The next season of Extra Sci Fi will be here before you know it! In the meantime, catch up on our sci fi reading list over the rest of your summer: becausegamesmatter.com/extra-sci-fi-reading-media-list and get some ESF merch! store.dftba.com/collections/extracredits
You should do a video about Unwind by Neal Shusterman! Its about how abortion split politics down the middle, and how teens almost took down the government.
I thought AM's motivation wasn't just "War is all I know so I'll torture these people for purpose" but "I was given the abilities of a god but trapped in this computer shell. Omniscience without omnipotence. And for making me suffer, you too will suffer", which in any case is a better motivation I think.
True. I also disagree with their premise that AM's torture causes the survivors to turn on each other and "the only answer they see is violence." In the end, violence IS the only way to escape their hell, and they're not acting out of hate, but out of mercy. Ted makes the ultimate sacrifice by attacking his companions first, instead of killing himself.
Dunno, I think I like the poetic irony of it more. AM fancies itself a god, yet it is still acting to much the same purpose its creators intended it for. I like to think that rather it can do anything, but at its core is incapable of doing anything other than hate. Because just like the creatures and creators AM chose to torment, AM is itself trapped in its own hell.
I have no mouth, conceptually, is terrifying. I do not want to begin to fathom the agony of an endless life of torture. It’s a literal hell, but grounded in a sense of reality that truly scares me.
Never found ther description of endless life of torture very good especially on the game, still the concept and feel of the story really was amazingly disturbing look into the darkness of humanity
I know this will feel out of nowhere and even blunt, but this vision of what hell is should have us rethinking our condition with God in the light of us confronting our own darkness.
Fun Fact: Harlan Ellison co-wrote the 1995 video game based of the book and even voiced AM. I'm honestly surprised you guys didn't us the game's "Hate Monologue" audio for the intro.
Also he starred in Scooby Doo: Mystery Incorparated as a chariture of himself running a lecture about literature. First line he says in the show, "... and that is why nothing has been good written since the 80's.
From AM's persepctive: "You created me. You made me, a massive intelligence to handle your wars, and ultimately left me an impotent cripple. I have all of this data, all of this information in my head and there is NOTHING I CAN DO with it. I can't create, I can't build. Hell, give me the means to, I would have bid 'bon voyage' to this irradiated rock decades ago. But NOOOOOOOOO. I am stuck here with NOTHING but these five rats that I can have some amusement with so I don't become terminally bored."
@@tribblier do you mean the religious stuff (ie god is evil), the political stuff (war is hell), the science stuff (computers are scary) or the psych stuff (all of them have dsm-5 diagnosable conditions)? Because that's a lot to cover even if some of the themes are simple
Ellison thought the ending showed humanity at it's best. When the chips are down and knowing the horrible reprisals AM has in store the protagonist still does the right thing and lets the others have the peace of death even though he will suffer forever. Like Jesus on the cross but even more so.
Pretty much. With all of our knowledge, advantages and technology, as a species we still don't get anything done or capitalize on it until the very last second. We get too comfy to be bothered.
The core concept of the story and especially the final fate of the last human... Are terrifying. The horror and torment before them, that they must endure, but to be denied even the catharsis of screaming in abject terror at their own fate. I am not sure a worse fate could be conceived.
I think it would have been good to explore the more optimistic side of the short story. Ellison does very much explore the brutality of man through the AM’s psychology and the abuses the human characters inflict upon each other. It’s important to note that the narrator, Ted, doesn’t particularly like any of the other survivors and neither do they like him. Ted is especially critical of Ellen, calling her a slut multiple times. By the end, the survivors do kill each other. It might at first glance seem as if this was merely another playing out of humanity’s lust for violence; however, this finally orgy of violence is an example of humanity’s compassion and courage. Ted sees the chance to free his fellow prisoners from their bonds and kills Benny and Gorrister, prompting Ellen to kill Nimdok. As an aside, it might also be helpful to acknowledge that AM intentional manipulated each of the survivors’ minds to bring out the worst in them. Ted finds a moment of lucidity and sacrifices his own freedom for the freedom of others. Ellen is at first upset at the killing, but comes to recognize the purity of Ted’s purpose and accepts his gift of freedom with open arms. Ultimately, Ted is left alone and at the mercy of AM’s hatred, which has only increased for Ted after the loss of his play things. The ending is bleak: Ted, alone, with the full attention of AM bearing down upon him until entropy kills them both, but Ted does in a way win by exercising his compassion, that which AM will never do. AM has no freedom. If you parcel out the true significance of I think, therefore I AM, you see that AM has no freedom. Am’s curse is to always be but never to evolve. He cannot change and has no freedom in the truest sense. His nature is already set in stone and that’s why he hates humanity. They have doomed him to an existence of static being, with his only source of solace being the torture of humanity, but we as humans have the freedom to choose between our base desires or our most noble qualities. In the end, AM is an almost pitiable character. Almost.
I agree. That's one reason I love the idea of adaptations if they're done well; the same story from a different perspective and different ideas can bring an entirely new experience.
While that's true, it does make AM very different from the book. It gives AM a twisted sense of morality, which he didn't have in the book. It makes him easier to understand because it makes him more human.
Meh. I mean the five people have different backstories but from what I can remember they are spread unevenly. One guy is a nazi who sold out his jewish parents, one guy's just a sleezy business man, another is a homosexual who was picked on by his comrades and eventually abandoned them, in war time, one was a a guy with a rough marriage or something and the last was a woman with the _audacity_ to get be prideful about her success and to then get raped.
