A friend of mine, fantastic pianist, graduate of Manhattan School of Music spend two years of his life going from competition to competition. He spend a lot of money: entrance fees, flight tickets, hotels... His best result? In two competitions he passed to the second stage.
Hi Ferruccio, thank you for sharing. I am writing a screenplay about piano competitions and wondering if you would be so kind as to put me in touch with your friend.
I suspect competition results would be quite different if the judges did not know the identity of the pianist, and could not see him/her. Just seeing a competitor approach the piano might suffice to color a judge's opinion! Does she stride to the piano confidently, or does he sort of slouch, as if unsure of h imself? Such impressions can carry weight, even if denied or unacknowledged. Paul Hein
Judging a pianist by name is just dumb but there is definitely something to be said about the performers actions beyond pressing notes. Think of rockstars getting into the music and moving vs just standing perfectly still. It certainly adds more to the performance when a pianist looks into the music (when it’s authentic and not just for show which frankly looks stupid).
@@Danofstockport Hope you know shows like the Voice are fabricated... The judges know exactly who is singing because that person had to audition. I know this because I know someone who made it to the televised part of the show. Can't say their name due to liability for them, but yeah... It's fake.
Sir Henry Walford Davis said "Our object is not to gain a prize or defeat a rival, but rather to pace one another on the road to excellence". That was on the wall above my piano teacher's piano.
I was entered for a piano competition when I was 14 by my piano teacher. I am so glad I chickened out, it would have damaged my love for the instruments. BTW, I am not bad, and not easily stage struck. I just wanna play what I want when I want to
I had the good fortune to attend the Van Cliburn competition in the early 1980's. Although the entire event was spellbinding, I enjoyed the preliminary rounds most of all. In the course of a couple of days, I heard perhaps a dozen different interpretations of several seminal pieces (including the Beethoven Appassionata, A Chopin Scherzo, etc.). I wish I had the time and opportunity to do it again.
Thank you. Have wondered about the piano compitions. Began in music and played juries in college but changed to art for a BFÀ. Did very well in art compition... Never really thought much about it. Just entered what was at hand. Now as a retired person I very thankful for UA-cam and your classes there which let me grow in music and piano again. Thank you!
Great video as always, Robert. I followed the 2015 Chopin competition and noticed that the eventual winner Seung Jin Cho received top scores from most of the judges but also received the lowest possible score from another judge. It seems that even among the very best of the best, there is considerable disagreement as to who is most deserving of the top prize.
Cho one because he’s one of the only competitors who knew how to play legato and make the melodies sing... that’s very telling about these competitions
Very interesting. I think piano competitions are so important to keeping classical piano music alive. I love to follow them, and hear the up and coming youngsters. Interestingly, Lang Lang and Yuja Wang - two of the most successful artists today, did not do a lot of competitions.
Very interesting video. I've heard the story of Argerich becoming furious during that competition before, but I didn't know it had such an impact on Pogorelich's career.
Love what you said about individualism and taking liberties with expression to create a much more heartfelt expression that resonates with a player's inner being. I feel sorry for those music college students who's enrollment are decided on a jury.......some may be thrown out of college for different expression to what the jury likes.........Hope you are doing well
Hey Robert. I've noticed that Beethoven sometimes uses a I diminished chord (fx E dim, in E major) shortly before the ending of a section, where he afterwards goes and plays the I chord, then the V (or IV to V) and back to I. So something like: I - I dim - I - V - I. Or: I - I dim - I - IV - V - I. I know that the purpose is probably to create some tension and then resolve it, but are there other theoretical uses for it? I don't know why, but it sounds amazing. I'm trying to use it when I compose, but it's kind of tricky. Maybe you have some tips? Love your videos btw.
Could you make a video on “cheating” (avoiding certain notes or modifying them slightly to make it easier without being noticeable) know even the top pianists do it and I put it in quotations because it’s seen as negative but I’m kinda on the fence about it. Vocalists will often change the key from the original to a lower or more comfortable key during a live performance to give themselves the best chance of success. Of course the nature of classical music is slightly different, and I’m sure it’s not as acceptable in, say, opera! ( Sometimes it’s even unintentional-this happens a lot with chasse beige by Liszt because there so much tremolo that it creates a “white noise “ , and I will often find myself unintentionally avoiding a chord that is awkward or hard and playing a single note instead , for example) would love to hear your thoughts!
I think if a piece of music is written such that changing a note doesn't make a difference to the best ears of a generation, then the fault is probably on the composer (who was probably just trying to show off).
I also cheated on my recital when I played Czardas by V. Monti. I coudn’t reach one of the keys in my left hand so I played it with a key that I can reach. 😂😂😂
I used to play in regional and state flute and piano competitions when I was in junior and high school, that was my experience with competitions. I had no idea that there were big, national and international competitions but I was just a girl growing up in the wheat fields of Kansas in the 1980‘s, I was lucky to have a good piano/flute teacher who instilled a love of classical music in me. My daughters both took ballet and my oldest daughter experienced some of the ballet competitions and summer intensive auditions. I haven’t decided if they were a good or bad experience, I think that the competitions were probably a waste of time and money but she was able to go to the Kirov Academy in Washington DC and the Chicago Ballet for summer intensives, so I think that she had a good experience with them. She didn’t stick with ballet after graduating from high school unfortunately...
I go to a piano festival in the summer and the concerto winner gets to play with the local symphony. It's unbelievable how scant the audiences are, even when all the recitals are free. A first class recital hall might have 10 people in the audience. The participants don't even go to hear each other play. Last summer, a visiting artist who gave a recital and did master classes lambasted them for the way they practiced and how all they cared about was their next competition. The festival had gone on for years before I even knew about it. It's a great opportunity to hear some of the best talent from all over the world, age 12 to 30. They are unbelievable. The whole world is missing out. People just don't care about spending their spare time listening to classical piano recitals, no matter how good the player is. That includes people who you might think would be most interested, like local pianists, students, and piano teachers. A festival competitor would sooner be in a practice room practicing than to hear the others perform. You have to buy a ticket to hear the concerto winner do their concert with the symphony, but that audience is still scant. Most of the city doesn't even know it's going on. You can hear the finalists play with the symphony for free as they prepare for the finals. The finalists likely have the Van Cliburn in their sights. As one young adolescent girl told me with regard to practicing...."It's all I ever do." She has no other life.
To be fair, there is a valid reason for not wanting to hear other competitors play _before_ you play. When competing at a high level, pretty much everybody else is going to sound very good. So by hearing other people, you will just be making yourself more nervous. But after the competition is over, competitors should listen to recordings of the other players, especially ones who placed better.
Yet everyone will watch AMG or BGT and be astounded by what they think are the greatest pianists alive today, yet they're about grade 5 on piano, everyone is interested in that! It's a great shame the way today's world works. Our TVs are saturated with these so called talent shows and singing shows, nothing that is of a high quality is shown because its too difficult for most people to appreciate. No one is interested in a 40 minute Brahms piano concerto when they can watch 30 seconds of Claire de lune blended/massacred with an Ed sheeran song.
Hello Robert, What are your thoughts on the visual side of the performer? for example some competitors are like Lang Lang they tends to be showy and extravagant and some like Olga Kern very transparent in inner emotions and yet other pianists are very reserve in their posture and demeanor. Do you think judges are swayed by these outward visual expressions at piano competitions?
