Відео

She's a video game character using models from 2008.

@@mmaldonadoofficial the non-stop twirlage

A 10 frame jab is equally as unreactable as a 3 frame jab. So no, not everything. The difference between speeds of fighting games does not have the implications most people think. What happens most often is the quality of decisions decreases as speed increases. In the Tekken community, people memorize each move that is -10, each move that is -11, each move that is -12, each move that is -13, etc. because they have more time to react to the situation and come up with the most optimal punish for that move. The game becomes very tech-based, and game knowledge contributes heavily to your success rate. In the KoF community, those numbers exist, and they do matter - there's value in memorizing which moves are -4 and which moves are -5 and which moves are -6, etc. but that's not what people focus on because it's not really feasible to optimize every single punish. Part of it is because most characters don't get significantly better punishes at each frame interval - even in Tekken, there are characters that skip -12 punishment entirely, and use their -11 punish against both -11 and -12 moves. Part of it is because, even if a character does get a better punish at the next frame interval, the difference in reward is insubstantial. In Tekken, the difference between a -13 and -15 punish is unbelievably high. That dynamic doesn't exist in KoF - a 5-frame close heavy punch is your best punish in most cases, and most characters get the same combo from their 3-frame jab anyway, so people just always use their 3-frame jab - because the developers didn't choose to take that route. Part of it is the input leniency. Tekken has a billion years of input buffer, and KoF XV only has a few frames. KoF XIII has zero. So KoF players value the consistency of using their fastest attacks to punish and frame trap and perform link combos because it's physically more difficult to optimize that way. But the largest part of it is the mental stack. If a game is fast, it's not reasonable to have your frame-perfect punish ready every time - or, if you do have your punishes perfect, then the rest of your gameplan is stale and breachable because you're so focused on that one thing. In Tekken, there's not really that much to react to other than Block- and Whiff-Punishment. In KoF, you have so much more... but this response is already too lengthy. Hopefully this answers your question.

@@Moqlnkn Thank you, as always! Oh! One more question! Do you think there might be a way to extract frame date from fighting games released on consoles ??? I would love to have frame data for all Tekkens, SoulCalibur & all? Do you think it's possible to make mods for KOF XIII PC to show hitboxes & frame counter & frame data? Would love that to have for the GOG version ...

@@sneharashmi7553 Everything on PC is "possible," yes. I'm currently working on an old Wii fighting game using the Dolphin emulator, trying to list all the frame data by inputting things one frame at a time. It takes a whole day to confirm one character's data using this method, but it's basically guaranteed to be accurate, and doesn't require any knowledge of how the game is coded. It's also theoretically possible to dig into the game's code and find the place where it stores a character's attack data, and generate a frame data chart based on the data. The problem with that is we don't have the SOURCE code - what the developers actually typed out - because it's all been COMPILED into machine code for the sake of speed. For example, there's no reason for the console to know the names of variables - it only needs to know what the variables do - so just looking at the code of a game, as it is given to us, will not be readable, because all of the variables will be unnamed. In general, trying to sort through compiled code by hand is a mess. Finally, it's also theoretically possible to DECOMPILE a game. They recently did this with Ocarina of Time. The process of decompiling is taking the code of the game, actually sifting through all the unreadable crap, and re-writing the source code from scratch. Chances are, you'll pick different variable names from what they were originally, but that doesn't matter - it'll be as readable and understandable as you make it. Getting a game to this state is amazing because it makes the game modifiable as if you were the game developer. For example, in Ocarina of Time, we now have "Ship of Harkinian" which lets the game run any framerate, built-in item randomization, Link's tunic color randomization, music randomization, importing new models and music, bug fixes, and more. So yes, getting frame data / hitbox viewer is "possible" in any game, as long as you can play it on a PC. Every game is different, though, and will require a different level of work to get to that point. If the developers have a variable for toggling on and off hitboxes, but it was never supposed to be accessed by us, then all we need to do is dig through the code and find that one variable. If they didn't use that variable, then we'd need to construct hitbox display ourselves, which means we'd also need to find hitboxes, distinguish them from other boxes, and learn how to render things in the game on top of everything else, and probably more. Modding consoles is possible but a lot different. I currently don't even own a console, so I don't know the current state of console modding, for consoles that don't have PC emulators yet.