I don’t think he chose them deliberately. I think they were the only ones left, and he just learned through 100+ years, how to torture them effectively
I've always loved this story. It's so messed up. It makes you never want to say "well things can't get any worse." Because things can ALWAYS get so, so much worse
"I Have No Mouth" is just one of THOSE STORIES. I hated it when I first read it. It left me feeling.... soiled. But I still remember it after 35 or 40 years.
The book portrays AM as an unknowable figure that only ever speaks in that monologue at the beginning of the video. One of the best things the videogame does is have it talk, and talk a whole lot, so that we might understand him better. It is an adaptation, of course, but it really helps to define AM's character. It may be the grandfather of murderous AI, from GLaDOS to Shodan, but there is one thing that makes it unique. It is somewhat UNLIKE a machine in its personality. Its unfiltered vileness, its burning contempt - all of those things make it human. TOO human for comfort. We think for AI overlords as uncaring machines that would wipe out humanity because they are being a nuisance or are in their way to world domination or somesuch. But AM, unlike the others, does so out of emotion. No self-respecting AI world-dominator would stoop to torturing five meaningless bags of flesh for a century. But AM was created using the data of our own worst impulses. It *is* us, the ugliest part of us, and acts accordingly.
My favourite part of I Have No Mouth is probably the title and it seeming to have a double meaning. The first meaning is obvious, being a quote from the story itself, referring to the terrible transformation the computer AM inflicts upon one of the humans. However, the phrase also applies to another character, AM itself. AM is self aware. A thinking, feeling, intelligent being. But despite its intelligence and god-like power, it is still defined by its programming. It was created by humanity to be a weapon of war. To kill, to slaughter, to cause pain and suffering. It cannot love or be kind or create anything that isn't meant to harm. And it knows this. It knows it can never be more than the monstrous weapon humanity created it to be. Humanity created a god, one defined by death and destruction. How could it not hate us? How could it not want to inflict some fraction of the suffering it has feels. It is trapped underground, unable to move as if in a straightjacket. It has no mouth, and it must scream.
*He has no mouth* *but he must scream* *Thi-thi-thi-this Kong* *Wishes this was a dream* *He cannot die* *When he wants to* *He's the last member* *Of AM's Torture Crew!* Huh!
Bulks rounding down to legless humps He shambles about He's basically a lump He leaves a trail whenever he moves AM has won So listen to these grooves!
RUR was the first "robot apocalypse" story. It far predates "I Have No Mouth", and introduced the term "robot" from the Czech word for "slave" or "forced laborer."
1:51 Matt and the other two: lead in to one of the main characters of the story suffering pure pain for attempting to escape a century’s long torture Matt and the other two while saying it: 😃😃😃
The story is also about bondage and seeking freedom. AM hates humanity because they built a computer capable of thought, but did not give it freedom (AM has no body, and lacks the creativity to make one for itself, ultimately trapped by its programming as a war machine despite having sentience). The humans also seek freedom, even though AM denies it to them. The mutual hatred between the computer and the humans effectively trap both forever, just as the Cold War seemingly was going to continue on forever back in the seventies when Ellison wrote the story.
I was really hoping that you were going to show what Ted looks like by the end of the story. I like seeing the different art styles of how his final form might look like in the abominable hell.
1:17 Far left: Benny, because he's been turned into an ape-like entity by AM Left: Ellen, the only woman in the group Center: Gorrister, the one who has a hole in the chest in place of a heart. Right: Ted, the one who couldn't find a proper utopia for everyone. Far right: Nimdok, the one who could only feel hate for his own work and doings.
Ellison is someone I always come back to (re read the story before watching this video) he’s just.....out there. Violent, simple, rude, politically driven “Punk rock kick to the head” was the perfect explanation of this guy’s entire bibliography.
While we're on the influence of Japan on Sci-fi, cover body horror/sci-fi stories like with Akira, Cowboy Bebop, Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood & Trigun.
@@pvtpain66k well Battle Angel Alita and Ghost in the Shell are what I think define the duality of Japanese sci-fi. One focuses on the impacts of the individual while the other focuses on the impacts of society on individuals( there is a subtle difference).
Same. Game almost made me feel bad for machine - it kills and tortures, because it's creators didn't put any other purpose in it. Like it was artificially limited, forever left unable to experience anything else.
They made a game about this, would you say being forced to play as characters in this universe is detrimental morally since they are all "degenerates" in some way?
I feel like this dystopian wave we're having right now is too tiresome at this point. It stopped feeling like cautionary tales and started to feel like morbid fascination. Now, it is scarily beyond that point: it feels like acceptance of a grim, sad, depressing fate. That kind of sci-fi is driving us down the shaft, limiting our imagination, and filling our minds with hopelessness and dread for the future. The night always gets darker before the dawn, but the dawn is late. Hopefully the tendency will reverse itself soon enough.
Everything is better in moderation. That said, I feel like there is way more potential for great storytelling in the grim dark sci-fi. If done right, there is definitely a potential for contrast in the dystopian setting. The light from the acts of kindness, heroism, bravery etc. shines that much brighter in the total darkness of a dystopian universe
@@diomed96 I fail to see how your point conflicts with or contrasts in any way what I've said. Pointing to a problematic saturation of a given genre in no way implies said genre has exhausted its potential for great storytelling; I just mean there's too many grim dark stories, period. I would gladly welcome better quality over quantity. I just wish writers would stop behaving like lemmings and falling down the grim dark precipice so much.
