I have an addiction to writing stories where the protagonist has an unhingedly strong belief and a homoerotic relationship with a character foil who challenges that belief. It's just so fun and my favourite way to write theme.
I think making different characters based off of the theme and showing the difference in opinion within those characters is really powerful. I really like your videos Shaelin! Keep up the awesome content!
That can be a really cool technique as well, using various characters to explore different facts of the theme!! It can especially be interesting if you have a multi POV story with an overarching theme, and then each character can explore that theme in a different way.
Thank you for this. You may have just saved me. I often struggle with coming up with “original”/ “meaningful”themes and overthink what I want to say / how to explore it. Usually when I watch book/movie analyses, the themes seem so clear cut / concrete, but that’s bc reviewers spend a lot of time studying the writers’ intentions so they can communicate with their viewers and make the content more comprehensive.
I was worried my story's ending not having a clear moral thesis and the protagonists' lessons learned being complex and murky was a bad thing so I'm glad that's not a rule of writing. Also the vido's end music reminds me of Stephen universe
Loved your thoughts on theme changing and developing as the characters and plot change and develop! But now I'm wondering how to implement that thematic change and motion into my process without losing the theme's sense of continuity..
I think it helps to think of the change as the theme itself! So how that theme is moving along side the characters/story is actually where the depth comes from. A character in a static place doesn't have much to provide thematically because we have no journey or context to give it meaning, but a character who is changing through a situation does, because the movement gives us something to explore. So it's less 'the theme was this at the start of the book, and now the theme is this at the end'' and more 'the movement of the story and characters is what allows the theme to develop/clarify.' It's all a bit fluffy haha but I hope that makes sense!
Letting theme emerge is what I'm mostly trying to do even though I have a pretty definitive outline plot wise. I'm writing about armed conflict which always raises a bunch of obvious questions about the morality of violence but I don't really have any answers planned and not sure I want to offer any obvious answers. I started writing before the war in Ukraine and the aggressor in my story is an AI which makes it even easier to go "oh well they started it, so of course we have to fight back." There are situations like that and WWII where the decision to fight is obvious but it still results in things like bombing civilians. I'm trying to explore how people make decisions when the fear of violence and death is well founded and ever present but I'm not sure I really want to present any idea of what the best things to do is so much as what people tend to do. That and even though it's been done to death I can't help but include the eulogization of people sacrificing their lives.
To be clear though I 100% stand by Ukraine and Putin's invasion is an example of where people have no choice but to fight back, and thus far no attacks have been launched against Russian civilians but have against Ukrainian civilians.
you might enjoy LocalScriptMan’s content here on youtube. he goes very in depth about theme, and his writing philosophy centers around the theme of a story. his videos are also impeccably entertaining and i have prof diag. ADHD! all this to say i HIGHLY recommend his channel!
The fear of "getting it wrong" is relatable to put it mildly. As someone for whom context is everything, I encounter what seems to be a neverending stream of frustration when people's first reaction to the things I write is to skim the surface and jump on the first idea they see. Themes take time and patience. (As you put it, "the answer is the whole book".) Likewise, framing themes as a thesis is right on the edge of being one of my pet peeves. The best writers among us know how terrible it is to preach. My works often explore morality ... and the key word is "explore", because finding the answers during the act of writing them is more interesting to me than driving a preconceived message into the viewer's brain. The part of your approach that jolted my brain (thank you from the bottom of my soul) is getting away from treating theme as a cloud over the story and instead linking it to plot beats, word choices, and moving components. As much as it sucks when everything is telegraphed, there is such a thing as too much subtlety, which I can say from experience is going to backfire. Unity of form and content (or as I tend to put it: the vehicle of style with substance in the driver's seat) has become a lot bigger for me as I develop more projects. My habit of flip-flopping between mediums for any given story (will it be a play? a novel? a TV series? etc.) is more manageable and I make up my mind quicker when I ask myself how the story is being communicated and what effect it'll have. For example a series I've been desperate to pitch to CBC will only work if I write it as a book first. The worldbuilding is so theme-heavy, and TV in general has veered so far toward "binging", that maybe preserving the meat of my story will be easier by arranging for the adaptation process to be part of the storytelling experience. When you talked about theme done wrong as a mouthpiece, you accidentally reminded me of Wiseau's The Room. And now I can't stop thinking about framed photos of spoons.
I think, RE your first point, what has helped me is to remember that the majority of readers aren't consciously looking for a theme, and that's okay. If they don't pick up on it, it doesn't mean all the work you put in to threading those ideas into the story wasn't worth it, because it probably really did contribute to their reading experience and the depth and complexity of the piece, even if they aren't able to write an essay about the themes at the end haha. Many readers will only pick up on theme subconsciously, but those themes probably still made the story richer and more compelling even if they didn't leave taking away a really clear picture of the theme.
