The Decline of Forever 21...What Happened?
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- Опубліковано 3 жов 2024
- One of the country's biggest clothing stores has fallen on some tough times. This video talks about why Forever 21 has been having so much trouble.
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They should've focused on selling more of the basics, kinda like H&M. It never fails, you see a shirt you like, go to turn it around and there's a huge obnoxious graphic on the back.
Bro fr we're like "oh! that looks good-...oh no."
I Definitely thought I was the only one💀
Seriously!
@ghost mall same here, I'm 35 and I just buy plain basic shirts now lol. Nothing fancy, just simple and comfortable.
This. Maybe my tastes have changed, but I remember getting nice men’s cardigans and basics when I was younger. Last time I walked into a Forever 21, it looked like a straight up KB toys and just about every item had some dumb graphic or gaudy design.
Ironically I saw a forever 21 store that has those “everything must go” signs. But they also have a “we’re hiring sign” too
I worked at a K-Mart for 6 months through christmas to the store's liquidation. They got rid of most of the christmas staff, and things mega slowed down business wise. However, when you're in liquidation, business spikes back up. Since liquidation lasts months, you will need some new staff.
@Arielle ♪ nice fake music tick 🤓
Lol! That is ironic!
"We're hiring to make everything go", kind of like how the Roman imperial army hired a bunch of Germanic tribes right before the western empire fell.
Yeah I know when toys r us close down they hired a bunch of people to help with the rise in sales and cleaning up the building etc
I think Forever 21 dropped the ball with not expanding more into the mens market. Every F21 I would go into would only have a tiny section for men, where as H&M has a giant mens section. Also H&M had more styles and more basic streetwear, where as Forever21 clothing always seemed like knock off apparel from other stores and had giant logos and graphics on it.
Yes and the cheap screen prints and fake “gucce/asidas/channel” style knock offs make everything look sooo cheap
100 percent aggree. Growing up I knew so many of my female friends going to Forever 21. The guys would all go to H&M, Gap, Express and Zara. Never went to forever 21. I never even knew they had a mens section.
I was definitely not shopping at forever 21 at a young age had they sold men's clothes.
I was always at hot topic and anchor blue.
Can we get a video about Miller's Outpost/Anchorblue?
Agreed. But also when they first launched menswear under the Heritage 1981, they had really nice, quality designs and fabrics. That shifted drastically over time. I also know of people who used to work in design at F21 and they said designers they were poaching at the time were from brands like Guess, but the company let these people go as 21 Men became the mens' brand, and designs suffered over time...as did fabrics as cheaper materials were being used. You'll notice F21 reuses a lot of fabrics and prints in multiple piece variations.
Those men's section's at H&M are also empty most of the time. No humans to be found anywhere.
So I really don't think that's it.
And becoming just another H&M would have killed them even sooner. They wouldn't stand out if they did.
Last time I went into a Forever 21, the quality of the clothes was basically at the level of Fashionnova, shien, or god forbid Wish, which are all cheaper. I think Chinese fast fashion online shopping hurt them a lot.
I actually think this is one of the main reasons. I’m surprised this wasn’t mentioned. In the early/mid 2000s there weren’t many options for fashionable cheap clothes especially for plus size. Other cheap fashion forward brands started to arise and technology (androids and iPhones) becoming more popular and readily available which made for people to have more options and less reason to go to the mall.
Clothing quality is trash. Fabric is basically tissue paper. Actually worse than other fast fashion like H&M -- or Zara, which actually has some nice stuff.
I bought a black tank top and when I put it on it was so shiny because of the high polyester content. It’s plastic. 😖
I bought leggings and everybody could still see my ass 🤣😭😭it was hella see through
I still have a Emo long sleeve sweater type shirt from 2009 from Forever 21 and my mom got some clothes there that year somewhere that still were together the last I saw them she would wear them to the goth Clubs and cemeteries.
I’d argue that one of the main factors behind Forever 21’s decline was that it totally missed the boat on e-commerce.
For a company whose core consumer base is young millennials, it always baffled me that they missed consumers shifting preferences to online shopping. Most incumbents like Forever 21, Abercrombie & Fitch, Urban Outfitters, and American Appeal pretty much let newcomers like ASOS or Fashion Nova, whose entire business model is online, enjoy that first-mover advantage and just grab market share.
It just goes to show how destructive complacency can be in business.
I was surprised this point wasnt on the list.
I do plenty of online shopping, but unless there's free returns, I would rather try clothes on in person. Otherwise it's just a hassle.
A&F went down for reasons that had nothing to do with e-commerce
Forever21 has e-commerce. At least for the past 8 years I've been a shopper there.
Ugh, I think that online clothes shopping should be banned! Pain in the neck, not being able to try things on...
I used to shop at F21 when I was in college and didn't have much disposable income. I stopped shopping there around my mid to late 20s or so...everything just seemed so cheap and unsustainable. I still love shopping at brick-and-mortar stores, but I avoid F21 because everything is so cheaply made, and plus the stores are always a mess.
I once bought sweatpants from their, it was spring so most warm clothes were in clearence and when i wore it again at home like tons of tiny pieces of wool was falling. Man i bet i can find something thats cheaper but doesn't feel cheap in my local goodwill.
H&M always seemed to have the cheapest made stuff to me. The stuff from forever 21 at least had all the stitches properly sewn and wasn't as thin as a McDonald's napkin. But fast fashion is terrible.
@@ZachJ-0 Yeah, I see what you mean. That's also why I don't shop at H&M.
