And now I have to go and rebuild my current refinery set-up for like the third time becase I saw something fancy from Brothgar. My dupes'll be like "c'mon man, just knock it off" xd
I'm pretty sure each refining recipe will actually show how much increase in temperature your coolant will experience (or at least it use to). I remember steel being, by far, the greatest, followed by Iron.
Great idea ! I put 2 metal refinery, a closed loop of petroleum for heat transfer in the steam chamber where I put 2 thermo aquatuner for dual purpose and 3 steam turbines on top, above I have a co2 vent for the general cooling with hydrogen loop and stuff. works great with nearly not heat leakage, it is producing 50 % of the energy of the base of 11 dupes as a byproduct of other useful activities
metal refinery takes 40 seconds to complete and that time can be reduced by the tinkering stat. liquid comes in packets of 10kg and it takes 400kg. that's 10kg a sec over 40 seconds is 400kg. thus if you have a dupe with even one point in tinkering they will drain the liquid out of the refinery faster then it can resupply itself. this also means ONE dupe can operate multiple refineries. this means one dupe refining metal with a high enough tinkering skill will be better then having them on a wheel. assuming you never run out of ore to refine.... also there must be a lot of heat loss from your walls or maybe everything didn't stabilize all the way, you should be able to run 2.6(max) turbines from steel and 1.5(max) from iron. there will be losses here and there so not those exact numbers but you are missing .6 of a turbine and it's still not even maxing the two out and the iron version did only support 1 turbine. so weird. fun experiment for sure.
Seeing that the game is starting to pick up a bit again, would you consider making a series where you start with explaining the basics(for beginners, but for smart ones) and then start talking about tips and tricks while you advance?
Have you seen that the Recipe if you click on it shows you how much heat its going to add to the liquid? Because ONI does show that. at #10:26 for example
Actually, there is a big interrest in late game to refine thermium to niobium. It limit the number of space trip you need to get your tons of thermium. With only one trip, if you get lucky, you can have the 5kg of niobium that you need to start refining thermium. Then you can turn it back to more niobium and restart process. With only 5kg of niobium, you can transform 95% of the wolframite in the map into thermium. In my base, after the bunker layer over the whole map, reprocessing thermium to niobium and back and forth, is the principal activity of my refineries.^^ But anyway, well done for that automation, you doing this with so much... instinct?^^
Any American worth their salt can run the C=(5/9)(F-32) equation with their subconscious. Adding 273.15 is hardly a chore. One must keep arithmetically limber somehow.
Brothgar, at 13:00 you asked why the steam turbines weren't running at the same power level and what I've noticed is if you connect the water drain lines of the steam turbines together and always run them to the hottest side of your steam area which for me is usually the left side then for some reason this works and the turbines run at the same power and efficiency. I do not know why this works for me but it does indeed work.
Brothgar the turbines run unevenly because a lot of heat gets exchanged right under the first turbine, and the turbines are controlled from one pair of sensors under the first turbine, so the readings aren't the average, but ~max temperature, which are "local" to that turbine. What you would need is to have a steam chamber per each turbine, add "manual" valves to adjust the flow to split the liquid evenly, and add independent sensors for every turbine to make them run evenly; with this setup the better the insulation of the hot coolant pipes, the more evenly they will run. You also should put that storage tank in a vaccum, to minimise potential heat loss from oil to the air around the tank.
Hey, i found an even better use for metal refinery heat! Using liquid copper inside the loop you can heat regolith till it liquifies into magma. Cool that slightly so it transitiones into igneous rock at 1400C. Then use that to preheat the regolith. Since regolith has 5 times smaller heat capacity. It means the system is creating more heat. Cooling that inside a steam boiler to power turbines... And lastly feeding the rock to hatches for meat and coal... NOW THATS THE RENEWABLE POWER!!!
No, YOU stay awesome Brothgar! I came for the Adcap videos, I stayed for your personality. :) Even though you are a complete number nerd it is fun to watch you play :D
Brothgar - can you try to make a self cooling steam turbine without the need of wheezeworts? You can probably run the water it gives off through an aquatuner below the turbine, and use that cool water to drop the temperature of the turbine (while the aquatuner generated heat gets recycled)
GG. I'm not sure if you did something like this before but how about this challenge: build a base using only hamster wheels to the point where you can launch a rocket.
