Відео

I agree. However, hardly ever any new brand in the markets is a brightest diamond when its found. Especially if you are compete with the price. They can become a real diamond, but that requires still some development work in the manufacturing processes. I was also hoping that spinning rockers would be more close to JW profiles. These blades spinning rockers are more close to Ultima´s blades, means very flat.

I have seen only one pair of MK Pro´s and they were used which didn't have anymore original cross grinding. Drag pick had also evidences that they have been also modified. Therefore I do not have any reliable reference from MK. What I have seen theoretical profile information of MK Pro´s and Gold Seal profiles in the real life, I would say that Flight profile is more close to Ultima´s profiles than MK Pro or Gold Seal. Touch point is longer and spinning rocker flatter.

You can find the answer from my other videos. Please check them, thank you!

Its true that JW/ MK profiles are popular and many other manufacturer tries to make their own version of these most popular profiles. However, you need to note that even profile would be very close to same, it can be positioned differently compared to the toe picks. At least Ultima does not have any 100% identical blade with JW. JW and MK does have huge manufacturing tolerances. Its kind of copy protection when each blade is unique. Even left and right foot. This makes copying much more difficult. :)

In many Ultima blades heel lift is lower than in JW/MK blades. I believe this is one reason why previous JW/MK users does not like Ultimas blades. Their touch point is also more further from the toes than in JW blades.

These kind of blades makes me think that the time I used could be used for something better. Alternatively I should have some of these automated sharpening machines where I can just put the skate, close my eyes and ears and push the start button. When I open my eyes next time I have superb sharpened blade and happy skater. This is how many pro shops has solved this issue.

I believe you made your conclusion from the photo where I have made one light grinding pass. Even the edges were unevenly grinded, that was not what I tried to demonstrate. Reason my blue ink still exists in one side of the blade comes from the fact that I could not get blade 100% same height as previous grinding at first grinding pass. @SterlingSnyder-ef5yc has already more experience form the blades sharpening's, so his analyses were very good and they could cause burr inside the hollow. However I have different theory what caused burr.

Yes, there was burr inside the hollow and yes, wheel has not probably dressed enough often. Its also possible that wheel has been more coarse than mine or wheel has been dressed to cut more aggressively (fast dressing movement). These conclusions are most visible in the photo where I have made one light grinding pass. Worn wheel radial profile could be also root cause for the burr, but I believe there is some other reason for the burr. Its not shown so clearly in video, but burr did exists only in the area where we can see "polishing" in the chrome removal area. If burr would come from the wheel, I think the burr should exist in whole length of the blade. Burr didn't exist in the end of blade which is hardly even used, so my conclusion is that ice has not made deburring for the areas which are used all the time. Your analyses were good, but I have some other theory what has caused the burr.

Un moteur de 120 W n'a probablement pas assez de couple pour affûter le patin. Très probablement, le disque s'arrêtera ou du moins sa vitesse de rotation diminuera considérablement après un bon démarrage. Il peut également être difficile de le monter aussi fermement que des moteurs plus gros. De plus, la masse du petit moteur électrique amortit mal les vibrations.

I think they are all made in China, even they are sold under several brands. To find closest supplier, try to use following search words in the Google picture search => BEVEL EDGE SQUARES, ADJUSTABLE DIN 875/0

True. 120W motor cannot provide so high torque. Increasing rpm helps a bit, but may cause higher vibration. I have printed new dust collector to my LE, but it was not so good as I hoped.

Are you here in the US? Do you have a page on Facebook?

@@SterlingSnyder-ef5yc Nope. Living different side of the World and I do not use any common social medias like FB , TikTok or Instagram. Whatsapp mainly. It would be interesting to know how you are able to restore the original profile. I believe someone said that you can do that.

I believe you are interested in how close to the drag pick the hollow grinding should go and you are interested about this because you are wondering if an 8" grinding wheel can be used for figure skates? Sharpening should always start as close to the drag spike as possible. Not because the entire NSZ area touches the ice, but because the risks of grinding a hump in to the most important area of the blade increases significantly. A large grinding wheel makes significantly more difficult to start sharpening pass smoothly and speeds up the erosion of the spinning rocker. You can see one example of the damage caused by a large grinding wheel in my video, Classic figure skate sharpening fails. It took me years to understand why NSZ is so important. I recommend watching this video. Pay attention to how far the cross grind is done and how long it remains at the end of the sharpening. Cross grinder is must to have equipment for serious skate technicians. If I guessed wrongly about your interest, we can discuss the topic further. If you are able to speak English, we could even consider if we could keep Teams meeting. You seems to have lots of interest to figure skate sharpening's.

