I would like to add a few words of advice if I may. Intermountain 33 inch metal wheels, kadee couplers, and cars weighted to NMRA standards. Also have all your couplers either body mounted or truck mounted but do not mix. A kadee coupler height gauge is a must. Thank you for the paperclip tip. 36 inch intermountain metal wheels for passenger cars.
I figured that at some point I'm going to have to upgrade my rolling stock. However, the track work has to be good to eliminate sections where "something always derails there." My old turnouts were giving me problems, so the paperclip spring seemed to fix that issue. I have a couple of other problem spots that I'm going to fix next. Then I'll look at the metal wheels and Kadee couplers. I heard somewhere that HO scale rollingstock can use different size wheels, is that true? I may need to invest in a pair of calipers so I know what size I have... Thanks for the comment and for watching.
Someone mentioned it's an old idea. Others mentioned switching to A different brand. It's a old idea that I did not know. Someone else mentioned he did not explain how how or why this fixes the problem. Without the explanation, I had no idea what it was that he was doing to Improve the turn out. I'm in no position to buy new anything. Everything I get is used so if I end up with atlas so be it. But now If I have an issue, because of this video I know how to fix it for a about a penny instead of going out and paying twenty dollars to fifty dollars for a new turn out. One cent fix for a fifty dollar problem. Works for me and thanks for the video!
I didn't know about this until a bit ago when I stumbled across it. I too am on a very tight budget so anything to prolong the life of something, or an inexpensive way to have fantastic results I look for, and then share here. You're welcome for the video, I had hoped it would be beneficial to the community. Glad you found value with the video and good luck with your own layout. Thanks for watching and welcome aboard.
You would be better off by going with peco switches/turnouts. They are already spring loaded and work flawlessly. Yes they cost more but the product is that much better.
True, and I will probably go through and change them out over time, but for now this looks like it won't be a bad substitute. Thank you for your comment and welcome aboard!
Yeah I was wondering the same. Peco points (yes here in Australia they're called points/turnouts), are spring loaded and I have never even seen any points no matter what brand that are not spring loaded. Had me guessing what was going on with the paper clip.
Very quickly Philip: 1/ Shinohara were springless. 2/ The paperclip, being supposedly spring steel, is a really good idea. The problem is same as all those overcentre springs, they wear out the bearing holes in the plastic ties (sleepers). The effect is made worse (I wanted 'exascerbated', but am at war with Spalcheque today) by the paperclip not being exactly square in its bends. Suggest you read my earlier comments. 3/ The world map is printed upside down.
Hmm? Might be a good idea to find a copy of kalmbach's John Armstrong publication 'Track Planning for Realistic Operation'. Have a look at the section on 'S' curves. It is a bit hard to tell, especially in the time I don't have available as I write this, but is the derailing car and the cars either side still under distortion from the S curve on the approach to the turnout? Things move in straight lines and the curves and curves in turnouts actually accelerate from that straight line. I find, particularly on 'S' bends, trouble lurks whenever at least a car length is not left between the end of one curve and the start of another. And yes, even if the curves are in the same direction. Simplify before ballasting. The problem might be in the track geometry, not in the turnout. That spring is like the 'over-centre' spring of Peco. I tried a similar idea on some old Shinohara (N 1/160). The principle is sound; the problem is wear of the hole in the tie which is in effect a bearing. 1/ soft and hard material; that's good 2/ Even so, the tie 'bearing' wears large, causing loss of spring tension, and even more wear 3/ Situation made worse by our sloppy engineering introducing stresses as things are not square. For example when you squeeze down the cut ends the forces bend the wire against the supporting hole and the bent angle wreaks havoc in use. Peco last better because they are engineered better. You could retire on just one of their die machines. The best solulution is p-r-o-b-a-b-l-y (good for touch typing practise finding the hyphen) to machine a couple of tiny brass bushes to carry the wear. Still a soft and a harder material, but much better than too soft a material. Problem is it needs a lathe. Probably better to instal a ground throw as I have on my 'layout'. You still have too soft and hard, but the forces are gentle and non torsional. In use throw the bar just far enough to feel tension. You can make an omega loop in the wire between the machine and the turnout, but not needed and that introduces a torsion effect. If we lived nearby I would invite you round to see EVERY error in the book. Gotta go mate; hope this helps, and thanks to 'Michelle' below. Let's all share ideas. None of us are always right; mercifully neither are we always wrong.
Thank you for the thoughtful response. Yes, I am looking at moving the turnouts farther back on the arrival departure track. In fact that will be the next video. The paperclip is a good stop gap, but I think a peco turnout down the road is probably the better way to go. but for now, this is working and I can do some operations, once I move the turnouts and take care of the derailments. I'd love to come and visit your layout! Always looking out for good ideas, plus I love seeing what other people's creative juices create. Thanks again, and welcome aboard!
