What's the point of buying a reprint P9 if they're illegal in basically every format sans only restricted in Vintage? Even if the reprinting puts them into Standard/Modern era there's no way the Moxes, Lotus, or time vault are even considered to be unbanned. Given the power creep, maybe not even Time walk or Recall. I mean, I'd buy a set of Official P9's around the same price as I can buy a real nice proxy set from a 3rd party. They'd only be show for the art side. I'd drop $200 easy for a set of dual lands. For reference, in 1993/1994 REVISED, you got about 2-3 dual lands per $99.99 booster box, so yeah.. a full set for $200 or even $300 would be on-par. If I was buying them for a deck? I'd maybe grab one full set and just pick up singles of the others (maybe, because some will be pricey as singles and that's a risk as well)
@@ralphthegnome its not gonna be some outrageous price. its gonna be like 179.99 for foil set. or some shit like that. but if it "sells out" ; where the problems start LOL
Nope, people would be stupid to buy expensive proxies. People who do will be the outlier bootlickers who insist they’re “real” because Wizards printed them.
And yet... They are real. Because wizards made them. Lol. Who even cares about the card back when 1) we don't play in tournaments and 2) we use sleeves?
If you’re playing “non-tournament legal” $20 cards from WotC, you’re going to have to allow 29¢ “non-tournament legal” proxies. It’s a huge risk increasing people’s exposure and acceptance to those. It’s playing with a loaded gun
I have no issue with this. Maybe not in Major tournaments, but casual events like some FNMS? Have a Proxy limit for those. I find the game might be more Skill based then.
@@MrThetruthhurts I’m not saying it’s a problem for us, but pushing people where it’s more normalized can’t be good for business. I’m just saying they’re not too bright.
@@chim007azo We have a saying in my play group when a proxy is played and someone doesn’t own the card because we likely sold it over the last 12 months. Wizards done f’ed up.
Potential to hurt reserved list value is too great. If people want proxies: make proxies! It's cheap and easy to do, and you don't feed hasbro's greed. Boycott any official proxies! 😁
For real. The whole point of proxies is getting a card you cannot afford because the manufacturer created conditions to make it unaffordable. Giving said manufacturer money in the process of getting your proxy is moronic at many levels...
At this point, I've boycotted official proxies, MOM: Aftermath, Commander Masters 2023, and about 3 months worth of drafting. Im happy to spend my money on Sorcery: Contested Realms and Hasbro seems happy to push me into their game.
I got poxies of all ten duals for $30. $100 is way to much for ten proxies. And if reserve list goes rule zero it will just be a hassle to play at game stores. Even when there are no prizes or entry fee, nobody i know wants proxies in their games
I would, because there are lots of heavily invested rich people out there willing to take a legal action against Wizards/Hasbro and beat the shit ton of money out of them if they reprint RL.
@@nukewhales7015 I expect it to happen eventually, but this is also why I expect it to be a last resort. They're going to try every other gimmick they can think of before they ditch the reserve list.
@@nukewhales7015 I believe you are overestimating the threat of legal action when WotC already has a precedent of changing the RL several times to no real outcry.
Hard pass mox the dual lands are dual lands there should be no ten dollar ones I see how it could be cool. But the one time my collection hit a good number in value the same week it lost 15%. It’s a shame but some of the prices are already as low as ever so tell them to buy that. Proxies are one thing but reprinting the reserved list is stepping on sacred ground. Did you see the grave born token from commander masters?? Soooo cool 😎
When everything is special, nothing is special. If you want the OG cards, "work 3 jobs and save for it".... I think I heard someone say :) Don't reprint the Reserve List cards IMO
How about they, oh I dunno, make new cool stuff? Like work at it and take time. Management needs to stop treating new cards as cheap peanut butter and spreading it thin to not at all
Those days are long gone, sadly. Now people don't even make their own decks. 90% of the time you're facing some min max deck found online these days. Lol
😮 can you buy the reserve list cards on mtg arena. I've never played on-line.... so I just don't know ... if they only put them online would that take away from the real cards??? 🤔😕😮 I don't think they should reprint them
Reprints of dual lands, different art or not, would tank dual lands unless they control for the price and rarity. (Like they did with 30th) If you release a secret lair of 10 dual lands for $100 dollars then revised dual lands become worth $100 for a set of 10. So they would have to limit the number of secret lairs to like 5000, so that they don’t tank dual lands. Dual land value comes entirely from player demand. Reprint duals of any kind, without very limited availability/pricing will tank the value.
Why should I pay WotC prices for fake cards? Makes 0 sense. Print modern day versions of reserve list, new art, new boarders, the whole deal. Hell, make it it’s own set, booster boxes and all, Magic the Gathering: Reserved. But NOT proxies. The Reserved List is a company policy and they do NOT have to maintain it. It’ll be a big PR hit, but not the worst one they’ve had even during the last year.
This kind of greed is going to continue to alienate the collectors. I get that they want to casually intro old cards into the marketplace, but it's done more to disenfranchise than it has awakened curiosity. I don't know if the player base, as its already grown wary and wallet-fatigued from Hasbro's antics, is going to want to stomach this. As you say, it really depends on what price point they set.
Perfectly said. It definitely feels like the amount of confidence they're willing to sacrifice with each decision, far outweighs any immediate financial gain. Also, it isn't replaced by anything so there's never any compromise. It feels like they're deliberately dumping the game. Basically what BOA said.
Let's be clear, they know what dual lands cost and have a solid understanding of the cash flood they'd unleash if they reprinted even just the EDH-relevant RL cards. 30th PBS taught them a lot about what players will and will not accept and they will eventually go whole hog, the RL is the only untapped vein in their gold mine and Hasbro told them to play a Strip Mine.
Honestly, I think wizards has given up on the secondary market. They are going for play and play only it seems like. And they just don’t care what happens post sale as long as people play the game.
If they did this properly the amount of secret lair sales would be huge, if they slowly inserted them as the mystery card and made it hard like sliver hive extended art ….. but I don’t see anything good coming from them the track record is not well with wizards.
I'm convinced the reserve list means nothing; in a good way. There is an abundance of non reserve list cards that are holding incredible price points simply for being original foils. Don't believe me, just look at anything from Urza's Legacy and up. Anything before that which is Reserve list will hold their value. Think about it. These cards, at some point, will be antiques.
Proxies are like downloading roms they're technically both illegal, but nobody cares if you download/print that rom/card. Heck, they're both comparable in the sense that both let you experience something from the past. You were probably weren't aware or even born to try out.
Theres really not a point in reprinting the cards as non tournament legal. 30th anniversary wouldve been a fun draft experience at 3-4 dollars a pack. Being able to build vintage decks and play them with friends and make/revisit memories with it would have been great, but why would I spend 40+ for (lets say) the 10 dual lands that im still gonna have to tell people they're proxies and i still cant take them into a wotc sanctioned tournaments? Especially when i could spend that 40+ and get 50 - 100 copies proxied out with whatever art and back i want. Also before anyone starts saying lawsuits im highly surprised they havent already been caught up in gambling lawsuits since they clearly do look at the secondary market plus the one of one ring fiasco.
