Hi I recently flashed my ASUS firmware, system will not boot, i changed/rehanged all settings, tried different drives, its only that pc, i tried to flash back the old rom and went well, still no boot. I tried to google everything, I tried every setting I can think of can you offer any help. I tried the fTMP reset and nothing. ssd works fine in another pc
Is optane still king as a win10 boot drive ? the new gen5 nvme are rocking 12GB/s nowadays ive never heard of wingit, i like a little app called ninite, its simple enough and makes a packaged exe
I love that the actual RAID setup was short and sweet as expected, and then half the vid is just Wendell complaining about Microsoft (as any good sysadmin should).
I'm so glad Wendel is talking about this problem with Winget and the Win Store, and how completely stupid this whole thing is, I hope it brings some coverage to the subject. I can add the fact that when we arrive on this Winget page of the store we often see that it is available for the update as if it were already available even though the command does not work....... . honestly wtf?!! The icing on the cake is this phrase that comes up more and more often: “do people at Microsoft use their product?” It’s so meaningful. It's really fascinating.
@guillaumechanut : you are SPOT ON with your comments about M$, they really need to change their tune. @Level1Techs : way to go Wendell !!! 😎😎😎 Keep sh*tting on M$ and pointing out their mistakes, we really need more people with your level of expertise, reputation and public following to (continuously) p*ss on them in order to make them realize that they're making things worse for everyone (including themselves).
No and I'm certain that they've stopped using their own products for decades. For example, the best version of Microsoft Word is 5.1a on the Mac dating back to... 1993. Yeah, that was 30 years ago.
@@Splarkszter yeah but then we wouldn't have updates that push on the desktop a new search bar nobody asked for and that is redundant with the one already forced down my throat in the task bar just at the bottom of the screen ?? I don't know how you can even imagine behind productive without that, can you ?? 🫠
Your probably already know, but when installing Windows next time, choose "English (World)" when choosing time and currency (it's asked early on in the installation). If you do that, 90% of the bloat in the start menu is not installed
A friendly reminder to first download all the latest software and driver versions you need for a Windows system and when you install said system the first step is to disconnect any network connection until you are done.
i support Microsoft products on a high level. I can confirm: none of them use their own tools for anything. Why do you think Microsoft asks enterprises "How are you using this software/hardware?" And they keep making MORE products that aren't being used internally, nor will they be used internally and aren't likely even going to see any external use either. They legitimately have no idea. I would happily give you my time to tell you all the awfulness internally.
I think we need a new video going over how you configure a new install of Windows and Linux. This includes the order you do things, first steps, what you install, what things do you tweak to make life easier. There's so much old, outdated advice out there for setting things up.
Windows: After install, do several rounds of updates. Then check device manager to see what hardware drivers you need. Figure out the manufacturer and exact model, sift through their websites to get each driver individually. Then it's on to each piece of software you want. Hope you haven't clicked an SEO'd link to malware. Linux: Install. Then update once.
7:36 That pause when Wendell is trying to decide if he should date himself with the "Back in the days of WINNT 3.51" rant about the "floppy boot" drivers being distinct from all the rest of the drivers.
The difference is that the main competitor for desktop and server Windows (albeit not a very strong one by market share on the desktop) is Linux, and the majority of Linux distros have software repos that deliberately eschew all of the profit seeking spam that causes all of those bad search results
App Installer is actually automatically installed when you update Microsoft Store apps. Yeah, it sucks, but I use those for script install all apps in newly formatted PC.
Thanks for bringing more awareness to these drives once again, I have multiple 905ps running on all desktop environments i manage and its incredible hardware! i wish another company would invest in this build tech.
Micron was partnered up with Intel and they both unfortunately axed it at separate times. To bad Optane didn’t take off more given its benefits over traditional storage mediums.
I will say, I used that feature for a bit, but when I noticed that after a while my computer would hang for hours. When I open Task Manager, 100% utilization of 0MB/s of Read and Write. I check their SMART status, their reporting fine. I copy the data off onto a NAS and create a Storage Pool, no issues thus far at the moment. I have no idea why it started doing that when the drives are fine and healthy.
Just want to let you know I relate so much with your "app installer" mini-rant followed by the gripes about Windows' Start Menu and app installation behaviors.
For a RAID volume like this does it matter if the PCIe lanes come from the CPU or the chipset? What if some disks have lanes from CPU and others have lanes that are from the chipset?
Until you saturate bandwidth it's basically okay. So a raid 0 or 1 with 2 drive you're okay or very nearly so. You get 2-3 nvme behind the chipset and it's not as good in raid because they complete with each other behind the chipset for bandwidth back to the CPU
Yeah, the situation with windows is stupid. I've been using scoop instead of winget for most of my applications and it works great. It "installs" programs for single user and doesn't need administrator privileges for installing (it needs it for adding to the "right click" context and other reg edits, but that is fine). I fallback to winget if I need to install something that *needs* to be installed the normal way. Anywyas as always, thank you for a great video!
I've used PCIE multiplexing cards for my U.2 setup. So long as you aren't hitting all the drives at once you get pretty decent performance. And they can be had for pretty good prices off Aliexpress.
Pleaseeee give a parts list. This is exactly what I've been wanting. Part selection in the UK is dumb, like we pretty much don't get Optane at all but I still wanna look.
The catch here is that with a RAID setup you're kind of by definition hitting all the drives at once - not an issue for stuff like medium performance SSD servers but it does kill the peak speed benefits of throwing Optane or high end SSDs in there
Sometimes you’re forced to mix Intel and AMD. The AsRock Aqua series being the most frustrating. Motherboard only available in Z690 LGA and the matching GPU only as a 7900xtx.
Great video. Just out of curiosity, what is the benefit of Optane over a Gen 4 ssd at this point? And I agree that windows store is terrible. I always try and get the standalone executables.