@@dcrrails3402 I wonder if you would be kind enough to do two things for the Utube community: give us a first name; and establish a 'gmail' under the Comments tag. Comments are of little use as no attachments can be sent, and one must be careful mentioning brand names. I notice a very respectable British reviewer/commentator was recently censured by a manufacturer a while back. You might notice the major magazines ensure the protection of 'Ivy League' or equivalent editorship. Gmail gives us at least minimal protection, and you still have anonymity, a luxury not afforded to your correspondent. I'll try and find some useful things for you, but I need a gmail. There is nothing necessarily wrong with the turnout you have now. It is at least as good (or bad) as the rest of the layout, and can be made work. Its real problem is the plastic crossing, but again, make it work. Remember the first rule of model railroading 'Neva spend eniphink!' (Spalqueque is appalled). Yes, moving turnouts is great. When I designed my current layout, I sat on track design, I slept on track design, I patted the golden retriever on track design, and so-on. Over time your thinking changes, and a kind of 'being' is there that wasn't there before. It's all about straight lines. There was one place I could not 'straigten'; guess where the problems are years later! Sometimes you are forced to hand-lay. Don't head for the peppermints: just work at it. Anyway, I hope this encourages you. Sorry this sounds 'preachy''; the mood it's written in is the opposite to that. Simply no time to write it properly.
You are also experiencing problems because you using the old hook horn couplers. There is a reason that the manufacturers stopped using them. Kadee couplers do not put lateral forces on the cars. The hook horn couplers do. Besides that, hook horn couplers look like crap. Go visit any club layout, no one is using hook horn couplers.
@@petert9749 Your insights are truly valued, and I’m grateful for the time you took to share them. You're not preachy at all. I really appreciate the thoughtful feedback. The journey of building and adjusting my layout has been a learning curve, and I realize now how much more flexibility I could have had with a wall-mounted layout. The 8x4 tabletop was my initial vision and I just made it bigger turning it into a 6 x 10 table, but I'm seeing the limitations now that everything is in motion. I realize now that I could have much more track if I redesigned the layout to run along the wall and into the garage and I stand in the middle I'd have much more straight track and room and use the same amount of usable space. So, when the deep freeze goes out, I will get an upright freezer and then I can rearrange the garage, build the new layout along the walls, and have a whole new set of problems to solve! Your point about living with the track design until it becomes a part of you resonates with me, and I’ll take that to heart as I plan for the future. Thank you again for your encouragement and for participating in this journey. Your perspective is a big help as I navigate through these creative endeavors!
@@pmsteamrailroading I also plan on dealing with the couplers. I just boxed up the train as a kid. Now that I've got time and a place to build I pulled everything out and started working on a layout. I agree the old hook-horn has its share of issues. I'm also considering replacing the plastic wheels with metal ones when I'm ready to tackle changing the couplers. But first, I need the tracks in place and not causing issues. Thanks for the feedback and thank you for joining me on this journey.
Also if you want trains to run anything like smooth you are going to have to do something about that " turnout curve " piece the tracks have to join as smoothly as possible
Yes, the turnouts from the mainline to the arrival/departure track definatnly need some attention. In fact, that is the subject of my next video. Stay tuned and thanks for watching.
An old idea, but I've never had much luck implementing it due to bending straight wire into the proper shape and length. This demonstration is a few steps simpler and seems just as effective. Nice job!
I used too be in the hobby and loved splurging on railcars that I normally couldn't afford to look at not alone own. Knowing that the cars where a serious piece of craftsmanship, precise engineering and everything else that justified the manufacture's three digit price tag of some limited run car, I knew they were designed to run flawlessly but setting the car on a mainline rail on my layout and crossing over a turnout and jumping the rails E V E R Y single time - in both directions frustrated me to the point where I ended up redesigning the entire layout and eventually giving the hobby up for the sake of my sanity. I think your resolution to the problem I was having would have found me still running my layout to this very day. All I can say is PECO, Eat your heart out!!😏
This is called an over-centre spring. Peco switches have them built in. The paperclip will be fine, but the key element is to make sure that the distance between the turnout''s existing hole and the one you drill in the next tie is just fractionally SMALLER than the distance between the two prongs of the trimmed paperclip. That's what makes the clip want to spring back to full extension. It works even better with really springy wire, like a guitat string, which will not soften and lose its springiness over the years like a paperclip.
I noticed some cars rocking very easily as if they have no weight🧐had similar issues and some of my issues were self induced like ballasting and couplers but the major one was weight of the cars! Most were underweight! Harbor freight has tire weights and I have a diagram I follow per length of rolling stock and add the necessary weight sometimes going over a bit on purpose. Now my trains can go several laps without derailing!
