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Julius Derzocker
Приєднався 3 лип 2012
Pikmin 2 TAS - Part 4: Snagret Hole
In this Part of my second Pay off Dept TAS, I tackle Early Blues (EB) and Snagret Hole (SH). Read more ---
Early Blues:
I exited WFG with a good RNG seed that lets Olimar bump two purples without whistling, and it has good pellet posy positions. For the scale glitch, I use the spicy cutscene, since I didn't have a good use for spicies yet. This avoids ever triggering the poison cutscene.
I had the good luck that the blues started attacking the first two pellets by themselves, letting me harvest all pellets before the gate. Two blue sprouts get left behind though. If I had collected the pellet from the dwarf bulborb on Day 4, it would have worked out perfectly.
SH-1:
I need to reach 5000 pokos after BK to skip the 40% cutscene. Therefore I go pretty hard for bugs in SH. Collecting the bulborb takes about 52 frames for 7 pokos, or 4.2 pokos/sec. I didn't get the fast death animation.
SH-2:
This is one of the best layouts, and the first time that I actually got the specific RNG seed I wanted. Thanks to APerson13 for finding it.
This level involves manipulating the enemies to politely miss my Pikmin, and to make the Pikmin not lose their flowers. It looks fun, with the bits of random movement here and there to manipulate RNG.
SH-3:
Here I get the best layout, with the hole next to the snagret and snitchbug. The snagret on the rocky side is about 15f faster. I snipe that snitchbug for style points (and free pokos). The slowest part is collecting the head in time, because it takes so much longer than the treasure to get tangible.
It's actually possible to kill snagret before the first peck and before it shakes, but I hadn't known about it back then.
SH-4:
This layout is not the best. Also I didn't throw enough Pikmin on the marble at the beginning, but I didn't want to redo the level. The canon beatle kill shows off what you can only do in TAS, as I throw my Pikmin before the beatle is even there. Getting the rigth amount of whites on the body took many tries. Also notice the poor red Pikmin that loses its flower D:
SH-5:
Good layout. Sadly, I couldn't snipe the bulborb in mid-air, because then the marble would have slided further away. This is one of the few times where I don't collect the body, so I bitter the antenna beatle and manipulate a bitter drop.
SH-6:
For this sublevel I made a Lua script to search through layouts faster, by automatically executing CaveGen with a seed. It's still manual, but this is about 5 times faster than checking seeds without the script. Feel free to use and adapt it:
github.com/Julian-Wollersberger/Pikmin2_Scripts/blob/master/Pikmin2_CaveLayoutManip.lua
I grow extra whites here, which only loses 2.7 sec. I can conveniently pluck them while snagret is dying. With that, I have 5 more whites than RTA.
The bulborb gets sniped this time, and lens is collected with convenient C-sticking. Here I learn that you can kill snagret faster if it does the slow come-up. With lens and TST I have 180 extra pokos, of which 80 were already skipped in WFG3.
SH-7:
This was a very hard level to optimize. First, I ruled out that I didn't want to use a spicy, because it messes up the quick kill, and also no bitter, because I can collect mitites during the death animation. That's 25 pokos for about 6sec of timeloss.
The next hard part was getting a stun. There is a 1% chance of stunning snagret when a purple hits on its downwards arc. I don't think you can stun on the upwards part of the throw. This took many tries with many throwing angles.
Pikmin manipulation needed to happen at the same time. I needed to throw the purples quite fast, with mostly 3 frame throws ('A' nothing nothing). 4 or 5 frame switch throws ('A' 'A' left nothing nothing) were to slow. I needed 2 purples left for mitites. When throwing the rest, I carefully needed to C-stick to avoid throwing any of my 11 leaves or the remaining 2 purples.
Then it's mitites time. The furthest 4 mitites needed whites to get collected fast enouth, but I only had 3 white flowers. So only 9 mitites for me. Then I stall for a bit, because it takes ages for the nectars to become tangible.
Snagret needs to stay on screen the whole time to get a good treasure slide. The head is the slowest thing again, so I dismiss all the whites on it. With a bit more Pikmin finagling, they get on the treasure decently fast and don't overshoot the pod. With that, Snagret Hole is complete.
Sprays:
At this point, I'm convinced that unlocking sprays was a mistake. Spicies mess up the boss quick kills and bitters erase the bug bodies that are almost always needed. Only the few gates become faster. I don't think that will save the 40sec it took to unlock sprays.