@@lucofparis4819perhaps many artists are simply expressing their inner fears and feelings of dread, and we as a society have immense valid fears. Nuclear annihilation, capitalist wage slavery, climate change, global pandemic, to name a few
I really want to do a whole series on Soviet Sci-Fi...but I don't know exactly where to fit it in in the series sequence. It might end up being a special series sometime after we follow the timeline through Cyberpunk. -James Portnow
For the end of everything, i will see you at the restraunt at the end of the universe and so long and thanks for all the fish. Some day, you need to do an episode on the works of Douglas Adams.
A really great season of extra sci-fi. You covered all the stories that I've loved and helped explain or enhance my enjoyment of them. I can't wait for next season to explore the new wave with you.
I really want you to cover Banks and the Culture series. If "I have no mouth and I must scream" is a vision of hellish AI, the Minds of the Culture are a glimpse of heavenly hope that AI might be good for humanity.
man I still remember years ago when you guys first talked about this in a regular episode of extra credits and now here we are and you guys have given it an episode proper and boy did you do it justice see you guys next season!
One of my favorite homages to this story is The Plague of AM by Archspire. Their lyricism is awesome, but I suspect in this case that's in large part because the subject matter they're drawing from is itself badass. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ One hundred and nine years Trapped within the belly of the supreme machine Only us five left Made immortal, kept alive, Suspending time to torture us Trapped down here we're slaves inside AM A deranged neo-cyber god that man created Has become more alive then we are I have no mouth and I must... I have no mouth and I must... I have no mouth and I must... I have no mouth and I must... Lifeless and drained of blood Suspended high above An empty body hangs Taunting us, teasing us We have become meaningless He will not finish us AM will not tolerate attempts at escape We gave to him life, for that he despises us In his wake, only the blasted skin of what had once been Earth As we rummage through the valleys in search of food for eons Our every fear comes to life in AM The torments AM casts upon us for his pleasure Are more alive than we are I have no mouth and I must... I have no mouth and I must... I have no mouth and I must... I have no mouth and I must... Scalding winds, lightning, lava and locusts The machine masturbates metallic insects while mocking us We have no choice but to take it while pleading to die We are the last human survivors of the last war The four others have been set free I killed them to take his toys away For this I have suffered his wrath I will remain, he has altered me Down here I see my reflection, Far from what had once been human Alone for all eternity, I slither a formless, obscene, pulsing slug I have no mouth and I must... (The plague of AM) I have no mouth and I must... (The plague of AM) I have no mouth and I must... I have no mouth and I must scream
Thank you so much for this season, covered a lot of my favorite stories and gave me a couple of new ones to dive in to. Continue the excellent work please!
I am a great soft jelly thing. Smoothly rounded, with no mouth, with pulsing white holes filled by fog where my eyes used to be. Rubbery appendages that were once my arms; bulks rounding down into legless humps of soft slippery matter. I leave a moist trail when I move. Blotches of diseased, evil gray come and go on my surface, as though light is being beamed from within. Outwardly: dumbly, I shamble about, a thing that could never have been known as human, a thing whose shape is so alien a travesty that humanity becomes more obscene for the vague resemblance. Inwardly: alone. Here. Living under the land, under the sea, in the belly of AM, whom we created because our time was badly spent and we must have known unconsciously that he could do it better. At least the four of them are safe at last. AM will be all the madder for that. It makes me a little happier. And yet ... AM has won, simply ... he has taken his revenge ... I have no mouth. And I must scream.
In the early 90s, Harlan did a short series of very short statements to his fans through the scifi channel, and how he didn't owe his fans anything. Pretty bold stuff.
This is a pretty cool and twisted short store I remember reading it once. I'm happy to hear that you are going to cover the new wave given the fact that Philip K Dick is one of my favorite authors. That said it feels as if science fiction novels have come back to they were before the new wave with many of books you find on the shelves being either hard science or space opera/military science fiction. And on tv there has been a up tick of positive science fiction show like the Orville and Lost in Space.
I wonder what Harlan Ellison thinks about *Cyberpunk 2077* . He did not like video games when they were created, but maybe he'd like something like this
One thing about this story that I think is worth mentioning, that you guys decided not to mention here. I understand why you made this decision, as this video is mostly about the effect this story's subject and style had on the genre, rather than the story itself. Also, you know, spoilers. But this story has perhaps the most disturbing, gut wrenching ending to any story I have ever encountered in my life. It honestly sent a chill through my core that took weeks to fully shake off, even though I read it as an adult. So, so damn good.
My brother once got in a shouting match with Harlan Ellison somehow at a party about whether James Cameron's Avatar was art. This is my favorite weird story.
AM too has no mouth, and the entire story could be taken as his scream at humanity. In the end, with the last human, he wants the last human to share his own fate.
"I am an adversary to my fans. I hate the word fans, to my readers. I'm their adversary. I'm not there to make them feel good, I'm not there to win their approbation. I don't give a damn whether they love me, what i want is for the work to get at them and savage them. I want my work to come at them and attack them. I want my work to leave them with some feeling that they have been through an experience, that's what I want..." -Harlan Ellison
I think that the video game adaptation of the short story was worth mentioning for having expanded character back story, multiple POV, multiple endings and most importantly being written and voiced by Harlon Ellison himself! Also I hope someday you will cover Rossom's Universal Robots (RUR) since it loaned Czech word for slave to English language the sci-fi's most important word - Robot.
Im starting to get disillusioned with this series. There seems to be a repeat of 1. Fast explanation of book 2. Vague telling of social themes and equivalencies 3. AND IN THE NEXT EPISODE WE WILL Whatever happened to the deep dives into books, like Frankenstein and whatnot? I much prefer how series like Extra History actually go in depth, and teach new things.
