I saw a comment on a video which really hit home for me. “ The marvel movie phase 4 is like playing a game where you have completed the main storyline and now your grinding to get 100% completion.”
I loved WandaVision tho cuz of the mystery of wtf was going on plus Wanda going insane was entertaining. I just hated the line “They’ll never know what you did for them” or something like that cuz wtf does she mean acting like Wanda didn’t just mind control an entire town
WandaVision was good but it was the first show to actively affect a movie, MoM was bad mainly because we already saw this Wanda on the show, it was sorta lame in the movie compared to the show.
@@itizwhatitiz9560 the problem is that they changed Wanda in Dr.Strange back to a villain like they had no clue what to do with her character but she did make a dope villain
@@theoutsiderjess1869 her idea was cool but I didn't like her as a villain, she's the opposite of the usually great villains we get in MCU, her motivation was illogical, weirdly dramatic and even the CGI wasn't that good with her. She shouldn't have been the main villain.
My opinion on the MCU is that the cameo trick is over used and there are almost no stakes. When the story's are bad they just add a popular cameo and they expect the audience will watch it. The problem with the multiverse is there are almost no stakes. The multiverse is just so big that the threads do not matter mutch.
Yeah it's hard to conceptualize the entirety of everything being erased or destroyed. That there are universes going to be destroyed or have been already. The stakes are big, but hard to understand and the MCU puts no work into making us care besides talking of "billions of billions lives" unseen, unheard and never thought of again.
@@DougieYT Don't forget iron girl (or whatever), new black panther, mighty thor, sam (replacing Hawkeye) She-her Hulk (replacing Hulk), and Wanda... Ig captain falcon is still male lmao XD
I agree that the problem is the Storyline, or lack of. It's related to what's wrong with Phoenix/Jean X-Men movies. We got the stories of the team working together, tackling difficult situations and being individuals that just happened to also have powers. Then Phoenix, then we had the emotions and stakes. The first 2 phases of the MCU introduced us to each character, how they saw the world and themselves. They also had growth, be it powers, abilities, understanding, or personal... but there was character development. Now it seems they are trying to jump ahead to the ending story without the through line like you mentioned. Love this series. Thank you
The whole problem boils down to one thing for both Film and Comics, Bad Writing. If a Story and Characters are Written well people will enjoy it and want more. Its Rare in the Comics, but even more rare on Screen now.
The snap is a joke now the infinity stones are a joke. It's an ice cream shop in the MCU. 'Infinity Cones'? That little thing takes out the gravitas of what happened.
Also giving it a stupid name with the Blip. Good thinking Marvel, take possibly your most emotional and traumatizing moment in this universe and use it for a bunch of stupid jokes, great job 🤦🏻♂️
this video truly highlights the reason why we love the mcu and why stopped liking them precisely imo, bringing up the impact of phase 3, genuinely can relate that phase 3 was the anchor point since alot of people started to care about the MCU at that time, especially civil war era
Ant Man connection was that he broke into the new Avengers facility established at the end of Age of Ultron which led to Falcon getting him involved in Civil War.
An additional problem or related problem is setting these schedule of movies out in these huge batches with definite release dates. It leaves no room for alteration for the most part. And if things like I don't know pandemics or people dying occur you leave yourself no room to deal with these unforeseen circumstances and it becomes a house of cards. They are switching things around and you start to disassemble what was so tightly assembled and you run the risk of things being misaligned and consequential.
I feel like you are on target about the story. Most definitely people drop off of the MCU because they feel like it's changing the characters or not serving a purpose. I feel like the truth is that they are going through comics to help reach the next phases and that's where the story breaks off. The fact that there is no time and effort to build up these characters and the timing for many of them feels like an affront to many only makes it worse. Then again, comics don't transfer well directly and we have seen that too many a time.
@@TheUnseenPath it was never about "the wokeness" that changed it considering the Ultimate universe and surprisingly the animated movies tackled just as much of the same content. It's the falling out from having a huge budget masterpiece to restarting from the ground up that nobody wants to deal with.
I agree too Benny I feel like this what is happening with Marvel, DC, and now Star Wars. They are forgetting that we went to see these movies was because there was a connecting story to them now its just we are going to make a She Hulk show because people like She Hulk and we need a Marvel Show for Disney Plus. It would have been nice to at least have an after credits scene where Sam shows up at Jens office to talk about starting the New Avengers. If they would have done that and also not make the whole show a joke about CGI is too expensive I think it would have been much better.
while i enjoyed shehulk my issue was they took a legit comic group intellgensia modok's group and used it to troll the incels and the moronic m-she-u channels on here which to me was low hanging fruit, so instead of focusing on the plot built, they decided to be petty and troll....how do you show youre "above the hate" by doing that? they just gave both groups more fuel to the fire.... and they also caved into the cameo fans and channels again instead of the movies and tv shows...because of these things its failing and how do i know this? in this video shang-chi is the most beloved movie of phase 4 that had none of the previous points, loki even though it was a time travel/multiverse the same thing....gotc vol 3 was beloved for the same reason and in that movie it took a shot at the mcu in a good way unlike shehulk's shot, it was just a joke in the movie not taking up the whole plot and deadpool is a fourth wall breaking character but imagine if they took his villians built them up and then made them a internet group of westboro church members who said deadpool is the sign of the end times and made central to the plot even thou it makes sense for a character like deadpool? it would tasteless and would of ruined the whole movie
I agree with the interconnectedness. My favorite Punisher run was the like 5 issue story when he goes Captain Punisher and then fights Bucky at the Licoln Memorial. All immediately after the death of Steve Rogers back in the 2000s
Debating Joker, Batgirl, Zeb Wells Spider-Man, Green Arrow or Wally next... Who do you guys think? Or do you have someone else you hope I have an issue with
Could've had Kang be the one causing the incursions with his super tech because he wants to rule over the world's, and this is the most effective way to get rid of opposition
I think that's the direction they're going. He's really the only villain they've set up who could be capable of it. I'm not sure how I feel about Kang being responsible but I'm not entirely against it. I'm just not totally sold on it. Depends on how it's implemented.
@@lilsabin he should've been the character to tie it all together since, as established in Ragnorak, he keeps track of all dangerous magical beings and situations around the world. It would make sense for him to appear.
@@DavidMartinez-ce3lp yup… Ant- man shoulda been stuck there and in after credit scene , they show dr strange opening a portal and getting him by saying , we don’t have time … This alone woulda been HUGE 🙂
This is what I've been saying. Phase 4 would be good if kept the story going, but with everything being so isolated with little to no connections to the previous story. Phase 4 overall feels pointless. In my opinion I believe that Phase 4 should have been an epilogue. It should've tied up any and all loose plot threads from the previous saga and started the process of introducing the Incursion story plots.
I agree. i'll also add that phase 4 should have been the last phase. I know it is hard to hear but nothing last forever. The MCU should have ended with a bang, now it is slowly burning out.
@@kaiserzaiser5002it’s not they’re rebuilding, and they have been hinting at kang…. Phase 1 was barely connected. Of course it’s gonna be different now because they need to create a new story
Makes me feel like if phase 2 had been individual movies for each of the Guardians of the Galaxy before releasing Guardians of the Galaxy they could have set up a lot more storylines that wouldn’t feel rushed or out of the blue
Shang-Chi would've worked better as a show. That way they wouldn't need to go so big scale and do all this CGI stuff. And he could interact with other street level heroes like Spiderman or Daredevil.
You hit the nail right on the head! But there's only ONE thing I just want them to do, and that's choosing "quality" over "quantity," too many projects in so little time that needs to change, that's just my opinion.
The snap would’ve been such a good movie to bring up the effects of the snap and have doctor strange feel the consequence of letting it happen or something like that
At this point, if Marvel made an adaptation of Watchmen, it would surely be this: Ozymandias: "Now that New York has been destroyed, the world powers will put aside their differences and unite against the threat I myself created to save them. I know millions have died by my hand, BUT BY MY HAND I HAVE ALSO SAVED BILLIO...Rorschach, did you just fart?"
I agree 100%. I will add that I think it's OK to have a few things that aren't connected. Like if they never intend for she-hulk or moon knight to be apart of the avengers, fine. Those shows would have to be fantastic on their own. The issue is that they weren't. Like you said she-hulk was mediocre sitcom and moon knight didn't actually show moon knight much. When you add to it that they aren't connected to everything else that's going on, it's a double whammy of negativity.
Ant man actually beating kang on his own is hilarious, i remember watching an animated avengers show called "earths mightiest heroes: the avengers" and it was extremely good because of its storyline and character portrayals which even had an amazing story featuring kang
I believe that before Phase 4 started, or at the very beginning, Feige himself saif that the whole arc leading to a big villian was no longer their goal and that they were looking for shorter arcs, and projects that were not directly related to each other. Like now ypu have a muñtiversal thing gping on, along with an earth story (secret invasion & the falcon story line), a probable mystic story (with Shang-Chi), a universal story (Eternals), etc. I believe many of the characters will come together in the next Avengers movie, but not their stories.
It feels like the MCU stopped taking itself seriously and completely left plausibility at the door. It's hard to suspend your disbelief and really enjoy then film when the even the characters don't.
