The Not-so-flat Truth About Flatwound Strings | Tuning Up
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- Опубліковано 11 гру 2021
- You've tried a zillion pedals, guitars, and amps … it's time you tried flats. Just don't make the same mistake I did!
Read: bit.ly/Flatwounds
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#premierguitar #guitar #flatwound
Read: bit.ly/Flatwounds
Subscribe to PG's Channel: bit.ly/SubscribePGUA-cam
Don't Miss a Rundown: bit.ly/RIgRundownENL
Merch & Magazines: shop.premierguitar.com
How in the world can I know what the new strings sound like when you kick in a full-throttle fuzz effect and obscure the pure sound of the guitar and strings?
Hahahahaha....true!
I mean the idiot didn’t even know what flatwound strings were for 20 out of 37 years of playing guitars soooo
The first 13 seconds of the video and the Elvis "Don't Be Cruel" riff @3:47 both show the non fuzz tone of flatwound strings...
Bloody exactly!!
Wasted all my time watching this junk then Mr Emoji blasts it through a third grade fuzz box.
@@Dejoblue yeah and with a great sound quality too.........honestly this is PREMIER GUITAR?
I thought those guys knew what they were talking about
I've been using 13-56 flatwounds for 10+ years, can't imagine going back. I play heavy rock tuned to C# standard.
C# standard is JUICY
7 minutes of talking, 7 seconds of playing.
With fuzz.
I learned a great deal thanks to this wonderful content.
Thank you for saving me from wasting my time
Check out Khruangbin. Mark Speer plays flat wounds on a Strat.
I’m disappointed that you didn’t show us what flatwounds sound like through a Metal Zone and a BitCrusher.
Just to round out the discussion here (ha!) flatwound strings also FEEL different while playing. Sliding from chord to chord and licks like buttah.
Duck?
I put some on my Strat after seeing Mark Speer and the Khruangbin rig rundown and honestly wouldn’t go back to round wound now. Even on a Strat they sound warm and mellow and no more metallic scratch when you run your hand up and down the frets between notes or chords which to my ears gives them more refinement in a weird way. Of course they’re not going to be for everyone but I love the variation of tone I get at the jazzier end of things playing clean - usually neck or middle.
The irony is what it does for the high end.
People think flats just arbitrarily chop off the high end, but that's actually what a tone knob does, it just flattens the top end with a hammer - but flatwounds on the other hand, especially when broken in, allow you to crank the high end on your amp/guitar and get all sorts of rich, natural, pleasant high end that still has little frequency peaks and valleys as where simply turning the tone down sounds like putting earplugs in.
On bass it drives me insane when people think turning the tone down gives you a 'flatwound sound' but you really are just hacking off the entire top end, leaving you with zero nuance in the upper register.
I put together a light gauge flatwound set (.008 - .038) with Thomastik-Infeld strings. There are no flatwound .008 sets that I know of, so I put a custom set together from Thomastik-Infeld individual strings at "Just Strings". This is an expensive way to do it. There are flatwound .009 sets available from Curt Mangan, GHS, and LaBella that cost less than the custom set method, but flatwound sets are more expensive than roundwound sets overall. Next time I may go with an already made flatwound .009 set, but I do like T-I's quality.
I put my custom flat set on my '58 Jazzmaster reissue. Well, to say the least I'm very, very happy with them on that guitar, and I'm going to try them on my '62 Strat (a real one). I expect that I'll be equally happy with what they do on that guitar. If I had to describe it, I'd say that they add distinctly more character and more harmonic quality.
The idea was to go to flatwounds for many reasons that you already know from this and other similar sites. However, I wanted the tone to remain bright, so a very light set was imperative. Lighter gauge strings increase mid and upper-mid response, give you fabulous touch response overall and are amazing when bending and adding hand vibrato.
Lighter gauge strings also reduce the stress on all guitars and let them resonate more freely. Yes, you'll probably have to adjust the truss rod a bit loser as there is less string pull on the neck. This also lets the neck relax which adds sonic benefits.