Hey brothgar here's a challenge idea: due to how the new portal delivers critters and other resources it should be possible to live with three dupes limited only to the starting biome.
So now you could set up some automation based on a battery. You could cue up all the materials and store the ore in containers that only allow access to materials that it can "afford" to refine. It starts with steel but then closes access to that when it maxes out power and opens access to gold then to copper. It runs the negatives and recoups with the positives. In truth, I just want to see some crazy complex and sophisticated automation. :)
This definitely looks like you could pipe the oil to a bunch of refineries set to different materials, and the power-potential would be averaged from each one. Then with the smart storage automation, you would be gaining power from building things from refined materials as your dupes go to replenish the supply.
I used steel production to produce power with only 1 turbine. You need to be careful with it though as the liquid can easily spike above 500C. I was using petroleum. I used 4 liquid reservoirs, 2 for each loop. A loop for the metal refinery and a cooling loop.
What is if you bring two pipes into the metal refinary and two pipes out off the metal refinary, will it double the fill and empty speed? and what is with 3 or 4?
Very importantly the heat capacity of the material is not all that matters. Also its melting point. The refinery adds heat proportional to how much it would take to cool it from molten. Steel is so good because of its high melting point.
There are some pipe configurations with bridges that allow the coolant to loop and not block the refinery from emptying. No need for automation on those pipes
ExEvolution I use polluted water at 40°. It then goes up to nearly 130° without boiling in metal refinery and then I put it straight into the filter which drops it back to 40°, but this idea is better.
See, my issue is that I have a cool slush geyser on my world and the water is coming out too cold to use for pinchapepper nuts so I need a way to reliably heat it up to the correct temperature and I can do this build with polluted water to output to the plants once it hits the 35c+ needed to prevent stifling
Amazing footage yet again! It didn't seem like there was that much of a difference in the temperatures coming off of the refinery. but it is enough that i almost want to set up two refineries one for low temp materials and the other for steel and iron. Do you think it could be used to flash oil consistently? Or perhaps a dirt and/or sand oven. Time to refine this for my useage, back to ONI!
@@brothgar Ahh the elusive space missions. I did get close in one of my saves but have yet to break the burning surface of my germ infested little rock. Often find myself short on one resource or another to the point of complete collapse. The metal refining has been a constant hitch in my plans...Turns out you can do anything but the iron right in your livingroom! And with this setup this part seems to be solved now and with a +/- break even return overall! I think space is within my grasp this time! Thank you for putting the time in where i often can't ;)
Volcano = Mineral & Heat Mineral + Rock Granulator = Sand & Heat Sand + Glass Forge = Glass & Heat Glass + Renewable Energy Research = Power All heat produced in this infinite cycle = INFINITE POWWWWWWUUUUUUHHHHRRRR
You could, trough the heat tooltip that is described on the bottom of every metal, deduce wich is the best. Other than that if the conversion rate in this game is 100%, you coud with the heat tool tip calculate the exact power you whould gain.
if you have batteries which produce heat, build them out of thermium and put them in the puddle of oil to add heat to the oil. instead of the resevoir of course.
Got a bit of a problem in my oxygen not included base. I dug into the purple biome and didn't construct a water lock all I did was put some mechanical airlock doors hoping it would munch the chlorine now some has got into my base and it's getting a bit annoying so does anyone have some advice to get rid of it I know it settles just above carbon so I'm thinking about getting rid of said carbon and putting a gas muncher down there when I unlock automation unless you have an earlier game idea or a quick fix for it ( that doesn't involve vacuuming my base it's not like I have a massive fart cloud or anything lol)
hey, if you keep raising the temperature you can not turn it into petroleum? I have not tried but the transformation of a liquid in another in a pipe does not matter right?