I really wish I had some clue as to what the heck you're talking about! but I do have a question about sitting in the bios like that. Does the temp climb slowly like it does on most consumer boards while in the BIOS?
I prefer to use WingetUI since you get to use both chocolatey and winget from the same package manager in case the version on one or the other is not up to date (which does happen)
is there currently anything in works to replace optane? there were efforts to push stacked hmb as a sort of buffer between level3 cache of cpu and igpus vram and fast nvme drives and that there are significant updates on mram to be used as universal memory replacing both ram and ssd but nothing out there, only more layered nvme going pcie 5 and 6 now using less pcie lanes due higher throughput but nothing significant like the mistreated optane was.
Not really, Optane is by a wide margin the best option for serving the role of NVRAM and better than SSD latency, it's just that Intel couldn't be asked developing it long enough to make it more price competitive, and was completely unwilling to release their vendor lock in for key Optane features. An HBM cache IMHO isn't super useful as an SSD cache because it's significantly smaller than even system RAM and the extra layer of caching carries a small but significant potential latency penalty, depending on specifics, and NAND is just too fast for bulk data transfer for anything else to catch up right now (when NAND plateaus that might free up some more R&D time and money for novel technologies).
Would using single drives through RAID mode have any benefit compared to classic AHCI mode? I remember seeing some posts claiming that single drives through RAID mode can sometimes be few % faster on some boards while on some boards the AHCI mode is the faster one. I had no chance to test these claims anywhere though.
I am running 3x Samsung 970 Pro 1TB M.2 NVMe SSDs configured in RAID-0, as boot drive, on an Intel Z390 platform. I am going to switch to AMD this year, so I am interested to know how RAID works on AMD platforms.
I use chocolatey gui. It's a bit 90ies but works much better than the usual way. Searching for stuff in the store or, in fact, anywhere is crap now - marketing killed search both in windows os and on the web (i kinda remember Google from way back when when it properly sorted operators like + and - instead of replacing the first with double quotes and ignoring them at will to show you anything but the stuff you need
Hey Wendel, this video comes really in clutch as I'm preparing to build my NAS with a 7700 and 2 Samsung 990 Pro in RAID 1 as boot drives, I was thinking about using Debian 12 or Ubuntu 24.04 as my OS, do we need the drivers or are they already inside of the Kernel? Thanks and have a nice day!
for 990 pro, make sure to cheeck the firmware version in case it needs to be updated; some had notoriously bad wear which is not undone but just stopped by the firmware update. I had to use magician under Windows as their bootable ISO wouldn't boot on my latest build.
@BoraHorzaGobuchul because I want the max speed and durability for it, as I'm going to run some databases like MariaDB, PostgreSQL and some containers that use machine learning
The room he is filmed in isn't great for audio recording. It echoes his voice and also all the computers we use for testing. We're working on getting some better soundproofing in there, but in the meantime, I make do with what I can using Adobe Audition. ~Editor Autumn
ICEY DOCK, INSTALL DIRECTLY FOR YOUR HARDDRIVE ICEY DOCK, INSTALL DIRECTLY FOR YOUR HARDDRIVE ICEY DOCK, INSTALL DIRECTLY FOR YOUR HARDDRIVE ICEY DOCK, INSTALL DIRECTLY FOR YOUR HARDDRIVE
I'm sure there's plenty of Windows devs using Windows, the key is that the enterprise editions have secret additional tooling to kill a lot of the nonsense that they embed in single unit licence versions, plus they've probably got a ton of automated internal tools to deploy software (they don't want single users to get access to this stuff because a free access software repo kills the Microsoft Store and potential ad revenue)
*Wendell just trying to install software on Windows* "no... no... no... nO.... nOooOOO... NOooOOOoo.... NOOOOOOOO" Had me in tears as my last week or so on Windows was the same, just hacking through the ads/forced clicks to get anything done was driving me insane. Using Fedora 39 KDE and now using my computer is fun again :D
On the package manager rant, when you’re installing apps on a Mac distributed through PKG files, it tells the operating system “hey, I’m installing stuff. Please don’t install more stuff” It’s not as sophisticated as some of the locks on Linux, allowing you to do drag and drop installations and App Store installations while PKG installations are in progress, but those other installation types shouldn’t interfere with PKG installers.
One of my favorite things, as a Mac admin, is that Apple allows you to make meta-packages. You can do packages that just run scripts. You can chain together multiple installers into one package. You can build packages that just throw a .app into /Applications. By their powers combined, you can make pretty powerful management action packages. Sure, you can do basically all of that with EXE installers on windows, but they’re not nearly as standardized. Even if you use install shield or some such
Microsoft has had a history of being found to not be running their products where better alternatives existed; they did put in development work to try to disguise the appearance of such systems though. I've been using chocolatey for years though it still has the annoying bug where you have to pay money to have it detect the version of software that is installed; easy+mandatory workaround is pinning any package that is updated externally and using a program's own autoupdates or getting from original source is still the best way to get quick security updates.