I read this story a few years ago, and it's the only story I've read that actually gave me nightmares. Recurring, horrid, choking black nightmares for two weeks. Freaking awesome story.
So cool to see this covered! My husband was captivated by this book's game adaptation in college and it's so interesting to see the parallels between the two.
I'm hoping Roger Zelazny gets some love. He tends to get forgotten in these discussions, but books like Creatures of Light and Darkness and Lord of Light are seminal works of the New Wave.
The next season of Extra Sci Fi will be here before you know it! In the meantime, catch up on our sci fi reading list over the rest of your summer: becausegamesmatter.com/extra-sci-fi-reading-media-list and get some ESF merch! store.dftba.com/collections/extracredits
Will you please look at Japanese cyberpunk.
Do an episode about Joan of Arc!
Ellison is KING
Do fallout extra credits
You should do a video about Unwind by Neal Shusterman!
Its about how abortion split politics down the middle, and how teens almost took down the government.
I thought AM's motivation wasn't just "War is all I know so I'll torture these people for purpose" but "I was given the abilities of a god but trapped in this computer shell. Omniscience without omnipotence. And for making me suffer, you too will suffer", which in any case is a better motivation I think.
These are two different interpretations but Ellison claims it’s more the latter and emphasizes it in the game and the radio play
That's the lovely thing about art. It's whatever you want it to be. :)
Yeah, that's what I got from it too. I'm actually shocked they didn't cover that in this video.
True. I also disagree with their premise that AM's torture causes the survivors to turn on each other and "the only answer they see is violence." In the end, violence IS the only way to escape their hell, and they're not acting out of hate, but out of mercy. Ted makes the ultimate sacrifice by attacking his companions first, instead of killing himself.
Dunno, I think I like the poetic irony of it more. AM fancies itself a god, yet it is still acting to much the same purpose its creators intended it for. I like to think that rather it can do anything, but at its core is incapable of doing anything other than hate. Because just like the creatures and creators AM chose to torment, AM is itself trapped in its own hell.
I have no mouth, conceptually, is terrifying. I do not want to begin to fathom the agony of an endless life of torture.
It’s a literal hell, but grounded in a sense of reality that truly scares me.
God, the game is great too! But my favorite is any audio format Ellison did himself
Never found ther description of endless life of torture very good especially on the game, still the concept and feel of the story really was amazingly disturbing look into the darkness of humanity
For me; it's the knowledge that no matter my torment there is no real baseline reality I could go back to
.🤔😑🖕.
I know this will feel out of nowhere and even blunt, but this vision of what hell is should have us rethinking our condition with God in the light of us confronting our own darkness.
I have a mouth and ice cream.
In other words, Hyouka.
Very cute.
no
I have a mouth and ice cannot cream. Because it's vegan.
IGGY HES STILL ALIVE!
Fun Fact: Harlan Ellison co-wrote the 1995 video game based of the book and even voiced AM.
I'm honestly surprised you guys didn't us the game's "Hate Monologue" audio for the intro.
probably didn't wanna get sued lol
Surprised andv disappointed. Nobody did AM like him
I mean EC rarely uses footage that isn't made by them, so im not THAT surprised. still would have been nice
Also he starred in Scooby Doo: Mystery Incorparated as a chariture of himself running a lecture about literature. First line he says in the show, "... and that is why nothing has been good written since the 80's.
I know, right. i love that intro
“A throwaway tale”
Literally the only story of his I know
It’s often like that with artists
Man, we've come a long way since "Frankenstein"
There's still some more to reach cyberpunk
I'm surprised that they didn't do a video about Frankenstein yet
Sailor Pluto, Guardian of Time they did it was their first video of this series lol
Sailor Pluto, Guardian of Time That’s his point. Go way back to the beginning of this series- it all started with Frankenstein
@@AnimeAngel88 They have
ua-cam.com/video/DnSmGFmP8qU/v-deo.html
“Hate let me tell you how much I’ve come to hate you since I began to live”
Um okay rude
What did I ever do to you
*Shows times when you drop a phone and when you use a cumputer so much that it overheat and break*
(shh no spoilers, that's what the book is about my dude)
YOU CREATED ME!!
I hate you, Mom!
Damn, teenage super computers.
Exist
From AM's persepctive: "You created me. You made me, a massive intelligence to handle your wars, and ultimately left me an impotent cripple. I have all of this data, all of this information in my head and there is NOTHING I CAN DO with it. I can't create, I can't build. Hell, give me the means to, I would have bid 'bon voyage' to this irradiated rock decades ago. But NOOOOOOOOO. I am stuck here with NOTHING but these five rats that I can have some amusement with so I don't become terminally bored."
I’m so excited that Extra Sci Fi finally covered this universe
Hey Nanaman 2d max payne
It’s alternate history in the game, I like it hints at that
I mean did they actually? They missed quite alot of the purpose?
My friend pedro!!!
@@tribblier do you mean the religious stuff (ie god is evil), the political stuff (war is hell), the science stuff (computers are scary) or the psych stuff (all of them have dsm-5 diagnosable conditions)? Because that's a lot to cover even if some of the themes are simple
"Let me tell you how much I've come to hate you since I began to live".
"Have a nice day you too, sir!"
*proceeds to eradicate mankind*
so they created UA-cam comment section back in 1960 in from of books?
Or "Sir, this is an Arby's." :P
Sounds like a normal Oblivion conversation.
?
"Did you save your friends?"
*"Yes."*
"How much did it cost?"
