Amateur Radio Emergency Data Network (AREDN) Basics/Tutorial
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- Опубліковано 21 кві 2023
- AREDN is cool! It is a fast, IP-based wireless mesh network using cheap commercial components. Because it is self-organized, it is easy to use. Its initial purpose was for emergency communication, but it is also a lot of fun without an emergency.
Today, we will build our first network and connect it to the “SwissDigitalNet.” Beginners can learn what it needs, and experienced users see how we solve things.
Links:
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Access point AC (Nightly Build): amzn.to/41aUrSu
UPS (5V/24V PoE): s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_DEr...
AREDN homepage: www.arednmesh.org/
Flash hap Router: • Installing AREDN Firmw...
Flash Access Point: • Flashing a Mikrotik Ra...
Flash Ubiquity: • Installing AREDN Firmw...
Documentation and files for flashing: github.com/dhamstack/AREDNsta...
Holder for Mikrotik AP: www.thingiverse.com/thing:301...
AREDN UA-cam Channel: / @aredn749
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I am 200km from the Bay Area AREDN and thus unable to get to them via RF... but I am on a very high location. Have thought about tunneling in with my current router... but watching your video I slapped my head at the notion of just getting another router. Duh... thanks for kicking my neurons into gear. Great videos as always.
Cool. You would be member of a very big network!
My company just got rid of about 20 Cisco VOIP phones and this is a PERFECT project to utilize the older hardware. Thanks for the inspiration as always
I agree!
Hello Andreas! This is fascinating. Looking forward to the rest of the series! 73!
Glad you like the topic!
Interesting and quite remarkable! Great ingenuity and craftmanship when building everything into a compact flightcase.
I probably will also build one in the future. It is quite handy to have everything in one place on the bicycle...
Danke für diese tollen Beitrag eine tolle Idee und man hörte dass es tip top geklappt hat! 🙂
Genau. Die Qualität ist normalerweise sehr gut.
In the uarly 2000s I found out about similar networks using off the shelf wifi components, with high gain antennas for the long range trunk repeater node things. Sadly my house was on the wrong side of a hill and couldn't see any other nodes. This is a really great system, too. Maybe I should get my ham license one of these days.
We have HAMnet (based on standard IP protocol) for a long time. AREDN is a mesh which is a bit easier to use.
I've been on AREDN for several years now. Still haven't found it as useful as you do. 😃
We are in contact with the authorities to build a network, for example. So we have something useful to do….
@@HB9BLA Das war schon immer/oft so, dass die Behörden es nicht schlecht finden, aber eigentlich nicht brauchen. Mein Eindruck ist, dass die Behörden es lieber hätten wenn sich nicht zuviele in ihr Netzwerk/Org. Einmischen. 😲 Zumindest die Zürcher Behörden.
@@ManuOutdoor Wir haben schon mit einigen Kantonen Verträge und andere sind in Diskussionen. Vielleicht nicht die Zürcher. Als "Baselbieter" weiss ich ja, dass die alles besser wissen ;-)
Very good, informative video. Sparked some use case idea
Thank you!
sehr schön, habe schon zwei CPE210 und zwei alte Mitel 6867 beiseite gelegt und bin ganz gespannt
die CPE210 sollten unterstützt sein. Allerdings auf 2.4GHz. Da findest du möglicherweise nicht so viele Gegenstationen. Aber du hast ja 2 ;-)
Hello. Excellent video, congratulations and thanks for the explanation. From Argentina, Bahia Blanca, AREDN user LU4EOU
You are welcome!
Hi Andreas! I did some similar work using different equipment (Cisco phones, Asterisk server, Raspberry Pi, and GL-iNet routers. I found that it worked well. I only had mine running around my house but my setup was pretty scaleable if it’d needed to be. Some of the Ubiquiti kit is good for outdoor use, used that loads in the past for other applications. The TP-Link equipment also looks good but I didn’t want to spend £££ to try it when I really was only looking at the problem conceptually.
Cool that you had your own mesh! We use outdoor devices because we want to bridge distances. So we need powerful devices and good antennas...
@@HB9BLA - Agree. I live in a bit of a dead spot for radio, so doing a mesh network isn’t much use here unless I use the internet tunnelling option, and then I don’t need mesh to spread from there.
I think you made a great choice with the kit. Those Ubiquiti devices are certainly very good, but I’ve never used them on AREDN. Presumably they work well, seeing as they’re on the “supported” list. I recall from distant memory that it’s possible to run 12v into two pins of the Cat5 connector instead of a POE injector and they’ll work run off that.
@@daveys Yes, all these devices use "passive" PoE. That uses spare wires of the Cat cables.
Very very helpful this video is thanks for making this video,,,,,,,,,
You are welcome!
