Did Ben even pay attention to the movies? Winter soldier is what made Captain America suspicious of an all powerful organization like SHIELD and Age of Ultron is what made Ironman call for international security instead of relying on himself like before.
He doesn't care about the movies much, I think if he'd truly watch them one by one and analyze them combined he would see it differently, but he has a life, children and a business, he just does these rankings for us, and honestly it's still great even if I disagree with his rankings. Just seeing him talking about Marvel is perfect.
Honestly! It's frustrating to watch this since he forgot that characters can have arcs and change over time. Comic book characters stay much more stagnant than their movie counterparts. Ben just doesn't know that apparently.
So here's what Ben Shapiro doesn't understand about Civil War: Iron Man was against giving control to the government in Iron Man 1. He believed that the responsibility of protecting the innocent was to be in his, and later on, the Avenger's hands. But in Age of Ultron, that responsibility was mishandled. Iron Man created Ultron. Out of guilt, and seeing the consequence of government not being involved, he switched positions. Conversely, Captain America saw the corruption of the government in Winter Soldier. He saw how the government could not be trusted. The point of Civil War is showing how they both changed their opinions. He's right, Iron Man was against the Government and Captain America was for it. But Civil War, continuing from Age of Ultron and Winter Soldier, showed how their experiences changed their viewpoints. Edit: the situation is more complicated than he gives it credit for.
@@seele7561 This may come off rude and forgive me but that has to be the dumbest shit I've read in a comment section in a while. Changing your opinions based on your experiences is a significant trait of human beings.
Ben, you don’t understand Captain America. He’s not pro government, he’s pro America - the ideas and values America was built on. That’s why he was against registration.
It really feels like he didn’t watch Winter Soldier at all. That was literally what that movie was all about. The fact that times have changed and blind love for the government is no longer a thing. It’s way more complicated now. Caps character arc is the best in the Marvel universe by far. It’s not even close.
The movie has aged very well. Especially the scene where Zola talks about how people are now willing to sacrifice their freedom for security which would allow Hydra to take over. Sounds very much like the anti-second amendment and pro forced mandates crowd.
This is the problem with Ben. He doesn't like Marvel, so his take isn't that well informed, because he doesn't care enough. We are literally shown why both Tony and Steve switches sides over time.
@@mickpagel4311after what he did in age of ultron, what hulk did, and what the team did at the beginning of civil war. It’s a pretty straight shot for him to say they need oversight.
From someone who collected, read, and knows the actual comic book characters Ben himself a comic book collector is wrong about Captain America. First Captain America was never pro government he has always been pro America. Anyone agreeing with Ben reminds me of The Red Skull. Do you fans of the movies know about a storyline in the 80's where through the machinations of The Red Skull the US government stripped the name and uniform of Captain America from Steve Rogers? For a time in the books (the source material) Steve Rogers was known as *Nomad.* Don't even try a reply with the excuse of *we're discussing the movies* because the first sentence I typed Ben knows the source material himself. Now Ben's talking about the movies too but it's not hard to take 15 or 20 seconds to talk about the difference between movie/book. It's something a person who hasn't read the books might appreciate even people here who believe Ben and agree with him that *Captain America was pro government, lol.*
Yeah Ben is really annoying when it comes to moves. We literally see character development with Captain America and Iron Man that leads to the views in Civil War. CA experienced government overreach in Winter Soldier and Iron Man experience superhero overreach in Age of Ultron. Thats why they take the positions they took.
Ben is not completely wrong about Iron Man's shift, though. He did fundamentally change sides from 2008 to Civil War, and it is barely prompted throughout the MCU.
The Captain America films are some of the most conservative movies to come out of Hollywood in recent years. Ben's contempt for them has never made a lot of sense to me.
He’s so off on Captain America. Winter soldier is easily the best Marvel movie Captain America was never supposed to be about the government. He was supposed to be about the IDEALS. That’s why his entire origin is him ignoring orders and sneaking off to rescue the other soldiers
@@Age_of_Apocalypse that’s a tough sell. To have conclusive character arcs you need to count end game and end game is BRUTAL. Infinity war has very bad pacing problems too. Overrated
Excellent point. Cap represent America and the ideals it represents. He's not a government tool. His first act as a solider was going against orders to so the right thing
I don't necessarily agree about Winter Soldier being in the top 5, but I agree with the rest of what you said. Cap was totally turned off about the government by the time Civil War came around. He had been played and betrayed at almost every turn. His fight was about freedom, and the government was trying to curtail the freedoms of his work family. Made perfect sense to me. I'm shocked that Ben didn't see that angle.
is he though......? Like... how? Just cause he wants to kill people? Meh. He's not scary. and I genuinely don't know how to do this successfully but Ben is right about one thing, Marvel write crap villains. The red skull was at least believable, I mean Hitler wasn't great so.... that was fine. And they could have had a really great villain in Iron Man 3 then NOPE. Maybe the Vulture from Tom Holland's first Spider man. But other than that.... I don't think... there's been a really decent villain. Thanos included. Weeping over Gamorrah like he's a good guy at heart just a bit tortured. Oh please.
@@grandmatildyfromtennessee4605 Agreed. People complain about Kaecillius from the first Doctor Strange being "forgettable", but in truth he's not that different from the others. Yeesh. Marvel fans need to be taught logos.
The reason for Tony Stark's shift is bc he's basically responsible for most of the bad things that have happened over the course of the films and feels guilty about it. Steve Rogers has no shift in ideology. The government does.
Correct. Stark just has survivors remorse and PTSD from some of the bad things his Anarchist like nature caused by mistake. And wouod gladly five over authority to whoever can and will take it. In this case Shield and The Government. Captain American was never loyal to the Government. He was loyal to the ideals it stood for in his time. Their ideals and what they stood for changed while he was frozen in ice. He didn't realize or accept that axiomatic fact at first. Then later it hit him all at once like a ton of bricks. That the united states government had literally become H.Y.D.R.A like literally. And H.Y.D.R.A is who he was created to fight. So he fought them in their new form. The U.S Government.
Gee it’s almost like Marvel decided that they didn’t like Iron Man’s ‘capitalism good’ message and they wanted to tell everyone that what the most patriotic person ever (AKA Cap) would do is rage against the system.
Bruh, captain america and ironmans’ character developments over winter soldier, ultron, civil war, infinity war to endgame is a masterpiece. That’s the whole point, their character development is to start off ideological, switch ideologies and learn nuance by the finale.
Ben, you are totally contradicting yourself when you say that the subsequent movies after the origin story are boring because there's "no character development" but THEN you say you don't like Civil War because the characters are different. Iron Man sides with the government in Civil War BECAUSE of what happened in Avengers Age of Ultron (both because his own tinkering created the evil robot and because their actions to stop Ultron resulted in so many dying. He wants the government to stop rogue actors and take the blame and the responsibility.) Captain America doesn't side with the government in Civil War BECAUSE of what happened in Captain America 2: Winter Solider (both because he realizes that governments and bureaucracies are highly corruptable and because his best friend Bucky's brainwashing is a result of that. He doesn't want others' agendas to wrongly accuse his friend and take away the heroes' agency.)
Top 5 in no particular order: -Captain America: Winter Soldier -Avengers -Spider-Man: No Way Home -Iron Man -Ant Man Ant Man holds a special place in my heart. When I saw it for the first time, I was in the hospital getting a bone marrow transplant after getting a leukemia diagnosis months before. My daughter was only four at the time, and the movie hit hard about being a dad needing to do whatever it took to stay in his daughters life and how much love between a dad and his daughter…..8 years later and still holds a special place in my heart
Yeah the father-daughter part REALLY gave it heart. Casting Paul Rudd made the character as much as RDJr made Ironman. Both were meh comics/characters but the actors made them very engaging. The worst crime is how they turned his loving little girl into the SJW. SMH BTW my wife is in oncology/BMT so I hear a bunch about it (Im an accountant, not scientist) and I hope you are doing well here 8 years later!
I heard Marvel is making a comeback. Kevin Feige is firing all the directors who label themselves as ‘activists.’ He admits they’ve gone woke and wants to fix it.
I knew his staff was joking about superman being a marvel hero but when he said that rocket isn't actually a raccoon, I was like did you not watch GOTG3??