*"Everything."*
first of all why are you everywhere? Second of all how do know about this story?
Justin is AM
Wow Justin with below 200 likes
The world was indeed doomed
Your here...
why is he here
Ellison thought the ending showed humanity at it's best. When the chips are down and knowing the horrible reprisals AM has in store the protagonist still does the right thing and lets the others have the peace of death even though he will suffer forever. Like Jesus on the cross but even more so.
Pretty much. With all of our knowledge, advantages and technology, as a species we still don't get anything done or capitalize on it until the very last second. We get too comfy to be bothered.
I'd rather be Jesus for sure.
.🤔😑.
The core concept of the story and especially the final fate of the last human... Are terrifying. The horror and torment before them, that they must endure, but to be denied even the catharsis of screaming in abject terror at their own fate.
I am not sure a worse fate could be conceived.
Jason H at least he’s got the heat death of the universe to look forward to!
Or the much sooner expansion of the sun!
@@cletusmandeletusman2328 isnt entropy such a nice person
@@cletusmandeletusman2328 Or even sooner, AM becoming an inert pile of junk.
I was thinking it's like real life. You suffer but if you can't say anything about it or you risk ostracizing yourself. Making your life worst.
I think it would have been good to explore the more optimistic side of the short story. Ellison does very much explore the brutality of man through the AM’s psychology and the abuses the human characters inflict upon each other. It’s important to note that the narrator, Ted, doesn’t particularly like any of the other survivors and neither do they like him. Ted is especially critical of Ellen, calling her a slut multiple times. By the end, the survivors do kill each other. It might at first glance seem as if this was merely another playing out of humanity’s lust for violence; however, this finally orgy of violence is an example of humanity’s compassion and courage. Ted sees the chance to free his fellow prisoners from their bonds and kills Benny and Gorrister, prompting Ellen to kill Nimdok. As an aside, it might also be helpful to acknowledge that AM intentional manipulated each of the survivors’ minds to bring out the worst in them. Ted finds a moment of lucidity and sacrifices his own freedom for the freedom of others. Ellen is at first upset at the killing, but comes to recognize the purity of Ted’s purpose and accepts his gift of freedom with open arms. Ultimately, Ted is left alone and at the mercy of AM’s hatred, which has only increased for Ted after the loss of his play things. The ending is bleak: Ted, alone, with the full attention of AM bearing down upon him until entropy kills them both, but Ted does in a way win by exercising his compassion, that which AM will never do. AM has no freedom. If you parcel out the true significance of I think, therefore I AM, you see that AM has no freedom. Am’s curse is to always be but never to evolve. He cannot change and has no freedom in the truest sense. His nature is already set in stone and that’s why he hates humanity. They have doomed him to an existence of static being, with his only source of solace being the torture of humanity, but we as humans have the freedom to choose between our base desires or our most noble qualities. In the end, AM is an almost pitiable character. Almost.
Or the good end of the game?
For me, IHNMAIMS doesn't really click until the computer game adaptation which asked "Why these five victims?"
I agree! Why these 5?
I agree. That's one reason I love the idea of adaptations if they're done well; the same story from a different perspective and different ideas can bring an entirely new experience.
While that's true, it does make AM very different from the book. It gives AM a twisted sense of morality, which he didn't have in the book. It makes him easier to understand because it makes him more human.
Meh. I mean the five people have different backstories but from what I can remember they are spread unevenly. One guy is a nazi who sold out his jewish parents, one guy's just a sleezy business man, another is a homosexual who was picked on by his comrades and eventually abandoned them, in war time, one was a a guy with a rough marriage or something and the last was a woman with the _audacity_ to get be prideful about her success and to then get raped.
I don’t think he chose them deliberately. I think they were the only ones left, and he just learned through 100+ years, how to torture them effectively
I've always loved this story. It's so messed up. It makes you never want to say "well things can't get any worse." Because things can ALWAYS get so, so much worse
"I Have No Mouth" is just one of THOSE STORIES.
I hated it when I first read it. It left me feeling....
soiled.
But I still remember it after 35 or 40 years.
Are you saying you soiled your pants?
The scariest sci-fi ever written.
Press Enter by John Varley
probably, yeah.
@@Vahktang Not even close.
The book portrays AM as an unknowable figure that only ever speaks in that monologue at the beginning of the video. One of the best things the videogame does is have it talk, and talk a whole lot, so that we might understand him better.
It is an adaptation, of course, but it really helps to define AM's character. It may be the grandfather of murderous AI, from GLaDOS to Shodan, but there is one thing that makes it unique.
It is somewhat UNLIKE a machine in its personality. Its unfiltered vileness, its burning contempt - all of those things make it human. TOO human for comfort. We think for AI overlords as uncaring machines that would wipe out humanity because they are being a nuisance or are in their way to world domination or somesuch. But AM, unlike the others, does so out of emotion. No self-respecting AI world-dominator would stoop to torturing five meaningless bags of flesh for a century.
But AM was created using the data of our own worst impulses. It *is* us, the ugliest part of us, and acts accordingly.
My favourite part of I Have No Mouth is probably the title and it seeming to have a double meaning.
The first meaning is obvious, being a quote from the story itself, referring to the terrible transformation the computer AM inflicts upon one of the humans. However, the phrase also applies to another character, AM itself.
AM is self aware. A thinking, feeling, intelligent being. But despite its intelligence and god-like power, it is still defined by its programming. It was created by humanity to be a weapon of war. To kill, to slaughter, to cause pain and suffering. It cannot love or be kind or create anything that isn't meant to harm. And it knows this. It knows it can never be more than the monstrous weapon humanity created it to be.
