When my father bought our Homelite Super XL Automatic back in 1967 or 68 (the Blue one), the mixture requirement was 16:1 ratio. I have religiously continued that mix ratio and my saw still runs like a brand new one after 55 years of countless cords of wood cut. Back in the late sixties and early seventies, to me, that was Homelites "Golden Years". They made their best saw during that period of time.
You absolutely don't need to mix modern oils at 16:1. That was a specification then because oil quality was so much lower then. You'll be absolutely fine at 40:1 with most modern oils. I run Amsoil Saber at 50:1 in most saws, but I've run saws at 80:1 with it. No problems at all after a lot of use
@@AnarchAngel1 We do NOT know that. We are only listening to the oil manufacturers' claims, without ANY way to verify such claims. If your prized saw burns up, will the oil manufacturer compensate you? Of course not. We are operating purely on faith. Like stillwater62, my firewood saw is an early 1970s Homelite XL-12 and I would never, ever take a chance using 50:1 mixes. It's simply not worth the risk.
We have several Stihl and Husqvarna chainsaws of all sizes that get used hard year round on our farm. Most of them have modified mufflers and some port work. We use KLOTZ Synthetic oil and 91 octane non-ethanol gas. We mix 40:1 and run it in everything. It's a really good mix and nice balance of good lubrication and power. Plus - it smells great too!
Man did you kick a Hornet's nest or what. Brave soul. I use Honda HP2 at 40:1. I've used that on both my saws for nearly 4 years now, I got frustrated with Stihl's oil clogging up the system. I really appreciate your videos, you've helped me resurrect a few Homelite's. I posted on my local forum a while back that I wanted unloved or unused chainsaws so I could teach myself how to work on them and now I'm lost for space. You wouldn't believe how many saws came my way. For me, it's like working on puzzles, a little messier though.
Good points Leon! Thank you for your experience and the channel! From our personal experience at work (we operate a landscape company), we have tried many different types of 2-cycle oil at 50:1 ratio - no matter what type/brand of oil we run in our 2 cycle equipment, we always experience a loss of engine compression in roughly ONE full calendar year/365 days (equipment is used very heavily, in a harsh commercial environment, and is run hundreds of times each week, year round). However, at 40:1 ratio, our equipment lasts virtually indefinitely, for 10+ or more years before we upgrade (we made the change 10 years ago and nothing has lost compression since then, so we aren't sure how long 40:1 allows equipment to last). Equipment inevitably has other problems before failed cylinders (cracked frames, failed electrical systems) and/or is stolen, before wearing out at 40:1 in our company's personal experience. We haven't experienced carbon buildup or any fouled spark plugs either. Our thoughts are: Oil and plugs are cheap - equipment isn't. When we remove spark plugs, we have the usual light tan/beige color on the electrode which many mechanics have told us, is the proper indicator of a correct burn/mixture/jet setting. We have never tried the Amsoil synthetic oils or other boutique/high end oils simply due to mixing requirements. We need exactly (1) 6.4 oz 2-cycle premix oil container for our 2 gallon fuel canisters for precise consistency. I'm not sure if you can get that from Amsoil (or other brands) without having to carefully measure each time - asking crews to do this, in my experience, proves highly inconsistent and introduces variables (too much oil one time and too little in another time). Having the whole amount of oil in one container per fuel container, proves effortless with measurements. Also, I personally tune everything myself using the service manual engine specs (idle rpm, max rpm, etc...) using an engine tachometer. An engine tachometer is exact, precise, and effortless. I always make every single piece of equipment "4-stroke" at high rpm which means it's a little richer. Also, every piece of equipment has the spark arrestor removed prior, since it is a "weak link" in the reliability chain - where we work in California, it's 100% asphalt and concrete, and we haven't burned down any concrete where we work. Small equipment mechanics used to love our company - we would spend thousands each year in repairs. Simply changing our fuel canisters from 2.5 gallon to 2.0 gallon while using the same 6.4 oz of premix oil (Supertech) for air cooled engines was a game changer. We haven't been back to the mechanic for decades. It was an old timer that once yelled out to me "Good thing you aren't running 40:1, or you would never be back in here." I in turn walked back over to Jerry and asked: "I thought 50:1 was...." and he interrupted me: "Someone has to keep the EPA and CARB happy..." Since then, I did what this elderly mechanic recommended and I've never looked back. He actually advised AGAINST synthetic because in his words, it doesn't burn completely, so we just use the conventional Supertech universal 2 cycle oil for air cooled engines for $1.50 for 6.4 oz, that meets the most important JASO-FD oil spec. This simple change, made decades ago, has made our company extremely profitable to where we're completely maxing out our retirement accounts, my spouse's retirement account, and my children's as well - simply by changing from 50:1 to 40:1 premix ratio at our company which uses 2 cycle equipment hundreds of times each week at hundreds of commercial properties in the California Bay area. Your results may vary.
i wonder why all the scrap yards are full of chainsaws and weed eaters and i wonder why people are constantly having to replace top ends on dirt bikes ?? the EPA wants them scrapped out ... i have a small engine shop and every 2 stroke engine that comes in that was ran on 50:1 has stuck rings and no compression ,, with all due respect you have a great channel !!
@@skinnybigstuff1040 that is impossible according to the laws of physics. The rpm of a motor is based on him much fuel your finger is releasing from the throttle, and how your carb is adjusted , NOT octane !
I have a Stihl ms271 and run that at 40 :1 full synthetic Stihl oil. I'd rather a little more oil as the motors do run a bit hot being aircooled and Australia also has a warm climate most of the time
I have found it to be best to run the mix for the load intended, as to keep a bit of oil on the bearings in the crank case at all times. A slow running engine that is hardly run above medium speed, under a small load, will be fine at all times with a 100:1 ratio. A slow to fast running engine that is ran somewhat hard, will need at least at 50:1 ratio. A fast running, hard working engine, such as a snow blower that is rarely going to be at idle, will in fact need at least a 32:1 mix. It is that simple.
Well once I again I will disagree based on my own experiences BUT it does come down to the quality of your 2-stroke oil and proper tuning. I would never have believed it if I had not run these ratios for myself. One thing I can say for certain is that my firewood saws do not lead an easy life.
@@LeonsChainsawPartsAndRepair Only ams oil for my stuff lol, and I have used at a 100:1 before with heavy use on the engine, but not for long, because like my dad said for many years, you must give it a rest every so often with the mix being thinner, unless you want to see piston and bearing wear happen a lot faster than normal. Lets just say, everyone like us, totally loves their engines, and we do what we must to take care of them..lol. Hey, I have a question about the super ez duckbill thingy... Is the size you sell, the same for all the saws that use them?
Leon, I took your advice and got some. Still fine tuning the Super XL. The low jet is fussy, still figuring out the best setting. Thanks for the video.
I agree with this dude I have run almost everything under the sun. High octane plane fuel, castor oils, motul, Honda, Sthil, the orange saw stuff, different additives. I have wasted lots of time and money but I agree Saber is good stuff.
I need some help guys. I was using the Blendzall 455 Ultra product , at a 50:1 ratio like recommended by the manufacture Redmax. I was using the Blendzall in my Redmax Trimmer Bcz260ts and absolutely Loved the trimmer (and I've used them all) I also love the smell lol. The motor began to get harder to start and seemed to be losing power it was only 4 months old and still under warranty YET when I took it in for evaluation, they said it was run without oil (straight gas ) and the Piston and cylinder wall were both scarred. They refused to warranty. I told them that I was sure it had oil/ Blendzall and they still refused to warranty. I would like to be able to use the Blendzall product but it appears that it has failed. Did I do something wrong? I saw a comment that it has NO protection if its been cold. I did have on porch over the winter. Please advise, I just don't want to throw 300 away again. Michael and thanks so much in advance.
I hear lots of people saying “they use really good oil” and I use some good stuff too but pull that muffler off and have a look. My saws show sticky oily mufflers even when leaned right out so it may lube the bearings well but carbon scoring will most likely be an issue. I’m thinking of trying this 80:1 thing...
I used Alco No Smoke full-synthetic oil many years, a multi-ratio mix (2.6 oz/gal), in everything with a 2-stroke motor, no matter what the mix ratio specs were, and highly recommend it. A couple years ago I switched to Echo Red Armor 50:1 (only for the Echo 5-year warranty) and I've run it in a 1974 Homelite XL 2, 1982 Homelite Super XL, 1983 Homelite CS-50, 2018 Echo CS-590 Timber Wolf and several grass trimmers with specified mix ratios from 32:1, 40:1 to 50:1. When non-ethanol gas became a thing of the past where I live and everyone had to start running "corn-bustion" engines, I always add Lucas ethanol treatment and only mix one gallon at a time of 89 octane. A couple times a year and always before winter storage, everything gets a slug of Sea Foam, and I KNOW everything is going to start in the Spring, including my 25 year old outboard boat motor.