If you've ever played flats, you already know what they do. I'm not going to add to what was said here and elsewhere. There is no need to. Just try them, they're really worth the experiment and after giving them a shot for a while you just may be as happy with them as I am.
We bass players know all about flats. Didnt know they were popular with 6 stringers.
Truth. All of my basses have flats on them. I bought a set of flats for our guitarist, but she hasn’t tried them out yet. Curious to see how she likes them.
I have the original flatwounds that came on my 1975 Precision Bass
LOL!
I have a set of 9 year old la Bella flats on my p bass & they sound lush 😍
Thomastik user here! Best strings ever..
Shawn, thank you for this video and PG article! Based on my brief experience trying half-rounds on my bass 40 years ago, I assumed flatwounds on guitar were for jazz players who actually *liked* that muted tone for whatever reason (I always have my tone knobs dimed). After reading/viewing this story, I took a leap of faith on the Thomastik-Infeld JS110 set, stringing them on my reissue Kay Barney Kessel. I replaced just the wound strings at first and played for a couple of hours, very pleased with the new T-Is on 4-5-6 and a little put off by the stock D'Addarios on 1-2-3. Totally worth the 30 bucks!
I think everyone used flat wounds until round wounds were invented in the 60s
There was nothing else available for the lower strings: and in those days, 'lower strings' on an electric guitar meant the bottom four, not the bottom three - something else the reviewer here doesn't mention. The biggest changes in the 60s were probably the replacement of the flatwound string by the roundwound string: the replacement of the wound G string by the plain G string; and the general adoption of lighter gauges all round, which began with players substituting a banjo string for the high E and was then picked up by the manufacturers. Taken together, those innovations provide the foundation for 60s blues and rock playing: big, sustaining sound, fast picking, hammer-ons and pull-offs, finger vibrato and wide bends.
In 1961, the Les Paul Junior (SG shape), which we now think of as a very rock-and-roll guitar, was still sold with flats and a one-piece cast bridge with crude intonation ridges: the 'lightning bolt'. Those ridges were grouped 4 and 2 - correct for flatwounds, where only the top two strings are plain. Such a bridge will not intonate correctly with a plain G string: the ridges have to be grouped 3 and 3. This is what you will see on the modern Gibson 'lightning bolt' bridge and its many copies.
That’s why I had intonation issues with my wraparound SG. That’s being converted into a slide guise so I will get flatwounds anyways
@@innocentoctave Telecasters with three saddle bridges are intonated when they have four wound strings, I don't know why more people don't talk about this.
@@TheTurtleneck64 There are a lot of people who aren't interested in the history of the technology they use. Even when you point out how it affected the way that musicians played and the music they composed, they just shrug. But this is an instance in which, if you don't know about the 4/2 split, the Telecaster 3-saddle bridge just looks incomprehensible: like, why would you even do that? Of course, the underlying issue of using one saddle for two strings doesn't go away, even if they are of the same type.
Shawn, miss you and the guys at the NAMM shows. Very informative post on new gear at those shows. Hope you and Jason will be back reporting from the NAMM shows! Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year 2022!
Flatwound strings were standard on guitar until the Late 60's ; the Beatles were still using them on Revolver in 1966.
I use D’Addario 12-52 flats on my slide guitar, a 1968 brass body Dobro. Amplified, the tone is luscious and the rattle of slide against round wound strings is gone. So sweet.
Try GHS flats or Thomastik flats - worlds better than D'addario.
@@allrequiredfields how? Why?
I really miss seeing the number of dislikes. They were a great way to not waste seven minutes of my life.
😂😂😂 so true
Imma use this else where on this interweb thanks periwinkle
That's why they removed the feature. You can still see it with an extension though.
