Sorry for slow content, had reactions to allergies to the point where my chin was swelling up lol... Anyway getting much better now. Hope you guys enjoyed this one!
Yeah, Frame Chasers is kind of a bell end, but he is right about the chip. I don't trust the guy, but I do keep an eye on him. Better than Linus gets, cause I can't stand him at all! Hope you're feeling better, Sir. o7
I’m glad you called out frame chasers. I can’t stand the guy. He’s an elitist and a jerk. He charges 500$ for just a consult for a tune for warzone. If you watch his live streams he’s toxic af. His discords even more toxic. Hes had tons of people complain about him and he just blocks them. He’s quite rude to people who question anything he says, he says he doesn’t watch any other content creators stuff and doesn’t listen to anyone’s testing. He thinks He is a god and thinks All his oc nunbers are the best. He won’t tell anyone his voltage and tries to claim everyone’s after his secrets and they’re stealing his secrets. He’s got some big conspiracy theory that everyone’s out to steal his lucky charms.
@@kaisersolo76 Yeah, it's lie using WCCFTech or Wikipedia as a source! LOL! That said, I still keep an eye one him. He at least has a point once in a while, unlike Linus!
Had the same reaction about 15 days ago when the weather was nice and went on to a small forest (closely urban) and sat on a bench for about an hour.. someone told me that these was to some dust that is produced through pines or caterpillars (those that form large chains and get up on logs of trees) Anyway.. the one thing is to never touch th9se reg8ons on the skin though it rushes you to itch, and apply some soothing cream..and wash it only with mild soap and not rub at all. hope yoy recover fast
I'm mega power user I need 7950X3D, I even created my own custom SLI profiles for games that didn't support SLI back in the day and I got SLI working for unsupported game. 7950X3D is tweaker's dream CPU! You can tinker and tune so much it's just a treat. I'm not some console player that wants to start PC and game. I want to tinker, set things, tune, more tuning.
Which to be sure is a MINORITY of PC gamers. MOST PC gamers are buying prebuilts and expect them to be 100% plug n play. Id wager that the vast majority of PC gamers have never even seen a BIOS screen.
@CaptCapitalist hell, pretty much any 6+ core processor will run most games fine... I did a 8 core fx 8120 and it handles most titles with a fatboy 590
Anyone in the business could see this coming from a mile away. There's a very good reason that the 7800X3D is so heavily delayed, they tried to sell as many 79**X3Ds as possible before people caught on. I'm sure the 7800X3D will be a great CPU for mainly gaming, but this business practice is so anti-consumer it reeks.
true, considering the amount of time you have to wait, if people value their time, they just buy any CPU and gaming several months already instead of waiting.
@@ZackSNetwork didums, you are so impatient you cant even wait a month. Lol. This is why gamers always get shafted. It's not cos the companies are greedy, it's because the gamers are greedy. They want it all now like a child. Pathetic. Daddy I want it nooooooowwwwwww. Reeeeeeeeeeee
The unfortunate fact is that the average PC users skill levels are progressively getting lower as time progresses. This is inline with the dumbing down of society in general. Which is great news for the marketing people who exploit this truism. As people slowly lose the ability to think for themselves the markets will happily exploit them. The 7950x3d is a clever piece of technology . but not a pure gaming chip.
Thought I would throw a few dollars your way bro. Thanks for being a reasonable dude and keeping your channel positive man. There's enough negativity online, you're a pro at being professional and decent about everything you cover. Very solid example of being an adult online, we need more of that out here for sure bro. Keep it up man! Much love from the States (Seattle area).
This is the best take on this “situation” out of all the channels. It takes into account both sides and boils it down well. Thank you for doing that, especially that trash DDR5 is better and gear mess the other channels were incorrectly configuring. Keep it up.
If your main focus is to primarily play games, than for sure you should wait for the 7800XD3. And even if you want to get the 7950X3D you should wait until the 7800X3D comes out because they will soon start to heavily reduce the price of the 7950X3D because its sales will get even worse once the 7800X3D comes out.
There is no point getting a 7950x3d. The 7950x is $200 (!) cheaper here, for a loss of 6% in games. Then its like 600 fps or 550fps.. which no one will notice anyway.
the point in buying a 7950X3D is the multicore performance, duh if you want BOTH top tier multicore AND gaming no other processor does BOTH Intel is inefficient in multicore, 7950X is shit in gaming, 7800X3D is shit in multicore
The 3900X 5900X, and finally 7900x are 6 core CCD's. No surprise it has ALWAYS been that way! If you bought one thinking it was not than that is the consumers fault for spending money and not understanding what it is they are buying!
7950X3D = 8 core CCD0(X3D) & 8 core CCD1(non X3D) 7900X3D = 8 core CCD0(X3D) & 4 core CCD1(non X3D) 7800X3D = 8 core CCD0(X3D) 7950X3D = 8MB cache per core. 7900X3D = 10MB cache per core. 7800X3D = 12MB cache per core. UA-camrs who have disabled CCD1 from 7950X3D doesn't have accurate 7800X3D benchmarks. For example: 7950X3D CCD0 (50W) - CCD1(50W) - iGPU (20W) = 120W total. If they disable CCD1 (non X3D) it will only run 70W (CCD0 at 50W) and iGPU(20W). CCD0 won't get anymore then 50W that voltage/power is limited/locked it's for all CCD's. 7800X3D will have additional 50W more power available and this with 12MB cache per core. Will increase even more fps and higher jump in gaming performance then 7900X3D which has 2MB more cache. But can't deliver that additional power to CCD0 as it's lock due to dual CCD's limit which is 50W, except the 7800X3D. This is why it doesn't need higher clocks it has more cache per core and double the power draw of dual CCD on a single CCD. My analysis and expectation of 7800X3D is going to aim for gaming performance better then 13900KS that's right KS! 7900X3D/7950X3D will get updates overtime and get slowly better performance but the 7800X3D will BLAST OUT 7950X3D/KS.
They'll all perform similarly. Nothing special about X3D this time at all. Incredibly disappointing launch and results. Not even 4K numbers change where as 5800X3D did over 5800X. These CPU were just made for competition with Intel or to beat them ever so slightly.
Maybe we need to redefine what is a pc enthusiasts…. One moment it’s someone who is coming up with custom memory timings and fan curves and overclocking the cpu and gpu. And another moment it’s to hard to follow directions to assign cores. It’s always something in this hobby. Either way have as much fun as you can ❤
Bro if u r into tuning n ocing u wud get 13900k anyway . U tune once n u r good. U dont have to do it for every application like this cpu n 13900k tuned beats this in gaming n productivity. That’s y it’s called a scam. If u jus want gaming 7800x3d wud be easily better
@@snotspat I can translate the 13900ks is better if you wanna be in a bios screen overclocking. Mostly due to better 1% lows. Your getting scammed because of amd misleading a lot of customers some people thinking the 7950x3d boost higher than the 7800x3d in gaming or that both ccds were v cache and my favorite that the scheduling just works automatically which for many programs people are talking about lassoing their cpu.
The point of the 7950x3d is to be “as good” as a 7800x3d in gaming AND “as good” as a 7950x in multi core workloads. It’s meant to be best of both worlds, I’ve got a 7950x3d for gaming but I also like to work in blender and do 3d modelling for 3d print sculpts. If I got the 7800x3d it would struggle with my blender workload,
I thought this too but it’s hard to say if there will be a difference. AMD is advertising that the 7800X3D will boost up to 5GHz which is what I am seeing on the V-Cache CCD on my 7950X3D. The non-V-Cache CCD will boost higher but I never catch any core boosting all the way to the advertised 5.7GHz. Basically, we won’t know if these 7800X3D simulations are accurate until we reviews are out. I just hope that these simulations aren’t going to end up being misleading.
@@kBitre the cache resides on each core complex die. So by disabling the second ccd completely you lose all access to that l2+l3 cache. Its not using a central pool of cache that both ccds draw from they are separate. Thus disabling the ccd will make it have equal cache to the 7800x3d
@@Jsteeeez - Thus disabling the ccd will make it have equal cache to the 7800x3d...slightly incorrect. The 7950X3D has 16 MB l2 cache, while the 7800X3D only has 8 MB. The 7950X3D also has more L3 cache, 128 MB compared to 96 MB on the 7800X3D.. Combine these with the higher boost clock speeds of the 7950X3D, I think we can safely say that the 7800X3D is not going to perform as well. How much of a difference there is, remains to be seen.
My opinion is a 8c 16t cpu is low end. There is one in the series s for 250$. Also I've owned both 7800x3d and 7950x3d and I can tell you first hand the 7950x3d is 100% a better cpu. Out side of gaming it's 100%+ better. That includes running windows.
Is the 7950x3d a scam.. no It's a compromise between gaming and productivity in one cpu. 16 cores 8 of them are 3d v cache The 7800x3d will be the best gaming deal and likely better performance and efficiency than disabling half the cores in the 7950x3d. If you are streaming and gaming and running other stuff the 7950x3d may be better.
Brian seems a bit confused about what his message is in this video. That early adopters of the hybrid CPU that is the 7950X3D have to do a bit of extra work to get them to run properly has nothing to do with the question as to whether they're a scam or not. They're not. Frame Chasers clearly doesn't understand how core parking works and he's flat out wrong when he says that only one chiplet works when you're gaming. Gordon's not the only one to have proven him wrong, Level1Tech did a really good explanation not only of how it works but why the approach AMD and Microsoft have taken is the only sensible option.
