Man I love this. Just discovered this channel 2 days ago and I'm on board. I've been sober for awhile now and have always struggled with the "spiritual agenda" the big book preaches. I have atheist friends with long term sobriety and I'm always drawn to them. This has given me courage to speak honestly knowing that it's going to ruffle some feathers in the meetings I go to. Thanks for this!!!!
I've been steadily losing my religion for the last 10yrs in AA. I have athiest friends in AA that have helped a lot. Not sure if I'm agnostic or athiest. I get lots of, "keep coming, you'll find a HP" stuff. I'm going in reverse, compared to many in AA- so that's interesting. I'm glad to hear other ppl's experience, especially secular/skeptic ones. I'm also extremely grateful for channels like this
I think those who encourage us to find a "higher power of our own choosing" are meaning to be helpful and inclusive, but they just don't understand that not everyone needs to think in terms of an external force that keeps them sober. Many people feel more comfortable understanding and emphasizing the practical action they can actually take to find a sober and happy life. I don't need a higher power, I don't have a higher power. There are people in my life who help me and who have helped me in the past, and there are resources I can access to help with my growth and recovery, but those things aren't defined as a higher power. I just don't use the terminology. It's not how I talk. It's someone else's language. Thanks for listening.
Katy something you brought up reminded me of this meeting . Someone in AA picked up their 20 year chip after the meeting as we were heading to our cars I had a talk with him. He said he had been a homeless heroin addict and a terrible alcoholic on the brink of death. Meetings and most importantly marijuana is what got him clean and now at 23 years sober he still is recovered from alcohol and heroin and is big on Buddhism. I do not ask him if he still smokes weed not my business. My friend 15 years on opiates got clean on weed it took her 1 year of weed to get off opiates 7 years later she is still clean from opiates and periodically does weed for anxiety. Thank you Katy for this interview.
Thanks for raising this really important point. Cannabis really helps a lot of people in so many ways and it also splits itself from the illicit drug market when regulated. Reducing demand for opiates and other drugs including alcohol among a whole new generation of young people. Aa is part of the status quo by cultural censorship of positive experiences of cannabis. Just under 50 percent of drug deaths in Scotland (Can't find source at time of writing) are people who use cannabis regularly but there seems to be no recognition of the need to provide good quality products at reasonable prices by speaking to people who are buying unreliable quality of all drugs on street in Scotland and to try and get anonomysed evaluation from people who have left 12 steps groups.
I stopped going to my aa home group at the end of last year, at least on a regular basis. So I attended maybe 20 meetings this year. Last Wednesday the topic was how do we balance church and AA. Well I spoke up and after the meeting I was told I should keep my opinions about my non belief and aa history like the wording of step 3 to myself! Oh please keep coming back but just tone it down. I am out. LifeRing, SRG zoom, stands for secular recovery group. Good interview thank you.
They told me it didnt have to be a supernatural power, but it had to be a power greater than me. So of course they said they as a group were that power. I thought, No Way. No group of people are going to direct me. I gave in. It led me to follow conflicting advices as people differered so much. I ended up in a mess of confusion. I left but relapsed over and over trying to follow them. Eventually i stopped but it was too late to construct any life due to age and other physical problems that keep me housebound very often . now live a montonous sober life depending on tv and utube to try endure it. Hopefully i wont live longer than 10 more years.
I recommend doing a lot of searching for things you can do rather than settling on watching media and decaying away unhappy. People need social interaction, even if you're only joining zoom meetings and interacting with people that way
The truth is you don't need a power greater than yourself. It may be helpful to surround yourself with people and resources to support you in your recovery goals, but you don't need to call that a "higher power." You are the one doing the work. You decide what you want you life to look like, you find the support you need to get that life, and then you do what is necessary to obtain it. Higher Power is religious terminology, quite frankly. You can define it as "other people", but it makes no sense to me to use the language at all. I learned to talk about my experience in they way that I actually talk. I had people help me. They weren't a higher power. They were friends.
Hi John because of some of your guests that led me to certain books and one I just started reading this week I could be wrong I need to do further reading. William James might have said our Higher Power is deep within our subconscious. So it does come from within. I need to be careful and do some more reading on this.
SBNR, and sometimes I am practically an atheist. Just a little spiritual and mostly pragmatic, cannot stand hearing about religion. 34 years of 12 step groups never changed me. They irritated me. People hide behind religion, they often use it as a crutch. "When God becomes a Drug" is a book these people ought to read.
Theyre so condsending if youre an atheist. Or they never invite you for coffee or include you in any chit chats after meetings. Anyone would think us atheists had a contagious disease! Lol wish it was.
Hated Lifering. One is restricted to sharing only past 7 days and intentions for future 7 days. My life was unemployment little sleep and severe arthritic pain every day. Getting to a meeting was hard enough. Id no plans to share.
Sorry to hear you hate LR I do 2 zoom meetings a week and like it. I have been attending for about 8 years. I miss the in person meetings. I hope you find something that works. Smart Recovery or secular AA and maybe Buddhist Recovery. Good luck.