I think Sea Foam has ethanol in it. It's good for cleaning carbs and fuel lines out but I wouldn't want it to be the last thing my engine saw before storage. One of the only things the expensive pre mixed fuel is good for in my opinion. I leave my saws full of that (the Husky pre-mix to be more specific). They alway fire up fine for me. I had a Stihl that sat for 2 years with that in the tank and it fired up pretty easily 🤷♂️
Great info. Nice delivery and straight to the point. Iv tried listening to the older guys about my chainsaws and tried running 43:1 and then tried running 50:1 when the saw calls for 40:1 but I honestly like the 43:1
Yes! Finally someone else that strictly uses Ams Oil! Ive been telling people for years to use AMS OIL. Ams Oil has never let me down. I prefer to use the RED Ams Oil 2 stroke racing oil on everything. as long as the bottle says "Ams Oil" then your good to go 👍
Been running Husqvarna XP+ at 45:1. Never had a problem with it but I just ordered some Saber after hearing many experienced mechanics recommend it. I think I will also try the 80:1 mix just because 100:1 seems a little too low to me
I run the husqvarna XP+ as well, usually at a 40:1 for my mcculloch PM610 and eager beaver 3.4. However after watching this I will probably just start mixing a 50:1 mix as the xp+ is a pretty damn good oil
@dieselmechanicsam I've been really happy with the Amsoil Saber since I switched. Although like I said the XP+ never gave me a problem. I think the Saber is a step up though. It's full synthetic vs the XP+ which is semi synthetic. I just run it at 50:1 and it still burns cleaner than most oils. I've run it at 80:1 also and had no problems. I just like knowing I've definitely got the lubrication I need. When I literally switched from my husqvarna mix to the 80:1 Saber mix you could hear the RPM lower because it was delivering more gasoline through the carb. Had to lean out the saw to get it running right again. When you think about it, the combination of that and running a oil lean mix like 80:1 is delivering significantly less oil to the engine. Even if it's better oil I don't like that idea
@dieselmechanicsam I like running oils like XP+ slightly richer than 50:1. I would stick with 40-45:1 with oils like that. I've run Red Armor too. Same thing...usually mixed it at 45:1 just to give myself a little more insurance. I've torn down a few engines that was used in and that Red Armor is everywhere at 45:1. I'm also well aware that too much oil causes problems too though. Some people don't understand that more oil isn't always better. If you understand how to tune and read your spark plug and screen, you start to realize you shouldn't go any richer than 40:1 with good modern oils. If it's garbage Walmart oil or something I'd run that at 32:1 and only if I was forced to
My 2 cents. I've burned up a couple saws using 50-1. I was also using ethanol blend gasoline. I switched to non-ethanol 91 and went with a 40-1 mix from a solid source- Stihl, Husky or currently Dolmar. I don't know who makes the oi for these companies, but if it's an oil from those 3 or Echo, I'm comfortable. The 40-1 seems to do well in everything from ancient Macs and Pioneers to much newer Euro/Japanese saws. I just can't bring myself to go to the real lean mixes. They way work, but I just can't do it. Good discussion though, I enjoyed it.
I run 42.5:1 using Orange bottle Stihl (Castrol) and Non-E fuel. I decarbon 4-5 times a year using a Carb inlet injected product applied engine running. Great Results.
I run Echo Red Armor at 50:1 in everything I own, two cycle. I like JASO FD certified oils. I am primarily a Stihl Man but own MACs, huskies and Poulans. I used to run Stihl Ultra but it is just to filthy for my tastes.
@@offroad4x4nhlife45 any JASO FD oil, like Red armor can be run in any saw at 50:1 without any problems. That, is one of the requirements to meet the FD specification. I run it in my MAC PM610 with no problems.
Thanks for the video,,,I started using amsoil after you had suggested it to me as the oil you use. I had bought some parts from you and helped me with some other issues. I have been running it at 32:1 in my homelite saws,,and 40:1 in my sthil saws I was always afraid of damage to the saws if I ran them both on the same mix, I'm not the best at tuning, still learning,,,but I do enjoy working on saws,anyway thanks again for the video.
Using a modern high quality synthetic oil, like Amsoil or Redline, I would still shy away from going more than 50:1. I run ~~ 32-50:1 in all my 2-stroke equipment.
I'm late on this topic. I"ve been running Amsoil 100:1 since 1990. from Snowmobiles, chainsaws, weedeaters and such. Never yet had one go down for oiling issues. Any engine with roller bearing cranks that is. I did blow up a 50's vintage Johnson out board not realizing it wasn't a full roller crank.
I remember when I was a kid, around 12, I was first starting to get into saws, papaw was a stihl guy, but he had one of those old crappy poulan wood sharks, and he didn't want to waste his stihl oil in that thing, so we went to the gas station close by, and got a bottle of green 2cycle oil that I cant even say the name right, iuzue? it wasn't mag 1, cheapest thing they had, mixed up a jug of 50:1,(he was stuck on that because that's what stihl recommended) the oil didn't look very good, was a green /brown color and after a whole lot of smoke, and getting really hot fast, she kicked the bucket in about 17 min of normal fire wood cutting lol, but I agree, when I first started buying my own stuff, first saw I ever bought was a 1975 homelite 350 pro, first year or two I used penzoil, cause that was the top of the line at Walmart, but iv run caster 9 and did great, my favorite blend for the last four years had been Sunoco 87 octane mixed with lucas semi synthetic iv been very happy with no problems at all, iv heard several people now say that saber is a great oil, I think I will order me some, im ready to give it a try, thanks Leon.
I have ran all sorts of premix oil over the years , synthetic oil 50.1 and I have ran mercury quicksilver 2 cycle marine outboard premix oil with no issues at all , but I gotta admit that I will run the old Itasca green bottle premix oil at 40.1 in my echo weedeater and hand leaf blowers and also my 1985 year model poulan chainsaw and I never worry about running them hard and have has outstanding results with it !
Excellent video. I really appreciate all the good information. Where can we find the Amsoil product? Is it only on the internet? Haven't seen it in stores. Thanks for all you do Leon.
Thank you! I have smallest 25cm2 and cheapest Made in China saw and there is 25:1 fuel/oil mixture recommended. But I have Makita oil which is very good at 50:1.... Many users use 30:1 oil mixture for 25cm2 engines... Spark plug is brown with 25:1 with Makita oil... I think - the best is to check Spark plug "color" after change ratio, to find ideal mixture.
This is interesting about 2t oils.50:1 is a very common and standard mix for all engines.Husqvarna from Sweden recommends it,Stihl from Germany as well. Small yamaha made in Japan outboards like the 2hp engine recommends 100:1 fuelmix,its not a high temp/rev engine. Over all I think 50:1or 40:1 is a good fuelmix.
Just bought a case of saber and was browsing looking for mix reccomendations. I think ill put a 1.6 ounce package per gallon and that will end up between the 80 and 100:1. Closer to 85. Been running the echo opil in all of our stuff for 6 years with no issues but the salesman sold me on the saber and seems as though its quite a bit cheaper in the long run. The echo stuff is almost 30 dollars for a 6 pack that mixes 16 gallons. The amsoil was less than 60 and will do 48 gallons.
Thank you Leon, I am learning more with every video, I run Stihl hp Ultra, at 50:1 and 40:1, I will be trying the Amsoil next (maybe not at 80:1) I'm still learning how to tune.
I'll have to very politely disagree with your comment that more oil reduces power. I own a Stuska dynomometer and have tested many two stroke engines with different types of oil and different ratios and the results are not what might be expected. I have not applied these tests to chainsaw two strokes yet but every other type of two stroke so far has responded the same, rotary valve, reed valve and piston port. We monitor not only HP and torque but also the positive crankcase pressure, which was checked by using a one way valve installed in the crankcase. We also adjusted fuel air mixtures for optimum with different oil ratios. At the ratios commonly used there was no HP difference between synthetic oil and mineral based. With mineral oil or blends we took it all the way to 8 to 1 and saw HP improvements. An engine that produced 39 HP at 16 to 1 jumped to 41 HP at 8 to 1. This particular test was an outboard hydroplane competion engine that smoked at low speeds with 8 to 1 but showed no smoke behind it at all at high speed. We feel that the higher oil mixes are vastly better at sealing the reeds, piston skirts or seals for a jump in crankcase compression that enables a larger charge of F/A to enter the combustion chamber, producing more power. Todays ignition systems seem to still get long spark plug life at these ratios, fouling plugs is rare. I may try 8 to 1 in a chainsaw just to see if it becomes unuseable due to smoke. Possibly the chainsaw guys aren't interested the HP gains at the expense of inhaling more smoke which would be understandable. We feel that engine life is greatly extended by using these heavy mixes and we have no mufflers on our competition engines to (possibly) build up with carbon.
That is interesting for sure. The lack of muffler would make a difference for carbon buildup. A thicker mix would likely allow for a better ring seal...did you see a difference in RPM's attained?