I thought werewolf by night was pretty good. Also I'd like to see more with the monster characters and possibly after Deadpool 3 maybe tie in the monster characters and possibly lead to king Deadpool.
I'm one of the people who watched Endgame without watching the whole mcu movies that came before. I LOVED IT. Endgame is the reason why I've become a fan of Marvel and superheroes. I wish it happened years before
Narratively I agree with you. There's the whole business side of marvel and there's a lot of other weeds that we can get into, but if we're just focusing on the story of the MCU I agree 100%.
My main thing now they have gotten too big and are now putting stuff out on too many platforms and trying to keep the cohesive story going For example putting a major reveal in the Guardians of the Galaxy Christmas special, or putting Kang in Loki it's getting to a point where you have to watch stuff on Disney plus inorder to understand what is going to happen to the next movie also the fact the movies have to build up the next big bad in Kang but also be really inconsistent with his power scaling like apparently he's so strong he managed to wipe out the avengers in multiple timelines to the point where he doesn't even remember how many times he's done it and then having him lose to Ant-Man?
This, this is the only thing with also Disney pushing them to put out double the content faster. It's awful to have great moments scattered around 12 movies/shows Even in Phase 5, 2 years and 5 movies, 7 shows... TOO MUCH
Exactly. I watched Multiverse of Madness and needed to watch Wandavision. Started She-Hulk and try referenced Abomination's pussy in Shang Chi. I feel like I NEED to watch EVERYTHING just to to be emotionally invested.
Idk if this is a hot take but Thor: the dark world is way better than Thor:Love and Thunder. It makes no sense how they fumbled one of the greatest Thor stories.
I just wanna add that I actually know someone that went to Endgame without seeing the other movies. They love movies overall (almost will call him a film buff). He was completely lost as you'd expect. He had a fun time because it looked visually pleasing and character interactions were engaging but he never felt the stakes or story because you would need prior knowledge to understand them. Because of that, he gave it a 6/10. Wasn't in love with the plot but enjoyed the time travel and action sequences.
Endgame is the second part of one movie though. That's like watching only part 2 of deathly hallows... You can't expect to understand anything in Endgame without infinity war.
I would add that having a streaming service and that being on a streaming service has made them stumble on their storytelling as well as bad management with the woman who was overseeing vfx along with coming off of a pandemic when almost everything was shut down the whole world was shut down. Also the death of Chadwick Bozeman was also a problem as well too.
One of the most frustrating things about Disney's influence in the MCU today is the way gore and blood are heavily censored in fights, with "At the Multiverse of Madness" being a rare exception. I mean, am I the only one who remembers that scene from "The First Avenger" (made when Disney wasn't in charge) where a Hydra agent is completely torn apart by a propeller?
Yeah but I don't remember it being super bloody to be fair. Dude just got shredded. Imo the boys is gore and the MCU has never come close to any of that
@@BlueCheeseLucci It wasn't that explicit, but considering how reluctant Disney is to showing blood, I was genuinely shocked after seeing a guy turn into red gas in a universe in which every character has to throw a bad joke every 5 seconds
Interesting, gave me something to think about. I always felt it doesn't always need to connect. Like it bugged me a project would end on a cliff hanger. They should make a show or movie like it's your last, your passion.
The inclusion of TV shows and other source material, along with the ever-increasing number of plot holes in the Lore, makes following the MCU more and more frustrating. That's why I have much more interest in the release of DC animated movies, since these, even despite some sharing the same universe, are completely independent of each other and I don't have to read and watch hundreds of things before being able to enjoy them. For example, one of the reasons the recent movie "Batman: the Doom that Came to Gotham" was so good is because the movie is so independent and stand-alone, even someone who doesn't know much about Batman could enjoy it
Fun fact: Endgame was actually the first movie that introduced me to the marvel franchise. I was very confused then i got into it and watched spider man no way home later on.
Was Moon Knight not appearing enough in Moon Knight actually a complaint? I mean, I thought the show was pretty good for what it was. Its more of a character drama show than your generic superhero show, and imo they nailed the drama pretty well.
Yea but it’s pretty stupid they skip the last the fight and we never got the see the 3rd suit. Spoilers Jack lockley moon knights 3rd personality has a badass black and red suit I was hoping we would see. Hopefully in season 2
@@creed8712 How is that not an excuse? Daredevil wasn't struggling with DiD and was already a vigilante in episode 1. The story of Moon Knight told from Steven's perspective made it plausible for why Moon Knight wasn't appearing in every episode, because the guy was literally experiencing this for the first time in his life. I wasn't really bothered by the lack of Moon Knight because it made sense, plus I'm much more invested in the Steven/Marc character drama.
i think that there are three changes that could have saved phase four/ mcu as a whole. 1: cut down one the new characters introduced. we just got done with the biggest battle with the biggest consequences, we don't need new faces, we need to see the effects that infinity war and endame had on the universe as a whole. 2: push back the multiverse/kang as the next bad. again, we just defeated thanos, there should be some breathing room before we start building up our next villain and yet they are already moving toward secret wars at a breakneck sped without enough build up to justify it. there were a couple of movies and shows that used the multiverse but not nearly enough to justify where they are going with it. even looking at the phase five slate, there are still way more earth level movies/ shows that the multiverse kind of feels jarring to focus on. 3: have an avengers movie or some kind of culmination event at the end of phase four. i think there was enough interconnectivity between the ground level heroes to justify one in phase four. it could have been secret invasion or even push back the thunderbolts and make that the final movie of phase four. not every hero needs to showup, we just need a justifiable crossover to make the world still feel connected.
I do want to say Ant-Man did not beat kang, kang was too busy whooping Ant-man's ass that he wasted too much time and couldn't get through the portal fast enough
I watched Multiverse of Madness and was… perplexed. Then I watched Thor:Love and Thunder… great kids movie, but now I’ll NEVER waste my time watching Quantumania, or be excited for anything McU unless it’s specifically something or someone I recognize and fully love and enjoy. Period. Which blows because I used to get really hyped for the Avengers and anything MCU from phase one/two… it’s just not the same.
8:00 I can back this statement up, my family was on a Disney Cruise back in 2019 and we were able to watch Endgame again from its theater and someone in the row in front of us hadn’t seen a single MCU movie before and so was constantly turning to the person beside them going “what’s going on here” and whatnot and I had even asked either myself or my family after “Why would you go see a finale movie, especially one like this, without seeing any previous movie?”
What sucks for me is the fact that we don't get the day by day stuff of the heroes fighting crime much anymore ;-; we do get some in some scenes and shows but it's always saving the world and that's about it 😭
Voiced the same issue in my own comment. The superhero charachters have *nothing* to offer than saving the world. They are tools with good dialogues. There is no personal motivation in them, they all fight for the world, but they have absolutely zero ego, not even healthy ego - it's like they do not really want anything really bad. They just keep the world in balance, that's all. It's all colleague interactions, no personal ones.
@@wroomwroomboy123 Right! It makes me so fucking sad. I just feel like the animated TV shows do it better cause that way we could actually see them doing some saving along with the crazy shit.
I totally agree... plus, there are many instances where our heroes and heroines aren't acting very heroic, they actually are more criminal and there's no angst or regret over it
@@montelhelem8707 Thanos has deep worries about overpopulation and will fight to his death for it. It's bad, but man he is a character that has a strong motive to change something. Ultron was exactly the same. It's all bad waya they want to do it, but it's understandable what they want. I just wish the superheroes also would go above and beyond for something that isn't a reaction to someone elses actions.
I didn't like: - How much they changed Tony Stark’s personality from the comics to RDJ - How they handled a lot of Ironman’s supporting cast - How they handled Hulk - Practically everything they did with Spider-Man - How they butchered storylines like Civil War, Extremis, Creation of Ultron, etc. - How lots of their movies just have a tone of insincerity by making everything a joke - How bad a lot of the leathery suits looked There's other things too, but those are the main issues and a lot of this stuff is pre-Endgame because I stopped watching after that.
