I am proud that I know the history of how TECHNO music started. Thank you, David & Roger along with the many companies that built these electronic devices.
As a photographer, I completely agree. Having learned the ins and outs of my 35-55mm stock (if I remember correctly), I felt I know exactly what I wanted in a macro lens, and used it to get the shots I'd been composing mentally while learning about lens tech before making the monetary commitment. I just ordered the Push after learning the software for 2+ years now, and while I'm waiting for it to ship, (12-16 weeks argh!) I've been finding myself approaching projects with that workflow in mind.
Love the interview. It is really good to hear the thoughts of these two masters of design engineering. I did chuckle at how much they slag off DAW's and Soft Synth's whilst being sat in front of an Akai Controller Keyboard and Mahasssivee Computer Monitor. Still a great video. Please interview more greats.
Amazing that this outfit was able to get both these guys together for an interview - I have come across it a few times. However, it always struck me as odd that whoever got these guys in the same room to talk didn’t make sure that both guys talked about what really put them on the map. This is Dave Smith and Roger Linn in the same room together and the LM-1 and/or LinnDrum wasn’t even mentioned? The interviewer touched on their foundations and started with the MPC60 when he began introducing Roger. At least Dave brought up the Prophet 5 briefly, but you can’t bring up the P5 during an interview with Dave Smith but completely skip over the LinnDrum when Roger Linn is sitting right next to him. Weird, but I’d probably enjoy an interview where those guys talk about their favorite sandwiches together.
I thank Roger Linn should have continued to keep the legendary Mpc 60, Mpc 60 II, Mpc 3000 going you find more people constantly looking for these machines all over the globe.
True, the point being though that analog naturally has all the character and colour more advanced softsynths are trying to create, and while more expensive has far greater resale potential due to not becoming "obsolete" as quickly.
The only issues I have with the old is price and lack of recall. I only have so much time to work on my hobby and to go back to a project and have to get all the knobs etc back to the original settings would cut into that time greatly. With the proper midi controllers I find the software route to be great! This is coming from a Cubase guy...
+Tonguç Endem I noticed, when Roger started talking about the sample rate, aliasing, and bandwidth limiting in digital oscillators, Dave got a look on his face like, "Where are you going with this?"
+Tonguç Endem Dave addressed this recently. How the oscillator itself has always been analogue, but the way the pitch is controlled has been digital to prevent pitch drifting. Recently, they all went back to complete VCOs because the technology is more stable now.
With all due respect, I remember when the MPC was said to have no soul and that the 12 bit sampling gave it a plastic sounding sizzle to things. That there was no warmth to it. When I hear the rant at 5:00 and on, all I hear is the usual luddite "there's no soul" argument that is always being made about technology, from the CD to digital effects pedals to digital visual effects.
Oh I'm not worried about profit losses from theft or anything. My main concern is that the ease of availability cheapens the value for the person using them. When I first started using Ableton, with a huge array of diverse instruments, effects, and samples, ie when I could do "anything", I didn't really know what to do or where to start. About the same time, I started playing with an old sample-sequencer Electribe and had so much more fun with a far more restrictive tool, relatively speaking.
I don't know the circuitry, DSP, or anything like that. All I know is that when I got my Bass Station ii, despite being in my thirties, I was like one of those digital/software kids Dave described. Now this Bass Station sits next to a Mopho and a Minibrute. I also like that hardware rarely gives you anything tantamount to a 'not responding' message.
Reminder to folks - If you are worried about losing your synths to future upgrades or old computers, learn how to virtualize a computer. Boom, archived.
Using MIDI controllers is where it's at. You can program a MIDI controller to your taste that plays any soft synth that exposes all its properties. I guess it's a matter of personal taste. These 2 guys along with Bob Moog, the Korg guy, and the Roland guy are the fathers of electronic music. Of course there are others but we have to get as many as possible together in one room like Ean Golden did. Please Ean try to get all of them next time. Offer free lunches and door prizes. Kidding, obviously, but getting all of them in discussion would be mind blowing. Do it before they die. We owe them so much. Just listen to Dave and Roger and how much they care. It wasn't just business to them at all. These 2 guys are geniuses. I forgot the English guy who created consoles, amongst other hardware. Thanks a lot Ean. This video is a classic. And thanks so much to your guests.
After 4 years of home studio, i'm so agree with Mr Smith, long life for hardware !!! just buy a kronos which had computer in it,run the risk to faill quicky, hope that certain trademark continue to have synthesizer whitout computer in it ? to keep it 10, 20, or 30 years.......when a computer have five years life is fantastic.........
Make a double blind test with real Moogs and empty Moog hulls that are connected to a simulation like Minimonsta. Even professionals will loose that test I guess. A similar test was made with violinists, Stradivarius and modern violins. Of course the modern violins won the contest even though the violonists thought them to be inferior. Add dedicated knobs and a housing to a soft synth and all will love it.