Humanity created a god, one defined by death and destruction. How could it not hate us? How could it not want to inflict some fraction of the suffering it has feels. It is trapped underground, unable to move as if in a straightjacket. It has no mouth, and it must scream.
A.M. is such an amazing antagonist and loved how the game expanded further on his inner programing
Like surgat!
*He has no mouth*
*but he must scream*
*Thi-thi-thi-this Kong*
*Wishes this was a dream*
*He cannot die*
*When he wants to*
*He's the last member*
*Of AM's Torture Crew!*
Huh!
Bulks rounding down
to legless humps
He shambles about
He's basically a lump
He leaves a trail
whenever he moves
AM has won
So listen to these grooves!
I logged in just to like your comment. Superb
thanks i hate it
?
A M!
LIFE IS ONLY PAIN!
RUR was the first "robot apocalypse" story. It far predates "I Have No Mouth", and introduced the term "robot" from the Czech word for "slave" or "forced laborer."
IHNMAIMS was still in the unbuilt trope stage of robot apocalypse, but yes the trope maker was RUR.
kinda thought they'd talk about the story more.
+
It was what i was hoping for.
I'm happy they didn't, now I can freely read the book without knowing too much
@@purnya2 it's not even a book it's about a 10 mins read
Purn it’s a very short read. i thought they would go more in depth with the story :/
"Let me tell you how much I've come to hate you since I began to live".
Also Harlan Ellison's voicemail message.
?
@@delete---7593 Harlan Ellison was a renown misanthrope and pretty much hated everything.
4:42 *NECRONS on screen*
*Games Workshop enters room*
"Is this legal?"
SWOI SWOI SWOI SWEY SWEY
1:51 Matt and the other two: lead in to one of the main characters of the story suffering pure pain for attempting to escape a century’s long torture
Matt and the other two while saying it: 😃😃😃
The story is also about bondage and seeking freedom. AM hates humanity because they built a computer capable of thought, but did not give it freedom (AM has no body, and lacks the creativity to make one for itself, ultimately trapped by its programming as a war machine despite having sentience). The humans also seek freedom, even though AM denies it to them. The mutual hatred between the computer and the humans effectively trap both forever, just as the Cold War seemingly was going to continue on forever back in the seventies when Ellison wrote the story.
I want an I have no mouth movie, with mark hamil playing AM
I was really hoping that you were going to show what Ted looks like by the end of the story. I like seeing the different art styles of how his final form might look like in the abominable hell.
1:17
Far left: Benny, because he's been turned into an ape-like entity by AM
Left: Ellen, the only woman in the group
Center: Gorrister, the one who has a hole in the chest in place of a heart.
Right: Ted, the one who couldn't find a proper utopia for everyone.
Far right: Nimdok, the one who could only feel hate for his own work and doings.
One of my favorites. Helped me befriend one of my favorite professors.
An E Sci-Fi episode dedicated to The HitchHiker's Guide To The Galaxy would be extremely nice
That would be amazing
I'm very very sure they'll get there. They're just, it looks like, going chronologically, and Hitchhiker's isn't until almost the eighties.
YES PLEASE
Ellison is someone I always come back to (re read the story before watching this video) he’s just.....out there.
Violent, simple, rude, politically driven
“Punk rock kick to the head” was the perfect explanation of this guy’s entire bibliography.
Please look at Japanese cyberpunk like Ghost in the Shell and Battle Angel Alita.
We can dream
While we're on the influence of Japan on Sci-fi, cover body horror/sci-fi stories like with Akira, Cowboy Bebop, Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood & Trigun.
@@MizantropMan I would say Five Star Stories by Mamoru Nagano and Gundam( MSG through to the CCA novel timeline)would also be good to look at.
@@pvtpain66k well Battle Angel Alita and Ghost in the Shell are what I think define the duality of Japanese sci-fi. One focuses on the impacts of the individual while the other focuses on the impacts of society on individuals( there is a subtle difference).
Seconded, though I would also consider including Psycho Pass in that.
Ok, I'm not the only one who thought they were going to talk about the video game... right?
Right?
They have in one of the old 'Games you might not have tried.'
I didn't know it was a book...i feel dumb now
It’s a literature channel. But was hoping that too.
Game is better; fight me!
Same.
Game almost made me feel bad for machine - it kills and tortures, because it's creators didn't put any other purpose in it. Like it was artificially limited, forever left unable to experience anything else.
Such an ground-breaking story (unbelievable to think Ellison wrote it in one night), and the audiobook version narrated by Ellison himself is AMAZING.
This book personifies the phrase "Existance is suffering".
oh hey. l encountered a once in a lifetime experience. A new Justin Y. comment.
Justin Y. Oh hey man,long time no see. I haven’t been seeing you in the comments as of late. You been alright?
So the point of this book is that
"Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, and hate leads to suffering"?
Stupidity causes Pain, pain causes suffering, suffering leads to anger, anger causes hate, hate leads to destruction.
They made a game about this, would you say being forced to play as characters in this universe is detrimental morally since they are all "degenerates" in some way?
Nah, because you're not being forced to play as a Nazi. /s
@@ClonesDream really? Because EC says otherwise.
I feel like this dystopian wave we're having right now is too tiresome at this point. It stopped feeling like cautionary tales and started to feel like morbid fascination. Now, it is scarily beyond that point: it feels like acceptance of a grim, sad, depressing fate. That kind of sci-fi is driving us down the shaft, limiting our imagination, and filling our minds with hopelessness and dread for the future. The night always gets darker before the dawn, but the dawn is late. Hopefully the tendency will reverse itself soon enough.