Captain America the winter soldier was the last movie I tried to break my neck to watch and I loved it . After that I just stopped caring about the story
Honestly I feel like I’m the only that understood why they had so many MCU tv projects tho cuz the Marvel universe is so massive that it would take multiple decades to introduce so many marvel characters in the MCU especially if they kept doing 3 movies a year. Tv shows just help them be introduced in the world and allowing us to see their own stories which is a good thing at least
@@DavidMartinez-ce3lp Nah not all of them to me I did really enjoy WandaVision and Moon Knight and Loki and honestly Falcon and the Winter Soldier was pretty great with the action at least. I agree with people considering it overwhelming tho
Both, Marvel & DC had the same problem with the MCU & the DCAMU(2014-2020) *TRYING TO MAKE A NARRATIVE IN MOVIES Extralimits your way of telling a Long Term story, specially when you Tell your story without a clear end point*
For me the main problems are the following 1). As you pointed out disconnection from other projects. 2). They try to be this edgy family friendly whatever. Their needs to be projects like Daredevil and the Defenders/Heroes for Hire. Those shows gives us adult oriented content that's not meant for children (WHO DON'T CARE OR UNDERSTAND CONTINUITY) and allows you explore the Marvel universe in a more grounded way. You have civilians mentioning current events that have happened. Like no one has mentioned the damn Celestial emerging out of the water or the one that abducted three random civilians. MCU shows need to be more than BS for kids, toy marketing and Disney+ monthly subscription/quarterly revenue. 3). Character development and random changes. One of the things that angers me the most was Kevin Fiege shitting the bed on Inhumans with ABC and turning Ms.Marvel into a Green Lantern. That was one of the dumbest decisions made. It was also dumb to randomly make her a mutant to set up the X-Men🙄🙄 Either in Ms.Marvel or She-Hulk (pretty sure She-Hulk) they shows newspaper or TV report in the background talking about a bar fight that involved a man with "three metal claws on his hands". Don't paste a small out of focus Easter egg. Show footage or something and than just don't show Logan's face so you can decide who you want to cast in the role. I also take a look at Captain Larson (Marvel) and wonder... who TF even wrote this script and directed it? And than I look at who did and listen to their comments on things and go "OHHHH makes a ton of sense" as to why that's the most forgotten and worse MCU project or at least movie. 4). Kevin Fiege needs to relinquish control. Like the comics the MCU is in a desperate need of directors styles that fit the character with out turning into a half-assed sitcom. Guardians does a mostly great job with this but Gunn's constent need to intrupt a fair amount of serious moments with stupid humor can get pretty annoying. But overall Gunn was absolutely perfect for the GOTG. Sam Raimi should have had his way with Doctor Strange:MOM and not been cut down or hindered by Kevin Fiege cause it was to dark for kids. That being said Kevin sticks his nose into was to many projects, especially when it comes to stylized directors who have a certain signature style of directing and world/character building. For example Taika with Love and Thunder... Gorr was pathetic... like in the sense of his presence. We didn't see him kill anyone except for A God... I mean heaven forbid we actually saw Gorr kill people inside of watching a sped up out of focus montage on a holo transmission in the Guardians ship.
Wandavision was pretty much the only show besides What If? that actually felt like it was made for an episodic release format. And I didn't even enjoy Wandavision.
Personally I don't need heavy interconnectivity in either the books or movies. If I'm reading am iron man book I want to read about iron man. If I'm watching a Spider-Man movie I want to watch a spidy movie. If I wanted to read about iron man and rotating heroes I would read marvel teamup. Same with the movies (teamup movie or whatever). Don't get me wrong. I wouldn't mind seeing iron man drop into a captain America book or see spidy interact with Ant-Man in a movie but every so often. But that's just me.
Moonknight was great also Werewolf by Night. I think I enjoyed they were just different that a lot of the other marvel shows/movies I have watched. Im hoping we will see these types of characters build to a dark Marvel team/universe/setting soon like you said they did with avengers I would love to see more like that in the future. I also like the idea of the What If? cartoon though I didnt love some of what I watched lol I honest feel after the Thanos stuff the stakes cant *really* get any higher so they need to chill out, we need to drop some expectations a bit and see more smaller scale stories or something quite a bit different then they can build up again. But also I think we as viewers need to realize it will *probably* never be that good again until maybe Xmen or something down the road quite a way. Honestly another thing is ...a lot of people grew up with the Avengers and loved them but they are getting old and being replaced and most of those replacements arnt iconic. They are just like people who are similar but not what most of us grew up with and there is a lot less enthusiasm with them. That doesnt mean they are inherently bad characters but most people do not care about the replacements. I also think the death of the actor who played Black Panther screwed Marvel a bit because I think he was going to be a big part of things going forward and was charismatic enough people would see movies he was in and he could be a big part of things going forward.
@@frostyyy7158 Aside from the other Spidermen who aren't getting movies anyways there is nothing anyone cares about in the multiverse. Like is anyone crying about Mr. Fantastic getting Sphagettified? The multiverse thing doesn't actually scale the threat in a meaningful way.
They straight up should have killed ant man at the end of his movie. The emotional stakes would have been great and given the MCU an “it’s no laughing matter” vibe to the big bad. Plus it would give a reason for Cassie to have a character arc
I don't know why they didn't use the remaining characters like Sam Wilson Cap,Thor,Ant-Man. To introduce new characters as side characters. As much as I disliked Doctor strange 2 with how they handled Strange & Wanda being played by the same actors after No way home & Loki I did enjoy the introduction of the Illuminati. They're also missing the opportunity to use Charlie from Iron man 3 as Iron lad(Young Kang) in the MCU
I saw endgame with my girlfriend and she was extremely confused but enjoyed it. We actually watched the entire series together afterwards. She’s extremely nice so I’m not completely sold she’s into the movies and not just watching them to be supportive of my hobbies. We see every marvel movie in theaters now.
Ya, Endgame in my opinion is actually way worse for the overall story that what you’re hinting at here. Imagine if Phase is ended with a Thanos win. Characters whose story was over or contracts up were killed off and Thanos was out there as a specter along with other big bads. That gives an impetus for the surviving Avengers (broken as they would be) to start looking for the next generation to be better than they were. Hawkeye finds Kate Bishop because he can’t quite keep up anymore and he’s basically deaf. Black Widow is broken looking for another Widow that she can trust (and still telling her origin). A much more vibrant story telling landscape while the universe is still reeling from what Thanos did.
I think phase 4 for the MCU would have been a great time to go back to basics and reset. 6 - 8 movies, 2 - 3 movies a year, and it needed an event film at the end like the Avengers, even if it wasn’t the Avengers. Maybe Dr. Strange should have been an event film with the Illuminati being like a multiversal Avengers and them teasing Kang at the end.
Just being simple here but all great movies not just comic movies, have a n amazing bad guy(s). Another problem is that bad guys start expanding to take over earth, universe, multiverse, sub space, just seems like eventually someone ends up running out of real-estate to protect or conquer/destroy. You can only go so big or so small until you have to start over.
I think the phase 4 & 5 films and shows could feel a little more connected if they came in a different order, because they had basically 3 or 4 interconnecting tag lines going on at once. Imagine a world where Black Widow, and Falcon and the Winter Soldier, and Hawkeye were all saved until later. They are all building up to Thunderbolts. And if Loki season 1, 2, Antman, and Avengers Kang Dynasty. That a Kang story saga And Wandavision, What if?, Spider-Man NWH, and Dr Strange Multiverse of Madness. You've got a through line about Wanda's arc, teaching audiences how to understand the Multiverse, payoff for watching What If? in Dr Strange 2, AND if you save NWH for last an epic finally that adds context to why Dr Strange is afraid of messing with the Multiverse after the spell accidently messes with it. And I guess you could bundle Shang Chi with Ms Marvel and The Marvels so you'll have all of Brie Larsons appearances together and whatever vague space stuff their setting up.
It's not just the flooding of them, but the fact that every movie feels like it has to be a 10 on the disaster scale. At some point, you need to tone it back down to just street level heroics. Give us Punisher, Spider-man, Luke Cage, or anyone else who usually deals with the problems of a neighborhood/city rather than the world or universe as a whole. This is arguably what Shang-Chi could have been except they had to do the whole portal thing at the end. What makes matters worse is that there's no coherent narrative like 20 movies/tv shows in. Phase 1 gave us the Avengers. Phase 2 gave us a few of the Infinity Stones. Phase 3 was supposed to be Thanos, but I would argue that was a mess already. Phase 4 is the continuation of that mess, but without the Infinity Stones or Thanos, so there was nothing to tie them together. Phase 5 was supposed to be the Multiverse, but we still see little traces of them being brought in. It was literally 20 movies/TV shows of side stories. The MCU needs to step back, take a break, and form a more coherent narrative.
The problem is simply this. Phase 1-3 movies took their time and didn’t rush scripts, vfx and screenplay. Phase 4 has had 17 projects and only 2 -3 in my opinion were top tier (Spider-man No Way Home, GOTG ) i like only 3 tv series (Wanda, Loki, FATWS) everything else i was “meh” about rushing these projects meant less time to make a GREAT movie.
I have a buddy who, unlike me, isn't into comic books at all. I told him Endgame was the conclusion of everything the MCU had been building up towards. Fast forward to about 2 years later and he was like: 'Why are there still so many goddamn superhero movies?! I thought you said they finished their storyline with Endgame.' I simply replied: 'They finished their storyline, yea. They just didn't finish milking dry the cashcow yet.' Even for me, an avid comic book fan since early childhood, this is just exhausting and overwhelming. It was great for a time and I'm super happy I got to be part of the ride, but I'm also ready to see it come to an end now. Unfortunately, that doesn't look like it's going to happen any time soon. Not while the cash keeps flowing. I keep begging to please just stop. Take a break for a few years. I'm so inundated by now. But they won't until the whole thing crashes and burns catastrophically, which it's bound to do if they keep this going. Nothing stays this big and popular for this many years without losing sight of some of important things along the way. But money rules, as it has always done and will always do. Hurts more for us fans, but no one upstairs gives a damn.
You're 100% on everything you said. I tapped out after endgame, didn't watch the last thor, Loki or anything else 🤷🏾♂️ hopefully secret invasion will make me care again.