The latest patch must have corrected something. The dirty water from the sink breaks the toilet pretty much immediately. The last game I played a day or two ago it was just fine to run used sink water or polluted water through toilets with no damage. Now, even on easy, there is not enough water. I am sucking up every puddle on the map and I can't get my water reservoir higher than half a block. 4 sinks and 4 toilets, 4-5 carbon skimmers and electrolizers, and I'm burning through a tonne of water every minute... something's wrong. Now, if you join two waste pipes together, then one is clogged and the other runs and they don't mix...
I think you need super-coolant to get a net-gain for that to be worth it. In this particular video, Brothgar is trying to make something feasible with the current materials he has available in his Let's Play series.
anyone can tell me if theere was a patch to the temperature ""stacking"" of the temperature in the reservoir or something ?? i just did the same experiment he did i do not get steam.
I know this is an old vid but I didn't see this comment. When you worked out that you had 195kj free energy, you didn't take into account the power drain from running the aquatuner.
Love your content, Brothgar! Got me watching your video until the little mans hours. I was wondering if you thought about doing maybe a quick tips and tricks video for newer players?
.........SO,PLACING THIS IN METAL VOLCANO TURBINE ROOM WITH LOTS OF RADIANT PIPES IS A GOOD SOLUTION ............AT LEAST I'VE MANAGED SOMETHING BY MYSELF
Brothgar 0:54 You clearly didn't get the joke (I was using water as coolant for first tests). 7:50 Yes, it would generate (or at the very last cause a change of) voltage *potential* across one pair of the conductors in the output wire, if it were to generate electrical energy. Should I just leave to not expose any more bad jokes? On the other hand, does a mod allow you to turn *steel* to iron or it's ore? Because that may be better than the manual generator (unless you require power to turn a refined metal into it's previous form).
I'll be better, use a lot of a steel transformators, u don't waste energy, but they generate heat, thanks that you can build the almost perfect perpetum mobile xD
And now I have to go and rebuild my current refinery set-up for like the third time becase I saw something fancy from Brothgar. My dupes'll be like "c'mon man, just knock it off" xd
So excited for ONI to officially launch! So many hours enjoyed in early access, Klei makes such great games.
i guess you waited a minute until it really launched
I'm pretty sure each refining recipe will actually show how much increase in temperature your coolant will experience (or at least it use to). I remember steel being, by far, the greatest, followed by Iron.
yeahthat even showed in the video, but brothgar ignored it :0
This man has a Refined taste in Machinery
"it wasn't all that hard"
-cries in liquid oxygen
Klei: reworked steam turbine
Brothgar: it's free real estate
Great idea ! I put 2 metal refinery, a closed loop of petroleum for heat transfer in the steam chamber where I put 2 thermo aquatuner for dual purpose and 3 steam turbines on top, above I have a co2 vent for the general cooling with hydrogen loop and stuff. works great with nearly not heat leakage, it is producing 50 % of the energy of the base of 11 dupes as a byproduct of other useful activities
metal refinery takes 40 seconds to complete and that time can be reduced by the tinkering stat. liquid comes in packets of 10kg and it takes 400kg. that's 10kg a sec over 40 seconds is 400kg. thus if you have a dupe with even one point in tinkering they will drain the liquid out of the refinery faster then it can resupply itself. this also means ONE dupe can operate multiple refineries. this means one dupe refining metal with a high enough tinkering skill will be better then having them on a wheel. assuming you never run out of ore to refine....
also there must be a lot of heat loss from your walls or maybe everything didn't stabilize all the way, you should be able to run 2.6(max) turbines from steel and 1.5(max) from iron. there will be losses here and there so not those exact numbers but you are missing .6 of a turbine and it's still not even maxing the two out and the iron version did only support 1 turbine. so weird. fun experiment for sure.
@@brothgar
next time for sure. always hard to find a balance between practicality, perfection and time.
Seeing that the game is starting to pick up a bit again, would you consider making a series where you start with explaining the basics(for beginners, but for smart ones) and then start talking about tips and tricks while you advance?
Have you seen that the Recipe if you click on it shows you how much heat its going to add to the liquid? Because ONI does show that. at #10:26 for example
Ah, re-finally I get to use this joke
Technically, it’s a pun.