​@@Annisk8s yeah I just learning into this, because my wife a figure skating coach and we planning to open the skate shop with the sharpening.. I research everything for the sharpening method or technology behind it, but there are still lack of information, thats why I found your channel and start watching haha My blademaster machine come around Dec this year, before that I need to hone my soft skill or to complete my skate shop sharpening tools.. for the teams meeting, sounds good, I'm so interested

May I ask which Blademaster machine you have purchased? Are you member of this forum? skatingforums.com/index.php?board=25.0

@@Annisk8s the portable/bench with 8”, Im not yet member of that forum, but I read some discussion there

I have sent private message to one of your channels. Its up to you now if you want to free training in Teams.

Dear Lisa, kindly check the comments from the video where you did see these two mentioned things. You can find answers to your questions from there.

Both are my own design's. This white tool is something what I modelled / 3D-printed to help my selves. It does not have any commercial name and it cannot purchased from any shop. I could ship one for you, but shipping cost are quite high. Unfortunately I cannot affect shipping cost. 3D model I am not ready to share. Transparent film I made by tracing Edea and Risport boots soles from the photos using Cad software. Basically you need just two circles and line between their center point. Outlines of the sole just helps a bit to get confirmation in the center point definition. Soles shapes varies from model to model, so my sketches are not 100% duplicate from the original soles. So I do have them on digital format. These I could share in PDF format, if we find some way to get them you. One problem is that transparent films may not be available in larger sizes than A4. For adults skates A4 prints are a bit too small.

​@@Annisk8s For the white tools, i've already seen somewhere, it is to determine centre of circle.. But it turns out quite useful for determine center of sole. For the sketches, if you can share, I will be appreciate it. Anyway, thanks for your detail answer.

@@YuliusSriloka If you use search word "Center Finder" in the Aliexpress, you can find several similar tools, but not any where you would have center finders at the both ends of the ruler. V-shapes has to be mirrored. That is basically only invention in my tool. I made it when I got frustrated trying to hold two different center finders at same time and making some markings. Snyder boot gauge is meant for roller skates and gives you different result. If you have plenty of money, you can buy Blademaster tool skatingforums.com/index.php?topic=8738.0

Download link to PDF files for transparent film prints expires 1st of November 2024 filebin.net/knt14zvar8p9j0ni

@@Annisk8s hi many thanks! I end up to design and 3d print the tools.. thanks for the inspiration!

I would hope that it would be some new ingenious invention that can be accurately duplicated for each and every blade in the same way, and not just one of many examples what 100% inspection means and how blades manufacturing process does still have manual machining phases in the critical areas. Every day I dream that the world's best would be synonymous with high quality. Clearly I do have wrong expectations when users seem to be happy what they get. Am I over engineering?

Great question from @KP-zd3hc related to the drag pick positioning!!! I believe Matrix Legacy was 9.5". I have recorded these videos 2021, so it´s hard to remember or find evidences of these specific Matrix blades size, when I have several hundreds of pictures from the skate blades. Drack pick position compared to the end of toe plate is not same in Matrix and Pattern 99. Pattern 99 drag pick seems to be more further than in Matrix, even video gives opposite impression. You are the first person ever whom has asked me about the drack pick positioning compared to the toe plate end. I really appreciate this. Most likely you do have also understanding why some blades are mounted 3-5 mm backwards from the shoe tip, like I did show in one of my videos. I have documented these specific blades drack pick position differences very clearly 2021 , but it seems I have forgot to include that picture in to this video. Alternatively I have chosen not to publish that information in that time. As said, it´s hard to remember everything so clearly after 3 years. But as I said earlier, I do have nice photo where these blades drack pick positions are compered with two different ways.

@@Annisk8s thank you so much. :) I asked because I was forced to go down a blade length due to using Risport boots that require a smaller blade. I use the Legacy blades because my feet are so used to 8’rockers, but I am so annoyed that the drag pick is now so much closer. I’m looking into the Pattern 99 now, thank you!

@KP-zd3hc Are you sure you will get 8´ rocker when you buy P99 blades? I would not. JW seems to have couple manual grinding phases in their manufacturing process and this leads to changes in their profiles. However you mentioned that drag pick positioning is now the main pain point. I will try to find some way to show you the difference your are interested.

@ziadkhedr4244. This is something what I made by my selves. First made 3D model and then I printed it with 3D printer. Unfortunately tool is less or more blade specific and rounds the edge quite easily. As it uses sand paper, and papers thickness also vary, it cause some problems. I have never used it to any skater blades. I have used it to study if hollow polishing is possible without rounding the edge. If you are living in Europe and are interested to test it, we may find some solution for it.