They should have made tournament legal playtest cards that looked like the original playtest cards of the early 90s(which as we know are sought after already), even using the old imagery made from photocopiers (I'll never forget the mons goblin raider that had a dude's face smashed into the copier as it's artwork, the Calvin and hobbs art, etc). I very much loved when they brought back the retro frames for a moment.
Poison all Poison Blake Rasmussen said Commander Masters is not a premium product. No one will be able to afford any of their products. The only price point is zero. Leave the Reserve List alone period. The only thing they learned is that people would have bought it at $250 and eventually $500 and finally a $1000
Fredo, you just broke my heart... Here is the problem. This article, this video you just made is ALL DESENSITIZATION They will let you Groom us to allow them to stick it in again!!! NEVER FORGET! Never forget MAGIC 30😢
It's going to be 2-3 years until they actually pull the trigger on a functional reserve list reprint, they've got the art from modo which is usable for the playables but the greed will keep the price up for a long time yet. Until they print a legal version at a realistic price point they aren't worth buying.
If WotC reprints reserve list cards, then I will have no reservations about going to third party proxy card makers and just buying those cards there for far less. If WotC opens this door any wider then they did with 30th Anniversary, I think they are going to actually destroy the product they have spent 30 years building. What is the point of making "official" proxies?
Kinda surprised they didn’t do a limited edition proxy vintage cube product for $2000+. Kinda think they should just leave the resevered list alone and design more and better cards as that would be the way to have the game continue long term.
Honestly I love secret Lairs and was buying most all of them but haven't bought the last few bundles. First I think ever secret lair needs minimum 5 cards+ the secret one and it has to have some value to it. But yes I would love non tournament legal secret lair reserve list cards.
Your printer can spit those proxies out for pennies. If you do accept the official proxies and not other proxies doesn't it just make those official proxies legal. You saw that even with the limited print of 30th the reserve list took a hit. The more they do print official proxies, the lower the value of those original cards will go.
Nah, don't give newbs the chance at this😳.... In all seriousness I agree Moxman. Including everyone in the celebration of MTG (old or new players) is a good move for the game. And yes, do not use the original art and do not price players out. Hahaha, I like my nachos made for me and delivered to me😂
I’m torn. “ official proxies” will most likely negatively impact reserved list prices, which is frustrating for those who’ve collected and invested in the game based on the premise of “ the reserved list”. That said, my favorite format is legacy, and I feel like that format would have a much wider audience were it more affordable. I think a greater overall acceptance of proxies is a good thing, and if done right, investment pieces could live alongside their “ casual only” counterparts.
Lol they can print whatever they want 🤷♂️. I’ll still be buying Alpha and Arabian Nights because they are actually Magic cards, organically scarce, and precious to me 👍
Totally. I don't care if they reprinted Guardian Beast. If it used the same art, I'd be a bit irked, but still an Arabian Nights card is an Arabian Nights card. Pulling out an OG set of Urza lands is still something, even if they're reprinted them all over and over.
You're telling me that if they reprinted Alpha and Arabian Nights with a tiny planeswalker symbol to differentiate, you'd be a buyer? You'd be insane. Everything that shitty little planeswalker symbol has touched has nuked the value.
@@b2x10wt8 Bazaar of Baghdad dropping from ~2600-2700 down to ~1800-1900 still puts it about 500 above the start of the spike and right about where the value should be + or -. That's what's so bad about the recent market hike. In reality, Bazaar of Baghdad should be sitting around 800-1200 given a standard rate of increase from history.. but you pop on TCGPlayer and see Damaged ones listed at 1700, all because of some record sales (likely high graded versions) sold off in early 2021. It's like saying the alpha lotus is worth 500k because of the Post Malone auction purchases. It's not. That sale skewed the pricing history, and they're nowhere near that. There's no reason a graded lotus sold for 25k or less 7 years ago and now the low end is showing ~150k with a 500k market value. There's no reason that they went from sub 10k to nearly 30k in 3 years either. Abu Jafar Market being ~80. LP version ~25. Reprint version, NM, 0.10- 0.50. Not one naysayer has held any real evidence about reprints killing OG prices. The 2020 bubble collapsing and overvaluing FOMO of new cards is causing this effect. These OG cards are just as solid as ever. Remove the bubble and don't over pay into an "investment" that isn't a real investment. These aren't solid investments. The prices come and go depending on who wants something. Auctioneers will say it time and time again. A rough estimate value of an item may be one thing, but you put 2 people in a room who want it and the sky's the limit. No magic card is worth any more than a person is willing to pay for it. Invest in real investments. Buy pieces of cardboard that you like because you like the cardboard and/or want to use it to play.
Unfortunately, they killed my goodwill with the Magic 30 debacle. I absolutely would love a vintage cube to play with, but I'm not dropping $100 for dual lands, when I can drop about $150 to proxy the entire cube.
More mistakes? I'm surprised they are even considering making a mistake like this. Hasbro's PR team should make an immediate statement confirming the Reserved List promise before the last of their collectors leave in droves. This is great news for new games like MetaZoo, Sorcery, and FaB. The more market share those games can capture from disenfranchised collectors, the better.
this is bad but everyone already knew it was only a matter of time. i think mtg is better as a game with the types of restrictions that make design space interesting because these and the power 9 are the simplest most powerful cards but the fun has been in finding convoluted ways of replicating those powerful effects. beyond that, it's sad to see hasbro leaning so heavily on wotc to piss out more profit because clearly their shareholders don't care about reserved lists and wotc is sadly going to have to do all the things they said they'd never do so hasbro can keep pretending it still makes toys people want.
30th hurt the protection shield of Reserved List, no matter at what price they were offered. WOTC will not go this route again. The WOTC video mentioned Counterspell and not RL cards. Playables in all formats such as Bolt, Giant Growth, Counterspell , Dark Ritual etc. are targets for play test cards.
I think they actually think they have realised they cannot re-print the reserve list because they need it to keep its high price point. Reason being they need to be able to justify the high price of new products and players need to know there are expensive cards out there. If everything drops in price, then they simply cannot keep charging more.
If dual lands were printed in secret lairs. I would buy them. The idea of knowing what you're buying puts everything into perspective. I don't know if I'd spend $200CAD for them though.
@@pascalraskal9347 You're not wrong. I guess it would come down to whether they would be tournament legal or not. I wouldn't be able to justify that much for what would essentially be proxies printed by Wizards.
Time for me to take an MTG break for a few years. I haven't been buying anything MTG retail in the last few months, and this is a sign that it's time to step away for a few years. Hopefully MTG (WOTC and the Community!)will work itself out.