Well, software gets outdated eventually. Sure sucks when that happens. Then again, so do hardware standards (cables, voltages, ...) and, let's face it, hardware breaks every once in a while. Plus, I've never spilled anything on a piece of software, neither did I ever have to clean or dust a VST plug-in. Don't get me wrong, I can certainly appreciate a good piece of gear. But please, don't make it sound holier than it is.
done it all Analog Virtual analog Samplers Romplers... sold it all got me a quad core 32 gb ram Cubase 5 Ableton 8 live n Reason 5+ Reason 6.5 essential. The new gear blows it away. tech dont hamper creativity or give you more scope YOU do. What holds ya earz apart is the best damn instrument/ editor. Cool vid tho, (y)
>software synths outdating and needing bought again >Not recognizing that VSTi Standard doesn't have this problem. I'll agree that analog is great, but IMO the only real advantage they have is a lack of band limiting. Otherwise the argument is basically digital vs vinyl, and different peoples preferences for interfaces.
Ok. I have a Moog LP, a Kronos and Minimonsta and I know that there is different behavior between analog and digital. Nonlinearity of analog parts and direct control of the sound via knobs are be part of the fascination of analog synths. But they both can not tell me that analog sounds "better". They are just selling there products. If you put enough processor power into it you can do any "nonlinear sound " with a computer. Bandwidth and aliasing is not a problem anymore.The 90ties are past.
Cool interview but a bit biased. There is no argument that analog synths sound amazing but there are routing options and creative possibilities that can be done with software synths that analog synths can't touch. Spectrasonics Omnisphere, Massive, Reaktor ensembles for example just to name a few. Both have their place. NI Komplete is also $400 and comes with endless great-sounding instruments. A Prophet 12 is $3,000 and only has analog synth sounds. Analog vs digital snobbery will never end.
His entire response is based on a completely outmoded understanding of what a software synth is. Anyone who has fifty dollars has an interface that controls what you see on the screen, you don't need to touch the mouse or keyboard.
Ironic though, that i know so many struggling electronic producers who openly pirate every piece of software out there but then can't write anything!! Too much choice is a creativity killer, plus if you get the software for free very little value is placed on it, and thus little incentive to explore and learn what it can do.
Those guys are innovative and smart. I can't help but think its a bit of self-preservation. That fact is Plugins are not the future. They are the present. Go ahead and buy yourself a rotary phone if you love the feel so much. I'm going to stick with my iphone.
To make everyone' sentiments simple: Analog is great! (learning, quality, human side, etc) --> :) Ah, but Analog is expensive. (money, poor, real human life, etc) --> :'( So, we use digital...
Dave Smith & Roger Linn did not even touch the main reason why analog synths/hardware sounds different than digital. I guess it's a secret... The reason is the power supply. That's the big secret. Power supply on all synths and DA conversion on virtual analog synths. The effect of the power supply on hardware is to this day, impossible to recreate digitally. Want an awesome sounding synth? Look at the power supply DA Conversion on virtual analog and digital hardware synths turns the SR to ∞
Sadly, the main draw of software synths is that they can be downloaded without paying for them. Aside from a lot of fantastic free software, it's just too easy to pirate software these days to justify spending $400+ on hardware.
As a photographer, I completely agree. Having learned the ins and outs of my 35-55mm stock (if I remember correctly), I felt I know exactly what I wanted in a macro lens, and used it to get the shots I'd been composing mentally while learning about lens tech before making the monetary commitment. I just ordered the Push after learning the software for 2+ years now, and while I'm waiting for it to ship, (12-16 weeks argh!) I've been finding myself approaching projects with that workflow in mind.
![[UA] NAVI vs MOUZ | BO5 | IEM Rio 2024](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/CMBYk0cbGoA/mqdefault.jpg)
I am proud that I know the history of how TECHNO music started. Thank you, David & Roger along with the many companies that built these electronic devices.
The best part of being an interviewer to me is getting to meet these amazing people!
Just clicked "like" 1 sec in. Who can dislike what both of these guys did for the music industry?
As a photographer, I completely agree. Having learned the ins and outs of my 35-55mm stock (if I remember correctly), I felt I know exactly what I wanted in a macro lens, and used it to get the shots I'd been composing mentally while learning about lens tech before making the monetary commitment. I just ordered the Push after learning the software for 2+ years now, and while I'm waiting for it to ship, (12-16 weeks argh!) I've been finding myself approaching projects with that workflow in mind.
great interview!!! thanks DJTT
Love the interview. It is really good to hear the thoughts of these two masters of design engineering. I did chuckle at how much they slag off DAW's and Soft Synth's whilst being sat in front of an Akai Controller Keyboard and Mahasssivee Computer Monitor. Still a great video. Please interview more greats.
