineffectual and effete, so totally, so exquisitely, a veritable poster child of the 'carbon pulse', would be someone we would ever turn for anything at all in times like these. These are the kind of people you run from. Nevertheless that was a thoroughly enjoyable listen, I suppose for morbid reasons....
Yep. We’re a victim of our own success. Every once in a while a creature becomes so dominate that all others have to be at its “mercy”. That’s the situation in our present predicament. Except in our case we have broad agency. We can act in ways that now involve choice to not only to survive but to assist the Living Planet in a responsible manner. Let’s do that work now with joy and vigor.
At a societal level we need to consume way less and start thinking about how to lower population and energy consumption. But the forces of capitalism are mighty and I don’t know what will stop them voluntarily.
@@dermotmeuchner2416 You said it. Probably nothing.
Unfortunately there are some seriously grim possibilities when it comes to massive and sudden population reduction that it would be unseemly to discuss in mixed ocmpany. You can see them on display in the war in Gaza.....
@@Joeyjojoshabbadoo I guess I was thinking more generally about 'counter-culture left' this guest is an example of, maybe not what she is saying here specifically. Put it this way, even if we would solve all of our material problems, a lot of people probably still would feel aliened/disconnected in this world because we evolved to live in small close tribes wandering in nature all the time. What you often see advanced as a solution in these counter-culture left circles is returning to the land, to community, to a simpler way of life closer to nature. I think that can maybe work as an individual solution, for some to combat these feelings of disconnect, but I don't think it can solve our 'material' problems in a world of 8 billion people.
I agree BTW that you only get to focus on these kind of problems in a world affluent enough to not have to care about more basic things, and that there is something deeply ironic about all these people railing against the system that gave them the opportunity to spend time and energy on these issues in the first place.
I love her reference to Ken Wilber, he states we live in flatland. Essentially our projection is away from being human. Just sit and look at what we have created, the systems are insane and counterproductive to the biosphere we are destroying. It’s all linked, that is why Steve Keen’s study on economic history is so pertinent. Imagine the world if we followed the physiocrats ideology, we could possibly living in such a different way where the source of wealth is the pure amazement of the Mother Earth rather than a dopamine hit of the artificial profit related system we have created.
I totally agree. I love your linking to the origins of the discourse of economics!
I can't get to the center of what she's saying. It's a bit non-sensicle to me. I think it would help if she was clear and to the point.
Yes. Had to turn this off at "mysticism is .... "
Didn't understand a word she said... Like Nate said, men are from Mars, and women are from Venus
Congrats on being just as close-minded as the worst climate deniers out there. Respectfully, I would ask you to shut your mouth and open your third eye and take some DMT, LSD and THC @@stevealdrich2472
@@clarkdavis5333no, you just never had a psychedelic experience and your mind is closed and your eyes are shut
This lady is obviously a grifter. Or a charlatan or whatever you want to call it. Peddling spiritual heroin for liberal women, and that's how she pays the bills. I guess ladies like this and Nate run in the same circles, which is not terribly encouraging. And so why not have her on, it couldn't hurt. But her gibberish is probably not going to connect too well with the more typical citizen who's worried about, you know, societal collapse. But there's only so many Simon Micheauxs to go around I suppose....
At the end felt this conversation wouldhave been better as a round table discussion, theme "Life at the Center" with guests Samantha Sweetwater, Vandana Shiva and Nora Bateson, as it was I’m afraid it did nothing for me, or know where spirituality fits in with the biophysical, poly and metacrisis facing us as a solution🤔
Indeed. I'm not sure what ladies like this are gonna do when the crunch finally comes, and the ride is finally over. But I ain't sharing my food with her.....
We HAD original instruction in Europe. We lost it when we e got colonised by the Holy Roman Empire.
Nate, as some of your conversations have highlighted the need for a new religion, a prime candidate would be the Eco-Theology of Michael Dowd. Sadly, Michael is no longer with us. But he had already created a huge media legacy which brought together many people from varying backgrounds around the world who share his vision.
Did you just suggest a new religion? And you're serious.
