Especially the gauge cluster. Frieghtliner has been using that gauge cluster since the early 2000s. Amazing how the small pickup truck companies get picked on about that s*** but the big truck companies haven't changed them in decades. That interior is outright outdated. Can we please get some new gauges?
Us truck drivers do not want anymore fancy electronic’s than we already have, for two reasons 1 the fancy shit breaks and is expensive to repair and takes far too long to repair ( wheels aren’t turning we’re not making money). We don’t care too much about looks, we need aerodynamics to get the best mpg we can get, everything else is second and third thought. That dash isn’t Freightliner, at least not that Autozone lick and stick fake ass “ Wood” . That company bought what is called a “ rolling chassis”.
@@ALMX5DP yeah I'm all for that generally speaking, and I do like Freightliners trucks a lot. They really are a good all-around product for a good price. It's just amazing to me that they literally haven't changed those in so long. Even if they just change the background color or something. It's almost like they're going for a record and not admitting it.
This was a great test guys. I own both a 1 ton diesel pickup, and a Freightliner like the one in the test. I have owned the FL (Freightliner) since 2001, and have worn out 4 pickups in that same amount of time. I can tow 900 miles before I need to refuel, the cab is a lot quieter then a pickup, there is so much more elbow room. The combination of air-ride suspension-cab-& seats lets you drive a lot further before you need a rest. There's no bucking or jerking motions while tow with the FL. On one trip, my trailer brakes were not working....I didn't even realize til the trip was over cause the truck could handle it! I'm on my 4th set of tires, but still on the OEM brakes. I have never had a "white-knuckle" ride, even driving in heavy downpours the truck feels planted to the ground. I set the cruise control at 1800RPM in 6th (about 62/63 MPH) and it holds it's speed even on the 7% climbs. Anyone on the fence with deciding between a pickup or an FL....The FL is well worth owning, cause besides many other reasons it will last you 20+ years!
A 1-ton DRW is enough capability for the vast majority. A bigger medium duty hauler makes sense if you spend a lot of time on the road to where long haul comfort becomes a bigger deal. Driving all over the country in a pickup truck cab is a little tough to stay comfortable.
I think its a fair comparison. With trucks now up into the 20-30000lb capacities, if you're needing to regularly tow that weight, you should consider a true medium/heavy duty solution.
That’s what I’m saying. I drive truck for a living. Mine peterbilt 579 80” bunk price $159k. Has bed refrigerator inverter for coffee pot. microwave. And I’ll yank that little trailer up that with my 565 hp Cummins 2250 torque. In other words kiss my butt freightliner
@Mr Sunshines actually dummy, my point went right over your head. Using the completely redesigned 2020 HD would have been much more valid comparison. The latest Freightliner has to offer vs the latest GMC, is the extra 100k worth what you get out of a something specifically designed for hauling.
Y'all must forgot that Chevy makes a medium duty 5500 & up Silverado (KODIAK replacement) with live front axle and manual locking hubs but the DuraMax is detuned for longevity and you can look it up.
So what did we learn? Yes the 1 ton will tow and stop the load in relative comfort and ease. Yes the 1 ton cost less. Yes the 1 ton is simpler to drive and dont require a CDL. No it wont pull the same weight as the freightliner. No it wont do it day in and day out for 10 years. So if you are planning on pulling heavy very frequently over medium to long distances a TRUE medium duty truck is the ONLY way to go. Awesome video. Would love to see more medium duty stuff.
He's right, the price here doesn't mean much if you're towing really heavy stuff all the time. The confidence he mentioned cannot be overstated. The Freightliner will hold a grade better, won't break down after 20 steep grades, has MUCH better brakes, air ride (it's not a luxury item if you're doing long haul, it's mandatory), and likely get better fuel mileage. You could very likely spec out one of these M2s with less luxury for a lot less money. Just be careful of the CDL requirement, laws (and tickets) are much more strict for CDL holders.
What this test really shows is that the newer one ton dually trucks are capable of medium duty level work when needed. An actual medium duty does the job better overall, but the daily driver one ton can do it. Running a 6.6L with a 3.73 gear against a 9L with a 4.33 gear and the 6.6L handles the job well. Cool video to watch. Thank you.
You gotta consider the difference in weight and tire sizes between the two. People get stuck on 4.33 vs 3.73. You’d have to consider the final ratio of all of that to the ground. In the end, I’d take the FL. The handling, braking, and interior space is a major plus for me.
It is pointless to compare axle ratios without also comparing transmission ratios (different, because they are different transmissions) and tire diameters.