I don't like any reprints of RL cards in general. But what about if they would print entire Legacy decks with different artworks and cardbacks, including RL cards! I think this would be fun for lots of players to dive into the old days of Mtg IF they don't charge a fortune for those decks.
Tummies will def be disappointed. Wotc printed "playtest" underground sea as an example will still be out of "price-point" of the loudest complainers of rl
Oh I wish I had faith that they wouldn’t have overcharge. Thanks Mox! I was eagerly awaiting your take when I saw the Reddit post this afternoon. I would buy it for the right price, then I would scoop up the OGs when they crash. My thought is they should serialize any RL reprints when it finally happens. Maybe that wouldn’t totally mess up the RL value. I defer to your MTG finance expertise though. Boomstick.
I have no clue as to the sports card market, but have the companies like Topps attempted to reprint the Mickey Mantle rookie card? Isn't that the one that is worth huge money? Would sports collectors buy reproductions of the old Honus Wagner cigarette pack cards? And if so, for how much? Just wonderin'.
There is a way to get around the RL, this isn't it. The original RL allowed WOTC to make promos like the judge promos. We said the reprinting of the RL would be the beginning of the end for Wizards... well I see this ending.
I just want a sliver queen reprint tbh. I have every other sliver legend for my commander, and I hate that queen costs so much when she’s just alright. The First sliver is arguably better imo
Well now. I just use a printer. Then i can print 9 cards for 25 cents. So if wizards can do maybe 10 cents a card. Otherwise, i will just pass. I am AGAINST violating the reserve list. I remember selling a Time Elemental for $50. When 'ICY' was reprinted 'ICY' value dropped 90%. Any reprint will CRUSH the value of the card. PERIOD. Remember there were 1100+5000+15000 = 21100 of Each of the P9.
I’d buy a playset of secret lair dual lands if the price was right. If the price is ridiculous, I’m cool with people using proxies and sticking to my fetch and shocks
Why not just create a much stronger version of the power 9? Add 4 mana of any one color, draw 4 cards, take an extra turn after this one, untap 2 lands 😅
They basically said they'd probably do that over direct reprints, just to avoid legal fees from frivolous lawsuits claiming breach of contract (which the reserved list is not). This may be testing the waters. some. They basically reprinted Moat from Legends. Only instead of an enchantment, it's a creature. Exact same casting coast, exact same wording on the card. They've definitely been playing around with what impact new cards have on reserved list cards.
@@ralphthegnome IMO, with the macro market in collectibles still taking damage, they should be keeping their head down and rebuilding the equity they blew frivilously over the past couple of years on endless reprints and variants. Now is not the time to be screwing with people again. WOTC is becoming a menace to their own player base.
They should either just reprint the cards fully or not do proxies. I think that if they reprinted them, as you suggested, with different frames and art (maybe like Brother's War) but had them legal in Vintage, that would be just fine. I know people try to use this as an invenstment, but to be honest it is a game first and formost. If it has side value, neat. But if they continually chase the dragon looking fo money they think they are mission out on bsed upon secondary market, then they will fail. I predict another stock market hit for them in the next quarter. \
I think if they price them anything less than the price of the card theyll feel they didn’t steal enough. They priced those portal cards at market value - and they tanked. What’s imperial seal and imperial recruiter? This is a scam. Make wizards make more lotr. Not more commander legends. If they reprint the reserve list expect them to be serialized chase cards in $1000 collector booster box
10 dual lands for $100 invites a class action lawsuit from EVERY player who owns dual land. We're talking prices tanking, triple damages. This could sink both Hasbro AND WotC. Even considering it could cost the company billions of dollars (yes; billions with a b)
10 dual lands for any price invites this lawsuit... if they are printed with Magic card backs. If not, they may be safe from a lawsuit, but players and collectors will still leave the game in droves and cost the company millions in market share.
Regarding WOTC’s execution, nah! If I want a proxy then I’ll get a proxy which often has better art and the quality is better than WOTC’s cards. Regarding reprinting legal reserve list cards this is where my opinion converges with Mtgmoxman; I’m all for it as long as it is not a replica of the original as it pertains to artwork. That being said I do wish to add something to that and that is the idea of “distribution matching” as I call it……meaning that the products are released in a particular manner or more specifically quantity that does not negatively impact the overall value of the originals to a great degree. In my mind doing so will enable newer players to get some of the same experiences as the OG’s, limiting distribution puts paper in the bank for WOTC as well as keeping the collectors happy which in some cases happier as they will get both versions to display in a set! Go for an execution that’s a win for everyone not just Hasbro. Will it happen? I doubt it; historically execution is WOTC’s greatest weakness next to quality control as it pertains to the newer products.
I own reaerve list cards and proxies and I would never buy wizard “proxies” unless they were cheaper then real proxies. If it is printed by wizards but they don’t allow them to make them tournament legal I could see them open to a lawsuit. This worked for the gold bordered cards because the game is so new. Also I would argue what makes gold boarder cards not real besides a different boarder and back, because no other “legal” cards have a different boarder or back right?
Just watch they will create a tri-land that has no drawbacks to make the reserve list duel lands moot. With power creep the way it is now it’s just a matter of time before they print out something like this under a new tier of rarity.
You can make your own nachos and cheese but not your own proxies? Huh, I prefer both homemade 😀 Or the original from 20 to 30 years ago, including nachos from back then!
It's just so disappointing. Imagine if 30th had been a draft box of 24 packs for 200-300. It would have been the best selling Magic set of all time, they could have printed money for years with it.
They would of only been able to print so little of it that the price would have shot up to the same price it was and resellers would of made money instead of WotC.
@@patmacrotch5611 Yeah dude, that's called getting value for the thing you bought. When I buy something valuable, I don't want to give the value back to the person who sold it to me.. That's why they have my money. You see, it's an exchange. Let me know if this is making sense.
@@patmacrotch5611 Why would they only have been able to print a small amount? They can print as many as they want, or better yet, as many as WE want by printing to demand through Secret Lair or Pulse or something. And they are proxies, so (from Wizards' point of view) they don't use up any equity.
@@asaffin1 Because they cannot make it readily available because it WILL effect the price of real duals. They already do this when they reprint stuff not on reserve list. When they are thinking about reprinting duals and playable staples from the reserve list... they cannot tank the value of the current cards. (or else law suits) So they have two options, make the price of the product very high so that the value is inline with the value of the secondary market value. Or they can make the print run very small so they secondary market isn't effected. It's a balancing act of these two factors. This is why magic 30th was price the way it was and the print run it had. The lesson that WOTC will take from magic 30th is that the price point was too high. Therefore, if they try something like magic 30th again they are going to go the other way. They will greatly reduce the print run. If the community accepts the product then, its just going to be bought up then place on the secondary market at 2-3x the price. And everyone will just be crying about how magic 35 was the worst ever because they didn't print enough and blah blah.