Cap started out as a character who believed in the American government but through his experiences in Avengers, and definitely Winter Soldier, he begins to realize that the American government does not share the values he believes it should have. This is why he would be against registration. Iron Man on the other hand is a character who started off only caring about himself until he realized what his apathy had caused: his weapons being sold to terrorists and innocent people dying. He takes it upon himself to try and protect the world but often causes more harm than good. The wake up call for him was Ultron. After Ultron Tony begins to see that his way of protecting the world is not working and that despite his best efforts, innocent people are still dying because of his actions.
Actually, ideologically Captain America is about doing the right thing, no matter how much it costs. Iron Man has always been self-centered. Because he feels bad because Shirley's son died, he thinks everyone should do what he wants and sign.
I've heard it's different in the comic books, but in the movie Cap only seems concerned about keeping his buddy from facing any consequences from killing and injuring tons of people. Not very heroic.
Cpt America: Winter Soldier better explains Rogers ideology and how he goes from supporting the government to his current view. Civil War was also a movie that shouldn’t have been made and strayed so far from the source material it didn’t really make sense
Cap is a Brooklyn kid who understands the plight of the downtrodden. Stark can't relate due to the extra resources his wealth provides. I also never saw Stark force Parker to sign. Hypocrisy.
That's true. It took very little to emotionally manipulate him. Granted what little it was, was still an unthinkable tragedy, and that poor woman should never have had to deal with such a loss. Tony may be smart as a whip, but his lack of proper parental rearing gave him some issues with self regulation.
I think Shapiro's analysis of Civil War is incorrect. Cap should be the one against the gov because he grew up in an era where Constitutional originalism was taught. So he knew what the essence of the gov should be: limited. Contrast that with Stark whose progression makes cultural sense as we have seen so many genius billionaires become pawns of the gov, like Zuckerberg or Gates. Cap in his rebellion still embodies American ideals, whereas Stark capitulates American ideals out of a sense of misplaced guilt.
We see Cap's progression in The Winter Soldier. He's trying to be a company man, just "following orders." And then he can't any further because he sees what the gov has become with its gross overreach.
Actually Steve Rogers grew up when FDR was President and running roughshod over the Constitution, in the name of helping people - and the American people loved him for it.
Absolutely correct, @rainmakr315. Your take is spot-on. Ben's analysis is way wrong; Steve Rogers is quintessentially American and we Americans are traditionally ANTI-government. Honestly, neither he nor Tony Stark would be pro-government, but of the two, handing Stark that role makes more sense in light of big tech being in bed with the state, as you point out.
It's played as character growth of both that went beyond its bounds they both overcorrected their faults by the time you get to civil war and then they both mellow out afterwards
Rocket is not an alien, the third film reveals he is a normal earth raccoon who was genetically and neurologically experimented on at his great suffering. This motivates him to embrace the fact he is a raccoon and that all animals deserve rights, not just humans and talking aliens. Vol. 3 is a great film with a serious message.
The reason Tony and Steve swith ideologies is that Tony has guilt over Ultron and wants a check on himself. Meanwhile, Steve doesn't trust the government after Winter Soldier. Their characters aren't static. They grow and change over the course of the movies.
yeah I’m surprised that Ben missed the point of the last two Captain America movies. it’s basically Steve Rodgers fighting the deep state that has corrupted America
Could not cosign on this point more than I do. And to add to your point about Tony, he literally says in the movie that he's trying to fix things with Pepper by signing the Accords. It's a combo of guilt and selfishness in trying to win back Pepper. This went RIGHT over his head, but I'm not surprised.
IM3, not woke, trash. Love and Thunder, not woke, fucking trash Thor 2, not woke, trash, (I kinda have a soft spot for it even thou it's 100% trash) Far from Home: not woke, Super Trash.
How can you argue that Captain America and Iron Man seemed to have illogically swapped roles? Or that any of Steve’s actions, except maybe the early ones, were about loyalty to America? From the very beginning, Steve Rogers demonstrated a rebellious streak, defying rules and expectations. His initial actions before turning into “Captain America” involved visiting multiple army recruiting offices, lying about his health and identity in a desperate attempt to join the fight. After becoming “Captain America”, he disregarded orders and single-handedly liberated an entire platoon of soldiers from Hydra. In the first Avengers movie, he goes against Shield’s authority by breaking into the carrier to uncover its secrets after Iron Man hacks into Shield's mainframe, revealing that Nick Fury might be hiding something. Later, Steve conceals the truth about the death of Tony Stark’s parents to protect his childhood friend, who was responsible for the murders. The U.S. wanted to ratify the Sokovia accords- once again, Steve rebelled when he perceived the accords were more about “control”. His decisions were never about blind loyalty to the U.S. government but about doing what was right, even when the personal cost was high. His journey is one of unwavering friendship and loyalty, often when the stakes are impossible, driven by a strong moral compass and an unyielding commitment to his convictions.
Ben, I understand why you might think that Civil War makes no sense, because that's if you rip Tony and Steve straight from their first movies. There were events that transpired that led to them believing how they do in Civil War. For Tony, his creative and literal freedom is what led to Ultron being created, so he wants to effectively collar himself afterwards. For Cap, in his second movie, he discovered how corrupt the government who created him is, so he uses the gifts given to him to fight against it
Winter Soldier is bad because they changed Tony who’s message was: Capitalism is good, into the bad guy. Then gave the good guy, Cap, the most patriotic, all American guy in the world, the position of America is evil rage against the patriarchy. Also he’s right that Cap doesn’t act anything like a kid from 1940’s Brooklyn.
Yeah honestly, sometimes I feel he’s not much better than the leftists. He called Captain America a “soy boy” then didn’t give any actual reasons why. It’s like the left calling us incels or chuds. You can’t just use a buzzword as your argument.
oh, no it is SUPER important to view everything with a political/ideological lens...! I just think sometimes Ben's gets a bit narrow. The thing with Captain America/Iron Man, that's just.... blinkered watching. taking your worldview and critical thinking into the cinema with you, especially now when movies are made so militantly ideological anyway... it NEEDS to be exhausting but also I think he misses context, story-lines etc. Iron Man's journey to supporting the government - Should be obvious. (kinda dumb but still obvious). The story line in Captain Marvel about immigrants=good or at least harmless - I notice Ben didn't say anything about. and I genuinely don't know if that's because he is ignoring context or... you know, maybe he's just a guy and he misses it :)
I kind of agree with most of what Ben said, but strongly disagree with the point he was trying to make with civil war. He clearly doesnt get into them, so he misses a lot of the character development. Steve doesn't like the government because he learns it is corrupt and no longer for the people (hydra). Tony doesnt necessarily like the government, but he sees the disaster his tech and the Avengers do, and the negative effects they have had to date, so he feels there needs to be limits and boundaries to what they do. Civil war is the movie that helps Tony to realize the balance that's needed and how he was wrong to allow the government to have control over his friends. That, along with don't fight with your brothers and sisters and kill yourselves. This is just the tip of the iceberg, but in a nutshell, you need to understand the comics, lore, and actually like what you are watching to accurately rate the Marvel universe. Ben can't do this, as he himself admits its not his cup of tea.
Tony switches because yes in Iron Man 1 he wanted to put the onus of protecting the world on him but then in Avengers Age of Ultron he majorly messes up by creating an AI robot that almost destroys the world so his remorse makes him switch to being open about having an overlying system make them have accountability for their great power
@@aldonc1407yes and no. I think ben is correct in noting that in the beginning cap has been on the side of the government. And then the entire government organization turned out to be vastly infiltrated by the ally organization of the nazis, so therefore he grows sceptical of anything that gives powers to individuals he doenst trust
Furthermore, Hank Pym actually created Ultron but the movies changed it to give Tony the MAJOR guilt trip. (also the Stark branded bomb that should have killed Wanda and Pietro)
Yeah but capt America saw the Germans become authoritarian, so he understands that registering with the govt would be a bad idea line 1940s Jewish in Germany. He saw it, he didn’t just read about it like ironman. But this is captain America’s character development. He starts off as someone who follows the govt like a lib, but becomes fully aware that govt is made up of people and those people’s agendas can change. That’s how he changes. His journey was the best but ultimately a bit hard to see if you were just a casual marvel movie goer.
His arc was the worst. He literally runs away from any authority and accountability for the deaths he caused. His answer to the deaths is "hmmm well you win some you lose some"....he feels like he can enter any country and kill whoever they want so long as they think they're bad 😅....
Plus, after CA: Winter Soldier he saw how easily Hydra was able to infiltrate the US government and use the government's power to oppress and threaten the American public.