@@ZachJ-0 cheap materials and slave labor.. look at Nike these days. You can't get a harm-free article of clothing let alone a cell phone that isn't produced under slave labor lol lol lol some brands are just a cult of personality and get to charge wider profit margins.
I always dreaded going into Forever 21 for any woman in my life. When I hit my mid 20s it was no longer an option and I was so glad to see that day.
Damn, I didn’t know all the controversies. For me it’s the lack of quality, and the messy and poor presentation in stores. When I was a pre-teen and in my early teen years, I enjoyed going there for the cheap prices and if it weren’t for the bad quality and ripped off designs I might still as an adult but it doesn’t appeal to me anymore. 🤷🏻♀️
Totally, it felt like i was digging through a bargain bin every time I shopped there. I can't really blame the employees for not keeping it tidy tho considering how poorly they were treated.
Yeah, it can be hard to shop there because it’s so chaotic and all over the place. Because products go in and out so fast, they can’t keep a cohesive presentation at any time.
I have to agree middle school and high school yesss but ugh the quality in my eyes started to get bad after 2016ish then it just got so worse in 2018. And their prices are very high now. Especially the mens section like you’re better off just buying a better quality item their men jeans I remember trying to get my brother a pair were like $60 bucks and I’m like you can get a good pair of Levi’s or Nordstrom pants for less than that
Very poor quality and very young designs, like for teenagers. We had better "cheap" stores in Canada, especially at the time, Suzy Shier and Dynamite, those were my staples in my 20s.
Forever 21 literally looks like a lower quality, same price H & M. Which is an achievement.
EXACTLY lol
H&M already low quality lol
@@Almighty_Mage that's the point.....if H&M is low quality..... Then forever 21 is complete trash.......
H and m is more expensive
@@tsarina24honolulu87 no cuz actually
Malls dying and the rise of Amazon and other online shopping sites is going to be the downfall of almost all mall brands. These companies won’t expand to online shopping while simultaneously shutting down their in person stores. I have a feeling we will be seeing more of this along with bigger companies too in the coming years/decade. I’m
It sad too because malls used to be full and fun place to shop at but now it's becoming a gost town..
@@runrafarunthebestintheworld idk how hate a bad thing
Edit also fuck your name is ruins my comment
I don't even like Amazon, to be fair. Yes, there's other retail sites, but Amazon's on my blacklist because of stupidly high shipping costs in US territories, and they have a serious distaste for US territories as well. They strongly cater to the mainland US, but not its territories at all.
Amazon has been around since 1994
I don't buy clothes online. I ha e to try them on. I don't understand online shopping for this reason.
Seems like all brands/retailers that market themselves as:
1: "trendy"
And
2: primarily for young teens
Eventually decline. The marketplace for that demographic is a revolving door where every new brand in the space makes the existing brands less "hip".
It's a very tough space to hold market share/continuously grow for more than 5-10 years
My point people aren't teens forever
Agreed. And online vs bricks and mortar is no guarantee. Both Nasty Gal and Misguided filed for bankruptcy recently. Shein crushed them
@@Whatisthisstupidfinghandle wow, I didn’t know that 😰🤭 very concerning for many reasons...
Even when I was a teen, I disliked HM and forever 21 cause their clothes were garbage
It’s seemed to workout for hot topic
I'd say being hostile to the workers and the customers would be a part of their downfall. Even if they had gotten into the online store space earlier, it wouldn't have made much a difference because of the strict "no returns" policy. They wouldn't give money back unless you spoke to the manager's manager for whatever reason lol
Then working there was messy, as with all fast fashion stores it seems, stingy on break policies, minimum wages, laughable "raises" if it ever happened, 10% discount barely covered tax. It was a staple in my wardrobe for a while, but working there ruined it for me. Along with the knowledge of fast fashion in general, but that's a different story lol
Working Mall retail is truly its own unique hell
I pretty much hated how small there sizes ran...i was smaller size then and I feel like I shouldnt of had to go into a plus size (there isnt anything wrong with plus size its just my size then was generally medium or small)
Yeah I had a friend who had a really bad experience working there in HS, after she quit she refused to ever step foot in one again.
@@miley4051 womens sizing is literally all over the place
@@gildedpeahen876 true
I would never give Forever 21 a second glance, I'm nowhere near their demographic, but this is one of the most interesting case studies you've made yet. Interesting because it "could have" turned out so much better for so many reasons. Control, expansion both geographically and store sizing, betting on malls for too long, expansion overseas, it seemed like if they had outside counsel SOMEBODY could have steered the ship better.
Agreed, as a man whose peak fashion is my everlasting Adidas track suit, I could care less about this company going under. But their story is quite interesting.
I used to walk through the big, 2 story store at the Garden State Plaza, NJ, as they had entrances direct to the parking deck.
As a forever 21 employee, it’s surreal to see you making a video about this. But really, the company did this to themselves. Fast fashion itself is ironically out of fashion these days.
All the same, great vid as always!
Fast fashion is not out of fashion in fact it is growing. Look at Shein
@@slickrick2420 they have a point there and h&m has fast fashion too
Maybe I could’ve worded myself better. Apologies. It’s not the idea of fast fashion’s trendy nature that’s out of style per se. Can’t deny the success of Shein and H&M, but more specifically I’m referring to the politics and environmental impacts behind fast fashion companies. It’s not a good look for any company. Sooner or later that stuff comes back to bite them, and it’s especially prevalent these days.
But yes, Shein and H&M make cool stuff 😎
@@MrDemonsushiGuy I didn't like shein or h&m because I didn't have a good experience with the clothing
@@personwitharat9039 Why? Quality problems?