MoxMan! I always said they should "reprint" cards so we can have game pieces. But not flawless replicas of the originals. They should have hot new art and modern layout.
I agree just do it and get it over with. I'd rather not have joke looking test cards though. Please just reprint them and change the art. Dual Lands will lose value btw... At least the ugly damaged copies that people sometimes buy for play will. Otherwise collectors versions worth having will probably skyrocket. The reason is because the proxy cards will promote the old cards and make them that much more exciting to new collectors.
Reserved list was created to not reprint those cards. Wizards already lied and made magic 30. Tournament legal or not they went against their own policy. Why not do it again and finish off what’s left of the original players
I still feel that reprints, reserved list or not, will find their value based on the number available of that specific print and the artwork. I can't see a reprint Mishra's meeting or beating the Antiquities version. Unless they bring some jaw-dropping art.. but yep That's exactly what I started saying when coming back to MTG. I think the current prices will take a hit, but I think they'll stay above the natural price point ignoring the 2020 jump. Juzam is my go to example. Useless card, awesome art and most of the value is in that art. They can't unprint existing reprints, but going forward? They have the chance to immortalize the originals and further fortify the value of the originals. Power 9 shouldn't be reprinted, really.. because they're banned. There's no REAL reason to reprint a banned card. Restricted? sure, Banned? Naw. I wouldn't even buy a reprinted Mox/Lotus if they're still banned. Heck, that can change the whole landscape of Prints/Reprints and their values. They can make a limited run to add value by low print count. They can have a later reprint with amazing art that makes the card more popular than the original (this is already seen in non-reserved reprints). I'm not afraid. I am only hesitant that they will mess it up somehow in a chase for more cash.
To a degree, yes print and artwork.. but then why the f*)k did they make "The List" and "Mystery Booster" as near-perfect counterfeits of rare printings and artworks? Pick a path!! Either reserve cards, or reserve art/treatment. If they're doing the latter, then STOP WITH THE LIST!!!
@@Syne111 Myself (if you track down my myriad of comments regarding reserved list) and Moxman's comment in the vid is specific to alteration of the reprinted version. The List is just a janky awkward bonus lotto and poorly implemented/regulated to boot. They need to draw a line. Not in the sand, a firm line. Original run prints use original artwork. Any reprints use a different artwork. That sets the score base value and identification of the card. Then you can play with all the dumb things like foil types, etching, serial numbers, etc to try to bolster value/collectability. Mystery boosters are/were one of the worst things, along with serialized event cards (I'm looking at you 2023 PA Shivan Dragon). It's one thing to have a fun prize, but do it "right" like the acorn card for the cosplay contest winners at GenCon.
@@ralphthegnome YES!! But not enough people are sending the message. It's difficult to cut through the noise of people whining for handouts, to get to good advice like this. In 93/94 they said black border meant original printing. They had the right idea 30 years ago. Now just update it for 2023! P.S. - Serialized cards are a joke. I actually don't mind the limited printings like the Praetors, but the mass-product junk with tramp stamp was pointless, and those will trend toward nothing.
@@Syne111 I think most serialized will fall off, mostly because they were dumb and not selective enough. Mox Amber? Yes plz Mishra's Bauble? Uhhh.. No? throwing a dart at the wall and slapping a number on the card it hit won't matter if that card had no value to begin with.
The whole reason that I buy RL cards is because they can not be reprinted, if WOTC reprint the RL I just think that I will sell off my collection slowly and just buy other Tcg's.
The 30 set was a mistake and destroyed confidence from long time collectors. They should have NEVER consider doing RL printings. I believe if they did the printings they would be inserted as chase cards and would be massively expensive when opened, completely making the reprinting no reason to have it happend in the first place. A really cheap reprint would tank too many cards as well. The Rl maybe the only thing saving the game from completely collapsing from Wotc constant bad decisions.
Expect an outrageously priced Power 9 and Duel Lands Secret Lairs.
What's the point of buying a reprint P9 if they're illegal in basically every format sans only restricted in Vintage? Even if the reprinting puts them into Standard/Modern era there's no way the Moxes, Lotus, or time vault are even considered to be unbanned. Given the power creep, maybe not even Time walk or Recall. I mean, I'd buy a set of Official P9's around the same price as I can buy a real nice proxy set from a 3rd party. They'd only be show for the art side.
I'd drop $200 easy for a set of dual lands. For reference, in 1993/1994 REVISED, you got about 2-3 dual lands per $99.99 booster box, so yeah.. a full set for $200 or even $300 would be on-par. If I was buying them for a deck? I'd maybe grab one full set and just pick up singles of the others (maybe, because some will be pricey as singles and that's a risk as well)
😒 you think $600 is "outrageous"?
I'm just joshing. It's complete 🐎 💩
@@ralphthegnome its not gonna be some outrageous price. its gonna be like 179.99 for foil set. or some shit like that. but if it "sells out" ; where the problems start LOL
😂 run it into the ground
Nope, people would be stupid to buy expensive proxies. People who do will be the outlier bootlickers who insist they’re “real” because Wizards printed them.
Boomstick!
Like that gold bordered garbage
And yet... They are real. Because wizards made them. Lol. Who even cares about the card back when 1) we don't play in tournaments and 2) we use sleeves?
@@MTGMOXMANthry still will.
Only way it works is if it's printed in the millions. Period!
All depends on how high the print run is! Period...
If you’re playing “non-tournament legal” $20 cards from WotC, you’re going to have to allow 29¢ “non-tournament legal” proxies. It’s a huge risk increasing people’s exposure and acceptance to those. It’s playing with a loaded gun
I have no issue with this. Maybe not in Major tournaments, but casual events like some FNMS? Have a Proxy limit for those. I find the game might be more Skill based then.
If you still have a problem with proxies in 2023 you like being bent over and abused by WotC.
@@MrThetruthhurts I’m not saying it’s a problem for us, but pushing people where it’s more normalized can’t be good for business. I’m just saying they’re not too bright.
@@chim007azo We have a saying in my play group when a proxy is played and someone doesn’t own the card because we likely sold it over the last 12 months. Wizards done f’ed up.
Potential to hurt reserved list value is too great. If people want proxies: make proxies! It's cheap and easy to do, and you don't feed hasbro's greed. Boycott any official proxies! 😁
We can't expect them not to push the envelope and charge as much as they possibly can, and they'll still probably add in some RNG...
For real. The whole point of proxies is getting a card you cannot afford because the manufacturer created conditions to make it unaffordable. Giving said manufacturer money in the process of getting your proxy is moronic at many levels...
At this point, I've boycotted official proxies, MOM: Aftermath, Commander Masters 2023, and about 3 months worth of drafting.
Im happy to spend my money on Sorcery: Contested Realms and Hasbro seems happy to push me into their game.
They cannot print cheap, widely available duals or reserve list reprints without destroying the value of reserve list cards. It’s not possible.