@@LeonsChainsawPartsAndRepair That's a good question, on a dyno you can vary the rpm's with an adjustable water brake to any rpm and watch the torque at the same time. Then by multiplying the torque times the rpm is the HP. With a hydroplane the propeller determines rpm but a little more hp should show a higher rpm with the same setup. It looks like a synthetic blend gives the best of both worlds. A racer/small engine builder in my area saw the inside of an engine that was run for years with a very heavy oil mix and he said it was exceptionally clean and to continue doing whatever I have been. It would appear a 50:1 or even 100:1 gives enough of an oil film to keep parts protected but a heavy oil mix really seals up areas for max hp. A gauge monitoring the internal crankcase pressure (which is a positive/negative reading) that only reads the positive pressure shows a jump from 7 1/2 psi with 32:1 to almost 9 psi with an 8:1 mix. That pressure is what feeds the cyl the charge so it will increase hp unless it actually over scavenges the charge out the exhaust port.
Echo Red Armor, Stihl oil, Walmart Mystic brand, Redmax Oil, is made by Citgo oil. (Citgo SUPERGARD Air-Cooled 2-Cycle Engine Oil) is what these are branded oils are based off of. In the old saws From late 40's 50's Clinton,Mall,Mcculloch, Some Homelites, called for 8:1 or 16:1 mix ratio using only the SAE30 motor oil.
My store swapped brands of 2cycle oil that i buy all the time . i used to use 1 8 ounce per gallon which according to the orignal oil i used gave me a 40 to 1 ratio. today i bought some 2cycle oil and wasnt paying attenton thinking again,what a dangerous move. after i put the reg gallon of mid grade 89 octane in and mixed it up.. something didnt seem right. i got the pint size container out of the truck and looked at it with some reading glasses and lo and behold ..this oil i had bought requires one container 8 ounces per 2.5 gallons to achieve a 40 to 1 ratio . my only q is will this 16 to 1 ratio i currently have harm the engine and what about the 32 to 1 ratio.. thiese motors are 45cc and 54cc engies ,, which is safer for me to run? the 32:1 or the lower value. as my container only holds 2 gallons of gas. 54cc is a weed trimmer with brush attachments the other is a mucullah pro 610 chainsaw yes its a classic but the compression test is superb!i dont want to ruin either of my investments whats your opinion?
i have run 20:1 for over 20 years in my saws and never had one blow up or wear out yet. i mix 1 quart of 2 stroke oil in 5 gallons of non ethanol 91 octane gas, sometimes when i have run out of 2 stroke oil i have used 30 or 40 weight engine oil at the same ratio. they all smoke when cold but when its warm and working non of mine smoke. i did blow up a snowmobile engine on gas mixed at 50:1. oil is cheaper than parts
@@LeonsChainsawPartsAndRepair I have also used sae 40 diesel monograde and multigrade engine oils in my 2 stroke generator, no side effects but you have to burn all the gasoline to avoid carbs gumming. 2 stroke generators can use nearly every 4 stroke engine oils in their mixtures but you have to make sure to let the generator consume all the mixed fuel until the generator dies and you're good to go. 2 stroke oils have become extremely rare, so a monograde sae 40 can do the job pretty well, it will smoke of course but it's not that dramatic
Great video Leon. Project Farm did a test very recently with Amsoil 2st vs Super Tech. Amsoil destroyed the Super Tech in almost every test. Don’t think it was Saber though. Thanks again.
Running 80:1 is a brave act of faith. When I bought my Super EZ Auto in December 1974, recommended mix was 16:1. Not sure I’m brave enough to go 80:1. Now my “new” saw, the Husky 385XP, a saw shop “demo” I bought in 2002, specifies 50:1. Interestingly, I’ve seen discussion of Husky manuals published in other countries that said 32:1 for the large displacement saws. So confusion reigns. Enjoyed the video, though.
I run Stihl premium mix 50:1 what was in the Amz oil packet? it's all in the carb tune have to tune to your fuelmix altitude counts for a lot as well. Have a great one keep the chips flying............
You got it, tuning is a huge part of making your mix work for you! The packet was a smaller dose meant for 1 gallon cans. I had a few from a shipment from a friend a while back.
I own 2018. 2 stroke Makita rbc414 brushcutter which is factory reccommended 25:1 regardless of oil. I contacted Makita Europe and their tech service responded that cos of engine construction that strict 25:1 mix is needed, regardless anti-wear, burn or other qualities of any oil out there.. so there is or could be something else here. maybe mixture thickness could be one..
Most OEM's will claim exactly that. However Amsoil warranties your machine when using their oil when mixed properly. All I can say is I've literally run this mix in 100's of 2-strokes without a single failure.
@@LeonsChainsawPartsAndRepair thanks for your input, but it makes no sense here as Makita/Dolmar has 2stroke oils 50:1 as well as 100:1 which are reccomended in certain machines, for example MS-4510 etc. but for this machine oficials says - absolutly not..
I was just wondering about this in my old Shindiawa that calls for 25:1 ratio which surprised me. It smokes like a freight train. So when the machine was made, it called for 25:1, but now with the better formulation of mix oil I should be running 40:1 or 50:1….correct?
I'm friends with a professional mechanic, turned small engine guru. He does it for the Husqvarna dealership to make money on the side, they actually paid to send him out for training ( even though he said he knew more than 1/2 the people there.. but thats besides the point ) According to him, the majority of the saws that come in are for two reasons... Reason A: the saw was run with straight gas in it and fried the engine. OR common reason B: The piston ring was clogged up really bad from running 32:1 and destroyed the engine. He said zero issues running 50:1... and I can agree with this as I've been running my old MS270 for about 20 years on 50:1 and I mean running it hard. Never been re-built and never had an issue, other than wearing out Stihl bar after Stihl Bar lol... Anywho, I'm gonna go with his opinion, because he deals with dozens of fried saws per week, and I don't... because I run 50:1
Great advice - lately I have heard negative comments re: Stihl oil. I have a Stihl MS271 chainsaw and 8 Echo power tools. I use Stihl HP Ultra oil in the chainsaw and Echo Power Blend oil in the Echo tools. I want to use one brand of oil for all my power tools. In chainsaw, will it damage anything to go from a fully synthetic oil to a synthetic blend? Do you prefer Echo Power Blend or Echo Red Armor? thanks
everyone has their favorites! I been playing around with this myself. My opinion is Blendzall is the hands down best smelling! but, I hear it gunks up a saw. I run all my stuff 40:1 regardless of brand. last week ran Beano, liked it, this week running royal purple, following week I have a Maxima blend to try. long as it lubes, I'm good :-)
I would love to run a castor based product in my chainsaw and weedeaters. BUT I had a brand new Redman commercial trimmer ( best I've used) and it lasted about two months. SHOP would not warranty the unit, said i ran with no oil and it killed the piston. BLENZALL SAID they stood behind their product but it may have separated in cold weather. I want to run castor but just don't know. Thanks
If you run that Amsoil or the similar Opti-2 your saw will run better. I have been running Stens Mix for quite a while now and I notice a huge difference in how machines run. I have heard great things from other shop owners who have been running the Amsoil.
i run klotz R50 45:1 with 94 octane gas ethanol free in all my and everyone else's 2 stroke stuff very clean burn good power smells awesome! ps dirt bikes get 32:1 same oil an octane
I run echo oil 50:1 in all my saws never had a issue but if I was running cheap oil I would go 32:1 and retune amsoil is good stuff I run 6000 thousand hour oil changes in my big air compressors 25 years still going
I use a 3-gallon tank on my sailboat and make a batch of fuel with 2-1/2 gallons of no ethanal British Petroleum premium gas and 4 oz of Am-zol works great in my 5 hp~2 cycle Mercury outboard engine. Always starts with the first pull. Thanx~! Should note low-speed idle mixture and idle rpm is the only adjustments. High speed is not adjustable at all. Smoke is limited, to say the least. She's humming like a Swiss Watch.
i have a homelite 360 automatic 70,s model and it was gave to me the guy said it ran but i didnt ask if it was mix type well i look and it is and some one told me that it might be a 32,1 mix all my other chain saw,s are 40,1 mix all but my 50cc pulypro its a 50 ,1 mix but .so is that homelite a 32,1 mix its a 1975 i think
We don't got amsoil here I probably get a good oil mix mine at 32:1 I had a little homlite xl I ran klontz tecnaplate 2 stroke in it for over 20 years lol 32:1 I had dirt bikes back then I used the oil in every thing
I run this oil that's a $1.00 for a 1 gallon gas mix 50.1 sounds cheap but it's really good oil..my gas station sells it and I've been using it for years. I can tell by the temp of the saw if I'm not thick enough
I have a super 1050, Would you say that its safe to use 50:1 with the VP racing 2 stroke oil? I mixed it at 40:1 because im nervous. Cap specifies 32:1
Nothing wrong or that different with Walmart Supertech. I've used it in all my Stihls at 50:1 regularly for over 23 years in my woodlot. No smoke and no loss of power, never had to open or overhaul any of them. Amsoil is a fanboy favorite for no good reason.