Been working on an AMD RAID issues on my new system. Be wondering if you experienced it or know of it. So the setup is as follows. An Asus x670e motherboard, 4 NVMe slots. Slot 1 and 2 have a pair of 2TB WD SN850x drives on latest firmware. The 3rd slot has a 1TB WD SN850x latest firmware too. Disk 1 and 2 are in a RAID0 and originally I wanted to have Drive 3 as a standalone "Legacy" disk running a Duel boot of Windows 11 Pro. The now RAID0 Array has Windows 11 Pro installed on it. All working fine and preforms really well. However when I go to install the second OS I will ether get to 86% copying files and it pauses for 10min or so, then might get to 100% and pause again. Then fail and ether crash the installer or reset it back to opening screen. Then you might skip that issue and get to 1-3% of getting files ready and it crash again. Once I manged to get the OS installed as far as going though and picking region, setting Wifi and then it crash on naming the PC. (Second OS is going to be intune/Entra ID joined) I've tried the standalone drive as "legacy" (Clear meta date in RAIDXpert2), or the Jbods Volume type and "Raidable". All do the same crashing during the install. I've ordered a second 1TB SN850x while they are reasonably priced. So I am hoping having it in a RAID0 or 1 with the current drive might allow for the second OS to install. But couldn't find anything in the AMD Raid manual about it. It should be a supported setup. I've tired a number of things as well as the drive presentations. Including removing the GFX card and running from the 7950X3D (it was like this for the first windows install on the RAID0). Resetting the BIOS to defaults and running completely base BIOS settings. Always the same crashes. Spec: AMD Ryzen 9 7950X3D Asus ROG Strix Gaming x670e-a (updated to latest BIOS as of December and AMD RAID drivers are the latest from both Asus and AMD as in two versions) 32GB of DDR5 6000 CL30 Memory XFX 7900XTX 2x 2TB WD SN850x 1x 1TB WD SN850x (second to come tomorrow) Edit: Update 12/02/2024: After posting this I found a readme.rtf in the drivers folder stating a known issue with installing a OS on a second array. Looking back at a version released the previous year (about 1 year ago) This was also present. So not holding my breath on getting that fixed.
(Edit: early comment) Huh? Of course one can run Optane on AMD platforms - it's PCIe-ish! That's the beauty of computer science - usually, we take the abstraction layers kind of scenic route. Even Optane/3D-Xpoint "speaks" NVMe, which is, and always has been, afaik, a "dialect" of PCIe. (i remember a few PCper VODcasts, back when Ryan Shroud and the magnificent Malventano still ran the show - i think, they've published an explainer piece - how NVMe is Intel tech, and how they'd had to tweak PCIe …yadda-yadda …optimise it into a new method, now called NVMe) …it's kinda like the OSI model - it's abstraction layers, all the way down.
though using the baby optane consumer cache drives as cache with the intel software had some hardware checks and sometimes manufacturers had their own release with its own checks.
This video reconfirms why I switched from Windows to Linux many years ago. The best part is that Linux has improved a lot since I switched. Nothing is perfect, Linux has its own set of warts and frustrations, but it's nothing comparable to Windows.
That is thanks to proprietary bullshit and 0 standards, not Linux issue, remember FLOSS like linux is community maintained, nothing stops you from making your own solution.
While I fundamentally understand your statement, sit back, reflect a while and then try to close the circle to the issue of “Why does the year of the Linux desktop always seem to be next year?”.
@@abavariannormiepleb9470 I have been daily driving Linux Mint since 2 years now as a complete noob. And i'm incredibly happy of having done so, windows just gives a lot of headaches, the only reason HDR works there is because they had economical incentives and also because consoles have basically the same code anyways. With how horrible microsoft is at everything except at manipulating the market in an anti-competitive way. I don't care, i won't give them money in any way anymore.
A large part of that has been the slow transition to Wayland. X11 is no longer really being developed, and Wayland has had bigger fish to fry in terms of usibility. We are slowly seeing the first steps on HDR, plasma 6 supports it, of course that does not mean applications will use it yet but steps are now clearly being made.
i was forced into a new Intel laptop running Windows 11 at work today. it was a sad day. I hate everything about it compared to my previous AMD Windows 10 laptop. time to get a new job I guess
Im building a server atm using just an old Threadripper 2920X(might upgrade tot he 16core/32 thread version since those are stil around for cheap), 128gigs of ram, AMD 6600(non XT)gpu, tons of storage, 16 enterprise 6TB HDD's, gonna use Unraid installing Unraid on a NVMe m.2 SSD, looking forward to using it, it's mainly gonna be for storage and video encoding. It would be fun to have 16 of those Intel Optane 905P drives instead but im a lowly peon with a normal job not getting paid much..lol ...I would also love to try the new threadripper systems, but also can't afford them, so hope this adventure with an old gen2 threadripper goes well..lol
Unrelated to this video but I had a question. I have a NAS and it's running truenas core. I recently bought 2x netapp ds2246 disk shelves which also came with a full compliment of 600gb sas drives. All for around $500. I installed a Broadcom 9500-16e into the NAS, and it can only see 1 disk shelf. If I switch the cable to the other disk shelf it'll appear. But both together will not populate (only 1 populates) Any insights?
Win11. Yup. I simply make my way through installing each app but I have a thumb drive with a software folder and installing on NVMe is fast so it's easy enough. Yes I update the software on the thumb drive from time to time. I have to edit the registry to fix Win Explorer to get back the old context menu, then do a handful of changes to make it more Win10 like and then after that it doesn't bother me. I get rid of most the things that Win11 puts onto the taskbar and put on the things I want there, shift the start button to the left, etc...................
What is the point of using a raid volume? How does the OS manage what gets stored on one before it fills up and begins using the other? I don't think I would want to leave to chance windows using optane for my 100gb of cat pics when it could be used for more productive things...
The OS doesn't manage this, the RAID operates below the filesystem. In this setup each drive is split into 256 kilobyte chunks and then the chunks are interleaved. For any file over 256k in size it is split across both drives.
@@BAD_CONSUMER Wendell was using RAID0 mode. I didn't realize you were asking about the mode he didn't use. That mode just concatenates disks. Accesses to the first half go to the first drive and accesses to the second half go to the second drive. This could be useful if you have drives of differing sizes and need them to show up as one, otherwise it's stupid.
I may be biased here as a 20+ years linux user who has been booting off of encrypted root partitions on software raids for what feels forever, but man I'm always baffled how cumbersome it still is to do the easiest things on Windows. Starting with, you know, just install the darn thing including some basic software to make it usable - not even talking about this dance just to get your root on raid. Can't agree more with Wendell here, really surprised that Microsoft with all their resources and running the most used desktop OS still haven't figured out basic things like package management.