Some competitive people like piano competitions. Most of the *pianists find them frustrating,* because one has to prepare a lot, then perform under stress, then feel being judged for the thing that we like most in life. The best pianist do not enter piano competitions, because they do not feel good to play under the setting of stress and judgement. If there was a well paid improv competition, then maybe the best would enter for fun. The classical piano competitions are stressful.
As an accomplished organist, I certainly would say the same thing of organists having to fit into certain stylistic interpretations. I am often rather dismayed how anyone who dares interpret the music of J.S. Bach, for example, with their own fresh individuality is immediately attacked as a hack for daring to challenge the prescribed narrative. Now, to be sure, there are historically informed interpretations and organ registrations which should be acknowledged and held in highest esteem; however, we are still artists as musicians, and simply regurgitating established performance practice without any consideration for ones own creativity seems a bit empty to me.
I used to take my piano students to regional youth competitions just as observers. I never agreed with the idea that "this is what all the 12-year-olds are playing," or a particular required piece was expected of eight-year-old students. My older students accompanied me to the quarter or semi-finals of the Van Cliburn in Ft Worth the years it was held. Very enjoyable listening and helped to round out their music education.
I’m 15 gonna be 16 in February. I’m gonna be entering the concerto competition for piano in my city this year, which happens in October. It looks like (and I’m only just about to get started) I’m gonna be trying Beethoven’s Emperor Concerto. But I might try settling with something a little easier like Mozart’s K 488. My teacher also really likes the idea of me trying Grieg. I don’t know. Probably gonna be Beethoven. Either way, wish me luck and give me any kind of advice you can think of. Commenters are always the smartest lol Btw, I am doing my first adjudication at the end of this month. I’m gonna play Chopin’s first Etude
One detail missing from this is that the judges, & for the most part, the top pianists capable of making it to the finals, already assume all of this and competition performance involves a subtle conversation between the pianists and judges on all the issues involved. To be good enough to win (meaning being one of the top 5 or ten pianists in the entire world under 30 years old), you have to have mastered the instrument and core repertoire to such a degree that you can pull off any reasonable interpretation of the piece (Russian romantic-virtuosic; Germanic dreamy-romantic or Germanic intellectual-austere, or American international synthesis/academic, or British aristocratic-intellectual (Leeds)) or combination at will. The competition tests a kind of professional competence that seeks to transcend arbitrary eccentricity and limits individuality to the strictly non-arbitrary, non-self-indulgent, non-trivial, non-vulgar showmanship, all of which would exclude Horowitz by the way, who certainly had great musical strengths and talents, but was too much of a self-indulgent showman to be seriously admired by fellow pianists of the top rank. (It is an interesting question what Chopin would have thought of Horowitz; I suspect not much: Chopin had a more aristocratic sensibility that disdained any kind of heart-on-sleeve meretricious display-- and even in his most "romantic" vein, was deeply intellectual and restrained, with a Bachian kind of austerity and sober emphasis on form, structure, certain balances, and the most refined nuances of expression, including surpassingly subtle gestures of wit, pathos, irony, and ethical assertion; every composer puts an *entire* worldview in their music after all). So what I think really takes place in these competitions, ignored by this video, is the communication going on between pianists and judges presupposing all of the assertions presented in this video, with the pianist showing his or her grasp of every issue at stake, and ability to convey every aspect of this at the keyboard. That is what separates a modern virtuoso from a merely highly accomplished amateur. Only when this professionalism (which many consider boring or bland, but is the heart of true pianistic excellence) is established is there room for the pianist to say: "beyond that, here are my own unique personal insights." What this video also misses is acknowledgement of raw intellectual talent and genius. It assumes the ordinary piano striver grinding out, by 7-10 hrs practice a day, the ability to play 4 hours of programs from memory and a couple of concertos is the type of musician these competitions focus on or reward. Not true at all. They may enter, but they are the sideshow. The ones who win have 'mastered' (relatively speaking: at least thoroughly knowing the notes and the purely physical demands of execution) most of the relevant repertoire years before deploying it in competition. (That doesn't mean they don't sometimes learn a sonata or two for the competition, but that they already have such a "professional" grasp that learning the new material is comparable to a surgeon's doing a slightly different surgery: the result comes from the vast underlying skill and expertise, based on raw talent combined with years of training). In other words, just like there are skilled amateurs who may enter the U.S. open or run the NY marathon, there is a fundamental difference between them and the Serena Williams or Kenyan runner who will actually win.These are hard workers (make no mistake) but their hard work only builds on underlying innate abilities only a few in the world are born with. ****In piano terms, they are the ones you see on UA-cam tossing off a Mozart sonata (or rather several such sonatas, and for extra cuteness, perhaps "Flight of the Bumble Bee" or "Fantasy Impromptu") at 6 or 7 years old.***** They are not good amateur pianists reaching such heights as older kids or teens, like the ones who wind up majoring in piano in college. The potential concert pianist has achieved "college level" (a few hours' progams from memory, a concerto or 2) playing already as a young child (look up Kissin or Yuja Wang for example), and by college age have so mastered the instrument they use their college years for broader intellectual development, rarely majoring in music, almost invariably at an Ivy league school or equivalent (Tiffany Poon and her Julliard teacher Emanuel Ax both Columbia grads, for example, majoring in philosophy and French, respectively; many great pianists major in physics or math for example-- very few in music, because they have professional musical ability/knowkedge years before college). There are exceptions: Peter Donahoe was a brilliant non-pianist (in the prodigy sense) with basic piano foundations entering adulthood, but was a highly skilled rock musician and general intellectual who using his natural and cultivated intelligence transferred his rock musician skills and knowledge into classical endeavor, pulling it off pretty seamlessly, won the Tchaikovsky competition (as a balding man just at the cut-off age, about 32) though being a "late bloomer" in classical music. He could do it only because he was a genius. In other words, the ones who win these competitions do so because of 3 things of equal importance: extremely, extremely rare innate intellectual and physical talent, years or hard work, and a unique personality and temperament capable of combining the first two elements into a package capable of convincing similarly talented competition jurists they are among the top 2 or 3 or 5 pianists in the world of competition elegibility age. They do this by subtly communicating, purely through their hands, everything I summarized in my first paragraph. CRITICAL: All that said, there is such a thing as the late bloomer who reaches competition-level playing in college, and *catches up* to the level achieved by prodigies (the "1000 hours of practice principle," which is probably true, if underlying innate requirements are there). The cut-off age is around 30, so there is plenty of time for late bloomers to catch up. But the point is, even those "late bloomers" must reach the same level the prodigies have attained, so what they present at the competition is only a small sliver of their actual abilities and repertoire. If you can barely master the repertoire to enter and get through the rounds, you have no chance of winning; at most you get the ability to claim you were there. Potential concert pianists though do not have to strain or stretch themselves just to learn and get through the repertoire. A basically solid grasp of the material is already presupposed, and the preparation is extreme polishing of what they can do competently with relatively little trouble. Those are the top 3 or 4 or 5 pianists in the world.