Hmm - Fuel Deterioration due evaporation/fuel quality issues if the problem where I live. That's Australia/Queensland. Temp range local is 5 to 48 Degrees C through the year. So here I'm VERY mindful of the age of the mix. In short, If the mix is over about a month old, I won't use it in any high RPM application. Fortunately Briggs mower engines appear to enjoy reject fuel from their screamin' cousins. There's toluene in all 'gasoline' here - even part of the set standards, even though there's supposedly little if any alcohol in our 95 and 98 ROH rated fuels. I won't allow my engines to even get a sniff of the 10% Booze and the 91 ROH (called regular unleaded) rubbish. The people responsible for design of the only gasoline powered car we own won't allow the stuff. There's a hint. That being said, my SXL AO Homelite appears to like 30:1 on synthetic oil. The stuff spec's for air-cooled engines appears good to 25:1 - what's on the cap. I'm too lazy and too frightened to try 50:1 and re-tune. Parts COST here. We had a major scare with ultra-lights plummeting sans engine power a decade or so back - sheeted home to running LEAN. Gas evaporating quicker than oil - the appearance of rich running (smoky) but carby or course delivering a set A/F ratio and cooking the engine. I guess the moral is Shit fuel, hot climate >> melting, melting...Fresh fuel, troops:-) Comments welcome.
You make a great point of about fresh fuel! That's also one of the reasons I use Amsoil as it has stabilizers that claim to make it good for a year. I still mix Stabil in each can for good measure and I'm fortunate enough to have access to non-ethanol unleaded so I use that as well to avoid some of the issues you talked about.
Fraught, ain't it:-) Small engines and their owners are victims in so many ways. I know the people in my local mower shops exhibit steam coming outa their ears when fuel is mentioned. They've well and truly had enough. They're rather sell machines to happy customers than bill them for repairs every other month.
@@LeonsChainsawPartsAndRepair Hello, you can use 1:33 ls + husqvarna in saws 372xp 357xp and scythe 545rx without damaging carbon deposits? is it better 1:40?
The oil topic is a sensitive area because everyone is an expert, right? Back in 95, I was running Saber at 85:1 in a consumer saw, any richer it would load up from oil drag. Its a top quality oil any works well in any handheld equipment. Lately I have tried the walmart marine oil in a POS consumer trimmer and it amazed me because I never had any piston damage running it at 40:1 with the throttle pinned in heavy weeds. After getting an ECHO trimmer, I run the STIHL oil (grey bottle) because its available to me at a reasonable price point.. One thing that makes a difference for me is to add a tablespoon of Marvels Mystery Oil in a 2-Gal fuel can, it helps to keep the fuel metering clean and the engine does not lean out.
Ummmmm... So is it safe to say that if I run 50:1 stihl synthetic oil with non ethanol gas in most of everything, could I run 80:1 in ams oil without retuning? Or 60:1?
I run stihl m tronic 462s hard. 5 days a week 10 hrs a day logging. I picked up a few bottles of saber to try. Would you still recommend I use 80:1 for my application? Thanks!
I know this is an older video but any thoughts on VP race 2 stroke oil I have been using it for 5 years now in my sthil an vintage saw mixed at 33:1 seems to be about right for my elevation and climate here in pa . in the winter time i may have to turn a low screw up or down just a hair
I have a question concerning the fuel mix. Will this mix work in a Mercury water cooled 5 hp two-cycle engine? It was stated in a video that a 80:1 mix using a synthetic two cycle oil was the preferred concoction for your chainsaws. This fuel ratio will require a 'HI-LOW' tweak for the carb's needles. No big deal. It would be nice to have a bit more power without fogging for mosquitoes. The Mercury O/B pushes my 2,200 lb. Com-Pac 19 sailboat. Honestly ... What was the first thought? [You crazy sailor. He ought to be keelhauled.] Thanks very much. C.J. Weis [My chainsaw is an old and very trusty Homelite EZ Automatic. ]
Most equipment manufacturers have typical and common wording in their warranty clause that dictates the owner's responsibility. The warranty is a contract between the consumer and the manufacturer. If a consumer chooses to not comply with the wording of the contract then the warranty will be voided. Both Stihl and Husqvarna have wording that states: "The following are NOT covered by this limited warranty: (10) repairs made necessary due to improper oil mix ratios or the use of oils or other lubricants not specified in the products instruction manual." This is a direct quote from Stihl but nearly all manufacturers have similar wording. So yes, you are required to maintain your equipment to the standards written in the warranty contract if you expect the manufacturer to warrant the product. Amsoil doesn't make equipment nor do they warranty equipment. While under warranty you should follow the requirements of the equipment manufacturer.
I like 32-1 Lucus oil seems to run good in my old Macs and my husky’s rather change a plug than run mine lean and burn them up don’t mind some smoke I know it’s got oil in it
Alot of Chinese two stroke oil is filtered used motor oil. I've noticed all Chinese motors recommend heavy mixes. Makes sense for the oil used over there.
I picked up one of the Chinese saws and it recommended the 25:1 for the first couple of tanks then 40:1. I generally run a good 2 stroke motorcycle oil at 30-40:1 for most everything.
the chinese spec 25 to 1 because they sell those saws in every 3rd world market in the world. they know that most of them will get fed used 4t motor oil thats why they spec them for 25:1. Like Leon says cheap 2t oil go 32 to 1. fyi the manual for the Zenoah 5200 of which most of these chinese saw like the x-bull are clones of says 25:1 if running a JASO FB rated oil and 50:1 if FD rated.
I have an old Homelite Super XL my Uncle James bought it new and kept it in great shape and gave it to me a couple of years ago. When I first got it I put the 40 to 1 in it. But I switched to the Stihl premium synthetic 50 to 1 and it feels like it's got more power. It is a really strong saw for 58cc!
I run 32:1 VP mix with Rec 90 no ethanol in my Lawnboys and my Homelite 150s my Homelite 360 and my two super XLs with good results all about the tune really but I'm a firm believer ethanol which is alcohol should not be used in any two stroke hell even 4 cycles since it cuts oil that lubes two strokes and also dries rubber fuel lines
When my father bought our Homelite Super XL Automatic back in 1967 or 68 (the Blue one), the mixture requirement was 16:1 ratio. I have religiously continued that mix ratio and my saw still runs like a brand new one after 55 years of countless cords of wood cut. Back in the late sixties and early seventies, to me, that was Homelites "Golden Years". They made their best saw during that period of time.
You absolutely don't need to mix modern oils at 16:1. That was a specification then because oil quality was so much lower then. You'll be absolutely fine at 40:1 with most modern oils. I run Amsoil Saber at 50:1 in most saws, but I've run saws at 80:1 with it. No problems at all after a lot of use
@@AnarchAngel1 We do NOT know that. We are only listening to the oil manufacturers' claims, without ANY way to verify such claims. If your prized saw burns up, will the oil manufacturer compensate you? Of course not. We are operating purely on faith. Like stillwater62, my firewood saw is an early 1970s Homelite XL-12 and I would never, ever take a chance using 50:1 mixes. It's simply not worth the risk.
We have several Stihl and Husqvarna chainsaws of all sizes that get used hard year round on our farm. Most of them have modified mufflers and some port work. We use KLOTZ Synthetic oil and 91 octane non-ethanol gas. We mix 40:1 and run it in everything. It's a really good mix and nice balance of good lubrication and power. Plus - it smells great too!
I just pick up a stihl 661 and I run klotz in all my toys cannot beat that smell
Man did you kick a Hornet's nest or what. Brave soul. I use Honda HP2 at 40:1. I've used that on both my saws for nearly 4 years now, I got frustrated with Stihl's oil clogging up the system. I really appreciate your videos, you've helped me resurrect a few Homelite's. I posted on my local forum a while back that I wanted unloved or unused chainsaws so I could teach myself how to work on them and now I'm lost for space. You wouldn't believe how many saws came my way. For me, it's like working on puzzles, a little messier though.
Good points Leon! Thank you for your experience and the channel!
From our personal experience at work (we operate a landscape company), we have tried many different types of 2-cycle oil at 50:1 ratio - no matter what type/brand of oil we run in our 2 cycle equipment, we always experience a loss of engine compression in roughly ONE full calendar year/365 days (equipment is used very heavily, in a harsh commercial environment, and is run hundreds of times each week, year round).
However, at 40:1 ratio, our equipment lasts virtually indefinitely, for 10+ or more years before we upgrade (we made the change 10 years ago and nothing has lost compression since then, so we aren't sure how long 40:1 allows equipment to last). Equipment inevitably has other problems before failed cylinders (cracked frames, failed electrical systems) and/or is stolen, before wearing out at 40:1 in our company's personal experience. We haven't experienced carbon buildup or any fouled spark plugs either. Our thoughts are: Oil and plugs are cheap - equipment isn't. When we remove spark plugs, we have the usual light tan/beige color on the electrode which many mechanics have told us, is the proper indicator of a correct burn/mixture/jet setting.
We have never tried the Amsoil synthetic oils or other boutique/high end oils simply due to mixing requirements. We need exactly (1) 6.4 oz 2-cycle premix oil container for our 2 gallon fuel canisters for precise consistency. I'm not sure if you can get that from Amsoil (or other brands) without having to carefully measure each time - asking crews to do this, in my experience, proves highly inconsistent and introduces variables (too much oil one time and too little in another time). Having the whole amount of oil in one container per fuel container, proves effortless with measurements.
