The corridor for helicopter traffic is no higher than 200' feet and further to the east, the collision occurred higher than that. The pilot of the helicopter wasn't where they were suppose to be.
3 PEOPLE made errors that caused this. 1. Chopper Pilot was flying too high at 350 feet, and should have been under 200 feet. ATC did NOT correct the Chopper's flight altitude and then changed Eagle flight 5342 on to a runway that would put it in the direct path of the Chopper. The ATC supervisors sent the second Controller home early leaving only one controller to manage everything. Come back to my comment in 2 years when they finally admit all this. 1. Chopper over allowed Altitude. 2. No Correction by ATC. 3. ATC Changed Eagle flight 5342 to a different runway last minute that put it on track with the Chopper. 4. Under staffed control tower.
@@VoiceOfTruthSpeaks i agree with #1, #2 once the helicopter pilot stated they had traffic in sight ATC turned visual separation over to to the helicopter crew. #3 that is a common thing and the crew of PSA accepted it meaning they had no problem doing it
can't the ATC see that? maybe i'm wrong but I do not recall the ATC relaying the misposition of the blackhawk. Does ATC not see the elevation of the helicopter due to it being a military copter?
@@VoiceOfTruthSpeaks Wow, look at you… you solved the whole investigation from the comfort of your couch. You don’t even need the black boxes or any background education/knowledge on how aviation works. Amazing… someone get this fella an NTSB jacket and a hefty salary.
Yup, let's stop trying to shift blame onto the plane or the tower. You have a helicopter that was restricted to 200 ft, ramming a plane at 350-400ft, even though the plane was clearly visible and the tower warned them twice. Helicopter is 100% responsible for this accident that was 100% avoidable.
@@sophieedel6324 There is another aircraft in the picture to, and since it was night time with a LOT of flashing lights all over the place, it would be easy to identify the wrong air craft as in the one that was taking off and they could have figured that was the one to follow. The other factor was the separate radio frequencies in use. The only person that would have heard both sides of the conversation is the atc. The blackhawk would only have heard anything from the controller and NOT the other aircraft, and the same with CRJ as they would have NOT heard anything from the blackhawk, With all the things happening with ATC with separate radio frequencies and staff shortage, the CRJ's (Both of them) and their positions taking off and approach and from the same company, its night time which is hellish to fly in on the best of days, and the blackhawk busting altitude the swiss cheese was perfectly lined up for the crash. I think you are going to find it will be a combination of things that broke and not just one factor.
@@MrFturner ATC did not give approval to pass the same position at the same time. The visual separation requires maintaining appropriate horizontal separation to go with the mandatory 200' vertical ceiling! The helo can stop and indicated they saw the plane. ATC directed them to pass behind the plane (maintaining visual separation from the plane they claimed to see).
@@MrFturnerI just saw someone read the CVR of the CRJ. They heard the transmission to/from PAT. At literally the last second, the CRJ received an ACARS warning “Traffic, Traffic”. It apparently does not give avoidance guidance like “descend, descend” when below 1000’ so as not to drive you into the ground. I think they also said that there was an abrupt pitch change input, which makes me think maybe the pilot saw it 3/4 second before impact.
@@davidblurton7158 I agree, don’t like him either and he’s obviously not responsible for this accident… but he is responsible for that horrific press conference yesterday morning, barely 12 hours after the crash. It was extremely insulting to the families.
@rohanlawrence If that is so, it is beyond comprehension that a suicidal person would want to take others down with him. A suicidal pilot is one explanation for the disappearance of the Malaysian flight a number of years ago. OK, you want to top yourself, but why take others with you?
@rohanlawrence Quite implausible. Would a suicidal pilot hit a civilian airliner? That would also require psychopathy. Always look for the simplest explanation. More likely the pilot was confused, careless, cocky, or didn't like following rules (in a place they assumed was safe). Those are more common behaviors.
Very possible. He could also have been playing chicken, which is also suicidal in a way. Seeing how close he can get the plane. There are now other videos of near misses in the same area. In all these cases, it looks like the helicopter is deliberately going toward the plane. Not just staying on course, but changing course to get closer. Maybe it's a bragging right for the military pilots.
I was a crew chief when I was in the service, and anytime we fly in the city, or around other air traffic all of us would always look around all the time and make sure to call out if anything doesn't look right
500 and 1,000 hours is not “a lot”. 500 hours is the minimum for basic proficiency. That is the level at which experience creates a confidence level where the frequency peak of accidents occurs.
Yes, as usual the MSNBC reporter was wrong & sounded foolish. Even by the interviewee's non verbal action, he disagreed! 500 hrs by the female captain piloting the helo is very low for that situation. Why was she fast-tracked to be there to begin with? THAT answer will also be Be investigated!
Kids talk, heli was told plane incoming at 33, so it had to be at 11 o'çlock. There was no other plane at 11 o'çlock. They were told to go behind plane, they did not go behind any plane.
Thank you mr. Bowman to be the first I have heard to confirm the ability to hold ones position with a helicopter. During landing and take off procedures at an airport nothing should be crossing the path of the plane doing the action. Just halt for a couple of seconds, it doesn't cost that much. You just don't want to be in such a position for a crash.
@telebubba5527 He hinted at the problem. Often these missions transport "high value" officials, like politicians or foreign officials. Big headed people don't want "their helicopter" to wait, especially not for an airliner full of "common people". The FAA should set a new rule, to MAKE THEM WAIT (but trump's FAA won't).
The helicopter flight crew was not in the proper air corridor along the eastern bank of the Potomac River but rather in the middle. They clearly did not comprehend runway 33's approach pattern over the river. Perhaps they believed all the traffic was using runway 1 and therefore, they were careless in flying over the middle. They clearly misidentified the landing/acquisition lights of DCA arriving/departing aircraft when they requested visual separation from air traffic control. It was their responsibility to identify and avoid.
I agree, I think they were not expecting a turning aircraft to rnwy 33. Initially, the CRJ would of been above and to their left. The tragedy is that they changed the CRJ from runway 1, which is to the left of the river...When they changed to 33, they extended their path to the right of the river.
I agree. And what an brilliant Idea to fly around in the landing path of airliners. This should not happen, because humans can fail. Better not to fly there.
He didn’t answer if the 6 million dollar helicopter had a warning signal for altitude similar to my $40,000 car that warns me if I start to move out of a lane on the freeway! This is absolutely unbelievable!
@ How is that possible? Safety systems on my car work while it’s on the ground and also lane keeping system in my car alerts within inches of moving out of the lane. The helicopter was 200 feet over the 200 foot altitude limit. Also the camera that showed the crash was miles away! How could the helicopter pilots not see the plane! That helicopter crew must have been doing something other than what they should have been doing!
Why is is this NOT suicide? The Blackhawk pilot was clearly warned of the the regional jet 30 seconds before impact, the night was so clear that cameras miles away were able to capture the aircraft course and collision, the Blackhawk was flying 200 feet above the maximum altitude it should have been flying, and we know now that the Blackhawk had veered off course. And finally, the pilot was a very experienced pilot with more than a 1,000 hours of flight time. Everything about this collision is beginning to look very intentional to me. As crazy as it sounds, they should investigate this as a possible suicide. Instead of asking questions, the air traffic controller should have instructed and demanded that the Blackhawk pilot change its flight path; for example, BANK LEFT!!!, BANK RIGHT!!! PULL UP!!!, or DIVE!!! Had he done so, there might have been a different outcome. Unless, this was suicide! Also, with all the flight experience this pilot had, he absolutely should have known that they were entering a flightpath corridor dedicated to commercial aircraft landing at that airport. I also find it interesting that the pilot confirmed that he had a visual on an aircraft, but if he mistook which aircraft, the pilot missed the aircraft that was right in front of him. Given the clear night that it was, it makes no sense to me that he could miss a well-lit aircraft right in front of him. Sad, but may be true!