I worked at a Forever 21 roughly ten years ago when I was in my early 20s. It was a fun temporary job and I made a few friends but the boss always has a stick up her butt. The quality of the clothes are hit and miss, you CAN find some good items if you pay attention to the material and stitching. But please, for the love of God, WASH YOUR CLOTHES BEFORE YOU WEAR THEM. We would have "overnight parties" where we would come in in our PJs and just sit on the floor and put on security tags. Every single item at Forever 21 has been on the floor, essentially used as a dust mop.
I did fitting room a lot and was doing "detailing" (buttons, zippers, etc so it can go back on the floor) reached into a jacket pocket only to find WET underwear. Stuff like that did not go back onto the floor.. it was damaged out.
… I don’t think anyone is buying clothes from the store & just wearing them immediately without washing first… or is that just me?? 😅
@@yanikeonpurposeI’ve literally never thought to wash clothes from the store, except for under garments, and it annoys me doing so because it takes the newness out of it
I did some work for them as a consultant several years ago. The number of lawsuits that they were experiencing was unbelievable. As the video stated, they had a culture of blatantly breaking copyright law by constantly copying designer clothing and accessories.
that's azians for u!
@@vetealv2174came here to say exactly that. You can take a person out of Asia but you cannot take Asia out of a person
The people shopping there realized they weren’t 21 forever anymore
I remember some years ago a supermarket checkout video warning older women not to compete with younger women when it came to fashion and dress. To the point, it seemed to be saying, stay out of Forever 21 ! You are simply not that age anymore ! 😂
Online shops like Romwe, Shien,Fashion Nova are beating them at their game by selling at a lower price and even faster fashion.
For someone that worked there for 7 years. I can say a lot of the issues came from distribution. I was stock, stock manager, assistant manager. The amount of shipment you would get a day was enormous. You would sit on product for months cause there would be no room to put it anywhere. The amount of money spent on storage units and uHauls to transfer between stores in the district was insane.
Oh
I would really like to see a retail store named “Forever 55” which was when all my investments matured and I retired and just sat around watching UA-cam and tending to all my animals. Maybe they’d have coveralls to compete with Carhardtt and Levi’s, sitting on equipment that competes with John Deere, and supplements to compete with Ensure and diapers that compete with 8 layers of underwear.
Well, rest easy knowing we ladies already have that in Ann Taylor, Chico's, and Talbots.
@@LindseyLouWho - seriously now…. My mother is 95 years old and living in assisted living. She wants me to order some clothes for her online because she’s lost weight since last summer. Got any ideas where I can find some for her? Many thanks in advance.
@@enigmawyoming5201 I realize this post is a few days old, but in addition to the stores mentioned, try Northstyle, Soft Surroundings, and Lands End. Also Coldwater Creek and Christopher and Banks. All cater to a more mature lady. Best wishes to your mom!
@@aksez2u - thank you SO MUCH for this information! I just got off the phone with my Mom about a half hour ago and she again asked me to find her some summer clothes because her facility doesn’t turn the air conditioner down enough during these hot days that are happening in our area (Denver, in her case). Thank you also for the good wishes you send to her!
@@enigmawyoming5201 I hope you find lots of cute things for her! ❤️
Back in the mid 2010s I used to LOVE forever 21. They had this sweet and cute style of clothes that I couldn’t find anywhere else. I also live in Canada so it was harder to find a location that wasn’t in a big city. Then the bankruptcy happened and I’m not positive but I’m pretty sure they closed almost all of their Canadian locations. Fast forward to earlier this year and a “forever 21” opens as almost like a corner shop in The Bay which is kinda like a Sears with fancier brands. They also had their clothes occasionally in other discount fast fashion places like Urban Planet. The one thing I notice right away is that although prices are still in that “average/slightly above average” area, their clothes have gotten remarkably lower quality. Like, almost lower than Shein/Romwe quality in some cases. Everything is made of cheap polyester even when it doesn’t have to be, Seams aren’t finished or have fraying or thread sticking out, zippers are ripped or really poor quality and you can just feel the clothes falling apart even while you try them on. Even with items on sale, it’s hard to justify the purchase because I’m thinking “oh I’ll have to sew this” or “oh I’ll have to reinforce this”. And like, there’s some items I have from before the bankruptcy that I still wear almost 10 years later, but now anything I buy from there feels like I’ll only get a wash or two out of them before they’re ruined. I can only imagine the quality control and conditions of their clothing manufacturers…. Plus… maybe im just older now at 26, but I find the clothes not all that unique anymore? They often use the same patterns or fabric for multiple items and they’re not as cute as they are either just edgy or something you’d wear on a night out. I remember getting cute cardigans from there, and dress clothes and nice blouses and now that’s nowhere to be found. It’s just sad the direction they’ve gone in because I really had a lot of loyalty and favour for the brand but now it feels like a completely different store. And they don’t even have that much stock anyways, either online or in store. It’s just disappointing honestly.
@ghost mallit is, I can't believe 2015 was 7 years ago
Too long, didn't read.
@ghost mall well in a business perspective it’s been a minute.
Yes! That was my favorite too! All the classy button ups and ruffle tops. It was a fancy core before all fancy cores.
@@loveofmangos001 so? i dont think they even care that u didnt read it and its not like ur the comment judge
I came here with my sister when accompanying her to the mall and now with my wife on occasion. In 15 years the difference is shocking, even to me, a man who is paying minimal attention. It’s basically a thrift store now and every store is so empty. Every time you go to the mall you think “wow, that place is still here? How low is their rent?”