I flipped from AMD raid to Storage Spaces for my win11. Was a matter of concern of whether trim was supported, and time to experiment. Oddly Storage Spaces can't be enabled for a boot raid, although it's been achieved on some version of a surface tablet. Certainly the win11 oobe is awful, and ntlite is a godsend to that nightmare.
Well it makes sense that a software raid(ish) solution can’t be done on a boot drive because you’d need the software on the disk to get the raid started. Kind of a chicken and egg problem.
@@harrychufan well, somehow it gets kicked off with the EFI MsHyperspaceDriver. It's beyond me how that could be generalized for PC and not just the Surface Pro.
well back in day we had motherboard with a chipset and socket that you could use both AMD and Intel cpu in. but in the end there come a spilt in the road one wanted to bring Personal Computer to more people, with more backward and forward compatibility, but the other Just wanted to make a lot of money.
AMD also used to be a secondary manufacturer of the intel chips. I remember AMD also making upgrade replacements for older intel chips to run at higher speeds. Even after they started building their own media instructions and sockets started to diverge you had at least one company (ecs? i dont remember) try to make it so you could use either on 1 board.
"Sleeper agents secretly making the desktop experience worse." I wish it was something that interesting. No... it is just consistently bad decisions by OSS devs.
A U.2 to M.2 adapter cable... They're also called: M.2 Key M to U.2 SFF-8639 NVMe Adapter The 4.0 cables/adapters *generally* support 5.0 speeds. The 3.0 cables/adapters generally do *not* support 4.0 or 5.0, only 3.0 and below. "Delock M.2 Key M to U.2 SFF-8639 NVMe Adapter with 50 cm cable" is a suitable choice for guaranteed "at least 4.0" speeds. Again, it *should* work at 5.0 and make sure you do thorough testing/validation/blah blah blah before you use in production or at scale. If you want to be super-safe, just set the m.2 slot to 4.0. I don't believe any cables/adapters are fully certified to work at 5.0. You could try reaching out to Kioxia to see if they have a recommendation for 5.0(?).
Wow, the crap people who use windows have to go through just to install a device driver (more than one) is mind boggling! I don't have an optane drive, but I'm pretty sure that if I installed one, and booted up my Linux PC, the kernel will already have the drivers and load them, and the drive would be ready to configure and partition.
Hey! Use this affiliate link if you're interested in doing your own AMD Raid: newegg.io/ncbe30db78
Hi I recently flashed my ASUS firmware, system will not boot, i changed/rehanged all settings, tried different drives, its only that pc, i tried to flash back the old rom and went well, still no boot. I tried to google everything, I tried every setting I can think of can you offer any help. I tried the fTMP reset and nothing. ssd works fine in another pc
Winget upgrade --all (add this to the end if you so choose that part of the update) --include-unknown
Is optane still king as a win10 boot drive ?
the new gen5 nvme are rocking 12GB/s nowadays
ive never heard of wingit, i like a little app called ninite, its simple enough and makes a packaged exe
i use a little installer called ninite it lets you checkbox software and gives you an all in one installer package
Why is the manufacturing of NAND down?
"short and sweet" = 26 minutes
26 sweet minutes
here for every second of it. Wendell's the Bob Ross of computing. If not him, ExplainingComputers
Some strong lilliputian binary trees
Wendell is just too good :D
i bet you still watched the whole thing tho............. and i did too
I love that the actual RAID setup was short and sweet as expected, and then half the vid is just Wendell complaining about Microsoft (as any good sysadmin should).
I'm so glad Wendel is talking about this problem with Winget and the Win Store, and how completely stupid this whole thing is, I hope it brings some coverage to the subject. I can add the fact that when we arrive on this Winget page of the store we often see that it is available for the update as if it were already available even though the command does not work....... . honestly wtf?!! The icing on the cake is this phrase that comes up more and more often: “do people at Microsoft use their product?” It’s so meaningful. It's really fascinating.
@guillaumechanut : you are SPOT ON with your comments about M$, they really need to change their tune.
@Level1Techs : way to go Wendell !!! 😎😎😎 Keep sh*tting on M$ and pointing out their mistakes, we really need more people with your level of expertise, reputation and public following to (continuously) p*ss on them in order to make them realize that they're making things worse for everyone (including themselves).
No and I'm certain that they've stopped using their own products for decades. For example, the best version of Microsoft Word is 5.1a on the Mac dating back to... 1993. Yeah, that was 30 years ago.
@@powerpower-rg7bk and the win 8 start menu team coming in with their mac's 😑
Fck microsoft, embrace linux. Been daily driving it without a single issue since 2 years now.
@@Splarkszter yeah but then we wouldn't have updates that push on the desktop a new search bar nobody asked for and that is redundant with the one already forced down my throat in the task bar just at the bottom of the screen ?? I don't know how you can even imagine behind productive without that, can you ?? 🫠
Your probably already know, but when installing Windows next time, choose "English (World)" when choosing time and currency (it's asked early on in the installation).
If you do that, 90% of the bloat in the start menu is not installed
Regardless of if Wendell knows, I didn't and I'm very happy to have seen this
the real LPT is always in the comments
"Am I the one taking crazy pills here?!" ❤
In the world of big tech there is unfortunately so much insane BS that makes your mind long for the sweet release of death.
I am SO glad I moved over to Linux for desktop as of December 2022!!! :D
I did on january of that year, completely enjying it, windoz is such a headache.
Which distro? Installed Ubuntu Cinnamon on an old laptop last month, very lightweight and works like a charm for basic stuff.