Ean's a pretty good interviewer.
Amazing that this outfit was able to get both these guys together for an interview - I have come across it a few times. However, it always struck me as odd that whoever got these guys in the same room to talk didn’t make sure that both guys talked about what really put them on the map. This is Dave Smith and Roger Linn in the same room together and the LM-1 and/or LinnDrum wasn’t even mentioned? The interviewer touched on their foundations and started with the MPC60 when he began introducing Roger. At least Dave brought up the Prophet 5 briefly, but you can’t bring up the P5 during an interview with Dave Smith but completely skip over the LinnDrum when Roger Linn is sitting right next to him. Weird, but I’d probably enjoy an interview where those guys talk about their favorite sandwiches together.
Amazing! More stuff like this!!
Very interesting to hear their opinions, I'm gonna read about bandlimiting. thanks so much Ean!
I thank Roger Linn should have continued to keep the legendary Mpc 60, Mpc 60 II, Mpc 3000 going you find more people constantly looking for these machines all over the globe.
No big deal just DAVE SMITH AND ROGER LINN!?
Thanks for the interview!
Any info on the keyboard and studio monitors seen in the video?
ROGER, I have been using your MPC 60 & 3000 for YEARS! And I will NEVER sell it! THANK YOU! - Logikbomb (DC Producer)
nice vid man I love this type of informative nerdy dj stuff
True, the point being though that analog naturally has all the character and colour more advanced softsynths are trying to create, and while more expensive has far greater resale potential due to not becoming "obsolete" as quickly.
Roger Linn is the man!!! thanx ean
The only issues I have with the old is price and lack of recall. I only have so much time to work on my hobby and to go back to a project and have to get all the knobs etc back to the original settings would cut into that time greatly. With the proper midi controllers I find the software route to be great!
This is coming from a Cubase guy...
Just to be clear, non of the Dave Smith Instruments products now have analog oscillators.
+Tonguç Endem I noticed, when Roger started talking about the sample rate, aliasing, and bandwidth limiting in digital oscillators, Dave got a look on his face like, "Where are you going with this?"
+Tonguç Endem Dave addressed this recently. How the oscillator itself has always been analogue, but the way the pitch is controlled has been digital to prevent pitch drifting. Recently, they all went back to complete VCOs because the technology is more stable now.
With all due respect, I remember when the MPC was said to have no soul and that the 12 bit sampling gave it a plastic sounding sizzle to things. That there was no warmth to it. When I hear the rant at 5:00 and on, all I hear is the usual luddite "there's no soul" argument that is always being made about technology, from the CD to digital effects pedals to digital visual effects.
amazing as hell! :) what kinda monitors are behind you by the way?
Dave Smith is legend ;D
Nice interview. There are some decent thoughts in this. I wish we heard a little more from linn though. Dave was more of the talker.
i second this. great interesting interview.
Oh I'm not worried about profit losses from theft or anything. My main concern is that the ease of availability cheapens the value for the person using them. When I first started using Ableton, with a huge array of diverse instruments, effects, and samples, ie when I could do "anything", I didn't really know what to do or where to start. About the same time, I started playing with an old sample-sequencer Electribe and had so much more fun with a far more restrictive tool, relatively speaking.
i love the intro music!!! what is it? xx
I don't know the circuitry, DSP, or anything like that. All I know is that when I got my Bass Station ii, despite being in my thirties, I was like one of those digital/software kids Dave described. Now this Bass Station sits next to a Mopho and a Minibrute. I also like that hardware rarely gives you anything tantamount to a 'not responding' message.
Roger linn with that double cup
Reminder to folks - If you are worried about losing your synths to future upgrades or old computers, learn how to virtualize a computer. Boom, archived.
Using MIDI controllers is where it's at. You can program a MIDI controller to your taste that plays any soft synth that exposes all its properties. I guess it's a matter of personal taste. These 2 guys along with Bob Moog, the Korg guy, and the Roland guy are the fathers of electronic music. Of course there are others but we have to get as many as possible together in one room like Ean Golden did. Please Ean try to get all of them next time. Offer free lunches and door prizes. Kidding, obviously, but getting all of them in discussion would be mind blowing. Do it before they die. We owe them so much. Just listen to Dave and Roger and how much they care. It wasn't just business to them at all. These 2 guys are geniuses. I forgot the English guy who created consoles, amongst other hardware. Thanks a lot Ean. This video is a classic. And thanks so much to your guests.
dave smith is as honest as it comes. no bs
After 4 years of home studio, i'm so agree with Mr Smith, long life for hardware !!! just buy a kronos which had computer in it,run the risk to faill quicky, hope that certain trademark continue to have synthesizer whitout computer in it ? to keep it 10, 20, or 30 years.......when a computer have five years life is fantastic.........
So True, I got rid of my Roland SH101 years ago now I could kick myself for that.
