My great-great grandfather, Robert F. Leng, was the captain on board the Joseph H. Thompson, one of the boats that responded and aided in rescue efforts of the Steinbrenners crew. It was pretty emotional when I met this lady one time, her dad had been one of those lost on the Steinbrenner and we immediately connected through that shared tragedy.
Big Old Boats is easily becoming my favorite maratime disasters yt show. Brick Immortar is very good, but BOB just keeps putting out and the content and quality are top notch.
Definitely one of my favourite great lakes frieght steamer disaster channels that concentrate on well documented sinkings with emphasis those caused by an initially seemingly harmlessly mundane human error from the second half of the last century
Brick Immortar needs to learn to put more inflection in his narration. His content is interesting, but his videos are way too long for how soporific his voice is.
She was barely seaworthy. Her brave crew fought a losing battle. Another Great Lakes tragedy...thank you for making it so very real, for bringing us on board.🌹⚓
Sadly, my great uncle was one of the ones who perished on the Henry Steinbrenner. It happened before I was born so I never knew him, but I know my grandmother was deeply affected by the loss of her brother…
There was always someone missing at the Sunday dinner and holiday dinner tables, right until the last of his generation died. 💔 My great-uncle was KIA in WWII. His last surviving brother died in 2021. When he died, I finally felt like I could lay Uncle Harold to rest, the only great-uncle I didn't get to meet. It does affect the family for generations.
My Great Uncle Calvin Swartz was one of the men who went down on this ship leaving widow and 2 small children at home. Thank you, I have always heard stories about Uncle Cal!
There's something very wrong with an industry when an accepted part of a crewmans job was that they may die when their vessel sinks out from under them! Obviously insufficient open lifeboats and open life rafts killed countless seamen whom sought sanctuary in them. Had the bosses, directors and rule writers, or their offspring been on board during emergency evacuations, things would have rapidly improved... Edited for typo.
There were no other options in regard to lifeboats. Open life boats were still in use on the ocean liners of the Atlantic in 1953. One can point blame on those who did not maintain the ship properly, but they had the best that was available in 1953.
@@20thCenturyManTrad With respect, you're missing the point! Open lifeboats shouldn't have been the best things available in 1953. Covered, enclosed lifeboats actually save lives and are better in every way imaginable than open lifeboats. Enclosed lifeboats don't throw out their passengers if they're overturned, they don't get swamped and sink, they offer weather protection to the survivors on board. No one sets out in bad sea states or atrocious weather in open boats, but during a maritime emergency, bad sea states and atrocious weather are likely to be the cause of the emergency that endangers vessels and necessities passengers and crew launching lifeboats! The same conditions that ssnk their huge vessel is what they're now expected to endure in open boats...
@@felixcat9318 "Should have had" isn't an answer. It's like saying they should have had better steel in 1912 when the Titanic was made, it would have prevented the ship breaking apart, it just hadn't been developed. I mean they should had vaccines for cholera in the 1800s, but they didn't, it hadn't been developed yet. I don't deny that closed lifeboats are better, but they didn't have them, you can't pin that on anything but the walk of time. You can only have what was the best of your time.
@@felixcat931890% of everything you use in your day to day life has come to you by water. Whether the raw materials or components at some point in production or the entire finished product, almost everything in your home, vehicle or public transit, and in your workplace has come to you by water. So you're part of the industry, paying for the safety equipment.
The more I see of these bulk freighters sinking in bad weather, the more I believe its a fair weather design. They either break apart or get flooded when the deck hatches fail and the deck gets inevitably flooded. Yes, not all of them end tragically, but considering that they are built to carry loose heavy loads that are stored exactly amidships, and then designing the rest of the ship in a fashion akin to a teeter-totter in heavy seas...I mean, I am no engineer nor a sailor...but just from the outside I question the physics of it. And then there is not even a secure way across, almost as if it was intended for the engine room and bridge (and officers and deck hands) to loose contact during any storm...you know, when contact between them is the most vital. And then to top it off, lets skimp on the maintenance and life craft while demanding the crew to "make one last run of the season".
After the loss of the Edmund Fitzgerald, one maritime expert stated that the Great Lakes freighter is nothing but a motorised barge, virtually without any watertight integrity. Theoretically, a one-inch puncture in the cargo hold will sink it, he said.
As a one time employee of Steinbrenner(2 years on the Kinsman Independent(1988-1989) and also knowing someone who had a relative who perished on the Henry,l have some perspective on this.The KI was relatively modern and powerful boat, whereas the 2nd Henry (which succeeded the lost HS),was of a similar vintage,vastly underpowered,in similar disrepair and just as ripe for bad weather...l was always amazed she lasted until retirement and the scrapheap.
@@luketdrifter2100 Triple expansion is not the best but it works and the technology is (at that time) well known and reliable. The Liberty ships were all equipped with a triple expansion, not a turbine … for a reason.