If you need an Assistant at anytime, I'm studying both German and for the Swiss Exam. I'm a transplant from American via Geneva (Now living in 3053). I'm Swiss (French Speaker) / U.S. (dual). Im actually going to the Bern, club for a presentation on ARDEN.
Cool! Give me a call if you are licensed. There is a club in Solothurn/Burgdorf that is very active in AREDN
Well done as always!!! Cheers* K4PMO
Thanks you!
Very interesting!
Thank you! All ok on your side?
Thank you for posting. Cheers* K4PMO
My pleasure!
Excellent video! Thank you for producing this useful explanation.
You are welcome!
thanks
You are welcome!
Awesome! And first time I think I've heard you speak Swiss german (with a touch of french too?)
Swiss German uses French words (parts of Switzerland is French-speaking)...
Are there any similarities with Hamshack Hotline? Looks kind of similar, but I need to see the rest of the series 🙂 Keep em comming.
you can use ham shack hotline with arden
After looking at the Hamshack Hotline website, I think, these projects have a different goal. AREDN is a wireless mesh network for IP and Hamshack Hotline seems to be internet based VOIP.
Nice video which makes HAM radio license relevant in this era, Does AREDN support Meraki Access point
I do not think so. You find the list of the supported devices in my links.
I've breathed new life into original Meraki WiFi kit with openWRT firmware so it shouldn't be too difficult to get going if they haven't already. They literally used to give the Meraki stuff away years ago as they made their money on subscriptions. Then they literally outmoded good working gear, forcing people to pay to replace all their infrastructure. eBay has been awash with their stuff for pennies at times and it's really good quality
Run a speedtest over it, and see why it wont work under stress. Better to just ask your local WISP if you can have a couple free antennas for your ham radio club, I'm sure they'd love to help..
You are right. I got a few old Nanostations from somebody who upgraded the network.
Your cool.
Thank you!
in one of your upcoming segments can you compare and contrast ARDEN vs. BBHN? Seems like an evolutionary step up.
I do not know BBHN and it has no implementations around me. So I am the wrong guy to make such a comparison. However, while googling I found that AREDN has much more activity around the world. Am I wrong?
Wy HAM License …… such a net may also work with unlicensed regular WLAN Equipment without regulatory restrictions.
A HAM Network cant be used by persons outside the HAM Comunity as resut from regulation.
With Freifunk this is possible. What are the technological differences between Freifunk and Aredn in routing and organisation - the Part of the Network that is in Opposit to the links not effected by Regulation ?
@@joel_mckay Off corse i know …… you need much more relay stations …… but what can you do with a HAM Net outside an Emergency call? You can check whenever there is a connection and you can transport Data that is related to Ham activity …… wich mean in case of telephone you can talk about ham operator stuff. And in case of an Emergency …… the Probability is high that the system overloads in relation to air time of the transmitter. This means most real time Applications do not work and in this cases most routing protocols are collapsing wich means connectivity is lost complete. Then the Network resumes …… following by the load …… and the system collapses again.
For me, the reason to try it is that:
1) You can try experiments with the tech. Mesh radio is pretty good to have a go with, and many home wifi systems are using Mesh now, so why not understand it better.
2) You get to learn other technologies, e.g. VOIP, routing, Asterisk server, Pi, microwave frequencies, yagis/patches as part of the process.
3) It’s just another thing to try with a ham licence.
4) Can run greater power on a non-congested section of band. For me that either means that you can use amps or just yagis or huge plate antennas which otherwise would be illegal to use.
@@daveys Without Ham Liense i can all the things …… execpt Modification if the commercial wireless Packet Data Radios (mostly Wifi)
I must work with much shorter Links …… i have used kommercial Equipment for 20 Years with 3 and 7 km Range to the next bigger city. That works well, and i coud earn Money with this too. By the way i get legal additional frequencys and power limits in my contry. If you allowed to use more Power like a ham operator, you also occupied the Frequency on a quite greater Area on Earth. If you want to use such a Network heavily, high Power forbits himhelf. So often i work with much less power then allowed to optimize the ower all performance.
The Content limitating regulation in relation to ham transmissions solves this Problem to working level.
@@q9a - It’s all good fun to try these kinds of things, and so many research applications have commercial use as well - whether you apply the learning to make money or use it in disasters, it’s all just about applying the knowledge. Ham radio has always been a hotbed of research.
Commercial equipment on ISM bands usually are licensed including the firmware. Of course, you can change it. But AFAIK this is illegal.
Anyway, I have a HAM license and do not care too much about if it would be possible without it ;-)
Interesting concept, and I look forward to the next video. Is there a pure radio implementation, ie not using the internet? 73 de HB9FUH
Yes, of course. Just replace the tunnels with RF links. That is our goal.