There are so many factors that cause derailments. I know trackwork is one cause, and then car weights is another. Most of my rollingstock I got as a kid, so it is more of a toy than a model, but with some tune ups that can be corrected. Thanks for the tip, I'll be checking into the weights down the road. Tuning up the rail cars is going to be in my future. Thank you for commenting and watching.
You failed to explain what this changes in the way the switch behaves. Is it merely to act as a spring to keep the points to one side or the other on a manual turnout? That is a very old idea.
You're correct. I left that out. I have very old turnouts. I kept them when I put the trains away as a kid. I thought I'd use them now and they aren't holding up well. I found the paperclip thing and it seems to work okay on my layout so I thought I'd share. It might be old, but I didn't know about it until just recently. Thanks for watching.
It's a old idea that I did not know. You or someone else mentioned.He did not explain how how or why this fixes the problem. Without the explanation, I had no idea what it was that he was doing to Improve the turn out. I'm in no position to buy new anything. Everything I get is used so if I end up with atlas so be it. But now If I have an issue, because of this video I know how to fix it for a about a penny instead of going out and paying twenty dollars to forty dollars for a new turn out. One cent fix for a forty dollar problem. Works for me and thanks for the video!
I use PECO turnouts, I do have one or two Atlas and two Shinohara #8 curved ones as well. I find this video amusing because many modellers claim that one should remove the spring in the PECO turnout so they will work with a Tortoise machine, I leave the spring in and just use a thicker wire on the Tortoise. I made a spring turnout with a length of piano wire and some track nails, adjust the length of the wire so that your lightest rolling stock will push the points over without derailing.
Twisting motion on long wagons and carriages cause derailments. Needs a short straight to prevent the snaking effect as this produces two opposite forces...
I'm going to rework the location of the turnouts for the Arrival/Departure track and make a straight piece between the two turnouts. Thanks for the comments and for watching.
Super. I did something similar, but without an overthrow spring. I straghten a smaller paperclip, put a small loop in one end, then I poke the paperclip through the point throw bar where the switch machine connects. I get four track spikes, and put two into the layout, facing each other, holding down the middle of the paperclip, like a pivot, with the loop facing up. Then I push the loop end of the paperclip sideways to move the points and add two track spikes by the loop end, about 1/2" apart, with their heads facing out to catch the loop end of the clip. To switch tracks, I grip the loop, slide sideways slightly to unhook the spike head, lift, and slide sideways, moving the switch points, then replace the loop end against the other spike head. I provide the point tension and lock the points in that direction manually, by having the clip bend slightly, without any point overthrow springs. These work great, and are a cheap, easy, and effective turnout control method to allow operation during track construction, and they allow you to operate with no switch machines or throws until you can add them, and I even put paper clips on two overthrow spring equipped turnouts just to have a handle to switch them with. I still have six of them in use on an unscenicked seven track staging yard, mostly because of sentiment, because the rest of the layout has electric switch machines or high or low ground throws. Hello from the Tracy Mountain Railway in Colorado. 💙 T.E.N.
Other brands of points maybe cost more, but they will be cheaper in the long run. Another idea is to not have curved track right next to points. Another idra to help would be if possible to use flexi track for curves and S curves.
This is a neat thing that I wish I had thought of. Instead, I gave up on Atlas switch tracks and went with Peco, which have these springs already installed.
Dear DCR Rails, as so many commentators said before, Peco sells their turnouts with an over-centre spring installed. Also, Tim Warris from Fast Tracks Turnouts has made a great video on making your own over-centre springs out of piano wire. Great when the paperclip method works for the particular turnout on your layout. Nevertheless, it may be worth checking the video from Tim I mentioned, especially when the loop on the paperclip may show to be too wide to accommodate the appropriate spring action to put firmly the point rails in their positions on the stock rails. Just to close, I humbly think it’s instrumental to keep this possible tweak on our ‘hard drives.’ Therefore I very much appreciate your reminder! Cheerio
OK, nice trick, you made sure that the switch rails are kept as close as possible to their corresponding heel rails. More modern turnouts are spring loaded by design while older types left this task for the point motor mechanism. But what about the turnout you removed?
Fun fact about paperclips, invented in Norway in 1899. Nice seeing you improve what you have but I would look into modern trackwork if you can before committing to much more scenic work, Hi from UK 👍
I didn't know the fun fact. Thanks for sharing. I keep wanting to get to doing scenery, but the track work is keeping me busy! Thanks for watching and commenting.
Life Like Power Lock track and have fun setting up everyway you can imagine , always another way to lay track , about 3 or 4 months and it changes , get nickel silver
2 things--- dont try to cram too many tunouts in a really small area, and ALWAYS ALWAYS check the track by eyeballing it for smooth flow when installing it! From all directions!!!