I 100% agree with your video. What I would add is also the fact that the characters introduced in phase 4 were niche characters themselves and not everyone are naturally drawn to them. What I would offer as the solution is to wait. Phase 4 is assembling the pieces to do something with them later. however I will offer that it is ok to have independent stories as an interlude.
Honestly I feel like you summed things up pretty well with this video! Please make the MCU actually connected with each other again and actually have a through-line Marvel! Also, at 11:46, how have I never noticed Cap's shield in Iron Man?! I've seen that movie so many times and I never saw it until you pointed it out. That's actually a pretty awesome easter egg!
He keeps using the word, "macguffin" wrong. A macguffin is an arbitrary object whose only purpose is to propel the story forward. Since the infinity stones are specific, detailed objects with their own intricate stories, history, and function, they aren't a macguffin. Whatever is inside the briefcase in Pulp Fiction is a macguffin, because it literally didn't matter what was in there. So much so that we never even find out what's in the briefcase
With phases 1-3 leading up to endgames premier me and my friends would watch the movies in order of when the movies took place in the MCU timeline(Captain America then Captain Marvel then Iron Man ect.) You can't do that with phase 4 cause the only definitive chronological thing you can say is that Dr Strange 2 takes place after WandaVision.
She-Hulk is the third character in the Marvel Cinematic Universe to break the fourth wall, after Groot and Pizza Poppa. Unlike the two, She-Hulk is the first character to break the fourth wall on a normal basis, whereas the previous two only did it once. In Whose Show is This? She-Hulk breaking out of her own series and getting into Assembled to address the creators is a modern reference to how She-Hulk ripped through the comics to address the writers of her story at times.
They should have used Kang's variants like they used the Infinity Stones. He Who Remains in Loki (which they did), Scarlet Centurion in Quantumania, Immortus (acting like Madame Web) in No Way Home, and Rama-Tut in Eternals (set entirely in the ancient past). Of course, Kang in the next Avengers films. There. Done. If you had trouble with getting Jonathan Majors for all those, you could have full face masks and his voiceover for them. Duh. She-Hulk should have been saved for Deadpool since they break the fourth wall. Moon Knight should have been in Werewolf by Night as one of the monster hunters. Shang-Chi should have a Disney Plus show with accurate rings and a real Mandarin.
I’m pretty sure they said phase 4 was a new phase for introducing characters. It’s phase one all over again. Also I’ve said this point on a few TikTok’s so I’ll say it here. I think we’ve been spoiled by the first three phases that we expect payoff without setup. Image if phase one introduced Thanos and killed him off at the end of phase one or two without the build up. We have been to spoiled with what we want now and not what we will have later on.
Phase One introduces the Avengers Initiative d with the payoff being the first Avengers. The Marvel Netflix shows lead to the defenders. Phase 4 has build up that currently isn't going anywhere.
I'd say one of the big things for me to critique about the MCU is the TV series, that somewhat continues the movie plotlines, I don't have anyway outside of piracy to watch them, as I don't have very good internet nor money as a poor college student, and here in South Africa, their is no broadcasts of any Disney+ I can just sit and watch, usually my family gets a movie or 2 for my birthday, but that's it, so I find it very hard to keep up with the more recent stuff around the TV series, and that puts me out of wanting to watch the MCU as a whole, while just sitting on UA-cam or even just the internet I'll get notifications about the stories and since it involves the MCU that just breaks the flow for me, kinda hard to get invested in the plot if I have to watch over a week's worth of TV shows to know the character motivations and reasons for being there in the first place.
Man you opened my eyes! I'm not being sarcastic now, my mom when she watched Captain America civil war did not understand what was going on at all because she did not follow the other movies, so now the studio wants every character or every project to have a line, but some or we can say not all are done as well as for example Guardians of the Galaxy and so we that's why we don't really care about the other projects that always be a projects.
Benny bringing up End Game stand alone, he has to admit the same can be said with a bunch of anime movies. A lot of animes finish their show with a movie. And those movies would be extremely confusing without seeing the show first. So End Game isn't the first to do this. Saying it doesn't work alone is valid, but it was never intended to be seen stand alone.
there's a cartoon on disney channel called Moon Girl and Devil Dinosaur and she takes her name from Captain Rambeu and her Dinosaur is maybe Mephisto in disguise, but the Beyonder keeps showing up taking interest in her adventures, maybe for the latter reason.
This was a great take and I believe is generally shared by most die hard comic fans and the new casual MCU fans. The very thing that created the beast is the same thing that slayed it: money Prior to phase one, the 'Rights War' (Sony v Marvel/Disney) had comic book movies dead (I'm stilly salty for the lack of respect and 'non- thank yous' that neither organization gave Blade prior to IM1). With new money and some lucky 'got it right' casting, Ph1 and Ph2 had exactly what Bro. Ben shared: a centralized theme. As things progressed and we the consumer kept throwing our dollars at the big screen and on toys and merch, the House of Mouse became infected with the age old greed plague and forgot how they got to their mountain of success in the first place. You have to have money AND simple competent writing and story telling. It's almost like what happened to Family Guy (bear with me on this analogy). Season 1-3 was fresh funny and written well, though Fox cancelled it a few times. Season 4-8 (a little 9), you had a pinnacle and then the decline began as the demand increased (Macfarland OWNED Sunday evening after the NFL) but things spun out of control (American Dad got terrible and the Cleveland Show was She-Hulk bad). Again, once we get to certain levels of success, you forget about the competent things that work. Jokes started to just arrive w/o context and then (worse of all) forced jokes arrived to 'demand' laughs (they started writing bits in about everyday life that isn't even remotely funny, but the thought of referencing them in a tv broadcast "supposedly" makes them funny ((see Thor 4, which really had the potential to be great or at least much better than what we got)) Not to mention the expansion of social (not political but social; politics relates to the gov. affairs of a country) agendas of writer's, producers, and directors with boat loads of cash to create what they want instead of sticking to what the consumer wants. We (consumers) did very well with our outcry and displeasure of the last 6 years of Star Wars evil that was thrown our way, but failed to do so with the MCU, though we are slowly catching on. In order to gather the change we need, we need to sway Disney shareholders, and that's only done one way: stop giving them money.
I saw a comment on a video which really hit home for me.
“ The marvel movie phase 4 is like playing a game where you have completed the main storyline and now your grinding to get 100% completion.”
Couldn't agree more.
Yhhh 😂
It feels like trying to 100% arkham city 😂
Yoooo, that's straight up truth
@@kbreezy1581 Fr😂.
I loved WandaVision tho cuz of the mystery of wtf was going on plus Wanda going insane was entertaining. I just hated the line “They’ll never know what you did for them” or something like that cuz wtf does she mean acting like Wanda didn’t just mind control an entire town
I preferred Loki and What if those were my favorite show
if you watch Deadpool 2, you will hear the name of who is behind the Wandavision tv show
WandaVision was good but it was the first show to actively affect a movie, MoM was bad mainly because we already saw this Wanda on the show, it was sorta lame in the movie compared to the show.
@@itizwhatitiz9560 the problem is that they changed Wanda in Dr.Strange back to a villain like they had no clue what to do with her character but she did make a dope villain
@@theoutsiderjess1869 her idea was cool but I didn't like her as a villain, she's the opposite of the usually great villains we get in MCU, her motivation was illogical, weirdly dramatic and even the CGI wasn't that good with her.
She shouldn't have been the main villain.
My opinion on the MCU is that the cameo trick is over used and there are almost no stakes. When the story's are bad they just add a popular cameo and they expect the audience will watch it. The problem with the multiverse is there are almost no stakes. The multiverse is just so big that the threads do not matter mutch.
The multiverse could have worked too Nwh and Doctor strange did a good job showing how the tear of the multiverse could work alongside doctor strange
still better than dc
Yeah it's hard to conceptualize the entirety of everything being erased or destroyed. That there are universes going to be destroyed or have been already. The stakes are big, but hard to understand and the MCU puts no work into making us care besides talking of "billions of billions lives" unseen, unheard and never thought of again.
@@estherbrowning DC hasnt even started the multi verse yet, if they even do.
@@murphyoalexander51 *Arrowverse enters the chat*
"no reason for the Avengers to reassemble" is a really good point, just shows how low the stakes have been for the MCU since Endgame
It'll be the "Avengettes" at this point
@@kindatim1798 Right, We have Kate Bishop, She-Hulk, America Chavez😂. It’s just the Avengettes featuring Thor, Hulk, Sam and Hawkeye😂.
@@DougieYT Don't forget iron girl (or whatever), new black panther, mighty thor, sam (replacing Hawkeye) She-her Hulk (replacing Hulk), and Wanda... Ig captain falcon is still male lmao XD
@@kindatim1798 Oh I forgot about that chick😂.
That probably means they need to make movies on the other hundreds of thousands of marvel characters. Disney one big cash cow, recycling same people
I agree that the problem is the Storyline, or lack of. It's related to what's wrong with Phoenix/Jean X-Men movies. We got the stories of the team working together, tackling difficult situations and being individuals that just happened to also have powers. Then Phoenix, then we had the emotions and stakes.