Moxman has lost it. Reserve list reprints would have me leave the game.
Good riddance to bad rubbish
Even if the reprinted RL cards have different artwork, the RL price will tank.
I got poxies of all ten duals for $30. $100 is way to much for ten proxies. And if reserve list goes rule zero it will just be a hassle to play at game stores. Even when there are no prizes or entry fee, nobody i know wants proxies in their games
I would not be surprised one bit if they tried to reprint the reserve list 😮
F#ck that
After what they tried with the OGL I'd say it's only a matter of time now.
I would, because there are lots of heavily invested rich people out there willing to take a legal action against Wizards/Hasbro and beat the shit ton of money out of them if they reprint RL.
@@nukewhales7015 I expect it to happen eventually, but this is also why I expect it to be a last resort. They're going to try every other gimmick they can think of before they ditch the reserve list.
@@nukewhales7015 I believe you are overestimating the threat of legal action when WotC already has a precedent of changing the RL several times to no real outcry.
Don’t be messing with our Soldevi Excavations and we won’t have a problem!!
I read the same article and didn’t think of that. Great insight! I love your channel and it’s firmly in my daily rotation. Thanks for everything
Awesome! Thank you! Boomstick
Hard pass mox the dual lands are dual lands there should be no ten dollar ones I see how it could be cool. But the one time my collection hit a good number in value the same week it lost 15%. It’s a shame but some of the prices are already as low as ever so tell them to buy that. Proxies are one thing but reprinting the reserved list is stepping on sacred ground.
Did you see the grave born token from commander masters?? Soooo cool 😎
But dual lands were 10$ when I was buying them lol
When everything is special, nothing is special. If you want the OG cards, "work 3 jobs and save for it".... I think I heard someone say :) Don't reprint the Reserve List cards IMO
For the real deal cards 100% for fake proxy cards? 2 full time jobs should be fine
How about they, oh I dunno, make new cool stuff? Like work at it and take time. Management needs to stop treating new cards as cheap peanut butter and spreading it thin to not at all
Some of the original joy of the game was not everybody having a whole set of cards And having to build something competitive at least for me
Those days are long gone, sadly. Now people don't even make their own decks. 90% of the time you're facing some min max deck found online these days. Lol
@@Frenchtoastedfruitloops Those days are not gone for me. Yes, I net deck a little.. but moreover I build for flavor.
Good to hear. I guess a few people still play for fun. I'll probably never play again if i run into another copy an pasted Son of Yawgmoth deck. 💀🤯
I'm not sure I understand how that would be tarnished by this per-se. Mayber I'm being dumb IDK heh.
More and more they make me want to buy Sorcery
For me it's fab but sorcerer is looking pretty good
Sorcery hired a lot of the OG mtg artists and the cards look🔥
@@MrArchivist1 that's why I'm so interested in the game still not 100% solid on the game play but I will have to do more research on it.
😮 can you buy the reserve list cards on mtg arena. I've never played on-line....
so I just don't know ... if they only put them online would that take away from the real cards??? 🤔😕😮 I don't think they should reprint them
FOLKS!.....
BOOOMSTICK!
Reprints of dual lands, different art or not, would tank dual lands unless they control for the price and rarity. (Like they did with 30th)
If you release a secret lair of 10 dual lands for $100 dollars then revised dual lands become worth $100 for a set of 10. So they would have to limit the number of secret lairs to like 5000, so that they don’t tank dual lands.
Dual land value comes entirely from player demand. Reprint duals of any kind, without very limited availability/pricing will tank the value.
Tank the value... good
@@daganisoraan Wrong.
They start reprinting reserved list cards I start putting all my cards in the paper shredder.
Why should I pay WotC prices for fake cards? Makes 0 sense.
Print modern day versions of reserve list, new art, new boarders, the whole deal. Hell, make it it’s own set, booster boxes and all, Magic the Gathering: Reserved. But NOT proxies.
The Reserved List is a company policy and they do NOT have to maintain it. It’ll be a big PR hit, but not the worst one they’ve had even during the last year.
Should do it now while CM PR fail is overshadowing everything.
This kind of greed is going to continue to alienate the collectors. I get that they want to casually intro old cards into the marketplace, but it's done more to disenfranchise than it has awakened curiosity. I don't know if the player base, as its already grown wary and wallet-fatigued from Hasbro's antics, is going to want to stomach this. As you say, it really depends on what price point they set.
Perfectly said. It definitely feels like the amount of confidence they're willing to sacrifice with each decision, far outweighs any immediate financial gain. Also, it isn't replaced by anything so there's never any compromise. It feels like they're deliberately dumping the game.
Basically what BOA said.
Let's be clear, they know what dual lands cost and have a solid understanding of the cash flood they'd unleash if they reprinted even just the EDH-relevant RL cards.
30th PBS taught them a lot about what players will and will not accept and they will eventually go whole hog, the RL is the only untapped vein in their gold mine and Hasbro told them to play a Strip Mine.
Honestly, I think wizards has given up on the secondary market. They are going for play and play only it seems like. And they just don’t care what happens post sale as long as people play the game.
Yeah, that's truly what they care about.. The game. lol
If they did this properly the amount of secret lair sales would be huge, if they slowly inserted them as the mystery card and made it hard like sliver hive extended art ….. but I don’t see anything good coming from them the track record is not well with wizards.
No, they will ruin this like they ruin everything. With greed.
I'm convinced the reserve list means nothing; in a good way.
There is an abundance of non reserve list cards that are holding incredible price points simply for being original foils.
Don't believe me, just look at anything from Urza's Legacy and up.
Anything before that which is Reserve list will hold their value. Think about it. These cards, at some point, will be antiques.
I would buy if the price was like regular secret lairs sure, but if they try to do like they did with 30th, let them burn them in a dump
No, just leave the RL alone. At this point, it will do more harm than good to mess with it.
For years I said they will do snow duals and secret lair r list cards. Prolly reprint the four horseman sets to.
Proxies are like downloading roms they're technically both illegal, but nobody cares if you download/print that rom/card. Heck, they're both comparable in the sense that both let you experience something from the past. You were probably weren't aware or even born to try out.
Theres really not a point in reprinting the cards as non tournament legal. 30th anniversary wouldve been a fun draft experience at 3-4 dollars a pack. Being able to build vintage decks and play them with friends and make/revisit memories with it would have been great, but why would I spend 40+ for (lets say) the 10 dual lands that im still gonna have to tell people they're proxies and i still cant take them into a wotc sanctioned tournaments? Especially when i could spend that 40+ and get 50 - 100 copies proxied out with whatever art and back i want. Also before anyone starts saying lawsuits im highly surprised they havent already been caught up in gambling lawsuits since they clearly do look at the secondary market plus the one of one ring fiasco.
Agree that the SEC should be investigating.