@@advorak8529 yeah because it was cheap and easy to maintain. They were under powered by a lot. Liberty ships were built to be expendable. Thats why they were built the way they were.
We only know about that quote because Dennis Hale, the only survivor of the Daniel J Morrell, wrote it in his book. And the only reason he wrote the book is because he suffered "survivor's guilt" to the extent that he was debilitated from it, and finally his psychologist told him he had to write about it to get it out in the open.
@@kskssxoxskskss2189.........And I'll bet it's still been said alot long before him, or before any of us were even born. Alotta folks after we die will say it too. You missed the point where I claimed GL was the first and only one to say that. Or that GL 'owned' it. Wait!!! I never claimed that, did I??? Oops.
Your choice of music, archival footage, etc really give you a unique tone. I even went and found the music ghost hunt from Restless Moons because of your use. That band and/or guy does some good stuff. It gives your channel stories an eerie nostalgia quality to them, is the only way i can describe it
I live in Minnesota so I've heard of the boat but never the story. Thanks for this. Excellent story teller. The Sykes one of the prettiest boats on the lakes.
16:47 starts the transition between chapters… i swear, the sounds and images you displayed creates such a perfectly eerie ambience. I even rewinded 🙃 thank you for these high quality videos!
Here in the U.K l've become very interested in stories from the Great Lakes & their ships, mainly through The Edmund Fitzgerald & Gordon Lightfoot's classic ballad. A friend & myself visited the U.S three times, the last took us to Seattle & Vancouver & on the flight home we stopped over at Chicago for a few hours & while there took a walk down to the Michigan waterfront. Back then l didn't really have any knowledge of the lakes so I didn't pay as much attention to that visit as l would now but l'm glad of the memory. BOB's is an excellent channel, keep up the good work.
the switch from 'nice and sunny' to 'black and white' in the editing was a small but cool detail to the overall video, i've been binging this channel recently between work and noticed that having the visuals line up with the story on those days when you have time to watch really changes the story into a 'spooky story' to a panic-inducing 'oh god i could imagine that'
An excellent video as always. Would you ever consider doing a video on the loss of the SS Marine Electric in February 1983, I recently finished Until The Sea Shall Free Them, by Robert Frump, that is why I am asking. Rest in peace to the lost crew of the Henry Steinbrenner.
My teacher's husband was in the same union as the SS Marine Electric and SS Poet guys - tragedies caused by awful maintenance; his ship was rusty & run down too.
Great video! I watched the ones about the Carl D. Bradley and the Daniel J Morrell. The Steinerbreiner seem to have a lot going against it. I don't know if you have done videos on the Edmund Fitzgerald, Kamloops or the Benjamin Noble, but with that being said, you have yourself a new subscriber. Can't wait to see what you have next.
My late father worked on tug boats performing towing and marine salvage with a company out of Amherstburg, Ontario on the lower Detroit River. One job in the '70s had them righting a Laker that capsized in one of the Soo Locks. I can't remember the name of the ship unfortunately. My dad kept many photos from his time on the lakes and some great books about shipwrecks such as the Steinbrenner. Sadly he eventually sold off the books and photos in order to stay afloat after he stopped working.
@@kimfleury Also, what amounts to a hurricane hitting a smaller amount of water than an ocean. Much easier to whip a smaller amount of water into a frenzy with the same force.
These lakes are dangerous because they get severe thunderstorms that form upwind over land in the midwest, where spring to fall the weather is volatile and known for some of the strongest storms on earth. After peak severe weather season and into mid-late fall, they get similarly volatile squalls when it's still warm during the day and when jet streams of cold air from northern canada are more frequent - when those clash with warm weather you get sustained squalls with gusts creating very high waves for far longer than the more violent spring/summer storms. Basically, because the Oceans are so large and so uniformly cool, they very much prevent the potential for instability and storms/wind. Any real bad weather/waves on the ocean have to be from a tropical storm/cyclone moving far into cooler waters which is both not very common for the N Atlantic and also easily and routinely planned for and avoided since like the 1950s when a lot of money was spent to improve national weather services. Oh and also lake freighters were complete deathtraps up until the 1980s by the time all the dangerous broke operators were bankrupt.
@@Demoralized88 Thanks for info. I remember in high school learning about the "Lake Effect" from the great lakes and how it affected the snow around the area.
I live in Michigan and sail on the Great Lakes. You take weather forecasts seriously as in many ways sailing on the Great Lakes can be more challenging than on the ocean.
Stories like these remind me of how weather forecasting has changed over the decades. A common thread seems to be that the ship leaves Duluth or Superior as the low pressure center comes out of the Plains. The warm front passes over and the ship experiences warm temperatures and south-southeast breezes. As the cold front approaches winds out of the south become stronger. Storms also develop out ahead of the cold front. Behind the cold, strong northwesterly winds drive the seas up. Anywhere along the cold front those old Lakers would be at risk. Even into the 1970s weather forecasting was still something of an art.