More likely they surely knew they were high, and didn't care because they assumed it was safe. They saw no planes in the area. A FATAL assumption. Meanwhile, the pres teaches everyone, "rules are for losers." They ignored rules.
The military craft has been estimated to have been at 350 ft. That alone tells me this was not an “accident”. The trajectory adds to it but alone would not be enough to scream this was not an accident due to night vision, reflection of lights, etc. HOWEVER the sustained trajectory at that elevation does scream NOT an accident. How much of this will never get disclosed as to facts? We may never know.
Why are you ignoring the published communications between Air Traffic Control and the Blackhawk, which clearly show Air Traffic Control did everything properly? This accident is entirely on the Blackhawk pilots who repeatedly assured Air Control that they could see the airplane and were maintaining proper distance -- until they crashed into the airplane.
indeed, tower informed helo, with minutes before, about inbound traffic, then helo asked visual separation, tower approved, then helo confirmed aircraft in sight... why helo goes straight to that plane and with that speed is very strange..
Everything Bowman stated in this interview indicates that Helicopter was at the wrong altitude and didn't see the plane he ultimately collided with. Another Blackhawk pilot stated that even though the helicopter pilot confirmed separation with the tower he was probably looking at the wrong plane. And airline pilot, Capt. Steve said the same thing. That also stated that we still have to wait for the investigation to determine the cause.
But which plane? There were two!Whose fault was it that the plane that was landing wasn't properly observed? Was it the helicopter pilots who presumably had no instrumentation to tell them where exactly to look for the plane, or was it the air traffic controller who saw exactly where all the planes and helicopters were in real time? Should the controller have given the pilots the coordinates to look for the plane?
@@KOFAKEDEMThe TCAS system is automatically disabled below 1000ft. Neither plane was getting alerts. The AIRPORT is inherently unsafe. They had a near miss the previous day.
I don't think anyone is ignoring the ATC communication, at this point in aviation if a mid air collision is happening, it's not just due to pilot error, layers of safety protocols, tools and procedures has been created to prevent this and the fact that it has happened means a multi dimensional problem NTSB is not formed to call out people mistakes, it happens all the time, it's to create safety barriers to prevent it from happening next time These safety barriers all failed together for this accident : 1- helo pilot to monitor and maintain their altitude 2- standard visual separation protocol has failed miserably since 3- TCAS is unable to issue RA under 1000ft and for some reason it's normal warning also has been ignored, it didn't have the expected effect
The Blackhawk pilot was told exactly where the CRJ was by ATC and the Blackhawk crew acknowledged it. DCA Tower: PAT25, traffic just south of the Woodrow Bridge, a CRJ, it's 1200 feet setting up for runway 33. (approximately 1 min to incident) Anybody flying this corridor regularly would know exactly where just south of the Woodrow Bridge is. The Blackhawk also was out of the corridor reserved for that traffic and 100-150 feet above their allotted airspace. ( 300-350 feet at impact ). It's worked for years until it didn't. Human beings are not infallible.
Yup. Had this all gone right, the UH60 would have been no higher than 200ft, accurately identified the CRJ, ensured it had passed by and THEN proceeded 'behind' it per the ATC instruction (and their own request for visual separation). A lot of folks seem to think they were supposed to cross the same spot at the same time at the same speeds with only a hundred or so feet of vertical separation. Not true.
The other thing that bothers me is that early on the Blackhawk pilot said "in sight" and they were quite a ways upriver, which was kind of hard to believe.
Flying military helicopters across the path of commercial planes must introduce a risk for those on the commercial planes. Did anyone ask the passenfers and crews on those commercial flights if this risk is acceptible to them? I image lawyers for the families that have lost family members will be asking this question in court.
@RWROW Yes! Unfortunately last year SCOTUS ruled that public officials can't be sued in civil court, even if they're found to have done wrongful things. WE'RE LOSING OUR RIGHTS while the ULTRA-RICH (not just oligarchs) are taking over.
Good interview Katy, you asked a lot of key questions and it was interesting some of his answers. I don't think the Blackhawk saw it or was alert to it ,
The Federal Aviation Administration is fighting a class-action lawsuit alleging it denied 1,000 would-be air traffic controllers jobs because of diversity hiring targets. It was revealed that staffing levels were “not normal” at the time of this week’s deadly midair collision.
FULFILLING PROMISE TO END ILLEGAL DISCRIMINATION AND BRING BACK COMMON SENSE: This Presidential Memorandum builds on President Trump’s day-one Executive Order ending the Biden Administration’s illegal and immoral DEI discrimination programs. In his inaugural address, President Trump promised: ““We will forge a society that is colorblind and merit-based.” President Trump stated in his January 20, 2025 Executive Order on Ending Radical and Wasteful Government DEI Programs and Preferencing: “Americans deserve a government committed to serving every person with equal dignity and respect, and to expending precious taxpayer resources only on making America great.”
@@davidgiles9651 we do know that the Blackhawk acknowledged they had visual. It's on publicly available ATC recordings. If they didn't identify the wrong aircraft they had visual to, the only alternative is that they flew into the CRJ intentionally, which would make this even worse.
@@davidgiles9651 that is incorrect. There was another aircraft approaching a couple miles behind (AAL3130), also, another aircraft that just took off (AAL1630). They could have mistaken either one for the CRJ.
His expression when she overstated that 1,000 and 500 hrs was "alot" of experience is telling. Those are very low times. Neither have even close to the minimum required experience to be a regional airline co pilot let alone PIC. The low experience Black Hawk pilots deviated in altitude and the requirement to maintain visual separation.
Indeed, the helo pilots were blinded by the landing spotlights of the airliner straight in front eye to eye. A little confused what to do now...maybe thinking being involved in a kamikaze online game.
20 years ago the number of airplanes or helicopters flying in that airspace has probably increased..and lights and buildings have also probably increased.
Both were VFR… making right of way for the airplane. Tower ATC is advisory only… I would say the tower is culpable… putting the two aircraft on a collision course, but the helicopter is at legal fault, regardless of altitude.
ATC did not give approval to pass the same position at the same time. The visual separation requires maintaining appropriate horizontal separation to go with the mandatory 200' vertical ceiling!
@ Tower ATC for aircraft in the air, is advisory only for VFR aircraft. Both aircraft were VFR. CRJ was on an instrument flight plan until they accepted the visual for RWY 33. When both aircraft are VFR, the helicopter must see, avoid, and give way to the airplane. Sad, because the tower controller advised them into the bad situation… had the CRJ still be IFR, ATC would be at fault for not providing separation. However… this also depends on the instrument minimums. The helicopter had no where to go, couldn’t push the cyclic to descend or they would likely would have had a tail strike. Couldn’t turn right to Washington National, couldn’t turn left into the traffic… looks like a last ditch effort to do a quick stop which explains the small altitude gained. If they saw the CRJ coming at them, the difference between 300 and 500ft… likely was non discernible.
I don't know much about aviation, but from what we hear, is there a possibility that it was intentional from the helicopter pilot? Is it technically possible to do that?
US militarism does a lot of unethical things (proxy war that's wiping out Ukrainians being one example you probably support), but taking out this jet on purpose is highly unlikely.
Dual control aircraft with Student and instructor at the controls. Ultimately, the Instructor is responsible for oversight and failed to manage route constraints.
Yes, when she said that he raised his eyebrows and kind of shrugged his shoulders. I think he was going to say it's really not that many hours, but changed his mind.
Kathy Tur here says that 500 hours is "a lot of flight hour experience". I saw an interview with a Black Hawk pilot who said it is NOT. He said it was very low experience
To all experienced pilots, have you ever had ATC ask if you have plane insight without giving direction altitude? WBC1995 @ your 3 0'clock 3 miles, 1,000' on final approach, do you have American Eagle Flight 5342 insight?