The first 2 phases of the MCU introduced us to each character, how they saw the world and themselves. They also had growth, be it powers, abilities, understanding, or personal... but there was character development. Now it seems they are trying to jump ahead to the ending story without the through line like you mentioned.
Love this series. Thank you
100% they’ve tried to create too many films that don’t link
The whole problem boils down to one thing for both Film and Comics, Bad Writing. If a Story and Characters are Written well people will enjoy it and want more. Its Rare in the Comics, but even more rare on Screen now.
The snap is a joke now the infinity stones are a joke. It's an ice cream shop in the MCU. 'Infinity Cones'? That little thing takes out the gravitas of what happened.
Like, imagine if someone named a middle eastern restaurant "Twin Tower Fall"
They might as well have reversed the 5 years rather than basically act like snap and blip had no consequences and would be a geopolitical crisis
Also giving it a stupid name with the Blip. Good thinking Marvel, take possibly your most emotional and traumatizing moment in this universe and use it for a bunch of stupid jokes, great job 🤦🏻♂️
Right, that’s like having an amusement park themed around September 11th called 11th Millennium or something.
The snap was a big deal. It’s not a joke now, but the MCU can’t focus on the past if they’re trying to set up the big bad
Best and most sane Phase 4 take critique I've seen. This genuinely showed me a new perspective. This is why I've been a fan for years, Benny.
this video truly highlights the reason why we love the mcu and why stopped liking them precisely imo, bringing up the impact of phase 3, genuinely can relate that phase 3 was the anchor point since alot of people started to care about the MCU at that time, especially civil war era
@@salmantorik6091şojj
Ant Man connection was that he broke into the new Avengers facility established at the end of Age of Ultron which led to Falcon getting him involved in Civil War.
An additional problem or related problem is setting these schedule of movies out in these huge batches with definite release dates. It leaves no room for alteration for the most part. And if things like I don't know pandemics or people dying occur you leave yourself no room to deal with these unforeseen circumstances and it becomes a house of cards. They are switching things around and you start to disassemble what was so tightly assembled and you run the risk of things being misaligned and consequential.
I always maintained the problem with the mcu is over saturation and not taking their time With the movies like they used to do at least in my opinion.
I felt like Spider-Man will always make box office sales, whether the movie was good or bad.
I feel like you are on target about the story. Most definitely people drop off of the MCU because they feel like it's changing the characters or not serving a purpose. I feel like the truth is that they are going through comics to help reach the next phases and that's where the story breaks off. The fact that there is no time and effort to build up these characters and the timing for many of them feels like an affront to many only makes it worse. Then again, comics don't transfer well directly and we have seen that too many a time.
It’s the wokeness and lecturing nothing more.
@@TheUnseenPath it was never about "the wokeness" that changed it considering the Ultimate universe and surprisingly the animated movies tackled just as much of the same content. It's the falling out from having a huge budget masterpiece to restarting from the ground up that nobody wants to deal with.
@@TheUnseenPath boy marvel has been woke and lecturing longer than that term existed. Quit that non-sense rhetoric.
@@TheUnseenPath100 percent right
I agree too Benny I feel like this what is happening with Marvel, DC, and now Star Wars. They are forgetting that we went to see these movies was because there was a connecting story to them now its just we are going to make a She Hulk show because people like She Hulk and we need a Marvel Show for Disney Plus. It would have been nice to at least have an after credits scene where Sam shows up at Jens office to talk about starting the New Avengers. If they would have done that and also not make the whole show a joke about CGI is too expensive I think it would have been much better.
Tbh i feel like dc is doing more well with the batman movie last year that was better than all the movies in phase 4 combined
while i enjoyed shehulk my issue was they took a legit comic group intellgensia modok's group and used it to troll the incels and the moronic m-she-u channels on here which to me was low hanging fruit, so instead of focusing on the plot built, they decided to be petty and troll....how do you show youre "above the hate" by doing that?
they just gave both groups more fuel to the fire....
and they also caved into the cameo fans and channels again instead of the movies and tv shows...because of these things its failing
and how do i know this? in this video shang-chi is the most beloved movie of phase 4 that had none of the previous points, loki even though it was a time travel/multiverse the same thing....gotc vol 3 was beloved for the same reason and in that movie it took a shot at the mcu in a good way unlike shehulk's shot, it was just a joke in the movie not taking up the whole plot
and deadpool is a fourth wall breaking character but imagine if they took his villians built them up and then made them a internet group of westboro church members who said deadpool is the sign of the end times and made central to the plot even thou it makes sense for a character like deadpool? it would tasteless and would of ruined the whole movie
I agree with the interconnectedness.
My favorite Punisher run was the like 5 issue story when he goes Captain Punisher and then fights Bucky at the Licoln Memorial. All immediately after the death of Steve Rogers back in the 2000s
Debating Joker, Batgirl, Zeb Wells Spider-Man, Green Arrow or Wally next... Who do you guys think? Or do you have someone else you hope I have an issue with
Very good!
Spider-Man!
The MCU hitting the DCEU phase.
Maybe wait for next issue of Spider-Man. Apparently Wells is going to get off the internet because the next issue will be that controversial
The problem with Benny's chair
Could've had Kang be the one causing the incursions with his super tech because he wants to rule over the world's, and this is the most effective way to get rid of opposition
Or have the kang that Ant man fight be a fake to test earth's hero
I think that's the direction they're going. He's really the only villain they've set up who could be capable of it. I'm not sure how I feel about Kang being responsible but I'm not entirely against it. I'm just not totally sold on it. Depends on how it's implemented.
Dr strange should have cameo in ant man
@@lilsabin he should've been the character to tie it all together since, as established in Ragnorak, he keeps track of all dangerous magical beings and situations around the world. It would make sense for him to appear.
@@DavidMartinez-ce3lp yup… Ant- man shoulda been stuck there and in after credit scene , they show dr strange opening a portal and getting him by saying , we don’t have time … This alone woulda been HUGE 🙂
This is what I've been saying. Phase 4 would be good if kept the story going, but with everything being so isolated with little to no connections to the previous story. Phase 4 overall feels pointless. In my opinion I believe that Phase 4 should have been an epilogue. It should've tied up any and all loose plot threads from the previous saga and started the process of introducing the Incursion story plots.
I agree.
i'll also add that phase 4 should have been the last phase. I know it is hard to hear but nothing last forever. The MCU should have ended with a bang, now it is slowly burning out.
@@kaiserzaiser5002it’s not they’re rebuilding, and they have been hinting at kang…. Phase 1 was barely connected. Of course it’s gonna be different now because they need to create a new story
@@angelodomingo2953 I am going to politely disagree. thank you for your input.
Phase 4 was just not as exciting without Cap and Tony and Tchalla. And all the TV shows were uninteresting to me except WandaVision.
Makes me feel like if phase 2 had been individual movies for each of the Guardians of the Galaxy before releasing Guardians of the Galaxy they could have set up a lot more storylines that wouldn’t feel rushed or out of the blue
Yeah let me go watch the drax movie 🙄
@@izacgarcia708 they screwed him over by not giving him any closure with his quest to kill Thanos in Endgame
@@izacgarcia708 that would be a good 1 hour movie
@@razzledazzle9971 hardly
Thanos should've finished the job ☠️
Imagine disney trying to handle the Ultimate universe 💀
Shang-Chi would've worked better as a show. That way they wouldn't need to go so big scale and do all this CGI stuff. And he could interact with other street level heroes like Spiderman or Daredevil.
You hit the nail right on the head! But there's only ONE thing I just want them to do, and that's choosing "quality" over "quantity," too many projects in so little time that needs to change, that's just my opinion.
The snap would’ve been such a good movie to bring up the effects of the snap and have doctor strange feel the consequence of letting it happen or something like that
At this point, if Marvel made an adaptation of Watchmen, it would surely be this:
Ozymandias: "Now that New York has been destroyed, the world powers will put aside their differences and unite against the threat I myself created to save them. I know millions have died by my hand, BUT BY MY HAND I HAVE ALSO SAVED BILLIO...Rorschach, did you just fart?"
I agree 100%. I will add that I think it's OK to have a few things that aren't connected. Like if they never intend for she-hulk or moon knight to be apart of the avengers, fine. Those shows would have to be fantastic on their own. The issue is that they weren't. Like you said she-hulk was mediocre sitcom and moon knight didn't actually show moon knight much. When you add to it that they aren't connected to everything else that's going on, it's a double whammy of negativity.
MCU: Our projects are failing and we don't know why.
DCEU: First time?
Ant man actually beating kang on his own is hilarious, i remember watching an animated avengers show called "earths mightiest heroes: the avengers" and it was extremely good because of its storyline and character portrayals which even had an amazing story featuring kang
On his own? The whole quantum realm attacked Kang.
I believe that before Phase 4 started, or at the very beginning, Feige himself saif that the whole arc leading to a big villian was no longer their goal and that they were looking for shorter arcs, and projects that were not directly related to each other. Like now ypu have a muñtiversal thing gping on, along with an earth story (secret invasion & the falcon story line), a probable mystic story (with Shang-Chi), a universal story (Eternals), etc. I believe many of the characters will come together in the next Avengers movie, but not their stories.