@@PashaGamingYT yes, puns are infact jokes :P
Actually, there is a big interrest in late game to refine thermium to niobium. It limit the number of space trip you need to get your tons of thermium. With only one trip, if you get lucky, you can have the 5kg of niobium that you need to start refining thermium. Then you can turn it back to more niobium and restart process.
With only 5kg of niobium, you can transform 95% of the wolframite in the map into thermium.
In my base, after the bunker layer over the whole map, reprocessing thermium to niobium and back and forth, is the principal activity of my refineries.^^
But anyway, well done for that automation, you doing this with so much... instinct?^^
When all the American viewers have to convert C° to F° for the temperatures to make sense but you use K°
*Laughs in easy conversion*
It's just kelwin not degrees kelwin
And Kelvin has no degrees
Any American worth their salt can run the C=(5/9)(F-32) equation with their subconscious. Adding 273.15 is hardly a chore. One must keep arithmetically limber somehow.
Multiply Celsius value by 2 and add 32. Fuckin. Easy.
Add 273 to Celsius. Even. Easier.
Most American youth cab generally understand celcius and know the comfort range vs hot or cold but, still. You're not far off in my opinion.
Brothgar, at 13:00 you asked why the steam turbines weren't running at the same power level and what I've noticed is if you connect the water drain lines of the steam turbines together and always run them to the hottest side of your steam area which for me is usually the left side then for some reason this works and the turbines run at the same power and efficiency. I do not know why this works for me but it does indeed work.
Brothgar the turbines run unevenly because a lot of heat gets exchanged right under the first turbine, and the turbines are controlled from one pair of sensors under the first turbine, so the readings aren't the average, but ~max temperature, which are "local" to that turbine. What you would need is to have a steam chamber per each turbine, add "manual" valves to adjust the flow to split the liquid evenly, and add independent sensors for every turbine to make them run evenly; with this setup the better the insulation of the hot coolant pipes, the more evenly they will run. You also should put that storage tank in a vaccum, to minimise potential heat loss from oil to the air around the tank.
Hey, i found an even better use for metal refinery heat!
Using liquid copper inside the loop you can heat regolith till it liquifies into magma. Cool that slightly so it transitiones into igneous rock at 1400C. Then use that to preheat the regolith. Since regolith has 5 times smaller heat capacity. It means the system is creating more heat.
Cooling that inside a steam boiler to power turbines...
And lastly feeding the rock to hatches for meat and coal...
NOW THATS THE RENEWABLE POWER!!!
You're a genius! This work very well
Wow, I’m definitely adding that to my base
Does this still work with the launch version of the game ?
What about using the metal refinery in the sour gas energy thingy to heat the oil?
thanks for solution i always run issue that my pipes keep blowing up because water in them gets too hot and no place to sink the heat too.
Someone explain why we are paying taxes for energy again?
xD because rl doesn't work that way. We have no infinite power machines
No, YOU stay awesome Brothgar!
I came for the Adcap videos, I stayed for your personality. :) Even though you are a complete number nerd it is fun to watch you play :D
hey,you can save your energy in your liquid and keep them in vacuum.It's better than waste in battery.
Brothgar - can you try to make a self cooling steam turbine without the need of wheezeworts?
You can probably run the water it gives off through an aquatuner below the turbine, and use that cool water to drop the temperature of the turbine (while the aquatuner generated heat gets recycled)
I was wondering if that was possible!
GG. I'm not sure if you did something like this before but how about this challenge: build a base using only hamster wheels to the point where you can launch a rocket.
Shawn H Corey easy done. Just make sure all your dupes have high tinker and tinker passion.
Brothgar, there is a steam engine running in the top left of your screen when you did your initial calc.
Hey brothgar here's a challenge idea:
due to how the new portal delivers critters and other resources it should be possible to live with three dupes limited only to the starting biome.
Until you run out of the natural resources. There are no geysers in the starting biome.
So now you could set up some automation based on a battery. You could cue up all the materials and store the ore in containers that only allow access to materials that it can "afford" to refine. It starts with steel but then closes access to that when it maxes out power and opens access to gold then to copper. It runs the negatives and recoups with the positives. In truth, I just want to see some crazy complex and sophisticated automation. :)
This definitely looks like you could pipe the oil to a bunch of refineries set to different materials, and the power-potential would be averaged from each one. Then with the smart storage automation, you would be gaining power from building things from refined materials as your dupes go to replenish the supply.