Why does anyone wait until the situation is that bad to request assistance? I’ve noticed airline pilots have a tendency to this also. Is it a personality trait common to those attracted to risky leadership positions?
Dude these videos are so good the editing the music the story everything. Keep doing more and more. I do have one question why haven’t you done a Fitz video
Shout out to the content creator for changing his narration style in the more recent videos! I know it isn't easy changing the tone of your voice consistently for script reads but it really does make a difference that can be appreciated by the average listener/viewer.
Hell yeah! You’re getting really good at this video making stuff so keep up the good work buddy. I think they are great to watch late at night and fall asleep too sometimes. It’s sort of like getting transported to a much better time in history lol.
I've been out in two rough weather days on Lake Huron. Well familiar with waves breaking over the bow. The one storrm a Canadian weather buoy, center of Lake Huron was reporting 9 to 12 meter seas, low mean average. One in ten 25% larger, one in a hundred 50% larger. There were 65 footers on Lake Huron that night. I was 100 miles south of that buoy, 3 to 5 meter seas, but still I saw breaking seas curl entirely over the sailboat, land on it as hard as a freight train .
I always found the similarities between this and the Cyprus disaster interesting. They were built at around the same time and almost certainly foundered for the same reason: a failure to put canvas over their hatch covers which shared the same flawed design. Yet they feel like they are from different eras because Cyprus sank on her second voyage, and the Steinbrenner was in service for over 50 years
When will people learn: complacency kills. It doesn't matter if the day is unseasonably warm and the water smooth as a millpond: at this point I've heard - and experienced - that often enough to correlate that with meaning a pretty big storm is on the way. If the NWS says an inbound storm shouldn't be that bad, even if it's not, treat it like it's going to be. *Secure those daggon hatches tight as a rock before you go anywhere. Give older ships the proper maintenance needed.* And then one shouldn't have any problems.
A good title for a book about a shipwreck on the lakes would be, "From mill pond to maelstrom". Because most freighters that sank in storms left port in calm weather.
Love the channel and love the storytelling. Any possibility of doing a story on the Hewletts? I remember the first time I saw them in the early nineties at the Pittsburgh Conneaut dock in Conneaut Ohio they were in the process of being removed. They look like giant monsters with these tentacles towering above the water. Would love to know and see more about how they operated, and The Operators themselves Those days are gone and apparently the remaining Hewletts,stired in Cleveland, are being sold for scrap
Unfortunately the history of lake freighters has always been about money over safety. I wonder if the savings they thought they were making in the end out weighed the final cost. Of course every life lost is worth more than any savings these companies made. God bless the lost on the lakes!
So many tales that are damn tear jerkers. I cannot imagine how much fear someone could get hit with in these circumstances (seriously, I white knuckle on the Manly ferry). No way I could ever have taken a maritime job. Fascinating material well told as always.
I've been binge watching Big Old Boats today. The reason i can watch is because there's no way in hell I will ever be on a big old boat in a body of water that I can not see land on either side! Having said that it seems there is a design flaw in these lake freighters, one that rears its head in a bad storm with heavy waves. That and one last run of the season. Maybe these ships are in such a need of repair by that one last run that, well you get it. God bless those lost at sea.
The important thing in nearly all such stories is that: 1) hatch covers must be so flimsy or even unattached that they welcome the sea into the ship; and 2) at least most of the lifeboats need to jam in deploying or otherwise become unusable. Perhaps if these two well-known, oft-repeated elements were controlled for in the design, engineering, and operation of these vessels, there would have been far fewer such losses.
Why would hatches and everything else not be completely secured in port every time? What special kind of idiocy would defer that action until a vessel was underway? Have regs changed to address that? The only possible non-excuse might be the labor involved. Can anyone clarify?
The only reason not to close covers before sailing would be time and time is money. Always follow money. The hatch covers are a poor design which should be BOLTED or otherwise positively retained buy many independent fasteners.
10:38 something I didn't really realize until the narrator said there were no tunnels below deck to traverse the length of the ship like vessels built later. Capt must have often got a cold meal unless he felt like making the hike to the aft. I've been down in those tunnels and they are scary yet in a way give you sense of the boat if that makes sense. Going up top even in rain or snow must have sucked
I am no expert on Lakers but there were a lot of considerations to their design. Many of them had to go through the Soo Locks, and this restricted their beam. They also had to get into some tight ports. How they were loaded and unloaded was a factor, with docks like those at Duluth and Superior. There also were Hulett unloaders. Those, or certain kinds of retractable bucket unloaders. Today, many Lakers are self unloaders.
Those freshwater waves look so close together and steep they just seem to crawl together up the freeboard until rolling across the deck of iron ore tankers for what looks like it's gonna be non-stop . . . At least for too damned long and too damned often. I'll bet Superior gets real cold in a lifeboat on a stormy winter night.