A friendly reminder to first download all the latest software and driver versions you need for a Windows system and when you install said system the first step is to disconnect any network connection until you are done.
i support Microsoft products on a high level. I can confirm: none of them use their own tools for anything. Why do you think Microsoft asks enterprises "How are you using this software/hardware?" And they keep making MORE products that aren't being used internally, nor will they be used internally and aren't likely even going to see any external use either.
They legitimately have no idea. I would happily give you my time to tell you all the awfulness internally.
I think we need a new video going over how you configure a new install of Windows and Linux. This includes the order you do things, first steps, what you install, what things do you tweak to make life easier. There's so much old, outdated advice out there for setting things up.
Windows: After install, do several rounds of updates. Then check device manager to see what hardware drivers you need. Figure out the manufacturer and exact model, sift through their websites to get each driver individually. Then it's on to each piece of software you want. Hope you haven't clicked an SEO'd link to malware.
Linux: Install. Then update once.
7:36 That pause when Wendell is trying to decide if he should date himself with the "Back in the days of WINNT 3.51" rant about the "floppy boot" drivers being distinct from all the rest of the drivers.
Drivers. The second plague for in IT . 🖨️ 1st obviously
To be fair, app stores returning a pile of shit on search results is not particularly a Microsoft Store issue. It's ubiquitous across all appstores.
The difference is that the main competitor for desktop and server Windows (albeit not a very strong one by market share on the desktop) is Linux, and the majority of Linux distros have software repos that deliberately eschew all of the profit seeking spam that causes all of those bad search results
It does seem to be a ubiquitous problem. The Ubuntu “store” kills me every-time I have to use it.
App Installer is actually automatically installed when you update Microsoft Store apps. Yeah, it sucks, but I use those for script install all apps in newly formatted PC.
Thanks for bringing more awareness to these drives once again, I have multiple 905ps running on all desktop environments i manage and its incredible hardware! i wish another company would invest in this build tech.
Micron was partnered up with Intel and they both unfortunately axed it at separate times.
To bad Optane didn’t take off more given its benefits over traditional storage mediums.
I will say, I used that feature for a bit, but when I noticed that after a while my computer would hang for hours. When I open Task Manager, 100% utilization of 0MB/s of Read and Write. I check their SMART status, their reporting fine. I copy the data off onto a NAS and create a Storage Pool, no issues thus far at the moment. I have no idea why it started doing that when the drives are fine and healthy.
Just want to let you know I relate so much with your "app installer" mini-rant followed by the gripes about Windows' Start Menu and app installation behaviors.
Cool stuff. Hope you're ok Wendell. Take care of yourself!
I wish Intel continued developing the Optane consumer technology.
For a RAID volume like this does it matter if the PCIe lanes come from the CPU or the chipset? What if some disks have lanes from CPU and others have lanes that are from the chipset?
Id love to get an answer to this question too.
Same, I never know how to distinguish these.
Until you saturate bandwidth it's basically okay. So a raid 0 or 1 with 2 drive you're okay or very nearly so. You get 2-3 nvme behind the chipset and it's not as good in raid because they complete with each other behind the chipset for bandwidth back to the CPU
@@Level1Techs thanks for answering so quickly!
Disabling caching in the bios is most important.. Catching with AMD raid hinders performance, optane does not need caching..
We did not see how much the raid affected the latency, would have been interesting to see one drive alone and compare.
Yeah, the situation with windows is stupid.
I've been using scoop instead of winget for most of my applications and it works great. It "installs" programs for single user and doesn't need administrator privileges for installing (it needs it for adding to the "right click" context and other reg edits, but that is fine). I fallback to winget if I need to install something that *needs* to be installed the normal way.
Anywyas as always, thank you for a great video!
I've used PCIE multiplexing cards for my U.2 setup. So long as you aren't hitting all the drives at once you get pretty decent performance. And they can be had for pretty good prices off Aliexpress.
Not recommended for RAID0 or 10 for obvious reasons.
Pleaseeee give a parts list. This is exactly what I've been wanting.
Part selection in the UK is dumb, like we pretty much don't get Optane at all but I still wanna look.
The catch here is that with a RAID setup you're kind of by definition hitting all the drives at once - not an issue for stuff like medium performance SSD servers but it does kill the peak speed benefits of throwing Optane or high end SSDs in there
Wish I could get my hands on optane for NA prices. Would love to toy around with the performance!
Sometimes you’re forced to mix Intel and AMD. The AsRock Aqua series being the most frustrating. Motherboard only available in Z690 LGA and the matching GPU only as a 7900xtx.
Great video. Just out of curiosity, what is the benefit of Optane over a Gen 4 ssd at this point?
And I agree that windows store is terrible. I always try and get the standalone executables.
Even if you get a drive with same or better speeds, the endurance is gotta be better for optane. Did not check.
Lower latency and higher write endurance are the key benefits of Optane.
"Happens tot the best of us". Easy to say when you are the best of us ;)
You had me at hello Optane...
I really wish I had some clue as to what the heck you're talking about! but I do have a question about sitting in the bios like that. Does the temp climb slowly like it does on most consumer boards while in the BIOS?
ooo package manager. interesting. love how the prog u mentioned is stuff I've been using for a long time. hehe. cool stuff.
I prefer to use WingetUI since you get to use both chocolatey and winget from the same package manager in case the version on one or the other is not up to date (which does happen)
"Am I the one taking crazy pills here?" made me laugh out loud 😂
For Windows 11 23H2 it should already be install but it must be updated via the MS Store under Library.
How did you get the blue Intel electrons to play nice with the red AMD electrons? 😮
You can take more than 1 program at a time in winget
7:37 Ah, good old F6 drivers. Shout out to all y'all who even know what I'm talking about. 👴
Thank you for sharing these thoughts
is there currently anything in works to replace optane? there were efforts to push stacked hmb as a sort of buffer between level3 cache of cpu and igpus vram and fast nvme drives and that there are significant updates on mram to be used as universal memory replacing both ram and ssd but nothing out there, only more layered nvme going pcie 5 and 6 now using less pcie lanes due higher throughput but nothing significant like the mistreated optane was.