For me, it was the contest winners back in the early 60's. I had heard William Kapell in a recording of Rachmaninov's 2nd concerto. I didn't know at the time that he had won the Naumberg Competition. Only that there was something unique about his sound. and technique. Later, I heard of and bought recordings by John Browning who had won the Leventritt contest although I believe He'd won at least one other Award. Then, it was Malcom Frager's first prize in Brussels and that monstrous Prokofief concerto in G minor. Then, of course it was John Ogdon along with Vladimir Askenazy both taking first prize, in Moscow?? was it? I knew these cats could rip, but didn't know how much involved was at the time. I soon learned after watching broadcast of the Van Cliburn competition more than once. Many artist win and, even though they nail a contract and career seem to fall out of the public eye. Andre Michel Schub won the Cliburn competition, made some recordings and appearances and seemed to disappear. He was a ferocious virtuoso like Andre Watts ( who, by the way apparently didn't need to win any test of this order ). His career was literally launched by Leonard Bernstein. I have heard Serkin, Gulda and Rubinstein and Gould play Mozart. ( yeah, Rubinstein ). But, the most criystalline performance in a Mozart concerto for me, was by Andre Michel Schub.
Connecting with an audience, not judges is the key. Check out my original pieces ( such as Prelude # 8 Heart of Sorrow) if you like. See if they connect!
Music can be SUBJECTIVE. I remember seeing on UA-cam, a video involving a Julliard Master Class where a student, Mackenzie Melemid, was being instructed by Robert Levin. At 25:00 minutes until 28:00 minutes in the video, the teacher talks about how interpreting the Bach piece being played a certain way involving ornamentation might offend the judges. I have a problem with that because who’s to say that one interpretation is better than another? Watching the video further, in my opinion, confirms the accusations being made that those competitions have judges who have students that enter them and win because their teacher is the judge. Mr. Levine playfully drops a hint that he’s a judge in one of the Bach competitions and tells his student, Mackenzie, what to do as far as ornamentation is concerned IF he enters it. Levine even stated that he said all of this to Mackenzie in his private lessons with Levine as well. Mr. Levine uses humor there, which might lead people to believe that he’s just joking, but there’s nothing to be interpreted a a joke when you’re telling your student that judges might sabotage your score just because of your interpretation. What Levine said should be taken literally. Composers do have dynamics and expression terms (pianissimo, forte, etc…) in their music. However, they leave no markings in certain passages which leaves that part of the music, in my opinion, up to the interpreter. It’s hard enough to accept losing when you’ve been factually beaten in competition. It’s another thing when you lose all because of something subjective. You do have to put in the work (3-4 hours a day) to make something of yourself. However, I have a serious problem with someone telling me to put in the work only to enter a competition and lose because of something subjective.
a sobering fact: we all know the names of the great pianists from the last 100 years. some people can name twenty of them, some less than ten, some none. there are 7 billion people on the planet. becoming one of the greats requires a very, very unique ability. and some luck. All the rest of he really great pianists might play in orchestras, or teach at universities, or in high schools, or even teach your child. a very humbling outcome for most all
Piano competitions and Barbershop Quartet competitions. Standards can't be faked. Your point was well taken about how winners win because they have styles that don't offend.
Competitions are an excellent way to start a career, but to make them and only them the purpose of your life with nothing else is the wrong approach in my view. We are in an age where there are many venues, online and in real life, with which one can perform. Take as many options as possible, and enjoy the music
Would you rather be a truly great pianist who doesn't get the career you want or rather be an average pianist like me who simply loves to play the piano every day and gets great enjoyment and fulfillment from it?
Competing at music sounds like an unhappy life, if one must stifle one's inner voice to do well. Isn't that the exact opposite of what great musicians are supposed to do?
What an informative video. Seems like competitions are an entirely different beast and class of piano playing. I'm guessing it's like the difference between being a youtube star at something and a college level professional. The college level professional could trounce the much more popular and recognized youtube star with superior talent. The only time you get into trouble is when you think one equals the other I guess. Having amazing talent, and being able to market and showcase the talent you have are two different things. It's really a treat when you see an amazing talent with the skills to effectively communicate how amazing they are to a wide audience.
Ivo Pogorelich didn't make it to the finals?!?! WHAT?! I've never heard another pianist whose playing was so precise in timing and evenness and yet so nuanced and expressive.
Let me tell you about what happened to me at the spotlight in 1989.. a lot of competitions are corrupt and determined based on timing.. I was literally told by the adjudicators- you were the clear winner- but we had to give it to this girl cause her scholarship to Eastman depends on it.. come back next year - and it’s yours.. I had never lost a major one up until that point (except for the Bach festivals). Seriously- so wrong.
Horowitz was the last true artist in piano playing. Classical piano died when the archetype of the ideal pianist shifted from the Horowitz type to the Pollini type.
Here's my story, I entered a piano competition when I was younger and it completely put me of for life. There were two of us in the competition who played Eric Satie's Gymnopedie No.1. I feel that I did a really good job with playing the piece, I tried to capture that misty, magical, and nostalgia tinged nature of the piece and I feel I did that successfully. Alongside the expressive dimension of the piece I also managed to play through the piece without any technical errors. The other person played the piece much too fast in my opinion. She rushed through it and was plonking a way at the piano to the with no use of pedal or legato whatsoever. All the beautiful nuance and mystique of the piece was lost. She played it so dry and staccato, ignoring many of Satie's directions, that it almost sounded like a parody of a gaudy Chopin waltz. Aside from this she made multiple technical errors and completely stop/started about twice in the piece. Yet somehow, out of all that, the judges decided that her performance superior to mine. Both me and my piano teacher agreed that it was completely unfair and I had the given the better performance and we could not understand why it went to the other person. My piano teacher was a highly respected teacher in the area and was in much demand. He was direct and bluntly honest if he felt your playing wasn't up to scratch, so based on this, and the performances given, we knew the judging hadn't been fair and impartial. Due to that I never entered another piano competition as it gave me the impression it was rigged from the start.
I'm sorry to hear that. I have the same question for 3 of my favorite pianists in the last Chopin competition. I don't know how did they drop out. I just know that they are much better than the others
Thank you for sharing your experience with piano competitions. Do you mind if we get in touch? I'm writing a screenplay about a contestant in a piano competition and would appreciate hearing more about your experience and thoughts.
Great example is Lucas Debargue who did not win the Tchaikovsky competition because he played so differently. But the audience recognised him and the world now recognises him whereas you would be hard pressed to remember who won the competition that year.
I feel horrible for Ivo’s predicament. Genius pianist with a unique voice denied his rise to stardom in the Chopin competition. Though this actually catalyzed his road to fame. It’s unfortunate that he was never the same after the death of his beloved spouse.. 😢
His pianism continued to evolve and deepen (in the positive musical sense) after his spouse passed away. Hardly a predicament considering that there are music connoisseurs who consider him amongst the handful of current greatest living pianists.
It's kind of insane when you consider the amount of dedication it takes to even give yourself a CHANCE of becoming a top pianist, and for it to have very little value in society. Sure, there are performers who command a nice fee, but there are extremely talented pianists who are anything but financially comfortable. Geez.
Ivo Pogorelić didn't make through 3rd stage, because he was making too many mistakes. It would set a bad example, that you can get away with mistakes when you are flashy. Real controversy was when Yulianna Avdeeva won 1st prize over Ingolf Wunder in 2010.