Forever 21's position is hardly unique. When you build a brand focused on young female fashion, the countdown to decline begins the minute you open. Some innovate enough to survive longer, but still lose their luster. Selling "hip and trendy" to young women when their mom has memories of frequenting your establishment is a tough psychology to navigate past. Victoria Secret is probably the gold medal winner of navigating this time bomb, and even they eventually fell.
Lol I thought the name was supposed to be alluding to moms having nostalgia for when they were 21 years old back in the day
Wrong, "the countdown to decline begins the minute you open." they became a billion dollar company that is still around for 3 decades. Your entire comment makes *some* sense but you're way off the mark there pal hahah they peaked 2 decades after opening and the entire economy has shifted. You're looking through a pinhole trying to make your argument lol
That reminds me, whatever happened to Wet Seal?
@@WobblesandBean you brought back memories of being a mall employee with that one!
That’s so true lmao. Trends change and brands get associated w specific trends not just “being trendy” in general. It’s rare when u see a Calvin Klein whose navigated these transitions since the early 80s … was that when Brooke shields did her ad? I didn’t see it firsthand but they’re an iconic brand
I shopped here for most of high school, the last time I actually bought anything from forever 21 was 2018 right before my birthday, I was searching for an outfit to wear for my senior pictures and I found two outfits I absolutely loved, the most frustrating thing I experienced was definitely the lack of quality with my clothes, sometimes I’d spend so much time and money on something I’d wear once or not at all, their leggings were always see through and the fabric never seemed to be the same, after graduation I was working a part time job as my full time job and had a bit more disposable income than I did before and started shopping at American eagle, aerie and pink, I’ve noticed the quality in pink go down dramatically over the years (back to school shopped there since middle school) I have to say the clothes I have purchased from American eagle and aerie I have re-worn year after year and are much more livable, I think my generation is becoming more aware of the quality of clothes and the evils of fast fashion which could also be contributing to forever 21s downfall
Forever 21 was a huge hit in the Philippines when it first came in, mostly because it was a foreign brand that was exclusively familiar to the upper class market who travel abroad or have relatives there. The prices were higher than local brands that use better quality cloth, but F21 successfully marketed itself as a more upscale brand than it really was.
Fast forward to some years later and the general market became more familiar with F21, so people increasingly stay away from it. We were turned off by the flimsy quality and the thin-ass cloth, even though we live in the tropics. Because our average income is smaller than that in the US, we prefer clothes that make us look good and also last for a year or more, so the concept of fast fashion isn't compatible with our clothing culture except for more affluent kids who can afford disposing a $17 dress after 3-5 uses. This is why Uniqlo is the number one foreign clothing brand in the PH. Their clothes, even though basic, can be worn in any way at any time. H&M is also doing well here despite being synonymous to fast fashion because they sell both basic and trendy clothes of better quality than F21's. Today a few F21 branches have closed, while some have downsized.
In terms of quality, yes, H&M has better quality than F21. The moment you wash your clothes from F21 they look like rags, i could never re-wear them. The designs of their clothes also declined. Now its just full of coachella outfits, lots of crop tops and holes that's only meant to be worn once
I used to shop at forever 21 in my mid 20s or so, but I quickly switched to h&m for the basics they had. I still prefer h&m if I need basics and forever 21 honestly doesn't really have much to offer me anymore.
The whole point of Forever 21 (and Zara and H&M) is to go see what's new, what's in the store today. This doesn't translate well to online shopping.
Personally, I find H&M's basics to be good value. Anything trendy is hit or miss. Zara feel like they're trying to be upmarket but don't quite understand what that means. Forever 21 were a disorganized mess the last time I was there.
I still shop at Forever 21 from time to time. Their clothes are low quality, but I can occasionally find a cute t-shirt or hoodie.
They were great when I needed a cheap t-shirt at the last minute for reasons not worth getting into right now. It was cute but it did not last forever. I didn't need it to at the time.
I used to shop every now and then at the Forever 21 I used to live close to. What I liked best about it was the variety of sizes. I liked how you could pretty much find everything from extremely petite sized clothing to extra large garments. Being extremely small, I often have to settle for kid's clothing at most retailers because that's all that fits. At Forever 21, though, I was able to find clothes that fit and weren't designed for kids, just really small women like me. I haven't had a lot of luck finding another retailer which equally caters to such a wide range of sizes and fashions for adults, but then again, I'm not huge on clothes shopping. Nowadays I just buy what fits and looks good when I happen to find it. X)
I feel the same way. When I was in my 20s, I was the skinniest I could weigh and still be healthy, and I have always been short but with proportionally wide hips. Finding clothes has always been a struggle, and back then I often found things at Forever 21 because they'd make clothes for shorty skinny adults.
But now it's like... idk, I don't find anything there like I used to, plus their physical stores are less inviting than they used to be. I never could stand the loud music and that has gotten worse now that I'm 30. I've also gained some weight and can now shop at whatever store I like, ha ha.
As a T-shirt and jeans kinda guy, the only reason I clicked on this episode is because I love this channel!
To me, it's the decline of quality. In the last 5 years, I've been switching to Old Navy and Uniqlo. Old Navy for cheap everyday wear, for white dresses which are not see-through, and Uniqlo for super sturdy basic wear.
Old Navy was a staple when I was younger. Their bad pant sizing is the only reason I don't shop there anymore
Old Navy is great! And I love that most of the clothing is actual cotton, sometimes rayon blends, but hardly any scratchy cheap polyester.
@@M123Xoxo And they have slips inside all of their white dresses to prevent see-through!
I stopped shopping at Old Navy because I think they're basics are not as good anymore and their quality is declining too. It's a way better option than forever 21 though and their basics are still ok.