Also, I personally tune everything myself using the service manual engine specs (idle rpm, max rpm, etc...) using an engine tachometer. An engine tachometer is exact, precise, and effortless. I always make every single piece of equipment "4-stroke" at high rpm which means it's a little richer. Also, every piece of equipment has the spark arrestor removed prior, since it is a "weak link" in the reliability chain - where we work in California, it's 100% asphalt and concrete, and we haven't burned down any concrete where we work.
Small equipment mechanics used to love our company - we would spend thousands each year in repairs. Simply changing our fuel canisters from 2.5 gallon to 2.0 gallon while using the same 6.4 oz of premix oil (Supertech) for air cooled engines was a game changer. We haven't been back to the mechanic for decades. It was an old timer that once yelled out to me "Good thing you aren't running 40:1, or you would never be back in here." I in turn walked back over to Jerry and asked: "I thought 50:1 was...." and he interrupted me: "Someone has to keep the EPA and CARB happy..." Since then, I did what this elderly mechanic recommended and I've never looked back. He actually advised AGAINST synthetic because in his words, it doesn't burn completely, so we just use the conventional Supertech universal 2 cycle oil for air cooled engines for $1.50 for 6.4 oz, that meets the most important JASO-FD oil spec.
This simple change, made decades ago, has made our company extremely profitable to where we're completely maxing out our retirement accounts, my spouse's retirement account, and my children's as well - simply by changing from 50:1 to 40:1 premix ratio at our company which uses 2 cycle equipment hundreds of times each week at hundreds of commercial properties in the California Bay area. Your results may vary.
Thank you very much.
Randy D.
Thank you very much for taking the time to share this experience!!
Thanks buddy. I think I may just change my Go To ratio to 40:1
i wonder why all the scrap yards are full of chainsaws and weed eaters and i wonder why people are constantly having to replace top ends on dirt bikes ?? the EPA wants them scrapped out ... i have a small engine shop and every 2 stroke engine that comes in that was ran on 50:1 has stuck rings and no compression ,, with all due respect you have a great channel !!
@@im-that-guy-pal well higher octane fuel does seem to increase the rpm on my weedeaters and saws
@@skinnybigstuff1040 that is impossible according to the laws of physics. The rpm of a motor is based on him much fuel your finger is releasing from the throttle, and how your carb is adjusted , NOT octane !
@@robertdillon9989 - Correct. High octane prevents detonation, like in high compression engines.
You're 100 right, I been a mechanic for 50years and I appreciate your video.
I have a Stihl ms271 and run that at 40 :1 full synthetic Stihl oil. I'd rather a little more oil as the motors do run a bit hot being aircooled and Australia also has a warm climate most of the time
Thank you sir for sharing your opinion... I'm new to small engines and you seem like a trustworthy guy who knows his stuff.
I have found it to be best to run the mix for the load intended, as to keep a bit of oil on the bearings in the crank case at all times. A slow running engine that is hardly run above medium speed, under a small load, will be fine at all times with a 100:1 ratio. A slow to fast running engine that is ran somewhat hard, will need at least at 50:1 ratio. A fast running, hard working engine, such as a snow blower that is rarely going to be at idle, will in fact need at least a 32:1 mix. It is that simple.
Well once I again I will disagree based on my own experiences BUT it does come down to the quality of your 2-stroke oil and proper tuning. I would never have believed it if I had not run these ratios for myself. One thing I can say for certain is that my firewood saws do not lead an easy life.
@@LeonsChainsawPartsAndRepair Only ams oil for my stuff lol, and I have used at a 100:1 before with heavy use on the engine, but not for long, because like my dad said for many years, you must give it a rest every so often with the mix being thinner, unless you want to see piston and bearing wear happen a lot faster than normal. Lets just say, everyone like us, totally loves their engines, and we do what we must to take care of them..lol. Hey, I have a question about the super ez duckbill thingy... Is the size you sell, the same for all the saws that use them?
Leon, I took your advice and got some. Still fine tuning the Super XL. The low jet is fussy, still figuring out the best setting. Thanks for the video.
I agree with this dude I have run almost everything under the sun. High octane plane fuel, castor oils, motul, Honda, Sthil, the orange saw stuff, different additives. I have wasted lots of time and money but I agree Saber is good stuff.
I need some help guys. I was using the Blendzall 455 Ultra product , at a 50:1 ratio like recommended by the manufacture Redmax. I was using the Blendzall in my Redmax Trimmer Bcz260ts and absolutely Loved the trimmer (and I've used them all) I also love the smell lol. The motor began to get harder to start and seemed to be losing power it was only 4 months old and still under warranty YET when I took it in for evaluation, they said it was run without oil (straight gas ) and the Piston and cylinder wall were both scarred. They refused to warranty. I told them that I was sure it had oil/ Blendzall and they still refused to warranty. I would like to be able to use the Blendzall product but it appears that it has failed. Did I do something wrong? I saw a comment that it has NO protection if its been cold. I did have on porch over the winter. Please advise, I just don't want to throw 300 away again. Michael and thanks so much in advance.
Are you still running this ratio and oil there Leon? Thanks for your videos!!
I hear lots of people saying “they use really good oil” and I use some good stuff too but pull that muffler off and have a look.
My saws show sticky oily mufflers even when leaned right out so it may lube the bearings well but carbon scoring will most likely be an issue.
I’m thinking of trying this 80:1 thing...
Having worked in the woods for over 20 yrs.,amsoil is used in about evertthing. I tend to agree with you Leon.
Great advice, thanks.
I used Alco No Smoke full-synthetic oil many years, a multi-ratio mix (2.6 oz/gal), in everything with a 2-stroke motor, no matter what the mix ratio specs were, and highly recommend it. A couple years ago I switched to Echo Red Armor 50:1 (only for the Echo 5-year warranty) and I've run it in a 1974 Homelite XL 2, 1982 Homelite Super XL, 1983 Homelite CS-50, 2018 Echo CS-590 Timber Wolf and several grass trimmers with specified mix ratios from 32:1, 40:1 to 50:1. When non-ethanol gas became a thing of the past where I live and everyone had to start running "corn-bustion" engines, I always add Lucas ethanol treatment and only mix one gallon at a time of 89 octane. A couple times a year and always before winter storage, everything gets a slug of Sea Foam, and I KNOW everything is going to start in the Spring, including my 25 year old outboard boat motor.
You give it a slug of Sea foam and then run it dry? When winterizing?
I think Sea Foam has ethanol in it. It's good for cleaning carbs and fuel lines out but I wouldn't want it to be the last thing my engine saw before storage. One of the only things the expensive pre mixed fuel is good for in my opinion. I leave my saws full of that (the Husky pre-mix to be more specific). They alway fire up fine for me. I had a Stihl that sat for 2 years with that in the tank and it fired up pretty easily 🤷♂️
Great info. Nice delivery and straight to the point. Iv tried listening to the older guys about my chainsaws and tried running 43:1 and then tried running 50:1 when the saw calls for 40:1 but I honestly like the 43:1
Yes! Finally someone else that strictly uses Ams Oil! Ive been telling people for years to use AMS OIL. Ams Oil has never let me down. I prefer to use the RED Ams Oil 2 stroke racing oil on everything. as long as the bottle says "Ams Oil" then your good to go 👍
Been running Husqvarna XP+ at 45:1. Never had a problem with it but I just ordered some Saber after hearing many experienced mechanics recommend it. I think I will also try the 80:1 mix just because 100:1 seems a little too low to me
I run the husqvarna XP+ as well, usually at a 40:1 for my mcculloch PM610 and eager beaver 3.4. However after watching this I will probably just start mixing a 50:1 mix as the xp+ is a pretty damn good oil
@dieselmechanicsam I've been really happy with the Amsoil Saber since I switched. Although like I said the XP+ never gave me a problem. I think the Saber is a step up though. It's full synthetic vs the XP+ which is semi synthetic. I just run it at 50:1 and it still burns cleaner than most oils. I've run it at 80:1 also and had no problems. I just like knowing I've definitely got the lubrication I need. When I literally switched from my husqvarna mix to the 80:1 Saber mix you could hear the RPM lower because it was delivering more gasoline through the carb. Had to lean out the saw to get it running right again. When you think about it, the combination of that and running a oil lean mix like 80:1 is delivering significantly less oil to the engine. Even if it's better oil I don't like that idea
@@AnarchAngel1 100% agree with that! I'm sticking with nothing leaner than 50:1 just to make sure I'm safe
@dieselmechanicsam I like running oils like XP+ slightly richer than 50:1. I would stick with 40-45:1 with oils like that. I've run Red Armor too. Same thing...usually mixed it at 45:1 just to give myself a little more insurance. I've torn down a few engines that was used in and that Red Armor is everywhere at 45:1. I'm also well aware that too much oil causes problems too though. Some people don't understand that more oil isn't always better. If you understand how to tune and read your spark plug and screen, you start to realize you shouldn't go any richer than 40:1 with good modern oils. If it's garbage Walmart oil or something I'd run that at 32:1 and only if I was forced to
My 2 cents. I've burned up a couple saws using 50-1. I was also using ethanol blend gasoline. I switched to non-ethanol 91 and went with a 40-1 mix from a solid source- Stihl, Husky or currently Dolmar. I don't know who makes the oi for these companies, but if it's an oil from those 3 or Echo, I'm comfortable. The 40-1 seems to do well in everything from ancient Macs and Pioneers to much newer Euro/Japanese saws. I just can't bring myself to go to the real lean mixes. They way work, but I just can't do it. Good discussion though, I enjoyed it.