Would like to preface this by saying I love the channel, so eloquently written with soothing narration. I'll continue by posing a question, these great lakes freighters have a great length with an incredibly narrow beam,they look delicate. How can such a design be allowed?
The Sykes is still in use today and is in process thru Michigan/Superior right now. Tho it is still above the water, it probably has some great stories from 1949 when it was built.
Thank you so much for sharing. There aren’t any videos out there on this ship other than this! Thank you. Plus no books that I’m aware of. I’ve always loved reading about the Steinbrenner or hearing about it. Does Stonehouse’s book also include the Coast Guard report? Plus I’ve also found Norm Bragg’s story interesting. I think Arthur Morse is the one who let the starboard lifeboat loose. Plus, did you know that there were 3 more Henry Steinbrenner’s after this first one? That’s what makes it so much more intriguing to me!
Great Lake Freighters will always be cool. Especially the ones with the Pilot House Forward & Engine Cabins aft arrangement. Also, 13:52, The chapter called Ripped Open. It reminded me of a certain UA-cam series called Murder Drones, and specifically On Episode 8 (Spoilers for anyone who hasn’t seen Murder Drones), Cyn, the Antagonist, starts ripping open N’s chest, and she keeps saying “Let me In” over and over and over again. That’s what it must have been like between the SS Henry Steinbrenner & Lake Superior. The waters & waves of Lake Superior continuing to pound the Harry Steinbrenner’s deck, continuously trying to GET IN. And unfortunately, it did get in.
My great-great grandfather, Robert F. Leng, was the captain on board the Joseph H. Thompson, one of the boats that responded and aided in rescue efforts of the Steinbrenners crew.
It was pretty emotional when I met this lady one time, her dad had been one of those lost on the Steinbrenner and we immediately connected through that shared tragedy.
Bragg’s last words have always gotten me. He knew the odds of surviving another wreck in a storm like that were next to nothing. Great video.
Big Old Boats is easily becoming my favorite maratime disasters yt show. Brick Immortar is very good, but BOB just keeps putting out and the content and quality are top notch.
He has a superb, pleasant speaking voice, too.
Definitely one of my favourite great lakes frieght steamer disaster channels that concentrate on well documented sinkings with emphasis those caused by an initially seemingly harmlessly mundane human error from the second half of the last century
Brick Immortar is fantastic for deep technical dives into disasters. BOB is more focused on the story telling.
Brick Immortar needs to learn to put more inflection in his narration. His content is interesting, but his videos are way too long for how soporific his voice is.
Im subscribed to both, lol. I personally think they are both very good channels and worthy of falling asleep to. @TBone-bz9mp
She was barely seaworthy. Her brave crew fought a losing battle. Another Great Lakes tragedy...thank you for making it so very real, for bringing us on board.🌹⚓
Sadly, my great uncle was one of the ones who perished on the Henry Steinbrenner. It happened before I was born so I never knew him, but I know my grandmother was deeply affected by the loss of her brother…
RIP. Thanks for sharing!
There was always someone missing at the Sunday dinner and holiday dinner tables, right until the last of his generation died. 💔 My great-uncle was KIA in WWII. His last surviving brother died in 2021. When he died, I finally felt like I could lay Uncle Harold to rest, the only great-uncle I didn't get to meet. It does affect the family for generations.
Wow. Sorry for your loss. RIP❤
@@kimfleury
Anyone else here absolutely terrified by the sea/lake, but are addicted to this channel? Just subbed. Good job.
I’m actually considering a trip next Spring to the Great Lakes due to this channel.
Bragg had a really tragic story. He survived one shipwreck only to die on another. That's some really bad luck.
It’s like the Lakes said to Bragg, “You may have survived once, but we have already laid claim to you.”
Take a hint.
@@rottenroads1982 - Spooky…
@@rottenroads1982 heh, if you stay a sailor until you die... really ups the odds of dying in a shipwreck.
he was the bad luck
The fact that lessons weren't learned from the accident is the even bigger tragedy
My Great Uncle Calvin Swartz was one of the men who went down on this ship leaving widow and 2 small children at home. Thank you, I have always heard stories about Uncle Cal!
There's something very wrong with an industry when an accepted part of a crewmans job was that they may die when their vessel sinks out from under them!
Obviously insufficient open lifeboats and open life rafts killed countless seamen whom sought sanctuary in them.
Had the bosses, directors and rule writers, or their offspring been on board during emergency evacuations, things would have rapidly improved...
Edited for typo.
There were no other options in regard to lifeboats. Open life boats were still in use on the ocean liners of the Atlantic in 1953. One can point blame on those who did not maintain the ship properly, but they had the best that was available in 1953.
@@20thCenturyManTrad With respect, you're missing the point!
Open lifeboats shouldn't have been the best things available in 1953.
Covered, enclosed lifeboats actually save lives and are better in every way imaginable than open lifeboats.