@@Moqlnkn Thank You for the elaborate response! What motivates you though, clearing doubts of knowledge seekers like us ???

@@sneharashmi7553 I like doing it. Explaining why I like doing it is impossible.

As far as I know, it's just used for cancels. For example, she can do two standing heavy punches in a row by doing: heavy punch > pull out the stick > put away the stick > heavy punch

She laughed when I read this to her.

@@Moqlnkn 😁

That's because KoF XIV is absolute garbage at a high level. Everyone either moved back to XIII or moved up to XV.

@@Moqlnkn i can't even say i disagree because i remember watching those matches... benimaru 2b2b max mode, shun-ei was a pest etc.

I disagree. At the top level, it's still about having better execution than your opponent, and, in most cases, it's about limiting your opponent's options, reducing the importance of adaptation even more. In the most extreme example, you have Tech Chasing. If you aren't good enough to Tech Chase on reaction, you have to adapt to the opponent's tech options. If you are good enough, you don't have to adapt anymore - you just react. There's a difference between a "guess" (rotating through options" and a "read" (adapting to the opponent). My website goes into more details regarding this difference.

@@Moqlnkn I understand the difference between a guess and a read, and Melee is read heavy game because of the power both players have in the 2 way mixup is immense and make them *extremely* complex and layered :P when it comes to things like tech chasing, thats was kind of my point about character choice, and kind of the origin of 20XX, some characters are more powerful with better hands, But Fox, being the poster boy for that style of play, is actually considerably weaker in the current meta, much more so than years past, And Yoshi, an Extremely read heavy character because of the way double jump armor and parry work is performing extremely well right now, better than ever. Melee is an extremely dynamic system and actually supports both styles of play. Also, I just am not convinced its that true that "better hands" have *that* much of an advantage ,they have some, but like, its kind of a meme that there is an army of "net play species" that have amazing tech skill, but still kind of suck because they arn't good at the "thinking" part of the game. I'm not saying you should like Melee, especially if you don't really enjoy the execution aspect(because that is really important) but generally I think your wrong about how important execution actually is to winning and I'm not even talking about like, top 100 level of play, but even like just "good".

@@Thepryomaniac It's impossible for a 2-way mixup to be "complex and layered."

@@Moqlnkn sorry I meant 2ways as in, 1way is the attacker, and the other way is the defender as opposed to the binary of success fail(baiting a DP/shimmy/meaty/frame trap/tick throw/ect) in normal 2d games(most of the time) in melee both players interact multiple times before things return to neutral. Its also continuous is most cases meaning that the mix up continues even after one player gets hit, an example being am I going to DI left or right or for survival or to try and tech, or out to try and end the combo but give up screen position, and you make this decision every hit of the "combo", and there could be *way* more options, which can create many many layers based on what each players wants/habits. and Neutral/oki/advantaged interactions can all be equally complex. Not two ways as in high/low or Strike/throw.

@@Thepryomaniac That is 90% of the King of Fighters XIII.

You should read the title of my most recent video. Also, I love stupid comments - it gives me even more content, like my most recent video.

That's irrelevant to what I'm talking about.

Elaborate

@@zazenbo I never claim that I have to focus on execution during the match. Your argument is that you develop muscle memory, which lets you focus on things outside of execution during the match. My claim is regarding the importance of particular types of skills. Imagine a low-level player who is pretty bad at everything. Now, duplicate that person so you have two identical players. You tell one of the players to spend a week practicing execution. You tell the other player to spend a week learning how to adapt to his opponent. If those players fight, the one who practiced execution will win. That is how Melee is balanced.