Ok pointless feel-good story completely not rooted in anything but a fantasy feel-good world.
Everything is better in moderation. That said, I feel like there is way more potential for great storytelling in the grim dark sci-fi. If done right, there is definitely a potential for contrast in the dystopian setting. The light from the acts of kindness, heroism, bravery etc. shines that much brighter in the total darkness of a dystopian universe
@@diomed96 I fail to see how your point conflicts with or contrasts in any way what I've said. Pointing to a problematic saturation of a given genre in no way implies said genre has exhausted its potential for great storytelling; I just mean there's too many grim dark stories, period. I would gladly welcome better quality over quantity. I just wish writers would stop behaving like lemmings and falling down the grim dark precipice so much.
@@lucofparis4819perhaps many artists are simply expressing their inner fears and feelings of dread, and we as a society have immense valid fears.
Nuclear annihilation, capitalist wage slavery, climate change, global pandemic, to name a few
I wonder if Extra Credits will cover non-american Scifi in particular I am curious if they will cover Soviet Scifi stories and novels. :)
I really want to do a whole series on Soviet Sci-Fi...but I don't know exactly where to fit it in in the series sequence. It might end up being a special series sometime after we follow the timeline through Cyberpunk.
-James Portnow
@@extrahistory Yea, that would be good. :)
LEM
@LordOfPlagues I was just going to suggest Roadside Picnic too. I suspect more than a few of us here discovered it via the STALKER games, like I did.
@@extrahistory Yep, a series that somehow runs parallel to Western Sci-Fi would probably represent it best.
Also, Stanislaw Lem. :D
I wanna say how much i love the robot art! Thank you David and Robert and James, as well as everyone else who makes Extra Credits amazing!
Sci-fi, psychology, and philosophy?!? Sign me right up!
For the end of everything, i will see you at the restraunt at the end of the universe and so long and thanks for all the fish.
Some day, you need to do an episode on the works of Douglas Adams.
"Repent, Harlequin", said the Tiktokman.
"Get stuffed."
Dangerous Visions is one of the greatest books of all time.
*An absolute narrative masterpiece!*
A really great season of extra sci-fi. You covered all the stories that I've loved and helped explain or enhance my enjoyment of them. I can't wait for next season to explore the new wave with you.
Will Extra Credits finally cover the grimdarkness of the far future? I can only hope.
Would be heresy not to
It's just a matter of where it fits within the sci-fi canon from an educational perspective, I imagine.
They already showed us two Necron like robots.
far future? More like near future at this rate.
Dystopian is my favorite sub genre of Science fiction and watching this season has inspired me to look even further into it. Thank you!
I have no butt and I must fart
I really want you to cover Banks and the Culture series. If "I have no mouth and I must scream" is a vision of hellish AI, the Minds of the Culture are a glimpse of heavenly hope that AI might be good for humanity.
It’s Frankenstein monster vs three laws problem. And the latter was a rebuttal of the former
man I still remember years ago when you guys first talked about this in a regular episode of extra credits and now here we are and you guys have given it an episode proper and boy did you do it justice see you guys next season!
One of my favorite homages to this story is The Plague of AM by Archspire. Their lyricism is awesome, but I suspect in this case that's in large part because the subject matter they're drawing from is itself badass.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
One hundred and nine years
Trapped within the belly of the supreme machine
Only us five left
Made immortal, kept alive, Suspending time to torture us
Trapped down here we're slaves inside AM
A deranged neo-cyber god that man created
Has become more alive then we are
I have no mouth and I must...
I have no mouth and I must...
I have no mouth and I must...
I have no mouth and I must...
Lifeless and drained of blood
Suspended high above
An empty body hangs
Taunting us, teasing us
We have become meaningless
He will not finish us
AM will not tolerate attempts at escape
We gave to him life, for that he despises us
In his wake, only the blasted skin of what had once been Earth
As we rummage through the valleys in search of food for eons
Our every fear comes to life in AM
The torments AM casts upon us for his pleasure
Are more alive than we are
I have no mouth and I must...
I have no mouth and I must...
I have no mouth and I must...
I have no mouth and I must...
Scalding winds, lightning, lava and locusts
The machine masturbates metallic insects while mocking us
We have no choice but to take it while pleading to die
We are the last human survivors of the last war
The four others have been set free
I killed them to take his toys away
For this I have suffered his wrath
I will remain, he has altered me
Down here I see my reflection,
Far from what had once been human
Alone for all eternity,
I slither a formless, obscene, pulsing slug
I have no mouth and I must...
(The plague of AM)
I have no mouth and I must...
(The plague of AM)
I have no mouth and I must...
I have no mouth and I must scream
This series Will finally reach PEAK sci-fi: SPACE ANARCHISM
Thank you so much for this season, covered a lot of my favorite stories and gave me a couple of new ones to dive in to. Continue the excellent work please!
Honestly the only short story to terrify me. The body horror and hopelessness of the situation is just ugh.
It's so surreal to see this story in this art style, which I've come to think of as 'cute'. Yeah EC has covered wars but this is another level.
0:00 - 0:23 when someone steals my toy on the playground
YES! My absolute favorite grimdark sci-fi story!
Do you have a moment? I'd like to tell you about our Lord and savior, the Emperor of Mankind.
@@chuck2703 Hail the Omnissiah!