Enclosed lifeboats don't throw out their passengers if they're overturned, they don't get swamped and sink, they offer weather protection to the survivors on board.
No one sets out in bad sea states or atrocious weather in open boats, but during a maritime emergency, bad sea states and atrocious weather are likely to be the cause of the emergency that endangers vessels and necessities passengers and crew launching lifeboats!
The same conditions that ssnk their huge vessel is what they're now expected to endure in open boats...
@@felixcat9318 "Should have had" isn't an answer. It's like saying they should have had better steel in 1912 when the Titanic was made, it would have prevented the ship breaking apart, it just hadn't been developed. I mean they should had vaccines for cholera in the 1800s, but they didn't, it hadn't been developed yet. I don't deny that closed lifeboats are better, but they didn't have them, you can't pin that on anything but the walk of time. You can only have what was the best of your time.
@@felixcat931890% of everything you use in your day to day life has come to you by water. Whether the raw materials or components at some point in production or the entire finished product, almost everything in your home, vehicle or public transit, and in your workplace has come to you by water. So you're part of the industry, paying for the safety equipment.
@20thCenturyManTrad open lifeboats were a thing because passengers and crew needed to row to keep the boat steady in rougher seas.
The more I see of these bulk freighters sinking in bad weather, the more I believe its a fair weather design. They either break apart or get flooded when the deck hatches fail and the deck gets inevitably flooded. Yes, not all of them end tragically, but considering that they are built to carry loose heavy loads that are stored exactly amidships, and then designing the rest of the ship in a fashion akin to a teeter-totter in heavy seas...I mean, I am no engineer nor a sailor...but just from the outside I question the physics of it. And then there is not even a secure way across, almost as if it was intended for the engine room and bridge (and officers and deck hands) to loose contact during any storm...you know, when contact between them is the most vital.
And then to top it off, lets skimp on the maintenance and life craft while demanding the crew to "make one last run of the season".
The last one run is indeed a theme...
I also question the design of a ship that does not have internal passageways... Just get out there and hold on to the railing I guess...
@@GeoffreyWarewell where’s all the cargo gonna go if their taking up space with secure internal pathways
After the loss of the Edmund Fitzgerald, one maritime expert stated that the Great Lakes freighter is nothing but a motorised barge, virtually without any watertight integrity. Theoretically, a one-inch puncture in the cargo hold will sink it, he said.
@@GeoffreyWarethere's no railing except stern and fore. The rest is chain.
As a one time employee of Steinbrenner(2 years on the Kinsman Independent(1988-1989) and also knowing someone who had a relative who perished on the Henry,l have some perspective on this.The KI was relatively modern and powerful boat, whereas the 2nd Henry (which succeeded the lost HS),was of a similar vintage,vastly underpowered,in similar disrepair and just as ripe for bad weather...l was always amazed she lasted until retirement and the scrapheap.
Those triple expansion boats always seemed to be fighting a losing battle in the power department.
@@luketdrifter2100 Triple expansion is not the best but it works and the technology is (at that time) well known and reliable.
The Liberty ships were all equipped with a triple expansion, not a turbine … for a reason.
@@luketdrifter2100better chill 😎
@@advorak8529 yeah because it was cheap and easy to maintain. They were under powered by a lot. Liberty ships were built to be expendable. Thats why they were built the way they were.
Wow
"It's been good to know ya" is a line in the Gordon Lightfoot song about the Fitz. Gotta feeling that quote has been said alot, sadly.
It's originally from Woody Guthrie, an Oklahoma Dustbowl refugee and folksinger.
@@kskssxoxskskss2189Woody probably heard it from someone else 😂
We only know about that quote because Dennis Hale, the only survivor of the Daniel J Morrell, wrote it in his book. And the only reason he wrote the book is because he suffered "survivor's guilt" to the extent that he was debilitated from it, and finally his psychologist told him he had to write about it to get it out in the open.
@@kskssxoxskskss2189.........And I'll bet it's still been said alot long before him, or before any of us were even born. Alotta folks after we die will say it too.
You missed the point where I claimed GL was the first and only one to say that. Or that GL 'owned' it. Wait!!! I never claimed that, did I??? Oops.
@@kimfleury.........A statement like that has been said alot on them boats that sink.
I hope he found Peace.
Watching Big Old Boats 25 seconds after an upload? Splendid
As a Atlantic Ocean sailor-I am always at awe of the mysterious happenings in the great lakes
You do a terrific job of telling these really tragic tales of our treacherous Great Lakes. I subscribed 🏭
Your choice of music, archival footage, etc really give you a unique tone. I even went and found the music ghost hunt from Restless Moons because of your use. That band and/or guy does some good stuff. It gives your channel stories an eerie nostalgia quality to them, is the only way i can describe it
I live in Minnesota so I've heard of the boat but never the story. Thanks for this. Excellent story teller. The Sykes one of the prettiest boats on the lakes.