Me I would not want to use it running something else when playing a game. I am in 2 minds as the game I wanted this CPU for Star Citizen uses all cores . some people that have test it in game show that when the CPU is heavy under load as in the Cities all or most cores are used but when flying out of the plants Atmo and into space the 8 cores with V-cache are the only ones running . so the game / Xbox bar thing works. it runs 8 cores in game and then if needed boost with the other cores. I take it in most games Shooters and like the 7800x3d will be the better choice and some say the same with the space sim too. Im not 100% sure they have the dual ccd working fully and the 1 ccd with v-cache just shows it up more
In what way, the listed 7950x3d higher clock boost is only on the second CCD that doesn't have the extra 64 MB of cache (disabling it turns the 7950x3D into a 78000x3d) Installing the AMD chipset driver and making sure Xbox game bar is enabled it core parks the second CCD on the 7900x3d/50 (as long as Xbox game bar detects the running game)
Scam argument is stupid AF . Not all games will utilise all cores , maybe 4 at most. 7950X is a productivity CPU or for games which can 100% utilize that CPU
For now just need to wait for WIndows OS and Well AMD drivers to sort out just what CCD is to be used when gaming Till Windows catches up to the Chip design providing they dont totally Knee cap it that is, Benchmarks will be all over the place
I am sure that, If there was no 7950X in the first place and AMD launched 7950X3D alone, no one would ever have had a complaint about 7950X3D ! It is power efficient and cool and gives a very high frame rate with high end GPU and great productivity results too. And Disabling and enabling CCDs as needed is not a big task in AMD systems. 🤔 it is definitely the current fastest gaming CPU and is not a scam. But waiting for a 7800X3D is a good thing for more budget oriented gamers.
It’s a gimmick. 13900k does both but better. If u have to rely on applications n windows to work properly then y not jus tune 13900k one time n u r done. Does better in games n productivity
@@anuzahyder7185 13900k does not do both better at all. It takes more than x2 the power to still lose in fps and win by a few % in productivity. I can’t understand why people don’t understand the 7950x3d. It’s for the person who wants the best gaming while also wanting amazing productivity. Calling it a scam or gimmick is simple minded. People need to read more or watch someone like Level1Techs who actually understands this.
@@cszthompson i cant say its a scam but comparing the price with the performance u feel like its a scam. about 150$ more for just about 2% fps on games that's what called a scam. The only positive side is power consumption is about half in 7950x3d.
One thing to keep in mind is the PPT limit of the cpu if you're heavily taxing the non vcache portion of the cpu, your vcached core clocks are likely going to suffer to stay within that limit.
Brian, I don't know if the footage in the video is direct from benchmark captures but when setting the core affinity to Corona Benchmark, I think you set it to 13 cores (19 to 31) instead of 12. I have no idea if it makes an appreciable difference in the results you were trying to obtain but I figured I should point that out. Great content, as always. Cheers!
I don’t know if I’d call it a scam but like you said janky sounds more like it. In my opinion Gordon actually proved more so that it’s a “scam” when he tried to say it wasn’t. When he ran Cinebench on 4 threads while gaming it ran on the 3D CCD. Shouldn’t it have assigned that to the non 3D CCD, for better Cinebench score with the faster CCD and only had game on the 3D CCD for best gaming performance.
Thanks for your take on this. I was stoked about the CPU until the details came out. I'm happy with my 5900x but I was able to snag an RTX 4090 and I am going to want to upgrade my cpu again in a few years. I hope there are some ways newer processors will be able to report certain things to the operating system about their topology and how to handle thread scheduling more transparently though today that isn't the case. Applications will also need to catch up so it's like the chicken and the egg. We know the chiplets and "tiles" are coming for specific tasks and acceleration but today you can have a very powerful CPU and an OS that isn't really able to fully leverage it because of lack of awareness which isn't ideal.
I too have a 5900x and 4090. Assuming you play at 4K like me, there really isn't a CPU worth upgrading for at the moment, these 3D chips included. That will change with the 5090 and next generation CPUs however.
7950X3D is for someone who is both a gamer and a content creator/productivity power user. If gaming is your main and only use case, as Bryan says, wait for 7800x3d or grab discounted cpus like 7700X/7600X/5800X3D/13600K.
7600x no cause 13600k is better option. 7700x idk, id still say just get 13600k... but yeah 7800x3d will be the best gaming money can buy. 13600k is the best price to performance gaming cpu.
@@anuzahyder7185 Eeah exactly. If just gaming get 7800X3D or if on budget get 13600K... If you want to do both game and high thread count workloads, get 13900K. 7950X3D is pointless due to how poorly AMD executed it.
@@teemuvesala9575 Nah it's not quite as simple as that anymore in this weird transitioning phase where the customer is spoiled with choices. If you're on budget, you're not even going to have the budget for a 13600K build. You should be looking at a 5600 or a 13500 instead. 13600k is good on the charts, but in practicality unless you plan to use it for some content creation / video encoding or VM virtualisation. You're often better served just getting a 5800X3D (similar price region) especially if you're only gaming. For those who are lucky enough to be near a microcenter, an AM5 build is outright better value because bundles. Intel sucks in platform longevity and 13th gen is EOL. In a few years time that forward-planning will pay off.
I don't think this is a true simulation a 7800X3D. Point to make is that the boost clock for 7800X3D is less than the boost clock for the 7950X3D on the 3D v-cache CCD. In addition, the 7800X3D has 96MB of L3 cache and 7950X3D has 128MB. Also, L2 cache sizes are different. The only way to tell how they compare is to have a real 7800X3D to test.
When you togle off the other cpu ship, you only use 96mb of cache… So this is quite accurate. In 7950x3d the v-cache ship is slow aka as slow as 7800x3d is suposed to be. And the non v-cache chip is the fast one. So simulation should be quite accurate. What we don´t know is how they bin the v-cache chips to 7950x3d vs 7800x3d. If they use better chips in 7950x3d it may be that the simulated results are better than what 7800x3d will deliver. We have to wait one month to see that.
In no way is the 7950X3D a scam. It offers very good gaming performance and can also handle content creation quite well. It's a jack of all trades and quite honestly the sort of CPU I like. I don't like single purpose driven designs because I'm not "just" a gamer or content creator or etc.
Heh! 7950x3d is ultimate gaming / productivity combo if you need both. 7800x3d is the ultimate I just play games CPU. AMD did test with two v-cache chips… The CPU was not faster in gaming, it was more expensive and much worse at productivity. So… No good. This is excelent compromise if you want both. And if you only need productivity. 7900 or 7950 are best option, if only gaming wait 7800x3d. I think that AMD portfolio is starting to look good.
We should just wait until the real 7800x3d comes out and test then, because there will be a difference in the Vd cache so performance will differ. Great vid as alway's Bryan :D
That's what companies do. They go after that crowd first. it's for the .1 of 1%. Just like any other product in the PC market. When it comes to Nvidia's 2080Ti. Then to the 3090Ti. Lastly to the 4090. It's all for the enthusiast class. Where they use blender, AutoCad, etc. Where they make money when they use it.
I completly get what you are saying and for the most part I agree with you but splitting the CPU into just 8 gaming cores and 8 "work" cores is not what they did here. Yes 8 cores are meant for gaming and only gaming, but the other 8 cores are meant to work with the gaming core to provide you with the 16 cores when "working" If you only used the extra 8 you would get less proformance for "working" this chip is meant for someone who wants the best of both worlds. Perfect gaming and the ability to have 16 cores for a work load. It should have been labeled better as such instead of just the worlds best gaming but the 7800x3d will not be able to preform "work" tasks as well as the 7950x3d.
Interesting analysis. Thanks for your hard work. Personally, I think this CPU is basically a slightly nerfed 16 core 7950x and a slightly nerfed 7800X3D. AMD promised a best of both worlds, but what we get is a slightly nerfed best of both worlds. I think I'll stick to the 7800X3D if possible, but for people that can harness the power of a 16core chip, I guess it's a great compromise. I don't think AMD is out to milk people for their money, if I were AMD I wouldn't launch th e7800X3D first either because if I launch it first and send the cpus by air, then I would end up increasing the base price of the cpu to cover the shipping expenses. It makes a load more sense to send the highest margin parts via AIR and launch them first to target the niche market. If you're getting a 7950X3D, you'd better be making money with it.
This processor is for a professional who also wants top gaming performance and efficiency. The type of person who won’t mind setting core affinity in apps. Pure gamers should get 7800x3d when it comes out
Like I have been saying since the 7900X3D and 7950X3D announcements, it all comes down to how the scheduling works and AMD has an abysmal track record with making on-paper capabilities work at the software level. It looks like the 7800X3D will beat the 7950X3D in gaming, even though on paper the 7950X3D should be able to offload all other processes to the non-3D CCU and free up processing power to the 3D CCU to focus 100% on the game. Intel's 13th generation processors flat out scale better as you go up in price and SKU, AMD's predictably do not and are a mixed bag because the marketing for their tech doesn't marry to the reality of their tech in action. Tale as old as time here. Compare use cases of a 13700k vs a 7800X3D and a 13900k vs a 7950X3D in the following scenario: you are using Discord, afterburner, a browser with several tabs open and a full screen youtube video on a second monitor, OBS streaming or recording, and Spotify (very very typical application load for a modern desktop with multiple monitors). How many frames are you getting in a game and how much are background processes affecting 1% lows (stutter/lowest frame moments)? I'd wager my savings account that the Intel chips perform better and schedule correctly to their E-cores while the 7950X3D does not.