Could you make a video on different types of cooling methods I have had problem with cooling things such as powers generators and geysers
brothgar. What about using liquid glass for power? Can't you turn glass back into sand, or melt glass down again?
I used steel production to produce power with only 1 turbine. You need to be careful with it though as the liquid can easily spike above 500C. I was using petroleum. I used 4 liquid reservoirs, 2 for each loop. A loop for the metal refinery and a cooling loop.
You this is crazy, you can contactless pump magma into your metal refinery as coolant. You can heat it up to the point that you can melt more magma
What is if you bring two pipes into the metal refinary and two pipes out off the metal refinary, will it double the fill and empty speed? and what is with 3 or 4?
What’s wrong with 29 C 14:30
Very importantly the heat capacity of the material is not all that matters. Also its melting point. The refinery adds heat proportional to how much it would take to cool it from molten. Steel is so good because of its high melting point.
There are some pipe configurations with bridges that allow the coolant to loop and not block the refinery from emptying. No need for automation on those pipes
can you make an air conditioner? Like expanding or contracting a coolant?
dont forget that the liquid has to heat up the pipes/walls when you it moves into a new loop, which loses some stored heat.
Great video, I've been looking for a good way to manage the refinery's heat.
ExEvolution I use polluted water at 40°. It then goes up to nearly 130° without boiling in metal refinery and then I put it straight into the filter which drops it back to 40°, but this idea is better.
See, my issue is that I have a cool slush geyser on my world and the water is coming out too cold to use for pinchapepper nuts so I need a way to reliably heat it up to the correct temperature and I can do this build with polluted water to output to the plants once it hits the 35c+ needed to prevent stifling
What mod allows you to turn refined metals back into raw ore?
Amazing footage yet again! It didn't seem like there was that much of a difference in the temperatures coming off of the refinery. but it is enough that i almost want to set up two refineries one for low temp materials and the other for steel and iron. Do you think it could be used to flash oil consistently? Or perhaps a dirt and/or sand oven. Time to refine this for my useage, back to ONI!
@@brothgar Ahh the elusive space missions. I did get close in one of my saves but have yet to break the burning surface of my germ infested little rock. Often find myself short on one resource or another to the point of complete collapse. The metal refining has been a constant hitch in my plans...Turns out you can do anything but the iron right in your livingroom! And with this setup this part seems to be solved now and with a +/- break even return overall! I think space is within my grasp this time! Thank you for putting the time in where i often can't ;)
Volcano = Mineral & Heat
Mineral + Rock Granulator = Sand & Heat
Sand + Glass Forge = Glass & Heat
Glass + Renewable Energy Research = Power
All heat produced in this infinite cycle = INFINITE POWWWWWWUUUUUUHHHHRRRR
You could, trough the heat tooltip that is described on the bottom of every metal, deduce wich is the best. Other than that if the conversion rate in this game is 100%, you coud with the heat tool tip calculate the exact power you whould gain.
This man is a wizard.
@brothgar what's your final plumbing setup for the first part? Did I miss it?
detail final loop layout and automation pls time 7:23
Still work?
does actualy skill level "tinkering" of dup saves power ?
if you have batteries which produce heat, build them out of thermium and put them in the puddle of oil to add heat to the oil. instead of the resevoir of course.
You are a Machine! Lol, honestly, keep up the Awesome. I tell people about your channel, because I think you are actually doing Good Work. Excelsior!
you forgot to show the pipes for the final design near the reservoir
Got a bit of a problem in my oxygen not included base. I dug into the purple biome and didn't construct a water lock all I did was put some mechanical airlock doors hoping it would munch the chlorine now some has got into my base and it's getting a bit annoying so does anyone have some advice to get rid of it I know it settles just above carbon so I'm thinking about getting rid of said carbon and putting a gas muncher down there when I unlock automation unless you have an earlier game idea or a quick fix for it ( that doesn't involve vacuuming my base it's not like I have a massive fart cloud or anything lol)
Did this get patched out or something? I didnt try this but i had a severe issue with the refinery overheating if i pumped hot oil into it.
you don't pump hot oil into it, you pump it out when it's done.
why i didn't think of that earlier T_T
hey, if you keep raising the temperature you can not turn it into petroleum? I have not tried but the transformation of a liquid in another in a pipe does not matter right?