Not really, Optane is by a wide margin the best option for serving the role of NVRAM and better than SSD latency, it's just that Intel couldn't be asked developing it long enough to make it more price competitive, and was completely unwilling to release their vendor lock in for key Optane features. An HBM cache IMHO isn't super useful as an SSD cache because it's significantly smaller than even system RAM and the extra layer of caching carries a small but significant potential latency penalty, depending on specifics, and NAND is just too fast for bulk data transfer for anything else to catch up right now (when NAND plateaus that might free up some more R&D time and money for novel technologies).
Would using single drives through RAID mode have any benefit compared to classic AHCI mode? I remember seeing some posts claiming that single drives through RAID mode can sometimes be few % faster on some boards while on some boards the AHCI mode is the faster one. I had no chance to test these claims anywhere though.
What do you mean the calibrate touch and pen input thing is going to disappear? As an artist with a bunch of pen & touch screens, I kinda need that...
It's not in the latest windows 11 update. Only seem to have any number of touch devices working on one monitor at a time too
I am running 3x Samsung 970 Pro 1TB M.2 NVMe SSDs configured in RAID-0, as boot drive, on an Intel Z390 platform.
I am going to switch to AMD this year, so I am interested to know how RAID works on AMD platforms.
I use chocolatey gui.
It's a bit 90ies but works much better than the usual way.
Searching for stuff in the store or, in fact, anywhere is crap now - marketing killed search both in windows os and on the web (i kinda remember Google from way back when when it properly sorted operators like + and - instead of replacing the first with double quotes and ignoring them at will to show you anything but the stuff you need
18:30 “No. No. No. No. …” LOL! Glad to see I’m not the only one who does this!
Hey Wendel, this video comes really in clutch as I'm preparing to build my NAS with a 7700 and 2 Samsung 990 Pro in RAID 1 as boot drives, I was thinking about using Debian 12 or Ubuntu 24.04 as my OS, do we need the drivers or are they already inside of the Kernel? Thanks and have a nice day!
Ah so for Linux don't do this as I said in the video. Do mdadm software raid in Linux. All better. Nothing special needed in bios.
for 990 pro, make sure to cheeck the firmware version in case it needs to be updated; some had notoriously bad wear which is not undone but just stopped by the firmware update. I had to use magician under Windows as their bootable ISO wouldn't boot on my latest build.
@mirror1766 thanks, I will definitely take a look on that!
Why 990 pro?
@BoraHorzaGobuchul because I want the max speed and durability for it, as I'm going to run some databases like MariaDB, PostgreSQL and some containers that use machine learning
Microsoft is an up and coming ad service that used to make an operating system.
Great video but something’s weird about the audio. Sounds crunchy, low bitrate
The room he is filmed in isn't great for audio recording. It echoes his voice and also all the computers we use for testing. We're working on getting some better soundproofing in there, but in the meantime, I make do with what I can using Adobe Audition. ~Editor Autumn
ICEY DOCK, INSTALL DIRECTLY FOR YOUR HARDDRIVE
ICEY DOCK, INSTALL DIRECTLY FOR YOUR HARDDRIVE
ICEY DOCK, INSTALL DIRECTLY FOR YOUR HARDDRIVE
ICEY DOCK, INSTALL DIRECTLY FOR YOUR HARDDRIVE
Those creating the products, do not use it. We can all see it daily in these softwares! This is too common. Thanks, Wendell, for pointing it out.
I'm sure there's plenty of Windows devs using Windows, the key is that the enterprise editions have secret additional tooling to kill a lot of the nonsense that they embed in single unit licence versions, plus they've probably got a ton of automated internal tools to deploy software (they don't want single users to get access to this stuff because a free access software repo kills the Microsoft Store and potential ad revenue)
Need to make a performance and cost performance comparison when using ZFS with NVMe vs using RAID
*Wendell just trying to install software on Windows* "no... no... no... nO.... nOooOOO... NOooOOOoo.... NOOOOOOOO"
Had me in tears as my last week or so on Windows was the same, just hacking through the ads/forced clicks to get anything done was driving me insane. Using Fedora 39 KDE and now using my computer is fun again :D
On the package manager rant, when you’re installing apps on a Mac distributed through PKG files, it tells the operating system “hey, I’m installing stuff. Please don’t install more stuff”
It’s not as sophisticated as some of the locks on Linux, allowing you to do drag and drop installations and App Store installations while PKG installations are in progress, but those other installation types shouldn’t interfere with PKG installers.
One of my favorite things, as a Mac admin, is that Apple allows you to make meta-packages. You can do packages that just run scripts. You can chain together multiple installers into one package. You can build packages that just throw a .app into /Applications. By their powers combined, you can make pretty powerful management action packages.
Sure, you can do basically all of that with EXE installers on windows, but they’re not nearly as standardized. Even if you use install shield or some such
Hi, great intro, gives me confidence to go from single 900p 280gb AIC to dual 900p 280gb, but is worth it??? a used 900p 280gb AIC for US$100+/-10
Weight loss looks good on u bro!
24:55 Either I'm completely misunderstanding the next 30s, or Wendell forgot that Optane is not a NAND-based storage technology
Microsoft has had a history of being found to not be running their products where better alternatives existed; they did put in development work to try to disguise the appearance of such systems though. I've been using chocolatey for years though it still has the annoying bug where you have to pay money to have it detect the version of software that is installed; easy+mandatory workaround is pinning any package that is updated externally and using a program's own autoupdates or getting from original source is still the best way to get quick security updates.