That is not working anymore you can't do the multiverse and not have things connect
It feels like the MCU stopped taking itself seriously and completely left plausibility at the door. It's hard to suspend your disbelief and really enjoy then film when the even the characters don't.
I thought werewolf by night was pretty good. Also I'd like to see more with the monster characters and possibly after Deadpool 3 maybe tie in the monster characters and possibly lead to king Deadpool.
Benny starts reading manga and watching anime:
Also Benny: This is mid
Anime fans: You are one of us now
I'm one of the people who watched Endgame without watching the whole mcu movies that came before. I LOVED IT. Endgame is the reason why I've become a fan of Marvel and superheroes. I wish it happened years before
Narratively I agree with you. There's the whole business side of marvel and there's a lot of other weeds that we can get into, but if we're just focusing on the story of the MCU I agree 100%.
TL;DR = Oversaturation + Lack of interconnectivity + Lack of credible threat = Phase Meh
My main thing now they have gotten too big and are now putting stuff out on too many platforms and trying to keep the cohesive story going
For example putting a major reveal in the Guardians of the Galaxy Christmas special, or putting Kang in Loki it's getting to a point where you have to watch stuff on Disney plus inorder to understand what is going to happen to the next movie also the fact the movies have to build up the next big bad in Kang but also be really inconsistent with his power scaling like apparently he's so strong he managed to wipe out the avengers in multiple timelines to the point where he doesn't even remember how many times he's done it and then having him lose to Ant-Man?
This, this is the only thing with also Disney pushing them to put out double the content faster. It's awful to have great moments scattered around 12 movies/shows
Even in Phase 5, 2 years and 5 movies, 7 shows... TOO MUCH
Exactly. I watched Multiverse of Madness and needed to watch Wandavision. Started She-Hulk and try referenced Abomination's pussy in Shang Chi. I feel like I NEED to watch EVERYTHING just to to be emotionally invested.
Idk if this is a hot take but Thor: the dark world is way better than Thor:Love and Thunder. It makes no sense how they fumbled one of the greatest Thor stories.
I just wanna add that I actually know someone that went to Endgame without seeing the other movies. They love movies overall (almost will call him a film buff). He was completely lost as you'd expect. He had a fun time because it looked visually pleasing and character interactions were engaging but he never felt the stakes or story because you would need prior knowledge to understand them. Because of that, he gave it a 6/10. Wasn't in love with the plot but enjoyed the time travel and action sequences.
Endgame is the second part of one movie though.
That's like watching only part 2 of deathly hallows...
You can't expect to understand anything in Endgame without infinity war.
People liked the original ending to Ant-Man, but the studio thought it was too similar to the ending of the previous film.
I would add that having a streaming service and that being on a streaming service has made them stumble on their storytelling as well as bad management with the woman who was overseeing vfx along with coming off of a pandemic when almost everything was shut down the whole world was shut down. Also the death of Chadwick Bozeman was also a problem as well too.
One of the most frustrating things about Disney's influence in the MCU today is the way gore and blood are heavily censored in fights, with "At the Multiverse of Madness" being a rare exception. I mean, am I the only one who remembers that scene from "The First Avenger" (made when Disney wasn't in charge) where a Hydra agent is completely torn apart by a propeller?
Yeah but I don't remember it being super bloody to be fair. Dude just got shredded. Imo the boys is gore and the MCU has never come close to any of that
@@BlueCheeseLucci true but even the first captain America movie is pretty violent
@@BlueCheeseLucci It wasn't that explicit, but considering how reluctant Disney is to showing blood, I was genuinely shocked after seeing a guy turn into red gas in a universe in which every character has to throw a bad joke every 5 seconds
did you see werewolf by night?
That was pre Disney, with Paramount
Interesting, gave me something to think about. I always felt it doesn't always need to connect. Like it bugged me a project would end on a cliff hanger. They should make a show or movie like it's your last, your passion.
The problem is that Marvel stopped telling great stories.
The inclusion of TV shows and other source material, along with the ever-increasing number of plot holes in the Lore, makes following the MCU more and more frustrating. That's why I have much more interest in the release of DC animated movies, since these, even despite some sharing the same universe, are completely independent of each other and I don't have to read and watch hundreds of things before being able to enjoy them. For example, one of the reasons the recent movie "Batman: the Doom that Came to Gotham" was so good is because the movie is so independent and stand-alone, even someone who doesn't know much about Batman could enjoy it
No, no, no. Falcon & The Winter Soldier was all about "the snap". It was shit how they treated the snap, but it's all about it.
Fun fact: Endgame was actually the first movie that introduced me to the marvel franchise. I was very confused then i got into it and watched spider man no way home later on.
Spider-Man: No Way Home was the best out of most of the Marvel Phase 4 projects.
Was Moon Knight not appearing enough in Moon Knight actually a complaint? I mean, I thought the show was pretty good for what it was. Its more of a character drama show than your generic superhero show, and imo they nailed the drama pretty well.
Yea but it’s pretty stupid they skip the last the fight and we never got the see the 3rd suit. Spoilers
Jack lockley moon knights 3rd personality has a badass black and red suit I was hoping we would see. Hopefully in season 2
That’s not an excuse because Daredevil exists and has a sexy suit that he wears multiple times.
@@creed8712 How is that not an excuse? Daredevil wasn't struggling with DiD and was already a vigilante in episode 1. The story of Moon Knight told from Steven's perspective made it plausible for why Moon Knight wasn't appearing in every episode, because the guy was literally experiencing this for the first time in his life. I wasn't really bothered by the lack of Moon Knight because it made sense, plus I'm much more invested in the Steven/Marc character drama.
i think that there are three changes that could have saved phase four/ mcu as a whole.
1: cut down one the new characters introduced. we just got done with the biggest battle with the biggest consequences, we don't need new faces, we need to see the effects that infinity war and endame had on the universe as a whole.
2: push back the multiverse/kang as the next bad. again, we just defeated thanos, there should be some breathing room before we start building up our next villain and yet they are already moving toward secret wars at a breakneck sped without enough build up to justify it. there were a couple of movies and shows that used the multiverse but not nearly enough to justify where they are going with it. even looking at the phase five slate, there are still way more earth level movies/ shows that the multiverse kind of feels jarring to focus on.
3: have an avengers movie or some kind of culmination event at the end of phase four. i think there was enough interconnectivity between the ground level heroes to justify one in phase four. it could have been secret invasion or even push back the thunderbolts and make that the final movie of phase four. not every hero needs to showup, we just need a justifiable crossover to make the world still feel connected.
I do want to say Ant-Man did not beat kang, kang was too busy whooping Ant-man's ass that he wasted too much time and couldn't get through the portal fast enough
I watched Multiverse of Madness and was… perplexed.
Then I watched Thor:Love and Thunder… great kids movie, but now I’ll NEVER waste my time watching Quantumania, or be excited for anything McU unless it’s specifically something or someone I recognize and fully love and enjoy. Period. Which blows because I used to get really hyped for the Avengers and anything MCU from phase one/two… it’s just not the same.
8:00 I can back this statement up, my family was on a Disney Cruise back in 2019 and we were able to watch Endgame again from its theater and someone in the row in front of us hadn’t seen a single MCU movie before and so was constantly turning to the person beside them going “what’s going on here” and whatnot and I had even asked either myself or my family after “Why would you go see a finale movie, especially one like this, without seeing any previous movie?”
What sucks for me is the fact that we don't get the day by day stuff of the heroes fighting crime much anymore ;-; we do get some in some scenes and shows but it's always saving the world and that's about it 😭
Voiced the same issue in my own comment. The superhero charachters have *nothing* to offer than saving the world. They are tools with good dialogues. There is no personal motivation in them, they all fight for the world, but they have absolutely zero ego, not even healthy ego - it's like they do not really want anything really bad. They just keep the world in balance, that's all.
It's all colleague interactions, no personal ones.
@@wroomwroomboy123 Right! It makes me so fucking sad. I just feel like the animated TV shows do it better cause that way we could actually see them doing some saving along with the crazy shit.
I totally agree... plus, there are many instances where our heroes and heroines aren't acting very heroic, they actually are more criminal and there's no angst or regret over it
@@montelhelem8707 Thanos has deep worries about overpopulation and will fight to his death for it. It's bad, but man he is a character that has a strong motive to change something. Ultron was exactly the same. It's all bad waya they want to do it, but it's understandable what they want.
I just wish the superheroes also would go above and beyond for something that isn't a reaction to someone elses actions.
I didn't like:
- How much they changed Tony Stark’s personality from the comics to RDJ
- How they handled a lot of Ironman’s supporting cast
- How they handled Hulk
- Practically everything they did with Spider-Man
- How they butchered storylines like Civil War, Extremis, Creation of Ultron, etc.
- How lots of their movies just have a tone of insincerity by making everything a joke
- How bad a lot of the leathery suits looked
There's other things too, but those are the main issues and a lot of this stuff is pre-Endgame because I stopped watching after that.
The problem? MCU stopped caring about itself.