I think Daniil Trifonov was in many competitions and has gone on to be a highly acclaimed pianist. I think it must be really tough on the competitors. There are so many of them now. What I like about listening to them is hearing different young pianists interpret the Classical repertoire. Also, I like that they choose from the concert grands usually from Steinway, Fazioli, Yamaha and Shigeru Kawai, and occasionally even a less known line like the straight-strung concert grands from Chris Maene. Overall, I've learned of some wonderful concert pianists from competitions and I've attended their concerts when they performed in my area.
the truth about major competitions is that they are rigged. the teacher is usually on the panel or is a powerful person who can already influence the decision. behind the scenes, major competitions are very dirty. a sad fact.
The Truth about Piano Competition: when you walk in and see a bunch of Asian and Russian, you gonna talk to yourself: well... I'm not gonna try to embarrassing myself. I just gonna go home and call it is the day.
Damn this seems like it totally ruins the expressions of the player. Especially since music depends on the listener and the only deciders are the judges.
Piano competitions in my country is only trying to "wow" the judges, better yet is to manipulate them. I played a very emotional song at a piano competition it was fairly difficult hut doable, others who performed before me played casual pop songs, or something to raise their spirits. I played a sad but happy song that struck the judges feelings. I even made one cry over it. I won first prize. I was justt surprised, I am happy to have first prize but I was surprised how I was compared to the other pianist. The judges said that the piece I played (Which was Undertale OST: 071) was surprisingly powerful.
Hi, great video! However you forgot to mention the most important fact about competitions: prize winners are students of the members of the jury, members of the jury are a clan of people that are connected through masterclasses, summer schools and other competitions. In other words - I invite you to my competitions so you give my student a prize and then you do the same for me. In reality if you don't have people in the jury that already know in advance that they're going to vote for you, you can forget it. They won't even listen to you seriously. The prize winners of major competitions are known in advance, great individualistic artists who aren't directly connected to the jury get kicked out in the first round as to avoid a scandal in the finals. I have made forensic studies of some competitions, in other words have studies members of the jury and their backgrounds, competitors and their connections. It's as clear as a bright blue sky. In reality there is no competition.
Yes. In a competition I did my teacher said that one of her students didn’t make it to the next round, but after paying a nice sum of money she continued on. Big competitions are very sketchy. The competitors are incredible but there’s a lot that goes on behind the scenes too. A lot of life is about luck
Piano competitions are a joke. Note to any good pianist: 1. Study with a teacher you trust and also has experience and do not keep this to one teacher. 2. Move to a city that has a thriving arts community 3. Make music with anyone and everyone that has your passion and learn from one another. 4. Practice your ass off and enjoy the process 5. Keep in mind that there are a handful of pianists that actually make a full time living touring....have a back up plan.....teaching, church work, being an accompanist etc 6. Remember music is "food for the soul" and how can I fit in?
Piano Competitions are rubbish. Music is not a competition between musicians to see who is the best. Watch the smile on the faces of jazz pianists,who play for pleasure and the grim faced scowls of classical pianists,terrified of playing a wrong note.
Interesting??? Not really. A woman (Martha) gets emotional and storms out. Dang Thai Son (also 22 yrs old at the time) was actually better! Someone's uploaded it. See & listen for yourself!
The problem with so-called 'individualistic' performers is that their expressive gestures seem mannered and self-conscious-- being 'different' for its own sake. On the other hand, the 'correct' performers simply do 'what they were taught'. Artists should strive be to be authentic, instead of putting on this insincere, calculated persona they don't possess.
I'm a guitarist who only dabbles in keyboards but has a friend who is classically trained. The whole "competition" thing seems so damn arbitrary and it's basically a pissing match. You're literally judging COVERS of songs that nobody born in the past two centuries has ever heard the original performance by the original artist (composer) -only what's written on a piece of paper, which is a rough guide at best - usually with generic tempo directions like "allegro" and all sorts of other ambiguities. How many BPMs is "allegro"? And is playing in A440 the correct concert pitch? (it's going to be nearly a half step sharper than classical era stuff). Not to mention that PIANOS didn't become commonplace until the ROMANTIC period. So we're already starting 0/3 for everyone involved. Just imagine a "rock cover band" competition where people only have the tab/notation books to go by, and how nobody would sound a thing like the original - zero chance, it would be ridiculous... In the end, it all sounds like a recipe for some severe mental issues if you're so inclined to make competitions a priority in your life... Practicing all day every day is a great way to start hating something you love. Music should be taken seriously, but it should also be FUN.
A shorter version of my previous comment: Put Bach, Mozart, Beethoven, any of the greats in a modern classical piano competition. I'd say that as long as another performer is hitting all the right notes (and sounding similar to a recording made in the last half century), there's a very good chance the original composers would NOT win at performing their own songs. This is the definition of insanity, no?
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Winning a Piano Competition is not important.
Winning the hearts of your audience with your playing is.
Thanks for making me feel better with this meaningful comment
Totally agree with you but the sad reality is many good pianists can't get enough chance to have "audience" unless they win the competition..
Will it reach her?
“Competitions are for horses, not artists”
-Béla Bartók
Yes.
Said no first prize winner ever
I've seen this name, Bela Bartok, on a small random French street name years ago. Never knew who this person was till now :)
True, but tell that to Beethoven and Mozart!
@@PeaceNinja007 Listen to his Concerto for Orchestra.
Just practice 40 hours a day.
juliangst or just pretend to play 15 notes a second and become a sacrilegious boi on tv
I prefer only doing 12 hours, but I play for 180 minutes during each of those hours.
Thats sacreligous
Aren't we all Ling Ling-wannabes truly?
Ling Ling!!
A friend of mine, fantastic pianist, graduate of Manhattan School of Music spend two years of his life going from competition to competition. He spend a lot of money: entrance fees, flight tickets, hotels... His best result? In two competitions he passed to the second stage.
What’s his name? Would love to hear him and help pinpoint perhaps why
Hi Ferruccio, thank you for sharing. I am writing a screenplay about piano competitions and wondering if you would be so kind as to put me in touch with your friend.
"A performance is not a contest, but a love affair"
Glenn Gould
I suspect competition results would be quite different if the judges did not know the identity of the pianist, and could not see him/her. Just seeing a competitor approach the piano might suffice to color a judge's opinion! Does she stride to the piano confidently, or does he sort of slouch, as if unsure of h imself? Such impressions can carry weight, even if denied or unacknowledged.
Paul Hein
Judging a pianist by name is just dumb but there is definitely something to be said about the performers actions beyond pressing notes. Think of rockstars getting into the music and moving vs just standing perfectly still. It certainly adds more to the performance when a pianist looks into the music (when it’s authentic and not just for show which frankly looks stupid).
A similar reason the Voice singing competition was devised for TV. The judges face away from the stage and only hear the vocalist.
I think competitions would be much more interesting if they didn't reveal who was playing.
Or "Is the person blind?" i.e. Van Cliburn winner.
@@Danofstockport Hope you know shows like the Voice are fabricated... The judges know exactly who is singing because that person had to audition. I know this because I know someone who made it to the televised part of the show. Can't say their name due to liability for them, but yeah... It's fake.
All i know is that mr ice sits on your piano and tells you to not miss a key
wow! and you've got to turn black keys to white keys
Or be Prince of Piano
Chopin etude is EASY
And chopin valse is too easy
You already know who I am: even better, be ling ling
Sir Henry Walford Davis said "Our object is not to gain a prize or defeat a rival, but rather to pace one another on the road to excellence". That was on the wall above my piano teacher's piano.
