Some of my favourite time raiding in WoW was TBC where there was no WA and DBM handholding. My guild was also competing for server firsts and we were working the fights out from start to finish through our own effforts, there wasn't any source to watch kill videos or read a guide, it was mechanic by mechanic, trial and error until the boss died and damn was it rewarding to get the kill.
The only thing this story says about the game is that Blizzard should have started restricting addon makers a long time ago. Because it's an endless race in which developers are forced to come up with perverted game mechanics to create a challenge for addon users.
They overcomplicate the game, and design it around addons. Preminition for priest is a very very fine example. he's totally out of touch (ion) Adding countless mechanics which have no way of tracking them and expecting people to not use addons wont' work.
I main tanked a semi serious guild from Legion through the first half of slands and I would bet money I spent way more time refining and tweaking addons\ui than I did actually playing the game. Addons need to be reigned in.
I did mythic archimonde when it was current and that was too much in regards to WA. I've since quit mythic raiding, but that was just too much and its only gotten so much worse since.
I remember there was some raid fights either at the end of MOP or maybe WOD where the addons would know your exact x, y and z coordinates in the world space and which direction you were facing such that they could project graphics on your screen that would allow you to direct certain mechanics in precise directions and coordinate those movements with several other players also getting those mechanics. That ability to know precise coordinates and facing direction was quickly removed once Blizzard became aware of the extent that these addons were going to trivialise mechanics.
I would LOVE regular game to have weak auras settings. We have procs. Some classes, some specs has natural procs popping up. Others no. Why? Isn't relevant? I'm supposed to not track a bonus? So make it a damn lazy passive and we move on.
bad take, those mechanics were designed in mind with wa's existing thats why they needed to be solved in that short amount of times instead of giving people larger amount of time to solve it with communication, we are not cutting around the corner or cheesing anything when doing them. anyways its a good change i dont want to progress wa's either but no need to guilt trip people
I love wow. I love FF14 but the difference Is I can do savage diffculty in FF14 with no addons no need forit because The bosses are well timed and gives you fair warning if you choose to go for that one more spell with out moving and getting out the way or doing the mech you will die. Wow has poor design when it comes to mech, they give little to no warning without an addon. They pop super quick and if you are out of place you will die. And from the player point of view it looks like they just died from unavoidable damage, which wow raids seem to always have instead of ya know giving the classes they make time to heal people. So instead of something killling you flat out it take you to a percentage of health if the healer isn't on their job then you party will wipe. Just seems like alot of their bosses you are fighting poor design then the actual boss.
WA aren't the problem, the problem is Blizzard making encounters around the top 1% of players. No fight should have more than 2 or 3 mechanics. If the best players can do it first night, who cares, the game isn't made for just them. E Sports and MMO's don't mix, never have, never will. WA's don't get around mechanics, they help sort out the 5 and 6 mechanics going off all at once. The game has become too complex. Their proposed solutions just make the problem worse, RNG should never be a factor in getting a kill.
I disagree. Ion clearly stated they actually have to make the game more complex because of the weakauras. WA's do get around mechanics ie: Among us phase and egg breaks.
I completely disagree with you. Just see how ffxiv does. No need to external addon for mechanics, they make the design clear how the fight should go. I believe wow designers did say they are working more on that and i agree they are. This last raid was the least addon required. Heck i havent used one WA for the raid. The mechanics were clear.
@@midnyte_tv i wouldnt say bosses with 2 - 3 mechanics are great but its true that retail is just overloaded with spells, efects and shit all over the place that you cant even play the game without addons like WA. the World First Event at the start of new content is one one the best events happening and when its over in like 2 hours it isnt enjoyable or profitable in the long run. i stopped playing retail with sylvanas in shadowlands and played classic up to cata right now but when i see retail wow now i feel like im 20 years older and i just dont enjoy it anymore. i transform into a 50 years old dad.
The encounters were always about the 1%. Less than 2% off guilds that set foot in OG Naxxramas killed The Lich King before TBC came out. You could do OG Naxx without weak auras and the content was still hard. What we have now is an arms race between DBM/Weak auras providing ever more refined hand-holding and designers making fights more complicated to make the handholding harder to do.
@@Weezarvil FFXIV does it the wrong way imo. FFXIV fights have almost no RNG elements. It's about memorising a bunch of movements by rote until you beat the fight. Good fights should require some quick thinking and adaption, but not so much randomisation that it's out of the players control as to whether they win or lose.
I don't use weak auras, never have. Raiding has become a bloated dance. I guess if that is your thing then cool but it's stale and boring. This isn't Eve screw the spread sheets.
Lol I made about 60+ weak auras for wow classic, even recreated gladiatorlossa2 with weakauras for classic haha 😂 so yeah it does kind of break the game, haven't played since 2020 for classic and 2016 for retail
Some of my favourite time raiding in WoW was TBC where there was no WA and DBM handholding. My guild was also competing for server firsts and we were working the fights out from start to finish through our own effforts, there wasn't any source to watch kill videos or read a guide, it was mechanic by mechanic, trial and error until the boss died and damn was it rewarding to get the kill.