16:47 starts the transition between chapters… i swear, the sounds and images you displayed creates such a perfectly eerie ambience. I even rewinded 🙃 thank you for these high quality videos!
Here in the U.K l've become very interested in stories from the Great Lakes & their ships, mainly through The Edmund Fitzgerald & Gordon Lightfoot's classic ballad.
A friend & myself visited the U.S three times, the last took us to Seattle & Vancouver & on the flight home we stopped over at Chicago for a few hours & while there took a walk down to the Michigan waterfront. Back then l didn't really have any knowledge of the lakes so I didn't pay as much attention to that visit as l would now but l'm glad of the memory.
BOB's is an excellent channel, keep up the good work.
Such super production quality and detail content with ‘Big Old Boats’ keep up the great work!
the switch from 'nice and sunny' to 'black and white' in the editing was a small but cool detail to the overall video, i've been binging this channel recently between work and noticed that having the visuals line up with the story on those days when you have time to watch really changes the story into a 'spooky story' to a panic-inducing 'oh god i could imagine that'
I love this channel and your work. These stories of ships I've never heard of is what makes this channel stand out above all the others. Well done.
An interesting thing about the Sykes is that other than the self-unloading boom and raised smokestack, she's mostly original. Never lengthened.
@@bluerazor7049 Ahh big Wil
75 years old and still a great lady!
She sure is!
Those ore carriers are frightening.
I prefer the term "beastly"
An excellent video as always.
Would you ever consider doing a video on the loss of the SS Marine Electric in February 1983, I recently finished Until The Sea Shall Free Them, by Robert Frump, that is why I am asking. Rest in peace to the lost crew of the Henry Steinbrenner.
Seconded
My teacher's husband was in the same union as the SS Marine Electric and SS Poet guys - tragedies caused by awful maintenance; his ship was rusty & run down too.
The Great Lakes have extreme weather. Those men were brave and tough. God bless them all.
Just wanted to say I love your videos! By far the best historical boat videos I've come across!
I have listened to some of the other sea disaster channels, But you are by Far the Best, I truly appreciate you
Thanks for posting so much about the great lakes, living about 2 miles from lake Michigan it's always nice to hear so much about the lakes :3
Thanks!
Thank you!
Great video! I watched the ones about the Carl D. Bradley and the Daniel J Morrell. The Steinerbreiner seem to have a lot going against it. I don't know if you have done videos on the Edmund Fitzgerald, Kamloops or the Benjamin Noble, but with that being said, you have yourself a new subscriber. Can't wait to see what you have next.
You have such a soothing voice! Not only do I learn something new each time I watch your channel, I get to listen to your amazing voice and relax 😊
My late father worked on tug boats performing towing and marine salvage with a company out of Amherstburg, Ontario on the lower Detroit River. One job in the '70s had them righting a Laker that capsized in one of the Soo Locks. I can't remember the name of the ship unfortunately. My dad kept many photos from his time on the lakes and some great books about shipwrecks such as the Steinbrenner. Sadly he eventually sold off the books and photos in order to stay afloat after he stopped working.
This is so well done. The end with the story/quote from Bragg was perfect. Great work here.
Your ability to tell the story in such a manner that draws us into it is amazing. Keep up the good work! 👍
I adore the Great Lakes content on this channel!!
Another well produced and informative video with great visuals. I always enjoy your engrossing storytelling. Cheers
It's really something how a "Lake" is as dangerous, or even more dangerous than the ocean.
The waves come more frequently because they hit one shore then return to the other shore more rapidly than ocean waves hit opposite shores.
@@kimfleury Thanks for info.......
@@kimfleury Also, what amounts to a hurricane hitting a smaller amount of water than an ocean. Much easier to whip a smaller amount of water into a frenzy with the same force.
These lakes are dangerous because they get severe thunderstorms that form upwind over land in the midwest, where spring to fall the weather is volatile and known for some of the strongest storms on earth. After peak severe weather season and into mid-late fall, they get similarly volatile squalls when it's still warm during the day and when jet streams of cold air from northern canada are more frequent - when those clash with warm weather you get sustained squalls with gusts creating very high waves for far longer than the more violent spring/summer storms.
Basically, because the Oceans are so large and so uniformly cool, they very much prevent the potential for instability and storms/wind. Any real bad weather/waves on the ocean have to be from a tropical storm/cyclone moving far into cooler waters which is both not very common for the N Atlantic and also easily and routinely planned for and avoided since like the 1950s when a lot of money was spent to improve national weather services. Oh and also lake freighters were complete deathtraps up until the 1980s by the time all the dangerous broke operators were bankrupt.
@@Demoralized88 Thanks for info.
I remember in high school learning about the "Lake Effect" from the great lakes and how it affected the snow around the area.
