Відео

I have old version of odds oracle. Don't know if it's still available. Their site went down a few years ago. But the program, if you purchased it, still works for hot/cold equities.

@@learnmixgames okay, ya I saw a thread mentioning odds oracle. I was able to find a copy, but it required a license key. Which I do not have. Also, after installing it I got a "Prohibited Software Usage" email from PokerStars. I guess they don't like it when you have that program installed. I just wanted it to review Big O hands. I have since removed it.

​@@learnmixgamesok, I saw an old Reddit thread mentioning odds Oracle. I found a link to a copy but I didn't have a license key, so I couldn't use it. And then literally the next day PokerStars sent me a "prohibited software use" email. So I uninstalled it immediately

There must be something wrong with your filter because I just checked and see a bunch of them even at $0.50/$1 with the Mixed filter on. Are you on their Discord? I'll add the link if you are not.

They have the best customer response.

@ I am not on their Discord but will go find it right now.

I left a message, and also can apparently see mix games if none of my filters are on, which is weird.

Will gladly answer if you send the question to learnmixgames@gmail.com

100% I was rewatching it and couldn't believe I missed that. Thanks for pointing that out!

Welcome to the wonderful world of mix games! 1:40 There are positions/situations where we want to fold after the 1st draw...in position, after the 1st draw, 1 card behind, is probably never one of them. 16:05 I have said in the past that if you have the draw lead you are usually betting when checked to. After the 1st draw in position I like to keep the pot small if I miss and it's 3/2 where ranges are wide and if I missed there is a good chance my opponent improved at least to a 2 card draw. I don't see an issue betting unimproved if you have significant blockers or if your opponent overfolds. In general betting unimproved every time opens yourself up to exploitation of getting check raised really lite. 28:17 I would say when you open the sb and the bb 3 bets you we are never supposed to 4 bet a 2 card draw because we are out of position so at a significant information disadvantage, our opponent is never drawing less cards than us, and we have given information that we have a pure 2 card draw...the last part meaning that if we start to put in any action on later streets our opponents should slow down because you most likely have a wheel draw. With respect to the call with the Jack, I also tend to pay off lite after the last draw if my opponent goes two to pat...so I don't think it's too lose. But if your opponent is never bluffing in this spot you need to take note and fold. Good luck!

@@learnmixgames This is all amazing advice, thank you! My bankroll is not huge on the site so 1/2 is the largest I should be playing (and even that's probably too big) but I hope to get into a circus mix or fun mix soon. (So I can botch all those games up too. ;) )

Absolutely! Thanks for watching!

Would not use NLO8 monker sims to compare ranges. My guess is there is a huge discrepancy between two games. Also...would much rather have 4578ds vs J923ds here anyway given the raise/call. Can definitely make the argument that 8754ds is a fold here. Probably close to neutral EV to be honest..rake probably makes it a fold. In game just waffled on the decision.

@@learnmixgames j923 is fave vs 4578 though and certainly higher up in a shoving range. i wiuld actually prefer to shove 4578 unopened that play a 3-4 way pot with middle cards. but either way your vpipping around 40% + here unless your folding better hands and calling worse hands that wouldnt make much sense to me.

You're talking about shoving in a limit game. That just doesn't compare . I think what is happening is that you are comparing the hot/cold equity of the hands vs each other. A rough example would be in limit hold'em if you had 22 vs AKo. 22 has a higher EV all in vs AKo but AKo is an open/raise/reraise/reraise from any position in even 9 handed limit holdem where 22 ONLY open raises in the SB...every other position it folds if given the chance to open. FWIW there is also another thing to consider and it has to do with the action that has already happened. When it goes raise/call in a 6 handed O/8 game, hands that were supposed to be folds now become playable because of card removal. J923ds is still a fold because the structure of the hand is so bad but I thought a hand like 8754ds could now be a call.