Loved the timing of this video, since I'm at the point where I'm trying to figure out the theme(s) in my story and the video is great. But I disagree about the theme needing to change along with the story. I feel like in a story everything else changes but the theme should always stay the same. To me, it's the anchor of the story and what the worldbuilding, plot and character all point to. If it's always jumping around can you really say you have a theme? 🤔That's not to say the theme can't change completely from say book one to the sequel, but not within the same book. Then again I do tend to prefer thesis statement themes so that might have something to do with my disagreeing.
This is a good way of looking at it! By the theme changing I didn't mean that the statement you're expressing literally changes (so you start with one conclusion and at the end you have changed your mind to a different conclusion), but that the idea develops or clarifies or complicates throughout the story. I meant that more in the sense that there's exploration, rather than just presenting a thesis and trying to prove it. But like I said, I tend to view theme as a question and that begs looking at ideas from different angles in most cases. Sorry if that was unclear!
I'm not one to stress over theme; character, plot cohesion, and appropriate word choice are more my focus, and yet listening to this, the theme of my manuscript cropped up with very little prodding: Trust We'll see if that influences the ongoing edits
The premise is usually the set up. For ex my current WIP has the premise that a local woman and her husband are conducting their own investigation to try to get justice for their murdered friends. The themes of that story (so far) is to what extent does justice fix things when it can't make it so the crime never happened and how do those left behind move on with their lives? I have nebulous thoughts on these questions but nothing I can wac poetic about so the characters and I will figure it out together.
Hi shaelin, I really need your advice. What should I do if I want to write a novella but have no ideas? I can write, and I want to write, and I can finish things, but I always struggle with coming up with ideas. I've had a really bad writer's block for over 5 months. I really hope you can write back to me and give me your advice.
I had a writer's block for more than 5 years. If you don't have a story to tell, just write something else. The ideas will come at the right moment. ;)
If you live under a bridge for 40days, there's a good chance you'll come up with a story. Sometimes our lives are too comfortable, and we need the rug pulled out from under our feet.
In school i was taught that every book begins with a theme. There is not a single book that was written around one, from childrens books to literary works. I thought that was insane. People read for entertainment and escapism, to expeirence something beyond themsleves. I told my teacher that there is no way every fiction novel started with a theme in mind. She didn't like that.
Hi Shealin. I really like your videos; you make a lot of sense, but I have one request; please slow down a little. You talk so fast that sometimes it's difficult to take it in. I know that you have a lot to say but not so fast. please.
Three thoughts on Theme 1. Even the generic “it's on this topic” kind of loosey-goosey theme is *also* the preaching a moral - because how could it not be? If you say you're writing about love or acceptance or diversity or whatever broad theme - you're also conveying your point of view. You are certainly not writing a story with all sides of an argument presented as equally true. You would not be happy if the audience came away thinking you were advocating the exact opposite of your personal beliefs, or even that the beliefs to which you are opposed as are actually equally justified as your own. Even if you're not trying to write a didactic preachy story, it will still have your thoughts on your theme that you want the audience to agree with. How could you not? 2. I often start with a very clear-cut didatic statement along the lines of, “You must do X if you want Y’ … which can be a rather obvious moral. But by the time I get through with my book, that is often tossed to the wayside. I try to see if there is another theme that has emerged from the story, and if I can find one, then I go back and tweak the story to strengthen that theme. 3. But I also like David Lynch’s take on it. When asked what was the meaning of his movie, he said, paraphrased, that he spent more than a year working very hard to make a three-hour movie - and the meaning is in the movie - the whole movie IS the meaning. If he could distill it to just a few sentences, he would've just done that instead of doing all the work of making the movie.
Just dropping by to mention the audio quality. It's kind of hard to hear you, maybe you're a little too far from the microphone? Or the space might be creating an echo.
I have an addiction to writing stories where the protagonist has an unhingedly strong belief and a homoerotic relationship with a character foil who challenges that belief. It's just so fun and my favourite way to write theme.
I think making different characters based off of the theme and showing the difference in opinion within those characters is really powerful. I really like your videos Shaelin! Keep up the awesome content!
That can be a really cool technique as well, using various characters to explore different facts of the theme!! It can especially be interesting if you have a multi POV story with an overarching theme, and then each character can explore that theme in a different way.
Your content has been FIRE recently. Thank you so much for these in-depth breakdowns, they've all been deeply applicable to my recent WIP.