This ship is named after the Grandfather of Baseball legend Geroge Michael Steinbrenner III
Couldn’t be any other family. The Steinbrenners ran a Great Lakes shipping company.
@OllieRamone true, she even ran for aforementioned company (Kinsman Transit)
Yes their tribe owns just about... everything, well everything that's is highly profitable
Baseball was just a side hustle for him.
@@ericreese7792 A side hustle?
I live in Michigan and sail on the Great Lakes. You take weather forecasts seriously as in many ways sailing on the Great Lakes can be more challenging than on the ocean.
Stories like these remind me of how weather forecasting has changed over the decades. A common thread seems to be that the ship leaves Duluth or Superior as the low pressure center comes out of the Plains. The warm front passes over and the ship experiences warm temperatures and south-southeast breezes. As the cold front approaches winds out of the south become stronger. Storms also develop out ahead of the cold front. Behind the cold, strong northwesterly winds drive the seas up. Anywhere along the cold front those old Lakers would be at risk.
Even into the 1970s weather forecasting was still something of an art.
2:00 What do you say to a radio call like that, what can you? Hearing someones last words like that.
Why does anyone wait until the situation is that bad to request assistance? I’ve noticed airline pilots have a tendency to this also. Is it a personality trait common to those attracted to risky leadership positions?
Love these series. Having grown up in the St Clair River and now live in Port Huron I love these stories!
Dude these videos are so good the editing the music the story everything. Keep doing more and more. I do have one question why haven’t you done a Fitz video
7:19-7:28 Source: Great Lakes Adventure, the ship in the video is called "William Clay Ford"
Thank you for your content. Your hard work, research and time you put into your videos is amazing.
Babe wake up Big Old Boats just uploaded!
Excellent, job well done. Time for me to rediscover your channel. The story captivated my attention. Thank you.
Shout out to the content creator for changing his narration style in the more recent videos! I know it isn't easy changing the tone of your voice consistently for script reads but it really does make a difference that can be appreciated by the average listener/viewer.
Hell yeah! You’re getting really good at this video making stuff so keep up the good work buddy. I think they are great to watch late at night and fall asleep too sometimes. It’s sort of like getting transported to a much better time in history lol.
I've been out in two rough weather days on Lake Huron. Well familiar with waves breaking over the bow. The one storrm a Canadian weather buoy, center of Lake Huron was reporting 9 to 12 meter seas, low mean average. One in ten 25% larger, one in a hundred 50% larger. There were 65 footers on Lake Huron that night. I was 100 miles south of that buoy, 3 to 5 meter seas, but still I saw breaking seas curl entirely over the sailboat, land on it as hard as a freight train .
5:02 “despite considerable effort the salvage WAS successful” were they trying to make it not successful?
..needs an editor!
It makes sense cuz normally they play Scrooge McDuck and don't spend money at all.
I always found the similarities between this and the Cyprus disaster interesting. They were built at around the same time and almost certainly foundered for the same reason: a failure to put canvas over their hatch covers which shared the same flawed design. Yet they feel like they are from different eras because Cyprus sank on her second voyage, and the Steinbrenner was in service for over 50 years
When will people learn: complacency kills. It doesn't matter if the day is unseasonably warm and the water smooth as a millpond: at this point I've heard - and experienced - that often enough to correlate that with meaning a pretty big storm is on the way. If the NWS says an inbound storm shouldn't be that bad, even if it's not, treat it like it's going to be. *Secure those daggon hatches tight as a rock before you go anywhere. Give older ships the proper maintenance needed.* And then one shouldn't have any problems.
George Steinbrenner"s (N.Y Yankees owner) grand father, his dad's name was also Henry as was his oldest son.
Every time I hear about one of these old lake freighter accidents, I think about how abjectly inadequate the bow rafts were as a rescue device.
Big old boats and scary interesting are my favourite channels
Your videos are so compelling. So many tragedies on the Lakes and seas. Not much chance for survival. So sad for all involved. 😢😢😢😢
Thanks for the outstanding content, A long-time subscriber
A good title for a book about a shipwreck on the lakes would be, "From mill pond to maelstrom". Because most freighters that sank in storms left port in calm weather.
I was fortunate enough to catch the Wilfred Sykes in the St. Clair River Basin a few years ago.
Beautiful boat.
Thank you for this story....amazing men who fought for her !!!
Another exceptional video.
Love the channel and love the storytelling. Any possibility of doing a story on the Hewletts? I remember the first time I saw them in the early nineties at the Pittsburgh Conneaut dock in Conneaut Ohio they were in the process of being removed. They look like giant monsters with these tentacles towering above the water. Would love to know and see more about how they operated, and The Operators themselves Those days are gone and apparently the remaining Hewletts,stired in Cleveland, are being sold for scrap
This channel is the best
Unfortunately the history of lake freighters has always been about money over safety. I wonder if the savings they thought they were making in the end out weighed the final cost. Of course every life lost is worth more than any savings these companies made. God bless the lost on the lakes!