I run 42.5:1 using Orange bottle Stihl (Castrol) and Non-E fuel. I decarbon 4-5 times a year using a Carb inlet injected product applied engine running. Great Results.
I run Echo Red Armor at 50:1 in everything I own, two cycle. I like JASO FD certified oils. I am primarily a Stihl Man but own MACs, huskies and Poulans. I used to run Stihl Ultra but it is just to filthy for my tastes.
I've been debating on running echo red armor 50:1 in my 621, I know factory calls for 25:1
@@offroad4x4nhlife45 any JASO FD oil, like Red armor can be run in any saw at 50:1 without any problems. That, is one of the requirements to meet the FD specification. I run it in my MAC PM610 with no problems.
Nice videos, you say each to their own, being 80 year old i go for more oil but i've got to go with you!!
Thanks for the video,,,I started using amsoil after you had suggested it to me as the oil you use. I had bought some parts from you and helped me with some other issues. I have been running it at 32:1 in my homelite saws,,and 40:1 in my sthil saws I was always afraid of damage to the saws if I ran them both on the same mix, I'm not the best at tuning, still learning,,,but I do enjoy working on saws,anyway thanks again for the video.
Try Schaeffer. Go to the sites and compare data
Nice to hear 80:1 on the Amsoil Saber. I think I’m headed in that direction and giving up the Stihl synthetic 50:1 ratio.
Using a modern high quality synthetic oil, like Amsoil or Redline, I would still shy away from going more than 50:1. I run ~~ 32-50:1 in all my 2-stroke equipment.
I had an engine failure on amsoil 50:1 after 1 year.
Ill never run that crap again!Klotz or Blendzall 40:1
@@577buttfan which aimsoil?
@@snipersam204 saber
@@577buttfan probably junky equipment haha
@@ForrestGump1212 maybe I'm not a big fan of the top 80 Italian engine too much vibration.
I run with VP 2 cycle oil it's works really good for me I use in all my chain saws trimers and my duraforce lawnmower
Some great advice and rational behind it, thanks Leon.
I'm late on this topic. I"ve been running Amsoil 100:1 since 1990. from Snowmobiles, chainsaws, weedeaters and such. Never yet had one go down for oiling issues. Any engine with roller bearing cranks that is. I did blow up a 50's vintage Johnson out board not realizing it wasn't a full roller crank.
I been using maxama castor 927 for 15 years in my dirt bikes and chainsaws and never had an issue.
I've been recommending it since I became a dealer 10 years ago and tried in my own personal saw and weed whacker. My commercial clients like it.
Agreed on saber. I use 70:1 without no issue for years and years.
I remember when I was a kid, around 12, I was first starting to get into saws, papaw was a stihl guy, but he had one of those old crappy poulan wood sharks, and he didn't want to waste his stihl oil in that thing, so we went to the gas station close by, and got a bottle of green 2cycle oil that I cant even say the name right, iuzue? it wasn't mag 1, cheapest thing they had, mixed up a jug of 50:1,(he was stuck on that because that's what stihl recommended) the oil didn't look very good, was a green /brown color and after a whole lot of smoke, and getting really hot fast, she kicked the bucket in about 17 min of normal fire wood cutting lol, but I agree, when I first started buying my own stuff, first saw I ever bought was a 1975 homelite 350 pro, first year or two I used penzoil, cause that was the top of the line at Walmart, but iv run caster 9 and did great, my favorite blend for the last four years had been Sunoco 87 octane mixed with lucas semi synthetic iv been very happy with no problems at all, iv heard several people now say that saber is a great oil, I think I will order me some, im ready to give it a try, thanks Leon.
I have ran all sorts of premix oil over the years , synthetic oil 50.1 and I have ran mercury quicksilver 2 cycle marine outboard premix oil with no issues at all , but I gotta admit that I will run the old Itasca green bottle premix oil at 40.1 in my echo weedeater and hand leaf blowers and also my 1985 year model poulan chainsaw and I never worry about running them hard and have has outstanding results with it !
Excellent video. I really appreciate all the good information. Where can we find the Amsoil product? Is it only on the internet? Haven't seen it in stores. Thanks for all you do Leon.
I like Motorex Cross Power 2T fully synthetic, at 40:1. Never had a problem in saws or dirtbikes Ktm. Great stuff.
Thank you! I have smallest 25cm2 and cheapest Made in China saw and there is 25:1 fuel/oil mixture recommended. But I have Makita oil which is very good at 50:1.... Many users use 30:1 oil mixture for 25cm2 engines... Spark plug is brown with 25:1 with Makita oil... I think - the best is to check Spark plug "color" after change ratio, to find ideal mixture.
This is interesting about 2t oils.50:1 is a very common and standard mix for all engines.Husqvarna from Sweden recommends it,Stihl from Germany as well. Small yamaha made in Japan outboards like the 2hp engine recommends 100:1 fuelmix,its not a high temp/rev engine. Over all I think 50:1or 40:1 is a good fuelmix.
Just bought a case of saber and was browsing looking for mix reccomendations. I think ill put a 1.6 ounce package per gallon and that will end up between the 80 and 100:1. Closer to 85. Been running the echo opil in all of our stuff for 6 years with no issues but the salesman sold me on the saber and seems as though its quite a bit cheaper in the long run. The echo stuff is almost 30 dollars for a 6 pack that mixes 16 gallons. The amsoil was less than 60 and will do 48 gallons.
Thank you Leon, I am learning more with every video, I run Stihl hp Ultra, at 50:1 and 40:1, I will be trying the Amsoil next (maybe not at 80:1) I'm still learning how to tune.
Amsoil at 80 to 100 to1 with premium ethanol free gas never a problem starting or with lack of power in cold or hot weather. Great stuff, Great video
excellent video. sharing the experience
I'll have to very politely disagree with your comment that more oil reduces power. I own a Stuska dynomometer and have tested many two stroke engines with different types of oil and different ratios and the results are not what might be expected. I have not applied these tests to chainsaw two strokes yet but every other type of two stroke so far has responded the same, rotary valve, reed valve and piston port. We monitor not only HP and torque but also the positive crankcase pressure, which was checked by using a one way valve installed in the crankcase. We also adjusted fuel air mixtures for optimum with different oil ratios. At the ratios commonly used there was no HP difference between synthetic oil and mineral based. With mineral oil or blends we took it all the way to 8 to 1 and saw HP improvements. An engine that produced 39 HP at 16 to 1 jumped to 41 HP at 8 to 1. This particular test was an outboard hydroplane competion engine that smoked at low speeds with 8 to 1 but showed no smoke behind it at all at high speed. We feel that the higher oil mixes are vastly better at sealing the reeds, piston skirts or seals for a jump in crankcase compression that enables a larger charge of F/A to enter the combustion chamber, producing more power. Todays ignition systems seem to still get long spark plug life at these ratios, fouling plugs is rare. I may try 8 to 1 in a chainsaw just to see if it becomes unuseable due to smoke. Possibly the chainsaw guys aren't interested the HP gains at the expense of inhaling more smoke which would be understandable. We feel that engine life is greatly extended by using these heavy mixes and we have no mufflers on our competition engines to (possibly) build up with carbon.
That is interesting for sure. The lack of muffler would make a difference for carbon buildup. A thicker mix would likely allow for a better ring seal...did you see a difference in RPM's attained?
@@LeonsChainsawPartsAndRepair That's a good question, on a dyno you can vary the rpm's with an adjustable water brake to any rpm and watch the torque at the same time. Then by multiplying the torque times the rpm is the HP. With a hydroplane the propeller determines rpm but a little more hp should show a higher rpm with the same setup. It looks like a synthetic blend gives the best of both worlds. A racer/small engine builder in my area saw the inside of an engine that was run for years with a very heavy oil mix and he said it was exceptionally clean and to continue doing whatever I have been. It would appear a 50:1 or even 100:1 gives enough of an oil film to keep parts protected but a heavy oil mix really seals up areas for max hp. A gauge monitoring the internal crankcase pressure (which is a positive/negative reading) that only reads the positive pressure shows a jump from 7 1/2 psi with 32:1 to almost 9 psi with an 8:1 mix. That pressure is what feeds the cyl the charge so it will increase hp unless it actually over scavenges the charge out the exhaust port.
@@morgan4xl Now this was a productive conversation, thank you for weighing in!
Thanks, subscriber has been made appreciate this simple but amazing info let you know more soon.
Echo Red Armor, Stihl oil, Walmart Mystic brand, Redmax Oil, is made by Citgo oil.
(Citgo SUPERGARD Air-Cooled 2-Cycle Engine Oil) is what these are branded oils are based off of.