Timing:
Enter SH takes 1:45.3 and SH takes 6:43.8. I leave SH at 32:59 RTA timing, with 31576 rerecords. For comparison, the community gold splits are 2:28 by Jack and 8:10 by iid. (Data from 2021, see docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/105B12_mhvdNJXnw3wd-8lc8kGlmwDY3yYE4K3PLDMDU)
Early Blues:
I exited WFG with a good RNG seed that lets Olimar bump two purples without whistling, and it has good pellet posy positions. For the scale glitch, I use the spicy cutscene, since I didn't have a good use for spicies yet. This avoids ever triggering the poison cutscene.
I had the good luck that the blues started attacking the first two pellets by themselves, letting me harvest all pellets before the gate. Two blue sprouts get left behind though. If I had collected the pellet from the dwarf bulborb on Day 4, it would have worked out perfectly.
SH-1:
I need to reach 5000 pokos after BK to skip the 40% cutscene. Therefore I go pretty hard for bugs in SH. Collecting the bulborb takes about 52 frames for 7 pokos, or 4.2 pokos/sec. I didn't get the fast death animation.
SH-2:
This is one of the best layouts, and the first time that I actually got the specific RNG seed I wanted. Thanks to APerson13 for finding it.
This level involves manipulating the enemies to politely miss my Pikmin, and to make the Pikmin not lose their flowers. It looks fun, with the bits of random movement here and there to manipulate RNG.
SH-3:
Here I get the best layout, with the hole next to the snagret and snitchbug. The snagret on the rocky side is about 15f faster. I snipe that snitchbug for style points (and free pokos). The slowest part is collecting the head in time, because it takes so much longer than the treasure to get tangible.
It's actually possible to kill snagret before the first peck and before it shakes, but I hadn't known about it back then.
SH-4:
This layout is not the best. Also I didn't throw enough Pikmin on the marble at the beginning, but I didn't want to redo the level. The canon beatle kill shows off what you can only do in TAS, as I throw my Pikmin before the beatle is even there. Getting the rigth amount of whites on the body took many tries. Also notice the poor red Pikmin that loses its flower D:
SH-5:
Good layout. Sadly, I couldn't snipe the bulborb in mid-air, because then the marble would have slided further away. This is one of the few times where I don't collect the body, so I bitter the antenna beatle and manipulate a bitter drop.
SH-6:
For this sublevel I made a Lua script to search through layouts faster, by automatically executing CaveGen with a seed. It's still manual, but this is about 5 times faster than checking seeds without the script. Feel free to use and adapt it:
github.com/Julian-Wollersberger/Pikmin2_Scripts/blob/master/Pikmin2_CaveLayoutManip.lua
I grow extra whites here, which only loses 2.7 sec. I can conveniently pluck them while snagret is dying. With that, I have 5 more whites than RTA.
The bulborb gets sniped this time, and lens is collected with convenient C-sticking. Here I learn that you can kill snagret faster if it does the slow come-up. With lens and TST I have 180 extra pokos, of which 80 were already skipped in WFG3.
SH-7:
This was a very hard level to optimize. First, I ruled out that I didn't want to use a spicy, because it messes up the quick kill, and also no bitter, because I can collect mitites during the death animation. That's 25 pokos for about 6sec of timeloss.
The next hard part was getting a stun. There is a 1% chance of stunning snagret when a purple hits on its downwards arc. I don't think you can stun on the upwards part of the throw. This took many tries with many throwing angles.
Pikmin manipulation needed to happen at the same time. I needed to throw the purples quite fast, with mostly 3 frame throws ('A' nothing nothing). 4 or 5 frame switch throws ('A' 'A' left nothing nothing) were to slow. I needed 2 purples left for mitites. When throwing the rest, I carefully needed to C-stick to avoid throwing any of my 11 leaves or the remaining 2 purples.
Then it's mitites time. The furthest 4 mitites needed whites to get collected fast enouth, but I only had 3 white flowers. So only 9 mitites for me. Then I stall for a bit, because it takes ages for the nectars to become tangible.
Snagret needs to stay on screen the whole time to get a good treasure slide. The head is the slowest thing again, so I dismiss all the whites on it. With a bit more Pikmin finagling, they get on the treasure decently fast and don't overshoot the pod. With that, Snagret Hole is complete.
Sprays:
At this point, I'm convinced that unlocking sprays was a mistake. Spicies mess up the boss quick kills and bitters erase the bug bodies that are almost always needed. Only the few gates become faster. I don't think that will save the 40sec it took to unlock sprays.