@@ArbitraryFilmings the 3d cache ccd on the 7950x3d and 7800x4d will be damn near the exact same around ~5ghz. The only difference is the non 3d ccd clocks to 5.7ghz and you wont be playing your games on that ccd anyway 99% of time.
If AMD is a scam Intel is a mega-scam given their E-Cores can't even move games properly and all and all consume way more power compare to AMD counterparts. Next gen might bring cache into all cores as a selling point to solve all related issues into CPU affinity not working properly on some titles. The extra core not having 3D cache was something they should add on the specs but given the way CPU specs work they didn't have to be so precise around their architecture arrange on L3 cache as long as the amount of memory they mention was already present. Note: Adding a 5800x3D and Intel 13700K for comparison should be a must on this benchmarks as you might spot failure on performance when you have some good reference of normal performance.
Has anyone run Windows 7 Ultimate on this yet? I want to know how Windows 7 is suppose to deal with 8 cores suddenly disappearing, or in the case of the 13K, how to load balance across unequal performance and efficiency cores. It's like CPU manufacturers suddenly went sh1tst0rmstvp1d...
Its not unrealistic. Either in BIOS or using Process Lasso to force games to play on only the X3D cores will get gaming performance from the 7950X3D that nearly matches the 7800X3D. Using Process Lasso does not require you to park the cores and they will automatically be used for productivity tasks. Also, just today they dropped the price on the 7900X3D to LESS than that of thge 7800X3D.
Well, if games is the only reason why you get 7950X3d, sure its a "scam" for gaming, but if you plan on running multiple VMs, an extensive Plex server, and playing games all at the same time then no.
Any product that doesn't work well out of the box end-up on the discount department. Monitor with bad calibration or a mouse/M.2 that required a firmware update to work properly also fall into this category. AMD did create a small failure trusting software to handle access to the 3D memory so yep we might see it drop in price if people complain about it in a loud way.
Jesus, I had no idea how complicated this new 7950X3D CPU was. I just bought a brand new AM5 board and 32GB DDR5 6000 and I was thinking about grabbing a 7950X3D for future proofing, but seeing how complicated it is to get this CPU to work right, I'm definitely thinking about just getting a 7800X3D instead for the simplicity and $250 cost savings. I honestly have no need for multi-tasking and productivity like video editing. Boy oh boy, just looking at the quick glance you took scrolling down the walk-through on your b-roll here already turned me off about the 7950X3D. It's just too much.
get 7800x3d. if you're heavy multitasker, 7950x is also better value than 7950x3d. turns out the ultimate cpu for mixed gaming and productivity is 13900k, if you can live with its power consumption.
@@teemuvesala9575 You're right, the 7800X3D is definitely my best bet. I did not go with Intel because of the high thermals and power consumption. Problem is having to wait a whole month to get the 7800X3D and that's a big IF with all sorts of bots and resellers grabbing all CPUs for profit. 2023 sucks.
@@agoogleuser2369 I doubt that will happen now, because economy is doing badly and people are not spending as much as they used to. Scalpers would be taking big gamble in unfavorable times. Just high prices in general suck this year due to inflation and some of these companies just outright milking the consumers. I personally upgraded from 10900K to 13600K (more of a vanity upgrade I know), but just wanted to build new system for reasonable price to make full use of my 2x2TB PCIE gen 4 980 Pros + was able to use my old DDR4 4400MHz Samsung b-die kit with new platform. I think I scored silicon lottery win this time, since I'm able to run 4x8GB Viper Steel at 4200MHz CL16 in 2 dimm per channel config. With 10900K anything over 3600MHz would not just work.
easy win for the 7950X . No point paying $200 for maybe 6% of improvement real world gaming . Like, do you really need 50+ fps when you are already about 300fps? lmao
@@claudep.1926 That's exactly what I ended up doing. I'm doing some testing with the 7950X as we speak. 0.1% lows on the X3D chips are actually worse on average compared to the non X3D CPUs, which means more stutters while gaming. I do not like heterogeneous CPU setups. It complicates things too much. If the 7950X3D had identical CCDs I would be all over that CPU. I'll just wait to get a 7800X3D when it comes out next month. I don't really need 16 cores.
Well based on the specs 7950X3D is 8+8 cores with 128MB L3 Cache divided by 8MB per core. 7900X3D is 6+6 cores with 128MB L3 Cache divided by 10.67MB per core. 7800X3D is 8+0 cores with 96MB L3 divided by 12MB per core. Looking forward to see if a 7850X3D with hypothetical 8+4 cores with 96MB L3 Cache divided by 8MB per core.
Dude, ANYONE buying a 7950x3d knows what they want, I think they know how to use a BIOS or AT THE LEAST AMDs program that runs IN THE OS. Yes, if ALL you do is game then the 7800x3d is cheaper but in no way is "people dont know how/want to configure a $700 cpu" a good reason not to buy it if you want future proofing/a high workload PC
The 7950x3D is better now but again, you should think 7950x3D is a CPU use for streaming where you can get both good FPS in gaming and solid production workflow ability, best of both word in a single package. If you argue that it is worst than 7950X in production and worst than 7800X3D in gaming then you are wrong since you will build a 1 PC for 2 task, not 2 PC for 2 task. That is what matter, if you only play games but you buy this then it is not gonna give you what you want, buy the 7800X3D, but if you are power user that use your PC more than just an entertainment machine then 7950X3D will be the best investment you can have.
I already know everything well about AMD but people don't like program configurations because AMD is rubbish that nothing can be done by AUTO programs of X3D processor so AMD put AUTOPROGRAMS without configuration!! You understand that I am not interested in configuration, it means AMD will not be able to do AUTOPROGRAMS and Intel is AUTO-ALL normal programs without getting tired!
I though Games like BF 2042 will be better on the 7950x3D.. because this game support 10 cores.. :-/ And now everyone says dont buy the 7950x3D if u only play games... and yes.. i rly just play games.. i never work with my pc. My RTX 4090 cant run well.. because i still sit on my shitti 8700k...
I disagree a bit here. 1. MOST people buying a high end CPU or building a new PC have common knowledge of what things need to be done. This includes updating Bios, updating Windows, updating drivers, etc. 2. UA-camrs are the ones creating all these conflicting statements which I really don’t have a clue why. The 7950X3D works as intended. I have had no issues. All this bullshit about turning off CCD to get games to work is utter bullshit. I’ve ran over 10+ top AAA games and all of them are work perfectly with Vcache and I haven’t had to turn off CCD or any of this manual crap that everybody is talking about. 3. If you really want to to get rid of any doubts, all you have to do is set prefer “cache” in bios settings. That’s it. Not need to disable cores or CCD. 4. All this crap about 7800X3D simulation showing it to be better than the 7950X3D in “Performance” is another utter crap. AMD has just recently released some benchmarks and it shows the 7800X3D to be either identical to 7950X3D or in some games a bit slower than the 7950X3D. YES, it is better than the 7950X3D in “VALUE”. Do not confuse this with having better “PERFORMANCE”. 4. Most people that game on PC probably do run other applications when running games, this is why it’s a good idea to have a 7950X3D as running other apps while gaming turns on the extra cores(non vcache) without impacting game performance. 5. All I did was throw in the new 7950X3D, update Bios, Update Windows, Update drivers and that’s it. Ready to rock. Every game working with vcache with massive performance gains. I’ve never seen so much drama and over complicating on something so simple.
I am tired of this nonsens , is the 7950 X3D really meant to be a Gamer ( only ) CPU ? , no , not really , its a 16Core CPU which is slightly slower in Apps than a 7950x but partly much faster in Games . The Gamer CPU for AM5 is the 7800X3D , as the 5800X3D was one for AM4 . Period . Is it a Scam from AMD to launch X3D parts on higher Core count CPUs as well ? No , of course not , there were enough People which criticized AMD for only lauch an single 8 Core V-Cache CPU on AM4.
I agree that it is better to wait for 7800X3D. Imagine an average buyer gets 7900X3D and later finds out that 7800X3D is faster and is cheaper. Of course they would assume 7900X3D is a scam. Imagine buying i9 and in gaming it is slower than i7, you would assume i9 is a scam. No need to complicate stuff AMD. Either give consumers 2CCDs with 3D V-cache or just release 7800X3D. Many gamers are going to be mad at AMD.
7900x3d is the best choice if you want to build a new PC now. 7950x3d is out of stock every where, 7800x3d will be out of stock in 5 minutes after launch. AM5 will supoort a few more generations of AMD., so you still can upgrade the cpu im the future. 7850x3d snd 7900x3d give almost identical performance and both are faster than 13900k.
No, of course it isn't a scam; that's just stupid. However it's not smart to buy it if you mainly are just going to play games on it. Much better to wait for the 7800X3D if you only game. But the REAL 7800X3D might end up being a little slower, since the 12 & 16 core Ryzens natively have double the L3 cache of the 6 & 8 core models before the 64 megs of 3D cache is slapped on top. But it won't be a big enough difference to be worth the huge increase in price...