@@m.m4982 there’s a line in the movie about that. He said “it may not be perfect, but the safest hands are still our own”. Saying that, while there were casualties, it would’ve been worse without their intervention, and being under the control of the govt could mean being the very oppressive thing that he saw in the previous movie “winter soldier” where they used giant planes pointing guns at everyone if someone became a threat. Capt understood that the word “threat” is subjective to the person wielding the gun.
You know I remember a time where liberals were the anti establishment and conservatives were the establishment. Funny how things have flipped since 2008
Decent list. His criticism on Ironman’s and Cap’s switch on the views of the government is off. The movies show why they changed their minds with Cap realizing his absolute trust in the government, military and its higher up leaders and secret organizations makes him distrust it all and he becomes more independent and libertarian in terms of super hero oversight. I don’t believe Tony Stark actually believes it’s the right thing to do to register with the government and have as much oversight, but I think he feels so much guilt for what he created in age of Ultron that he feels responsible and is trying his best to check himself and to prove to everyone else that he won’t allow this to happen again and do some damage control. I imagine he thinks this oversight keeps him accountable from having too much destructive power again. It’s kind of a cool flip of both characters.
Cap being against government and iron man being for is set up in their previous movies. You have to pay attention to their arcs. Cap starts out blindly following orders but starts distrusting fury / shield i n cap 2. Iron man starts as a rebel and discovers his carelessness is aiding terrorism and he feels guilty for the deaths in sokovia. So he agrees to be held accountable by the govt in civil war. Ultimately when he learns buckey killed his parents that is the final rip between them.
I’m with everyone else here in saying that he’s ignoring all the Iron Man and Cap movies and the avengers movies that preceded civil war that got them to those positions
They ideologically switch places because character development/character arc. Captain America doesn't trust authorities because of what happened in winter soldier. Iron man is no longer a Maverick because of the guilt he experiences for all the problems he caused. This switching of roles is one of the things that makes the infinity saga brilliant story telling.
@@liampower2866 so she has the same acting capacities that Brie Larson has. But Gina is much more carismatic and kind, and a lot of people like her much more.
Ben talking about Captain America Civil War: none of the characters make sense Also Ben: explains why (admittedly pretty well) only two characters don't make sense
Ben was clearly so bored by the MCU he didn't pay attention to any of the movies if he thought it didn't make sense Ironman was willing to have government oversight and Cap said no way. One of the main themes of Ironman 3 and Age of Ultron was that Tony was his own worst enemy and created so many problems with his impulsiveness and obsessions. Tony has started to learn from those mistakes, and then finding out the actions of the avengers led to so many innocent deaths really pushed over the edge to be open to supervision. Plus, I think it's heavily implied Tony was always going to be willing to bend the rules when the chips were down anyways like we see at the end of Civil War when he leaves to go help Cap. As for Cap, he saw the corruption of his government organization firsthand with Hydra infiltrating SHIELD from within in Winter Solider. Of course Cap doesn't trust the government anymore when he's seen firsthand that even those with good intentions in his own government can cause massive harm when unchecked. It's like Ben read a wiki summary on the 2 characters and nothing else and then watched Civil War and was confused lol.
I think Antman Quantamania is my favorite. Kang the Conqueror is indeed one of the most Ruthless and determined MARVEL Villains and is clearly the most volatile villain the MCU has introduced so far.
Glad that everyone agrees, Captain America is the best Also.. dude every line out of Thanos’ mouth is an iconic and has become a meme. He will go down as one of the best villains of the last 20 years as time progresses
Captain America opposes the federal government control in Civil War because in Winter Soldier he learns of the possibility for corruption. Iron Man is in favor of federal government control because he believes that he caused too much damage from events like Avengers 2012, and wants to relinquish some personal responsibility to the government
Yeah it’s evolved… iron man realizes his god complex and wants oversight because no one should operate without consequences… Cap like you said was aware of the corruption and accepted that he isn’t good or bad just a tool of the government as a soldier!
Captain America isn't blindly loyal to the American government. He's loyal to the American ideals of freedom and justice. And in The Winter Soldier he discovered that SHIELD had become dangerous and corrupt, which led to his distrustful attitude in Civil War. Meanwhile, Tony's arrogance and recklessness got innocent people killed in Age of Ultron, which is why he embraced accountability in Civil War. Character development.
In Cap's letter to Tony at the end of Civil War he literally says he believes in people, ie individualism, over the collective. His rejection of government control of the Avengers is based upon this. Civil War could also be read as a metaphor for gun control, with Cap taking the position of defending the 2nd amendment.
It is a fair point about Cap not holding on to that "man out of time" feel. Other than a few random jokes that completely goes away as the show goes on. It was present in the first Avengers than just disappears.
He's so wrong about Civil War lol. Tony Stark switched sides because (1) he created Ultron and almost annihilated the entire planet because he put everything in his hands that even his team, except Banner knew (2) his guilt when a kid was killed at the start of the movie. Cap's ideals changed during Winter Soldier where he realized that governing bodies have different agendas and can be controlled by people like Hydra. Ben using FEELINGS than FACTS.
11:29 Ultron, the artificial intelligence Tony created, destroyed Sarkovia. Everett Ross leads with this information when proposing the Sarkovia accords to Tony. It is for this reason he believed his power needed to be overseen. Captain America was also on the side of the American government until he learned Tony had interned scarlet witch, breaking his trust in him. It may not be like the comics but there are logical reasons provided in the movies for why these characters take the stances they take.
3:01 I have to stop here and make a post that Captain America. Civil War was a pretty good movie contrasting the freedom of the individual versus the tyranny of the state.
In civil war Captain America sides against the government because of his 1940s morals. The governments interest in totalitarian control of power in that movie is part of what grove Capt to fight the Nazis. Meanwhile ironman became afraid of his power and freedom following iron man 3 as well as age of Ultron, because his lack of oversight and regulations nearly killed everyone on earth.
Did he even watch Captain America 2 where Captain America is realizing the government was infiltrated by nazis and then stops blindly following his government ?
Ben, you more than anyone should understand that siding with America doesn’t automatically mean siding with the government. Too much faith in the government can be a problem and this is the whole point of Cap in the modern day. It’s not the 1940s anymore
Iron man has seen where if he is left unchecked, he can cause mass destruction by doing stuff like creating ultron and he feels at fault for Socovia because he was limitless in what he thought he could do, he also felt the same way about the team in Logos that kills a ton of people. Captain America trusted in shield which turned out to be controlled by hydra making him start to distrust the government he once pledged himself to, then when tony made ultron it made cap think that he couldn't even trust the avengers fully, so when he was told that he was going to have to do the bidding of the UN, an organization that was created after he was frozen so probably doesn't view it like a lot of people do, he decided that it would be best if he refused because he has seen every other organization that he has ever trusted be corrupted in some way shape or form... What's funny is that you said that you didn't like it because of the characterization in this movie but its specifically the character development that made the movie so great, they truly understood the characters and based their decisions on their experiences in the franchise thus far.
@@srl4050 I stopped watching mcu when all the movies became the same. Ant man was a cool heist movie, cap America 2 fantastic spy thriller, guardians 1 amazing motley crue team family movie.
4:50 Yeah, the argument was so lazy, but in the comic books it is actually pretty good. There, Thanos was an outsider from a little age, and he had only one friend: Mistress Death. Thanos was in love with her and wanted to prove his love, so he killed half of the Earth's population as a gift to Death.
tbh i would say the comic is not as good as the movie, idk im not a huge fan of thanos being this evil monstorous villain who just wants to kill for a girl, ik it sounds dumb but yeah thats how i feel. And in the movies he was being built up for 10 years, did everything he did because he had a clear goal, and i thought he was still scary and menacing while also like not being very monsterous like darkseid or something. I just think it works that's all
The reason that Iron Man was for the registration and Captain America wasn't, is because of their character arcs. Tony Stark was reckless and he created Ultron and nearly killed Pepper and himself by challenging the fake Mandarin. Also, he had panic attacks from the alien invasion, because he now knew that the threats were bigger and he couldn't trust himself. So he wants the collective strength of the world to defend it from this threat. Steve Rogers grew up in a time when a person was born, lived and died barely cognizant that there was a federal government. You looked to your community. Then he had the experience of Winter Soldier, where he realized you could not put you trust in powerful institutions because they can be corrupted, as Hydra did to SHIELD, or even by well meaning halfwits. Hence he says "the safest hands are still our own." Also, the country is not the government, it is the people. So he is still patriotic, just not a blind obedient to government.