I am happy to see that someone sees my videos to be interesting. Wheel balancing is very slow process and requires patient. I tried 3D-printed wheel balancing washer where I have three screws in the T-slot. Idea I copied from the commercial versions of wheel balancers meant for larger wheels. You can see one commercial versio of the balancing washer in @Clough42 video. I am not sure why same idea was not working in 3" wheels I use. I still use hot glue to make fine balancing. You need to note that wheel balance changes all the time you use it. Typically you need to reduce weight when wheel diameter reduces. I can post video where I balance one wheel, but I can already tell that its boring to watch :D

@@Annisk8s thank you! I would definitely watch it and would not find it boring. Do you rebalance the wheel after every time you re-dress it?

@@kylehicks7130 I will post the balancing video, but it takes some time before I have time to do it. Summer is so short in here and I do have plenty of things to do. I do dress my wheel minimum 3 times per one skate. Rebalancing the wheel even after every skate pair would be overkilling. I rebalance the wheel approx. after 10-15 pairs of skates.

Unfortunately this seems to be more and more common issue in brand new Wilson blades. It is not catastrophic when its close to the toe picks and if you have cross grinder, but still I would not like to see that in new blades. I do never see same issue in factory new Ultima blades. Wilson seems still to use lots of manual work in their manufacturing processes. Example NSZ lengths may vary quite a lot between the blade pairs and even between right and left blade. I agree that more further from the toe picks the flat spot exist, more severe it is. Usually I see these badly destroyed spinning rockers in the blades which has been sharpened several times with Prosharp machine.

Try to use following search words in the Google picture search => BEVEL EDGE SQUARES, ADJUSTABLE DIN 875/0

@@Annisk8s thank you!

The blade and boot is brand new so it was chosen to be like this. It is some kind of trend that people want shorter blades than in the past. Reason why blades are mounted 4-5mm from tip relates to Gold Seals toe pick positioning. In Gold Seals drag pick is further than toe plate.

@wallyhell5834 If the blade is not straight, it will lead most likely to uneven edges when blade is sharpened. In the other words, when sharpening machine axis travels straight and blade isn't straight, hollow will not come in to the middle of blade. You may get some spot where edges are in level, but its not enough. Sharpening machines skate carriage may straighten a bit the blade, but you should not trust this too much. Another possible problem is that the skate will turn in the direction the blade is bent and therefore you may have difficulties especially with one foot glides.

Well I mounted mine myself because I keep changing boots and blades and it gets expensive and I need to fix the right one. Nothing is right. The problem is, the nails tacking the sole on to the boot are right where I need to drill holes for the screws. It’s a huge problem.

Its designed for engineering. You can find more information about this square by reading comments from the video ua-cam.com/video/DbrR3hBtm70/v-deo.html

@issacasimov I have tried Blademaster BW3 (Norton 66261019852) buffing wheels which are thinner. They have some amount of thickness variation and axial runout which lead to edge rounding. If you have exact proposal of wheel type what to test, I can try that. Problem in 3000 grit wheel would be that it would spin too fast. It would require also constant liquid cooling to prevent grinding wheel clogging. I have tried ones wheels which were custom made with correct radius, but they were not working at all. They just "jumped" on the blade and basically didn't cut anything and it cause terrible noise!

I know the Brian's machine. I have been in his seminar and we have talked about his machine several times. I was even considering to buy machine from him, but the problem is that his machine works with compressed air. I do not have any changes to have compressor which would have enough high capacity. Even I would, system would not be very portable. As you can see from the video, you can purchase IE with follower roller. You can buy also patterns with 7, 8, 9, 10 and 11 foots radiuses. You need then also IE hockey carriage. I have tried to use those couple times, but positioning blade to patterns is real nightmare. Brian told me that he has position method which takes just few minutes. I would like to see how does he make it, but it is still his business secret. Purpose of this video was demonstrate to the audience that follower should be in the middle of wheel, not in side like in IE. My plan is make modifications with 3D printer so that I can have better follower. This was also test if I can print grinding patterns with blade profiles. In the video you can see Gold Seal profile. I am confident that printed pattern can restore profile more closer to the original when blades does have erosion from the normal handheld power grinding.

@@Annisk8s I agreed, the following wheel should be right at the centre like Brian's. . I have been experimenting CNC profiling and maybe even laser polishing/sharpening method.

I use IE and Pro-Sharp automatic machine myself. Pro-Sharp maintain profile quite well, occasionally I use IE to do fine finishes .