Making my own weak auras are honestly some of my best memories in this game. Which honestly says a lot about the game itself...
The only thing this story says about the game is that Blizzard should have started restricting addon makers a long time ago. Because it's an endless race in which developers are forced to come up with perverted game mechanics to create a challenge for addon users.
They overcomplicate the game, and design it around addons.
Preminition for priest is a very very fine example.
he's totally out of touch (ion) Adding countless mechanics which have no way of tracking them and expecting people to not use
addons wont' work.
Yea this is beyond ridiculous.
More often than not we're fighting the mechanics, not the boss lol.
I main tanked a semi serious guild from Legion through the first half of slands and I would bet money I spent way more time refining and tweaking addons\ui than I did actually playing the game.
Addons need to be reigned in.
I did mythic archimonde when it was current and that was too much in regards to WA. I've since quit mythic raiding, but that was just too much and its only gotten so much worse since.
didnt they "Nerf" WA back in the day because of archimonde 😆?
@@fatkonis2943not that I recall
I remember there was some raid fights either at the end of MOP or maybe WOD where the addons would know your exact x, y and z coordinates in the world space and which direction you were facing such that they could project graphics on your screen that would allow you to direct certain mechanics in precise directions and coordinate those movements with several other players also getting those mechanics. That ability to know precise coordinates and facing direction was quickly removed once Blizzard became aware of the extent that these addons were going to trivialise mechanics.
@@MrGryph78 You may be talking about AVR which was around during ICC.
I would LOVE regular game to have weak auras settings. We have procs. Some classes, some specs has natural procs popping up. Others no. Why? Isn't relevant? I'm supposed to not track a bonus? So make it a damn lazy passive and we move on.
bad take, those mechanics were designed in mind with wa's existing thats why they needed to be solved in that short amount of times instead of giving people larger amount of time to solve it with communication, we are not cutting around the corner or cheesing anything when doing them. anyways its a good change i dont want to progress wa's either but no need to guilt trip people
First you need to adjust specs not 100% relying on having wa like frost mage or enha shaman and so on. 60IQ dev.
Skill issue, l2p 4head
Relying? Lmfao the disconnect is real
Trash addon need to go
I love wow. I love FF14 but the difference Is I can do savage diffculty in FF14 with no addons no need forit because The bosses are well timed and gives you fair warning if you choose to go for that one more spell with out moving and getting out the way or doing the mech you will die. Wow has poor design when it comes to mech, they give little to no warning without an addon. They pop super quick and if you are out of place you will die. And from the player point of view it looks like they just died from unavoidable damage, which wow raids seem to always have instead of ya know giving the classes they make time to heal people. So instead of something killling you flat out it take you to a percentage of health if the healer isn't on their job then you party will wipe. Just seems like alot of their bosses you are fighting poor design then the actual boss.
WA aren't the problem, the problem is Blizzard making encounters around the top 1% of players. No fight should have more than 2 or 3 mechanics. If the best players can do it first night, who cares, the game isn't made for just them. E Sports and MMO's don't mix, never have, never will. WA's don't get around mechanics, they help sort out the 5 and 6 mechanics going off all at once. The game has become too complex. Their proposed solutions just make the problem worse, RNG should never be a factor in getting a kill.
I disagree. Ion clearly stated they actually have to make the game more complex because of the weakauras. WA's do get around mechanics ie: Among us phase and egg breaks.
I completely disagree with you. Just see how ffxiv does. No need to external addon for mechanics, they make the design clear how the fight should go.
I believe wow designers did say they are working more on that and i agree they are. This last raid was the least addon required. Heck i havent used one WA for the raid. The mechanics were clear.
@@midnyte_tv i wouldnt say bosses with 2 - 3 mechanics are great but its true that retail is just overloaded with spells, efects and shit all over the place that you cant even play the game without addons like WA. the World First Event at the start of new content is one one the best events happening and when its over in like 2 hours it isnt enjoyable or profitable in the long run. i stopped playing retail with sylvanas in shadowlands and played classic up to cata right now but when i see retail wow now i feel like im 20 years older and i just dont enjoy it anymore. i transform into a 50 years old dad.
The encounters were always about the 1%. Less than 2% off guilds that set foot in OG Naxxramas killed The Lich King before TBC came out. You could do OG Naxx without weak auras and the content was still hard. What we have now is an arms race between DBM/Weak auras providing ever more refined hand-holding and designers making fights more complicated to make the handholding harder to do.
@@Weezarvil FFXIV does it the wrong way imo. FFXIV fights have almost no RNG elements. It's about memorising a bunch of movements by rote until you beat the fight. Good fights should require some quick thinking and adaption, but not so much randomisation that it's out of the players control as to whether they win or lose.
yeeeees, remove all addons pls
I don't use weak auras, never have. Raiding has become a bloated dance. I guess if that is your thing then cool but it's stale and boring. This isn't Eve screw the spread sheets.
Lol I made about 60+ weak auras for wow classic, even recreated gladiatorlossa2 with weakauras for classic haha 😂 so yeah it does kind of break the game, haven't played since 2020 for classic and 2016 for retail