Let's not forget that Tony's background before the first Iron Man movie was as a contractor making weapons for the government. He was a cog in the system of regulatory control over power, and that's the world he understood. The events of the first movie showed him the destructive forces he was contributing to, and he created the Iron Man suit as a means of attempting to atone for that, but as we saw in the second film, the system kept right on going with Justin Hammer. Tony's attempts at privatizing world peace were ultimately illusory because once he was confronted with the bigger galactic threats that exist he fell right back to the systems he was familiar with as a contractor.
I don't think Ben understands Thanos. The writing difference of the villain in Infinity War and Endgame are meant to show two different sides of Thanos. Infinity War portrayed him as a broken person from a broken planet, and the audience is meant to sympathise with him since the film highlights his trauma and regret for not doing enough. Basically the opposite of Iron Man who did everything and didn't do enough. Then in Endgame, we see that, indeed, Thanos is still that broken person, but his ego, maliciousness and self-righteousness is highlighted
Rocket is not an alien that looks like a racoon. He's an actual racoon (from earth) that was experimented on and scientifically modified by a mad alien genius psycopath.
The iron man / Cap switch is actually important and you should appreciate it Ben! The whole point is that Cap realizes that the government has become corrupt (winter soldier movie) and chooses to stand for Ameircan ideals even when the American government refuses to, that's why he can't submit blindly to tyranny, he's seen what that looks like (ww2). Iron Man is on a journey away from self centered pride, and part of that journey is seeing his failures in Ultron, which leaves him in a place where he is trying to be accountable where before he lacked accountability. PS Infinity War is the best comic book movie, showcasing the utter failure of the heroes when they refuse to work together and be united as a team.
He doesn't care about the movies much, I think if he'd truly watch them one by one and analyze them combined he would see it differently, but he has a life, children and a business, he just does these rankings for us, and honestly it's still great even if I disagree with his rankings. Just seeing him talking about Marvel is perfect.
The fact Iron Man and Captain America 'swapped places' is exactly the character development most of us love. These 2 main characters of the Infinity Saga perfectly mirror eachother.
Shapiro definitely missed the entire point of Captain America...his arc over the movies, especially after what happened to Shield in Winter soldier is the reason he doesnt trust the government with the totalitarian authority...on the other end Iron man is feeling the guilt over creating Ultron, and his fear of what happened in New York during the first Avengers is why he is in support of the accords....reluctantly...but to him its the middle ground... Captain America did the same in the comics as he did in the civil war movie....he planted himself like a tree and told them "no, you move"...he held his grounds for what was right...not just because he wanted to save Bucky....he realized when Tony had put Wanda under house arrest basically after what happened in the beginning in Lagos.... She was a prisoner...Cap saw it was a slippery slope then...
For someone all about facts and logic, I found it perplexing that you like Antman. I mean how can one shrink an entire building and put it in a suitcase, if reducing its size does not reduce its density. The same goes with making the keychain made out of a real tank.
@@Eskewsme But what I described was the main thesis of the Antman’s power And the keychain was used as a trump card in the final scene which is hardly nitpicking
@@jenoskun I’m a very casual Marvel fan. And I remember seeing Antman and thinking: “Wow, this was actually pretty entertaining. That’s cool. I enjoyed this film more than some of the other Marvel movies, and I’ve never even heard of Antman.” And never watched it again. I think it’s that simple.
You honestly have the worst taste in marvel films Top 5: Infinity War Endgame Civil war Deadpool & Wolverine Far From Home/ AOU Worst 5: Black panther: Wakanda Forever Eternals Captain Marvel The Marvels Ironman 3
Did Ben even pay attention to the movies?
Winter soldier is what made Captain America suspicious of an all powerful organization like SHIELD and Age of Ultron is what made Ironman call for international security instead of relying on himself like before.
He's the comic book guy.....it's understandable
Ben is more a DC guy than Marvel..
He doesn't care about the movies much, I think if he'd truly watch them one by one and analyze them combined he would see it differently, but he has a life, children and a business, he just does these rankings for us, and honestly it's still great even if I disagree with his rankings. Just seeing him talking about Marvel is perfect.
"Did Ben even pay attention to the movies? "
🤣 Apparently not!
Honestly! It's frustrating to watch this since he forgot that characters can have arcs and change over time. Comic book characters stay much more stagnant than their movie counterparts. Ben just doesn't know that apparently.
So here's what Ben Shapiro doesn't understand about Civil War:
Iron Man was against giving control to the government in Iron Man 1. He believed that the responsibility of protecting the innocent was to be in his, and later on, the Avenger's hands. But in Age of Ultron, that responsibility was mishandled. Iron Man created Ultron. Out of guilt, and seeing the consequence of government not being involved, he switched positions.
Conversely, Captain America saw the corruption of the government in Winter Soldier. He saw how the government could not be trusted.
The point of Civil War is showing how they both changed their opinions. He's right, Iron Man was against the Government and Captain America was for it. But Civil War, continuing from Age of Ultron and Winter Soldier, showed how their experiences changed their viewpoints.
Edit: the situation is more complicated than he gives it credit for.
Spot on!
Precisely, he didn't care enough to pay attention
@@seele7561that’s not how a retcon works, changing from experience makes sense. That’s how people develop opinions
@@seele7561 I agree.
@@seele7561 This may come off rude and forgive me but that has to be the dumbest shit I've read in a comment section in a while. Changing your opinions based on your experiences is a significant trait of human beings.
Ben, you don’t understand Captain America. He’s not pro government, he’s pro America - the ideas and values America was built on. That’s why he was against registration.
It really feels like he didn’t watch Winter Soldier at all. That was literally what that movie was all about. The fact that times have changed and blind love for the government is no longer a thing. It’s way more complicated now. Caps character arc is the best in the Marvel universe by far. It’s not even close.
The movie has aged very well. Especially the scene where Zola talks about how people are now willing to sacrifice their freedom for security which would allow Hydra to take over. Sounds very much like the anti-second amendment and pro forced mandates crowd.
Its sad but Ben completely fumbled this one
@@fork6057I remember him also saying Rise of Skywalker was good. His movie takes are often terrible.
This is the problem with Ben. He doesn't like Marvel, so his take isn't that well informed, because he doesn't care enough. We are literally shown why both Tony and Steve switches sides over time.
One of the worst takes ive heard about captain america.
Disagree. That changed my view on cap vs iron man in civil war. Iron man completely abandons his beliefs.
Things about captain America becoming gen z was on point.
@@mickpagel4311after what he did in age of ultron, what hulk did, and what the team did at the beginning of civil war. It’s a pretty straight shot for him to say they need oversight.
@@itr8247 He was on point but still that is a good movie. /waaaayyy better then endgame.
From someone who collected, read, and knows the actual comic book characters Ben himself a comic book collector is wrong about Captain America. First Captain America was never pro government he has always been pro America. Anyone agreeing with Ben reminds me of The Red Skull. Do you fans of the movies know about a storyline in the 80's where through the machinations of The Red Skull the US government stripped the name and uniform of Captain America from Steve Rogers? For a time in the books (the source material) Steve Rogers was known as *Nomad.* Don't even try a reply with the excuse of *we're discussing the movies* because the first sentence I typed Ben knows the source material himself. Now Ben's talking about the movies too but it's not hard to take 15 or 20 seconds to talk about the difference between movie/book. It's something a person who hasn't read the books might appreciate even people here who believe Ben and agree with him that *Captain America was pro government, lol.*
Ben Shapiro is completely misunderstanding Captain America and Iron Man in Civil War...
Yeah Ben is really annoying when it comes to moves. We literally see character development with Captain America and Iron Man that leads to the views in Civil War. CA experienced government overreach in Winter Soldier and Iron Man experience superhero overreach in Age of Ultron. Thats why they take the positions they took.
Both make great points. Civil War is one of my favorite movies all time, much less favorite Marvel movies.
just like the writers and fans
Ben is not completely wrong about Iron Man's shift, though. He did fundamentally change sides from 2008 to Civil War, and it is barely prompted throughout the MCU.
I never thought about thanos manifesting new planets 😂
The Captain America films are some of the most conservative movies to come out of Hollywood in recent years. Ben's contempt for them has never made a lot of sense to me.
He’s so off on Captain America. Winter soldier is easily the best Marvel movie
Captain America was never supposed to be about the government. He was supposed to be about the IDEALS. That’s why his entire origin is him ignoring orders and sneaking off to rescue the other soldiers
@@tbone6032 cap is all about truth, justice and the American way
"He’s so off on Captain America. Winter soldier is easily the best Marvel movie"
The best movie with Avengers: Infinity War!