It depends on the use case. Games vary enormously in their behaviour, some are limited a great deal by a single physics/engine thread. Thus, a newer arch may help a lot, even if many more cores wouldn't matter as much. This though is why SKUs such as the 5500X3D, 5600X3D, 7500X3D and 7600X3D didn't and won't exist, because they would too much negate the relevance of higher margin parts. AMD learned this from the 3300X. Aswell as varying game engine behaviour, there's also the goals of the player. I'm fine with 1080p/60Hz atm (on a 48" TV, driven by a 1080 Ti and 5600X), but there are those playing esports & suchlike who want vastly higher frame rates, in which case a newer arch will help. Problem is, they don't bother separating IPC/clock/arch from core count, nor it seems do they much care. Or there are those using 1440p or more importantly 4K, for whom GPU speed is far more relevant. So you're right that those two CPUs can serve most gamers, but the loudest voices tend to come more from those for whom they can't, hence the dominant narratives become distorted. The absolute frame rates being talked about these days are absurdly high, better than the equivalent visual acuity of a bird, yet nobody bothers separating hw performance from simple practice with a game. We hear about Fortnite, CSGO, MW2, Apex, PUBG and others all the time, because they're so high up on Steam, likewise games like CB2077 are benched all the time in tech reviews, yet there are other games and entire other genres which have very different hw needs, are also very popular, but receive virtually no attention at all, especially sim games like ETS2 (more popular than BF5, Rocket League and Skyrim atm), or older games like GTA V which are still very popular (twice as many players as Hogwarts), or survival genre games like Sons of the Forest and Rust (again very popular, higher in the charts than many games typically used in bench reviews). Tech reviews have become too focused on specific types of gaming, mainly esports, competitive fps and certain first-person games like CB2077. It's distorted where the pressure is going in terms of what people think matters for suitable PC hw for playing games. It all depends on the game. 60Hz is fine for sim games (locked rate and consistency is far more important than absolute fps), for which my current hw config maxes out ETS2. On Steam, Sons of Forest has far more players atm than RDR2, yet only the latter appears in typical GPU reviews. SOTF doesn't need much to run well, but it does show the bias in what is covered in the tech space; it's more popular atm than R6S or CIV6. I mean heck, on Steam atm, W3WH is less popular than Farming Simulator 22. :D
When the 5800x3d came out everyone was crying for a 5950x3d. Now that amd gave them options all they do is cry. The 7950x3d is for the person that does 80/20% production/gaming & 7800x3d is just the opposite. That's why there's benchmarks. You don't want it don't buy it
Saying that the 7950X isn't "technically" a scam is a real cop-out. Complaining about AMD's use of Game Bar is strange since I never heard you complaining that Intel uses is too with the Thread Director. Why isn't the Thread Director janky? Why isn't the 13900K a scam? Claiming 24 cores but you only really get 8 gaming cores, that sounds pretty cheesy too?
1:32 you said it, it is unrealistic. At high resolution performance is GPU bound, at lower resolution the frame rates are insanely high to really matter to the average user. Most experts have a tough time agreeing on an exact number, but the conclusion is that most humans can see at a rate of 30 to 60 frames per second . We are comparing CPU performance based on unrealistic use cases. I am at the other end of the spectrum, I am a causal gamer I use UWQHD + (3840 x 1600 @ 60 Hz) I am happy with a Ryzen 7900 @60W TDP. When I have more performance than I really need then power consumption and heat becomes the decisive factor.
I don't see how this is any different than Intel and the big/little cores of Alder Lake. Is Intel a scammer then for coming out with the i9 CPUs when the i5 performs nearly the same in games (or better in some)? No. It's use case and target audience. The 7950X3D is marketed towards heavy users, not budget smooth brains. And it most certainly is up to devs to incorporate performance optimization for the CPU. There wasn't this bullshit going on at the Alder Lake launch (calling Intel a scammer) when certain games and applications were having issues. It was a discussion about how devs need to start optimizing for the "new" architecture. Software development needs to get out of the world of uniform CPUs and focus on newer technologies.
Another point of view, if the person can't be bothered to invest 5 minutes in setting up the PC by following simple instructions for this CPU then he probably is not a good candidate to assemble a PC and he should buy from an OEM. If he buy from somebody like Tech YES City then it is up to Tech YES City to set it up for that person and provide an install-medium (USB-stick) for a clean install with this setup (a simple script will do it) in the future if desired.
It's not a scam. It's pretty much a 7950X with better gaming performance and WAY better efficiency. If you like to game but also use your work for productivty it's amazing. It has its place on the market. If you just want to game then sure, get the 7800X3D.
Once again you ignore the fact that you don't need to wait for developer support, that's why there is that integration with xbox game bar to give you easy way to just mark anything as game to be sure it will be put on right cores. Is that a best solution possible? Probably not. But it's there and now I really start to wander why you ignore its existence? You are right in one thing, most people doesn't need 7950x3d for gaming. Nobody need that CPU just for gaming. But it was never made or marketed to be "just a gaming CPU".
AM5 3D CPUs with 2CCDs should have a built in hardware scheduler to properly assign tasks to cores, just like Intel did with their P and E cores. Not designing it and just selling these CPUs to general public is a kind of scam, imho.
Gordon Really surprised me with how he was misleading people and riding the typical conspiracy youtube thumbnail millennials. Wendell from Level1Techs seemed to be the only educated and honest about what AMD is doing with the architecture of the 3D-V Cache chips. Hence why Gordon had him on to try to clean up what he was insinuating.
This is an apple to apple and orange comparison. The 7950x3d is made for work and play. If I'm doing heavy data compression the 7950x3d is going to complete my workload faster giving me more game time.
im building with r7600x,who need more than 300-500fps?its competition? i can bet next gen 8600x gonna be stronger in games than that 7800x3d,sell old one buy new one,this is best choise,and im gonna keep 7600x until last am5 gen.
Is it a 16 core CPU - if yes, then it is never going to be a scam. It might be bad value, perhaps even shockingly bad value, but it will not be a scam. Please use a dictionary when putting together your click-baity BS title lines. Love your videos otherwise, please avoid the click bait.
I think maybe you should watch the Gamer's Nexus review of the chip. The results of your tests don't make any sense, which should tell you that there is something wrong with your methodology. Did you make sure to use the latest chipset drivers? That may very well explain the results that you and your fellow UA-camr were seeing.
Wholly crap everyone caaaaaalm down. This is just a scheduler issue in Windows. The processor just came out and once Microsoft tunes the scheduler so that you dont need to hack it, itll be perfectly fine. It's just like E cores and P cores and Windows had to fix the scheduler for that processor to. Did everyone forget that?
Intel having DECADES of software and optimizations. They surely have advantage there. But what amd is doing is not wrong or scam. This is what needs to take the most out of it.
Sorry for slow content, had reactions to allergies to the point where my chin was swelling up lol... Anyway getting much better now. Hope you guys enjoyed this one!
Yeah, Frame Chasers is kind of a bell end, but he is right about the chip. I don't trust the guy, but I do keep an eye on him. Better than Linus gets, cause I can't stand him at all!
Hope you're feeling better, Sir. o7
I’m glad you called out frame chasers. I can’t stand the guy. He’s an elitist and a jerk. He charges 500$ for just a consult for a tune for warzone. If you watch his live streams he’s toxic af. His discords even more toxic. Hes had tons of people complain about him and he just blocks them. He’s quite rude to people who question anything he says, he says he doesn’t watch any other content creators stuff and doesn’t listen to anyone’s testing. He thinks
He is a god and thinks All his oc nunbers are the best. He won’t tell anyone his voltage and tries to claim everyone’s after his secrets and they’re stealing his secrets. He’s got some big conspiracy theory that everyone’s out to steal his lucky charms.
Never use framechaser as a source. What nonsense he puts out.
@@kaisersolo76 Yeah, it's lie using WCCFTech or Wikipedia as a source! LOL! That said, I still keep an eye one him. He at least has a point once in a while, unlike Linus!
Had the same reaction about 15 days ago when the weather was nice and went on to a small forest (closely urban) and sat on a bench for about an hour.. someone told me that these was to some dust that is produced through pines or caterpillars (those that form large chains and get up on logs of trees)
Anyway.. the one thing is to never touch th9se reg8ons on the skin though it rushes you to itch, and apply some soothing cream..and wash it only with mild soap and not rub at all.
hope yoy recover fast
I wonder what FPS these can do in DOS Quake at 320x200 🙂
🤯
damn Phil, you are quick, anyway it will be high but it seems consistency is a big head scratcher
when the whole game fits in your cpu's cache
You are capped @ 1000fps regardless because of nvidias driver implementation no matter what games.
@@JoeMama-yl1ow PCI 3dfx Voodoo to the rescue 🙂
I'm mega power user I need 7950X3D, I even created my own custom SLI profiles for games that didn't support SLI back in the day and I got SLI working for unsupported game. 7950X3D is tweaker's dream CPU! You can tinker and tune so much it's just a treat. I'm not some console player that wants to start PC and game. I want to tinker, set things, tune, more tuning.
Which to be sure is a MINORITY of PC gamers. MOST PC gamers are buying prebuilts and expect them to be 100% plug n play.
Id wager that the vast majority of PC gamers have never even seen a BIOS screen.
Bryan EZ 🍿👑
Pretty sure no one really wants to mess with affinities when I just wanna play games well, on any CPU.
If you're just a gamer get the 7800x3d if you do editing and productivity and gaming get the 7950x3d
I would just save the money and get the 7950x or the 13700k.
If you want the best of both worlds the i9 13900k is the best CPU still.
@@ZackSNetwork hopefully amd finds a solution or does the same thing intel is doing with big/little cores
@@ZackSNetworkif want best of both world, you get both CPU.
@@ZackSNetworkis the i9 13900 really better than both?