The fear to offend anybody has become a systemic problem of the modern world.
Brilliantissisissississimo! Gives us a more detailed explanation unlike others on UA-cam.👌👌
I was entered for a piano competition when I was 14 by my piano teacher. I am so glad I chickened out, it would have damaged my love for the instruments.
BTW, I am not bad, and not easily stage struck. I just wanna play what I want when I want to
Andy Wright I think you‘re actually bad
ItachiseinVater jerk
dude literally same
@@eternal.guidance_ well, that's an awful thing to say to someone you don't know.
@@eternal.guidance_ I would like to see you play.
Always a treat listening to your interesting piano stories! Thank you for sharing & wish you the best mr robert
I had the good fortune to attend the Van Cliburn competition in the early 1980's. Although the entire event was spellbinding, I enjoyed the preliminary rounds most of all. In the course of a couple of days, I heard perhaps a dozen different interpretations of several seminal pieces (including the Beethoven Appassionata, A Chopin Scherzo, etc.). I wish I had the time and opportunity to do it again.
Excellent presentation, as always!!! Thank you!
Very insightful. Thank you for taking the time to speak about this.
Thank you. Have wondered about the piano compitions. Began in music and played juries in college but changed to art for a BFÀ. Did very well in art compition... Never really thought much about it. Just entered what was at hand. Now as a retired person I very thankful for UA-cam and your classes there which let me grow in music and piano again. Thank you!
Robert you always have interesting videos and lots of nice pianos to play on. I like hearing the inside scoop/behind the scenes too. Thank you.
Great video as always, Robert. I followed the 2015 Chopin competition and noticed that the eventual winner Seung Jin Cho received top scores from most of the judges but also received the lowest possible score from another judge. It seems that even among the very best of the best, there is considerable disagreement as to who is most deserving of the top prize.
Cho one because he’s one of the only competitors who knew how to play legato and make the melodies sing... that’s very telling about these competitions
The only reason there was "disagreement" is that Entremont had problems with Cho's teacher, Michel Beroff.
Always insightful .. thank you Robert Estrin!
Very informative! I didn't know they were like this! Thanks
thanks for sharing the insight!
Very interesting. I think piano competitions are so important to keeping classical piano music alive. I love to follow them, and hear the up and coming youngsters. Interestingly, Lang Lang and Yuja Wang - two of the most successful artists today, did not do a lot of competitions.
Thx for your great videos!
Very interesting video. I've heard the story of Argerich becoming furious during that competition before, but I didn't know it had such an impact on Pogorelich's career.
Nobody knows who was the winner of that competition - but everyone knows Pogorelich :-)
It turns out that Argerich was wrong. Pogorelich does not have a major career.
Love what you said about individualism and taking liberties with expression to create a much more heartfelt expression that resonates with a player's inner being. I feel sorry for those music college students who's enrollment are decided on a jury.......some may be thrown out of college for different expression to what the jury likes.........Hope you are doing well
Hey Robert.
I've noticed that Beethoven sometimes uses a I diminished chord (fx E dim, in E major) shortly before the ending of a section, where he afterwards goes and plays the I chord, then the V (or IV to V) and back to I.
So something like: I - I dim - I - V - I.
Or: I - I dim - I - IV - V - I.
I know that the purpose is probably to create some tension and then resolve it, but are there other theoretical uses for it?
I don't know why, but it sounds amazing. I'm trying to use it when I compose, but it's kind of tricky. Maybe you have some tips?
Love your videos btw.
This channel has so many interesting subjects!
Could you make a video on “cheating” (avoiding certain notes or modifying them slightly to make it easier without being noticeable) know even the top pianists do it and I put it in quotations because it’s seen as negative but I’m kinda on the fence about it. Vocalists will often change the key from the original to a lower or more comfortable key during a live performance to give themselves the best chance of success. Of course the nature of classical music is slightly different, and I’m sure it’s not as acceptable in, say, opera! ( Sometimes it’s even unintentional-this happens a lot with chasse beige by Liszt because there so much tremolo that it creates a “white noise “ , and I will often find myself unintentionally avoiding a chord that is awkward or hard and playing a single note instead , for example) would love to hear your thoughts!
I think if a piece of music is written such that changing a note doesn't make a difference to the best ears of a generation, then the fault is probably on the composer (who was probably just trying to show off).
I also cheated on my recital when I played Czardas by V. Monti. I coudn’t reach one of the keys in my left hand so I played it with a key that I can reach. 😂😂😂
@@sunnyat2346 why is that cheating? Why should performance be dominated by large handed pianists, favoring size over expressiveness?
Fascinating! Thank you!
I used to play in regional and state flute and piano competitions when I was in junior and high school, that was my experience with competitions. I had no idea that there were big, national and international competitions but I was just a girl growing up in the wheat fields of Kansas in the 1980‘s, I was lucky to have a good piano/flute teacher who instilled a love of classical music in me.
My daughters both took ballet and my oldest daughter experienced some of the ballet competitions and summer intensive auditions. I haven’t decided if they were a good or bad experience, I think that the competitions were probably a waste of time and money but she was able to go to the Kirov Academy in Washington DC and the Chicago Ballet for summer intensives, so I think that she had a good experience with them. She didn’t stick with ballet after graduating from high school unfortunately...
I go to a piano festival in the summer and the concerto winner gets to play with the local symphony. It's unbelievable how scant the audiences are, even when all the recitals are free. A first class recital hall might have 10 people in the audience. The participants don't even go to hear each other play. Last summer, a visiting artist who gave a recital and did master classes lambasted them for the way they practiced and how all they cared about was their next competition. The festival had gone on for years before I even knew about it. It's a great opportunity to hear some of the best talent from all over the world, age 12 to 30. They are unbelievable. The whole world is missing out. People just don't care about spending their spare time listening to classical piano recitals, no matter how good the player is. That includes people who you might think would be most interested, like local pianists, students, and piano teachers. A festival competitor would sooner be in a practice room practicing than to hear the others perform. You have to buy a ticket to hear the concerto winner do their concert with the symphony, but that audience is still scant. Most of the city doesn't even know it's going on. You can hear the finalists play with the symphony for free as they prepare for the finals. The finalists likely have the Van Cliburn in their sights. As one young adolescent girl told me with regard to practicing...."It's all I ever do." She has no other life.
To be fair, there is a valid reason for not wanting to hear other competitors play _before_ you play. When competing at a high level, pretty much everybody else is going to sound very good. So by hearing other people, you will just be making yourself more nervous. But after the competition is over, competitors should listen to recordings of the other players, especially ones who placed better.
Yet everyone will watch AMG or BGT and be astounded by what they think are the greatest pianists alive today, yet they're about grade 5 on piano, everyone is interested in that! It's a great shame the way today's world works. Our TVs are saturated with these so called talent shows and singing shows, nothing that is of a high quality is shown because its too difficult for most people to appreciate. No one is interested in a 40 minute Brahms piano concerto when they can watch 30 seconds of Claire de lune blended/massacred with an Ed sheeran song.