Ahh thank you!! I've been putting a lot of effort into my content lately so I'm really glad it's helping
It is really helping. 🤞🏼
Thank you for this. You may have just saved me. I often struggle with coming up with “original”/ “meaningful”themes and overthink what I want to say / how to explore it. Usually when I watch book/movie analyses, the themes seem so clear cut / concrete, but that’s bc reviewers spend a lot of time studying the writers’ intentions so they can communicate with their viewers and make the content more comprehensive.
Yes! As someone who's literally insufferable about themes, I feel seen. Thank you for the amazing video as always!
I was worried my story's ending not having a clear moral thesis and the protagonists' lessons learned being complex and murky was a bad thing so I'm glad that's not a rule of writing. Also the vido's end music reminds me of Stephen universe
Loved your thoughts on theme changing and developing as the characters and plot change and develop! But now I'm wondering how to implement that thematic change and motion into my process without losing the theme's sense of continuity..
I think it helps to think of the change as the theme itself! So how that theme is moving along side the characters/story is actually where the depth comes from. A character in a static place doesn't have much to provide thematically because we have no journey or context to give it meaning, but a character who is changing through a situation does, because the movement gives us something to explore. So it's less 'the theme was this at the start of the book, and now the theme is this at the end'' and more 'the movement of the story and characters is what allows the theme to develop/clarify.' It's all a bit fluffy haha but I hope that makes sense!
Letting theme emerge is what I'm mostly trying to do even though I have a pretty definitive outline plot wise. I'm writing about armed conflict which always raises a bunch of obvious questions about the morality of violence but I don't really have any answers planned and not sure I want to offer any obvious answers. I started writing before the war in Ukraine and the aggressor in my story is an AI which makes it even easier to go "oh well they started it, so of course we have to fight back." There are situations like that and WWII where the decision to fight is obvious but it still results in things like bombing civilians. I'm trying to explore how people make decisions when the fear of violence and death is well founded and ever present but I'm not sure I really want to present any idea of what the best things to do is so much as what people tend to do. That and even though it's been done to death I can't help but include the eulogization of people sacrificing their lives.
To be clear though I 100% stand by Ukraine and Putin's invasion is an example of where people have no choice but to fight back, and thus far no attacks have been launched against Russian civilians but have against Ukrainian civilians.
Perhaps people might raise the question who made the AI or how it came to be, which might lend into the themes you're working with
I have never once understood theme until this video
you might enjoy LocalScriptMan’s content here on youtube. he goes very in depth about theme, and his writing philosophy centers around the theme of a story.
his videos are also impeccably entertaining and i have prof diag. ADHD! all this to say i HIGHLY recommend his channel!
@@2009sdaughter thank you, I'll check him out!
The fear of "getting it wrong" is relatable to put it mildly. As someone for whom context is everything, I encounter what seems to be a neverending stream of frustration when people's first reaction to the things I write is to skim the surface and jump on the first idea they see. Themes take time and patience. (As you put it, "the answer is the whole book".)
Likewise, framing themes as a thesis is right on the edge of being one of my pet peeves. The best writers among us know how terrible it is to preach. My works often explore morality ... and the key word is "explore", because finding the answers during the act of writing them is more interesting to me than driving a preconceived message into the viewer's brain.
The part of your approach that jolted my brain (thank you from the bottom of my soul) is getting away from treating theme as a cloud over the story and instead linking it to plot beats, word choices, and moving components. As much as it sucks when everything is telegraphed, there is such a thing as too much subtlety, which I can say from experience is going to backfire.
Unity of form and content (or as I tend to put it: the vehicle of style with substance in the driver's seat) has become a lot bigger for me as I develop more projects. My habit of flip-flopping between mediums for any given story (will it be a play? a novel? a TV series? etc.) is more manageable and I make up my mind quicker when I ask myself how the story is being communicated and what effect it'll have. For example a series I've been desperate to pitch to CBC will only work if I write it as a book first. The worldbuilding is so theme-heavy, and TV in general has veered so far toward "binging", that maybe preserving the meat of my story will be easier by arranging for the adaptation process to be part of the storytelling experience.
When you talked about theme done wrong as a mouthpiece, you accidentally reminded me of Wiseau's The Room. And now I can't stop thinking about framed photos of spoons.
I think, RE your first point, what has helped me is to remember that the majority of readers aren't consciously looking for a theme, and that's okay. If they don't pick up on it, it doesn't mean all the work you put in to threading those ideas into the story wasn't worth it, because it probably really did contribute to their reading experience and the depth and complexity of the piece, even if they aren't able to write an essay about the themes at the end haha. Many readers will only pick up on theme subconsciously, but those themes probably still made the story richer and more compelling even if they didn't leave taking away a really clear picture of the theme.