In the old saws From late 40's 50's Clinton,Mall,Mcculloch, Some Homelites, called for 8:1 or 16:1 mix ratio using only the SAE30 motor oil.
My store swapped brands of 2cycle oil that i buy all the time . i used to use 1 8 ounce per gallon which according to the orignal oil i used gave me a 40 to 1 ratio. today i bought some 2cycle oil and wasnt paying attenton thinking again,what a dangerous move. after i put the reg gallon of mid grade 89 octane in and mixed it up.. something didnt seem right. i got the pint size container out of the truck and looked at it with some reading glasses and lo and behold ..this oil i had bought requires one container 8 ounces per 2.5 gallons to achieve a 40 to 1 ratio . my only q is will this 16 to 1 ratio i currently have harm the engine and what about the 32 to 1 ratio.. thiese motors are 45cc and 54cc engies ,, which is safer for me to run? the 32:1 or the lower value. as my container only holds 2 gallons of gas.
54cc is a weed trimmer with brush attachments the other is a mucullah pro 610 chainsaw yes its a classic but the compression test is superb!i dont want to ruin either of my investments whats your opinion?
i have run 20:1 for over 20 years in my saws and never had one blow up or wear out yet. i mix 1 quart of 2 stroke oil in 5 gallons of non ethanol 91 octane gas, sometimes when i have run out of 2 stroke oil i have used 30 or 40 weight engine oil at the same ratio.
they all smoke when cold but when its warm and working non of mine smoke.
i did blow up a snowmobile engine on gas mixed at 50:1. oil is cheaper than parts
I'm glad your system works for you!
@@LeonsChainsawPartsAndRepair I have also used sae 40 diesel monograde and multigrade engine oils in my 2 stroke generator, no side effects but you have to burn all the gasoline to avoid carbs gumming. 2 stroke generators can use nearly every 4 stroke engine oils in their mixtures but you have to make sure to let the generator consume all the mixed fuel until the generator dies and you're good to go.
2 stroke oils have become extremely rare, so a monograde sae 40 can do the job pretty well, it will smoke of course but it's not that dramatic
Great video Leon. Project Farm did a test very recently with Amsoil 2st vs Super Tech. Amsoil destroyed the Super Tech in almost every test. Don’t think it was Saber though. Thanks again.
it was the dominator race oil.
@@MrSGL21 id be curious to see how the Saber does.
Running 80:1 is a brave act of faith. When I bought my Super EZ Auto in December 1974, recommended mix was 16:1. Not sure I’m brave enough to go 80:1. Now my “new” saw, the Husky 385XP, a saw shop “demo” I bought in 2002, specifies 50:1. Interestingly, I’ve seen discussion of Husky manuals published in other countries that said 32:1 for the large displacement saws. So confusion reigns. Enjoyed the video, though.
I use 42.5:1 in anything that calls for a 50:1 with Stihl oil. I do however hit the engines with a decarbonizer product every now and then.
They call for more oil in some countries due to the low quality of fuel.
@@mattfleming86 interesting! Thanks.
The oils back in 1974 had nothing to do with modern products! Dont get confused.
I run Stihl premium mix 50:1 what was in the Amz oil packet? it's all in the carb tune have to tune to your fuelmix altitude counts for a lot as well. Have a great one keep the chips flying............
You got it, tuning is a huge part of making your mix work for you! The packet was a smaller dose meant for 1 gallon cans. I had a few from a shipment from a friend a while back.
I own 2018. 2 stroke Makita rbc414 brushcutter which is factory reccommended 25:1 regardless of oil.
I contacted Makita Europe and their tech service responded that cos of engine construction that strict 25:1 mix is needed, regardless anti-wear, burn or other qualities of any oil out there.. so there is or could be something else here. maybe mixture thickness could be one..
Most OEM's will claim exactly that. However Amsoil warranties your machine when using their oil when mixed properly. All I can say is I've literally run this mix in 100's of 2-strokes without a single failure.
@@LeonsChainsawPartsAndRepair thanks for your input, but it makes no sense here as Makita/Dolmar has 2stroke oils 50:1 as well as 100:1 which are reccomended in certain machines, for example MS-4510 etc. but for this machine oficials says - absolutly not..
Right from the chainsaw guru! Makes sense to me Leon. Great video!👍
I was just wondering about this in my old Shindiawa that calls for 25:1 ratio which surprised me. It smokes like a freight train. So when the machine was made, it called for 25:1, but now with the better formulation of mix oil I should be running 40:1 or 50:1….correct?
I have an old Homelite XL 12 , what brand & what mix ratio should I use ?
I am a huge fan of the red armor oil
I'm friends with a professional mechanic, turned small engine guru. He does it for the Husqvarna dealership to make money on the side, they actually paid to send him out for training ( even though he said he knew more than 1/2 the people there.. but thats besides the point ) According to him, the majority of the saws that come in are for two reasons... Reason A: the saw was run with straight gas in it and fried the engine. OR common reason B: The piston ring was clogged up really bad from running 32:1 and destroyed the engine. He said zero issues running 50:1... and I can agree with this as I've been running my old MS270 for about 20 years on 50:1 and I mean running it hard. Never been re-built and never had an issue, other than wearing out Stihl bar after Stihl Bar lol... Anywho, I'm gonna go with his opinion, because he deals with dozens of fried saws per week, and I don't... because I run 50:1
32:1 jest złe ?
@Sensei948 Unnecessary with high quality oil like Saber for sure. I run it at 50:1 in every 2 stroke I own. It's excellent oil
Great advice - lately I have heard negative comments re: Stihl oil. I have a Stihl MS271 chainsaw and 8 Echo power tools. I use Stihl HP Ultra oil in the chainsaw and Echo Power Blend oil in the Echo tools. I want to use one brand of oil for all my power tools. In chainsaw, will it damage anything to go from a fully synthetic oil to a synthetic blend? Do you prefer Echo Power Blend or Echo Red Armor? thanks
Also back then those 8:1 16:1 was 30 weight motor oil now we have application specific oil for saws etc
everyone has their favorites! I been playing around with this myself. My opinion is Blendzall is the hands down best smelling! but, I hear it gunks up a saw. I run all my stuff 40:1 regardless of brand. last week ran Beano, liked it, this week running royal purple, following week I have a Maxima blend to try. long as it lubes, I'm good :-)
I would love to run a castor based product in my chainsaw and weedeaters. BUT I had a brand new Redman commercial trimmer ( best I've used) and it lasted about two months. SHOP would not warranty the unit, said i ran with no oil and it killed the piston. BLENZALL SAID they stood behind their product but it may have separated in cold weather. I want to run castor but just don't know. Thanks
If you run that Amsoil or the similar Opti-2 your saw will run better. I have been running Stens Mix for quite a while now and I notice a huge difference in how machines run. I have heard great things from other shop owners who have been running the Amsoil.
Stens is a FD rated oil.
Thanks Leon, great information
Hello, you can use 1:33 ls + husqvarna in saws 372xp 357xp and scythe 545rx without damaging carbon deposits? is it better 1:40?
I run 32:1 in everything and iv never had an issue 4 ounces to a gallon! Just my personal preference
and the carbon deposit?
i run klotz R50 45:1 with 94 octane gas ethanol free in all my and everyone else's 2 stroke stuff very clean burn good power smells awesome! ps dirt bikes get 32:1 same oil an octane
I run echo oil 50:1 in all my saws never had a issue but if I was running cheap oil I would go 32:1 and retune amsoil is good stuff I run 6000 thousand hour oil changes in my big air compressors 25 years still going
These old homlites xl12 super xl I always use 16:1 don't know know what type to use cause iv not had a xl 12 in years
I use a 3-gallon tank on my sailboat and make a batch of fuel with 2-1/2 gallons of no ethanal British Petroleum premium gas and 4 oz of Am-zol works great in my 5 hp~2 cycle Mercury outboard engine. Always starts with the first pull. Thanx~! Should note low-speed idle mixture and idle rpm is the only adjustments. High speed is not adjustable at all.
Smoke is limited, to say the least. She's humming like a Swiss Watch.
i have a homelite 360 automatic 70,s model and it was gave to me the guy said it ran but i didnt ask if it was mix type well i look and it is and some one told me that it might be a 32,1 mix all my other chain saw,s are 40,1 mix all but my 50cc pulypro its a 50 ,1 mix but .so is that homelite a 32,1 mix its a 1975 i think
Thoughts on Lucas 2 stroke oil at 45:1 vs. Stihl oil. I just bought a new MS 271
Medford? Oregon?
Friend, but working with the same 50: 1 oil after switching to 33: 1 will result in more deposits and deposits?
We don't got amsoil here I probably get a good oil mix mine at 32:1 I had a little homlite xl I ran klontz tecnaplate 2 stroke in it for over 20 years lol 32:1 I had dirt bikes back then I used the oil in every thing
I hear that alot too man, modern high end oil can run really lean.... I'm just sooo damn leary of it! LOL. in Oregon too by the way, Molalla area ;-)
I run this oil that's a $1.00 for a 1 gallon gas mix 50.1 sounds cheap but it's really good oil..my gas station sells it and I've been using it for years. I can tell by the temp of the saw if I'm not thick enough
Oil ratio is a touchy subject, well done. What's your personal recommendation on octane?