I like to think this raising of the alarm is a desperately necessary thing, and a good thing of course. We have the techno prowess now with the internet to spread the word at lightning speed, and hopefully people can become galvanized! While religion, who's only enduring legacy would be it's peculiar ability to herd people into large groups, where they get lost in the overwhelming presence of the crowd, and use dogma to steadily eat away at the reliable perception of their eyes and ears, exploiting their fears, uncertainties and innate vulnerability, quietly demanding submission, eventually getting the congregation to the point where they manage to seriously consider that 2+2 very well might = 5. And finally, if everything's clicking, its adherents will have replaced their own natural vigor and courage of mind and spirit, with some form of either soulless piety, or alarmingly ecstatic worship. And again, submission. And you're suggesting we start a new religion. Yeah, I pretty much figure we need to go in the polar opposite direction of more religion. Which is most definitely one of the defining factors that got us here in the first place. This could be our chance to finally break free from it! That's one of the exciting parts of this inevitable calamity....
As a Dowdian, I concur.
I prefer the science-focussed discussions that enable me to triangulate and check assertions to enable me to decide whether I trust the person making the assertions or not. This discussion was a bit too Deepak Chopra for me....a bit too lacking in concrete ideas and references..
The human body is one part of the body mind spirit complex.
Please have Lierre Keith as a guest.
I'm always suspect of someone who overuses the word texture. But in the end, it was a good listen. Than you.
There's a great poem called "Life Chant" by Diane di Prima. Fits in with this conversation.
8 billion self-organizing systems (people ) wake up each day, breathe (our contribution to the planet) and strive to do no harm while managing our waste.
Ok, i gave it 13min. Pure rubbish. Just enough buzz words to get the crystal crowd all wet in their panities. Not helpful Nate.
When the whale was about to become exterminated oil came out of the ground to save them. Now our love of the whale will save us from oil. And we won't know it until later.
Evolution is a story of the sequence of 'Adjacent Possibilities', at all levels; societal, individual mental, individual and species genetic, inter-cellular, intracellular, biological and biochemical. atomic and subatomic, with each on its own timeframe.
Anyone here ever read the Canopus in Argos series by Doris Lessing?
I started it but was too scared to rread on...
@@jonathanrider4417 what scared you?
Nate...loved that conversation....Thank you to you both.
😊
Mysticism...= Being objective with your subjectivity
Good use of the Right Brain when observing that all nations and tribes have a sort of ancient "Ten Commandments" relating to their place in Nature (which the actual Ten Commandments do not deal with - but Genesis does, and so do many other sections of the Bible). And that these rules arose when humans first started to observe that it was all too easy to exhaust the natural resources available to them - this happened at different epochs for different regions of the Earth, but nearly all these "Codes to Live By" were constructed long before Year One AD (CE). But both participants then revert to Left Brain "Power of Positive Thinking" mode - I suppose it is hard not to, for all of us. I think Dr McGilchrist does underline that essentially, the Right Brain is gloomy and "negative" and the Left Brain is optimistic to a delusional degree - simply because it cannot look at the Bigger Picture by itself, and often refuses to obey any attempt by the Right Brain to assist it in looking at the Bigger Picture. "We can go to the Moon!!!!" "To do what, pray?" "Buzz off, Right Brain, with your negativity ....... ". Etc.
There is no left v. right connection with gender, nor with studying the Arts more than the Sciences. Nor with playing house instead of dismantling machines or dissecting caterpillars. Indeed the Sciences (especially Maths and Physics, but all the Sciences) are very obedient to the right brain provided they have not become stifled by Mammon, Moloch, Baal, and other pagan deities into using only the left brain. The same is true of Nathan the Prophet, all the Old Testament Prophets, Jesus, St Paul, all the Apostles - in short, all the foundational texts and messengers of Judaism and Christianity. The Bible is an endless litany of right-brain prophets of doom warning Kings and Nations and Emperors and Scribes and Pharisees to try and look at the Bigger Picture, or Doom will ensue. Sometimes a King or two pays heed - but mostly, no-one does. So Doom duly ensues. The OT record tallies precisely with the rise and fall of giant civilizations in the Middle and Near East, and less gigantic ones too, squabbling in the shadow of the giants.