Timing:
Enter SH takes 1:45.3 and SH takes 6:43.8. I leave SH at 32:59 RTA timing, with 31576 rerecords. For comparison, the community gold splits are 2:28 by Jack and 8:10 by iid. (Data from 2021, see docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/105B12_mhvdNJXnw3wd-8lc8kGlmwDY3yYE4K3PLDMDU)
Переглядів: 87
Відео
Bulborb Knockback Extention to Snagret Hole
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Переглядів 922 роки тому
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Phasing through Walls to reach White Flower Garden faster - Pikmin 2 TAS Part 3
Переглядів 1152 роки тому
In this part of my Tool Assisted Speedrun for the Pay off Dept category, I enter White Flower Garden in 45sec and complete it in 5:00min. Rundown of splits: Enter WFG: Phasing the purples through the wall is a trick I learned from ToolAssistedPikm. Here is the best time to get the 10 reds back out that had carried the berries. It only takes 2sec and they'll be useful, particulary for the globe....
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Переглядів 1452 роки тому
The new Kap% category: The most important category of them all! My new PB is 2min 08sec or 4305 frames. (TAS timing stops at last input, but the first two seconds are missing in the recording.) If it isn't obvious, this is for April Fools day :P
Knockback Extention - Early White Flower Garden - Pikmin 2
Переглядів 1202 роки тому
With knockback extention there is a new way to get out of bounds even earlier and in even more places. This can be used to get to WFG before HoB without crushing the bag. Why is this useful you ask? It opens up routing possibilities for the speedrun. In WFG you get whites and the napsack. Whites move faster and the napsack is needed for Early Blues and other out of bounds tricks. KBE works by o...
Hole of Beasts - Pikmin 2 TAS Part 2
Переглядів 1873 роки тому
In this second part of my second Pay off Dept TAS, I enter Awakening Woods and beat the Hole of Beasts. The exit time is 18:46, which is 1m28sec faster than the current RTA WR, and 3m06sec faster than my first TAS. HoB entry: The big gate takes quite some time to destroy. In RTA you would grow some Pikmin here, but the TAS has enough Pikmin thanks to the mitites from day 4. Instead I collect th...
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Переглядів 2313 роки тому
Gate cutscene skip is a new timesave for the TAS which saves about 20 seconds. It is done by collecting the Courage Reactor on the same frame the gate finishes. Because it's the first treasure we collect in Valley of Repose, we get a day end cutscene that takes priority over the gate cutscene. Fortunately the Pikmin have a single frame to come back to the leader and don't die. This saves 12sec ...
The REAL Boss of Pikmin 2 - TAS Part 1: From Beginning to Emergence Cave Exit
Переглядів 2493 роки тому
The real boss are mitites. Those pesky little bugs are increadibly agile. In this video I'm killing 30 of them and making it look like it's easy. This is the first part of my second Tool Assisted Speedrun of Pikmin 2 Pay off Debt. The route is mostly from ToolAssistedPikm's great TAS, with one new cutscene skip. ua-cam.com/video/8UCRR-mII9c/v-deo.html Tricks involved: * Day 1 Extinction: Skips ...
[TAS] Pikmin 2 - Pay Off Debt in 1:30:36
Переглядів 4,9 тис.3 роки тому
This is my first Tool Assisted Speedrun, and the first completed TAS for Pikmin 2 Pay Off Dept. The RTA time is 1h30min36.26sek or 326176 frames. The main reasons why the TAS is fast is RNG manipulation for consistently good cave layouts, and not needing to search for treasures. The route is the same as in RTA. I learned a lot over the 2 months of making this TAS. In the beginning, I didn't kno...
Very nice 👍
Blast Off To Snagret Hole!! (original title is “Blast Off To Quacker Island” by TWD98)
1:15:21 Fuckin brutal
epic
What version of the game you were using? Pal or NTSC?
It was done on PAL, because it was the version of the game that I own myself. Not the optimal choice in retrospect.
You can save to have a memory card though!
Yay he did the speedrun
can someone explain to me how a 'TAS' is made?
so far as I know there's software that plays the game frame by frame and you painstakingly go through each frame of gameplay to make sure everything is as quick, optimal and frame perfect as you can possibly be. It oftentimes involves performing inputs that would be impossible for a human otherwise, or manipulating RNG to make things guaranteed to happen
@@LukeA471 There is another method which is easier to create, using save states, you can play through a section at full speed as many times as you want until you get the perfect outcome, though it is a lot less precise than the method you described. Often times this method is a segmented run, but it can also be considered TAS because you are using tools outside the game to help run the game optimally.
@@LukeA471In this specific context the tools mostly being used are to assist in memory manipulation to get good RNG
That sublevel 5 is a work of art. Amazing job.
Thanks ^^
This may potentially be used in VoR since there is a bulborb earlier in the map.
Cool idea!
aww you missed the funny part - when messing around with this, I found that opening the onion menu on the frame a cutscene starts, you softlock with no way out (time doesn't even move). I kid; really nice video.
Lol, nice to know
Wonderful to see this game broken to bits!
Oh-ho! This is nice! GL with this!