You guys really should use the cruise control. That's factored into the engine's algorithm to make sure the driving experience is optimized. If you want to stay at 50, set it to 50 and see what happens with the exhaust brake and the grade shifting. The trucks aren't designed to guess, so when you press the brake it's going to keep slowing until you have to step on it again just like the GMC did. If you tell it what to maintain, it'll maintain it. I think using the cruise control down the mountain would change the scoring technique completely. Don't use it uphill because you have to navigate traffic and stay safe, but nobody will complain about somebody going 50-ish down the mountain with a giant trailer. Everybody likes safety.
Heck even my 1/2 ton pickup knows to downshift itself going down a hill with the cruise control set, it just does what it needs to maintain whatever speed you tell it to maintain, rather than riding the brakes down the hill the truck maintains speed with the transmission like its designed to do....and my truck is a 2008 Toyota Tundra. I think even my grandfather's 2005 Tundra does that as well, I haven't towed with it so I'm not sure how responsive it is compared to the 08.
I'll take the FLD with the Cummins Jake brake 10 speed roadRanger 390 rears on air ride. Low pro 22.5 tires on Alcoa aluminum. All around even trailer. Should get 10 mpg.needs 2 100 gal fuel tank. full fithwheel hitch. Standard 7way trailer plug. True air disc brakes all around .
I love that you guys get your hands on these things for real world tests and actually show us. Unlike TV and magazines which are like "here's the technical specs and our biased opinion based only on the specs and politics." I'm waiting patiently for 6.6 gas vs. 7.3 gas, and if it happened with like a big truckbed camper, that'd be pretty cool. Like a "Payload Ike"
It's nice to see you guys reviewing bigger trucks now. I know it wasn't a super ike test but I'd like to see that someday soon. I'd also like to see what this fancy m2 would be like compared to a used semi truck. Figure a 60k used semi with double bunks, an automatic just to keep things equal (although I'd prefer the semi to have a manual). If you want give me a holler and I'll drive my combination unit out to test against
Trevor Story The test here seems to suggest other than what you claimed. My guess is that the exhaust brake is not strong enough to regulate the downhill speed in 5th gear. But when it downshifted to 4th, the engine RPM at 50 mph was higher than GM wants the engine to experience. So, the speed the Duramax maintained here was a bit slower than the target 50 (~45mph). For 2020, this issue might be largely remedied by the new 10 speed transmission.
@18:45 The re-gen has absolutely nothing to do with DEF fluid. Re-gen is part of the particulate filter. Normally the heat of highway driving keeps the filter clean, but if you do a lot of in-town driving or low speed driving the filter might not ever get hot enough and it will start to clog. The regen button starts a manual cleaning cycle. It takes around 45 minutes and the vehicle can't be driven while the regen is running.
A 1 ton pickup should have no problem towing 23k BUT the people that are asking the question you’re referring to want to know, will a 1 ton tow these 35k lbs trailers manufacturers are rating these days. The answer is yes BUT it’s not going to last long and without air brakes, there’s a safety factor The huge difference is that the Freightliner will to 20k all day everyday for 1 million miles and isn’t due for a major maintenance until 500k miles. The pickup will be in junkyard by 200k doing that same, all day everyday
This is also big on the price difference. Yes you will pay more now for that Freightliner, but when you think about the fact that the GMC will have to be replaced every few hundred thousand miles you'll save money with the bigger truck in the long run. $180,000 for I million miles $60,000 for 200,000 miles= $300,000 for I million.
Sure if you're doing it all day every day and not just a hobby/seasonal thing. Realistically a well equipped dually would be more than enough for the daily activities and how often out of all the miles you drive will it be in this extreme of a situation. I'll pocket the extra $100k+
Maybe if that pickup is a 6.0 or 6.4 but most other diesel pickups will go 3-400k before the junkyard. Rolling over 340k on my detroit and pops at 500k on his durumax. Price diff isn't worth it
I have to agree with the people saying their trucks are lasting 400k even when regularly hauling loads near their max. I’ve seen several survive that long myself. I haven’t owned one that long personally though, just acquaintances. 200k probably isn’t even the max for a gas truck now. Maybe 300k. Take care of them and they last a long, long time nowadays.
Andra and Mr. Truck work well together, You could even say they have some "chemistry" on camera. Great vid guys. Even though I will likely never want or need either of these trucks for myself I found the video interesting. Thanks for the great job.
@@MrChevystroker383 Yes, it does have an MPG readout. Fuel flow has been built into the engine electronics since the early 2000's. They probably didn't know how to access it. "Mr Truck" didn't even know what the regen button does since he gave some false "explanation" @18:45 about it having to do with the DEF fluid.
@@xNYCMarc well I've driven several recent model m2's and they dont have that feature. I own a 06 Columbia and it doesn't have that feature. So how do you access it? I've driven a 2018 cascadia day cab with the same cluster and it's not available on the cluster. There is a whole separate device for it on that truck that sits by the radio.