They should have made tournament legal playtest cards that looked like the original playtest cards of the early 90s(which as we know are sought after already), even using the old imagery made from photocopiers (I'll never forget the mons goblin raider that had a dude's face smashed into the copier as it's artwork, the Calvin and hobbs art, etc). I very much loved when they brought back the retro frames for a moment.
Why can't they just make new tri lands or new lands that do the same thing but are not the same card.
When they promised not to reprint the RL (several times, in writing), they also promised not to do this.
Fuck original dual lands. I just want Chains of Mephistopheles.
Poison all Poison
Blake Rasmussen said Commander Masters is not a premium product. No one will be able to afford any of their products. The only price point is zero. Leave the Reserve List alone period. The only thing they learned is that people would have bought it at $250 and eventually $500 and finally a $1000
"If you build it...they will flee" bet me reserve list dont drop another 30% just to start
I think your being generous I have it marked at 40-56% drop in 90% of reserve list cards depending I guess on how they did it
I KNEW I WAS RIGHT. As soon as I heard the news on Rudy's channel I said 3-5 years before the reserve list gets a reprint from Hasbro.
Fredo, you just broke my heart... Here is the problem. This article, this video you just made is ALL DESENSITIZATION They will let you Groom us to allow them to stick it in again!!!
NEVER FORGET! Never forget MAGIC 30😢
I feel like with a dual land SL that they'd at least try 400 or 500...greedy bastards 😆
It's going to be 2-3 years until they actually pull the trigger on a functional reserve list reprint, they've got the art from modo which is usable for the playables but the greed will keep the price up for a long time yet.
Until they print a legal version at a realistic price point they aren't worth buying.
If WotC reprints reserve list cards, then I will have no reservations about going to third party proxy card makers and just buying those cards there for far less. If WotC opens this door any wider then they did with 30th Anniversary, I think they are going to actually destroy the product they have spent 30 years building. What is the point of making "official" proxies?
Those OG duel land should have a reprint.
Screw the reserve list, who wants to play with fake cards? Just do a limited reprint to drop the prices down to levels that wont ruin a marriage lol
If they reprint cards the reserve list will fall atleast another 20 percent.
Kinda surprised they didn’t do a limited edition proxy vintage cube product for $2000+. Kinda think they should just leave the resevered list alone and design more and better cards as that would be the way to have the game continue long term.
What they don’t realize is that players who use proxies just print their own cards for the most part. Waste of their time honestly.
Honestly I love secret Lairs and was buying most all of them but haven't bought the last few bundles. First I think ever secret lair needs minimum 5 cards+ the secret one and it has to have some value to it. But yes I would love non tournament legal secret lair reserve list cards.
Your printer can spit those proxies out for pennies. If you do accept the official proxies and not other proxies doesn't it just make those official proxies legal. You saw that even with the limited print of 30th the reserve list took a hit. The more they do print official proxies, the lower the value of those original cards will go.
Just For Men is matching your natural color pretty well.
I wouldn't mind your idea. They can't make it overly pricey. But we all know how this will go. "Best laid plans of mice and men."
Nah, don't give newbs the chance at this😳....
In all seriousness I agree Moxman. Including everyone in the celebration of MTG (old or new players) is a good move for the game. And yes, do not use the original art and do not price players out.
Hahaha, I like my nachos made for me and delivered to me😂
I’m torn. “ official proxies” will most likely negatively impact reserved list prices, which is frustrating for those who’ve collected and invested in the game based on the premise of “ the reserved list”.
That said, my favorite format is legacy, and I feel like that format would have a much wider audience were it more affordable.
I think a greater overall acceptance of proxies is a good thing, and if done right, investment pieces could live alongside their “ casual only” counterparts.
Lol they can print whatever they want 🤷♂️. I’ll still be buying Alpha and Arabian Nights because they are actually Magic cards, organically scarce, and precious to me 👍
Totally. I don't care if they reprinted Guardian Beast. If it used the same art, I'd be a bit irked, but still an Arabian Nights card is an Arabian Nights card. Pulling out an OG set of Urza lands is still something, even if they're reprinted them all over and over.
And you'll have a shit ton to pick from because it'll likely drop the market by another 30%
You're telling me that if they reprinted Alpha and Arabian Nights with a tiny planeswalker symbol to differentiate, you'd be a buyer?
You'd be insane. Everything that shitty little planeswalker symbol has touched has nuked the value.
@@b2x10wt8
Bazaar of Baghdad dropping from ~2600-2700 down to ~1800-1900 still puts it about 500 above the start of the spike and right about where the value should be + or -. That's what's so bad about the recent market hike. In reality, Bazaar of Baghdad should be sitting around 800-1200 given a standard rate of increase from history.. but you pop on TCGPlayer and see Damaged ones listed at 1700, all because of some record sales (likely high graded versions) sold off in early 2021.
It's like saying the alpha lotus is worth 500k because of the Post Malone auction purchases. It's not. That sale skewed the pricing history, and they're nowhere near that. There's no reason a graded lotus sold for 25k or less 7 years ago and now the low end is showing ~150k with a 500k market value. There's no reason that they went from sub 10k to nearly 30k in 3 years either.
Abu Jafar Market being ~80. LP version ~25. Reprint version, NM, 0.10- 0.50. Not one naysayer has held any real evidence about reprints killing OG prices. The 2020 bubble collapsing and overvaluing FOMO of new cards is causing this effect. These OG cards are just as solid as ever. Remove the bubble and don't over pay into an "investment" that isn't a real investment.
These aren't solid investments. The prices come and go depending on who wants something. Auctioneers will say it time and time again. A rough estimate value of an item may be one thing, but you put 2 people in a room who want it and the sky's the limit. No magic card is worth any more than a person is willing to pay for it.
Invest in real investments. Buy pieces of cardboard that you like because you like the cardboard and/or want to use it to play.
Unfortunately, they killed my goodwill with the Magic 30 debacle. I absolutely would love a vintage cube to play with, but I'm not dropping $100 for dual lands, when I can drop about $150 to proxy the entire cube.
More mistakes? I'm surprised they are even considering making a mistake like this. Hasbro's PR team should make an immediate statement confirming the Reserved List promise before the last of their collectors leave in droves. This is great news for new games like MetaZoo, Sorcery, and FaB. The more market share those games can capture from disenfranchised collectors, the better.
I would be all for this. It makes sense. As long as they don't go Magic 30 prices again.
this is bad but everyone already knew it was only a matter of time. i think mtg is better as a game with the types of restrictions that make design space interesting because these and the power 9 are the simplest most powerful cards but the fun has been in finding convoluted ways of replicating those powerful effects.
beyond that, it's sad to see hasbro leaning so heavily on wotc to piss out more profit because clearly their shareholders don't care about reserved lists and wotc is sadly going to have to do all the things they said they'd never do so hasbro can keep pretending it still makes toys people want.