Go back and listen to the conversation, ATC referenced the plane's position to a known bridge, altitude was 1200' and on final approach to runway 33. So. . .this was done about 1 minute before the last exchange with the helo!
If that recreation they showed at the beginning is accurate it is chilling. It really looked like the helo slowed down and climbed directly in front of the jet. Something is bad wrong if that is accurate.
The helicopter, Ms.Katy, wasn't a little bit off! It was, at least, 200-250 feet off! And the experts say - 500 flight hours are not a lot at all! And ATC controllers should've warned the helicopter about dangerous proximity with the landing jet! How the helicopter's pilots didn't see the the huge jet right in front of them? They ran just straight into it - like suicidal "kamikaze"! As a result of that - 64 passengers lost their lives!!! What a tragedy for those who lost their loved ones. Thank you Mr. Bowman! You the one, who gave us the professional, detailed analysis of the tragedy that could've been avoided.
Blackhawk was exceeding altitude 200' max. ATC gave clearance for altitude, vector, speed directly into oncoming inbound traffic on final, which has "priority". ATC Tower has complete 100% control of ALL aircrafts, directions, altitude. "Do you see aircraft in sight?" Should have been, DO YOU SEE AIRCRAFT AT YOUR 1 o'clock @ altitude 600?
Go back and listen to the conversation, ATC referenced the plane's position to a known bridge, altitude was 1200' and on final approach to runway 33. So. . .this was done about 1 minute before the last exchange with the helo!
@northernlights6984 It isn't important. The only way the name would be important is if the pilot is related to a prominent gov official (like Hegseth or McConnell). Otherwise, no one should care.
No reason for the Military to be playing chicken with Civilian aircraft, sorry but NO. Never should have happened and I'm glad that President Trump is putting a stop to it.
Answering a direct question with many many words without answering the question means the question was asked correctly and was answered in the affirmative.
DCA Tower: PAT25, traffic just south of the woodrow Bridge, a CRJ, it's 1200 feet, setting up for runway 33. (approximately 1 min to incident) DCA Tower: PAT25 Do you have CRJ in sight? (approximately 20 seconds to Incident). and then immediately after that DCA Tower: Pass behind the CRJ (final visual instruction). Total duration from the 2nd visual Instruction from the ATC to the incident: 20 Seconds ATC spotted PAT25 is danger close and asked if CRJ is in sight and instructed to PASS Behind within 2 seconds. PAT25 completely overlooked JIA5342 and probably didn't hear PASS BEHIND. 20 seconds are enough time to perform necessary maneuvering. ATC sounded uneasy from the 2nd warning, growing increasingly concerned until sheer shock set in as both aircraft came dangerously close. It could be possible that PAT25 visualized the wrong aircraft but also didn't react to the verbal warning from the ATC to PASS BEHIND JIA5342. It is not finger pointing but the facts based on the recordings. ATC did realize 20 seconds prior to the incident that PAT25 is still not behind the CJR but continued on its course south. There is absolutely no way you cant spot the plane based on the last 7 seconds before the impact. Either the PAT25 pilot was looking at the instruments or on the other side puzzled with where the heck is this plane that he needs to go behind. The instructions were given to spot the plane and go behind 20 seconds before the impact.
There was only one ATC at the desk instead of two. The lone ATC was handling both copter and plane traffic. The crew of the copter was short handed as well for the mission...
Army Blackhawk with a crew of 3 instead of 4. Army pilots who couldn’t fly with instruments flew too high & off course. ATC had nothing to do with that. It’s all Army!!!
The chopper told atc they could see the planr. ATC shiuld have said ...well there's one taking off and 1 right in front of you. Drop to 200 ft and move out of this flight path, immediately. Why are people so afraid to speak up! You see what's happening. Ask better questions, inform the pilot who is about to be smashed, and use your authority to course correct. 3 -5 years of traing....for what?!? To be told exactly what to do because every situation will be the same?!? Sad!!!!
Why is it necessary to fly army officers and politicians around in an expensive military helicopter when driving is an option? Wouldn't that be more economical? Or does cost not matter when it's tax money?
@@vitalsigns2679I can tell you that had no effect on the crash. Just because people file a lawsuit, that doesn't create conditions for a plane crash. Checkmate.
How many pilots should have been on that helicopter? I’ve heard 4, but there were only 3-making it impossible to have optimal vision. Thus resulting in the crash.
Plain and simple……it was their FATE There wasn’t “just one” factor that contributed to the collision. ATC, the military, both made more than 2 mistakes. And it cost lives
Who thought it was a good idea allowing exercises with night goggles over civilian airports. The department that approved this needs a fulltime babysitter, because that defies all common sense.
under 1000 feet there is almost no room for error, and that being said ive seen stories that with the civilian congestion might of confused the helicopter pilot as to which plane they where looking for , the hubris youtube aviation experts is astounding
By the time anyone even seen what was happening, the brain didn’t even have process time. Why did the highly trained military pilot suddenly climbed to 350? And where the traffic, traffic.
So, what we have learned is that there is only a 100 foot safety zone to protect civilian flyers. One Hundred feet separate you from ending up in the Potomac when landing
@@JesusNonEnviromental ATC did not give approval to pass the same position at the same time. The visual separation requires maintaining appropriate horizontal separation to go with the mandatory 200' vertical ceiling! So, minimum separation is not only the anticipated vertical distance of 200'. The helo can slow or come to a complete stop to maintain appropriate separation. In fact, ATC directed them to pass behind the plane.
the helicopter route needs to go along the east side of the river instead of in the middle of the river, the glide slope for runway 33 is much higher there while the helicopter would still maintain lower altitude
The helicopter knew the flight path. They knew that they should stay below 200ft. They knew why that is. To eliminate the chance of colliding with incoming airplanes. You can safely assume that that crew wouldn't want to take hat risk. Still they ended up there in restricted air space where they didn't want to go. Why? Something clearly went very wrong on that shopper. But what? And for that answer we need the investigation be done with due diligence. It will take a couple of months before we will know.
@albertvandermeulen1177 Have you never met a cocky 28 year old? One who believes "I know what I'm doing is safe right now," while they bend the rules. Cocky. Confused. Careless. Ignore rules (because "it's safe"). Each explains it.
Before all of you backseat pilots jump to conclusions and move to punish the pilots of the helicopter remember that there are reasons other than pilot error that can lead to flying at the wrong altitude. Considering the complexity of the system that manages air traffic around major airports we all need to take a breath and let the professionals do their jobs and determine the root cause of this horrible disaster. We all want to know what happened, but we need to know the facts, not someone's version of the truth.
The plane was on the prescribed flight path for runway 33. ATC provided clear location and flight path information to the helo in response to the visual separation request. No need for disparaging (cannot punish lost loved-ones), but no need to misplace fault.
@gordonshaffer5560 The UH60 pilot knew the rules for routes 1 & 4. They were trained that 200 feet was the max ceiling near runway 33 (for obvious reasons). If they're headed straight to that area, and their craft rose too much, they should have informed ATC. No transmit before the crash. You'd hear a squalk or something. So unlikely that happened. More likely they didn't see the CRJ on final (because it was just above and to their left), and they had lost situational awareness. If they had NVG, that would have made it worse. This is why rules are so critical, in congested airspace. I agree we should wait for NTSB's prelim report, and 1+ years for the final one. In the mean time, people want things to make sense. It explains idle speculation.
For the love of…I can’t leave my refrigerator open for more than 15 seconds before something starts sending an alert that notifies my entire block. In this case the Blackhawk said yes we see the plane and that was it?? Which plane, where are the coordinates?
Go back and listen to the conversation, ATC referenced the plane's position to a known bridge, altitude was 1200' and on final approach to runway 33. So. . .this was done about 1 minute before the last exchange with the helo!