Seeing the title alone without even watching the video yet: FUCKING _GOOD._ I've been begging people to stop shopping at F21 for YEARS because of how they notoriously and repeatedly stole from small, independent artists and designers for their shit. They were a regular feature on the blog "You Thought We Wouldn't Notice", which was a repository for both artists and observers to post their finds.
As an illustrator for a living, it irked me to no end.
Their thieving was so rampant that they actually had an entire division of their legal department wholly devoted to handling copyright/IP claims brought by the artists they stole from. For the most part, they knew most artists wouldn't have the money/ability to go after them and in the cases that legal action WAS taken, it was cheaper for F21 to pay damages than to properly license the work in the first place.
H&M and Urban Outfitters are just as bad about this.
Independent artists have enough of an uphill climb to make a living as it is without bent coat hangers like these companies preying on them as well. Good fucking riddance.
Here in Korea they were kind of folk heroes who would get about three of four big news spots a year talking about their American dream success story. I remember the articles just kind of slowing down and then just disappearing completely. Makes sense now. Some people are the "always stay hungry" types, but a think cashing out or slowing your grind to bow out on top (Michael Jordan style) is a virtue in its own right.
i was always curious about how koreans viewed the founders of forever 21, this was good to know
Rn the American Dream is BTS so it makes sense
I mean BTS can buy out Forever 21 I'd they wished to
last time i was this early, forever 21 hadn’t filed for bankruptcy
I really despise fast fashion brands. The exploitation, the relatively high environmental footprint per product, and how badly it shapes pop culture. I know it's not as profitable to sell clothes that will last you several years, but I think that is ultimately the ethical thing to do. That's why I like BJJ rash guards and spats. They're comfortable, are designed to take a beating, and fit really well. Plus, you can wear pretty much anything over them as needed.
When I was in high school (about 15 years ago) I used to frequently shop at Forever 21. I liked their style, and it was affordable. But towards the end of high school/beginning of college, their quality seemed to decline and their stores seemed to get dirtier and I stopped going
There structure is how the chaebols in South Korea were run. Samsung, LG, Hyundai and so on are only and largely run by a single extended family. It's not surprising if the Changs emulated this in Forever 21.
That's a pretty good point. I wonder if there's some deep-seated cultural aspect in Korea that dictates this.
@@matthewbowen5841 yes. Korea replicated Japan economically. And they're society is really big into conformity.
@@matthewbowen5841 yes, otherwise they would have listened to their business advisors, in the US the common capitalistic business practice is idea-finding investors- success- sell, meanwhile the more conservative model led by S.Korean family system has the selling point as the last possible option, more than likely due to personal pride and feelings. Both have advantages and disadvantages.
Forever 21 is essentially Claire's, all grown up, struggling to adjust to not being noticed by the crowd anymore.
Shitty quality that prices went super high. I remember when forever 21 and h&m were competition while hollister was still kinda the “it store” before fast fashion became a huge thing in the late 2010’s
as someone who used to shop with forever 21 my two main gripes about them are their terrible exchange policy and their lack of awareness of what people are into
I used to shop there a lot way back, now Forever 21 kinda feels a bit stale nowadays. They had some of the cutest clothes, especially the plus size ones.
To be fair, I don't really shop Amazon at all. Hate having to pay for high shipping costs, and they're not being fair to US territories as well.
@@JonTheVGNerd I hear ya, sometimes some clothes from Amazon don't fit right and the size chart can be so confusing.
I love your videos! It’s such a great way to educate yourself on what to do/what not to do when starting a business/wanting to expand. Thank you for the awesome videos 🧡
Forever 21 was my 1st job when I was 16. The store was SO MASSIVE and we only had a few employees. I was in high school and would have to work until midnight or later just to do the take backs from try one and put everything back into place on racks that customers would absolutely destroy daily. I hated it. I only lasted about 6 months before my mom made me quit because the hours were too crazy and my school work suffered.
I used to live around the corner for the original store (Fashion 21) during Forever 21's boom year. And I will say the OG store with the original dirty carpet touched my heart. The founders didn't forget where they come from.
The reason I personally stopped shopping there is the cheap ugly quality I don't like cheap quality clothing urban outfitters is where I occasionally still go because the quality of some things are really good
Stupid fact, I went and shopped at a forever 21 back 11 years ago to buy and get this a Mad Men outfit, they promoted a line of Mad Men the tv show outfits. They looked really sharp and I even bought a shirt. :)
I still only get my clothes from JC Penney's because they're literally the only ones that make affordable plus-size clothes that are cut right.
Forever 21 does have Plus size
@@sagethealchemist yeah but they aren't cut right. the bottom of my sleeve from there connects with the torso WAY too low because all they seemed to have done is take a standard size and add some inches, which just doesn't work.
And I also want to see a "Final Chapter" video on Sears and Kmart! They are very numbered now, and I have no doubt they will close all their remaining stores soon.
Wow! Another great job of providing us a lot of information that makes simple sense of what happens to businesses we all know and wondering WHY? What happened? Thanks Mr. Man!!
I wonder how the Korean chaebol style of company ownership played an impact on Forever 21's ownership structure?
I was thinking the same when he said they were Koreans. Those companies also have government support.
It's funny that just the other day I was on their online store just browsing and didn't find anything appealing to me, I'm not sure if I'm no longer within the target demographic but that's my reason for not shopping like I use to.
The only have three pages of swimsuits and I only saw one sport illustrated monokini that was sexy asf ONLY ONE
Same, i used to online shop from them all the time years ago, but now the clothes on their site are not cute anymore.