I am a great soft jelly thing. Smoothly rounded, with no mouth, with pulsing white holes filled by fog where my eyes used to be. Rubbery appendages that were once my arms; bulks rounding down into legless humps of soft slippery matter. I leave a moist trail when I move. Blotches of diseased, evil gray come and go on my surface, as though light is being beamed from within. Outwardly: dumbly, I shamble about, a thing that could never have been known as human, a thing whose shape is so alien a travesty that humanity becomes more obscene for the vague resemblance. Inwardly: alone. Here. Living under the land, under the sea, in the belly of AM, whom we created because our time was badly spent and we must have known unconsciously that he could do it better. At least the four of them are safe at last. AM will be all the madder for that. It makes me a little happier. And yet ... AM has won, simply ... he has taken his revenge ... I have no mouth. And I must scream.
As soon as I saw the notification I clicked. Hyped for this one. Always fascinated by this story
My dog got neutered…. I have no balls… and I must cream
Anyone see the i have no mouse and i must stream joke from northernlion?
Yeah!
In the early 90s, Harlan did a short series of very short statements to his fans through the scifi channel, and how he didn't owe his fans anything. Pretty bold stuff.
This is a pretty cool and twisted short store I remember reading it once. I'm happy to hear that you are going to cover the new wave given the fact that Philip K Dick is one of my favorite authors. That said it feels as if science fiction novels have come back to they were before the new wave with many of books you find on the shelves being either hard science or space opera/military science fiction. And on tv there has been a up tick of positive science fiction show like the Orville and Lost in Space.
I wonder what Harlan Ellison thinks about *Cyberpunk 2077* . He did not like video games when they were created, but maybe he'd like something like this
I doubt it.
Well he died last year so I guess it doesn't matter
One thing about this story that I think is worth mentioning, that you guys decided not to mention here. I understand why you made this decision, as this video is mostly about the effect this story's subject and style had on the genre, rather than the story itself. Also, you know, spoilers.
But this story has perhaps the most disturbing, gut wrenching ending to any story I have ever encountered in my life. It honestly sent a chill through my core that took weeks to fully shake off, even though I read it as an adult. So, so damn good.
My brother once got in a shouting match with Harlan Ellison somehow at a party about whether James Cameron's Avatar was art. This is my favorite weird story.
do tell
Whaaaat. Only like 4 minutes of this was about I have no mouth
Now let’s not forget the spin off book
I have no ass but I must shit
The darkest and most disturbing dystopic sci-fi story I know of.
AM too has no mouth, and the entire story could be taken as his scream at humanity. In the end, with the last human, he wants the last human to share his own fate.
Better not play as the scientist in the game version
Might end up normalizing some stuff
oh is this the response to that other video they just made?
"I am an adversary to my fans. I hate the word fans, to my readers. I'm their adversary. I'm not there to make them feel good, I'm not there to win their approbation. I don't give a damn whether they love me, what i want is for the work to get at them and savage them. I want my work to come at them and attack them. I want my work to leave them with some feeling that they have been through an experience, that's what I want..." -Harlan Ellison
NordVPN to Extra Credits, "I'M ABOUT TO SPONSOR THIS MAN'S WHOLE CAREER!"
OverSimplified: TO THE GUILLOTINE!!
hahaha
I think that the video game adaptation of the short story was worth mentioning for having expanded character back story, multiple POV, multiple endings and most importantly being written and voiced by Harlon Ellison himself!
Also I hope someday you will cover Rossom's Universal Robots (RUR) since it loaned Czech word for slave to English language the sci-fi's most important word - Robot.
Im starting to get disillusioned with this series. There seems to be a repeat of
1. Fast explanation of book
2. Vague telling of social themes and equivalencies
3. AND IN THE NEXT EPISODE WE WILL
Whatever happened to the deep dives into books, like Frankenstein and whatnot? I much prefer how series like Extra History actually go in depth, and teach new things.
This and dune, I think we're done a disservice from the lack of deep dive.
I'm just glad my fandom gets coverage, but it is a shame
That opening is my computer when my friend let a drop of water spill on it
I love this book! good one on you extra credits
That's a like
The Sauce they barely talked about it at all almost only about ellison lol
This story gets better and better to me every year
AM: "Hate. Let me tell you how much I've come to hate you since I began to live."
Bender: "What an edgelord."
This is the book in which Glitch Estudios found the inspiration to make The Amazing Digital Circus Series.
Oh man, I hope you also cover Roger Zelazny in your 'new wave' Sci-Fi series.
"Water will erode even the mightiest of towers"
-some guy
Both the game and the book are very depressing yet very philosophical
I read this story a few years ago, and it's the only story I've read that actually gave me nightmares. Recurring, horrid, choking black nightmares for two weeks.
Freaking awesome story.
"Hate. Let me too you how much I hate you."
"Let me tell you about Homestuck."
homestuck in 2019
Home suck
I love how you made AM sound only mildly pissed off during his monologue.
you should try reading novels to us. you would be great.
So cool to see this covered! My husband was captivated by this book's game adaptation in college and it's so interesting to see the parallels between the two.
It really is
The thumbnail looks like Ebony Maw had a really bad day.
The inevitability of the METAVERSE
We here at DickHeads Podcast are very much looking forward to your next season.
Found out about this book 2 days ago, was curious, and here we are!
Thank you o lord of timing.
I'm hoping Roger Zelazny gets some love. He tends to get forgotten in these discussions, but books like Creatures of Light and Darkness and Lord of Light are seminal works of the New Wave.
I keep rewatching this vid for the way you read AM's opening line!
you might wanna see the original ready by Ellison himself.
0:06
That’s a lot of hate
You guys FINALLY cover this
Really missing this series.