Good points. I may have been over zealous with the industries. I added two more from the original track plan as I wanted places for operations. I have three real problem areas, and the one in the video was the worst offender as it was on the arrival/departure track and everything runs over that particular turnout. However, I plan on running the trains slower on the inner loop with the industries and all, so hopefully with good turn outs and the paperclip spring on the older turnouts things will go well. If not, new turnouts will be used, as needed.
the problem i had with Peco, is trains would always derail if the switch wasn't set correct (when coming from the opposite direction of the points). I have many older switches on my layout that will allow a train to pass without derailing, even if the switch is set wrong. Now I can see your fix for Atlas switches as they are designed to be used with a switch machine (either manual or electric). Without that, they won't hold their position well.@@dcrrails3402
It is understandable why your trains are derailing there. You are using #4 turnouts where you should be using #6''s. Also, your tangent to curvature is off. If there is always just one car that is derailing there it is because the wheel gage is off. Just some constructive criticism!
You've bring up some great points. I did start off using my old Atlas turnouts from my childhood, giving them a new life with the paperclip trick, but I’m always open to upgrading as necessary. I’ve incorporated a few Peco turnouts into my layout and have been really impressed with their performance. Regarding the radius, you're absolutely right-it's on the tighter side. I'm already planning adjustments to move the turnouts back for a smoother transition onto the arrival/departure track. These changes, along with navigating the switch between code 83 and code 100 track, will be covered in my next video. I've been working with what I had on hand, but I'm excited to share the solutions I've come up with. Thanks so much for watching and for the feedback. It's great to have you along for the journey!
DCR; or at least I hope it is DCR; losing track a bit here. To maul a great American saying: 'Go round the walls, Young Man; not up them.' That's what I did. 1/ long runs. 2/ huge radii 3/ Large radii turnouts. 4/ All is on narrow shelves; that means you don't lose the use of the room/garage. Effectively NO footprint. A layout on a table in the middle of a room takes out the whole room. 5/ Golden Retriever's bedding can be put under what is really a shelf layout. That means you don't break your neck on it. 6/ That last point is partly in jest, but only partly. Arrange your support legs so you cannot trip over the feet. It takes ONLY ONE FALL!!!! See if you can cantilever them out or place the layout shelf on angles secured to the wall. 7/ My layout is in a water-logged garage. The fact it still works is a wonder. Only one side is2' wide; the other main side is about 12" wide. Not quite that simple, but that will do. Some caveats: 1/ When 'going around' a room, swing the entry door the other way so you cannot lock yourself in. If you have a heart attack access is needed from outside. 2/ A lift section is needed as what you have is effectively an island layout. Have a look at 'Scott Rail'. My lift section is light enough, but is too wide. If time ever allows me back to the layout again I will replace it with a 2 foot long x 6" wide segment. Don't make 'duck-unders! You see: IT IS REALLY SO MUCH SIMPLER THAN WE ALL THINK. It can also be cheaper. Don't forget that 'gmail'. Meanwhile ua-cam.com/video/fZji6qDlh0A/v-deo.html
Your track is mis aligned, As your trains traverse the outer turnout to mext inner one they bounce. You track does not follow the manufacturer's designed track geometry!
Painful to watch. It took you 14 seconds just to cut the paperclip! More importantly, WHAT does the paperclip do? Yes, I know, it acts as a spring, but why didn't you explain that?
I would like to add a few words of advice if I may. Intermountain 33 inch metal wheels, kadee couplers, and cars weighted to NMRA standards. Also have all your couplers either body mounted or truck mounted but do not mix. A kadee coupler height gauge is a must. Thank you for the paperclip tip. 36 inch intermountain metal wheels for passenger cars.
I figured that at some point I'm going to have to upgrade my rolling stock. However, the track work has to be good to eliminate sections where "something always derails there." My old turnouts were giving me problems, so the paperclip spring seemed to fix that issue. I have a couple of other problem spots that I'm going to fix next. Then I'll look at the metal wheels and Kadee couplers. I heard somewhere that HO scale rollingstock can use different size wheels, is that true? I may need to invest in a pair of calipers so I know what size I have...
Thanks for the comment and for watching.
Someone mentioned it's an old idea. Others mentioned switching to A different brand. It's a old idea that I did not know. Someone else mentioned he did not explain how how or why this fixes the problem. Without the explanation, I had no idea what it was that he was doing to Improve the turn out. I'm in no position to buy new anything. Everything I get is used so if I end up with atlas so be it. But now If I have an issue, because of this video I know how to fix it for a about a penny instead of going out and paying twenty dollars to fifty dollars for a new turn out. One cent fix for a fifty dollar problem. Works for me and thanks for the video!