I love this format you got
So many tales that are damn tear jerkers. I cannot imagine how much fear someone could get hit with in these circumstances (seriously, I white knuckle on the Manly ferry). No way I could ever have taken a maritime job. Fascinating material well told as always.
I've been binge watching Big Old Boats today. The reason i can watch is because there's no way in hell I will ever be on a big old boat in a body of water that I can not see land on either side! Having said that it seems there is a design flaw in these lake freighters, one that rears its head in a bad storm with heavy waves. That and one last run of the season. Maybe these ships are in such a need of repair by that one last run that, well you get it. God bless those lost at sea.
Love this channel!!!
Thank you
Great job on this one, extremely interesting
As always great video, thanks.
The important thing in nearly all such stories is that: 1) hatch covers must be so flimsy or even unattached that they welcome the sea into the ship; and 2) at least most of the lifeboats need to jam in deploying or otherwise become unusable. Perhaps if these two well-known, oft-repeated elements were controlled for in the design, engineering, and operation of these vessels, there would have been far fewer such losses.
Another great video , thank you
Love your shows..you do great work on these . stories
Great video. Fine job.
Why would hatches and everything else not be completely secured in port every time? What special kind of idiocy would defer that action until a vessel was underway? Have regs changed to address that? The only possible non-excuse might be the labor involved. Can anyone clarify?
The only reason not to close covers before sailing would be time and time is money. Always follow money. The hatch covers are a poor design which should be BOLTED or otherwise positively retained buy many independent fasteners.
10:38 something I didn't really realize until the narrator said there were no tunnels below deck to traverse the length of the ship like vessels built later. Capt must have often got a cold meal unless he felt like making the hike to the aft.
I've been down in those tunnels and they are scary yet in a way give you sense of the boat if that makes sense.
Going up top even in rain or snow must have sucked
I am no expert on Lakers but there were a lot of considerations to their design. Many of them had to go through the Soo Locks, and this restricted their beam. They also had to get into some tight ports. How they were loaded and unloaded was a factor, with docks like those at Duluth and Superior. There also were Hulett unloaders. Those, or certain kinds of retractable bucket unloaders. Today, many Lakers are self unloaders.
Love these stories!!! Thank you 😊
Honey, wake up. Another Big Old Boats video is on.
Uuuugh that meme
Great vid. My brother worked for Great Lakes Towing in Buffalo, NY. I was familiar with some of the names of the freighters and locations.
Those freshwater waves look so close together and steep they just seem to crawl together up the freeboard until rolling across the deck of iron ore tankers for what looks like it's gonna be non-stop . . . At least for too damned long and too damned often. I'll bet Superior gets real cold in a lifeboat on a stormy winter night.
Well produced and researched 👍🏻
Oh, btw, radar is ALWAYS necessary. Complacency kills.
Great Video Bob 👍
Another excellent presentation 👍
Thanks 👍
Loving your videos!🎉
Excellent video!
Took some hard time to get better hatch covers.
Would like to preface this by saying I love the channel, so eloquently written with soothing narration. I'll continue by posing a question, these great lakes freighters have a great length with an incredibly narrow beam,they look delicate. How can such a design be allowed?
The Sykes is still in use today and is in process thru Michigan/Superior right now. Tho it is still above the water, it probably has some great stories from 1949 when it was built.
Been in a small boat in a squall.
It's funny how you get resigned to fate.
Unseaworthy; no radar ; no bad weather preparation.
Great story thank you
Thank you so much for sharing. There aren’t any videos out there on this ship other than this! Thank you. Plus no books that I’m aware of. I’ve always loved reading about the Steinbrenner or hearing about it. Does Stonehouse’s book also include the Coast Guard report? Plus I’ve also found Norm Bragg’s story interesting. I think Arthur Morse is the one who let the starboard lifeboat loose. Plus, did you know that there were 3 more Henry Steinbrenner’s after this first one? That’s what makes it so much more intriguing to me!
BOB is FASCINATINGLY EXCITING 💦 deep, human and poetic !!! BRAVO ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐
Great Lake Freighters will always be cool. Especially the ones with the Pilot House Forward & Engine Cabins aft arrangement.
Also, 13:52, The chapter called Ripped Open. It reminded me of a certain UA-cam series called Murder Drones, and specifically On Episode 8 (Spoilers for anyone who hasn’t seen Murder Drones), Cyn, the Antagonist, starts ripping open N’s chest, and she keeps saying “Let me In” over and over and over again.
That’s what it must have been like between the SS Henry Steinbrenner & Lake Superior. The waters & waves of Lake Superior continuing to pound the Harry Steinbrenner’s deck, continuously trying to GET IN. And unfortunately, it did get in.
It's tragic how many ships and crews would come to the aid of their fellows, only to meet the same fate in a later season.
Another fabulous story about humble men just trying to make a living 💔💔💔.