@gerardmarc5926 J'ai fabriqué près de 10 pièces d'outils de polissage très similaires avec des diamètres de cylindre différents. J'ai réduit le diamètre par pas d'environ 2 à 3 mm, mais ils ont quand même arrondi le bord. Les cylindres imprimés n'ont pas de remplissage à 100 %, donc je ne sais pas s'ils sont trop mous, ont-ils trop d'écart de rondeur, se déplacent-ils de manière non parallèle sur la rainure ou est-ce la poussière de meulage qui arrondit le bord. Il serait plus facile de résoudre le problème si je savais ce qui cause cet arrondi des bords. Votre idée de faire un cylindre ovale est intéressante, mais ne serait-ce pas fondamentalement la même chose si je réduisais le diamètre du cylindre? I have made close to 10 piece of very similar polishing tool with different cylinder diameters. I did reduce the diamater apporox 2-3mm steps, but still they did round the edge. Printed cylinders does not have 100% infill so I am not sure if they are too soft, do they have too much roundness deviation, do they travel unparallel on groove or is it the grinding dust which round the edge. It would be easier to solve the problem if I would know what causes this edge rounding. Your idea to make oval cylinder is interesting, but wouldnt it be basically same thing is I reduce the diameter of cylinder?

At the moment I do not see any working solution to make hollow polishing with power grinder. That is why I have tried test / develop Pro-filer type of hand polishing tool. As soon I have managed to recover my computer, which operating system crashed, I will publish new video about this procedure.

I believe it is easier to get good surface finish with larger wheel. This because the circumferential length of the wheel is longer which provides higher cutting speed. I would use larger wheel machine if blades would not have toe picks. Toe picks causes lots of troubles for large wheel machine operators and that leads often remarkably faster spinning rocker erosion. My Incredible Edger is spinning 20% slower that what it would spin in US. This because we have 50Hz frequency and in US it would be 60Hz. In some day I will put frequency converter to my IE so that I can increase speed to match 60Hz and even above of that. I would like to compensate wheel diameter reduction, just like some Blademaster machines do. One issue in large wheel machines is, that its more difficult to find fine grit wheels. However grit size does not always tell how good surface finish you will get. You can impact quite a lot to surface finish by dressing wheel differently and making sure that your diamond quill cuts nicely (without vibrations). If not, rotate diamond slightly and it usually helps. Rotating the diamond quill in some Blademasters is not anyhow possible.

I am using Incredible Edger. In this video you see their figure skate carriage. That I use in traditional steel blades as well as in aluminum framed blades, like Matrix and Paramount. In JW revolution blades I need to use IE hockey carriage. www.iceskateology.com/Skateology/Price_List.html I do like precision and that is why I am using adjustable precision square. Try to use following search words and search pictures => BEVEL EDGE SQUARES, ADJUSTABLE DIN 875/0 Wissota is otherways nice machine, but I do not like its large wheel size. It increases risk to destroy spinning rocker in the way what you can see in some of my videos. However lots of skate techs are using large wheel machines. Small wheel machines has their own weaknesses, but I still not would change back to large wheel machine.

@@Annisk8sthanks for all the info, it’s really appreciated :)

If people would look their blades, they would probably realize that the skate tech what they have keps professional, is not nessessary so professional. Unfortunate many figure skate shops are making terrible sharpenings.

I can understand your writings. Google translates pretty nicely. Chatter-marks are very common issue. In my opinion if affects more to gliding properties than how sharp edges feels. You can get razor sharp edges by using coarse grit wheel on machine, by dressing wheel with fast movement, using coarse hand hone for deburring and tilting the hand hone more than needed in the deburring phase. With my experience skaters does not like razor sharp edges, because skates feels even too sharp in the beginning and you need skate longer before the edges feels normal again. My target is that skates feels "normal" right after the sharpening. Imagine that you should sharpen blades day before competitions. Can you do it, if skates requires one week running in period? Even I have not seen either of the sharpening s you mention, I am confident that you are doing better job than any other sharpener in France. You are interested about technical things and you try to develop your selves and your methods all the time. That it what I appreciate!

Thank you Marc for your kind words! I don't think I'm the best in the world. My secret is that I'm willing to spend more time sharpening s and development than the pros. Just like you. A very important characteristic of a good sharpener is that you are more interested about the quality than in making skates with as little effort as possible. There is always something what could be improved in your own work and that is what motivates me. You are never the world best, because everyone has their own weaknesses / limitations. If I would like to be closer to world best title, I should grind blades using pattern and polish the hollows to mirror finish. They are still on my development to-do-list. Since I've never even skated on figure skates, my opinions are based on measurements or something what I can visually or audibly witness. What I bring up is the opposite of many other videos where they mostly hype something they don't even understand. Maybe I'm a hardened pessimist, but I feel like I only see problems. How much these problems that I bring up affect skating, everyone has to judge for themselves.