The 7950x3d is definitely an enthusiast chip, it's not just a gaming chip.... if you are just a gamer get the 7800
If your just a gamer get the 12100 or 13500
@CaptCapitalist hell, pretty much any 6+ core processor will run most games fine... I did a 8 core fx 8120 and it handles most titles with a fatboy 590
still waiting for the frame chasers vs hub punch on.
Anyone in the business could see this coming from a mile away. There's a very good reason that the 7800X3D is so heavily delayed, they tried to sell as many 79**X3Ds as possible before people caught on.
I'm sure the 7800X3D will be a great CPU for mainly gaming, but this business practice is so anti-consumer it reeks.
It's been delayed a month that's hardly heavily delayed 😂
@@LawrenceTimme It’s the only 3D chip that makes sense and matters to gamers. AMD is making scummy anti consumer moves.
Dumb comment. This is like saying 13900k is pointless cos 13600k will give you similar fps. No one buys 16cores cpu just for gaming, dummy
true, considering the amount of time you have to wait, if people value their time, they just buy any CPU and gaming several months already instead of waiting.
@@ZackSNetwork didums, you are so impatient you cant even wait a month. Lol. This is why gamers always get shafted. It's not cos the companies are greedy, it's because the gamers are greedy. They want it all now like a child. Pathetic. Daddy I want it nooooooowwwwwww. Reeeeeeeeeeee
The unfortunate fact is that the average PC users skill levels are progressively getting lower as time progresses.
This is inline with the dumbing down of society in general.
Which is great news for the marketing people who exploit this truism.
As people slowly lose the ability to think for themselves the markets will happily exploit them.
The 7950x3d is a clever piece of technology . but not a pure gaming chip.
People are just being dumb. When Wendell from L1techs says it's fine it's fine
Thought I would throw a few dollars your way bro. Thanks for being a reasonable dude and keeping your channel positive man. There's enough negativity online, you're a pro at being professional and decent about everything you cover. Very solid example of being an adult online, we need more of that out here for sure bro. Keep it up man! Much love from the States (Seattle area).
100% agree.
"bro"....
This is the best take on this “situation” out of all the channels. It takes into account both sides and boils it down well. Thank you for doing that, especially that trash DDR5 is better and gear mess the other channels were incorrectly configuring. Keep it up.
Nahh. It's just not Tech YES Value!
I'm early too for once lol
@@Marty_NZ Hit the bell icon and be Tech YES Early every time!
If your main focus is to primarily play games, than for sure you should wait for the 7800XD3. And even if you want to get the 7950X3D you should wait until the 7800X3D comes out because they will soon start to heavily reduce the price of the 7950X3D because its sales will get even worse once the 7800X3D comes out.
Theres no reason to reduce price wheb the cpu is sold out everywhere 🤷♂️
There is no point getting a 7950x3d. The 7950x is $200 (!) cheaper here, for a loss of 6% in games. Then its like 600 fps or 550fps.. which no one will notice anyway.
what sales do you mean? its sold out since day 1 in germany. where do you live?
the point in buying a 7950X3D is the multicore performance, duh
if you want BOTH top tier multicore AND gaming
no other processor does BOTH
Intel is inefficient in multicore, 7950X is shit in gaming, 7800X3D is shit in multicore
@@AndrewTSq really depends on the games you play certain games the v cache is a game changer
7950X3D 16 with 8x3D
7900X3D 6x12 with 6x3D
Imagine the rage when the 7800X3D comes out and they went 4x4 instead of using 5800 template.
Lol that would be hilarious
The CCD in zen 4 is 8 cores each so that would not happen at all.
The 3900X 5900X, and finally 7900x are 6 core CCD's. No surprise it has ALWAYS been that way! If you bought one thinking it was not than that is the consumers fault for spending money and not understanding what it is they are buying!
7950X3D = 8 core CCD0(X3D) & 8 core CCD1(non X3D)
7900X3D = 8 core CCD0(X3D) & 4 core CCD1(non X3D)
7800X3D = 8 core CCD0(X3D)
7950X3D = 8MB cache per core.
7900X3D = 10MB cache per core.
7800X3D = 12MB cache per core.
UA-camrs who have disabled CCD1 from 7950X3D doesn't have accurate 7800X3D benchmarks.
For example:
7950X3D CCD0 (50W) - CCD1(50W) - iGPU (20W) = 120W total.
If they disable CCD1 (non X3D) it will only run 70W (CCD0 at 50W) and iGPU(20W).
CCD0 won't get anymore then 50W that voltage/power is limited/locked it's for all CCD's.
7800X3D will have additional 50W more power available and this with 12MB cache per core.
Will increase even more fps and higher jump in gaming performance then 7900X3D which has 2MB more cache.
But can't deliver that additional power to CCD0 as it's lock due to dual CCD's limit which is 50W, except the 7800X3D.
This is why it doesn't need higher clocks it has more cache per core and double the power draw of dual CCD on a single CCD.
My analysis and expectation of 7800X3D is going to aim for gaming performance better then 13900KS that's right KS!
7900X3D/7950X3D will get updates overtime and get slowly better performance but the 7800X3D will BLAST OUT 7950X3D/KS.
They'll all perform similarly. Nothing special about X3D this time at all. Incredibly disappointing launch and results. Not even 4K numbers change where as 5800X3D did over 5800X. These CPU were just made for competition with Intel or to beat them ever so slightly.
Maybe we need to redefine what is a pc enthusiasts….
One moment it’s someone who is coming up with custom memory timings and fan curves and overclocking the cpu and gpu.
And another moment it’s to hard to follow directions to assign cores.
It’s always something in this hobby.
Either way have as much fun as you can ❤
Bro if u r into tuning n ocing u wud get 13900k anyway . U tune once n u r good. U dont have to do it for every application like this cpu n 13900k tuned beats this in gaming n productivity. That’s y it’s called a scam.
If u jus want gaming 7800x3d wud be easily better
@@anuzahyder7185 Someone who can't speak English shouldn't be lecturing anyone on the definition of the term scam.
@@snotspat I can translate the 13900ks is better if you wanna be in a bios screen overclocking. Mostly due to better 1% lows. Your getting scammed because of amd misleading a lot of customers some people thinking the 7950x3d boost higher than the 7800x3d in gaming or that both ccds were v cache and my favorite that the scheduling just works automatically which for many programs people are talking about lassoing their cpu.
@@majicalpandatech yeah it is telling that the 7800x3d hasn't been released yet.
"I can run tests at 1080p with an RTX 4090, I know it's unrealistic..."
Me watching this video on a 1080p monitor plugged into an RTX 4090 😐
The point of the 7950x3d is to be “as good” as a 7800x3d in gaming AND “as good” as a 7950x in multi core workloads.
It’s meant to be best of both worlds, I’ve got a 7950x3d for gaming but I also like to work in blender and do 3d modelling for 3d print sculpts. If I got the 7800x3d it would struggle with my blender workload,
So you also should run the clock speed at the 7800x3d speed for absolute comparison
7950x3d has more cache. it's a jank simulation
I thought this too but it’s hard to say if there will be a difference. AMD is advertising that the 7800X3D will boost up to 5GHz which is what I am seeing on the V-Cache CCD on my 7950X3D. The non-V-Cache CCD will boost higher but I never catch any core boosting all the way to the advertised 5.7GHz.
Basically, we won’t know if these 7800X3D simulations are accurate until we reviews are out. I just hope that these simulations aren’t going to end up being misleading.
@@kBitre the cache resides on each core complex die. So by disabling the second ccd completely you lose all access to that l2+l3 cache. Its not using a central pool of cache that both ccds draw from they are separate. Thus disabling the ccd will make it have equal cache to the 7800x3d
@@Jsteeeez I see. ty
@@Jsteeeez - Thus disabling the ccd will make it have equal cache to the 7800x3d...slightly incorrect. The 7950X3D has 16 MB l2 cache, while the 7800X3D only has 8 MB. The 7950X3D also has more L3 cache, 128 MB compared to 96 MB on the 7800X3D.. Combine these with the higher boost clock speeds of the 7950X3D, I think we can safely say that the 7800X3D is not going to perform as well. How much of a difference there is, remains to be seen.
My opinion is a 8c 16t cpu is low end. There is one in the series s for 250$.
Also I've owned both 7800x3d and 7950x3d and I can tell you first hand the 7950x3d is 100% a better cpu.
Out side of gaming it's 100%+ better. That includes running windows.
Is the 7950x3d a scam.. no
It's a compromise between gaming and productivity in one cpu. 16 cores 8 of them are 3d v cache
The 7800x3d will be the best gaming deal and likely better performance and efficiency than disabling half the cores in the 7950x3d.
If you are streaming and gaming and running other stuff the 7950x3d may be better.
Brian seems a bit confused about what his message is in this video. That early adopters of the hybrid CPU that is the 7950X3D have to do a bit of extra work to get them to run properly has nothing to do with the question as to whether they're a scam or not. They're not. Frame Chasers clearly doesn't understand how core parking works and he's flat out wrong when he says that only one chiplet works when you're gaming. Gordon's not the only one to have proven him wrong, Level1Tech did a really good explanation not only of how it works but why the approach AMD and Microsoft have taken is the only sensible option.
Me I would not want to use it running something else when playing a game. I am in 2 minds as the game I wanted this CPU for Star Citizen uses all cores .
some people that have test it in game show that when the CPU is heavy under load as in the Cities all or most cores are used but when flying out of the plants Atmo and into space the 8 cores with V-cache are the only ones running . so the game / Xbox bar thing works. it runs 8 cores in game and then if needed boost with the other cores.