THANK YOU SIR ROBERT FOR SHARING YOUR MEANINGFUL THOUGHTS WITH US. MUCH APPRECIATED🎈❤️🍀🎶🎹❤️🎈
Hello Robert, What are your thoughts on the visual side of the performer? for example some competitors are like Lang Lang they tends to be showy and extravagant and some like Olga Kern very transparent in inner emotions and yet other pianists are very reserve in their posture and demeanor. Do you think judges are swayed by these outward visual expressions at piano competitions?
Some competitive people like piano competitions.
Most of the *pianists find them frustrating,* because one has to prepare a lot, then perform under stress, then feel being judged for the thing that we like most in life.
The best pianist do not enter piano competitions, because they do not feel good to play under the setting of stress and judgement. If there was a well paid improv competition, then maybe the best would enter for fun. The classical piano competitions are stressful.
As an accomplished organist, I certainly would say the same thing of organists having to fit into certain stylistic interpretations. I am often rather dismayed how anyone who dares interpret the music of J.S. Bach, for example, with their own fresh individuality is immediately attacked as a hack for daring to challenge the prescribed narrative. Now, to be sure, there are historically informed interpretations and organ registrations which should be acknowledged and held in highest esteem; however, we are still artists as musicians, and simply regurgitating established performance practice without any consideration for ones own creativity seems a bit empty to me.
I really love your videos. Great insight, thanks.
Thanks Robert. This video is very interesting;
Winning prestigious piano competition will guarantee a great career
Winning the best world accordion competition will not guarantee great career
Good. Excited to have one
The force is strong in this pianist...I can sense it!
The thing with me is that I don't care if I win or lose....I just wanna play the piano for people who will listen
Great video!
I used to take my piano students to regional youth competitions just as observers. I never agreed with the idea that "this is what all the 12-year-olds are playing," or a particular required piece was expected of eight-year-old students. My older students accompanied me to the quarter or semi-finals of the Van Cliburn in Ft Worth the years it was held. Very enjoyable listening and helped to round out their music education.
Totally agree on Horowitz. Even in his old age, the last romantic was superb
I’m 15 gonna be 16 in February. I’m gonna be entering the concerto competition for piano in my city this year, which happens in October. It looks like (and I’m only just about to get started) I’m gonna be trying Beethoven’s Emperor Concerto. But I might try settling with something a little easier like Mozart’s K 488. My teacher also really likes the idea of me trying Grieg. I don’t know. Probably gonna be Beethoven. Either way, wish me luck and give me any kind of advice you can think of. Commenters are always the smartest lol
Btw, I am doing my first adjudication at the end of this month. I’m gonna play Chopin’s first Etude
I was a bit anxious about this video because of the title. But I'm very happy about it after watching it.
I know what you mean. Usually, videos entitled "THE TRUTH ABOUT X" turn out to be peddling conspiracy theory nonsense. Like Stefan Molyneux's crap.
thanks, interesting video.
One detail missing from this is that the judges, & for the most part, the top pianists capable of making it to the finals, already assume all of this and competition performance involves a subtle conversation between the pianists and judges on all the issues involved. To be good enough to win (meaning being one of the top 5 or ten pianists in the entire world under 30 years old), you have to have mastered the instrument and core repertoire to such a degree that you can pull off any reasonable interpretation of the piece (Russian romantic-virtuosic; Germanic dreamy-romantic or Germanic intellectual-austere, or American international synthesis/academic, or British aristocratic-intellectual (Leeds)) or combination at will. The competition tests a kind of professional competence that seeks to transcend arbitrary eccentricity and limits individuality to the strictly non-arbitrary, non-self-indulgent, non-trivial, non-vulgar showmanship, all of which would exclude Horowitz by the way, who certainly had great musical strengths and talents, but was too much of a self-indulgent showman to be seriously admired by fellow pianists of the top rank. (It is an interesting question what Chopin would have thought of Horowitz; I suspect not much: Chopin had a more aristocratic sensibility that disdained any kind of heart-on-sleeve meretricious display-- and even in his most "romantic" vein, was deeply intellectual and restrained, with a Bachian kind of austerity and sober emphasis on form, structure, certain balances, and the most refined nuances of expression, including surpassingly subtle gestures of wit, pathos, irony, and ethical assertion; every composer puts an *entire* worldview in their music after all).
So what I think really takes place in these competitions, ignored by this video, is the communication going on between pianists and judges presupposing all of the assertions presented in this video, with the pianist showing his or her grasp of every issue at stake, and ability to convey every aspect of this at the keyboard. That is what separates a modern virtuoso from a merely highly accomplished amateur. Only when this professionalism (which many consider boring or bland, but is the heart of true pianistic excellence) is established is there room for the pianist to say: "beyond that, here are my own unique personal insights."
What this video also misses is acknowledgement of raw intellectual talent and genius. It assumes the ordinary piano striver grinding out, by 7-10 hrs practice a day, the ability to play 4 hours of programs from memory and a couple of concertos is the type of musician these competitions focus on or reward. Not true at all. They may enter, but they are the sideshow. The ones who win have 'mastered' (relatively speaking: at least thoroughly knowing the notes and the purely physical demands of execution) most of the relevant repertoire years before deploying it in competition. (That doesn't mean they don't sometimes learn a sonata or two for the competition, but that they already have such a "professional" grasp that learning the new material is comparable to a surgeon's doing a slightly different surgery: the result comes from the vast underlying skill and expertise, based on raw talent combined with years of training).
In other words, just like there are skilled amateurs who may enter the U.S. open or run the NY marathon, there is a fundamental difference between them and the Serena Williams or Kenyan runner who will actually win.These are hard workers (make no mistake) but their hard work only builds on underlying innate abilities only a few in the world are born with. ****In piano terms, they are the ones you see on UA-cam tossing off a Mozart sonata (or rather several such sonatas, and for extra cuteness, perhaps "Flight of the Bumble Bee" or "Fantasy Impromptu") at 6 or 7 years old.***** They are not good amateur pianists reaching such heights as older kids or teens, like the ones who wind up majoring in piano in college.
The potential concert pianist has achieved "college level" (a few hours' progams from memory, a concerto or 2) playing already as a young child (look up Kissin or Yuja Wang for example), and by college age have so mastered the instrument they use their college years for broader intellectual development, rarely majoring in music, almost invariably at an Ivy league school or equivalent (Tiffany Poon and her Julliard teacher Emanuel Ax both Columbia grads, for example, majoring in philosophy and French, respectively; many great pianists major in physics or math for example-- very few in music, because they have professional musical ability/knowkedge years before college).
There are exceptions: Peter Donahoe was a brilliant non-pianist (in the prodigy sense) with basic piano foundations entering adulthood, but was a highly skilled rock musician and general intellectual who using his natural and cultivated intelligence transferred his rock musician skills and knowledge into classical endeavor, pulling it off pretty seamlessly, won the Tchaikovsky competition (as a balding man just at the cut-off age, about 32) though being a "late bloomer" in classical music. He could do it only because he was a genius.
In other words, the ones who win these competitions do so because of 3 things of equal importance: extremely, extremely rare innate intellectual and physical talent, years or hard work, and a unique personality and temperament capable of combining the first two elements into a package capable of convincing similarly talented competition jurists they are among the top 2 or 3 or 5 pianists in the world of competition elegibility age. They do this by subtly communicating, purely through their hands, everything I summarized in my first paragraph.