It is nonsense to suppose that only non-Abrahamic spirituality favours the right brain - instead, ancient history is littered with examples of non-Abrahamic religions that were misused by the left brain and the misuse caused civilizational collapse. Including Greek, Roman, Mayan, African, Norse, and Asian gods. Not to mention Easter Island's ugly gods. Although monotheism is less full of OVERT human sacrifice, Judaism and Christianity (and Islam) have also been misused from the very start - the Old Testament records serial Israelite misuses from Genesis onwards; and the misuse of Christianity started almost as soon as it swept to power in around 300 A.D., but the record is not neatly available as in the OT. Still, a lot of Christian priests now, in 2024, believe that things started to go wrong almost immediately after the death of Christ and his first Apostles. Which is kind of par for the course when it comes to human conduct down the ages and around the world.
The original biblical guidance of how to live sustainably is still there, throughout the Bible - but the Churches ignore most of it, not surprisingly, or there would be no donations would there? Now the Churches are chasing the Pink Pound, piling folly upon folly. We all know where it will end, if we study the rise and fall of civilizations (including "indigenous" ones - hallo, we were all "indigenous" once). Just get ready for the inevitable, and stop trying to avert it. Future generations of humans may or may not survive - but there is little we can do to ensure their survival now. We must just watch and pray. And talk of course - which is why this channel and many others are important, despite not being any practical USE. Since when did words have to be of practical USE? That is a typical left brain fantasy. A fork or a spade or a computer have to be useful. Words do not - but they are the province of the left brain, and the left brain imagines that words do need to be of some practical use, with measurable results. It is only in poetry and songs and occasionally drama and other forms of fiction, that the left brain will let go of its fixation that words have to be useful. Religious texts count as poetry. They are clearly not fiction, though many allege they are. The Holy Koran is actually presented as Poetry by a Poet - which it is. However, it has rarely been used properly since it was composed - what a surprise ..... not.
Hi Nate. Sorry to piggyback this video’s comment section but have you heard of Roger Hallam? A UK activist. I’d love to hear a discussion between you two
this conversation was way over my head... I understood almost nothing that was said here
What a load of crap. For the first time watching The Great Simplification videos I have been unable to get to the end of a discussion. Hopeless attempts to glorify mysticism and subjectivity to a plain where is sits alongside science. No, sorry, not for me.
I don't deny, or reject the existence of a spiritual / mystical domain, but any attempt to 'braid' it with science and subjectivity is a fools errand.
I was familiar ..with ...some of her concepts and orientations....wow..
I think we need to stop looking at physical or mental differences, and start looking for similarities and strengths.
Nathan means "the giver" in hebraic, Hagen in Dutch / Nordic means "Garden". Not that bad!
God dam! That was good.
You know when they say the next Buddha will be a community? I think I see it forming…
You use wide boundaries, but you are still limited by boundaries. Are those boundaries subjective, limitations caused by perception?
I like the direction but i wish it wasn’t contaminated with pop psychology and intersectional feminism. Some of these ideas are not wisdom. However, i will try to separate the wheat from the chaff.
She can’t even say woman. She says the inclusive leftist thing instead of. Oh man.
I really enjoy Nate saying he doesn’t understand what she says when she injects strange gnostic metaphysics. He is responding to her charisma, most likely. Not the profundity of her word combination.
Define “Proposive” lol
I think the solution is to re-orient to infinite time horizons. Once you do that, everything else must be repaired. If the analysis includes biophysics.
Welcoming children at birth is a very good and concrete idea.