I have a super 1050, Would you say that its safe to use 50:1 with the VP racing 2 stroke oil? I mixed it at 40:1 because im nervous. Cap specifies 32:1
I have an engine that the manufacturer recommends 30:1 yet most oils recommend 50:1, which do you go by?! Or maybe a happy medium and go 40:1?
Nothing wrong or that different with Walmart Supertech. I've used it in all my Stihls at 50:1 regularly for over 23 years in my woodlot. No smoke and no loss of power, never had to open or overhaul any of them.
Amsoil is a fanboy favorite for no good reason.
i wonder if he has a mccloch promac 800
I just bought a stihl ms170 saw and it says 50/1 and I am using there oil but my craftsman says 40/1
I use the AMSOil Dominator 50:1 on my newer saws. Would I be good running this mix with my vintage saw?
Hmm - Fuel Deterioration due evaporation/fuel quality issues if the problem where I live. That's Australia/Queensland. Temp range local is 5 to 48 Degrees C through the year.
So here I'm VERY mindful of the age of the mix. In short, If the mix is over about a month old, I won't use it in any high RPM application. Fortunately Briggs mower engines appear to enjoy reject fuel from their screamin' cousins.
There's toluene in all 'gasoline' here - even part of the set standards, even though there's supposedly little if any alcohol in our 95 and 98 ROH rated fuels. I won't allow my engines to even get a sniff of the 10% Booze and the 91 ROH (called regular unleaded) rubbish. The people responsible for design of the only gasoline powered car we own won't allow the stuff. There's a hint.
That being said, my SXL AO Homelite appears to like 30:1 on synthetic oil. The stuff spec's for air-cooled engines appears good to 25:1 - what's on the cap. I'm too lazy and too frightened to try 50:1 and re-tune. Parts COST here.
We had a major scare with ultra-lights plummeting sans engine power a decade or so back - sheeted home to running LEAN. Gas evaporating quicker than oil - the appearance of rich running (smoky) but carby or course delivering a set A/F ratio and cooking the engine.
I guess the moral is Shit fuel, hot climate >> melting, melting...Fresh fuel, troops:-)
Comments welcome.
You make a great point of about fresh fuel! That's also one of the reasons I use Amsoil as it has stabilizers that claim to make it good for a year. I still mix Stabil in each can for good measure and I'm fortunate enough to have access to non-ethanol unleaded so I use that as well to avoid some of the issues you talked about.
Fraught, ain't it:-) Small engines and their owners are victims in so many ways. I know the people in my local mower shops exhibit steam coming outa their ears when fuel is mentioned. They've well and truly had enough. They're rather sell machines to happy customers than bill them for repairs every other month.
@@johnpoot725Truth right there!
fresh is best
@@LeonsChainsawPartsAndRepair Hello, you can use 1:33 ls + husqvarna in saws 372xp 357xp and scythe 545rx without damaging carbon deposits? is it better 1:40?
The oil topic is a sensitive area because everyone is an expert, right? Back in 95, I was running Saber at 85:1 in a consumer saw, any richer it would load up from oil drag. Its a top quality oil any works well in any handheld equipment. Lately I have tried the walmart marine oil in a POS consumer trimmer and it amazed me because I never had any piston damage running it at 40:1 with the throttle pinned in heavy weeds. After getting an ECHO trimmer, I run the STIHL oil (grey bottle) because its available to me at a reasonable price point.. One thing that makes a difference for me is to add a tablespoon of Marvels Mystery Oil in a 2-Gal fuel can, it helps to keep the fuel metering clean and the engine does not lean out.
Ummmmm... So is it safe to say that if I run 50:1 stihl synthetic oil with non ethanol gas in most of everything, could I run 80:1 in ams oil without retuning? Or 60:1?
Probably...at that point, the difference shouldn't be too noticeable.
I run stihl m tronic 462s hard. 5 days a week 10 hrs a day logging. I picked up a few bottles of saber to try. Would you still recommend I use 80:1 for my application? Thanks!
Losing power, is NOT about burning oil off. The oil is for RING SEAL and engine protection.
I know this is an older video but any thoughts on VP race 2 stroke oil I have been using it for 5 years now in my sthil an vintage saw mixed at 33:1 seems to be about right for my elevation and climate here in pa . in the winter time i may have to turn a low screw up or down just a hair
Leon, what do you think about using Echo Red Armor in a PM 610 at 50:1. It has to be as good as Saber at 80:1. Just my thoughts.
I have a question concerning the fuel mix.
Will this mix work in a Mercury water cooled 5 hp two-cycle engine?
It was stated in a video that a 80:1 mix using a synthetic two cycle oil was the preferred concoction for your chainsaws. This fuel ratio will require a 'HI-LOW' tweak for the carb's needles. No big deal.
It would be nice to have a bit more power without fogging for mosquitoes.
The Mercury O/B pushes my 2,200 lb. Com-Pac 19 sailboat.
Honestly ... What was the first thought? [You crazy sailor. He ought to be keelhauled.]
Thanks very much. C.J. Weis [My chainsaw is an old and very trusty Homelite EZ Automatic. ]
Amsoil has a marine oil line as well, check it out here: www.amsoil.com/shop/by-equipment/marine/pleasure-boats/hp-marine-synthetic-2-stroke-oil/
@@LeonsChainsawPartsAndRepair Thank You Sir. Very much. I have learned so many CORRECT things from all of your videos and efforts.
Does that a fact the warrant on the saw.
Not according to the Amsoil Warranty statement at the bottom of the page: www.amsoil.com/p/saber-professional-synthetic-2-stroke-oil-atp/
Most equipment manufacturers have typical and common wording in their warranty clause that dictates the owner's responsibility. The warranty is a contract between the consumer and the manufacturer. If a consumer chooses to not comply with the wording of the contract then the warranty will be voided. Both Stihl and Husqvarna have wording that states: "The following are NOT covered by this limited warranty: (10) repairs made necessary due to improper oil mix ratios or the use of oils or other lubricants not specified in the products instruction manual." This is a direct quote from Stihl but nearly all manufacturers have similar wording. So yes, you are required to maintain your equipment to the standards written in the warranty contract if you expect the manufacturer to warrant the product. Amsoil doesn't make equipment nor do they warranty equipment. While under warranty you should follow the requirements of the equipment manufacturer.
What were you running for break in on your restored saws?
I run the same mix as normal, my 80:1 Amsoil Saber. On break-in I set the L side a bit rich for roughly 30 minutes of bench time.
@@LeonsChainsawPartsAndRepair 1:33 is ok ?
I like 32-1 Lucus oil seems to run good in my old Macs and my husky’s rather change a plug than run mine lean and burn them up don’t mind some smoke I know it’s got oil in it
I’ve been mixing my own 32:1 with that Walmart oil and 90 octane ethanol-free fuel. I’ve never seen any 32:1 premixed.
Project Farm tested walmart 2 stroke oil and it had stellar results believe it or not ...
To each there own! I run Stihl oil. That’s the equipment I own.
Im running 32:1 in my leaf blowers, maxima super m
Leon
i have 3 Craftman chainsaws that I run 50-1. I purchased a Chinese X-Bull and it says 25-1? what is your thought on that?
Thanks
Alot of Chinese two stroke oil is filtered used motor oil. I've noticed all Chinese motors recommend heavy mixes. Makes sense for the oil used over there.
I picked up one of the Chinese saws and it recommended the 25:1 for the first couple of tanks then 40:1. I generally run a good 2 stroke motorcycle oil at 30-40:1 for most everything.
the chinese spec 25 to 1 because they sell those saws in every 3rd world market in the world. they know that most of them will get fed used 4t motor oil thats why they spec them for 25:1. Like Leon says cheap 2t oil go 32 to 1. fyi the manual for the Zenoah 5200 of which most of these chinese saw like the x-bull are clones of says 25:1 if running a JASO FB rated oil and 50:1 if FD rated.
200m I put in 5lt is ok or is two much
i have bin running 50'1 stihl in a old homealite . runs good what do you think
A lot of guys do that...nothing wrong with the Stihl mix at all!
@@LeonsChainsawPartsAndRepair Its a dirty oil.
I have an old Homelite Super XL my Uncle James bought it new and kept it in great shape and gave it to me a couple of years ago. When I first got it I put the 40 to 1 in it. But I switched to the Stihl premium synthetic 50 to 1 and it feels like it's got more power. It is a really strong saw for 58cc!
it is me again its a homelite textron 360 automatic ant never used one before
I feel like need to buy a saw now!
i love chainsaw
I run 32:1 VP mix with Rec 90 no ethanol in my Lawnboys and my Homelite 150s my Homelite 360 and my two super XLs with good results all about the tune really but I'm a firm believer ethanol which is alcohol should not be used in any two stroke hell even 4 cycles since it cuts oil that lubes two strokes and also dries rubber fuel lines