My first electric was a 1957 Gretsch "Streamliner" (thick, fully hollow, cloud inlays, one patent-applied-for Filtertron at the neck) I bought it used in 1965, and it had Gretsch medium flatwounds on it (they had cloth wrapped ends with an extra high "E" and "B" and came in a circular plastic container - tres cool). I played it that way for a year and replaced any broken strings with the same. It sounded glorious, especially for Duane Eddy and other rockabilly stuff. I played on all my early sessions with it.
In 1966 I began using a new, 1966 Gretsch Chet Atkins "Nashville" (thinner, two cutaway, orange) but did not string it with round wound strings until I started going to very thin ones for easier bending and such in late1967.
I'm back to flats now and virtually all of my electric guitars are strung with them. Big improvement, say I.
Sometimes old school is the best school.
I'm so glad that I live right next to Vienna, Austria where Thomasik-Infelds are made and so they are not as expensive here.
I'm going to assume that the unnamed "brand X" flatwounds that you didn't like were D'Addario Chromes. I didn't think they were bad (at least for Jazz), but I do like the Thomastik-Infelds better.
TI also makes a "Jazz Bebop" string which is supposed to sound somewhere in between flat-wound and round-wound (although it is round-wound). I haven't tried them.
D'Addario also makes something in-between, a "half-round". I haven't tried those yet either.
As a TI user for my '63 L5CES and '76 Hagstrom Jimmy Oval, D'addarios have nothing on TI. Also half-rounds feel gross. They are just as dead as chromes and don't feel near as nice.
Gregory Holmberg-- I have tried the T-I BeBops and I love them! If you've got a guitar that you'd like to tailor for more of an 'R&B' tone, or just get a smoother, warmer, Jazzier tone out of with fuller mids and very slightly rolled-off high-treble and low-bass (kinda like what a Tube Screamer does), try a Thomastik-Infeld BeBop "Jazz Round-Wound" set, and maybe go up a gauge heavier than you usually would. Larger diameter core-wire with smaller diameter winding for a stronger fundamental; brighter and more 'round-wound' than flat-wounds. Solid/pure-nickel wrap on round core wire; similar to DR Pure Blues, but a little lower in the mid-frequencies emphasized and subtly darker- smooth purr compared to the upper-mid bite and attitude of the DR Pure Blues.
@@DavidGoessling what about the nylon wound flatwounds from D'Addario?
Hi, nice guitar, I have one too, I wanted to know what strings you put together because I also have flatwounds but I can't do much bending, especially with the G
I use D’Addario Chrome flatwound 10’s on a Telecaster and they don’t sound dead they just shift the mids to be really interesting clean or distorted. 10’s because they sound great through small amps like a Vibro Champ and also through big amps. Heavier strings overwhelm small amps the way I play.
Sean! GET to the bloody POINT mate!
I find that, with flatwounds on my Ibanez Artcore, I get a very mellow tone on the neck pickup and a nasal quality on the bridge pickup. In either case, I rely on distortion (even just "clean" distortion) to fill in the high end. I feel like I can really dig in, too, especially with the extra heavy flatwounds.
I love flats on my Gretsch for bebop/gypsy jazz
Back when I started playing electric guitar (1964, although I’d played acoustic since 1962), flatwounds were kind of the professional standard, although that was starting to change. The Ventures’ original 1960 recording of Walk Don’t Run featued Bob Bogle playing the melody on a Fender Jazzmaster with flatwound strings, both pickups on, through a clean amp. It’s a sound that I’d been trying to nail, and couldn’t get, maybe because I didn’t have a Jazzmaster, or flatwounds either! Whenever I’d find a Jazzmaster in a music store (I’ve never owned one!), I’d give
(cont.) Walk Don’t Run a good try, but something was still not quite there. At that time, new Fenders were shipping with roundwounds, probably .012”-.056”. Decades later, in the early 2000s, I tried a ‘60s Jazzmaster with flats through a Fender Pro Reverb amp, and there it was. The trick seemed to be those flatwound strings. So if I’m ever in a Ventures cover band, that’s what I’ll do...although flats don’t work very well for anything else I play except jazz! The only guitar I’ve ever used flats on was a Vox Phantom 12-string that I bought new in 1966, and I used flats on it because Pete Townshend had said in an interview that it was important to use flats on an electric 12-string. He didn’t say why, but the Vox sounded better with them, a little fuller and less shrill. I’ve never used flatwounds since-my current 12-string is a Fender that I use Elixir roundwounds on, and they sound fine.