@@barbarajohnson8968 guessing it was so that other planes could take off from RWY01...previous plane had been asked to switch too, but pilot said "unable". The CRJ accepted the change (they need to quickly reconfigure their computer (FMS) to the new runway. It's pretty common, and the pilot is free to deny the request. Quite possible that the collision would have still occurred given the Blackhawk's bad positioning.
So, if you take a different route to the store and have an accident. Changing routes caused the wreck? Planes takeoff and land on both runways! Go back and listen to the conversation, ATC referenced the plane's position to a known bridge, altitude was 1200' and on final approach to runway 33. So. . .the plane's path was communicated to the helo about 1 minute before the final exchange with the helo!
@@jcarlock4362 So, if you take a different route to the store and have an accident. Changing routes caused the wreck? Depends on if you changed lanes without looking in your sideview mirrors or not use your blinkers RECKON it could cause an accident. (EWE) need to Go back and listen to the conversation again.
@WatchingThemWatchingYou ATC informs the helo of the plane's position, altitude at 1200', and path to runway 33. Neither the ATC nor plane changed lanes on an adjacent vehicle. No one was near them and their planned path was clearly communicated.
500 hours is NOT A LOT. Another spokesperson said the numbers were 250 flight, 500 hours. I was sailplane/glider pilot. Commercial Pilot, Glider license, Flight Instructor, Glider certificate. I was involved in an accident. I had 1000 flights and 500 hours (glider flights tend to be
The helo was above the 200 ft floor but from seeing other videos, helos seem not to adhere to that floor. The other tragedy is that the CRJ was asked to change runways moments before being committed to runway 1, which would of placed it left of the river, so it would been a non issue. Possibly affecting situational awareness of the helo crew was that, the CRJ would be initially above and to the left, maybe they thought it was not the landing aircraft. Most likely, they were not expecting it to turn to runway 33...
No one else is talking about the fact that the airplane was asked to switch to runway 33!! I also think this could have contributed to the confusion and crash. Why did ATC change the runway in the final moments?🤔
We already KNOW she was above 200 feet. She wouldn't have run into the jet if she wasn't. What we want to know is her name and why they are hiding it from us. The pilot that was flying. The one with 500 hours, which to me doesn't sound like a lot.
Did the pilot and co-pilot have "a lot" of experience? We know that the co-pilot did not. MSNBC made that point, which could be false, and did NOT ask the expert if that was true.
You expect, ATC to monitor your ,Heli altitude throughout !!?? Really ? They can't baby sit..your pilots messed up ..big time ..do not try to sugar cost
One ATC-----2 aircraft on different frequencies is starting to add another layer to this! The copter going to 300' I think is a human error as they thought they were at the Woodrow Wilson bridge and were allowed the 100' elevation change.
She's not very bright - a 1000 hrs and 500 hrs is very little time in fact, so little that a pilot with these times would not qualify to fly forest fire flying in the Province of Ontario
Prayers to all those that have lost a loved one.
Amen. 🙏
The corridor for helicopter traffic is no higher than 200' feet and further to the east, the collision occurred higher than that. The pilot of the helicopter wasn't where they were suppose to be.
It's going out of its way to meet its destiny
3 PEOPLE made errors that caused this. 1. Chopper Pilot was flying too high at 350 feet, and should have been under 200 feet. ATC did NOT correct the Chopper's flight altitude and then changed Eagle flight 5342 on to a runway that would put it in the direct path of the Chopper. The ATC supervisors sent the second Controller home early leaving only one controller to manage everything. Come back to my comment in 2 years when they finally admit all this. 1. Chopper over allowed Altitude. 2. No Correction by ATC. 3. ATC Changed Eagle flight 5342 to a different runway last minute that put it on track with the Chopper. 4. Under staffed control tower.
@@VoiceOfTruthSpeaks i agree with #1, #2 once the helicopter pilot stated they had traffic in sight ATC turned visual separation over to to the helicopter crew. #3 that is a common thing and the crew of PSA accepted it meaning they had no problem doing it
can't the ATC see that? maybe i'm wrong but I do not recall the ATC relaying the misposition of the blackhawk. Does ATC not see the elevation of the helicopter due to it being a military copter?
@@VoiceOfTruthSpeaks Wow, look at you… you solved the whole investigation from the comfort of your couch. You don’t even need the black boxes or any background education/knowledge on how aviation works. Amazing… someone get this fella an NTSB jacket and a hefty salary.
Incredible, articulate response to explain the situation, context, and curiosity. Thank you, sir, for your continued service.
Chuckle.
Lol😂
That blackhawk flew right into a plane with its light on!
Yeah. With plenty of time. Not buying this story.
Helicopter was at 350 ft. in a 200 ft max. PAT25 helicopter was 100% at fault.
Yup, let's stop trying to shift blame onto the plane or the tower. You have a helicopter that was restricted to 200 ft, ramming a plane at 350-400ft, even though the plane was clearly visible and the tower warned them twice. Helicopter is 100% responsible for this accident that was 100% avoidable.
@@sophieedel6324 There is another aircraft in the picture to, and since it was night time with a LOT of flashing lights all over the place, it would be easy to identify the wrong air craft as in the one that was taking off and they could have figured that was the one to follow. The other factor was the separate radio frequencies in use. The only person that would have heard both sides of the conversation is the atc. The blackhawk would only have heard anything from the controller and NOT the other aircraft, and the same with CRJ as they would have NOT heard anything from the blackhawk, With all the things happening with ATC with separate radio frequencies and staff shortage, the CRJ's (Both of them) and their positions taking off and approach and from the same company, its night time which is hellish to fly in on the best of days, and the blackhawk busting altitude the swiss cheese was perfectly lined up for the crash. I think you are going to find it will be a combination of things that broke and not just one factor.
@@MrFturner ATC did not give approval to pass the same position at the same time. The visual separation requires maintaining appropriate horizontal separation to go with the mandatory 200' vertical ceiling! The helo can stop and indicated they saw the plane. ATC directed them to pass behind the plane (maintaining visual separation from the plane they claimed to see).
@@MrFturnerI just saw someone read the CVR of the CRJ.
They heard the transmission to/from PAT.
At literally the last second, the CRJ received an ACARS warning “Traffic, Traffic”. It apparently does not give avoidance guidance like “descend, descend” when below 1000’ so as not to drive you into the ground.
I think they also said that there was an abrupt pitch change input, which makes me think maybe the pilot saw it 3/4 second before impact.
Bottom line is that the helicopter exceeded the 200 foot limit in this restricted zone. Estimated to have been at around 350-400 feet.
Thanks for your expertise..
That’s not enough distance.
THE JET WAS ON FINAL APPROACH, IT'S THE HELICOPTERS PILOT WHO IS SOLELY RESPONSIBLE
It was trumps fault no one else
@@angle8676 as much as i hate the orange baboon cant pin this on anyone but the helo pilot,,
just so sad and a small mistake punished so badly
@@davidblurton7158 I agree, don’t like him either and he’s obviously not responsible for this accident… but he is responsible for that horrific press conference yesterday morning, barely 12 hours after the crash. It was extremely insulting to the families.
drumpf will say this never would have happened if the helicopter didnt have that woke dei name. drumpf will fix it by renaming it the WHITE hawk
Is it possible the Blackhawk pilot was simply suicidal?...Such a Glaring Error...Inconceivable
@rohanlawrence If that is so, it is beyond comprehension that a suicidal person would want to take others down with him. A suicidal pilot is one explanation for the disappearance of the Malaysian flight a number of years ago. OK, you want to top yourself, but why take others with you?
@rohanlawrence Quite implausible. Would a suicidal pilot hit a civilian airliner? That would also require psychopathy. Always look for the simplest explanation. More likely the pilot was confused, careless, cocky, or didn't like following rules (in a place they assumed was safe). Those are more common behaviors.
@ Yes, complacency.