@@learnmixgames yeah i understand that. i dont know the answer but the main question is what will be the difference between a for instance 35% shoving range in nlo8 and a 35% opening range in flo8. the fact its very likely to goto the flop in flo8 surely will alter the top 35% slightly. personally i would fold j923 and 4578 in that spot and they are fairly close on the spectrum. i feel 4578 plays far far worse vs raise and call all your straights pretty much make a low or and 2nd 3rd nut the low is not strong and will be the same 2nd 3rd 4th nut low most often. i think if your serious about coaching mix fames you need 2 look into making a solver for all games at least the common 8 games ones. then you would be at the top of the mixed coaching world until then we are slightly guessing about even well known games here. just a idea glgl

@@learnmixgames so you would bet vs any 4 4578 ds and i have j923 ds? or vs raise and call range you would choose 4578ds over j923 i think i take j923 in all 3 spots and fairly sure it would be like 0.0x% edge

You mean win rates for each game? No. Is there a software that aggerates each of the mix games? Can you point to a specific example about the Omaha hi/lo?

@@learnmixgames dont have time to rewatch now but it seemed as if your slightly too focused on low cards rather than high equity. maybe the 2347 ds is a good example although im sure in some games its not the worst open. i think its down to the fact 90% of these games are low orientated. i would try shave off some non ace low card hands. i think it was something u said about low cards in late position.

@@learnmixgames im not sure i use holdem manager and its not good for mix games. there probably is a mxied games hud and apparently gto has solved mix games possibly not all the odd variants you play but 8 game. maybe look into gto mix games and we could discuss some of the outputs.

I wish some more straight O/8 games went on the site. Maybe later. I went back through the video to see if there were more than 6 O/8 hands but I could not find them. Only 2 hands that I found: The 3345 on the button. Almost any 3 and probably ALL 4 card (excluding trips on button) wheel cards are opens in O/8. The 2347 ds in HJ. It's probably a small winner. However your point about "shaving off" non ace low hands in general are correct. Unless the hand is structured well (i.e. 4 wheel cards, KKQQds) you almost always want to have an ace in it.

@@learnmixgames where are you getting this range from? i play tighter than that in mtts its hare to believe we want to be that wide in a rake structured game but i could be wrong. just feels like j345 etc going to be a trouble hand and bb defends so much you will end up chasing low only hands and not even drawing at nut lows. im struggling to find good gto solutions so im not 100% sure.

Thanks for the compliment! Agree that the traffic is lacking. Fortunately there seems to be mix game going most of the time so I can get some content to you guys! They need tournaments badly and hopefully that changes in Q1 (as the roadmap and blog says). Fingers crossed. Good luck out there!

I don't think this is rude at all! I'm always looking for good feedback as it makes me a better player. I found when coaching, the best students ask the best questions and it is forced to keep me on my toes as I can't answer "I think this is right" and then justify it without sound logic. If you ever have a question please ask! With respect to your timestamps: 12:00 While we want an ace in our hand the majority of the time in O/8 there are a few exceptions with wheel combos that we want to play. Usually they have to be connected, be double suited/have a high suit, or two low pair. If we fold we lose -0.5bb and by calling my guess here is we get at least 1/2 of that back. Very similar concept to limit holdem where we call a rather highish frequency here with hands like KTo or Q9s. Calling in these situations is better than folding because you get more of your money back. However it also increases the variance. Also having a K here in our hand is different vs having a 9. K makes this a clear play but something like a 9 probably makes it a fold because of rake. Online is slightly different vs live games with kills. If this was a kill game and you had to put more money back into the pot my guess is that this would be a fold. 22:50 Tend to disagree here on this one. I opened an A and yes my range is wide as we can see but it's very different if I had opened some other low card (obviously impossible in this situation but say he brings it in with a 3 and I open a 6). Having an ace is like playing with a mini joker in this game and his range should be stronger when playing against an A vs a 6. A Q and J are aso dead which reduces my combos of making 2 pair. Also moxie can easily have 888 here and by not having a low draw anymore it kills our equity in the hand. This is a spot where realizing our equity going forward is going to be hard unless we catch a T. 24:08 With respect to this hand and the hand above this hand we have a low draw and the one above we do not. There is almost always a price where almost any play in poker can be justified. With Moxie folding I think the price is justified. Also the Ace opening here should be wide with only 2 players behind. The 2 is not a great card because 2 of them are already dead but I think calling a small bet on 4th with extra dead money makes it worth it. I gave him an extremely generous range of AA-22, cc, and any 2 low cards. So no bricks in this range which he should have and our hand still has 37%. If we add reasonable steal combos like A/wheel/broadway hands we have 40%. Immediately getting 5.3-1 we need 16% to continue and given we have more than double that I think we can also realize our equity too. 25:17 Yea this probably close. Think 5 handed this is a clear fold. 3 handed probably a play. 4 handed not sure. At these low limits you can probably get away with this steal regardless. If you think I'm wrong feel free to respond and give me any more feedback! This is how we all get better.