@@Age_of_Apocalypse that’s a tough sell. To have conclusive character arcs you need to count end game and end game is BRUTAL. Infinity war has very bad pacing problems too. Overrated
Excellent point. Cap represent America and the ideals it represents. He's not a government tool. His first act as a solider was going against orders to so the right thing
I don't necessarily agree about Winter Soldier being in the top 5, but I agree with the rest of what you said. Cap was totally turned off about the government by the time Civil War came around. He had been played and betrayed at almost every turn. His fight was about freedom, and the government was trying to curtail the freedoms of his work family. Made perfect sense to me. I'm shocked that Ben didn't see that angle.
Saying Thanos isn’t a good villian is criminal…
No, it's really reasonable.
is he though......? Like... how? Just cause he wants to kill people? Meh. He's not scary. and I genuinely don't know how to do this successfully but Ben is right about one thing, Marvel write crap villains. The red skull was at least believable, I mean Hitler wasn't great so.... that was fine. And they could have had a really great villain in Iron Man 3 then NOPE. Maybe the Vulture from Tom Holland's first Spider man. But other than that.... I don't think... there's been a really decent villain. Thanos included. Weeping over Gamorrah like he's a good guy at heart just a bit tortured. Oh please.
@@grandmatildyfromtennessee4605 Agreed. People complain about Kaecillius from the first Doctor Strange being "forgettable", but in truth he's not that different from the others. Yeesh. Marvel fans need to be taught logos.
People who think Thanos is a bad villian clearly haven't seen eternals...
@grandmatildyfromtennessee4605
Killmonger would have been a great villain if the rest of Black Panther wasn't so bad.
The reason for Tony Stark's shift is bc he's basically responsible for most of the bad things that have happened over the course of the films and feels guilty about it. Steve Rogers has no shift in ideology. The government does.
Exactly. I don't understand how Ben could have missed that
After that whole hydra thing in CA2, it's pretty understandable why cap doesn't really trust the authorities.
Correct.
Stark just has survivors remorse and PTSD from some of the bad things his Anarchist like nature caused by mistake. And wouod gladly five over authority to whoever can and will take it. In this case Shield and The Government.
Captain American was never loyal to the Government. He was loyal to the ideals it stood for in his time. Their ideals and what they stood for changed while he was frozen in ice. He didn't realize or accept that axiomatic fact at first. Then later it hit him all at once like a ton of bricks. That the united states government had literally become H.Y.D.R.A like literally.
And H.Y.D.R.A is who he was created to fight. So he fought them in their new form. The U.S Government.
Should have been called The Stark Accords.
Gee it’s almost like Marvel decided that they didn’t like Iron Man’s ‘capitalism good’ message and they wanted to tell everyone that what the most patriotic person ever (AKA Cap) would do is rage against the system.
Bruh, captain america and ironmans’ character developments over winter soldier, ultron, civil war, infinity war to endgame is a masterpiece.
That’s the whole point, their character development is to start off ideological, switch ideologies and learn nuance by the finale.
yeah hes a DC Homer so he checks out on Marvel, which I, honestly do the opposite ha ha
@@andrewlowden322I love DC and Marvel
Ben, you are totally contradicting yourself when you say that the subsequent movies after the origin story are boring because there's "no character development" but THEN you say you don't like Civil War because the characters are different.
Iron Man sides with the government in Civil War BECAUSE of what happened in Avengers Age of Ultron (both because his own tinkering created the evil robot and because their actions to stop Ultron resulted in so many dying. He wants the government to stop rogue actors and take the blame and the responsibility.)
Captain America doesn't side with the government in Civil War BECAUSE of what happened in Captain America 2: Winter Solider (both because he realizes that governments and bureaucracies are highly corruptable and because his best friend Bucky's brainwashing is a result of that. He doesn't want others' agendas to wrongly accuse his friend and take away the heroes' agency.)
Exactly
Exactly what I thought
So true and spot on
Top 5 in no particular order:
-Captain America: Winter Soldier
-Avengers
-Spider-Man: No Way Home
-Iron Man
-Ant Man
Ant Man holds a special place in my heart. When I saw it for the first time, I was in the hospital getting a bone marrow transplant after getting a leukemia diagnosis months before. My daughter was only four at the time, and the movie hit hard about being a dad needing to do whatever it took to stay in his daughters life and how much love between a dad and his daughter…..8 years later and still holds a special place in my heart
Yeah the father-daughter part REALLY gave it heart. Casting Paul Rudd made the character as much as RDJr made Ironman. Both were meh comics/characters but the actors made them very engaging. The worst crime is how they turned his loving little girl into the SJW. SMH
BTW my wife is in oncology/BMT so I hear a bunch about it (Im an accountant, not scientist) and I hope you are doing well here 8 years later!
Hope you’re doing well and happy new year!
I heard Marvel is making a comeback. Kevin Feige is firing all the directors who label themselves as ‘activists.’ He admits they’ve gone woke and wants to fix it.
Yea and Deadpool and Wolverine is just proof he’s going through with it
Good!
Part 2
ua-cam.com/video/hkhpcjH1n_Y/v-deo.html
I have a bridge to sell you.
Is he going to fire himself?
Tony Stark's transition in Civil War was crucial for his character arc.
Rocket isn’t actually an alien, the high evolutionary in Guardians 3 kidnaps animals from Earth to experiment on them and Rocket is one of them.
Yup. Rocket finds out that he is, in fact, a raccoon.
I was searching for this comment 🤣Rocket Raccoon is LITERALLY a raccoon. GotG 3 heavily focused on his origin
I knew his staff was joking about superman being a marvel hero but when he said that rocket isn't actually a raccoon, I was like did you not watch GOTG3??
Cap started out as a character who believed in the American government but through his experiences in Avengers, and definitely Winter Soldier, he begins to realize that the American government does not share the values he believes it should have. This is why he would be against registration. Iron Man on the other hand is a character who started off only caring about himself until he realized what his apathy had caused: his weapons being sold to terrorists and innocent people dying. He takes it upon himself to try and protect the world but often causes more harm than good. The wake up call for him was Ultron. After Ultron Tony begins to see that his way of protecting the world is not working and that despite his best efforts, innocent people are still dying because of his actions.
Actually, ideologically Captain America is about doing the right thing, no matter how much it costs. Iron Man has always been self-centered. Because he feels bad because Shirley's son died, he thinks everyone should do what he wants and sign.
Hell nahh Steve is the selfish one here.he doesn't give a fuck bout people's lives for the sake of their "freedom/freewill"
I've heard it's different in the comic books, but in the movie Cap only seems concerned about keeping his buddy from facing any consequences from killing and injuring tons of people. Not very heroic.
Cpt America: Winter Soldier better explains Rogers ideology and how he goes from supporting the government to his current view. Civil War was also a movie that shouldn’t have been made and strayed so far from the source material it didn’t really make sense
Cap is a Brooklyn kid who understands the plight of the downtrodden. Stark can't relate due to the extra resources his wealth provides. I also never saw Stark force Parker to sign. Hypocrisy.
That's true. It took very little to emotionally manipulate him. Granted what little it was, was still an unthinkable tragedy, and that poor woman should never have had to deal with such a loss. Tony may be smart as a whip, but his lack of proper parental rearing gave him some issues with self regulation.
Hating on Thanos is a horrible take
No, it's reasonable.
@@IkeMastreeexcept, it’s not
@@Qui-GonJinn1234 And WHY not?
I think Shapiro's analysis of Civil War is incorrect. Cap should be the one against the gov because he grew up in an era where Constitutional originalism was taught. So he knew what the essence of the gov should be: limited. Contrast that with Stark whose progression makes cultural sense as we have seen so many genius billionaires become pawns of the gov, like Zuckerberg or Gates. Cap in his rebellion still embodies American ideals, whereas Stark capitulates American ideals out of a sense of misplaced guilt.
We see Cap's progression in The Winter Soldier. He's trying to be a company man, just "following orders." And then he can't any further because he sees what the gov has become with its gross overreach.
Actually Steve Rogers grew up when FDR was President and running roughshod over the Constitution, in the name of helping people - and the American people loved him for it.
Absolutely correct, @rainmakr315. Your take is spot-on. Ben's analysis is way wrong; Steve Rogers is quintessentially American and we Americans are traditionally ANTI-government. Honestly, neither he nor Tony Stark would be pro-government, but of the two, handing Stark that role makes more sense in light of big tech being in bed with the state, as you point out.