Very possible. He could also have been playing chicken, which is also suicidal in a way. Seeing how close he can get the plane. There are now other videos of near misses in the same area. In all these cases, it looks like the helicopter is deliberately going toward the plane. Not just staying on course, but changing course to get closer. Maybe it's a bragging right for the military pilots.
No, SHE was DEI and inexperienced. Not suicidal. 68 people paid for her mistake with their lives.
I was a crew chief when I was in the service, and anytime we fly in the city, or around other air traffic all of us would always look around all the time and make sure to call out if anything doesn't look right
500 and 1,000 hours is not “a lot”. 500 hours is the minimum for basic proficiency. That is the level at which experience creates a confidence level where the frequency peak of accidents occurs.
May be that was a case of fast-track promotion, the opposite of DEI.
@@pabloernesto8044how is it opposite?
@@pabloernesto8044Trump would blame black air traffic controller in an instant. But when it’s the Army that is at fault, he goes completely silent!!!
Yes, minimum experience. Commercial pilot entry criteria in the 10-15,000h range.
Yes, as usual the MSNBC reporter was wrong & sounded foolish. Even by the interviewee's non verbal action, he disagreed! 500 hrs by the female captain piloting the helo is very low for that situation. Why was she fast-tracked to be there to begin with? THAT answer will also be Be investigated!
No one outside the White House needs a helicopter, they can sit in a car like the rest of us!
YES !!!!!
a helicopter can hold it's position, unlike an airplane.
*its
Fa is good soup
It’s the king of soup
It’s fa king good
It can, but it also needs time and distance to reduce speed.
It can, if pilot is not dei
Negative, helicopters are not hovered above ground effect. They can slow down, but they are not stopped due to a few factors.
Kids talk, heli was told plane incoming at 33, so it had to be at 11 o'çlock. There was no other plane at 11 o'çlock. They were told to go behind plane, they did not go behind any plane.
Thank you mr. Bowman to be the first I have heard to confirm the ability to hold ones position with a helicopter. During landing and take off procedures at an airport nothing should be crossing the path of the plane doing the action. Just halt for a couple of seconds, it doesn't cost that much. You just don't want to be in such a position for a crash.
@telebubba5527 He hinted at the problem. Often these missions transport "high value" officials, like politicians or foreign officials. Big headed people don't want "their helicopter" to wait, especially not for an airliner full of "common people".
The FAA should set a new rule, to MAKE THEM WAIT (but trump's FAA won't).
The helicopter flight crew was not in the proper air corridor along the eastern bank of the Potomac River but rather in the middle. They clearly did not comprehend runway 33's approach pattern over the river. Perhaps they believed all the traffic was using runway 1 and therefore, they were careless in flying over the middle. They clearly misidentified the landing/acquisition lights of DCA arriving/departing aircraft when they requested visual separation from air traffic control. It was their responsibility to identify and avoid.
I agree, I think they were not expecting a turning aircraft to rnwy 33. Initially, the CRJ would of been above and to their left. The tragedy is that they changed the CRJ from runway 1, which is to the left of the river...When they changed to 33, they extended their path to the right of the river.
I agree. And what an brilliant Idea to fly around in the landing path of airliners. This should not happen, because humans can fail. Better not to fly there.
He didn’t answer if the 6 million dollar helicopter had a warning signal for altitude similar to my $40,000 car that warns me if I start to move out of a lane on the freeway! This is absolutely unbelievable!
yup this is my issue, no warnings on the so heavily precious Military Helicopter.
That system doesn't work if they are too low
@ How is that possible? Safety systems on my car work while it’s on the ground and also lane keeping system in my car alerts within inches of moving out of the lane. The helicopter was 200 feet over the 200 foot altitude limit. Also the camera that showed the crash was miles away! How could the helicopter pilots not see the plane! That helicopter crew must have been doing something other than what they should have been doing!
Directly in front of you is the altimeter....
Why is is this NOT suicide? The Blackhawk pilot was clearly warned of the the regional jet 30 seconds before impact, the night was so clear that cameras miles away were able to capture the aircraft course and collision, the Blackhawk was flying 200 feet above the maximum altitude it should have been flying, and we know now that the Blackhawk had veered off course. And finally, the pilot was a very experienced pilot with more than a 1,000 hours of flight time. Everything about this collision is beginning to look very intentional to me. As crazy as it sounds, they should investigate this as a possible suicide. Instead of asking questions, the air traffic controller should have instructed and demanded that the Blackhawk pilot change its flight path; for example, BANK LEFT!!!, BANK RIGHT!!! PULL UP!!!, or DIVE!!! Had he done so, there might have been a different outcome. Unless, this was suicide! Also, with all the flight experience this pilot had, he absolutely should have known that they were entering a flightpath corridor dedicated to commercial aircraft landing at that airport. I also find it interesting that the pilot confirmed that he had a visual on an aircraft, but if he mistook which aircraft, the pilot missed the aircraft that was right in front of him. Given the clear night that it was, it makes no sense to me that he could miss a well-lit aircraft right in front of him. Sad, but may be true!
Very tragic loss what ever is determined
Elon Musk pushed the FAA director out and Trump finished the job.
It was already confirmed that the pilot was trans
Good! Biden's FAA was a disaster. They couldn't even update software without grounding every plane in the country
@@DeltaTango2024 That isn't the case. The person they claimed was the pilot is alive. They just happened to be a Blackhawk pilot.
@@DeltaTango2024you want that to be true so bad 😆
@@ashlibabbitt1111👈🏻rooftop creeper.
So 2 pilots did not notice almost double the altitude???
More likely they surely knew they were high, and didn't care because they assumed it was safe. They saw no planes in the area. A FATAL assumption.
Meanwhile, the pres teaches everyone, "rules are for losers." They ignored rules.
The military craft has been estimated to have been at 350 ft. That alone tells me this was not an “accident”. The trajectory adds to it but alone would not be enough to scream this was not an accident due to night vision, reflection of lights, etc. HOWEVER the sustained trajectory at that elevation does scream NOT an accident. How much of this will never get disclosed as to facts? We may never know.
Why are you ignoring the published communications between Air Traffic Control and the Blackhawk, which clearly show Air Traffic Control did everything properly? This accident is entirely on the Blackhawk pilots who repeatedly assured Air Control that they could see the airplane and were maintaining proper distance -- until they crashed into the airplane.
indeed, tower informed helo, with minutes before, about inbound traffic, then helo asked visual separation, tower approved, then helo confirmed aircraft in sight... why helo goes straight to that plane and with that speed is very strange..
Everything Bowman stated in this interview indicates that Helicopter was at the wrong altitude and didn't see the plane he ultimately collided with.
Another Blackhawk pilot stated that even though the helicopter pilot confirmed separation with the tower he was probably looking at the wrong plane. And airline pilot, Capt. Steve said the same thing.
That also stated that we still have to wait for the investigation to determine the cause.
But which plane? There were two!Whose fault was it that the plane that was landing wasn't properly observed? Was it the helicopter pilots who presumably had no instrumentation to tell them where exactly to look for the plane, or was it the air traffic controller who saw exactly where all the planes and helicopters were in real time? Should the controller have given the pilots the coordinates to look for the plane?
@@KOFAKEDEMThe TCAS system is automatically disabled below 1000ft. Neither plane was getting alerts.
The AIRPORT is inherently unsafe.
They had a near miss the previous day.
I don't think anyone is ignoring the ATC communication, at this point in aviation if a mid air collision is happening, it's not just due to pilot error, layers of safety protocols, tools and procedures has been created to prevent this and the fact that it has happened means a multi dimensional problem
NTSB is not formed to call out people mistakes, it happens all the time, it's to create safety barriers to prevent it from happening next time
These safety barriers all failed together for this accident :
1- helo pilot to monitor and maintain their altitude
2- standard visual separation protocol has failed miserably since
3- TCAS is unable to issue RA under 1000ft and for some reason it's normal warning also has been ignored, it didn't have the expected effect
The Blackhawk pilot was told exactly where the CRJ was by ATC and the Blackhawk crew acknowledged it.