I didn't know about this until a bit ago when I stumbled across it. I too am on a very tight budget so anything to prolong the life of something, or an inexpensive way to have fantastic results I look for, and then share here.
You're welcome for the video, I had hoped it would be beneficial to the community. Glad you found value with the video and good luck with your own layout. Thanks for watching and welcome aboard.
You would be better off by going with peco switches/turnouts. They are already spring loaded and work flawlessly. Yes they cost more but the product is that much better.
True, and I will probably go through and change them out over time, but for now this looks like it won't be a bad substitute.
Thank you for your comment and welcome aboard!
Not everyone can afford Peco track, the hobby is dam expensive enough as it is
Good comment Melissa.
Yeah I was wondering the same. Peco points (yes here in Australia they're called points/turnouts), are spring loaded and I have never even seen any points no matter what brand that are not spring loaded. Had me guessing what was going on with the paper clip.
Very quickly Philip:
1/ Shinohara were springless.
2/ The paperclip, being supposedly spring steel, is a really good idea. The problem is same as all those overcentre springs, they wear out the bearing holes in the plastic ties (sleepers). The effect is made worse (I wanted 'exascerbated', but am at war with Spalcheque today) by the paperclip not being exactly square in its bends. Suggest you read my earlier comments.
3/ The world map is printed upside down.
Hmm? Might be a good idea to find a copy of kalmbach's John Armstrong publication 'Track Planning for Realistic Operation'. Have a look at the section on 'S' curves. It is a bit hard to tell, especially in the time I don't have available as I write this, but is the derailing car and the cars either side still under distortion from the S curve on the approach to the turnout? Things move in straight lines and the curves and curves in turnouts actually accelerate from that straight line. I find, particularly on 'S' bends, trouble lurks whenever at least a car length is not left between the end of one curve and the start of another. And yes, even if the curves are in the same direction. Simplify before ballasting. The problem might be in the track geometry, not in the turnout.
That spring is like the 'over-centre' spring of Peco. I tried a similar idea on some old Shinohara (N 1/160). The principle is sound; the problem is wear of the hole in the tie which is in effect a bearing. 1/ soft and hard material; that's good 2/ Even so, the tie 'bearing' wears large, causing loss of spring tension, and even more wear 3/ Situation made worse by our sloppy engineering introducing stresses as things are not square. For example when you squeeze down the cut ends the forces bend the wire against the supporting hole and the bent angle wreaks havoc in use. Peco last better because they are engineered better. You could retire on just one of their die machines.
The best solulution is p-r-o-b-a-b-l-y (good for touch typing practise finding the hyphen) to machine a couple of tiny brass bushes to carry the wear. Still a soft and a harder material, but much better than too soft a material. Problem is it needs a lathe. Probably better to instal a ground throw as I have on my 'layout'. You still have too soft and hard, but the forces are gentle and non torsional. In use throw the bar just far enough to feel tension. You can make an omega loop in the wire between the machine and the turnout, but not needed and that introduces a torsion effect. If we lived nearby I would invite you round to see EVERY error in the book.
Gotta go mate; hope this helps, and thanks to 'Michelle' below. Let's all share ideas. None of us are always right; mercifully neither are we always wrong.
Thank you for the thoughtful response. Yes, I am looking at moving the turnouts farther back on the arrival departure track. In fact that will be the next video.
The paperclip is a good stop gap, but I think a peco turnout down the road is probably the better way to go. but for now, this is working and I can do some operations, once I move the turnouts and take care of the derailments.
I'd love to come and visit your layout! Always looking out for good ideas, plus I love seeing what other people's creative juices create.
Thanks again, and welcome aboard!
@@dcrrails3402 I wonder if you would be kind enough to do two things for the Utube community: give us a first name; and establish a 'gmail' under the Comments tag. Comments are of little use as no attachments can be sent, and one must be careful mentioning brand names. I notice a very respectable British reviewer/commentator was recently censured by a manufacturer a while back. You might notice the major magazines ensure the protection of 'Ivy League' or equivalent editorship. Gmail gives us at least minimal protection, and you still have anonymity, a luxury not afforded to your correspondent. I'll try and find some useful things for you, but I need a gmail.
There is nothing necessarily wrong with the turnout you have now. It is at least as good (or bad) as the rest of the layout, and can be made work. Its real problem is the plastic crossing, but again, make it work. Remember the first rule of model railroading 'Neva spend eniphink!' (Spalqueque is appalled).