I tried it long ago it still breaks the pipe
What about Thermium to Niobium?
The latest patch must have corrected something. The dirty water from the sink breaks the toilet pretty much immediately.
The last game I played a day or two ago it was just fine to run used sink water or polluted water through toilets with no damage.
Now, even on easy, there is not enough water. I am sucking up every puddle on the map and I can't get my water reservoir higher than half a block.
4 sinks and 4 toilets, 4-5 carbon skimmers and electrolizers, and I'm burning through a tonne of water every minute... something's wrong.
Now, if you join two waste pipes together, then one is clogged and the other runs and they don't mix...
Why use weeze to cool the turbines if you can use a aquatuner and then use this temp in another steam turbine??????
I think you need super-coolant to get a net-gain for that to be worth it. In this particular video, Brothgar is trying to make something feasible with the current materials he has available in his Let's Play series.
I subbed for this video. once I saw that juicy graph :P
Nothing like some Broth when you're feeling sick. Mama approves.
5:04 thermal dynamics *bam* *bam* **~it’s kinda how it works ™~**’
8:35 it looks like an upside down Christmas tree. The tree of power!
anyone can tell me if theere was a patch to the temperature ""stacking"" of the temperature in the reservoir or something ?? i just did the same experiment he did i do not get steam.
you need to keep doing it until the oil gets hot enough
I know this is an old vid but I didn't see this comment. When you worked out that you had 195kj free energy, you didn't take into account the power drain from running the aquatuner.
Love your content, Brothgar! Got me watching your video until the little mans hours. I was wondering if you thought about doing maybe a quick tips and tricks video for newer players?
How much power can a super dupe produce on a manual generator?🤔🤔
@@brothgar didn't it use to work like that? I've never played but I've been following from the beginning
15th Ha!!!! Awesome work Brothgar.
Next update : "Metal refinerys power costs now depends on what you're refining.
Does it??
refinerys targaryen
i try running that thing and all it dose for me is break pipes
how about automating polluted water drip into steam chamber, so you're refining metal, refining water & free energy
incoming polluted water can get warmed by heat in generator room before being dropped into steam chamber (cold water would 'waste' thermal energy)
I was using metal refinery for cleaning germs from lavatories and sinks , may I need to add steam turbine :)
MMC2019 wait, what? Explain.
@@Capitan83es germs die in high temperatures.
So THAT'S how the memory toggle works....
It's not free energy as long as a duplicant has to operate it.
Is the metal refinery affected by tinkering skill?
Cuz next thing we know, u get more the higher the skill is...
AFAIK tinkering affects the speed, so it takes less time to refine, at the same power level. So less power for the same heating.
ONI Thermodynamics is so broken xD
Super coolant !! Ja
.........SO,PLACING THIS IN METAL VOLCANO TURBINE ROOM WITH LOTS OF RADIANT PIPES IS A GOOD SOLUTION
............AT LEAST I'VE MANAGED SOMETHING BY MYSELF
Did you see rtgames?
Brothgar 0:54 You clearly didn't get the joke (I was using water as coolant for first tests).
7:50 Yes, it would generate (or at the very last cause a change of) voltage *potential* across one pair of the conductors in the output wire, if it were to generate electrical energy.
Should I just leave to not expose any more bad jokes?
On the other hand, does a mod allow you to turn *steel* to iron or it's ore? Because that may be better than the manual generator (unless you require power to turn a refined metal into it's previous form).
I'll be better, use a lot of a steel transformators, u don't waste energy, but they generate heat, thanks that you can build the almost perfect perpetum mobile xD
Some one call my name?
dude you talk too fast. for someone new its hard to get everything done
First!
Second!
Fifth