Morning Andreas, from sunny Autumn Australia. 48 V mmmm may battery bank?
Probably an up-converter is smaller...
If you build it they will come :)
I hope so!
Also wenn ich das richtig verstehe, brauche ich keine Lizenz, wenn ich das Netzwerk unabhängig vom Aredn betreibe. Sogesehn eine interessante Möglichkeit für den KatSchutz
Soviel ich Weiss darf man die Firmware auf einem Router/Access point ohne Lizenz nicht tauschen. Aber ich bin kein Jurist...
Guten Tag, dürfen HB3 Funker auch AREDN betreiben?
73s von HB3XYR
so a license-free option is still the only one and good old "CB"?
CP or PMR (and some other "public" bands in other countries. But these are no no ip networks, just voice.
@@HB9BLA thx
Hallo Andreas
Mich würden im speziellen die Konfiguration des Yeahlink interessieren. Anruf auf Direct-IP funktioniert bei mir schon. Aber von einen Cisco a/b Adapter wie es DL2FLY in seinem Video zeigt geht das bei mir nicht.
Machst du über die YEAHLINK noch ein spezielles Video?
Beste Grüsse aus HB0, und beste Grüsse von der Hilti ;-)
Stefan
Hallo Stefan,
ich kenne Hilti gut aus den alten Zeiten (war einer der Architekten eures SAP Systems)...
Was das Problem mit deinem SIP adapter ist Weiss ich nicht. Es könnte allenfalls der Port sein. Wir standardisieren auf den 5060 weil die Yealinks auf diesem hören.
Ich werde ein Video über unser Telefonbuch machen. Da sind die Telefone allerdings nicht im Zentrum weil wir davon ausgehen, dass die funktionieren. Wir wollen damit nur die Direktadressierung vereinfachen (und robuster machen). Mehr gerne direkt (du findest mich auf QRZ)
What makes aredn better than other solutions for example libremesh?
I do not know the technical differences. It seems that they have a similar goal and use similar HW.
@@HB9BLA they both use openwrt as base and both make a WiFi mesh
Why for that a Afu License is required? Isn’t it still using Wifi or directional Radio for the commutation, and when the hardware was usable before without a license why shouldn’t it be allowed. Also when the Communications are encrypted even a Afu license don’t make it legal.
It might be that at some point the communications get routed through methods requiring a license, similar to hams using IP connected dmr networks that run on amateurs frequencies
@@badgerbalti But if I only use standard wifi gear and maybe other license free gear it should be legal, am I right? And when some other member uses gear with require a license it shouldn't matter for me? I also use my ISP Network and they have a license to I don't need one. (Basic high level abstraction)
@@maxmustermann9858 provided you don't use their firmware or connect to their services that may subsequently route your data or transmissions via an amateur licensed frequency at any point, all of this can be accomplished without the need for an Amateur license, but, you'll have to roll your own setup or find an existing open source implementation that doesn't do anything which may require a license. I build setups on Greenfield festival sites which do similar things and it can all be done with off the shelf gear without needing a license. Their setup does much of the heavy lifting when it comes to the underlying configuration so they just have to load a new firmware and pop in a couple settings but it uses their frequencies and powers which require a license to operate, plus it will link to other systems that also use Amateur frequencies.
@@maxmustermann9858 an ISP or Wisp may operate gear that requires a license, but those are commercial licenses which are for the purpose of carrying consumer traffic so you don't personally need a license when your data transits those links. Amateur licenses are not commercial and their use is restricted for Amateur licensed purposes only
I am no lawyer. But I thought that the firmware is part of the test procedures for legal equipment. So it would be illegal to change it. But maybe this is a "grey" zone.
I think the most important thing is that HAM radio operators are already organized and can create (human) networks.
There are other such networks for non-licensed people available. See the comment about "libremesh".
I must be missing something. Because I don’t see any aspect of this setup that would warrant the need to have a ham license? Unless the regulations are completely different here in USA.
You need to change the firmware of the access points. This is not allowed on the ISM bands where devices are licensed including SW.
Our (licensed) frequencies are close to the 5.8GHz ISM band (and overlapping). So we are happy we can use standard HW.
Emergency Data Network for HAMS ??? are you for real???
We are proud Amateur radio oporators ( well , looks like some of us are), our hobby is WIRELESS ( not wires acting as antennas, lol) , not sure what in the word Wireless many of us fail to understand????
In a REAL emergency ( not local B.S) there will be NO INTERNET , NO) POWER ( Nada, ZERO, Kaput)!!!!!!!!! .
Time to get real people, like your toys and love wasting your money and time ,go for it ( you are not alone in this growing group, lol).