I have to say I consider your channel one of the most interesting and strangely entertaining on UA-cam. I started out watching your channel because you had videos about a few companies I cared about, now I find that I’ve watched almost your entire catalog and watch all of your new videos even when they’re about companies that I really don’t give a shit about at all…. And enjoy them. You have a rare and subtle gift sir.
I remember when Forever 21 came to our mall in the late 2000s right during the recession, they took over the former Kohls space, but they didn’t sell enough mens clothes, which they should be doing. Especially when they took over lots of retail space and didn’t diversify their products to include clothes for the whole family! They should’ve downsized the former Kohls anchor and made them look like Gap.
Fun fact: the matching birthday dresses my best friend and i wore for our 21st birthday party came from Forever 21.
Forever 21’s “treasure hunt” model never worked for me. It was just too much to dig through to find something simple and comfortable.
They also never carried long jeans and I’m 5’10 mostly legs.
Just hearing about this store is so nostalgic
I'm real glad your videos are easily digestible, alot of the fashion biz flies over my head. I didnt even know fast fashion was a thing.
I’ve worked here the past 2 years, the company is actually doing well since the bankruptcy, especially last years sales. I believe the company will be around for some time, but it does seem to be much less favored than it used to be. The biggest problem with the company is the overbuying. There’s too much product coming in everyday and they’re not making smart purchases. A lot of the new stuff is ugly and doesn’t look right on the hanger so it doesn’t sell. Or it doesn’t fit well because it’s made for 1 body type. So it ends up on sale for $5. This is a never ending cycle. On top of that the stores are too large and too full to properly maintain. As a customer, I wouldn’t want to shop in a store so messy, but if you do please understand we are doing our best.
THEY WENT OUT OF BUSINESS.
Forever 21 had a HUGE opportunity to cater to the plus size girlies...but if F21 insists on dressing us plus size gals like grandmas or children...we're gonna shop elsewhere :P
We do have a Plus size section!!!
Their plus size clothes were als9 like 2 sizes smaller than other brands too, and ugly.
That is a market that has a huge (no pun indended) demand for plus size clothes that actually look good and it can be done. It would be smart for a business specializing in fashion to do this. But if you don't you're going to hurt yourself in the long run
I honestly moved away from Forever 21 when I needed plus size clothing. My closet is basically a Torrid ad these days, but they're the only plus size brand chain that seems to at least understand plus size proportions. Forever 21 plus sizing always sat weird on me.
Yeah, when I was in college, had they had a plus size section they definitely would've gotten all of my money. They jumped on that train too late and fell short when they finally did. The selection wasn't there. Many items were online only. They didn't have great shipping options and their return policy was too restrictive to make plus size online shopping feasible.
Bro your intro bumps so hard when I have my AirPods in. good job
Forever 21 seemingly has been on a decline, and ironically, the one in Rockaway, NJ was a former FYE (which has since reopened to replace Saturday Matinee). Interesting you posted one for FYE and now one for Forever 21. Please do one for the decline of A&P!
What’s a&p
The Great Atlantic & Pacific Tea Company better known simply as A&P. They were once the biggest grocery store retailer in the United States (and at one time the world), but also a great innovator and trendsetter in business models we know and use today. They were around for over 150 years, but they are no longer in business now.
We share this experience in-common in that I too have childhood memories of shopping at A&P when I was growing up in Michigan in the late 80's and early 90's. It was the weekly experience to go with my late mom and head on down to the A&P store. I remember how they used to have physical bottle returns (just give someone your big bags of empty cans for money) and I remember that the bag boys in checkout would actually grind your coffee beans as you were being checked out. It was always a special trip because I would always get a little Borden chocolate milk from a paper carton and an early junk food called Pecan Twirls for the ride home. I was sad when that store was sold out to Farmer Jack in the late 90's, and I only shopped that store one time because I thought their prices were exorbitant and was appalled. Farmer Jack folded completely a couple of years later on in the early days of the long Michigan recession. I know about H-E-B and I hear that they are quite the dominant juggernaut when it comes to grocery stores down there. I hear that there is them and then everybody else. It is kind-of amazing how regional grocery stores can be, like of-course Michigan has its Meijer which is unheard of outside of the midwest, whilst I know stores like Piggy-Wiggly and Winn-Dixie are mostly South. From how I understand it the grocery store business is not a get-rich-quick profession and your margins for error between success and failure are very narrow.
@@theearthmovesagain Since you were in MI probably back in the 1970s visiting A&P did you have K Mart and A&P combined stores at that time? We did in Buffalo Grove IL, back in the early-mid 70s it was really a concept ahead of its time because you really didn't see the super general merchandise center-with full line groceries as a regular thing in the USA until WalMart arrived nationally in the late 80s and mostly early 90s with it.