Captain America the winter soldier was the last movie I tried to break my neck to watch and I loved it . After that I just stopped caring about the story
Honestly I feel like I’m the only that understood why they had so many MCU tv projects tho cuz the Marvel universe is so massive that it would take multiple decades to introduce so many marvel characters in the MCU especially if they kept doing 3 movies a year. Tv shows just help them be introduced in the world and allowing us to see their own stories which is a good thing at least
But they were garbage shows
@@DavidMartinez-ce3lp Nah not all of them to me I did really enjoy WandaVision and Moon Knight and Loki and honestly Falcon and the Winter Soldier was pretty great with the action at least. I agree with people considering it overwhelming tho
Agreed.
@@DavidMartinez-ce3lp In your minority opinion.
@@iraford5788 the shows didn't get good ratings, so no.
Both, Marvel & DC had the same problem with the MCU & the DCAMU(2014-2020)
*TRYING TO MAKE A NARRATIVE IN MOVIES Extralimits your way of telling a Long Term story, specially when you Tell your story without a clear end point*
Love these 'rants'. Excellent analysis.
Love this format for you. Already the reigning champ of audiobooking comics, good to see this versatility.
For me the main problems are the following
1). As you pointed out disconnection from other projects.
2). They try to be this edgy family friendly whatever. Their needs to be projects like Daredevil and the Defenders/Heroes for Hire. Those shows gives us adult oriented content that's not meant for children (WHO DON'T CARE OR UNDERSTAND CONTINUITY) and allows you explore the Marvel universe in a more grounded way. You have civilians mentioning current events that have happened. Like no one has mentioned the damn Celestial emerging out of the water or the one that abducted three random civilians. MCU shows need to be more than BS for kids, toy marketing and Disney+ monthly subscription/quarterly revenue.
3). Character development and random changes. One of the things that angers me the most was Kevin Fiege shitting the bed on Inhumans with ABC and turning Ms.Marvel into a Green Lantern. That was one of the dumbest decisions made. It was also dumb to randomly make her a mutant to set up the X-Men🙄🙄 Either in Ms.Marvel or She-Hulk (pretty sure She-Hulk) they shows newspaper or TV report in the background talking about a bar fight that involved a man with "three metal claws on his hands". Don't paste a small out of focus Easter egg. Show footage or something and than just don't show Logan's face so you can decide who you want to cast in the role. I also take a look at Captain Larson (Marvel) and wonder... who TF even wrote this script and directed it? And than I look at who did and listen to their comments on things and go "OHHHH makes a ton of sense" as to why that's the most forgotten and worse MCU project or at least movie.
4). Kevin Fiege needs to relinquish control. Like the comics the MCU is in a desperate need of directors styles that fit the character with out turning into a half-assed sitcom. Guardians does a mostly great job with this but Gunn's constent need to intrupt a fair amount of serious moments with stupid humor can get pretty annoying. But overall Gunn was absolutely perfect for the GOTG. Sam Raimi should have had his way with Doctor Strange:MOM and not been cut down or hindered by Kevin Fiege cause it was to dark for kids. That being said Kevin sticks his nose into was to many projects, especially when it comes to stylized directors who have a certain signature style of directing and world/character building. For example Taika with Love and Thunder... Gorr was pathetic... like in the sense of his presence. We didn't see him kill anyone except for A God... I mean heaven forbid we actually saw Gorr kill people inside of watching a sped up out of focus montage on a holo transmission in the Guardians ship.
Some of the Disney plus Marvel shows should have been movies.
- Falcon & The Winter Soldier
- Loki
- Hawkeye
- Moon Knight
- She-Hulk
Wandavision was pretty much the only show besides What If? that actually felt like it was made for an episodic release format. And I didn't even enjoy Wandavision.
And eternals should have been a series
With Johnathan Majors controversy, Marvel should take advantage of this and built a better Kang
Honestly everything you mentioned makes perfect sense. You said it all
Personally I don't need heavy interconnectivity in either the books or movies. If I'm reading am iron man book I want to read about iron man. If I'm watching a Spider-Man movie I want to watch a spidy movie. If I wanted to read about iron man and rotating heroes I would read marvel teamup. Same with the movies (teamup movie or whatever). Don't get me wrong. I wouldn't mind seeing iron man drop into a captain America book or see spidy interact with Ant-Man in a movie but every so often. But that's just me.
Moonknight was great also Werewolf by Night. I think I enjoyed they were just different that a lot of the other marvel shows/movies I have watched. Im hoping we will see these types of characters build to a dark Marvel team/universe/setting soon like you said they did with avengers
I would love to see more like that in the future. I also like the idea of the What If? cartoon though I didnt love some of what I watched lol
I honest feel after the Thanos stuff the stakes cant *really* get any higher so they need to chill out, we need to drop some expectations a bit and see more smaller scale stories or something quite a bit different then they can build up again. But also I think we as viewers need to realize it will *probably* never be that good again until maybe Xmen or something down the road quite a way.
Honestly another thing is ...a lot of people grew up with the Avengers and loved them but they are getting old and being replaced and most of those replacements arnt iconic. They are just like people who are similar but not what most of us grew up with and there is a lot less enthusiasm with them. That doesnt mean they are inherently bad characters but most people do not care about the replacements.
I also think the death of the actor who played Black Panther screwed Marvel a bit because I think he was going to be a big part of things going forward and was charismatic enough people would see movies he was in and he could be a big part of things going forward.
Agreed.
Nah, stakes weren't overly high with Thanos, I mean they were, but now that the concept of multiverse has been introduced it doesn't feel like that
@@frostyyy7158 Aside from the other Spidermen who aren't getting movies anyways there is nothing anyone cares about in the multiverse. Like is anyone crying about Mr. Fantastic getting Sphagettified?
The multiverse thing doesn't actually scale the threat in a meaningful way.
The VFX of Heimdalls kid in Thor love and thunder it’s too funny lookin
They straight up should have killed ant man at the end of his movie. The emotional stakes would have been great and given the MCU an “it’s no laughing matter” vibe to the big bad. Plus it would give a reason for Cassie to have a character arc
I don't know why they didn't use the remaining characters like Sam Wilson Cap,Thor,Ant-Man. To introduce new characters as side characters.
As much as I disliked Doctor strange 2 with how they handled Strange & Wanda being played by the same actors after No way home & Loki I did enjoy the introduction of the Illuminati. They're also missing the opportunity to use Charlie from Iron man 3 as Iron lad(Young Kang) in the MCU
I saw endgame with my girlfriend and she was extremely confused but enjoyed it. We actually watched the entire series together afterwards. She’s extremely nice so I’m not completely sold she’s into the movies and not just watching them to be supportive of my hobbies. We see every marvel movie in theaters now.
Ya, Endgame in my opinion is actually way worse for the overall story that what you’re hinting at here. Imagine if Phase is ended with a Thanos win. Characters whose story was over or contracts up were killed off and Thanos was out there as a specter along with other big bads. That gives an impetus for the surviving Avengers (broken as they would be) to start looking for the next generation to be better than they were. Hawkeye finds Kate Bishop because he can’t quite keep up anymore and he’s basically deaf. Black Widow is broken looking for another Widow that she can trust (and still telling her origin). A much more vibrant story telling landscape while the universe is still reeling from what Thanos did.
12:23 Antman 1 was a lot of Stark talk and cap reference + a full on Falcon cameo.
I think phase 4 for the MCU would have been a great time to go back to basics and reset.
6 - 8 movies, 2 - 3 movies a year, and it needed an event film at the end like the Avengers, even if it wasn’t the Avengers. Maybe Dr. Strange should have been an event film with the Illuminati being like a multiversal Avengers and them teasing Kang at the end.
Who said Shang Chi’s post credit scene tied into Ant Man 3? I could’ve sworn that was just a theory that everybody took as a fact with no proof. 8:45
I only remember the post credit scene with him joining the New Avengers
i hate that this is the first video im watching after this (the ad)
Same that ad hits different now
Also, a big problem, they made multiverse a small house you can visit
No seriously... who is like ACTUALLY an Avenger is the MCU nowadays its not clear at all . Like what makes you officially an Avenger in the MCU now ?
there are 2 ways to become an avenger now. Either wong opens a portal for you (shang chi) or you sacrifice your life to beat a villain (modok)
Just being simple here but all great movies not just comic movies, have a n amazing bad guy(s). Another problem is that bad guys start expanding to take over earth, universe, multiverse, sub space, just seems like eventually someone ends up running out of real-estate to protect or conquer/destroy. You can only go so big or so small until you have to start over.
Why not have a villain have a personal vendetta with a specific member of a group and is there in each of their solo movies interfering. Idk
I think the phase 4 & 5 films and shows could feel a little more connected if they came in a different order, because they had basically 3 or 4 interconnecting tag lines going on at once.
Imagine a world where Black Widow, and Falcon and the Winter Soldier, and Hawkeye were all saved until later. They are all building up to Thunderbolts.
And if Loki season 1, 2, Antman, and Avengers Kang Dynasty. That a Kang story saga
And Wandavision, What if?, Spider-Man NWH, and Dr Strange Multiverse of Madness. You've got a through line about Wanda's arc, teaching audiences how to understand the Multiverse, payoff for watching What If? in Dr Strange 2, AND if you save NWH for last an epic finally that adds context to why Dr Strange is afraid of messing with the Multiverse after the spell accidently messes with it.