Yes, moving turnouts is great. When I designed my current layout, I sat on track design, I slept on track design, I patted the golden retriever on track design, and so-on. Over time your thinking changes, and a kind of 'being' is there that wasn't there before. It's all about straight lines. There was one place I could not 'straigten'; guess where the problems are years later! Sometimes you are forced to hand-lay. Don't head for the peppermints: just work at it.
Anyway, I hope this encourages you. Sorry this sounds 'preachy''; the mood it's written in is the opposite to that. Simply no time to write it properly.
You are also experiencing problems because you using the old hook horn couplers.
There is a reason that the manufacturers stopped using them.
Kadee couplers do not put lateral forces on the cars. The hook horn couplers do.
Besides that, hook horn couplers look like crap.
Go visit any club layout, no one is using hook horn couplers.
@@petert9749 Your insights are truly valued, and I’m grateful for the time you took to share them. You're not preachy at all. I really appreciate the thoughtful feedback. The journey of building and adjusting my layout has been a learning curve, and I realize now how much more flexibility I could have had with a wall-mounted layout. The 8x4 tabletop was my initial vision and I just made it bigger turning it into a 6 x 10 table, but I'm seeing the limitations now that everything is in motion.
I realize now that I could have much more track if I redesigned the layout to run along the wall and into the garage and I stand in the middle I'd have much more straight track and room and use the same amount of usable space. So, when the deep freeze goes out, I will get an upright freezer and then I can rearrange the garage, build the new layout along the walls, and have a whole new set of problems to solve! Your point about living with the track design until it becomes a part of you resonates with me, and I’ll take that to heart as I plan for the future.
Thank you again for your encouragement and for participating in this journey. Your perspective is a big help as I navigate through these creative endeavors!
@@pmsteamrailroading I also plan on dealing with the couplers. I just boxed up the train as a kid. Now that I've got time and a place to build I pulled everything out and started working on a layout. I agree the old hook-horn has its share of issues. I'm also considering replacing the plastic wheels with metal ones when I'm ready to tackle changing the couplers. But first, I need the tracks in place and not causing issues.
Thanks for the feedback and thank you for joining me on this journey.
Also if you want trains to run anything like smooth you are going to have to do something about that " turnout curve " piece the tracks have to join as smoothly as possible
Yes, the turnouts from the mainline to the arrival/departure track definatnly need some attention. In fact, that is the subject of my next video. Stay tuned and thanks for watching.
Yeah, that really looks bad!
An old idea, but I've never had much luck implementing it due to bending straight wire into the proper shape and length. This demonstration is a few steps simpler and seems just as effective. Nice job!
It doesn't work. The clip invariably pops out.
I used too be in the hobby and loved splurging on railcars that I normally couldn't afford to look at not alone own. Knowing that the cars where a serious piece of craftsmanship, precise engineering and everything else that justified the manufacture's three digit price tag of some limited run car, I knew they were designed to run flawlessly but setting the car on a mainline rail on my layout and crossing over a turnout and jumping the rails
E V E R Y single time - in both directions frustrated me to the point where I ended up redesigning the entire layout and eventually giving the hobby up for the sake of my sanity.
I think your resolution to the problem I was having would have found me still running my layout to this very day.
All I can say is PECO, Eat your heart out!!😏
This is called an over-centre spring. Peco switches have them built in. The paperclip will be fine, but the key element is to make sure that the distance between the turnout''s existing hole and the one you drill in the next tie is just fractionally SMALLER than the distance between the two prongs of the trimmed paperclip. That's what makes the clip want to spring back to full extension. It works even better with really springy wire, like a guitat string, which will not soften and lose its springiness over the years like a paperclip.
I noticed some cars rocking very easily as if they have no weight🧐had similar issues and some of my issues were self induced like ballasting and couplers but the major one was weight of the cars! Most were underweight! Harbor freight has tire weights and I have a diagram I follow per length of rolling stock and add the necessary weight sometimes going over a bit on purpose. Now my trains can go several laps without derailing!
There are so many factors that cause derailments. I know trackwork is one cause, and then car weights is another. Most of my rollingstock I got as a kid, so it is more of a toy than a model, but with some tune ups that can be corrected.
Thanks for the tip, I'll be checking into the weights down the road. Tuning up the rail cars is going to be in my future. Thank you for commenting and watching.
0:10
Why do something !? Those sparks look awesome !😊
How does the paperclip fix derailments?
You failed to explain what this changes in the way the switch behaves. Is it merely to act as a spring to keep the points to one side or the other on a manual turnout? That is a very old idea.
You're correct. I left that out. I have very old turnouts. I kept them when I put the trains away as a kid. I thought I'd use them now and they aren't holding up well. I found the paperclip thing and it seems to work okay on my layout so I thought I'd share. It might be old, but I didn't know about it until just recently.
Thanks for watching.