I take it in most games Shooters and like the 7800x3d will be the better choice and some say the same with the space sim too.
Im not 100% sure they have the dual ccd working fully and the 1 ccd with v-cache just shows it up more
The i7-13700k is a much better price to performance chip. The 7950x3d is a gimmick and nothing else.
if you're using hogwarts as benchmark, please let it be in Hogsmeade! (It's the city, about 2 hours into the game)
the fact that people don't understand how to utilize a cpu to it's maximum potential, doesn't make a product a scam, people just dumb
Nice video.
Did you also simulate the lower CPU boost of the 7800X3D?
In what way, the listed 7950x3d higher clock boost is only on the second CCD that doesn't have the extra 64 MB of cache (disabling it turns the 7950x3D into a 78000x3d)
Installing the AMD chipset driver and making sure Xbox game bar is enabled it core parks the second CCD on the 7900x3d/50 (as long as Xbox game bar detects the running game)
Scam argument is stupid AF . Not all games will utilise all cores , maybe 4 at most. 7950X is a productivity CPU or for games which can 100% utilize that CPU
Intel 12 and 13 Gen rely on Software they will not work correctly on WIndows 10 and need Win 11 for the E Cores to work
Im glad i went with my 13600K. i just want to play and not spending time om bios.
Did you account for the speed difference? 7800X3D is supposed to be slower.
😅 your kinda right the chiplet that’s faster is non 3d so yeah… it’s gonna be the same
For now just need to wait for WIndows OS and Well AMD drivers to sort out just what CCD is to be used when gaming Till Windows catches up to the Chip design providing they dont totally Knee cap it that is, Benchmarks will be all over the place
7800 is a better buy for current games, but the 7950 has a higher max clock (5.7 vs 5.0 ghz) and more cores for the future and background stuff.
I am sure that, If there was no 7950X in the first place and AMD launched 7950X3D alone, no one would ever have had a complaint about 7950X3D ! It is power efficient and cool and gives a very high frame rate with high end GPU and great productivity results too. And Disabling and enabling CCDs as needed is not a big task in AMD systems. 🤔 it is definitely the current fastest gaming CPU and is not a scam. But waiting for a 7800X3D is a good thing for more budget oriented gamers.
Yep. 7950x3d is nothing but a gimmick.
It’s a gimmick. 13900k does both but better. If u have to rely on applications n windows to work properly then y not jus tune 13900k one time n u r done. Does better in games n productivity
@@anuzahyder7185 13900k does not do both better at all. It takes more than x2 the power to still lose in fps and win by a few % in productivity. I can’t understand why people don’t understand the 7950x3d. It’s for the person who wants the best gaming while also wanting amazing productivity. Calling it a scam or gimmick is simple minded. People need to read more or watch someone like Level1Techs who actually understands this.
@@cszthompson i cant say its a scam but comparing the price with the performance u feel like its a scam. about 150$ more for just about 2% fps on games that's what called a scam. The only positive side is power consumption is about half in 7950x3d.
@@anuzahyder7185 no, the 13900k loses in both gaming and productivity while using twice the power. Intel fanboys are on copium lmao.
Everyone doing click bait titles with "7800X3D" what a new low TechTubers.
Frame chasers is blunt but we need guys like that! Tell the truth. No fear!
Thanks for the review. I'll skip this gen & keep my 5950X until all issues are solved.
The issues are already solved ,, 13600k is CHAMPION
One thing to keep in mind is the PPT limit of the cpu if you're heavily taxing the non vcache portion of the cpu, your vcached core clocks are likely going to suffer to stay within that limit.
7950Xhalf3D
Seeing framechasers get a shoutout here brings a smile to my face
Brian, I don't know if the footage in the video is direct from benchmark captures but when setting the core affinity to Corona Benchmark, I think you set it to 13 cores (19 to 31) instead of 12. I have no idea if it makes an appreciable difference in the results you were trying to obtain but I figured I should point that out. Great content, as always. Cheers!
I love Tech YES Simulations!
Cash Grab from gamers? Sure. Scam? Absolutely not.
I don’t know if I’d call it a scam but like you said janky sounds more like it. In my opinion Gordon actually proved more so that it’s a “scam” when he tried to say it wasn’t. When he ran Cinebench on 4 threads while gaming it ran on the 3D CCD. Shouldn’t it have assigned that to the non 3D CCD, for better Cinebench score with the faster CCD and only had game on the 3D CCD for best gaming performance.
Thanks for your take on this. I was stoked about the CPU until the details came out. I'm happy with my 5900x but I was able to snag an RTX 4090 and I am going to want to upgrade my cpu again in a few years. I hope there are some ways newer processors will be able to report certain things to the operating system about their topology and how to handle thread scheduling more transparently though today that isn't the case. Applications will also need to catch up so it's like the chicken and the egg. We know the chiplets and "tiles" are coming for specific tasks and acceleration but today you can have a very powerful CPU and an OS that isn't really able to fully leverage it because of lack of awareness which isn't ideal.
I too have a 5900x and 4090. Assuming you play at 4K like me, there really isn't a CPU worth upgrading for at the moment, these 3D chips included. That will change with the 5090 and next generation CPUs however.
@@HeloisGevit I lol'd
I got 5900x and a 4090.
Now I don’t know if it’s worth upgrading to AM5 ugh
Frame Chasers tells it how it is and I like that.
7950X3D is for someone who is both a gamer and a content creator/productivity power user. If gaming is your main and only use case, as Bryan says, wait for 7800x3d or grab discounted cpus like 7700X/7600X/5800X3D/13600K.
7600x no cause 13600k is better option. 7700x idk, id still say just get 13600k... but yeah 7800x3d will be the best gaming money can buy. 13600k is the best price to performance gaming cpu.
If u want both get 13900k. Y go through the hassle of 7950x3d
@@anuzahyder7185 Eeah exactly. If just gaming get 7800X3D or if on budget get 13600K... If you want to do both game and high thread count workloads, get 13900K. 7950X3D is pointless due to how poorly AMD executed it.
If I was the 'power user' I would want the best performance for that, and the normal 7950x is best for that.
@@teemuvesala9575 Nah it's not quite as simple as that anymore in this weird transitioning phase where the customer is spoiled with choices.
If you're on budget, you're not even going to have the budget for a 13600K build. You should be looking at a 5600 or a 13500 instead.
13600k is good on the charts, but in practicality unless you plan to use it for some content creation / video encoding or VM virtualisation. You're often better served just getting a 5800X3D (similar price region) especially if you're only gaming.
For those who are lucky enough to be near a microcenter, an AM5 build is outright better value because bundles. Intel sucks in platform longevity and 13th gen is EOL. In a few years time that forward-planning will pay off.
I don't think this is a true simulation a 7800X3D. Point to make is that the boost clock for 7800X3D is less than the boost clock for the 7950X3D on the 3D v-cache CCD. In addition, the 7800X3D has 96MB of L3 cache and 7950X3D has 128MB. Also, L2 cache sizes are different. The only way to tell how they compare is to have a real 7800X3D to test.
When you togle off the other cpu ship, you only use 96mb of cache… So this is quite accurate. In 7950x3d the v-cache ship is slow aka as slow as 7800x3d is suposed to be. And the non v-cache chip is the fast one. So simulation should be quite accurate. What we don´t know is how they bin the v-cache chips to 7950x3d vs 7800x3d. If they use better chips in 7950x3d it may be that the simulated results are better than what 7800x3d will deliver. We have to wait one month to see that.
The extra cache and clockspeed comes from the non-3d chip, the one you don't want games to run on, so the simulated numbers should be quite accurate.
In no way is the 7950X3D a scam. It offers very good gaming performance and can also handle content creation quite well. It's a jack of all trades and quite honestly the sort of CPU I like. I don't like single purpose driven designs because I'm not "just" a gamer or content creator or etc.
thats why u just buy the i5 13600k at the moment cause of simplicity...
BEST choice :)
Heh! 7950x3d is ultimate gaming / productivity combo if you need both. 7800x3d is the ultimate I just play games CPU.
AMD did test with two v-cache chips… The CPU was not faster in gaming, it was more expensive and much worse at productivity. So… No good. This is excelent compromise if you want both. And if you only need productivity. 7900 or 7950 are best option, if only gaming wait 7800x3d.
I think that AMD portfolio is starting to look good.
Nobody buying a 7950x3d or needing its power is considered an average PC user. It's such a weird point to make.
The real scam is 7900x3d 😅
We should just wait until the real 7800x3d comes out and test then, because there will be a difference in the Vd cache so performance will differ. Great vid as alway's Bryan :D
Wow click bait anyone
To be fair 7950X3D is an enthusiast product so yeah.
That's what companies do. They go after that crowd first. it's for the .1 of 1%. Just like any other product in the PC market. When it comes to Nvidia's 2080Ti. Then to the 3090Ti. Lastly to the 4090. It's all for the enthusiast class. Where they use blender, AutoCad, etc. Where they make money when they use it.
7800X3D is better value worth waiting for than the 7950X3D
YOUR DREAM ,, how about wait for REALITY?