DCA Tower: PAT25, traffic just south of the Woodrow Bridge, a CRJ, it's 1200 feet setting up for runway 33. (approximately 1 min to incident)
Anybody flying this corridor regularly would know exactly where just south of the Woodrow Bridge is. The Blackhawk also was out of the corridor reserved for that traffic and 100-150 feet above their allotted airspace. ( 300-350 feet at impact ). It's worked for years until it didn't. Human beings are not infallible.
The Black Hawk pilot failed due to human error and perhaps a bit of military smugness. talking to a civilian giving directions.
Yup. Had this all gone right, the UH60 would have been no higher than 200ft, accurately identified the CRJ, ensured it had passed by and THEN proceeded 'behind' it per the ATC instruction (and their own request for visual separation). A lot of folks seem to think they were supposed to cross the same spot at the same time at the same speeds with only a hundred or so feet of vertical separation. Not true.
The other thing that bothers me is that early on the Blackhawk pilot said "in sight" and they were quite a ways upriver, which was kind of hard to believe.
yep,,, exactly,,, helo pilots fault end of,,,,
When I get in a plane I'm not agreeing to be part of the military's life and death training exercises.
Flying military helicopters across the path of commercial planes must introduce a risk for those on the commercial planes. Did anyone ask the passenfers and crews on those commercial flights if this risk is acceptible to them? I image lawyers for the families that have lost family members will be asking this question in court.
You can't sue the government. They can sue you and take everything you own, just like that. Not fair, is it?
Its a regular heli route there is no one to sue
@RWROW Yes! Unfortunately last year SCOTUS ruled that public officials can't be sued in civil court, even if they're found to have done wrongful things. WE'RE LOSING OUR RIGHTS while the ULTRA-RICH (not just oligarchs) are taking over.
It very sad situation! Praying for the victims and condolences for the families!
Good point about the Helo being able to hold mid-air. If only. It's a very costly unimaginable way to learn what to do or not what to do.
My heart goes out to Yu an the fellow officers tu for your service to all of them rest in peace 🇺🇲🙏
Good interview Katy, you asked a lot of key questions and it was interesting some of his answers. I don't think the Blackhawk saw it or was alert to it ,
I blame DEI - Donald's Enormous Incompetence.
The Federal Aviation Administration is fighting a class-action lawsuit alleging it denied 1,000 would-be air traffic controllers jobs because of diversity hiring targets. It was revealed that staffing levels were “not normal” at the time of this week’s deadly midair collision.
Didn't earn it
FULFILLING PROMISE TO END ILLEGAL DISCRIMINATION AND BRING BACK COMMON SENSE: This Presidential Memorandum builds on President Trump’s day-one Executive Order ending the Biden Administration’s illegal and immoral DEI discrimination programs.
In his inaugural address, President Trump promised: ““We will forge a society that is colorblind and merit-based.”
President Trump stated in his January 20, 2025 Executive Order on Ending Radical and Wasteful Government DEI Programs and Preferencing: “Americans deserve a government committed to serving every person with equal dignity and respect, and to expending precious taxpayer resources only on making America great.”
It was clearly pilot error and had nothing to do with the FAA
@@armorboy24DEI - Don Jr, Eric and Ivanka.
You're right, they didn't earn it.
Black Hawk pilot acknowledged a visual on a plane, the Black Hawk identified the wrong plane.
You don't know that
@@davidgiles9651 we do know that the Blackhawk acknowledged they had visual. It's on publicly available ATC recordings.
If they didn't identify the wrong aircraft they had visual to, the only alternative is that they flew into the CRJ intentionally, which would make this even worse.
@sncy5303 there was no other aircraft in the final approach path
Acknowledged a visual on the plane TWICE to atc. He was looking at the wrong plane as you said
@@davidgiles9651 that is incorrect. There was another aircraft approaching a couple miles behind (AAL3130), also, another aircraft that just took off (AAL1630). They could have mistaken either one for the CRJ.
You do not need to be an expert to see that the helicopter was at fault. you just need to be honest and accept reality. helicopter was at fault
I agreed 😢
My prayers go out to everyone involved 🙏
Sure, we need more prayers.
The radar shows that the UH-60 was at 320 feet.
His expression when she overstated that 1,000 and 500 hrs was "alot" of experience is telling. Those are very low times. Neither have even close to the minimum required experience to be a regional airline co pilot let alone PIC. The low experience Black Hawk pilots deviated in altitude and the requirement to maintain visual separation.
Thank you Mr. Bowman. Very articulate and the only person that I've heard that makes sense and describes things in layman terms.
Indeed, the helo pilots were blinded by the landing spotlights of the airliner straight in front eye to eye. A little confused what to do now...maybe thinking being involved in a kamikaze online game.
She doesn’t explain why the Helo ascended when the airplane the Helo pilots were supposedly paying attention was also ascending after taking off ??
@@AnakNi_Mina Well, the investigation is ongoing. But likely spotted the wrong plane and increased altitude to avoid the wrong traffic.
20 years ago the number of airplanes or helicopters flying in that airspace has probably increased..and lights and buildings have also probably increased.
In what world is 500 hours "a lot??" That is not much at all.
I retired with over 30,000 hours in 42 years including as a navy helo pilot. 500 hours is a beginner and 1000 as a PIC is low as well
''there have been a few near misses''.. Stupid place to fly Helicopters.
totally agree with you
All you hear from EVERY expert is I, WE DO NOT KNOW 😂😂😂
you should NOT fly to endanger peoples lives, !! that is unacceptable and stupid!!
Both were VFR… making right of way for the airplane.
Tower ATC is advisory only… I would say the tower is culpable… putting the two aircraft on a collision course,
but the helicopter is at legal fault, regardless of altitude.
ATC did not give approval to pass the same position at the same time. The visual separation requires maintaining appropriate horizontal separation to go with the mandatory 200' vertical ceiling!
@ Tower ATC for aircraft in the air, is advisory only for VFR aircraft.
Both aircraft were VFR. CRJ was on an instrument flight plan until they accepted the visual for RWY 33.
When both aircraft are VFR, the helicopter must see, avoid, and give way to the airplane.
Sad, because the tower controller advised them into the bad situation… had the CRJ still be IFR, ATC would be at fault for not providing separation. However… this also depends on the instrument minimums.
The helicopter had no where to go, couldn’t push the cyclic to descend or they would likely would have had a tail strike.
Couldn’t turn right to Washington National, couldn’t turn left into the traffic… looks like a last ditch effort to do a quick stop which explains the small altitude gained.
If they saw the CRJ coming at them, the difference between 300 and 500ft… likely was non discernible.
I don't know much about aviation, but from what we hear, is there a possibility that it was intentional from the helicopter pilot? Is it technically possible to do that?
US militarism does a lot of unethical things (proxy war that's wiping out Ukrainians being one example you probably support), but taking out this jet on purpose is highly unlikely.
Dual control aircraft with Student and instructor at the controls.
Ultimately, the Instructor is responsible for oversight and failed to manage route constraints.
500 hrs is NOT a lot.
Not by any stretch of the imagination.
No kidding... 62, 8 hour days and he's an expert...?
@@quadrifoglio400it was a woman flying the helicopter
She doesn't know that, she is a talking head.
Yes, when she said that he raised his eyebrows and kind of shrugged his shoulders. I think he was going to say it's really not that many hours, but changed his mind.
Kathy Tur here says that 500 hours is "a lot of flight hour experience". I saw an interview with a Black Hawk pilot who said it is NOT. He said it was very low experience
My question is, why go on a training mission during one of the busiest times for the airport?
The Military is 24/7... they don't need any clearance.
That's the only way to get experience.