You mean I'm not supposed to stop the whole story every third page to rant about my political views? Whhhhaaaaa?
Terry Goodkind has left the chat
I found a moronic comment I guess
Instructions unclear. Accidentally wrote „The Communist manifesto 2: Electric Boogaloo (revised version)“
This sounds dumb
Tysm, Shaelin! ❤
Btw, what is the title & author of the blue book on the top shelf? 📘 (next to the plant)
Betty by Tiffany McDaniel
“Theme should move”
Ayn Rand: hold my beer
Loved the timing of this video, since I'm at the point where I'm trying to figure out the theme(s) in my story and the video is great. But I disagree about the theme needing to change along with the story. I feel like in a story everything else changes but the theme should always stay the same. To me, it's the anchor of the story and what the worldbuilding, plot and character all point to. If it's always jumping around can you really say you have a theme? 🤔That's not to say the theme can't change completely from say book one to the sequel, but not within the same book.
Then again I do tend to prefer thesis statement themes so that might have something to do with my disagreeing.
Quite right
This is a good way of looking at it! By the theme changing I didn't mean that the statement you're expressing literally changes (so you start with one conclusion and at the end you have changed your mind to a different conclusion), but that the idea develops or clarifies or complicates throughout the story. I meant that more in the sense that there's exploration, rather than just presenting a thesis and trying to prove it. But like I said, I tend to view theme as a question and that begs looking at ideas from different angles in most cases. Sorry if that was unclear!
@@ShaelinWrites definitely :-)
NEW SHAELIN NEW SHAELIN
I'm not one to stress over theme; character, plot cohesion, and appropriate word choice are more my focus, and yet listening to this, the theme of my manuscript cropped up with very little prodding:
Trust
We'll see if that influences the ongoing edits
YAY
The statement “no theme is universal” makes me think of the saying “to understand all is to forgive all.” Happy writing themers.
Slay
Shaelin - are we talking about "premise" here? If not, can you briefly explain the difference? Thank you soooo much. :o)
The premise is usually the set up. For ex my current WIP has the premise that a local woman and her husband are conducting their own investigation to try to get justice for their murdered friends. The themes of that story (so far) is to what extent does justice fix things when it can't make it so the crime never happened and how do those left behind move on with their lives? I have nebulous thoughts on these questions but nothing I can wac poetic about so the characters and I will figure it out together.
Hi shaelin, I really need your advice. What should I do if I want to write a novella but have no ideas? I can write, and I want to write, and I can finish things, but I always struggle with coming up with ideas. I've had a really bad writer's block for over 5 months. I really hope you can write back to me and give me your advice.
I had a writer's block for more than 5 years. If you don't have a story to tell, just write something else. The ideas will come at the right moment. ;)
If you live under a bridge for 40days, there's a good chance you'll come up with a story.
Sometimes our lives are too comfortable, and we need the rug pulled out from under our feet.
In school i was taught that every book begins with a theme. There is not a single book that was written around one, from childrens books to literary works. I thought that was insane. People read for entertainment and escapism, to expeirence something beyond themsleves. I told my teacher that there is no way every fiction novel started with a theme in mind. She didn't like that.
Hi Shealin. I really like your videos; you make a lot of sense, but I have one request; please slow down a little. You talk so fast that sometimes it's difficult to take it in. I know that you have a lot to say but not so fast. please.
Three thoughts on Theme
1. Even the generic “it's on this topic” kind of loosey-goosey theme is *also* the preaching a moral - because how could it not be?
If you say you're writing about love or acceptance or diversity or whatever broad theme - you're also conveying your point of view. You are certainly not writing a story with all sides of an argument presented as equally true. You would not be happy if the audience came away thinking you were advocating the exact opposite of your personal beliefs, or even that the beliefs to which you are opposed as are actually equally justified as your own.
Even if you're not trying to write a didactic preachy story, it will still have your thoughts on your theme that you want the audience to agree with. How could you not?
2. I often start with a very clear-cut didatic statement along the lines of, “You must do X if you want Y’ … which can be a rather obvious moral.
But by the time I get through with my book, that is often tossed to the wayside.
I try to see if there is another theme that has emerged from the story, and if I can find one, then I go back and tweak the story to strengthen that theme.
3. But I also like David Lynch’s take on it. When asked what was the meaning of his movie, he said, paraphrased, that he spent more than a year working very hard to make a three-hour movie - and the meaning is in the movie - the whole movie IS the meaning.
If he could distill it to just a few sentences, he would've just done that instead of doing all the work of making the movie.
Just dropping by to mention the audio quality. It's kind of hard to hear you, maybe you're a little too far from the microphone? Or the space might be creating an echo.