I completly get what you are saying and for the most part I agree with you but splitting the CPU into just 8 gaming cores and 8 "work" cores is not what they did here. Yes 8 cores are meant for gaming and only gaming, but the other 8 cores are meant to work with the gaming core to provide you with the 16 cores when "working" If you only used the extra 8 you would get less proformance for "working" this chip is meant for someone who wants the best of both worlds. Perfect gaming and the ability to have 16 cores for a work load. It should have been labeled better as such instead of just the worlds best gaming but the 7800x3d will not be able to preform "work" tasks as well as the 7950x3d.
yeah but u should just get a 13900k in that case
Interesting analysis. Thanks for your hard work. Personally, I think this CPU is basically a slightly nerfed 16 core 7950x and a slightly nerfed 7800X3D. AMD promised a best of both worlds, but what we get is a slightly nerfed best of both worlds. I think I'll stick to the 7800X3D if possible, but for people that can harness the power of a 16core chip, I guess it's a great compromise. I don't think AMD is out to milk people for their money, if I were AMD I wouldn't launch th e7800X3D first either because if I launch it first and send the cpus by air, then I would end up increasing the base price of the cpu to cover the shipping expenses. It makes a load more sense to send the highest margin parts via AIR and launch them first to target the niche market. If you're getting a 7950X3D, you'd better be making money with it.
This processor is for a professional who also wants top gaming performance and efficiency. The type of person who won’t mind setting core affinity in apps. Pure gamers should get 7800x3d when it comes out
13900k says hi
@@anuzahyder7185
13900k is great but certainly not efficient
Like I have been saying since the 7900X3D and 7950X3D announcements, it all comes down to how the scheduling works and AMD has an abysmal track record with making on-paper capabilities work at the software level. It looks like the 7800X3D will beat the 7950X3D in gaming, even though on paper the 7950X3D should be able to offload all other processes to the non-3D CCU and free up processing power to the 3D CCU to focus 100% on the game.
Intel's 13th generation processors flat out scale better as you go up in price and SKU, AMD's predictably do not and are a mixed bag because the marketing for their tech doesn't marry to the reality of their tech in action. Tale as old as time here.
Compare use cases of a 13700k vs a 7800X3D and a 13900k vs a 7950X3D in the following scenario: you are using Discord, afterburner, a browser with several tabs open and a full screen youtube video on a second monitor, OBS streaming or recording, and Spotify (very very typical application load for a modern desktop with multiple monitors). How many frames are you getting in a game and how much are background processes affecting 1% lows (stutter/lowest frame moments)? I'd wager my savings account that the Intel chips perform better and schedule correctly to their E-cores while the 7950X3D does not.
@@ArbitraryFilmings the 3d cache ccd on the 7950x3d and 7800x4d will be damn near the exact same around ~5ghz. The only difference is the non 3d ccd clocks to 5.7ghz and you wont be playing your games on that ccd anyway 99% of time.
Good thing for Frame Chaser’s Chanel and being able to go against the grain. Once again!
If AMD is a scam Intel is a mega-scam given their E-Cores can't even move games properly and all and all consume way more power compare to AMD counterparts.
Next gen might bring cache into all cores as a selling point to solve all related issues into CPU affinity not working properly on some titles.
The extra core not having 3D cache was something they should add on the specs but given the way CPU specs work they didn't have to be so precise around their architecture arrange on L3 cache as long as the amount of memory they mention was already present.
Note: Adding a 5800x3D and Intel 13700K for comparison should be a must on this benchmarks as you might spot failure on performance when you have some good reference of normal performance.
Haha by reading the title I could tell you that is a frame chasers line he drops every 10 minutes.
Has anyone run Windows 7 Ultimate on this yet?
I want to know how Windows 7 is suppose to deal with 8 cores suddenly disappearing, or in the case of the 13K, how to load balance across unequal performance and efficiency cores. It's like CPU manufacturers suddenly went sh1tst0rmstvp1d...
Its not unrealistic. Either in BIOS or using Process Lasso to force games to play on only the X3D cores will get gaming performance from the 7950X3D that nearly matches the 7800X3D. Using Process Lasso does not require you to park the cores and they will automatically be used for productivity tasks. Also, just today they dropped the price on the 7900X3D to LESS than that of thge 7800X3D.
Well, if games is the only reason why you get 7950X3d, sure its a "scam" for gaming, but if you plan on running multiple VMs, an extensive Plex server, and playing games all at the same time then no.
Gordon just wants to chill
Any product that doesn't work well out of the box end-up on the discount department.
Monitor with bad calibration or a mouse/M.2 that required a firmware update to work properly also fall into this category.
AMD did create a small failure trusting software to handle access to the 3D memory so yep we might see it drop in price if people complain about it in a loud way.
BIG SAD I BOUGHT A 7900x3d instead of a 7950 r 7800, but honestly Im still getting really good performance out of it )700xtx gpu 670e-e board
Jesus, I had no idea how complicated this new 7950X3D CPU was. I just bought a brand new AM5 board and 32GB DDR5 6000 and I was thinking about grabbing a 7950X3D for future proofing, but seeing how complicated it is to get this CPU to work right, I'm definitely thinking about just getting a 7800X3D instead for the simplicity and $250 cost savings. I honestly have no need for multi-tasking and productivity like video editing. Boy oh boy, just looking at the quick glance you took scrolling down the walk-through on your b-roll here already turned me off about the 7950X3D. It's just too much.
get 7800x3d. if you're heavy multitasker, 7950x is also better value than 7950x3d. turns out the ultimate cpu for mixed gaming and productivity is 13900k, if you can live with its power consumption.
@@teemuvesala9575 You're right, the 7800X3D is definitely my best bet. I did not go with Intel because of the high thermals and power consumption. Problem is having to wait a whole month to get the 7800X3D and that's a big IF with all sorts of bots and resellers grabbing all CPUs for profit. 2023 sucks.
@@agoogleuser2369 I doubt that will happen now, because economy is doing badly and people are not spending as much as they used to. Scalpers would be taking big gamble in unfavorable times. Just high prices in general suck this year due to inflation and some of these companies just outright milking the consumers.
I personally upgraded from 10900K to 13600K (more of a vanity upgrade I know), but just wanted to build new system for reasonable price to make full use of my 2x2TB PCIE gen 4 980 Pros + was able to use my old DDR4 4400MHz Samsung b-die kit with new platform. I think I scored silicon lottery win this time, since I'm able to run 4x8GB Viper Steel at 4200MHz CL16 in 2 dimm per channel config. With 10900K anything over 3600MHz would not just work.
easy win for the 7950X . No point paying $200 for maybe 6% of improvement real world gaming . Like, do you really need 50+ fps when you are already about 300fps? lmao
@@claudep.1926 That's exactly what I ended up doing. I'm doing some testing with the 7950X as we speak. 0.1% lows on the X3D chips are actually worse on average compared to the non X3D CPUs, which means more stutters while gaming. I do not like heterogeneous CPU setups. It complicates things too much. If the 7950X3D had identical CCDs I would be all over that CPU. I'll just wait to get a 7800X3D when it comes out next month. I don't really need 16 cores.
Di you land up testing a 7800x3d? I thinking upgrading from i9 900kf
Well based on the specs
7950X3D is 8+8 cores with 128MB L3 Cache divided by 8MB per core.
7900X3D is 6+6 cores with 128MB L3 Cache divided by 10.67MB per core.
7800X3D is 8+0 cores with 96MB L3 divided by 12MB per core.
Looking forward to see if a 7850X3D with hypothetical 8+4 cores with 96MB L3 Cache divided by 8MB per core.
Dude, ANYONE buying a 7950x3d knows what they want, I think they know how to use a BIOS or AT THE LEAST AMDs program that runs IN THE OS. Yes, if ALL you do is game then the 7800x3d is cheaper but in no way is "people dont know how/want to configure a $700 cpu" a good reason not to buy it if you want future proofing/a high workload PC
The 7950x3D is better now but again, you should think 7950x3D is a CPU use for streaming where you can get both good FPS in gaming and solid production workflow ability, best of both word in a single package. If you argue that it is worst than 7950X in production and worst than 7800X3D in gaming then you are wrong since you will build a 1 PC for 2 task, not 2 PC for 2 task. That is what matter, if you only play games but you buy this then it is not gonna give you what you want, buy the 7800X3D, but if you are power user that use your PC more than just an entertainment machine then 7950X3D will be the best investment you can have.
Only reason 7950 won in Cyberpunk is because the game doesn't use SMT on AMD CPUs when you have more than 6 cores.
I already know everything well about AMD but people don't like program configurations because AMD is rubbish that nothing can be done by AUTO programs of X3D processor so AMD put AUTOPROGRAMS without configuration!! You understand that I am not interested in configuration, it means AMD will not be able to do AUTOPROGRAMS and Intel is AUTO-ALL normal programs without getting tired!
I though Games like BF 2042 will be better on the 7950x3D.. because this game support 10 cores.. :-/
And now everyone says dont buy the 7950x3D if u only play games... and yes.. i rly just play games.. i never work with my pc.
My RTX 4090 cant run well.. because i still sit on my shitti 8700k...
I disagree a bit here.
1. MOST people buying a high end CPU or building a new PC have common knowledge of what things need to be done. This includes updating Bios, updating Windows, updating drivers, etc.
2. UA-camrs are the ones creating all these conflicting statements which I really don’t have a clue why. The 7950X3D works as intended. I have had no issues. All this bullshit about turning off CCD to get games to work is utter bullshit. I’ve ran over 10+ top AAA games and all of them are work perfectly with Vcache and I haven’t had to turn off CCD or any of this manual crap that everybody is talking about.