Been working on an AMD RAID issues on my new system. Be wondering if you experienced it or know of it. So the setup is as follows. An Asus x670e motherboard, 4 NVMe slots. Slot 1 and 2 have a pair of 2TB WD SN850x drives on latest firmware. The 3rd slot has a 1TB WD SN850x latest firmware too. Disk 1 and 2 are in a RAID0 and originally I wanted to have Drive 3 as a standalone "Legacy" disk running a Duel boot of Windows 11 Pro. The now RAID0 Array has Windows 11 Pro installed on it. All working fine and preforms really well. However when I go to install the second OS I will ether get to 86% copying files and it pauses for 10min or so, then might get to 100% and pause again. Then fail and ether crash the installer or reset it back to opening screen. Then you might skip that issue and get to 1-3% of getting files ready and it crash again. Once I manged to get the OS installed as far as going though and picking region, setting Wifi and then it crash on naming the PC. (Second OS is going to be intune/Entra ID joined)
I've tried the standalone drive as "legacy" (Clear meta date in RAIDXpert2), or the Jbods Volume type and "Raidable". All do the same crashing during the install. I've ordered a second 1TB SN850x while they are reasonably priced. So I am hoping having it in a RAID0 or 1 with the current drive might allow for the second OS to install. But couldn't find anything in the AMD Raid manual about it. It should be a supported setup.
I've tired a number of things as well as the drive presentations. Including removing the GFX card and running from the 7950X3D (it was like this for the first windows install on the RAID0). Resetting the BIOS to defaults and running completely base BIOS settings. Always the same crashes.
Spec:
AMD Ryzen 9 7950X3D
Asus ROG Strix Gaming x670e-a (updated to latest BIOS as of December and AMD RAID drivers are the latest from both Asus and AMD as in two versions)
32GB of DDR5 6000 CL30 Memory
XFX 7900XTX
2x 2TB WD SN850x
1x 1TB WD SN850x (second to come tomorrow)
Edit: Update 12/02/2024: After posting this I found a readme.rtf in the drivers folder stating a known issue with installing a OS on a second array. Looking back at a version released the previous year (about 1 year ago) This was also present. So not holding my breath on getting that fixed.
As a happy owner of a P4800X I like these kinda videos.
(Edit: early comment) Huh? Of course one can run Optane on AMD platforms - it's PCIe-ish!
That's the beauty of computer science - usually, we take the abstraction layers kind of scenic route. Even Optane/3D-Xpoint "speaks" NVMe, which is, and always has been, afaik, a "dialect" of PCIe. (i remember a few PCper VODcasts, back when Ryan Shroud and the magnificent Malventano still ran the show - i think, they've published an explainer piece - how NVMe is Intel tech, and how they'd had to tweak PCIe …yadda-yadda …optimise it into a new method, now called NVMe) …it's kinda like the OSI model - it's abstraction layers, all the way down.
though using the baby optane consumer cache drives as cache with the intel software had some hardware checks and sometimes manufacturers had their own release with its own checks.
Query: What's the realistic difference between Winget or another package manager and Ninite, at least for when you're setting up the initial programs?
My computer is powered by AMD! It's a blast of threadrippin' exuberance!
This video reconfirms why I switched from Windows to Linux many years ago. The best part is that Linux has improved a lot since I switched. Nothing is perfect, Linux has its own set of warts and frustrations, but it's nothing comparable to Windows.
Amazing content!
How does it (does it?) work in Linux for a dual boot system?
Does AMD’s “new” chipset RAID software that is offered for X670E also work on X570?
Linux distributions’ HDR and 10 bit per channel colors handling is also preventing it from further proliferating on the desktop - at least in my case.
That is thanks to proprietary bullshit and 0 standards, not Linux issue, remember FLOSS like linux is community maintained, nothing stops you from making your own solution.
While I fundamentally understand your statement, sit back, reflect a while and then try to close the circle to the issue of “Why does the year of the Linux desktop always seem to be next year?”.
@@abavariannormiepleb9470 I have been daily driving Linux Mint since 2 years now as a complete noob.
And i'm incredibly happy of having done so, windows just gives a lot of headaches, the only reason HDR works there is because they had economical incentives and also because consoles have basically the same code anyways.
With how horrible microsoft is at everything except at manipulating the market in an anti-competitive way. I don't care, i won't give them money in any way anymore.
A large part of that has been the slow transition to Wayland. X11 is no longer really being developed, and Wayland has had bigger fish to fry in terms of usibility. We are slowly seeing the first steps on HDR, plasma 6 supports it, of course that does not mean applications will use it yet but steps are now clearly being made.
plug and play? the latest AMD mobile cpu killed 2 of my Optane drives trying to use them as boot drives.
That case looks dope, who makes that?
I can't get any Optane since I live in EU... They cost 2k eur here, not 400 :(
i was forced into a new Intel laptop running Windows 11 at work today. it was a sad day. I hate everything about it compared to my previous AMD Windows 10 laptop. time to get a new job I guess
Im building a server atm using just an old Threadripper 2920X(might upgrade tot he 16core/32 thread version since those are stil around for cheap), 128gigs of ram, AMD 6600(non XT)gpu, tons of storage, 16 enterprise 6TB HDD's, gonna use Unraid installing Unraid on a NVMe m.2 SSD, looking forward to using it, it's mainly gonna be for storage and video encoding. It would be fun to have 16 of those Intel Optane 905P drives instead but im a lowly peon with a normal job not getting paid much..lol ...I would also love to try the new threadripper systems, but also can't afford them, so hope this adventure with an old gen2 threadripper goes well..lol
Alternative title: "The state of managing packages and apps on Windows in 2024"
May be a dumb question but what server chassis is this?
Unrelated to this video but I had a question. I have a NAS and it's running truenas core. I recently bought 2x netapp ds2246 disk shelves which also came with a full compliment of 600gb sas drives. All for around $500.