I play a very defensive Falcon, mostly evading players that use a lot of tech, and using good shields and rolls to net me openings. I can't compete with the Foxes that go 200mph. But I can still win the games because I know my punishes for those characters. I may tank a lot of damage (I even see being waveshined up to 40% as an unblockable of sorts because my SDI is bad) but my ability to take center stage and keep it is often better than those that are trying too hard to execute too much tech. In a way, I play "lame." But again, I come from Tekken, specifically Tekken 7 where avoiding the opponent and waiting for whiffs was the name of the game (or conditioning whiffs, even) I do see where you're coming from. I get that players that focus on tech will be ahead in the game. But having good movement and fundamentals can and will beat out too much tech, if the player has patience. If I just sit and go "alright, I'm being rushed down." and hold strong, I can reversal my opponent. I can condition them to jump in. I can condition them to follow me to ledge. I can bait out their short hops. If I begin overshooting my aerials, I can bait out their options and land a grab. It's possible. When I came into the game, I saw Falco and Fox as being unfair in neutral (and they are,) but it is possible to just obliterate someone that out-techs you. Every time. They'll get mad that they're getting beaten too. I do see where you're coming from. The game is contingent upon knowing a baseline of tech in order to play neutral. Its skill floor for being able to compete at all is fairly high. But once you reach a small amount of tech, you truly can start to play the game, as long as you don't try to play in a way that doesn't suit your execution abilities. You know? Hopefully, I'm making sense. I think you have a fair point too.

@@zazenbo "Movement and fundamentals" are not adaptation. I ALSO don't want to win a game because I'm better at movement than my opponent.

There's nothing stopping you from playing other players except yourself... and the lack of other players. Worst case scenario, you lose horribly, your opponent leaves after one match, and you have one replay to analyze.

mmm you didnt watch the video did you

I don't play this game at all. King of Fighters is 100x more competitively viable. The only reason I'm not playing it is because there's no one else to play, and this game is ironically the closest. I played Melee around 2010ish, when i was 12ish, because it was better than Brawl. Then I went to Street Fighter 4 in 2012ish and never looked back. Then I went to KoF 13 in 2013ish and never looked back. It annoys me how much your win rate will improve based on your input execution in this game. I want to win because I adapt to my opponent's choices, not because I can do pivots and ledge dashes and dashbacks and waveshines faster than he can.

@@Moqlnkn It's true that there is a non-trivial technical barrier to being able to play at even a "novice" level of Melee by focusing on adapting to your opponent vs many other fighting games, but considering I picked it up as my first fighting game ever at age 35 and got good enough to not have to really focus on execution of basic skills like wd, db, and dashdance-jc grab after a couple months or so of practicing it, I think you're overstating the technical difficulty and importance of the game's mechanics. Especially in the gameplay you posted, your opponent didn't seem to be outplaying you technically and didn't require anything you seem incapable of doing to beat handily. I won't try to debate which game is more competitively viable than which, especially since I've never played a traditional fighting game competitively, but I think the 25-year track record of this installment in the smash series makes it hard to argue that any other individual game (not franchise) is more competitively viable than Melee. How many entries in such franchises have enjoyed similar success for that long? Anyway, you obviously don't have to take my advice or try to get better at Melee or anything. I just noticed what I thought were some easy things to do which don't require much technical skill to execute (like run-up shield to punish his fsmashes) and which would have helped you a lot in your match. I like articulating evaluations of MUs because, if nothing else, it helps _me_ improve my neutral game and understanding of my mistakes. I hope you don't think I'm trying to be mean by giving constructive criticism of your gameplay or anything, and you don't need to justify your level of technical ability. It's obvious that you haven't spent a great deal of time grinding tech skill, and that's perfectly understandable if you don't care much about getting better. Again, that's why my suggestions were all based on things that you can either already do, or learn to do in an afternoon at most.

@@Moqlnkn PS: There is a player named Borp who famously never did any tech skill and did quite well with that considered in his state's scene. He definitely couldn't win a major tournament, but he could certainly kick my butt considering he didn't get completely bodied playing Toph (a previous top 100 player). It's definitely a game of brains over skill generally-speaking.