Mr Chevy Nova 6.0 Its accessed by pressing the trip button multiple times until “LEG” appears on the screen, then it will show MPG since the truck was last started. It only works on the rectangular, green dot-matrix displays and the new Cascadia grey screens. If your truck has the 7-segment lcd display, then it won’t work.
@@MrChevystroker383 Here is a video of a piece of shit 1998 Freightliner Century. You can see the MPG when the guy gets in the cab. ua-cam.com/video/3kEtBeECX8A/v-deo.html
Towing is the main reason I got the Eaton 10 speed on my new Pete 337. The Alison are great for dump trucks and around town trips but running down the road the 10 speed is king.
a Ford F450 would have been a better comparison with the Freightliner. The Duramax is "the War on Terror" engine going on since the 1980s tho but especially the last few years. Hard to beat a GM product at the moment tho I would agree.
I don’t know jack about towing but I’ve driven heavy duty pickups and freight liner M2s as ambulances and the freight liners are a dream to drive. They handle so much better, have better visibility, better turning radius, more realible, and more comfortable to drive.
It's not about paying for a more luxurious, more comfortable hauler; it's about how many times would you have to replace the GMC before having to replace the Freightliner.
Great review totally enjoyed it. I could never justify the money for the Freightliner. I had a heck of time getting the wife to let me upgrade to my GMC 1 ton SRW truck to tow our 5th wheel. Thanks for sharing Andre, Kent and TFL.
Maybe a lottery win would help you out and convince the wife to let you go bigger for better ride and handling and longer time on the road. But I should add your better of going with the more luxurious SportChassis over the commercial grade Summit Hauler trying to be a SC, both are around the same price and you get more with the SportChassis
So, the GMC was faster up the hill and only needed one brake application coming back down? Gotta say, a loaded dually pick-up makes more sense $ for $. Shoot, you could replace it three times before costing as much as that freightliner...
@@ianholt5138 Put a fresh water tank and chemical toilet in a semi, license it as an RV, done. I know many horse people who do it because it's much cheaper buying a 10 year old semi than a dually, and they cost less to run up and down the road.
Your videos and reviews are great. I liked how you called out the actual temperatures on the Freightliner. Please call out the actual temperatures of ALL the trucks you review. I have had my eyes on a Freightliner M2 for a while and will begin working on the Wife to get one.
Not understanding the purpose of trying a 2020 Freightliner vs not even best in class for 2017 Class 3 truck. Seems like a Ford F550 or Ram 5500 would have been a better comparison. Or, maybe the purpose was to sell trailers. ;)
I will also say that I think you guys did an honest review and a good job. Even though some of the commentary was from a lack of experience and actual knowledge or so it may seem. Sorry if I seem a bit harsh but I am a long haul truck driver (27+ years). I see to many people with these medium duty trucks that shouldn't be driving them. Not saying you guys. They have made this to of truck to drivable for the average person that doesn't have knowledge and skills to handle something of this size and the same applies to new or modern 18 wheelers. Just my opinion. Overall, good video.
You've had some great reviews and comparisons of specialty vehicles. Like to see how the Freight Shaker compares to an International like the 7400 4x4 with a Cummins. 7400 4x4 is used as a platform for overland builds in the US like the Unicat comfort and GVX. MAN TGM and Mercedes Benz Unimog aren't sold here so the 7400 fills in.
Trucks don’t interest me. Diesel trucks don’t interest me. Towing doesn’t interest me but I love watching your videos towing up & down Ike! It’s cool seeing trucks do what they’re designed to do.