I installed a Broadcom 9500-16e into the NAS, and it can only see 1 disk shelf. If I switch the cable to the other disk shelf it'll appear. But both together will not populate (only 1 populates)
Any insights?
you bother to google the netapp model and truenas? first result.
Does it do TRIM?
Just reaffirmed my use of Chocolatey over winget lol
If i had 128 GB RAM in my home server, would a 118 GB Optane drive give me issues beacause it wont map well? thanks!
That is a sweet looking waterblock at the start of the video
How much is the latency penalty on AMD for Optane in RAID 0?
Win11. Yup.
I simply make my way through installing each app but I have a thumb drive with a software folder and installing on NVMe is fast so it's easy enough. Yes I update the software on the thumb drive from time to time.
I have to edit the registry to fix Win Explorer to get back the old context menu, then do a handful of changes to make it more Win10 like and then after that it doesn't bother me. I get rid of most the things that Win11 puts onto the taskbar and put on the things I want there, shift the start button to the left, etc...................
What is the point of using a raid volume? How does the OS manage what gets stored on one before it fills up and begins using the other? I don't think I would want to leave to chance windows using optane for my 100gb of cat pics when it could be used for more productive things...
The OS doesn't manage this, the RAID operates below the filesystem. In this setup each drive is split into 256 kilobyte chunks and then the chunks are interleaved. For any file over 256k in size it is split across both drives.
@@eDoc2020 that sounds like raid 0, I thought the volume setup was more like "make 2 look like 1" but not actually interleave anything
@@BAD_CONSUMER Wendell was using RAID0 mode. I didn't realize you were asking about the mode he didn't use. That mode just concatenates disks. Accesses to the first half go to the first drive and accesses to the second half go to the second drive. This could be useful if you have drives of differing sizes and need them to show up as one, otherwise it's stupid.
I may be biased here as a 20+ years linux user who has been booting off of encrypted root partitions on software raids for what feels forever, but man I'm always baffled how cumbersome it still is to do the easiest things on Windows. Starting with, you know, just install the darn thing including some basic software to make it usable - not even talking about this dance just to get your root on raid. Can't agree more with Wendell here, really surprised that Microsoft with all their resources and running the most used desktop OS still haven't figured out basic things like package management.
I flipped from AMD raid to Storage Spaces for my win11. Was a matter of concern of whether trim was supported, and time to experiment.
Oddly Storage Spaces can't be enabled for a boot raid, although it's been achieved on some version of a surface tablet.
Certainly the win11 oobe is awful, and ntlite is a godsend to that nightmare.
Well it makes sense that a software raid(ish) solution can’t be done on a boot drive because you’d need the software on the disk to get the raid started. Kind of a chicken and egg problem.
@@harrychufan well, somehow it gets kicked off with the EFI MsHyperspaceDriver. It's beyond me how that could be generalized for PC and not just the Surface Pro.
We need BIOS manufacturers to support MD for booting.
I use small Optanes as boot drives for arm SBCs lol
Is the ostinato in your theme music The Lick? If so.... nice!
WIndows store can be so bad because nobody is using it unless they absolutely have to or have no idea what they're doing on a PC anyhow.
I need the soundbite of Wendell saying no
well back in day we had motherboard with a chipset and socket that you could use both AMD and Intel cpu in.
but in the end there come a spilt in the road
one wanted to bring Personal Computer to more people, with more backward and forward compatibility,
but the other Just wanted to make a lot of money.
AMD also used to be a secondary manufacturer of the intel chips. I remember AMD also making upgrade replacements for older intel chips to run at higher speeds. Even after they started building their own media instructions and sockets started to diverge you had at least one company (ecs? i dont remember) try to make it so you could use either on 1 board.
Isn't "Ninite" easy/safer to use to get programs and "Shut-up 10/11" good to use to help with privacy/annoyances from Microsoft?
Can ninite batch update all programs installed through it?
"Sleeper agents secretly making the desktop experience worse."
I wish it was something that interesting. No... it is just consistently bad decisions by OSS devs.
Wendel is looking good.
@3:34 not yet - we need to wait for newegg to have another fire sale...
OK, you bought the 905P...me too...
I wish I had a need for a large Optane drive like that. I truly don't though, at least not yet.
is there a way (adapter) to connect an U.2 / EDSFF PCIe5x4 drive (kioxia) to a M.2 PCIe5x4 slot ?
A U.2 to M.2 adapter cable...
They're also called: M.2 Key M to U.2 SFF-8639 NVMe Adapter
The 4.0 cables/adapters *generally* support 5.0 speeds.
The 3.0 cables/adapters generally do *not* support 4.0 or 5.0, only 3.0 and below.
"Delock M.2 Key M to U.2 SFF-8639 NVMe Adapter with 50 cm cable" is a suitable choice for guaranteed "at least 4.0" speeds.
Again, it *should* work at 5.0 and make sure you do thorough testing/validation/blah blah blah before you use in production or at scale.
If you want to be super-safe, just set the m.2 slot to 4.0.
I don't believe any cables/adapters are fully certified to work at 5.0.
You could try reaching out to Kioxia to see if they have a recommendation for 5.0(?).
RAISE HALE PRAISE DALE Let's gooooooooo low latency storage! This is crazy and I'm here for it baby!
Wow, the crap people who use windows have to go through just to install a device driver (more than one) is mind boggling!
I don't have an optane drive, but I'm pretty sure that if I installed one, and booted up my Linux PC, the kernel will already have the drivers and load them, and the drive would be ready to configure and partition.
I am using AM5 B650 and I am us Raid as a boot drive
The more I use my new linux (pop-os) laptop... the more I HATE my Windows desktop..... so frustrating
Is optane still obtainable in the EU?
I think you can find _some_ Optane stuff. But it seems to be at least twice as expensive as in the US, sometimes much more. :(
amd and intel - oil and water
standards - emulsifier
Wendall can... I can't. 😊