And I guess you could bundle Shang Chi with Ms Marvel and The Marvels so you'll have all of Brie Larsons appearances together and whatever vague space stuff their setting up.
It's not just the flooding of them, but the fact that every movie feels like it has to be a 10 on the disaster scale. At some point, you need to tone it back down to just street level heroics. Give us Punisher, Spider-man, Luke Cage, or anyone else who usually deals with the problems of a neighborhood/city rather than the world or universe as a whole. This is arguably what Shang-Chi could have been except they had to do the whole portal thing at the end.
What makes matters worse is that there's no coherent narrative like 20 movies/tv shows in. Phase 1 gave us the Avengers. Phase 2 gave us a few of the Infinity Stones. Phase 3 was supposed to be Thanos, but I would argue that was a mess already.
Phase 4 is the continuation of that mess, but without the Infinity Stones or Thanos, so there was nothing to tie them together. Phase 5 was supposed to be the Multiverse, but we still see little traces of them being brought in. It was literally 20 movies/TV shows of side stories. The MCU needs to step back, take a break, and form a more coherent narrative.
The problem is simply this.
Phase 1-3 movies took their time and didn’t rush scripts, vfx and screenplay.
Phase 4 has had 17 projects and only 2 -3 in my opinion were top tier (Spider-man No Way Home, GOTG ) i like only 3 tv series (Wanda, Loki, FATWS) everything else i was “meh” about
rushing these projects meant less time to make a GREAT movie.
18:54 No Way Home also hinted at the Multiverse when the Spiderverse tore those huge purple gashes in the sky… just sayin
I have a buddy who, unlike me, isn't into comic books at all. I told him Endgame was the conclusion of everything the MCU had been building up towards. Fast forward to about 2 years later and he was like: 'Why are there still so many goddamn superhero movies?! I thought you said they finished their storyline with Endgame.' I simply replied: 'They finished their storyline, yea. They just didn't finish milking dry the cashcow yet.'
Even for me, an avid comic book fan since early childhood, this is just exhausting and overwhelming. It was great for a time and I'm super happy I got to be part of the ride, but I'm also ready to see it come to an end now. Unfortunately, that doesn't look like it's going to happen any time soon. Not while the cash keeps flowing. I keep begging to please just stop. Take a break for a few years. I'm so inundated by now. But they won't until the whole thing crashes and burns catastrophically, which it's bound to do if they keep this going. Nothing stays this big and popular for this many years without losing sight of some of important things along the way. But money rules, as it has always done and will always do. Hurts more for us fans, but no one upstairs gives a damn.
You're 100% on everything you said. I tapped out after endgame, didn't watch the last thor, Loki or anything else 🤷🏾♂️ hopefully secret invasion will make me care again.
The ONSLAUGHT BUILD UP WAS AMAZING!!!!!
I 100% agree with your video. What I would add is also the fact that the characters introduced in phase 4 were niche characters themselves and not everyone are naturally drawn to them. What I would offer as the solution is to wait. Phase 4 is assembling the pieces to do something with them later. however I will offer that it is ok to have independent stories as an interlude.
Honestly I feel like you summed things up pretty well with this video! Please make the MCU actually connected with each other again and actually have a through-line Marvel!
Also, at 11:46, how have I never noticed Cap's shield in Iron Man?! I've seen that movie so many times and I never saw it until you pointed it out. That's actually a pretty awesome easter egg!
He keeps using the word, "macguffin" wrong. A macguffin is an arbitrary object whose only purpose is to propel the story forward. Since the infinity stones are specific, detailed objects with their own intricate stories, history, and function, they aren't a macguffin. Whatever is inside the briefcase in Pulp Fiction is a macguffin, because it literally didn't matter what was in there. So much so that we never even find out what's in the briefcase
With phases 1-3 leading up to endgames premier me and my friends would watch the movies in order of when the movies took place in the MCU timeline(Captain America then Captain Marvel then Iron Man ect.) You can't do that with phase 4 cause the only definitive chronological thing you can say is that Dr Strange 2 takes place after WandaVision.
She-Hulk is the third character in the Marvel Cinematic Universe to break the fourth wall, after Groot and Pizza Poppa.
Unlike the two, She-Hulk is the first character to break the fourth wall on a normal basis, whereas the previous two only did it once.
In Whose Show is This? She-Hulk breaking out of her own series and getting into Assembled to address the creators is a modern reference to how She-Hulk ripped through the comics to address the writers of her story at times.
They should have used Kang's variants like they used the Infinity Stones. He Who Remains in Loki (which they did), Scarlet Centurion in Quantumania, Immortus (acting like Madame Web) in No Way Home, and Rama-Tut in Eternals (set entirely in the ancient past). Of course, Kang in the next Avengers films. There. Done. If you had trouble with getting Jonathan Majors for all those, you could have full face masks and his voiceover for them. Duh.
She-Hulk should have been saved for Deadpool since they break the fourth wall. Moon Knight should have been in Werewolf by Night as one of the monster hunters. Shang-Chi should have a Disney Plus show with accurate rings and a real Mandarin.
I’m pretty sure they said phase 4 was a new phase for introducing characters. It’s phase one all over again. Also I’ve said this point on a few TikTok’s so I’ll say it here. I think we’ve been spoiled by the first three phases that we expect payoff without setup. Image if phase one introduced Thanos and killed him off at the end of phase one or two without the build up. We have been to spoiled with what we want now and not what we will have later on.
That's fine but they should have introduced the multiverse after introducing all these new characters
Phase One introduces the Avengers Initiative d with the payoff being the first Avengers. The Marvel Netflix shows lead to the defenders. Phase 4 has build up that currently isn't going anywhere.
I'd say one of the big things for me to critique about the MCU is the TV series, that somewhat continues the movie plotlines, I don't have anyway outside of piracy to watch them, as I don't have very good internet nor money as a poor college student, and here in South Africa, their is no broadcasts of any Disney+ I can just sit and watch, usually my family gets a movie or 2 for my birthday, but that's it, so I find it very hard to keep up with the more recent stuff around the TV series, and that puts me out of wanting to watch the MCU as a whole, while just sitting on UA-cam or even just the internet I'll get notifications about the stories and since it involves the MCU that just breaks the flow for me, kinda hard to get invested in the plot if I have to watch over a week's worth of TV shows to know the character motivations and reasons for being there in the first place.
No compelling villains anymore in my opinion.
Your rants are great Benny we don't skip to the end 😂
Man you opened my eyes! I'm not being sarcastic now, my mom when she watched Captain America civil war did not understand what was going on at all because she did not follow the other movies, so now the studio wants every character or every project to have a line, but some or we can say not all are done as well as for example Guardians of the Galaxy and so we that's why we don't really care about the other projects that always be a projects.
Doctor Strange is an A tier film
Benny bringing up End Game stand alone, he has to admit the same can be said with a bunch of anime movies. A lot of animes finish their show with a movie. And those movies would be extremely confusing without seeing the show first. So End Game isn't the first to do this. Saying it doesn't work alone is valid, but it was never intended to be seen stand alone.
Great video topic and points.
there's a cartoon on disney channel called Moon Girl and Devil Dinosaur and she takes her name from Captain Rambeu and her Dinosaur is maybe Mephisto in disguise, but the Beyonder keeps showing up taking interest in her adventures, maybe for the latter reason.
This was a great take and I believe is generally shared by most die hard comic fans and the new casual MCU fans. The very thing that created the beast is the same thing that slayed it: money
Prior to phase one, the 'Rights War' (Sony v Marvel/Disney) had comic book movies dead (I'm stilly salty for the lack of respect and 'non- thank yous' that neither organization gave Blade prior to IM1). With new money and some lucky 'got it right' casting, Ph1 and Ph2 had exactly what Bro. Ben shared: a centralized theme.
As things progressed and we the consumer kept throwing our dollars at the big screen and on toys and merch, the House of Mouse became infected with the age old greed plague and forgot how they got to their mountain of success in the first place. You have to have money AND simple competent writing and story telling.
It's almost like what happened to Family Guy (bear with me on this analogy). Season 1-3 was fresh funny and written well, though Fox cancelled it a few times. Season 4-8 (a little 9), you had a pinnacle and then the decline began as the demand increased (Macfarland OWNED Sunday evening after the NFL) but things spun out of control (American Dad got terrible and the Cleveland Show was She-Hulk bad). Again, once we get to certain levels of success, you forget about the competent things that work. Jokes started to just arrive w/o context and then (worse of all) forced jokes arrived to 'demand' laughs (they started writing bits in about everyday life that isn't even remotely funny, but the thought of referencing them in a tv broadcast "supposedly" makes them funny ((see Thor 4, which really had the potential to be great or at least much better than what we got))
Not to mention the expansion of social (not political but social; politics relates to the gov. affairs of a country) agendas of writer's, producers, and directors with boat loads of cash to create what they want instead of sticking to what the consumer wants. We (consumers) did very well with our outcry and displeasure of the last 6 years of Star Wars evil that was thrown our way, but failed to do so with the MCU, though we are slowly catching on.
In order to gather the change we need, we need to sway Disney shareholders, and that's only done one way: stop giving them money.