It's a old idea that I did not know. You or someone else mentioned.He did not explain how how or why this fixes the problem. Without the explanation, I had no idea what it was that he was doing to Improve the turn out. I'm in no position to buy new anything. Everything I get is used so if I end up with atlas so be it. But now If I have an issue, because of this video I know how to fix it for a about a penny instead of going out and paying twenty dollars to forty dollars for a new turn out. One cent fix for a forty dollar problem. Works for me and thanks for the video!
I use PECO turnouts, I do have one or two Atlas and two Shinohara #8 curved ones as well. I find this video amusing because many modellers claim that one should remove the spring in the PECO turnout so they will work with a Tortoise machine, I leave the spring in and just use a thicker wire on the Tortoise. I made a spring turnout with a length of piano wire and some track nails, adjust the length of the wire so that your lightest rolling stock will push the points over without derailing.
Twisting motion on long wagons and carriages cause derailments. Needs a short straight to prevent the snaking effect as this produces two opposite forces...
I'm going to rework the location of the turnouts for the Arrival/Departure track and make a straight piece between the two turnouts.
Thanks for the comments and for watching.
Super. I did something similar, but without an overthrow spring. I straghten a smaller paperclip, put a small loop in one end, then I poke the paperclip through the point throw bar where the switch machine connects. I get four track spikes, and put two into the layout, facing each other, holding down the middle of the paperclip, like a pivot, with the loop facing up. Then I push the loop end of the paperclip sideways to move the points and add two track spikes by the loop end, about 1/2" apart, with their heads facing out to catch the loop end of the clip. To switch tracks, I grip the loop, slide sideways slightly to unhook the spike head, lift, and slide sideways, moving the switch points, then replace the loop end against the other spike head. I provide the point tension and lock the points in that direction manually, by having the clip bend slightly, without any point overthrow springs. These work great, and are a cheap, easy, and effective turnout control method to allow operation during track construction, and they allow you to operate with no switch machines or throws until you can add them, and I even put paper clips on two overthrow spring equipped turnouts just to have a handle to switch them with. I still have six of them in use on an unscenicked seven track staging yard, mostly because of sentiment, because the rest of the layout has electric switch machines or high or low ground throws. Hello from the Tracy Mountain Railway in Colorado. 💙 T.E.N.
sounds like great solution. Plus it holds the switch in place. Great idea. Thanks for sharing.
Other brands of points maybe cost more, but they will be cheaper in the long run.
Another idea is to not have curved track right next to points. Another idra to help would be if possible to use flexi track for curves and S curves.
This is a neat thing that I wish I had thought of. Instead, I gave up on Atlas switch tracks and went with Peco, which have these springs already installed.
Good move.
Dear DCR Rails, as so many commentators said before, Peco sells their turnouts with an over-centre spring installed. Also, Tim Warris from Fast Tracks Turnouts has made a great video on making your own over-centre springs out of piano wire. Great when the paperclip method works for the particular turnout on your layout. Nevertheless, it may be worth checking the video from Tim I mentioned, especially when the loop on the paperclip may show to be too wide to accommodate the appropriate spring action to put firmly the point rails in their positions on the stock rails. Just to close, I humbly think it’s instrumental to keep this possible tweak on our ‘hard drives.’ Therefore I very much appreciate your reminder! Cheerio
Thank you for the heads up. Thanks for the comment and watching!
OK, nice trick, you made sure that the switch rails are kept as close as possible to their corresponding heel rails. More modern turnouts are spring loaded by design while older types left this task for the point motor mechanism.
But what about the turnout you removed?
I threw it away. It was flat wore out and it wouldn't matter what I did with the thing.
Thanks for watching and commenting.
Fun fact about paperclips, invented in Norway in 1899. Nice seeing you improve what you have but I would look into modern trackwork if you can before committing to much more scenic work, Hi from UK 👍
I didn't know the fun fact. Thanks for sharing. I keep wanting to get to doing scenery, but the track work is keeping me busy! Thanks for watching and commenting.
Great idea. I'm going to try it.
Life Like Power Lock track and have fun setting up everyway you can imagine , always another way to lay track , about 3 or 4 months and it changes , get nickel silver
2 things--- dont try to cram too many tunouts in a really small area, and ALWAYS ALWAYS check the track by eyeballing it for smooth flow when installing it! From all directions!!!
Good points. I may have been over zealous with the industries. I added two more from the original track plan as I wanted places for operations. I have three real problem areas, and the one in the video was the worst offender as it was on the arrival/departure track and everything runs over that particular turnout.
However, I plan on running the trains slower on the inner loop with the industries and all, so hopefully with good turn outs and the paperclip spring on the older turnouts things will go well. If not, new turnouts will be used, as needed.