Humans must become the worshipers and stewards of life on Earth..We won't do that on our own, because that consciousness is light years away, we are indoctrinated, have unrealistic expectations, and our priorities are literally insane, but we will be forced into that position because of the consequences of our behavior, because of necessity..Such a monumental change will be a rebirth, a reordering of everything we do, think, and what motivates us..Rebirths are painful, and becoming the worshipers and stewards of life on Earth can only be the calm after the storm..And I think humanity has had this rebirth many times before, on small scales, but we really do have the long term memories of gold fish, both in our everyday lives and in our history..No goldfish were harmed in the production of this comment. We know why almost all of our civilizations and empires have failed but we repeat the same obvious mistakes anyway..Either we will mature as a species after our next world war/economic/ecological disaster or we will kill ourselves off, and take most complex life with us..
Must but won't. I possibly will mature after I take away as much of creations freedom and beauty as I can but why would expect anyone else to care?
I couldn't make it through this one Nate. Major eye-roll... This woman is a charlatan. I get it, we all want to feel good and hang out with half naked hippies in tropical retreat centers. As with so many others, follow the money. Profiteering from helping corporate executives feel good about themselves does not equal wisdom. Not sure how this helps us. I love your show, don't lose your focus. Beware the sexy gurus...
I called her a charlatan too and my comment was immediately deleted. There are many charlatans working this sector of the economy, but In this case it's just so glaring. Still, it was fascinating listening to this lady talk for ninety minutes. What with all the buzzwords and the jargon on full display. She even giggles every so often, like the true manufactured, post-flower child, well-credentialed late-capitalism eco-doom hustler she appears to be. I honestly wonder where these people come from, and how their lives even evolved to this point. This is not what one grows up aspiring to become. But, you know, everyone's gotta eat....
This speaks to failed, flawed privilege, in that "private law" is the DNA of each unique living entity. By failing to recognize that "privilege" in every "other" we disconnect from "continuity".
I’m not an evolutionary biologist but I would assume humans wiped out all the megafauna of the new areas they migrated to out of Africa and didn’t co evolve with because we were essentially taking the place in the ecology of the megafauna, kind of like this ecology ain’t big enough for the two of us type thing, we couldn’t co exist in harmony with the megafauna so one had to go and we wiped them out so a new sort of homeostasis of the ecology could take place
Pause after "the end".
80% Of this channels followers being men is no real show of bias for this channel specifically as much as it seems to be a preference for men to be regular youtube viewers so your audience pool potential starts out heavily skewed towards the male audience. Samantha's reply however also applies to a seeming male preference for longer form videos.
Fewer human beings = good for biosphere
You first.
Depends on how people behave as to how many. For instance, the planet needs less more frequent flyers and more tree planters.
@@madraven07 Clever. But we all likelier than not get to go together. Plus I know I am going to die. How about you? Are you special such as being able to violate the laws of nature and get rewarded? I think that was what bumblebee was about.
I'm not into this word salad nonsense. This show does the best when scientists are on.
Nathaniel is a powerful name.
Gary Inmendham would vehemently object to the perspectives of this guest.
Why do YOU think that?
@@garrenosborne9623Based on my understanding of anti-natalism, and his taking it to the next level, namely ethilism.
Samantha - i started at the beginning and tried to listen to this podcast again. I took notes and kept a record of your phrases. No flow, too verbose. I challenge you to represent women and ask to debate with someone like Robert Sopolsky. He would be very polite if he even accepted your request.
The world is so beautiful and sacred, I remember watching a video of an elephant that was eaten alive for 3 days. That happens to billions snd trillions of sentient beings every single hour. Spiritual and mother Gaia. Give me a break. All that you are trying to save isn’t worth saving and will eventually be destroyed by a solar event, a meteor, a dying star and so on.
Thanks, Nate. For sure, one of your better looking guests. Sweet. Unfortunately, I could not resonate with Samantha. If I may throw some light on the question of what are humans for? Humans are biological organisms harbouring a soul. The soul grounds to earth and connects the human to the ever-growing ALLgorithm in space. It is our single purpose to align with our soul and make it master of our mind. If that occurred, all will be fine. Listen to your heart, Nate and you become spiritual automatic.
80% male - climate change is a thermodynamics conjecture - ie abstract/ 'objective'. Whereas 'but I like my car' is feelings. You can see who is winning.