30th hurt the protection shield of Reserved List, no matter at what price they were offered. WOTC will not go this route again. The WOTC video mentioned Counterspell and not RL cards. Playables in all formats such as Bolt, Giant Growth, Counterspell , Dark Ritual etc. are targets for play test cards.
I think they actually think they have realised they cannot re-print the reserve list because they need it to keep its high price point. Reason being they need to be able to justify the high price of new products and players need to know there are expensive cards out there. If everything drops in price, then they simply cannot keep charging more.
If dual lands were printed in secret lairs. I would buy them. The idea of knowing what you're buying puts everything into perspective. I don't know if I'd spend $200CAD for them though.
Would you pay 3500$ for a one of every dual land secret lair because that would be a fair price ?! 😂😢😅
@@pascalraskal9347 You're not wrong. I guess it would come down to whether they would be tournament legal or not. I wouldn't be able to justify that much for what would essentially be proxies printed by Wizards.
Why not just go to any one of the websites out there that already make proxy dual lands then?
@@JoeyDCote maybe that's an idea too. Most of my playgroups would be good with secret lair cards but not with proxies. It's weird.
Reprinting with different artwork? absolutely not! That breaks the Reserved List promise, and will invite a MAJOR lawsuit.
This will be the nail in the coffin for the MTG collectors market.
Time for me to take an MTG break for a few years. I haven't been buying anything MTG retail in the last few months, and this is a sign that it's time to step away for a few years. Hopefully MTG (WOTC and the Community!)will work itself out.
Been I am glad you are least not selling your cards! Always enjoy the game
Using the old artwork would be wrong, unless you do it a mystery test card or an un set. Otherwise really new artwork would be a must.
I don't like any reprints of RL cards in general.
But what about if they would print entire Legacy decks with different artworks and cardbacks, including RL cards!
I think this would be fun for lots of players to dive into the old days of Mtg IF they don't charge a fortune for those decks.
Tummies will def be disappointed. Wotc printed "playtest" underground sea as an example will still be out of "price-point" of the loudest complainers of rl
I would love to play non Wotc old school type formats with these types of cards
Oh I wish I had faith that they wouldn’t have overcharge. Thanks Mox! I was eagerly awaiting your take when I saw the Reddit post this afternoon. I would buy it for the right price, then I would scoop up the OGs when they crash. My thought is they should serialize any RL reprints when it finally happens. Maybe that wouldn’t totally mess up the RL value. I defer to your MTG finance expertise though. Boomstick.
AliExpress duals are a couple bucks, 😂 no shot wotc is competing in the proxy market.
I have no clue as to the sports card market, but have the companies like Topps attempted to reprint the Mickey Mantle rookie card? Isn't that the one that is worth huge money? Would sports collectors buy reproductions of the old Honus Wagner cigarette pack cards? And if so, for how much? Just wonderin'.
There is a way to get around the RL, this isn't it. The original RL allowed WOTC to make promos like the judge promos.
We said the reprinting of the RL would be the beginning of the end for Wizards... well I see this ending.
I just want a sliver queen reprint tbh. I have every other sliver legend for my commander, and I hate that queen costs so much when she’s just alright. The First sliver is arguably better imo
they just need to do standard draft priced gold border packs and itll sell like gangbusters
Well now. I just use a printer. Then i can print 9 cards for 25 cents. So if wizards can do maybe 10 cents a card. Otherwise, i will just pass.
I am AGAINST violating the reserve list. I remember selling a Time Elemental for $50. When 'ICY' was reprinted 'ICY' value dropped 90%.
Any reprint will CRUSH the value of the card. PERIOD. Remember there were 1100+5000+15000 = 21100 of Each of the P9.
I can get dual lands for a dollar each. Not interested in any way
I’d buy a playset of secret lair dual lands if the price was right. If the price is ridiculous, I’m cool with people using proxies and sticking to my fetch and shocks
I'd spend at most 10$ for ten proxies of dual lands
Why not just create a much stronger version of the power 9? Add 4 mana of any one color, draw 4 cards, take an extra turn after this one, untap 2 lands 😅
They will.. after they get everyone's money for the RL. Once they bleed everyone dry by breaking their promise, they can make it obsolete.
They basically said they'd probably do that over direct reprints, just to avoid legal fees from frivolous lawsuits claiming breach of contract (which the reserved list is not). This may be testing the waters. some. They basically reprinted Moat from Legends. Only instead of an enchantment, it's a creature. Exact same casting coast, exact same wording on the card. They've definitely been playing around with what impact new cards have on reserved list cards.
@@ralphthegnome IMO, with the macro market in collectibles still taking damage, they should be keeping their head down and rebuilding the equity they blew frivilously over the past couple of years on endless reprints and variants.
Now is not the time to be screwing with people again. WOTC is becoming a menace to their own player base.
They should either just reprint the cards fully or not do proxies. I think that if they reprinted them, as you suggested, with different frames and art (maybe like Brother's War) but had them legal in Vintage, that would be just fine. I know people try to use this as an invenstment, but to be honest it is a game first and formost. If it has side value, neat. But if they continually chase the dragon looking fo money they think they are mission out on bsed upon secondary market, then they will fail. I predict another stock market hit for them in the next quarter.
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I think if they price them anything less than the price of the card theyll feel they didn’t steal enough. They priced those portal cards at market value - and they tanked. What’s imperial seal and imperial recruiter? This is a scam. Make wizards make more lotr. Not more commander legends. If they reprint the reserve list expect them to be serialized chase cards in $1000 collector booster box
10 dual lands for $100 invites a class action lawsuit from EVERY player who owns dual land. We're talking prices tanking, triple damages. This could sink both Hasbro AND WotC. Even considering it could cost the company billions of dollars (yes; billions with a b)
10 dual lands for any price invites this lawsuit... if they are printed with Magic card backs. If not, they may be safe from a lawsuit, but players and collectors will still leave the game in droves and cost the company millions in market share.
Regarding WOTC’s execution, nah!
If I want a proxy then I’ll get a proxy which often has better art and the quality is better than WOTC’s cards.
Regarding reprinting legal reserve list cards this is where my opinion converges with Mtgmoxman; I’m all for it as long as it is not a replica of the original as it pertains to artwork.
That being said I do wish to add something to that and that is the idea of “distribution matching” as I call it……meaning that the products are released in a particular manner or more specifically quantity that does not negatively impact the overall value of the originals to a great degree.
In my mind doing so will enable newer players to get some of the same experiences as the OG’s, limiting distribution puts paper in the bank for WOTC as well as keeping the collectors happy which in some cases happier as they will get both versions to display in a set!
Go for an execution that’s a win for everyone not just Hasbro. Will it happen? I doubt it; historically execution is WOTC’s greatest weakness next to quality control as it pertains to the newer products.