Good tip my brother
great video
Thank you! I'm glad you enjoyed it. Thanks for stopping by and commenting
Instead of a paper clip, can this be done with a staple? IJA🤷🏿♂️
I use the other hole so I don't have to drill one. It works just fine.
Something tells me that this trick is only necessary for use on certain makes of turnout.
Yes, Peco doesn't need this. Just trying to use what I have on hand and make things work. Thanks for watching and welcome aboard.
the problem i had with Peco, is trains would always derail if the switch wasn't set correct (when coming from the opposite direction of the points). I have many older switches on my layout that will allow a train to pass without derailing, even if the switch is set wrong. Now I can see your fix for Atlas switches as they are designed to be used with a switch machine (either manual or electric). Without that, they won't hold their position well.@@dcrrails3402
Hi, that dam music! You don’t need it that loud, it should be soft. Cheers
a piee of plastic between the moving and fixed tie is far easier and better
Seems like a good idea. Seems to work. But not for long. Pity.
It is understandable why your trains are derailing there. You are using #4 turnouts where you should be using #6''s. Also, your tangent to curvature is off. If there is always just one car that is derailing there it is because the wheel gage is off. Just some constructive criticism!
Your first mistake is using Atlas turnouts! Peco is the only way to go. Also the radius is to tight.
You've bring up some great points. I did start off using my old Atlas turnouts from my childhood, giving them a new life with the paperclip trick, but I’m always open to upgrading as necessary. I’ve incorporated a few Peco turnouts into my layout and have been really impressed with their performance.
Regarding the radius, you're absolutely right-it's on the tighter side. I'm already planning adjustments to move the turnouts back for a smoother transition onto the arrival/departure track. These changes, along with navigating the switch between code 83 and code 100 track, will be covered in my next video. I've been working with what I had on hand, but I'm excited to share the solutions I've come up with.
Thanks so much for watching and for the feedback. It's great to have you along for the journey!
I only use Walthers turnouts, was not impressed with Peco
DCR; or at least I hope it is DCR; losing track a bit here.
To maul a great American saying: 'Go round the walls, Young Man; not up them.'
That's what I did.
1/ long runs.
2/ huge radii
3/ Large radii turnouts.
4/ All is on narrow shelves; that means you don't lose the use of the room/garage. Effectively NO footprint. A layout on a table in the middle of a room takes out the whole room.
5/ Golden Retriever's bedding can be put under what is really a shelf layout. That means you don't break your neck on it.
6/ That last point is partly in jest, but only partly. Arrange your support legs so you cannot trip over the feet. It takes ONLY ONE FALL!!!! See if you can cantilever them out or place the layout shelf on angles secured to the wall.
7/ My layout is in a water-logged garage. The fact it still works is a wonder. Only one side is2' wide; the other main side is about 12" wide. Not quite that simple, but that will do.
Some caveats:
1/ When 'going around' a room, swing the entry door the other way so you cannot lock yourself in. If you have a heart attack access is needed from outside.
2/ A lift section is needed as what you have is effectively an island layout. Have a look at 'Scott Rail'. My lift section is light enough, but is too wide. If time ever allows me back to the layout again I will replace it with a 2 foot long x 6" wide segment. Don't make 'duck-unders!
You see: IT IS REALLY SO MUCH SIMPLER THAN WE ALL THINK. It can also be cheaper.
Don't forget that 'gmail'.
Meanwhile ua-cam.com/video/fZji6qDlh0A/v-deo.html
WHY THE MUSIC IT MADE THE HEARING WHAT YOU HAD TO SAY HARD TO HEAR
Why try to fix a problem that doesnt exist..............POINTS have springs in them so whu put a paper clip in
music to loud
noted
Or you give your cars the proper weight. Cars which are too light will always cause problems, in my experience, but nevermind me.
Adding weight to the cars is on my ever growing to do list...
Thanks for watching and commenting.
@@dcrrails3402 Seriously, it's one of the first things you want to do as soon as you have a functional railroad.
Your track is mis aligned, As your trains traverse the outer turnout to mext inner one they bounce. You track does not follow the manufacturer's designed track geometry!
Fix your crossover. The diverging rails in your video do not align.
Painful to watch. It took you 14 seconds just to cut the paperclip! More importantly, WHAT does the paperclip do? Yes, I know, it acts as a spring, but why didn't you explain that?
this would be watchable if it did not have that crap "music" - Way too loud - Adds nothing - Irritating.
Turning off the annoying music would be a benefit.!
Please cut out the music, it is very annoying. We want to hear the click as the turnout changes over.
It must be Atlas
track turnouts ,they are garbage !
Please don't try this at home. Use one of the 27 better ways to do this.
Perhaps you should put together a video and explain them to us.
🤠🖐🚂🫵