Well, I have to say that I never saw an A&P store combined with a K-Mart store before, nor never heard of one possibly existing somewhere around me either. I would not dismiss that idea entirely, though, since I can easily envision it happening. This was back in a time when K-Mart was a very strong store and a very serious player in retail; when you connected yourself with a K-Mart you were hooking up with a winner! I remember when other businesses used to have leases and separate space within K-Mart stores, and in-fact my first-ever job interview was with a Little Caesar's inside of a K-Mart store! I do remember, however, seeing this concept you speak of with another grocery store brand that was around when I was young, the IGA. We had two blended IGA stores in my area, the first one was with an independent drugstore. That was kind-of a neat place, actually; when you entered the drugstore, there were stairs that took you up to a second floor that was still the drugstore but was also whereas you could overlook both them on one side and, on the other side, the grocery store. You had to take another set of stairs down to enter the IGA from there! The other one was connected with a Ben Franklin five-and-dime store. (Who out there remembers that store anymore, eh)? It was a more-straightforward store design - enter Franklin's and then head towards the back of their store and you were now suddenly inside an IGA. To my childhood mind that was kind-of cool, and even a little bit strange, how you just could move from one entire store to an entirely different one just like that, how the architecture and the designs, even the floors and the lighting, just switched so suddenly. You are correct, this was a rather innovative idea in its time; it is commonplace, even boring, now, but several decades ago, the thought of this "one-stop-shop" was a relatively new concept and, honestly, the future to come. I can remember how older folks than I was would just be so blown away and overwhelmed by such stores. The first time I remember seeing a so-called "superstore" myself was when I shopped at a Meijer in probably the late 80's or early 90's. It was not as big as it is now and it was a differently-run store back then (department managers used to all wear these distinctive grey suits with these vests and ties that they do not do anymore), but it was definitely a "Wow!" experience to be in a single place that sold so much stuff underneath one roof. I do remember that as a teenager hearing about the "threat" of the coming of these Wal-Mart stores to Michigan, though, this gigantic superstore from down South that just sold "everything" cheaply and that put all of the local smaller competition out of business. I can remember from those days actual grassroots efforts by concerned peoples to stop such a store from coming to their towns! It all sounds so terribly naive now. Is not this strange to remember back to how life had once been and to what we had once thought then? But, there is so much history that is never written down but shared and learned only in the stories such as ours when we tell them!
I remember visiting with my skinny and tall friend and I was a bigger lady at the time. neither of us found things that fit. The sizing was geared for smaller sizes, like Chinese sizes. We were in a Canadian Forever 21.
Selling poorly-made crap DID work .. until the internet came to bat with 6,492 web sites offering the same (lack of) quality at a 20% discount.
I also noticed about 10 years ago or so all the forever 21s in my area (San Diego) had HUGE makeovers done to them. Like new floors, lights, basically everything (and all these stores are freaking huge too). So I’m sure that also added to their costs at some point 🤷🏼♀️
Interesting story. Personally, I'm not one for 'fast fashion' because, if I buy something, I want to wear it as much as I can to know it was worth it; stuff that you're supposed to only wear a few times and replace in a short time frame is so wasteful to me. 'Trendiness' is a messed-up concept.
same, i have some clothes in my closet that are "out of trend" but i still wear them
700k in 1980's man that's the most profitable and biggest start up revenue, even apple would have fought tooth and nail for that type of revenue in their first year
Let me guess…all the customers grew up and realized what a tool they were for buying overpriced, cheaply made-in-sweat-shop rags?
Honestly yes but their quality is so bad now. Worse than when I was In middle school and high school and their prices are so high especially the men they are scamming the men section
Interesting! I learned a lot of stuff I had no idea about here. Thanks for the great content as always!
You should do Claire's next, I got really big into them about 15 years ago
I've noticed Claire's used to be more for teen girls, now it's elementary school girls who wear it. Maybe that's part of the reason for their decline.
@@supervivo7069 they're more accessories and various knickknacks than stuff you "wear" tbh
You should definitely check out Round 1. It would be a GREAT video for why they’re successful. Especially looking at what most businesses went through with covid.
Definitely been awhile since I’ve set foot in a forever 21.
I feel like I've seen you in the comment section of almost every video I've watched since that one Caddicarus "George of the Jungle" game review from years ago. I can't complain. I like your comments! Plus you also have great taste in content. ;)
@@ohm_sweet_ohm Probably a comment bot of some kind
I don't know if it's because I'm 25 and getting too old for F21, or if the clothes just suck now. I used to go all the time as a teen and early 20-something, but now I only go once in a blue moon. Sometimes I'll find something cute, (my favorite winter coat that I get compliments on nearly every time I wear it, for example) but there's so much junk to go through that I don't feel like it's worth trying. It's like a more expensive and less fun version of going to a messy thrift shop.
Edit: Also, I think there's 2 major cultural shifts among young customers that F21 is suffering from. Firstly is the rising awareness of the ecological and unethical impact of fast fashion, I think more young people are trying to avoid fast fashion whenever possible. Secondly is the shift towards online sales, young people who want fast fashion are going to be flocking to Shein, Romwe, Fashion Nova, etc. instead of the mall to F21.
Used to shop at Forever21 often in my early 20s, I always found it was hit or miss with them though. You could go in one day and find a bunch of cool stuff u like, then go another day and there’s nothing u like. Also felt the clothing sections and organization layout was a bit messy for my taste. Regardless I did find some gems there, yea they didn’t last long but for the moment they were cool 👍
Their shops are always so messy.....
Great video as always! I think a bluebell icecream video would be cool
I've been in there a few times and see absolutely nothing I want. Even when I was closer to that age I never desired anything at the store. Taste and evolving traits and they didn't keep up.
To be honest, I've only been in a Forever 21 store once. It was at the local mall around 2015-2016 and I desperately wanted to get a dress for my first middle school dance from there. My dad and I walked in and immediately took notice of the mess. Everything was everywhere, it was kind of like looking through the clothes section in a thrift shop. Needless to say, I got my dress from Macy's and I still have it to this day!
Ive noticed they now have a “fashion nova-esque” party outfit section online and in stores but the items arent even private label? They have the same tags as perhaps a Shein. It appears theyre trying to now appeal to a demo that has moved on years ago.
See this is why watching your channel one to week is good for the soul I have never heard of this company before today when you mentioned it in your video
Shein is the new generations forever 21.