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Man I love this. Just discovered this channel 2 days ago and I'm on board. I've been sober for awhile now and have always struggled with the "spiritual agenda" the big book preaches. I have atheist friends with long term sobriety and I'm always drawn to them. This has given me courage to speak honestly knowing that it's going to ruffle some feathers in the meetings I go to. Thanks for this!!!!
I've been steadily losing my religion for the last 10yrs in AA. I have athiest friends in AA that have helped a lot. Not sure if I'm agnostic or athiest. I get lots of, "keep coming, you'll find a HP" stuff. I'm going in reverse, compared to many in AA- so that's interesting. I'm glad to hear other ppl's experience, especially secular/skeptic ones. I'm also extremely grateful for channels like this
I think those who encourage us to find a "higher power of our own choosing" are meaning to be helpful and inclusive, but they just don't understand that not everyone needs to think in terms of an external force that keeps them sober. Many people feel more comfortable understanding and emphasizing the practical action they can actually take to find a sober and happy life.
I don't need a higher power, I don't have a higher power. There are people in my life who help me and who have helped me in the past, and there are resources I can access to help with my growth and recovery, but those things aren't defined as a higher power. I just don't use the terminology. It's not how I talk. It's someone else's language.
Thanks for listening.
Katy something you brought up reminded me of this meeting . Someone in AA picked up their 20 year chip after the meeting as we were heading to our cars I had a talk with him. He said he had been a homeless heroin addict and a terrible alcoholic on the brink of death. Meetings and most importantly marijuana is what got him clean and now at 23 years sober he still is recovered from alcohol and heroin and is big on Buddhism. I do not ask him if he still smokes weed not my business. My friend 15 years on opiates got clean on weed it took her 1 year of weed to get off opiates 7 years later she is still clean from opiates and periodically does weed for anxiety. Thank you Katy for this interview.
Thanks for raising this really important point. Cannabis really helps a lot of people in so many ways and it also splits itself from the illicit drug market when regulated. Reducing demand for opiates and other drugs including alcohol among a whole new generation of young people. Aa is part of the status quo by cultural censorship of positive experiences of cannabis. Just under 50 percent of drug deaths in Scotland (Can't find source at time of writing) are people who use cannabis regularly but there seems to be no recognition of the need to provide good quality products at reasonable prices by speaking to people who are buying unreliable quality of all drugs on street in Scotland and to try and get anonomysed evaluation from people who have left 12 steps groups.
I stopped going to my aa home group at the end of last year, at least on a regular basis. So I attended maybe 20 meetings this year. Last Wednesday the topic was how do we balance church and AA. Well I spoke up and after the meeting I was told I should keep my opinions about my non belief and aa history like the wording of step 3 to myself! Oh please keep coming back but just tone it down. I am out. LifeRing, SRG zoom, stands for secular recovery group. Good interview thank you.
They told me it didnt have to be a supernatural power, but it had to be a power greater than me. So of course they said they as a group were that power. I thought, No Way. No group of people are going to direct me. I gave in. It led me to follow conflicting advices as people differered so much. I ended up in a mess of confusion. I left but relapsed over and over trying to follow them. Eventually i stopped but it was too late to construct any life due to age and other physical problems that keep me housebound very often . now live a montonous sober life depending on tv and utube to try endure it. Hopefully i wont live longer than 10 more years.
I recommend doing a lot of searching for things you can do rather than settling on watching media and decaying away unhappy. People need social interaction, even if you're only joining zoom meetings and interacting with people that way
The truth is you don't need a power greater than yourself. It may be helpful to surround yourself with people and resources to support you in your recovery goals, but you don't need to call that a "higher power." You are the one doing the work. You decide what you want you life to look like, you find the support you need to get that life, and then you do what is necessary to obtain it. Higher Power is religious terminology, quite frankly. You can define it as "other people", but it makes no sense to me to use the language at all. I learned to talk about my experience in they way that I actually talk. I had people help me. They weren't a higher power. They were friends.
Hi John because of some of your guests that led me to certain books and one I just started reading this week I could be wrong I need to do further reading. William James might have said our Higher Power is deep within our subconscious. So it does come from within. I need to be careful and do some more reading on this.
SBNR, and sometimes I am practically an atheist. Just a little spiritual and mostly pragmatic, cannot stand hearing about religion. 34 years of 12 step groups never changed me. They irritated me. People hide behind religion, they often use it as a crutch. "When God becomes a Drug" is a book these people ought to read.
Theyre so condsending if youre an atheist. Or they never invite you for coffee or include you in any chit chats after meetings. Anyone would think us atheists had a contagious disease! Lol wish it was.
Hated Lifering. One is restricted to sharing only past 7 days and intentions for future 7 days. My life was unemployment little sleep and severe arthritic pain every day. Getting to a meeting was hard enough. Id no plans to share.
Sorry to hear you hate LR I do 2 zoom meetings a week and like it. I have been attending for about 8 years. I miss the in person meetings. I hope you find something that works. Smart Recovery or secular AA and maybe Buddhist Recovery. Good luck.