3. If you really want to to get rid of any doubts, all you have to do is set prefer “cache” in bios settings. That’s it. Not need to disable cores or CCD.
4. All this crap about 7800X3D simulation showing it to be better than the 7950X3D in “Performance” is another utter crap. AMD has just recently released some benchmarks and it shows the 7800X3D to be either identical to 7950X3D or in some games a bit slower than the 7950X3D. YES, it is better than the 7950X3D in “VALUE”. Do not confuse this with having better “PERFORMANCE”.
4. Most people that game on PC probably do run other applications when running games, this is why it’s a good idea to have a 7950X3D as running other apps while gaming turns on the extra cores(non vcache) without impacting game performance.
5. All I did was throw in the new 7950X3D, update Bios, Update Windows, Update drivers and that’s it. Ready to rock. Every game working with vcache with massive performance gains.
I’ve never seen so much drama and over complicating on something so simple.
I am tired of this nonsens , is the 7950 X3D really meant to be a Gamer ( only ) CPU ? , no , not really , its a 16Core CPU which is slightly slower in Apps than a 7950x but partly much faster in Games .
The Gamer CPU for AM5 is the 7800X3D , as the 5800X3D was one for AM4 . Period . Is it a Scam from AMD to launch X3D parts on higher Core count CPUs as well ? No , of course not , there were enough People which criticized AMD for only lauch an single 8 Core V-Cache CPU on AM4.
I agree that it is better to wait for 7800X3D. Imagine an average buyer gets 7900X3D and later finds out that 7800X3D is faster and is cheaper. Of course they would assume 7900X3D is a scam. Imagine buying i9 and in gaming it is slower than i7, you would assume i9 is a scam. No need to complicate stuff AMD. Either give consumers 2CCDs with 3D V-cache or just release 7800X3D. Many gamers are going to be mad at AMD.
7900x3d is the best choice if you want to build a new PC now. 7950x3d is out of stock every where, 7800x3d will be out of stock in 5 minutes after launch. AM5 will supoort a few more generations of AMD., so you still can upgrade the cpu im the future. 7850x3d snd 7900x3d give almost identical performance and both are faster than 13900k.
No, of course it isn't a scam; that's just stupid. However it's not smart to buy it if you mainly are just going to play games on it. Much better to wait for the 7800X3D if you only game. But the REAL 7800X3D might end up being a little slower, since the 12 & 16 core Ryzens natively have double the L3 cache of the 6 & 8 core models before the 64 megs of 3D cache is slapped on top. But it won't be a big enough difference to be worth the huge increase in price...
If you're a gamer, you don't need 7000 series :)
3600 or 5600 is just more than enough, and saves you tons of bucks
It depends on the use case. Games vary enormously in their behaviour, some are limited a great deal by a single physics/engine thread. Thus, a newer arch may help a lot, even if many more cores wouldn't matter as much. This though is why SKUs such as the 5500X3D, 5600X3D, 7500X3D and 7600X3D didn't and won't exist, because they would too much negate the relevance of higher margin parts. AMD learned this from the 3300X.
Aswell as varying game engine behaviour, there's also the goals of the player. I'm fine with 1080p/60Hz atm (on a 48" TV, driven by a 1080 Ti and 5600X), but there are those playing esports & suchlike who want vastly higher frame rates, in which case a newer arch will help. Problem is, they don't bother separating IPC/clock/arch from core count, nor it seems do they much care. Or there are those using 1440p or more importantly 4K, for whom GPU speed is far more relevant.
So you're right that those two CPUs can serve most gamers, but the loudest voices tend to come more from those for whom they can't, hence the dominant narratives become distorted. The absolute frame rates being talked about these days are absurdly high, better than the equivalent visual acuity of a bird, yet nobody bothers separating hw performance from simple practice with a game. We hear about Fortnite, CSGO, MW2, Apex, PUBG and others all the time, because they're so high up on Steam, likewise games like CB2077 are benched all the time in tech reviews, yet there are other games and entire other genres which have very different hw needs, are also very popular, but receive virtually no attention at all, especially sim games like ETS2 (more popular than BF5, Rocket League and Skyrim atm), or older games like GTA V which are still very popular (twice as many players as Hogwarts), or survival genre games like Sons of the Forest and Rust (again very popular, higher in the charts than many games typically used in bench reviews).
Tech reviews have become too focused on specific types of gaming, mainly esports, competitive fps and certain first-person games like CB2077. It's distorted where the pressure is going in terms of what people think matters for suitable PC hw for playing games. It all depends on the game. 60Hz is fine for sim games (locked rate and consistency is far more important than absolute fps), for which my current hw config maxes out ETS2. On Steam, Sons of Forest has far more players atm than RDR2, yet only the latter appears in typical GPU reviews. SOTF doesn't need much to run well, but it does show the bias in what is covered in the tech space; it's more popular atm than R6S or CIV6. I mean heck, on Steam atm, W3WH is less popular than Farming Simulator 22. :D
When the 5800x3d came out everyone was crying for a 5950x3d. Now that amd gave them options all they do is cry. The 7950x3d is for the person that does 80/20% production/gaming & 7800x3d is just the opposite. That's why there's benchmarks. You don't want it don't buy it
Saying that the 7950X isn't "technically" a scam is a real cop-out. Complaining about AMD's use of Game Bar is strange since I never heard you complaining that Intel uses is too with the Thread Director. Why isn't the Thread Director janky? Why isn't the 13900K a scam? Claiming 24 cores but you only really get 8 gaming cores, that sounds pretty cheesy too?
1:32 you said it, it is unrealistic. At high resolution performance is GPU bound, at lower resolution the frame rates are insanely high to really matter to the average user. Most experts have a tough time agreeing on an exact number, but the conclusion is that most humans can see at a rate of 30 to 60 frames per second . We are comparing CPU performance based on unrealistic use cases. I am at the other end of the spectrum, I am a causal gamer I use UWQHD + (3840 x 1600 @ 60 Hz) I am happy with a Ryzen 7900 @60W TDP. When I have more performance than I really need then power consumption and heat becomes the decisive factor.
It's the FX 8350 all over again lol
I'm pretty sure AMD wouldn't make the same mistake again....... Right
I don't see how this is any different than Intel and the big/little cores of Alder Lake. Is Intel a scammer then for coming out with the i9 CPUs when the i5 performs nearly the same in games (or better in some)? No. It's use case and target audience. The 7950X3D is marketed towards heavy users, not budget smooth brains. And it most certainly is up to devs to incorporate performance optimization for the CPU. There wasn't this bullshit going on at the Alder Lake launch (calling Intel a scammer) when certain games and applications were having issues. It was a discussion about how devs need to start optimizing for the "new" architecture. Software development needs to get out of the world of uniform CPUs and focus on newer technologies.
Another point of view, if the person can't be bothered to invest 5 minutes in setting up the PC by following simple instructions for this CPU then he probably is not a good candidate to assemble a PC and he should buy from an OEM. If he buy from somebody like Tech YES City then it is up to Tech YES City to set it up for that person and provide an install-medium (USB-stick) for a clean install with this setup (a simple script will do it) in the future if desired.
It's not a scam. It's pretty much a 7950X with better gaming performance and WAY better efficiency. If you like to game but also use your work for productivty it's amazing. It has its place on the market. If you just want to game then sure, get the 7800X3D.
Once again you ignore the fact that you don't need to wait for developer support, that's why there is that integration with xbox game bar to give you easy way to just mark anything as game to be sure it will be put on right cores. Is that a best solution possible? Probably not. But it's there and now I really start to wander why you ignore its existence?
You are right in one thing, most people doesn't need 7950x3d for gaming. Nobody need that CPU just for gaming. But it was never made or marketed to be "just a gaming CPU".
AM5 3D CPUs with 2CCDs should have a built in hardware scheduler to properly assign tasks to cores, just like Intel did with their P and E cores. Not designing it and just selling these CPUs to general public is a kind of scam, imho.
Gordon Really surprised me with how he was misleading people and riding the typical conspiracy youtube thumbnail millennials. Wendell from Level1Techs seemed to be the only educated and honest about what AMD is doing with the architecture of the 3D-V Cache chips. Hence why Gordon had him on to try to clean up what he was insinuating.
This is an apple to apple and orange comparison.
The 7950x3d is made for work and play. If I'm doing heavy data compression the 7950x3d is going to complete my workload faster giving me more game time.
im building with r7600x,who need more than 300-500fps?its competition? i can bet next gen 8600x gonna be stronger in games than that 7800x3d,sell old one buy new one,this is best choise,and im gonna keep 7600x until last am5 gen.
Is it a 16 core CPU - if yes, then it is never going to be a scam. It might be bad value, perhaps even shockingly bad value, but it will not be a scam. Please use a dictionary when putting together your click-baity BS title lines. Love your videos otherwise, please avoid the click bait.
I think maybe you should watch the Gamer's Nexus review of the chip. The results of your tests don't make any sense, which should tell you that there is something wrong with your methodology. Did you make sure to use the latest chipset drivers? That may very well explain the results that you and your fellow UA-camr were seeing.
Wholly crap everyone caaaaaalm down. This is just a scheduler issue in Windows. The processor just came out and once Microsoft tunes the scheduler so that you dont need to hack it, itll be perfectly fine. It's just like E cores and P cores and Windows had to fix the scheduler for that processor to. Did everyone forget that?
Intel having DECADES of software and optimizations. They surely have advantage there. But what amd is doing is not wrong or scam. This is what needs to take the most out of it.