CRITICAL: All that said, there is such a thing as the late bloomer who reaches competition-level playing in college, and *catches up* to the level achieved by prodigies (the "1000 hours of practice principle," which is probably true, if underlying innate requirements are there). The cut-off age is around 30, so there is plenty of time for late bloomers to catch up. But the point is, even those "late bloomers" must reach the same level the prodigies have attained, so what they present at the competition is only a small sliver of their actual abilities and repertoire. If you can barely master the repertoire to enter and get through the rounds, you have no chance of winning; at most you get the ability to claim you were there. Potential concert pianists though do not have to strain or stretch themselves just to learn and get through the repertoire. A basically solid grasp of the material is already presupposed, and the preparation is extreme polishing of what they can do competently with relatively little trouble. Those are the top 3 or 4 or 5 pianists in the world.
Well done!
For me, it was the contest winners back in the early 60's. I had heard William Kapell in a recording of Rachmaninov's 2nd concerto. I didn't know at the time that he had won the Naumberg Competition. Only that there was something unique about his sound. and technique. Later, I heard of and bought recordings by John Browning who had won the Leventritt contest although I believe He'd won at least one other Award. Then, it was Malcom Frager's first prize in Brussels and that monstrous Prokofief concerto in G minor. Then, of course it was John Ogdon along with Vladimir Askenazy both taking first prize, in Moscow?? was it? I knew these cats could rip, but didn't know how much involved was at the time. I soon learned after watching broadcast of the Van Cliburn competition more than once. Many artist win and, even though they nail a contract and career seem to fall out of the public eye. Andre Michel Schub won the Cliburn competition, made some recordings and appearances and seemed to disappear. He was a ferocious virtuoso like Andre Watts ( who, by the way apparently didn't need to win any test of this order ). His career was literally launched by Leonard Bernstein. I have heard Serkin, Gulda and Rubinstein and Gould play Mozart. ( yeah, Rubinstein ). But, the most criystalline performance in a Mozart concerto for me, was by Andre Michel Schub.
Thank you for sharing! I always wondering about the piano competitions.
Connecting with an audience, not judges is the key. Check out my original pieces ( such as Prelude # 8 Heart of Sorrow) if you like. See if they connect!
Music can be SUBJECTIVE. I remember seeing on UA-cam, a video involving a Julliard Master Class where a student, Mackenzie Melemid, was being instructed by Robert Levin. At 25:00 minutes until 28:00 minutes in the video, the teacher talks about how interpreting the Bach piece being played a certain way involving ornamentation might offend the judges. I have a problem with that because who’s to say that one interpretation is better than another? Watching the video further, in my opinion, confirms the accusations being made that those competitions have judges who have students that enter them and win because their teacher is the judge. Mr. Levine playfully drops a hint that he’s a judge in one of the Bach competitions and tells his student, Mackenzie, what to do as far as ornamentation is concerned IF he enters it. Levine even stated that he said all of this to Mackenzie in his private lessons with Levine as well. Mr. Levine uses humor there, which might lead people to believe that he’s just joking, but there’s nothing to be interpreted a a joke when you’re telling your student that judges might sabotage your score just because of your interpretation. What Levine said should be taken literally. Composers do have dynamics and expression terms (pianissimo, forte, etc…) in their music. However, they leave no markings in certain passages which leaves that part of the music, in my opinion, up to the interpreter. It’s hard enough to accept losing when you’ve been factually beaten in competition. It’s another thing when you lose all because of something subjective. You do have to put in the work (3-4 hours a day) to make something of yourself. However, I have a serious problem with someone telling me to put in the work only to enter a competition and lose because of something subjective.
Could the same be said of TOB?
I wonder how much this affects the emotion of the music
Playing mendlessohn violin concerto for a symphonic concerto competition. Wish me good luck! I hope I win!
a sobering fact: we all know the names of the great pianists from the last 100 years. some people can name twenty of them, some less than ten, some none. there are 7 billion people on the planet. becoming one of the greats requires a very, very unique ability. and some luck. All the rest of he really great pianists might play in orchestras, or teach at universities, or in high schools, or even teach your child. a very humbling outcome for most all
Piano competitions and Barbershop Quartet competitions. Standards can't be faked. Your point was well taken about how winners win because they have styles that don't offend.
Competitions are an excellent way to start a career, but to make them and only them the purpose of your life with nothing else is the wrong approach in my view. We are in an age where there are many venues, online and in real life, with which one can perform. Take as many options as possible, and enjoy the music
Would you rather be a truly great pianist who doesn't get the career you want or rather be an average pianist like me who simply loves to play the piano every day and gets great enjoyment and fulfillment from it?
Competing at music sounds like an unhappy life, if one must stifle one's inner voice to do well. Isn't that the exact opposite of what great musicians are supposed to do?
What an informative video. Seems like competitions are an entirely different beast and class of piano playing. I'm guessing it's like the difference between being a youtube star at something and a college level professional. The college level professional could trounce the much more popular and recognized youtube star with superior talent. The only time you get into trouble is when you think one equals the other I guess.
Having amazing talent, and being able to market and showcase the talent you have are two different things. It's really a treat when you see an amazing talent with the skills to effectively communicate how amazing they are to a wide audience.
Ivo Pogorelich didn't make it to the finals?!?! WHAT?! I've never heard another pianist whose playing was so precise in timing and evenness and yet so nuanced and expressive.
Let me tell you about what happened to me at the spotlight in 1989.. a lot of competitions are corrupt and determined based on timing.. I was literally told by the adjudicators- you were the clear winner- but we had to give it to this girl cause her scholarship to Eastman depends on it.. come back next year - and it’s yours.. I had never lost a major one up until that point (except for the Bach festivals). Seriously- so wrong.
Horowitz was the last true artist in piano playing. Classical piano died when the archetype of the ideal pianist shifted from the Horowitz type to the Pollini type.
Here's my story, I entered a piano competition when I was younger and it completely put me of for life. There were two of us in the competition who played Eric Satie's Gymnopedie No.1. I feel that I did a really good job with playing the piece, I tried to capture that misty, magical, and nostalgia tinged nature of the piece and I feel I did that successfully. Alongside the expressive dimension of the piece I also managed to play through the piece without any technical errors.
The other person played the piece much too fast in my opinion. She rushed through it and was plonking a way at the piano to the with no use of pedal or legato whatsoever. All the beautiful nuance and mystique of the piece was lost. She played it so dry and staccato, ignoring many of Satie's directions, that it almost sounded like a parody of a gaudy Chopin waltz. Aside from this she made multiple technical errors and completely stop/started about twice in the piece. Yet somehow, out of all that, the judges decided that her performance superior to mine.
Both me and my piano teacher agreed that it was completely unfair and I had the given the better performance and we could not understand why it went to the other person. My piano teacher was a highly respected teacher in the area and was in much demand. He was direct and bluntly honest if he felt your playing wasn't up to scratch, so based on this, and the performances given, we knew the judging hadn't been fair and impartial. Due to that I never entered another piano competition as it gave me the impression it was rigged from the start.