@@Moqlnkn holy shit this is the biggest cope post ive seen on youtube in a decade. I was onboard with the video and vibe until I read this shit. You were "shocked" at your winrate improving alongside your improved input exectuion? Yeah no fucking shit, "I noticed i won more races when i went faster then the other cars" Your point about not being able to "adapt" to an opponent with mindgames over technical skill is quite possible the most objectivly insane thing ive ever heard. While technical skill is obviously big in melee, it WITHOUT QUESTION offers more ways to mentally destroy your opponent then any other fighting game in history, and its not even close. I grew up playing kof so I understand the love, but to say "Kof is more competativly viable" really just sounds like you got your shit pushed in, then did that thing we all do where we say "yeah you won.. but if we were playing xxxxx game im better at then id show you!" Plus like "never looking back" from street fighter 4 means anything. IF you went traditional 2d and never looked back, then why the hell are you playing this? Is it because it has interesting quirks some other games are lacking? If the game isent up your alley, then dont torture yourself. Judging by this video, you are a fairly newish player, which is great, more power to you. But somebody who is as well travelled in the fgc as you should have easily been able to see your issues are a result of your own lack of experience, not some inherent design problem

@@theremix54 I was trying to be nice, but ngl I kinda felt the same as you with the response I got to my extremely benign input.

No. They're just fun challenges/puzzles. Only a select few trials are actually close to optimal.

you get a taste of the character inputs but ya, the combos are pretty gross for actual combos, 8Sin-Am has very great KOF13 tutorials here on youtube for most of the cast!

Thanks.

It's not very different at all, but it's more different than the previous game any other Tekken has been.

@@Moqlnkn Thank You!

@@peterramos5128 I don't know move names, so I will assume you mean 214P 236P j1236982P. The shortcut is to delay the super and button hold. The timing is a bit later than it feels like it should be.

@@Moqlnkn yes the air grab super

That's a lot of opinions without a lot of facts.

I agree. SF6 wakeup is the same as SF5 wakeup, but with Drive Reversal after the patch. It's a universal problem across all Street Fighters - throws are too strong, but, instead of giving people invincibility to throws on wakeup, they just make throws knock you far away so there is no mixup after. It shows a fundamental design philosphy, which is they want people to guess between 3 options on wakeup, but not over and over again.

@@Moqlnkn 6 has throw loops though, which I think is worse than late SFV's throw system, and the main reason why oki is too strong. I think SF should prioritize neutral play over looping oki, as it is much more interesting than essentially weighted coin flips. Also 3s had wakeup throw invincibility, long enough that mash would beat meaty throw, so it's not unheard of for the SF series.

@@beam5655 Again, the problem is not that there isn't enough neutral - the problem is that the mixups are boring. Instead of fixing the mixups, they avoid the mixups. The problem with 3rd Strike is that it only gave throw invincibility on wakeup. It needs to be after any state the opponent's attacks can force upon you, including hitstun and blockstun. Also, SGGK just beats everything, so the throw invincibility on wakeup didn't matter anyway.

2XKO seems to be the best fighting game with true assists. But it has a lot of problems.

charge db > uf P > K This one is more precise on the timing, and harder for me, but might be easier if your left hand is holding you back.

@@RafaelVolcanes it's bad game design, not "different" game design. Keep commenting, though - I love when people try to defend desynced player inputs.

lol this is the longest bait comment I've ever seen

My parents definitely have never heard of Tekken, but they bought me both Smash Bros. Melee and Brawl as a kid.

@@Moqlnkn my parents were and both still are real traditional gamers who were teens in the 90’s so they definitely know more of a tekken street fighter or a mortal kombat than a smash bros. We’re in a new age with people who play video games raised by people who play video games so this ain’t like the old days.

This aint dong dong never die

my website > street fighter x tekken > basics > getting the game

@@Moqlnkn much appreciated

tekken deez?

I double tap a lot. It's a KoF habit that comes in very handy.

Yes, although the official term is "Ohio," which is a country, not a city.

Oops, I meant Ohio the continent, not the country.