All of this is truth.
It's played as character growth of both that went beyond its bounds they both overcorrected their faults by the time you get to civil war and then they both mellow out afterwards
Rocket is not an alien, the third film reveals he is a normal earth raccoon who was genetically and neurologically experimented on at his great suffering. This motivates him to embrace the fact he is a raccoon and that all animals deserve rights, not just humans and talking aliens. Vol. 3 is a great film with a serious message.
The reason Tony and Steve swith ideologies is that Tony has guilt over Ultron and wants a check on himself. Meanwhile, Steve doesn't trust the government after Winter Soldier.
Their characters aren't static. They grow and change over the course of the movies.
He completely missed that point
I love Ben but, I'm ganna have to disagree with him on this one.
Great story arcs
yeah I’m surprised that Ben missed the point of the last two Captain America movies. it’s basically Steve Rodgers fighting the deep state that has corrupted America
Could not cosign on this point more than I do. And to add to your point about Tony, he literally says in the movie that he's trying to fix things with Pepper by signing the Accords. It's a combo of guilt and selfishness in trying to win back Pepper.
This went RIGHT over his head, but I'm not surprised.
That take on Civil War and Captain America was almost as bad as Biden’s pres term
Best Marvel movies: Non-woke
Worst Marve movies: Woke as F
e
IM3, not woke, trash.
Love and Thunder, not woke, fucking trash
Thor 2, not woke, trash, (I kinda have a soft spot for it even thou it's 100% trash)
Far from Home: not woke, Super Trash.
@@TripleD2156 Far from Home pretty fun and what the hell is IM3? 2 other thor movies are average but not trash
@@0matters Ironman 3....really couldn't figure that one out?
And no Love and Thunder is one of the worst movies made in the last 10 years.
Well written vs poorly written would be more accurate.
Ben really needs to rewatch winter soldier and the first avenger. Two of the best anti government films I’ve ever watched
Wow ... Ben's read of Civil War was one of the worst I have ever seen.
Agreed, total misread of the characters.
Civil War is my least favorite pre phase 4 film and I still think he was being unfair to it. . .
Ben does get things wrong sometimes and this was one of them.
Yeah....Civil War was one of the best movies. He was way off-base with that.
Explain
Ben’s analysis seems lazily tainted by his stupid Twitter spats with Chris Evans. This makes him difficult to take seriously.
“Elon Musk, wearing a suit, flying around being a libertarian.” 😂
Yeah, but he doesn't shoot down Congress's attempts to control the suit until the 2nd movie, not the first movie.
How can you argue that Captain America and Iron Man seemed to have illogically swapped roles? Or that any of Steve’s actions, except maybe the early ones, were about loyalty to America?
From the very beginning, Steve Rogers demonstrated a rebellious streak, defying rules and expectations. His initial actions before turning into “Captain America” involved visiting multiple army recruiting offices, lying about his health and identity in a desperate attempt to join the fight. After becoming “Captain America”, he disregarded orders and single-handedly liberated an entire platoon of soldiers from Hydra.
In the first Avengers movie, he goes against Shield’s authority by breaking into the carrier to uncover its secrets after Iron Man hacks into Shield's mainframe, revealing that Nick Fury might be hiding something.
Later, Steve conceals the truth about the death of Tony Stark’s parents to protect his childhood friend, who was responsible for the murders. The U.S. wanted to ratify the Sokovia accords- once again, Steve rebelled when he perceived the accords were more about “control”.
His decisions were never about blind loyalty to the U.S. government but about doing what was right, even when the personal cost was high. His journey is one of unwavering friendship and loyalty, often when the stakes are impossible, driven by a strong moral compass and an unyielding commitment to his convictions.
Oof I’m gonna have to disagree with captain America, he’s for freedom. He fights for the people and constitution, not the government.
Ben is way off about Captain America. Just because he was a soldier, doesn't mean the government controls him. He does not get Marvel at all.
Ben, I understand why you might think that Civil War makes no sense, because that's if you rip Tony and Steve straight from their first movies. There were events that transpired that led to them believing how they do in Civil War. For Tony, his creative and literal freedom is what led to Ultron being created, so he wants to effectively collar himself afterwards. For Cap, in his second movie, he discovered how corrupt the government who created him is, so he uses the gifts given to him to fight against it
Winter Soldier is bad because they changed Tony who’s message was: Capitalism is good, into the bad guy. Then gave the good guy, Cap, the most patriotic, all American guy in the world, the position of America is evil rage against the patriarchy.
Also he’s right that Cap doesn’t act anything like a kid from 1940’s Brooklyn.
Is it possible for Ben Shapiro to not view everything with a political lens. I feel like it would get exhausting
Yeah honestly, sometimes I feel he’s not much better than the leftists. He called Captain America a “soy boy” then didn’t give any actual reasons why. It’s like the left calling us incels or chuds. You can’t just use a buzzword as your argument.
It’s his career…
oh, no it is SUPER important to view everything with a political/ideological lens...! I just think sometimes Ben's gets a bit narrow. The thing with Captain America/Iron Man, that's just.... blinkered watching. taking your worldview and critical thinking into the cinema with you, especially now when movies are made so militantly ideological anyway... it NEEDS to be exhausting but also I think he misses context, story-lines etc. Iron Man's journey to supporting the government - Should be obvious. (kinda dumb but still obvious). The story line in Captain Marvel about immigrants=good or at least harmless - I notice Ben didn't say anything about. and I genuinely don't know if that's because he is ignoring context or... you know, maybe he's just a guy and he misses it :)
@@katlyndobransky2419 Then he should stick to it and stop reviewing movies.
The thing is he's earning 💵 out of it unlike the other sad and lonely ones who's the main reason he is earning 😂
I kind of agree with most of what Ben said, but strongly disagree with the point he was trying to make with civil war. He clearly doesnt get into them, so he misses a lot of the character development. Steve doesn't like the government because he learns it is corrupt and no longer for the people (hydra). Tony doesnt necessarily like the government, but he sees the disaster his tech and the Avengers do, and the negative effects they have had to date, so he feels there needs to be limits and boundaries to what they do. Civil war is the movie that helps Tony to realize the balance that's needed and how he was wrong to allow the government to have control over his friends. That, along with don't fight with your brothers and sisters and kill yourselves. This is just the tip of the iceberg, but in a nutshell, you need to understand the comics, lore, and actually like what you are watching to accurately rate the Marvel universe. Ben can't do this, as he himself admits its not his cup of tea.
Tony switches because yes in Iron Man 1 he wanted to put the onus of protecting the world on him but then in Avengers Age of Ultron he majorly messes up by creating an AI robot that almost destroys the world so his remorse makes him switch to being open about having an overlying system make them have accountability for their great power
Also Cap stands for American ideals- freedom and limited federal control haha. Pretty explanatory in Civil War. Gonna have to disagree w Ben here 😂
@@aldonc1407yes and no. I think ben is correct in noting that in the beginning cap has been on the side of the government. And then the entire government organization turned out to be vastly infiltrated by the ally organization of the nazis, so therefore he grows sceptical of anything that gives powers to individuals he doenst trust
Exactly! That was my thought! I had to disagree with Ben on that one.
Ben c l e a r l y missed that in Civil War, it was pretty obvious why Tony and Steve switch ideologies
Furthermore, Hank Pym actually created Ultron but the movies changed it to give Tony the MAJOR guilt trip. (also the Stark branded bomb that should have killed Wanda and Pietro)
Winter Soldier is the best Marvel movie.
Yeah but capt America saw the Germans become authoritarian, so he understands that registering with the govt would be a bad idea line 1940s Jewish in Germany. He saw it, he didn’t just read about it like ironman.
But this is captain America’s character development. He starts off as someone who follows the govt like a lib, but becomes fully aware that govt is made up of people and those people’s agendas can change. That’s how he changes. His journey was the best but ultimately a bit hard to see if you were just a casual marvel movie goer.
Such a good explanation. I love it!
His arc was the worst. He literally runs away from any authority and accountability for the deaths he caused. His answer to the deaths is "hmmm well you win some you lose some"....he feels like he can enter any country and kill whoever they want so long as they think they're bad 😅....
Plus, after CA: Winter Soldier he saw how easily Hydra was able to infiltrate the US government and use the government's power to oppress and threaten the American public.