@@bjc8248 Maybe so, but obviously, they weren't ready for prime time yet. So, back to my comment.
Night is not the busiest time but whatever
@cubing6637 It was about six pm. So, I disagree.
To all experienced pilots, have you ever had ATC ask if you have plane insight without giving direction altitude?
WBC1995 @ your 3 0'clock 3 miles, 1,000' on final approach, do you have American Eagle Flight 5342 insight?
My question exactly
Go back and listen to the conversation, ATC referenced the plane's position to a known bridge, altitude was 1200' and on final approach to runway 33. So. . .this was done about 1 minute before the last exchange with the helo!
If that recreation they showed at the beginning is accurate it is chilling. It really looked like the helo slowed down and climbed directly in front of the jet. Something is bad wrong if that is accurate.
That wasn't a recreation--it was actual video of the incident.
The helicopter, Ms.Katy, wasn't a little bit off! It was, at least, 200-250 feet off! And the experts say - 500 flight hours are not a lot at all! And ATC controllers should've warned the helicopter about dangerous proximity with the landing jet! How the helicopter's pilots didn't see the the huge jet right in front of them? They ran just straight into it - like suicidal "kamikaze"! As a result of that - 64 passengers lost their lives!!! What a tragedy for those who lost their loved ones. Thank you Mr. Bowman! You the one, who gave us the professional, detailed analysis of the tragedy that could've been avoided.
why hasn't the pilot of the black hawk been identified?
What difference would that make??
Brett biting at the bit for some hatred…
The pilot gas not been identified at the request of her bereaved parents.
I heard that her family doesn't want her identity released.
@@lorettanericcio-bohlman567 not at all just find it strange her name hasn't been announced
Blackhawk was exceeding altitude 200' max. ATC gave clearance for altitude, vector, speed directly into oncoming inbound traffic on final, which has "priority".
ATC Tower has complete 100% control of ALL aircrafts, directions, altitude. "Do you see aircraft in sight?" Should have been, DO YOU SEE AIRCRAFT AT YOUR 1 o'clock @ altitude 600?
Exactly, they needed to be specific by stating the exact position of the aircraft they were asking about.
Go back and listen to the conversation, ATC referenced the plane's position to a known bridge, altitude was 1200' and on final approach to runway 33. So. . .this was done about 1 minute before the last exchange with the helo!
Duh! Don't fly around an airport!
500 hours is kindergarten
You must go back to school
No experience
No situational awareness
Perfect kamikazi hit mid ship
So, the name of the pilot at fault hasn’t been released?
Why is that important?
@@michaeldeierhoi4096 It's important so that trump can blame LGBT or minorities for low abilities.
@northernlights6984 It isn't important. The only way the name would be important is if the pilot is related to a prominent gov official (like Hegseth or McConnell). Otherwise, no one should care.
That part is always a political matter.
No reason for the Military to be playing chicken with Civilian aircraft, sorry but NO. Never should have happened and I'm glad that President Trump is putting a stop to it.
There's no training mission to fly at 400ft AGL through that corridor. End of story.
You're right. But this wasn't a "training" mission. It was an annual pilot recertification. Most media are misreporting.
@@keep-ukraine-free Even more terrifying. I read there were seasoned pilots at the helm.
Answering a direct question with many many words without answering the question means the question was asked correctly and was answered in the affirmative.
DCA Tower: PAT25, traffic just south of the woodrow Bridge, a CRJ, it's 1200 feet, setting up for runway 33. (approximately 1 min to incident)
DCA Tower: PAT25 Do you have CRJ in sight? (approximately 20 seconds to Incident).
and then immediately after that
DCA Tower: Pass behind the CRJ (final visual instruction).
Total duration from the 2nd visual Instruction from the ATC to the incident: 20 Seconds
ATC spotted PAT25 is danger close and asked if CRJ is in sight and instructed to PASS Behind within 2 seconds. PAT25 completely overlooked JIA5342 and probably didn't hear PASS BEHIND. 20 seconds are enough time to perform necessary maneuvering.
ATC sounded uneasy from the 2nd warning, growing increasingly concerned until sheer shock set in as both aircraft came dangerously close. It could be possible that PAT25 visualized the wrong aircraft but also didn't react to the verbal warning from the ATC to PASS BEHIND JIA5342.
It is not finger pointing but the facts based on the recordings. ATC did realize 20 seconds prior to the incident that PAT25 is still not behind the CJR but continued on its course south. There is absolutely no way you cant spot the plane based on the last 7 seconds before the impact. Either the PAT25 pilot was looking at the instruments or on the other side puzzled with where the heck is this plane that he needs to go behind. The instructions were given to spot the plane and go behind 20 seconds before the impact.
Thank you! This was not hard for them to find, but disparaging ATC continues.
Another example of military disregard for civilian life
Yeah the military hates civilians, that's why they save so many civilian lives... makes sense
There was only one ATC at the desk instead of two. The lone ATC was handling both copter and plane traffic. The crew of the copter was short handed as well for the mission...
TWR was sequencing three planes...that's a piece of cake for a controller. Traffic was very light.
tower did ok,,, maby could have monitored height more but no issues if chopper at 200 ft
Army Blackhawk with a crew of 3 instead of 4. Army pilots who couldn’t fly with instruments flew too high & off course. ATC had nothing to do with that. It’s all Army!!!
The chopper told atc they could see the planr. ATC shiuld have said ...well there's one taking off and 1 right in front of you. Drop to 200 ft and move out of this flight path, immediately. Why are people so afraid to speak up! You see what's happening. Ask better questions, inform the pilot who is about to be smashed, and use your authority to course correct. 3 -5 years of traing....for what?!? To be told exactly what to do because every situation will be the same?!? Sad!!!!
@eco_barbie007 there was heavy traffic in ATC's situational awareness, and a deficit of it with the Black Hawk crew.
Why is it necessary to fly army officers and politicians around in an expensive military helicopter when driving is an option? Wouldn't that be more economical? Or does cost not matter when it's tax money?
*FUN FACT:* Trump fired everyone on the Aviation Safety Advisory Committee 9 days before the crash.
You seem to be knowledgeable. Can you tell us about the class action lawsuit relating to the Air Traffic Controllers?
The pilot was trans
@@vitalsigns2679I can they're a bunch of whiny whyte boys like you. 😂
@@vitalsigns2679I can tell you that had no effect on the crash. Just because people file a lawsuit, that doesn't create conditions for a plane crash. Checkmate.
Funner Fact: There were ZERO crashes under Biden.
Basically if you are on a plane in that route you could always expect to meet your Creator in a high probability
How many pilots should have been on that helicopter? I’ve heard 4, but there were only 3-making it impossible to have optimal vision. Thus resulting in the crash.
You have no idea what you’re talking about.
Trump doesn't care. The prayer was only for his voters
This only adds up in all the wrong ways. Condolences to all involved.
Plain and simple……it was their FATE
There wasn’t “just one” factor that contributed to the collision.
ATC, the military, both made more than 2 mistakes. And it cost lives
The pilot in command, is ultimately responsible for a very avoidable inexcusable crash.
1,000 flight hours is not a lot… I retired with 18,500+ hours.
Agreed....did you see the guy's reaction?
Taxi service of the Pentagon
These people can drive to the airport like everyone else!!!
Traffic to the airport was also recently increased, presumably so politicians can have it easier.
Doesn’t air traffic controller know altitude of every aircraft
I grocery shop. Does that make me an "Expert?"
Who thought it was a good idea allowing exercises with night goggles over civilian airports. The department that approved this needs a fulltime babysitter, because that defies all common sense.
the parents and family of those Black Hawk pilots, not only did they lose their loved ones but now, The President is calling them Incompetent .
Well, it wasn't the planes fault....SO
Did he say that today? If so, he really has no compassion for the families.
No surprise there. He has never demonstrated much respect for the military. Perhaps his bone spurs are kicking up...