I used 3D-printed tool, which is my own design for the polishing. So I didn't use power grinder for polishing. My tool should not touch the edge in the way that it rounds the edge, but still it happens. I do not fully understand why.

Maybe tape the edge with like Kapton tape

I think tape will not help, but I can try that also@@issacasimov

Today I tried proposed tape trick. Not with Kapton tape, just with normal office tape. It helped a bit, but did not prevent edge rounding. @@issacasimov

I do not know the exact root cause for the weight difference, but I would claim that differences in the touch point lengths might be one reason. Probably there are other reasons too. 2 grams difference sounds very very small, but when you see that it means weight of three nuts, at least I started to wonder where this all material is missing. Based on the rumors JW has invested to new production equipment's. If so, they seems to still grind profiles hand held, which cause inconsistent to the tough point lengths. Also chrome removal is still something what I would hope to be different. Alternatively these blades were some old stock items.

@@Annisk8s I have the old pair ca lite and recently received a new pair. I can compare them later. I noticed the weld has improved. IMO the SS blade with chassis seems to have better QC consistency. I haven’t mastered sharpening SS blades.

I assume your method is very similar than what Precision blade honing enterprises promotes. I just do not understand how or where you use the magnet. Do you use some BAT gauge which has holes as "a scale"? In PBHE method you need to ensure that hollow is ground in to the middle of blade. Factory grinding are typically heavily uneven, which may lead to faulty conclusions.

This video was related to another UA-cam video where the guy was explaining how he positions blade by eye balling insole. I can understand inconsistency in the boots, which means that the outer sole is not either 100% reliable datum, but I do not fully understand how you can eye ball blade in to the middle of the insole. At least I do not have X-ray vision. Maybe the problem is just in my English skills? I use always outer sole center point as a starting point for the blade positioning. No matter what method is used to position the blade, each skater foots are unique. It is also so that not so many skater are able to tell if the blade is position correctly or not. There are also several other problems in the blade´s mounting and that is why this task is not my favorite things.

I also used vertical laser to check alignment. Again chorus QC is hit or miss. Ice Fly and Piano are much better.

I have tried Dremel type of tool, but at least my hands were not enough steady. This kind of 3D printed support could help. cults3d.com/en/3d-model/tool/diy-ice-skate-shaper

I will try that, maybe add tape to the side for thickness adjustment, thank you

What was the most shocking part of this video? :)

That is good way of working. However kids forget our advice's pretty soon :)

I have seen worst, 2mm deep 😅

Unfortunately Blademaster has not replied to my email where I asked their advice's how to use 3BW buffing wheels. I have some problems to understand in detail how they have planned these to be used. Do they example deliver shims together with their machines to compensate width difference, etc.

Did you get any answers from them?

Do you ever see similar blades?

Its possible that Prosharp has been used for these skates. Most likely they have seen couple different machines. Nevertheless, machine is not the root cause for uneven edges or several starting points.

I agree that John Wilson quality has gone down over the years. It´s a pity when they are so popular. May I ask if your opinion related to harder metal is based on visual judgement (color), measurements or something else?

No, these are not parabolic blades. They are tapered and side honed, just like normal Gold Seal´s.

You are welcome!

​@Annisk8s which ypu will recommend and which one is better currently please?😊

Chatter marks which has come from the poor sharpening, which was not even requested. Blades were purchased without sharpening, but they were still sharpened. This Skate-tech seems not to care at all the quality and she does not seems to know how the machine should be operated correctly. I would assume poor grinding causes at least friction and therefore poor gliding properties. Imagine that this skate blade would be old school shaving knife where one side of the blade is honed with very fine grit stone and lapped with leather belt and another side is just grind with angle grinder.

Using diamond paste or some polishing waxes seems to round the edges. Buffing wheel alone seems to keep edges sharpness in acceptable level, but I need to get skaters feedback before being sure about this. Of course this depend also how many passes you make. I would like to test Blademaster buffing wheels, but I believe they are sold only in 6 pc sets so its quite expensive test. Regular white buffing wheels in local stores cost 3-4 € per piece which is 10 times lower than Blademaster prices. I will practice first with these cheaper wheels.

@@Annisk8s I think the solution is using a thinner felt wheel , like 3mm thickness with polishing wax. Regular felt wheel won’t stay in shape, need support frame.