@@m.m4982 there’s a line in the movie about that. He said “it may not be perfect, but the safest hands are still our own”. Saying that, while there were casualties, it would’ve been worse without their intervention, and being under the control of the govt could mean being the very oppressive thing that he saw in the previous movie “winter soldier” where they used giant planes pointing guns at everyone if someone became a threat. Capt understood that the word “threat” is subjective to the person wielding the gun.
You know I remember a time where liberals were the anti establishment and conservatives were the establishment. Funny how things have flipped since 2008
Decent list. His criticism on Ironman’s and Cap’s switch on the views of the government is off. The movies show why they changed their minds with Cap realizing his absolute trust in the government, military and its higher up leaders and secret organizations makes him distrust it all and he becomes more independent and libertarian in terms of super hero oversight.
I don’t believe Tony Stark actually believes it’s the right thing to do to register with the government and have as much oversight, but I think he feels so much guilt for what he created in age of Ultron that he feels responsible and is trying his best to check himself and to prove to everyone else that he won’t allow this to happen again and do some damage control. I imagine he thinks this oversight keeps him accountable from having too much destructive power again. It’s kind of a cool flip of both characters.
WHY IS WINTER SOLIDER NOT IN YOUR TOP FIVE!!!!!!!!!!
Good question! It is in my top five: an awesome movie! 😍
Literally my number 1 lol
Because it is overrated. It's not bad, but it is not some masterpiece and not near the original Iron Man.
@@johnadams3418I feel the same way
One of the most overrated Marvel movies
Cap being against government and iron man being for is set up in their previous movies. You have to pay attention to their arcs. Cap starts out blindly following orders but starts distrusting fury / shield i n cap 2. Iron man starts as a rebel and discovers his carelessness is aiding terrorism and he feels guilty for the deaths in sokovia. So he agrees to be held accountable by the govt in civil war. Ultimately when he learns buckey killed his parents that is the final rip between them.
I’m with everyone else here in saying that he’s ignoring all the Iron Man and Cap movies and the avengers movies that preceded civil war that got them to those positions
Ben: "There's no character development in the sequels."
Also Ben: "Steve and Tony are completely different people in Civil War."
They ideologically switch places because character development/character arc. Captain America doesn't trust authorities because of what happened in winter soldier. Iron man is no longer a Maverick because of the guilt he experiences for all the problems he caused. This switching of roles is one of the things that makes the infinity saga brilliant story telling.
This exactly.
Saying guardians 2 is one of the worst movies is such a wild ass take
Not really
Gina Carano as Captain Marvel would've been badass 😁
Yes!!!!!!
She can’t really act, I found her acting poor in Deadpool and The Mandalorian.
She’s a terrible actress 😂. Hate what happened to her at Disney, but once again, she’s dreadful at acting
@@liampower2866 so she has the same acting capacities that Brie Larson has.
But Gina is much more carismatic and kind, and a lot of people like her much more.
@@sergiom1136lol so your argument is she’s less shitty than Brie Larson at acting, but is still shitty, so she should have played captain marvel? 😂
Ben talking about Captain America Civil War: none of the characters make sense
Also Ben: explains why (admittedly pretty well) only two characters don't make sense
Ben was clearly so bored by the MCU he didn't pay attention to any of the movies if he thought it didn't make sense Ironman was willing to have government oversight and Cap said no way.
One of the main themes of Ironman 3 and Age of Ultron was that Tony was his own worst enemy and created so many problems with his impulsiveness and obsessions. Tony has started to learn from those mistakes, and then finding out the actions of the avengers led to so many innocent deaths really pushed over the edge to be open to supervision. Plus, I think it's heavily implied Tony was always going to be willing to bend the rules when the chips were down anyways like we see at the end of Civil War when he leaves to go help Cap.
As for Cap, he saw the corruption of his government organization firsthand with Hydra infiltrating SHIELD from within in Winter Solider. Of course Cap doesn't trust the government anymore when he's seen firsthand that even those with good intentions in his own government can cause massive harm when unchecked.
It's like Ben read a wiki summary on the 2 characters and nothing else and then watched Civil War and was confused lol.
Nobody asked
I think Antman Quantamania is my favorite. Kang the Conqueror is indeed one of the most Ruthless and determined MARVEL Villains and is clearly the most volatile villain the MCU has introduced so far.
Glad that everyone agrees, Captain America is the best
Also.. dude every line out of Thanos’ mouth is an iconic and has become a meme. He will go down as one of the best villains of the last 20 years as time progresses
Captain America opposes the federal government control in Civil War because in Winter Soldier he learns of the possibility for corruption.
Iron Man is in favor of federal government control because he believes that he caused too much damage from events like Avengers 2012, and wants to relinquish some personal responsibility to the government
Yeah it’s evolved… iron man realizes his god complex and wants oversight because no one should operate without consequences…
Cap like you said was aware of the corruption and accepted that he isn’t good or bad just a tool of the government as a soldier!
Ben hasn't read or didn't understand old Captain America comics. Since the 1960s he's never been the government's lackey.
Captain America isn't blindly loyal to the American government. He's loyal to the American ideals of freedom and justice. And in The Winter Soldier he discovered that SHIELD had become dangerous and corrupt, which led to his distrustful attitude in Civil War. Meanwhile, Tony's arrogance and recklessness got innocent people killed in Age of Ultron, which is why he embraced accountability in Civil War. Character development.
In Cap's letter to Tony at the end of Civil War he literally says he believes in people, ie individualism, over the collective. His rejection of government control of the Avengers is based upon this. Civil War could also be read as a metaphor for gun control, with Cap taking the position of defending the 2nd amendment.
It is a fair point about Cap not holding on to that "man out of time" feel. Other than a few random jokes that completely goes away as the show goes on. It was present in the first Avengers than just disappears.
He's so wrong about Civil War lol. Tony Stark switched sides because (1) he created Ultron and almost annihilated the entire planet because he put everything in his hands that even his team, except Banner knew (2) his guilt when a kid was killed at the start of the movie. Cap's ideals changed during Winter Soldier where he realized that governing bodies have different agendas and can be controlled by people like Hydra.
Ben using FEELINGS than FACTS.
2:13 - He most definitely is a racoon
Video idea:
Ben reacting to a compilation of all of the Skibidi videos
😮
I'm not sure I can handle the brain rot
11:29 Ultron, the artificial intelligence Tony created, destroyed Sarkovia. Everett Ross leads with this information when proposing the Sarkovia accords to Tony. It is for this reason he believed his power needed to be overseen. Captain America was also on the side of the American government until he learned Tony had interned scarlet witch, breaking his trust in him. It may not be like the comics but there are logical reasons provided in the movies for why these characters take the stances they take.
3:01 I have to stop here and make a post that Captain America. Civil War was a pretty good movie contrasting the freedom of the individual versus the tyranny of the state.
agreed one of my favorites
Saying thanos isn’t a good villain is a wild statement
In civil war Captain America sides against the government because of his 1940s morals. The governments interest in totalitarian control of power in that movie is part of what grove Capt to fight the Nazis.
Meanwhile ironman became afraid of his power and freedom following iron man 3 as well as age of Ultron, because his lack of oversight and regulations nearly killed everyone on earth.
Did he even watch Captain America 2 where Captain America is realizing the government was infiltrated by nazis and then stops blindly following his government ?
Winter soldier is number 1
Ben, you more than anyone should understand that siding with America doesn’t automatically mean siding with the government. Too much faith in the government can be a problem and this is the whole point of Cap in the modern day. It’s not the 1940s anymore
5. Winter Soldier 4. Iron Man 3. Infinity War 4. Guardians of the Galaxy 1. Civil War
winter soldier and civil war are definitely up there, but Iron man 3 kinda flew over my head (not bad in my opinion just not memorable for me)
@@Sinister64not iron man 3… it’s the first iron man in the 4th best slot 👍
Iron man one is way better than civil war
@@Meyer-gp7nqcool man
Getting multiple ads for marvel games and movies throughout the video was a nice treat lol
No Spider-Man on Ben’s list is insane…
Non of the MCU spiderman films come close to the two animated films or Raimis 1 & 2
Tom Holland spider-man movies were pretty mid tbh.