I did some more research, Flatwound Strings were invented in 1874 & were originally designed for Bowed stringed instruments to replace the Gut Strings cause 1) they last many times as long, & 2) the flat surface makes them easier to play.
It's not unusual for Thomastik flats to last 7-10 years on a guitar. Their legendary upright bass spirocore flats last 12-20 years.
@@TropicalLatitude The design has improved over the years
Scotty Moore played a Gibson Super 400 during the RCA years and for the '68 Comeback Special, but the axe that's on the Sun sessions is his iconic Gibson ES295.
I think I will try them out.
I love Thomastik-Infeld Swing Flat-Wounds! Now, Shawn Hammond- If you've got a guitar that you'd like to tailor for more of an 'R&B' tone, or just get a smoother, warmer, Jazzier tone out of with fuller mids and very slightly rolled-off high-treble and low-bass (kinda like what a Tube Screamer does), try a Thomastik-Infeld BeBop "Jazz Round-Wound" set, and maybe go up a gauge heavier than you usually would. Larger diameter core-wire with smaller diameter winding for a stronger fundamental; brighter and more 'round-wound' than flat-wounds. Solid/pure-nickel wrap on round core wire; similar to DR Pure Blues, but a little lower in the mid-frequencies emphasized and subtly darker- smooth purr compared to the upper-mid bite and attitude of the DR Pure Blues.
Should I go down in gauge w flatwound? I usually use bronze 10s
Isn't 'Don't be cruel' intro played on upright bass?
I use them on my full size archtops. The difference in manufacturers isn't as notable, although the thomastik infeld strings are really good, pricey though.
The Same Thing Happened To Me! Buy years later, I like them! And they are good for slide on some guitars!
I too have a Broadkaster, but I probably be more likely to first try a set of flats on my Electromatic Rat Rod. I actually do use flats a lot on some of my basses, and I do like the tone when using a fuzz with a bass with flats on it.
Ordered a set of Thomasnik Infeld Jazz Swings. They are going on my Broadkaster!
Is there a Part II in which he makes a point?
Love the Flooded LTD hiding in the corner!
Also, is that Mabel from Gravity Falls on the guitar?
I’ve played all flatwounds and find that HALFROUNDS are what sound the best. I’ve got them on my acoustic archtops and Es -175. All the life, volume, harmonics of roundwound with the smoothness of flats.
Yep. I've switched to half rounds. All the tone with none of the string scrape.
Was thinking of putting flats on my baritone to reduce string noise.
feels like i wasted 7 minutes watching this.
"Rockabilly".. proceeds to generate Jack White grunge;) I'ts all good tho.
I use Flatwounds on 2 Les Pauls 12-52 Daddario Chromes tuned to standard and they last for years.. I hate the sound of flatwounds on a Strat or pretty much any Fender Guitar. But Flatwounds on a Les Paul is a great sound for me
I've tried the D'Addario Chromes and the Thomastik Infeld Flats and think the Ti Flats are worth the extra money. (Big price difference) They don't work on every guitar (meh on a Tele) but they sound great on my Godin 5th Avenue and on my Epiphone Special.. They last, stay in tune and are so smooth to play with a sweet tone. If you have multiple guitars , one of them should have flats.
cool tone, but I think the mic signal is distorted
I'd recommend Pyramids over Thomastik-Infeld for that "woody" rockabilly sound. Thomastik-Infelds are good, but I give Pyramids a significant edge for that "woody" rockabilly sound with more definition than the Thomastik-Infelds. I've played flatwounds for around three decades now and use them on most of my guitars and both bass guitars, including Gretsch 6119, 6120, and 6128. I've used both brands a lot and settled on Pyramids.