Seen $30/$60 going. Usually a $10/$20, $15/$30, or $20/$40 daily. Usually A-5 razz. Sometimes 2-7.

@ thanks!

It's designed to be an intro to players like yourself. Obviously learning to play the other 7 games of 8-game or just learning something like HORSE on it's own takes time. Goal of the channel is to give recommendations and ideas to players who want to learn those games.

Hey Jaxsen...thank you much for the feedback! I usually start playing around 8pm Chicago time (Central Standard) and there is usually a game going...if not I usually sit at a few tables and within 15 minutes there is a game started. Throughout the day I also see games going but they are all over the place, same with limits. Would not say there is a certain game going all the time however Fun and Circus Mix seems to be their most popular right now. They also have a great discord and there you can post where and what stakes you are sitting to let people know that you want to start a game. Good luck at the tables!

@learnmixgames ah nice, I'll have a look out for tables at that time then. Is it ok to share the link for the discord?

@@jaxsen31 Sure thing!! discord.gg/AZAXHXmR

In this stud game "Stud hi/lo regular" or "Any/Any" the best stud hi hand gets 1/2 the pot (my flush) and the best low...the low has no qualifier so it's just the best A-5 razz hand. Magic has T653A low and Blu has T8765. In all low games the best low hand is determined from the high card down to the low card. Hence T6xxx beats T8xxx.

@@learnmixgames Thanks, that's what I understood.

Thank you for subbing! Phenom just opened about 2 months ago so they are brand new. There is usually some sort of mix game going over there whenever I log in (Chicago time zone) somewhere between 8AM-10PM. Stakes are relatively small over there currently ($.5/$1 to $15/$30) however occasionally see some people playing 100-200 2-7 triple draw or so. My focus with the channel is to introduce players who want to learn mix games hand have some kind of background in poker like PLO and NL holdem. Any time I see a tournament series that includes mix games they seem to be getting more popular. Same in the past when I could play on PokerStars and Full Tilt. I believe Phenom is going to try and revive that in the near future (not 100% but have talked with the team) and anyone who wants to learn the basic concepts can start here for free. Honestly wonder how many players GG would get for a $1100 O/8 or HORSE bracelet online event. We will probably never find out but we might get a sniff if Phenom can bring some of those ideas back in the form of tournament series like FTOPS or mini FTOPS. With respect to edges it's just relative how hard you want to work. As someone who has played their whole career playing mix and is friends with some of the best mix game players out there, there is definitely an edge if you want to work hard and go find it. Good luck at the tables!

Thank you! You too!

Glad I could help. Will try to make more content in the future about games people might not see too often.

Thanks for the follow and sorry for the late response! I really like what Phenom is trying to do with respect to focusing on the players and giving them a way to get "equity" from playing and referring players. Their discord is super active and helpful. Also you are in control of your funds. You deposit into your wallet that you create when signing up. All other sites (I believe) are centralized with respect to the money. Meaning that you have to get approval to withdraw your money. Would say that Coin is ahead in that their software is really good and been around for a while. But last I checked they only have 3 games to play (NL, PLO, PLO5). Phenom still has some bugs to workout but they are fixing them everyday as well. Will be interesting to see what happens when Phenom adds tournaments to their rotation (hopefully next month). There is way more action on Coin as of now but Phenom is only been open a month. Good luck out there!