Mcu spiderman isnt spiderman....hes iron man light and doesnt make sense. Holland is good in the role....its a mid series
Tobey Maguire is Spider-Man
It’s actually highly understandable
Iron man has seen where if he is left unchecked, he can cause mass destruction by doing stuff like creating ultron and he feels at fault for Socovia because he was limitless in what he thought he could do, he also felt the same way about the team in Logos that kills a ton of people. Captain America trusted in shield which turned out to be controlled by hydra making him start to distrust the government he once pledged himself to, then when tony made ultron it made cap think that he couldn't even trust the avengers fully, so when he was told that he was going to have to do the bidding of the UN, an organization that was created after he was frozen so probably doesn't view it like a lot of people do, he decided that it would be best if he refused because he has seen every other organization that he has ever trusted be corrupted in some way shape or form...
What's funny is that you said that you didn't like it because of the characterization in this movie but its specifically the character development that made the movie so great, they truly understood the characters and based their decisions on their experiences in the franchise thus far.
Winter Soldier should have been your number 1!
Best movie Marvel have made imo. It's like a spy thriller. Fantastic movie
You don't get to decide what someone else's number 1 is.
Mid Imo
Its been a great movie
Just not the kind of movie I go to marvel for
@@srl4050 I stopped watching mcu when all the movies became the same. Ant man was a cool heist movie, cap America 2 fantastic spy thriller, guardians 1 amazing motley crue team family movie.
Infinity War and Endgame sharing 6th was wild. Also Guardians 2 in worst 5 is nuts.
Rocket is a racoon...lol. Literally a racoon operated on by the high evolutionary.
He's not a racoon. He's a rabbit...
4:50 Yeah, the argument was so lazy, but in the comic books it is actually pretty good.
There, Thanos was an outsider from a little age, and he had only one friend: Mistress Death. Thanos was in love with her and wanted to prove his love, so he killed half of the Earth's population as a gift to Death.
tbh i would say the comic is not as good as the movie, idk im not a huge fan of thanos being this evil monstorous villain who just wants to kill for a girl, ik it sounds dumb but yeah thats how i feel. And in the movies he was being built up for 10 years, did everything he did because he had a clear goal, and i thought he was still scary and menacing while also like not being very monsterous like darkseid or something. I just think it works that's all
@@saahithsreeram1680 Pft. Yeah, also the Bayformers are better than G1.
The reason that Iron Man was for the registration and Captain America wasn't, is because of their character arcs. Tony Stark was reckless and he created Ultron and nearly killed Pepper and himself by challenging the fake Mandarin. Also, he had panic attacks from the alien invasion, because he now knew that the threats were bigger and he couldn't trust himself. So he wants the collective strength of the world to defend it from this threat. Steve Rogers grew up in a time when a person was born, lived and died barely cognizant that there was a federal government. You looked to your community. Then he had the experience of Winter Soldier, where he realized you could not put you trust in powerful institutions because they can be corrupted, as Hydra did to SHIELD, or even by well meaning halfwits. Hence he says "the safest hands are still our own." Also, the country is not the government, it is the people. So he is still patriotic, just not a blind obedient to government.
Let's not forget that Tony's background before the first Iron Man movie was as a contractor making weapons for the government. He was a cog in the system of regulatory control over power, and that's the world he understood. The events of the first movie showed him the destructive forces he was contributing to, and he created the Iron Man suit as a means of attempting to atone for that, but as we saw in the second film, the system kept right on going with Justin Hammer. Tony's attempts at privatizing world peace were ultimately illusory because once he was confronted with the bigger galactic threats that exist he fell right back to the systems he was familiar with as a contractor.
@@Vader47000 Good point.
I don't think Ben understands Thanos. The writing difference of the villain in Infinity War and Endgame are meant to show two different sides of Thanos. Infinity War portrayed him as a broken person from a broken planet, and the audience is meant to sympathise with him since the film highlights his trauma and regret for not doing enough. Basically the opposite of Iron Man who did everything and didn't do enough. Then in Endgame, we see that, indeed, Thanos is still that broken person, but his ego, maliciousness and self-righteousness is highlighted
Rocket is not an alien that looks like a racoon. He's an actual racoon (from earth) that was experimented on and scientifically modified by a mad alien genius psycopath.
He's not a racoon. He's a rabbit...
Not having Winter Soldier in the top 5 automatically disqualifies this list.
The iron man / Cap switch is actually important and you should appreciate it Ben! The whole point is that Cap realizes that the government has become corrupt (winter soldier movie) and chooses to stand for Ameircan ideals even when the American government refuses to, that's why he can't submit blindly to tyranny, he's seen what that looks like (ww2). Iron Man is on a journey away from self centered pride, and part of that journey is seeing his failures in Ultron, which leaves him in a place where he is trying to be accountable where before he lacked accountability. PS Infinity War is the best comic book movie, showcasing the utter failure of the heroes when they refuse to work together and be united as a team.
“Civil war makes no sense because the characters were different 8 years ago”. LOL
He doesn't care about the movies much, I think if he'd truly watch them one by one and analyze them combined he would see it differently, but he has a life, children and a business, he just does these rankings for us, and honestly it's still great even if I disagree with his rankings. Just seeing him talking about Marvel is perfect.
The fact Iron Man and Captain America 'swapped places' is exactly the character development most of us love. These 2 main characters of the Infinity Saga perfectly mirror eachother.
What a terrible ranking
Ok…
Alrighty folks!!
Best comment
Beans on rye and call me a fry
Shapiro definitely missed the entire point of Captain America...his arc over the movies, especially after what happened to Shield in Winter soldier is the reason he doesnt trust the government with the totalitarian authority...on the other end Iron man is feeling the guilt over creating Ultron, and his fear of what happened in New York during the first Avengers is why he is in support of the accords....reluctantly...but to him its the middle ground...
Captain America did the same in the comics as he did in the civil war movie....he planted himself like a tree and told them "no, you move"...he held his grounds for what was right...not just because he wanted to save Bucky....he realized when Tony had put Wanda under house arrest basically after what happened in the beginning in Lagos.... She was a prisoner...Cap saw it was a slippery slope then...
Ben should make a Star Wars UA-cam Channel
For someone all about facts and logic, I found it perplexing that you like Antman.
I mean how can one shrink an entire building and put it in a suitcase, if reducing its size does not reduce its density.
The same goes with making the keychain made out of a real tank.
Part 2
ua-cam.com/video/hkhpcjH1n_Y/v-deo.html
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It’s about being entertained, for him. Not dissecting every movie and nitpicking so much.
@@Eskewsme But what I described was the main thesis of the Antman’s power
And the keychain was used as a trump card in the final scene which is hardly nitpicking
@@jenoskun I’m a very casual Marvel fan. And I remember seeing Antman and thinking: “Wow, this was actually pretty entertaining. That’s cool. I enjoyed this film more than some of the other Marvel movies, and I’ve never even heard of Antman.”
And never watched it again. I think it’s that simple.
The EFAP podcast had fun with this vid
Agreed
I mean, they were right about Ben.
Captain America DOES EVERYTHING that you said he doesn’t do.
Interesting to note no Logan no X2.
10:27 how dare you indeed?!
I had a crush on Tony Stark when he was a cartoon character; fifty-ish years later, I still do. What can I say? Glam-mama has a type. ♥
Nah you're just a woman and thry like money lol.
I love when they used the Spiderman 3 James Brown song for The Marvels lmao
Best Marvel movie: Avengers
Worst Marvel movie: Love and Thunder
The Eternals needed to make the worst list
IMO captain marvel, the marvels and eternals are the top 3 worst by some way.
Probably didn’t watch it.
Nobody watched it.
@@9tailjeza wish I didn’t too lol
Spiderman with Tobey McGuire and Captain America are definitely the best.
Not even a Spiderman mention???!! 😢
Captain America Winter Soldier easily the best marvel movie by far!!
Putting Civil War in the bottom 5 is just staright up insane
Okay. I think his list proves when it comes to movies he has absolutely NO CLUE what he's talking about.
Ben, Cap is basically a Republican... regardless of what you think of Chris Evans, the character is pure gold.
You honestly have the worst taste in marvel films
Top 5:
Infinity War
Endgame
Civil war
Deadpool & Wolverine
Far From Home/ AOU
Worst 5:
Black panther: Wakanda Forever
Eternals
Captain Marvel
The Marvels
Ironman 3
yours is just as bad - not having Iron Man 1 in the top five is a crime
@@tjsherpa why?? I never liked the Ironman trilogy. I think top 5 is good especially my top 3
Ant Man is one of the Most underrated MCU
Usually good takes but disliking civil war isnt okay😢
I remember losing it laughing when Ben pinned Chris Evans' tweet that read, "I really dislike Ben Shapiro"