Thanks for your story. I sympathize and had a similar thing happen to me. Cheers
I'm sorry to hear that. I have the same question for 3 of my favorite pianists in the last Chopin competition. I don't know how did they drop out. I just know that they are much better than the others
THOSE F CORRUPT A-HOLES, SORRY FOR YOU MATE, WATCH SOME MK11 FATALITIES PRETENDING THE JUDGES ARE AMONGTHE VICTIMS MAKE U FEEL BETTER
Thank you for sharing your experience with piano competitions. Do you mind if we get in touch? I'm writing a screenplay about a contestant in a piano competition and would appreciate hearing more about your experience and thoughts.
Great example is Lucas Debargue who did not win the Tchaikovsky competition because he played so differently. But the audience recognised him and the world now recognises him whereas you would be hard pressed to remember who won the competition that year.
Aaaaaand suddenly piano becomes not so fun anymore. Thanks for the video as always,Robert!
I feel horrible for Ivo’s predicament. Genius pianist with a unique voice denied his rise to stardom in the Chopin competition. Though this actually catalyzed his road to fame. It’s unfortunate that he was never the same after the death of his beloved spouse.. 😢
His pianism continued to evolve and deepen (in the positive musical sense) after his spouse passed away. Hardly a predicament considering that there are music connoisseurs who consider him amongst the handful of current greatest living pianists.
It's kind of insane when you consider the amount of dedication it takes to even give yourself a CHANCE of becoming a top pianist, and for it to have very little value in society. Sure, there are performers who command a nice fee, but there are extremely talented pianists who are anything but financially comfortable. Geez.
Competitions are for athletes, not artists.
My experiences with competitions is more corruption than can a stick can be pointed at.
The only fair competition would be: everyone plays the same piece - and then the composer says, which version he liked most ^_^
Ivo Pogorelić didn't make through 3rd stage, because he was making too many mistakes. It would set a bad example, that you can get away with mistakes when you are flashy. Real controversy was when Yulianna Avdeeva won 1st prize over Ingolf Wunder in 2010.
I do not believe in exams for piano. Perhaps if one decides to make a career of piano. Think students should learn as many composer as possible.
ling ling be like, huh, too easy.
I think Daniil Trifonov was in many competitions and has gone on to be a highly acclaimed pianist. I think it must be really tough on the competitors. There are so many of them now. What I like about listening to them is hearing different young pianists interpret the Classical repertoire. Also, I like that they choose from the concert grands usually from Steinway, Fazioli, Yamaha and Shigeru Kawai, and occasionally even a less known line like the straight-strung concert grands from Chris Maene. Overall, I've learned of some wonderful concert pianists from competitions and I've attended their concerts when they performed in my area.
Excellence is nice, but life is just too short!
i ve never even heard of these people thats so sad
The rebels, the visionaries, the geniuses, they aren't really what the competitions are looking for.
The same goes for violin competitions just saying
the truth about major competitions is that they are rigged. the teacher is usually on the panel or is a powerful person who can already influence the decision. behind the scenes, major competitions are very dirty. a sad fact.
Illuminati confirmed! 🛆👁️🛆
Necessary Evil
Ok so you are just explaining every asian?
The Truth about Piano Competition: when you walk in and see a bunch of Asian and Russian, you gonna talk to yourself: well... I'm not gonna try to embarrassing myself. I just gonna go home and call it is the day.
Damn this seems like it totally ruins the expressions of the player. Especially since music depends on the listener and the only deciders are the judges.
Piano competitions in my country is only trying to "wow" the judges, better yet is to manipulate them. I played a very emotional song at a piano competition it was fairly difficult hut doable, others who performed before me played casual pop songs, or something to raise their spirits.
I played a sad but happy song that struck the judges feelings. I even made one cry over it.
I won first prize. I was justt surprised, I am happy to have first prize but I was surprised how I was compared to the other pianist.
The judges said that the piece I played (Which was Undertale OST: 071) was surprisingly powerful.
No you didn't shut up.
Hi, great video! However you forgot to mention the most important fact about competitions: prize winners are students of the members of the jury, members of the jury are a clan of people that are connected through masterclasses, summer schools and other competitions. In other words - I invite you to my competitions so you give my student a prize and then you do the same for me.
In reality if you don't have people in the jury that already know in advance that they're going to vote for you, you can forget it. They won't even listen to you seriously. The prize winners of major competitions are known in advance, great individualistic artists who aren't directly connected to the jury get kicked out in the first round as to avoid a scandal in the finals.
I have made forensic studies of some competitions, in other words have studies members of the jury and their backgrounds, competitors and their connections. It's as clear as a bright blue sky. In reality there is no competition.
Yes. In a competition I did my teacher said that one of her students didn’t make it to the next round, but after paying a nice sum of money she continued on. Big competitions are very sketchy. The competitors are incredible but there’s a lot that goes on behind the scenes too. A lot of life is about luck
Hello I am an example of the pianist that would win every competition. I know how to win
Piano competitions are a joke. Note to any good pianist:
1. Study with a teacher you trust and also has experience and do not keep this to one teacher.
2. Move to a city that has a thriving arts community
3. Make music with anyone and everyone that has your passion and learn from one another.
4. Practice your ass off and enjoy the process
5. Keep in mind that there are a handful of pianists that actually make a full time living touring....have a back up plan.....teaching, church work, being an accompanist etc
6. Remember music is "food for the soul" and how can I fit in?
Thanks!
wow
Its just as bad with singers.
Lilo Ruf not even close
First! Also great video!
Piano Competitions are rubbish. Music is not a competition between musicians to see who is the best. Watch the smile on the faces of jazz pianists,who play for pleasure and the grim faced scowls of classical pianists,terrified of playing a wrong note.
Interesting??? Not really. A woman (Martha) gets emotional and storms out.
Dang Thai Son (also 22 yrs old at the time) was actually better! Someone's uploaded it. See & listen for yourself!
I was so expecting Tiffany Poon.
Tiffany is first class. And she's winning big- with her audience. And that is what counts, at the end :-)
The problem with so-called 'individualistic' performers is that their expressive gestures seem mannered and self-conscious-- being 'different' for its own sake.
On the other hand, the 'correct' performers simply do 'what they were taught'.
Artists should strive be to be authentic, instead of putting on this insincere, calculated persona they don't possess.
I'm a guitarist who only dabbles in keyboards but has a friend who is classically trained. The whole "competition" thing seems so damn arbitrary and it's basically a pissing match. You're literally judging COVERS of songs that nobody born in the past two centuries has ever heard the original performance by the original artist (composer) -only what's written on a piece of paper, which is a rough guide at best - usually with generic tempo directions like "allegro" and all sorts of other ambiguities. How many BPMs is "allegro"? And is playing in A440 the correct concert pitch? (it's going to be nearly a half step sharper than classical era stuff). Not to mention that PIANOS didn't become commonplace until the ROMANTIC period. So we're already starting 0/3 for everyone involved. Just imagine a "rock cover band" competition where people only have the tab/notation books to go by, and how nobody would sound a thing like the original - zero chance, it would be ridiculous... In the end, it all sounds like a recipe for some severe mental issues if you're so inclined to make competitions a priority in your life... Practicing all day every day is a great way to start hating something you love. Music should be taken seriously, but it should also be FUN.
A shorter version of my previous comment: Put Bach, Mozart, Beethoven, any of the greats in a modern classical piano competition. I'd say that as long as another performer is hitting all the right notes (and sounding similar to a recording made in the last half century), there's a very good chance the original composers would NOT win at performing their own songs. This is the definition of insanity, no?
Only losers complain about competitions.