I own reaerve list cards and proxies and I would never buy wizard “proxies” unless they were cheaper then real proxies. If it is printed by wizards but they don’t allow them to make them tournament legal I could see them open to a lawsuit. This worked for the gold bordered cards because the game is so new. Also I would argue what makes gold boarder cards not real besides a different boarder and back, because no other “legal” cards have a different boarder or back right?
Cheap official duel land proxies? Yes, I would buy those.
Just watch they will create a tri-land that has no drawbacks to make the reserve list duel lands moot. With power creep the way it is now it’s just a matter of time before they print out something like this under a new tier of rarity.
Some of my local shops have approved the use of the official wizards proxies in tournaments.
It's fun, right? Supercool?! ISN'T IT SUPERCOOL??!!!
Why did I read this in Randy from South Parks voice 😅
WotC would make an absolute fortune. Think they will not leave that money on the table.
They just have to keep beating that dead horse don't they?
You can make your own nachos and cheese but not your own proxies? Huh, I prefer both homemade 😀 Or the original from 20 to 30 years ago, including nachos from back then!
It's just so disappointing. Imagine if 30th had been a draft box of 24 packs for 200-300. It would have been the best selling Magic set of all time, they could have printed money for years with it.
I don't care if WOTC is able to print money. They already have the equity of almost my entire collection.
Just leave a few cards alone.
They would of only been able to print so little of it that the price would have shot up to the same price it was and resellers would of made money instead of WotC.
@@patmacrotch5611 Yeah dude, that's called getting value for the thing you bought.
When I buy something valuable, I don't want to give the value back to the person who sold it to me.. That's why they have my money.
You see, it's an exchange. Let me know if this is making sense.
@@patmacrotch5611 Why would they only have been able to print a small amount? They can print as many as they want, or better yet, as many as WE want by printing to demand through Secret Lair or Pulse or something. And they are proxies, so (from Wizards' point of view) they don't use up any equity.
@@asaffin1 Because they cannot make it readily available because it WILL effect the price of real duals. They already do this when they reprint stuff not on reserve list.
When they are thinking about reprinting duals and playable staples from the reserve list... they cannot tank the value of the current cards. (or else law suits)
So they have two options, make the price of the product very high so that the value is inline with the value of the secondary market value. Or they can make the print run very small so they secondary market isn't effected. It's a balancing act of these two factors.
This is why magic 30th was price the way it was and the print run it had. The lesson that WOTC will take from magic 30th is that the price point was too high. Therefore, if they try something like magic 30th again they are going to go the other way. They will greatly reduce the print run.
If the community accepts the product then, its just going to be bought up then place on the secondary market at 2-3x the price. And everyone will just be crying about how magic 35 was the worst ever because they didn't print enough and blah blah.
MoxMan! I always said they should "reprint" cards so we can have game pieces. But not flawless replicas of the originals. They should have hot new art and modern layout.
I agree just do it and get it over with. I'd rather not have joke looking test cards though. Please just reprint them and change the art.
Dual Lands will lose value btw... At least the ugly damaged copies that people sometimes buy for play will. Otherwise collectors versions worth having will probably skyrocket. The reason is because the proxy cards will promote the old cards and make them that much more exciting to new collectors.
Every single copy will. Revised will get absolutely decimated to the tune of 95%.
Reserved list was created to not reprint those cards. Wizards already lied and made magic 30. Tournament legal or not they went against their own policy. Why not do it again and finish off what’s left of the original players
Would you be OK with them being gold-bordered? imho the sample shown in this video is just not ... visually pleasing.
Done buying new MTG. Just want to complete my old sets
It all depends on the print run! Period!😂
I still feel that reprints, reserved list or not, will find their value based on the number available of that specific print and the artwork. I can't see a reprint Mishra's meeting or beating the Antiquities version. Unless they bring some jaw-dropping art.. but yep That's exactly what I started saying when coming back to MTG. I think the current prices will take a hit, but I think they'll stay above the natural price point ignoring the 2020 jump. Juzam is my go to example. Useless card, awesome art and most of the value is in that art.
They can't unprint existing reprints, but going forward? They have the chance to immortalize the originals and further fortify the value of the originals.
Power 9 shouldn't be reprinted, really.. because they're banned. There's no REAL reason to reprint a banned card. Restricted? sure, Banned? Naw. I wouldn't even buy a reprinted Mox/Lotus if they're still banned.
Heck, that can change the whole landscape of Prints/Reprints and their values. They can make a limited run to add value by low print count. They can have a later reprint with amazing art that makes the card more popular than the original (this is already seen in non-reserved reprints).
I'm not afraid. I am only hesitant that they will mess it up somehow in a chase for more cash.
To a degree, yes print and artwork.. but then why the f*)k did they make "The List" and "Mystery Booster" as near-perfect counterfeits of rare printings and artworks?
Pick a path!! Either reserve cards, or reserve art/treatment. If they're doing the latter, then STOP WITH THE LIST!!!
@@Syne111 Myself (if you track down my myriad of comments regarding reserved list) and Moxman's comment in the vid is specific to alteration of the reprinted version.
The List is just a janky awkward bonus lotto and poorly implemented/regulated to boot.
They need to draw a line. Not in the sand, a firm line. Original run prints use original artwork. Any reprints use a different artwork. That sets the score base value and identification of the card. Then you can play with all the dumb things like foil types, etching, serial numbers, etc to try to bolster value/collectability.
Mystery boosters are/were one of the worst things, along with serialized event cards (I'm looking at you 2023 PA Shivan Dragon). It's one thing to have a fun prize, but do it "right" like the acorn card for the cosplay contest winners at GenCon.
@@ralphthegnome YES!! But not enough people are sending the message. It's difficult to cut through the noise of people whining for handouts, to get to good advice like this.
In 93/94 they said black border meant original printing. They had the right idea 30 years ago. Now just update it for 2023!
P.S. - Serialized cards are a joke. I actually don't mind the limited printings like the Praetors, but the mass-product junk with tramp stamp was pointless, and those will trend toward nothing.
@@Syne111 I think most serialized will fall off, mostly because they were dumb and not selective enough. Mox Amber? Yes plz Mishra's Bauble? Uhhh.. No?
throwing a dart at the wall and slapping a number on the card it hit won't matter if that card had no value to begin with.
I'd do that simply because I want them for casual or put them in my desks, I don't want to play my metal workers any more
Metalworker is like an $80 card now. Used to be $300
@@Syne111 foil ones
The whole reason that I buy RL cards is because they can not be reprinted, if WOTC reprint the RL I just think that I will sell off my collection slowly and just buy other Tcg's.
The 30 set was a mistake and destroyed confidence from long time collectors. They should have NEVER consider doing RL printings. I believe if they did the printings they would be inserted as chase cards and would be massively expensive when opened, completely making the reprinting no reason to have it happend in the first place. A really cheap reprint would tank too many cards as well. The Rl maybe the only thing saving the game from completely collapsing from Wotc constant bad decisions.