The joke I always heard about forever 21 growing up was “Forever 21 clothes last 21 seconds”
I loved Forever 21 when I was in my 20s but it is one of those stores you tend to grow out of. In recent years, before the one in my mall closed, I would stop in and just see a bunch of crap. I'm all for fashion and trends but their clothing just looked trashy.
It’s cheap trendy clothing. But I used to love going shopping there with friends as a teen/young adult
When I was a teenager, Forever 21 was THE store but I don’t remember them having good prices like at all. It may have been the state but I remember the teens that shopped there weren’t from mid-to-upper class, these were kids who’s families were broke but would get their kids the latest in everything.
Personally I never shopped there. I think I went once and got a shirt? But it was ridiculously expensive and even though I was in the demographic, I just wasn’t a teen who chased fashion. And even though their decline seems to have happened into my college years, I remember Forever 21 being looked down upon even when I was in high school. Even the kids who went to F21 a month ago and would proudly state as such, would try desperately to hide it a month later.
The saying went “Why are you going to Forever 21 when they cater to smaller sizes, are too expensive, etc. just get your clothes from other places that won’t charge an arm and a leg!”
That’s at least been my experience. It’s amazing to me that people say they were good clothes for cheap because at my mall… F21 was not a store you wanted to go to for good deals.
This sounds more like urban outfitters
At full price they were ok, but they had fantastic sales, when you'd be able to get stuff at below 10$ a piece. I got a nice big wool mix sweater that I still wear to this day for literally 10$ on sale.
Forever 21 definitely got expensive but they are ripping off the men. If you go the mens section their prices are like urban outfitters.
Speaking of urban outfitters they are a complete scam. Bad quality clothing for ridiculous prices. That was my store in high school and idk what I was thinking. The only thing good about urban outfitters is if you are a vinyl collectors or they would have good books or knickknacks but even back in my high school years urban outfitters never had the prices they have now it was affordable the only expensive clothes would be like the sweats and hoodies before they became cheap quality
I bought a jean jacket for the very mild Florida winter of Jan 2019, 2 months later the buttons broke off.
It was a nice jacket but damn dog it looked a little old after a bit.
Fast Fashion! Is a brutal business
Probably the fastest one to burn a business
Bought a winter coat about 4 yrs ago. Love it, still use it every season.
I have watched your videos for years and I am thrilled that you spend the time to unravel the complexity/absurdity/fantasy/ well, I could use a lot more words, but in general, the history and perspective of the companies you focus on. I also do similar dives, but for a different purpose/rationale. I ran across something that I think could be an interesting topic for you. The "Beech-Nut Nutrition Corporation". If you have other endeavors, no worries, but this one may be a wild ride! Either way, keep making awesome content, your analytical perspective is well appreciated by this humble set of eyes... :)
Also "fast fashion" is the cultural decline of America and the west
Thanks for the video. Yeah, I been to Forever 21 only 3 times and I wasn't feeling the clothes. Could you do videos on Fashion Nova & Rainbow Fashion Apparel?
guess they found out you cant be 21 forever
As an Australian I loved shopping at Forever 21, because we didn’t have it here and I found the selection better than Zara and H&M at that time. I still have a favourite coat that’s 8 years old from there. Sounds like it really was an American dream. Right place. Right time. I didn’t think it would be possible to replicate that model now so successfully
To sum it up, it was pride, ego and unwillingness to adapt, which lead to their downfall.
stores are often overcrowded with merch and it doesn't match what's available online
Forever 21 "From Massive Trendy Fashions to a Massively Fat Joke"
I am kinda so sure that this was trying to be the next Walmart because Walmart was so successful in the first place that they open more stores all the time but forever 21 was just way too successful to get into the retail business or fast fashion retail market.
You should do a videos on wrestling companies. About the history of a company how we got started how they made their money, their top stars and ultimately How their demise happened
Forever 21 found out that 40 isn't the new 20.
Hahaha is that what you tell yourself after your gf left you for an older guy?
I really love this channel, it provides a lot of info on businesses re: what to do and what not to do, but I really, really wish the presenter wouldn't drag out the last syllables of his sentences.
Since the family was so involved and they saw their companys big success, I wonder if they were trying to run a Chaebol like business in America
Chaebol?
@@Tokuijin the typical family run company and business model in S. Korea. Extreme control and ownership passed only through the close/extended family, basically creating a royalty line in business.
Over time, not only did I stop going to Forever 21, but I've generally stopped going to Express and other upmarket retail stores, simply because places like Target actually sell decent looking clothes at reasonable prices (Target's Goodfellow brand actually makes some nice-ish casual clothing now). I may still hit up Banana Republic for comfortable shoes, suits or nightlife attire.
I use to love this store. But there clothes are sized so weirdly maybe that's why. There return policy is trash too
i agree. a lot of the returns are not allowed because it’s “final sale”
also it feels like everything runs so small?
I had a hooded sweater like vest I bought back in 2009 that lasted me for many many years. Since then I haven't seen anything that caught my attention :(.
They might be able to recoup some of their loses if they would expand their size availability and include sizes for larger men and women.
is this just your way of compensating for being overweight or do you genuinely think this is a good idea 😂
@@JimiArchive I’m not overweight, but if you look around you’ll find that they don’t exactly include bigger people in their size groups. They’re not the only ones either.
That’s really interesting, some other commentators said that they used to shop there because it was the only place where they could find nice and trendy plus sized clothes. Maybe it was a location thing?
I love the cut at 8:56. Company Man didn't want to go into why malls are failing., but BAM!