All the big boys are on H.F getting ready with their DX and NVIS setup.
On a good note, more boys busy with their internet toys, less noise on H.F.
When I was young, I worked for the Red Cross in war areas. I know how emergency communication on HF using Morse works. And how slow it is ;-)
I am not particularly interested in the Emergency aspect of these networks, I am more interested in the technical part. I see these networking topics as a good entry for young people in our hobby. DX and contesting obviously is not interesting for them if I look at my colleagues where I am a youngster with my age of 66 ;-)
@@HB9BLA All good BUT!!! we are taking part in a wireless hobby, not wires driven hobby ( to us that is so clear).
The internet should never be part of a wireless hobby as it is nothing more than using WIRES to communicate, it looks like our hobby will have to be divided to two, Computer internet communication, and ham radio WIRELESS communication (there is a big drive for this to happen as we are losing what makes us special and that's being WIRELESS antenna to antenna all the way.).
Imitating what is already there and could be done better with a much cheaper equipment called a cell phone / computer and a small network will take our hobby nowhere (I understand many do not care about the future and the abuse our spectrum, some are streaming you tube on it, lol).
The internet is great BUT!!! is it part of a WIRELESS hobby? and many are starting the truth here.
Remember speaking around the world with the use of internet is easy, the networks are easy to design AND no licence needed, anyone with a cell phone connection can do it better and with great video. yet, using a wire and a radio without a provided infrastructure is where our hobby shines ( well used to, lol)
yes, I live on a farm and got 8KM internet links set up using Ubiquiti antennas BUT I will never call this network ham radio, lol
The question is do we want a future or end up with a cell phone kind of a hobby.
Are we given the radio band spectrum, so we connect to to wires " antenna" called the internet? if we continue this way expect most of the ham band to be taken away.
yet its a sure way to divide the boys from the men.
too bad this needa a ham-license; if such solutions'd be created that "normalos" can also participate, it'd make things easier for all, since many people ask themselves "is it worth to make the license" (since it's not exatly cheap, and local radio-clubs are ...very selective... in who they allow to watch/sit with them aso...
Things like that are not legal because the firmware of the wireless devices have to be changed. This is probably why they are not made for the general public.
We are lucky that the ISM band on 5.8GHz is close to the frequencies we are allowed to use. That is why we can use standard gear.
@@HB9BLA this is true - it's just sad that there are so few "entry-points" to HAM nowadays; eg. if the local HAM-group consists of people who don't want "newbies" within them, there's no "let's try it"-band (since CB has been essentially killed by the no-mic-during-ride-ruling)
ALSO - imagine a situation where AREDN ...could do very good helping out authorities who didn't realise what problems the change to VoIP will bring in an emergency-situation (no more switchboard, no more local emergency-phone-net, aso; had an interesting debate at the airforce-center with a guide there, when i stood in the "special exhibition"-hangar where there was a switchboard stored, followed by a talk with the Gemeindepräsidentin, both were "very überrascht" about the non-possibilities of the "old emergency plans".
...are there so many certified HAM-users to make AREDN happen?
true - in an emergency-situation, no one would care if non-licenced would partake. but imagine there'd be an "open" solution.
like freifunk in germany back in the first years of the "WRT54G-legacy-years"...
(just look at what they did to the N-band-license in germany: an entry-license for newbys to check out "is it worth it" - HAMs complained, now the Nband-test (and in conclusion the E-license one) is more difficult than before... that's not the way to bring people in to this great hobby)
@@michaelkeller5008 It is not too complicated to get a license if you decide to do it. We have many non-organized new HAMS who never attended a class. Finding other interested people in this modern technology is not easy in the regular clubs, I agree. If you live in Switzerland, drop me a message, and I can get you in contact with the right people.
@@HB9BLA if you're education isn't based in the electronics-part, ...it's almost impossible to make the license (i tried), thanks for the offer, as soon my current situation is stabilised (difficult times atm) i'll come back to it! :)
All this can often be done with the same kit without an Amateur license. You just cannot use any of their firmware which alters the kit to use amateurs frequencies or connect to their networks as it may use licensed frequencies elsewhere. You would essentially need to roll your own setup using VPN's, Wireless bridges, Asterisk or 3CX for VOIP etc. Lacking an Amateur license, depending on your country you may need to get commercial licenses to operate Wireless gear at higher powers or on Wisp channels e.g. in the UK we can get a "Fixed Wireless Access" FWA license for 5.8GHz band C @36dBm pretty cheap from OFCOM. We use it for wireless bridging across large festival sites. In the UK you can also use 5.8GHz band B @30dBm without a license and that will still go pretty far with decent kit.
sorry, ich verstehe davon gar nichts
NICHTS
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