Fresh
he ean please make a vid about the tempest
Make a double blind test with real Moogs and empty Moog hulls that are connected to a simulation like Minimonsta. Even professionals will loose that test I guess.
A similar test was made with violinists, Stradivarius and modern violins. Of course the modern violins won the contest even though the violonists thought them to be inferior.
Add dedicated knobs and a housing to a soft synth and all will love it.
Does anybody know the name of the track at the end?
Well, software gets outdated eventually. Sure sucks when that happens. Then again, so do hardware standards (cables, voltages, ...) and, let's face it, hardware breaks every once in a while. Plus, I've never spilled anything on a piece of software, neither did I ever have to clean or dust a VST plug-in. Don't get me wrong, I can certainly appreciate a good piece of gear. But please, don't make it sound holier than it is.
done it all Analog Virtual analog Samplers Romplers... sold it all got me a quad core 32 gb ram Cubase 5 Ableton 8 live n Reason 5+ Reason 6.5 essential. The new gear blows it away. tech dont hamper creativity or give you more scope YOU do. What holds ya earz apart is the best damn instrument/ editor. Cool vid tho, (y)
>software synths outdating and needing bought again
>Not recognizing that VSTi Standard doesn't have this problem.
I'll agree that analog is great, but IMO the only real advantage they have is a lack of band limiting. Otherwise the argument is basically digital vs vinyl, and different peoples preferences for interfaces.
Ok. I have a Moog LP, a Kronos and Minimonsta and I know that there is different behavior between analog and digital. Nonlinearity of analog parts and direct control of the sound via knobs are be part of the fascination of analog synths. But they both can not tell me that analog sounds "better". They are just selling there products. If you put enough processor power into it you can do any "nonlinear sound " with a computer. Bandwidth and aliasing is not a problem anymore.The 90ties are past.
But I love designing patches in software synths =[
Great interview but maybe he should have move his midi keyboard out of the shot. Lol.
Hardware Synths are sooo expensive :(
Cool interview but a bit biased. There is no argument that analog synths sound amazing but there are routing options and creative possibilities that can be done with software synths that analog synths can't touch. Spectrasonics Omnisphere, Massive, Reaktor ensembles for example just to name a few. Both have their place. NI Komplete is also $400 and comes with endless great-sounding instruments. A Prophet 12 is $3,000 and only has analog synth sounds. Analog vs digital snobbery will never end.
His entire response is based on a completely outmoded understanding of what a software synth is. Anyone who has fifty dollars has an interface that controls what you see on the screen, you don't need to touch the mouse or keyboard.
Ironic though, that i know so many struggling electronic producers who openly pirate every piece of software out there but then can't write anything!! Too much choice is a creativity killer, plus if you get the software for free very little value is placed on it, and thus little incentive to explore and learn what it can do.
3:51 :)
Those guys are innovative and smart. I can't help but think its a bit of self-preservation. That fact is Plugins are not the future. They are the present. Go ahead and buy yourself a rotary phone if you love the feel so much. I'm going to stick with my iphone.
That guy at far left is sippin that double cup!
To make everyone' sentiments simple:
Analog is great! (learning, quality, human side, etc) --> :)
Ah, but Analog is expensive. (money, poor, real human life, etc) --> :'(
So, we use digital...
Dave Smith & Roger Linn did not even touch the main reason why analog synths/hardware sounds different than digital.
I guess it's a secret...
The reason is the power supply. That's the big secret. Power supply on all synths and DA conversion on virtual analog synths.
The effect of the power supply on hardware is to this day, impossible to recreate digitally. Want an awesome sounding synth? Look at the power supply
DA Conversion on virtual analog and digital hardware synths turns the SR to ∞
Sadly, the main draw of software synths is that they can be downloaded without paying for them. Aside from a lot of fantastic free software, it's just too easy to pirate software these days to justify spending $400+ on hardware.
Everyone please continue to buy digital software!!!! So i the real synth heads can save all the analog for themselves!!!
translation ... a lot easier to steal software than hardware
dave smith just shits on digital the whole dam time...making roger linn feel all wack for making a digital sampler...interesting
but Roger Linn is bigger legend;D
While I would love to have an analog synth, it's simply impractical for me and most other producers. Return on investment is just not there
Not true
+Siccmade79
Nope fat jean wearing homophobic music producer actually
+Siccmade79
Dude the Raiders are fucking terrible. They're still butt hurt about the Immaculate Reception.
As a photographer, I completely agree. Having learned the ins and outs of my 35-55mm stock (if I remember correctly), I felt I know exactly what I wanted in a macro lens, and used it to get the shots I'd been composing mentally while learning about lens tech before making the monetary commitment. I just ordered the Push after learning the software for 2+ years now, and while I'm waiting for it to ship, (12-16 weeks argh!) I've been finding myself approaching projects with that workflow in mind.