@jimmc8232 Trump was Chicken 🐔
@sallyire1 that's the fault of all the people who protected him in government.
under 1000 feet there is almost no room for error, and that being said ive seen stories that with the civilian congestion might of confused the helicopter pilot as to which plane they where looking for , the hubris youtube aviation experts is astounding
IF they were paying attention to the airplane taking off that was ascending , why did the Helo find it necessary to also ascend ???
No appropriate reason apparent. Because I have people wanting to misrepresent, where do I find the flight data?
By the time anyone even seen what was happening, the brain didn’t even have process time. Why did the highly trained military pilot suddenly climbed to 350? And where the traffic, traffic.
So, what we have learned is that there is only a 100 foot safety zone to protect civilian flyers. One Hundred feet separate you from ending up in the Potomac when landing
200 feet separation in the Potomac River. The helicopter pilots are the most incompetent mf
@@JesusNonEnviromental ATC did not give approval to pass the same position at the same time. The visual separation requires maintaining appropriate horizontal separation to go with the mandatory 200' vertical ceiling! So, minimum separation is not only the anticipated vertical distance of 200'. The helo can slow or come to a complete stop to maintain appropriate separation. In fact, ATC directed them to pass behind the plane.
the helicopter route needs to go along the east side of the river instead of in the middle of the river, the glide slope for runway 33 is much higher there while the helicopter would still maintain lower altitude
It is, looking at the published route. The heli. pilot was not at east side nor was he below 200'.
Katy Tur says 1000 and 500 hours of flight hours is "a lot". If she had just deferred to her expert, she would have learned that it's not that much.
He is twisting words through his teeth
After a pilot told me how difficult it truly is to fly with NVG's I totally understand.
1998 :US reckless pilot with "prowler" cuts cable car line in cermis, italy,killing 20 people.
Compliancy seems to be the issue, got so used to this being normal without an incident. And now 67 lives have been lost in a collision.
The helicopter knew the flight path. They knew that they should stay below 200ft. They knew why that is. To eliminate the chance of colliding with incoming airplanes. You can safely assume that that crew wouldn't want to take hat risk. Still they ended up there in restricted air space where they didn't want to go. Why? Something clearly went very wrong on that shopper. But what? And for that answer we need the investigation be done with due diligence. It will take a couple of months before we will know.
@albertvandermeulen1177 Have you never met a cocky 28 year old? One who believes "I know what I'm doing is safe right now," while they bend the rules.
Cocky. Confused. Careless. Ignore rules (because "it's safe"). Each explains it.
Before all of you backseat pilots jump to conclusions and move to punish the pilots of the helicopter remember that there are reasons other than pilot error that can lead to flying at the wrong altitude. Considering the complexity of the system that manages air traffic around major airports we all need to take a breath and let the professionals do their jobs and determine the root cause of this horrible disaster. We all want to know what happened, but we need to know the facts, not someone's version of the truth.
The plane was on the prescribed flight path for runway 33. ATC provided clear location and flight path information to the helo in response to the visual separation request. No need for disparaging (cannot punish lost loved-ones), but no need to misplace fault.
@gordonshaffer5560 The UH60 pilot knew the rules for routes 1 & 4. They were trained that 200 feet was the max ceiling near runway 33 (for obvious reasons). If they're headed straight to that area, and their craft rose too much, they should have informed ATC. No transmit before the crash. You'd hear a squalk or something. So unlikely that happened. More likely they didn't see the CRJ on final (because it was just above and to their left), and they had lost situational awareness. If they had NVG, that would have made it worse. This is why rules are so critical, in congested airspace.
I agree we should wait for NTSB's prelim report, and 1+ years for the final one. In the mean time, people want things to make sense. It explains idle speculation.
For the love of…I can’t leave my refrigerator open for more than 15 seconds before something starts sending an alert that notifies my entire block. In this case the Blackhawk said yes we see the plane and that was it?? Which plane, where are the coordinates?
ATC identified the plane and its location and its runway. Most reporting has ignored that presumably due to listening to an edited recording.
Go back and listen to the conversation, ATC referenced the plane's position to a known bridge, altitude was 1200' and on final approach to runway 33. So. . .this was done about 1 minute before the last exchange with the helo!
The runway change is whats at fault.
I'm wondering the same thing and no one else is talking about it. Why was the runway changed in the final moments?🤔
@@barbarajohnson8968 guessing it was so that other planes could take off from RWY01...previous plane had been asked to switch too, but pilot said "unable". The CRJ accepted the change (they need to quickly reconfigure their computer (FMS) to the new runway. It's pretty common, and the pilot is free to deny the request. Quite possible that the collision would have still occurred given the Blackhawk's bad positioning.
So, if you take a different route to the store and have an accident. Changing routes caused the wreck? Planes takeoff and land on both runways! Go back and listen to the conversation, ATC referenced the plane's position to a known bridge, altitude was 1200' and on final approach to runway 33. So. . .the plane's path was communicated to the helo about 1 minute before the final exchange with the helo!
@@jcarlock4362 So, if you take a different route to the store and have an accident. Changing routes caused the wreck? Depends on if you changed lanes without looking in your sideview mirrors or not use your blinkers RECKON it could cause an accident.
(EWE) need to Go back and listen to the conversation again.
@WatchingThemWatchingYou ATC informs the helo of the plane's position, altitude at 1200', and path to runway 33. Neither the ATC nor plane changed lanes on an adjacent vehicle. No one was near them and their planned path was clearly communicated.
best unbiased report i have seen..great questions..great responses
500 hours is NOT A LOT.
Another spokesperson said the numbers were 250 flight, 500 hours.
I was sailplane/glider pilot. Commercial Pilot, Glider license, Flight Instructor, Glider certificate.
I was involved in an accident.
I had 1000 flights and 500 hours (glider flights tend to be
what about TCAS? was is in place and active on the plane and the heli?
The helo was above the 200 ft floor but from seeing other videos, helos seem not to adhere to that floor. The other tragedy is that the CRJ was asked to change runways moments before being committed to runway 1, which would of placed it left of the river, so it would been a non issue. Possibly affecting situational awareness of the helo crew was that, the CRJ would be initially above and to the left, maybe they thought it was not the landing aircraft. Most likely, they were not expecting it to turn to runway 33...
No one else is talking about the fact that the airplane was asked to switch to runway 33!! I also think this could have contributed to the confusion and crash. Why did ATC change the runway in the final moments?🤔
They never knew what hit them. They didn't even know they died.
It will never ever change ! Bet your life on it !
We already KNOW she was above 200 feet. She wouldn't have run into the jet if she wasn't.
What we want to know is her name and why they are hiding it from us. The pilot that was flying. The one with 500 hours, which to me doesn't sound like a lot.
His name…
@@allangibson8494 Ten Bucks says it was a her....
@@allangibson8494 NYT is reporting that the third person in the helo was a woman, and that her name is being with held at the request of her family.
Settle down . . .making assumptions there...
Why do you need the pilot's name? Haven't received your irrational h@te & discrimination fix for the day?
Did the pilot and co-pilot have "a lot" of experience? We know that the co-pilot did not. MSNBC made that point, which could be false, and did NOT ask the expert if that was true.
You expect, ATC to monitor your ,Heli altitude throughout !!?? Really ? They can't baby sit..your pilots messed up ..big time ..do not try to sugar cost
Sad, SAD SAD! and DISTURBING 😢
These pilots are under Orders to SEE AND AVOID. HE DID AND DIDN'T, PERIOD
One ATC-----2 aircraft on different frequencies is starting to add another layer to this! The copter going to 300' I think is a human error as they thought they were at the Woodrow Wilson bridge and were allowed the 100' elevation change.
She's not very bright - a 1000 hrs and 500 hrs is very little time in fact, so little that a pilot with these times would not qualify to fly forest fire flying in the Province of Ontario