Which gauge of flats do you use on your 6120? Someone told me to go up a gauge or two with flats, but I don't know if that is necessary. Thanks in advance.
@@fibonacho I use Pyramid 411 Mediums (.011 to .048) on my 6120, and i currently use a .020 solid instead of wound for the G string. I use 412 Heavy (.013 to .052) and 310 Light (.010 to .0465) on some of my other guitars.
@@davidwdoerr Thanks for the reply! I'll give them a try. I looked into this a long time ago and remember people liking TI's, but based on your description Pyramids are probably what I'm looking for.
I learned nothing about flatwounds here. All I learned was that this guy needs a dog. Or three.
Reason the Thomasticks are so playable is that they play like a round wound. Lots of "springy ness". EB strings play like a power cable. Dead and no bounce.
I use chromes, they sound a little brighter cuz they're stainless steel.
I have a set of flat 11's On my Ibanez as103. So much fun to jam out some Mike Stern style leads with it. Shawn, I met you in Boston years ago. Great job with the Magazine.
that's because you need to try Thomastik Jazz Swings. You just SHOULD.
flatwounds sound heavenly on bright guitars with a "chime" sound, like stratocasters and anything with a mini-humbucker or firebird pickup. Be careful of the TYPE of flatwound you get.
There are:
Steel (called Nickel Plated) flatwounds,
PURE Nickel flatwound
and be careful of what brand---the construction between Pyramid and Thomastik is wholly different. I hate the pyramids. They sound dead from the get-go. The reason is that they are actually wound around roundwound strings! The thomastik infelds are wound straight over a round core.
Scotty Moore probably played a Gibson L5 with flatwounds on the guitar.
Luther Perkins Luther Played The Bogie Wogie Johnny Cash
Was your first experience with flats D'Addarios? I hate D'Addarios but their flats are Unquestionably the worst flats around - and flats are all I play, so I've been through most of them.
Wow, I knew about Flatwounds when I first started playing guitar 1962. Obviously you didn't buy a good string.
haha I wrote that before watching the whole thing and there you go. Am I right or not? :-D
Would like to have heard some clean playing.
At least give a third of the video to hearing the guitar on different settings with them! 🤣
medddddd
Couldn't spend a little more time showing us what these strings sound like? Maybe without all the added pedals? Basically less talk/more playing! Based on what I did hear, I still have no idea if I'd like flat wound strings.
tell me D'Addario Chromes suck without telling me D'Addario Chromes suck, lol.
I've never tried them, but from what I can tell they have a decently smooth feel, but they don't get the flatwound sound, and that the only real advantage the Chromes has is the price-
@@riogrande163 They sound dead to me -- and I suspect they are single-handedly to blame for most people who have tried flatwounds only to complain that they sound terrible
Is he drunk?
.my thoughts as well after he plays at the end and rattles about fuzz
The number of "model citizens" posting under this video. Some of you SERIOUSLY need to relax. Go outside and take in some oxygen. You clearly need it. For my part, I enjoyed this. We've seen John play often and he's amazing but never seen Shawn play before. Solid chops! Also enjoyed the flat wound discovery and the "off the cuff"-ness of this.
Get to the point…….
Wow Very fat guitar Sound!
It you want to display the sound of the strings, turn the distortion off. Also, yes, you've been playing for 30 years, but you've been playing the same thing for 27 of those 30 years. With distortion, you're covering up the sound of the flatwounds. There is a lesson there though: Guys, if you don't like the sound of what you're plaing, turn on the distortion.
The video left me feeling pretty flat wound - all blah and no useful tone comparison.
This guy doesn't know what he's talking about. He doesn't play the right kind of music for flats.
That's some pretty bad guitar playing and tone too.
pretty neurotic