@@hihaveaniceday9386 absolutely. I'd just like to see how the test would be when 2 trucks with virtually the same ratings but from different classes handle the loads. Of course the GMC would be pushing the limits of itself, and the Freightliner is probably under rated and under stressed, it would just be cool to see. I'm a big believer in buying a little more truck than you need, matching your ratings is one thing but having a truck that can do more than you need gives you more confidence and stops the white knuckle driving
@@matsherwood6277 actually if you think about the power each truck has and the engine size it's not bad. My semi would probably be 1mpg up that hill with a full load on
@@danatkinson6698 I don't consider anything down there to be real good fuel economy haha. Our sterling dump truck has a c12 cat. Gets like 4mpg pretty much regardless of the load I've heard. I guess it's all relative but I don't consider low single digits to be good fuel economy. Haha
The reason that the Freightliner is rated with less horsepower and not substantially more towing capacity than the Chevy is because its built to be worked at near 100% of its rating all day every day. The engine output and towing rating on modern "heavy duty" passenger trucks (really light duty in the grand scheme of things) are just advertising and penis measuring between the big 3 and are not really indicative of what the truck should be used for on a daily basis. Ratings on medium and heavy duty trucks are usually much more conservative since they may be loaded at or near those limits for most of the truck's life. I haven't looked recently, but I know that older versions of the Ford, Chevy and Cummins diesels were rated for lower output in the medium duty trucks than in the passenger trucks. I remember back when the Ford/Navistar 6.0L was still being used, the reliability of that engine in (unmodified) medium duty trucks was much better than in the F-series trucks, because they had a lower output rating. Durability is also a necessity since any breakdown or repair not only costs money to fix but will usually cost income due to the truck's downtime. Bigger displacement diesels (any many other that are for industrial use) are built for torque at low RPM, since that is what is needed to get a heavy load moving from a stop. Top speed and acceleration aren't as important, and keeping the engine speed low helps with durability. Are 1-ton passenger trucks technically capable of dragging that much weight up and down a hill? Yes. Should they be used for that purpose often? Certainly not. In perfect circumstances where everything is ideal, it will technically complete the task for life of the truck, although using it like that will make for a pretty short lifetime. In less than ideal circumstances or emergency situations, it will fail horribly. A trailer that size on a 1-ton truck will bully the truck all over the place. High wind? You're going on a white-knuckle ride all over the highway. Need to stop fast? Hope your trailer brakes are in amazing shape, because the truck isn't going to stop that much weight. Trailer brakes failed or just not that great? Hope there is a runaway truck ramp nearby. A medium or heavy duty truck will do fine under those circumstances, even when loaded to their rated limit. People seem to think that just because their truck has enough power to pull a load up to a certain speed that it is totally fine at that speed, but they don't seem to take into account what will happen when something unexpected occurs or how much stress they are really putting on the components of the truck by doing that. If you're only going to tow that much weight very occasionally, stick with a passenger truck. If you need to tow that much regularly, get a medium duty truck and tow that load safely and reliably. To the person who was comparing V8 vs I6 diesels, the I6 is probably a better choice for most truck applications since you want a lot of displacement per cylinder for low end torque. It also simplifies the intake, exhaust and turbo design. Most passenger truck diesels are V-engines for packaging reasons. I6 engines are hard to fit in a truck (or any other vehicle) unless it was designed for it (like the Dodges that put the radiator much further forward and have clearance specifically made in the firewall and cowling) In most cases, if a truck will fit a V8 gas engine lengthwise, it will fit a V8 diesel too.
Indeed... That brings up a good point.. Which felt more stable.. With the Much wider stance on the frightliner as well as being a good deal heavier... is then the Frightliner ( or class 5 truck in general ) better and safter for heavier hawling..especially on long distances ??
I have owned both and though the 3500's run strong and do everything very well..... The sense of security and braking power of the M2 alone is a world of difference in the two. The M2 with all the air ride equipment is a false sense of ride comfort because the trucks weight and rigid 110psi tires offer a harsh ride so the air ride has to absorb a lot of garbage thus making things feel "mushy" is a sense. If you absolutely need an M2 then it's a wise choice. Personally I prefer my 3500's for most basic 20k and under towing. Keep up the great videos!
I would like to have known with the fuel mileage was on the m2.. Also the price comparison is not really fair.. You got a base model 3500 dually up against a luxury model class 5. I'm certain you could get a cheaper version of that and you could probably pick one up used. and we all know which one is going to last longer and be easier to service out on the roads. Full access to all of the semi based truck stops and servicing for tires etc. I think if you were going to tow that trailer every once in a while you buy the 3500 Dually and if you're going to do it day-in and day-out you get the class 5. Great video guys
I will never understand horse people. That trailer costs more than my house. Edit: Thanks to everyone who chimed in to correct me. I used to haul horses for a breeder who was nothing but a rich kid playing with daddy's money. And I know a local guy who plays at being a rancher. He's actually a doctor who plays polo on the weekends. I guess I've just had bad luck meeting owners with less sense than their horses
It's a tax deduction. The horse activities are owned by a business that operates at a loss. Horse people pretty much exclusively do business with other horse people where/when they can. These trailers and trucks are baller for capital depreciation. If you want a solid truck, get a used horse trailer tow rig. They never mess with them and buy/sell often.
Luke NOPE !! ! Not all horse people, just a few that want a write off for a business !!!! You can get a good 3 horse trailer that will get the job done for 10 grand and you sure as hell do not need a 160,000 truck to pull em.......and REAL horse people would not drag that thing up a forest service road to ride in the mountains !!! That rig won;t fit in 99% of mountain campsites in a HORSE camp !!! Spent 30 years riding the mountains and never had a rig like that !!! Seen some idiots try to drag those up into a mountain camp and get hung up !! ! Those rigs are for the show snobs that "camp" in a flat parking lot at a horse show !!!
My house is $1,600,000.....Depends where you live in the Country and even so what type of house you have..people are all different income brackets.. Don't worry,I don't even own a new truck,nor a personal truck of my own(business has a few trucks I use when needed)..I do have 3 cars that are 2017 to current year but also 24 cars 1956-1972 (do own one 1978 one 1979).Car collector and restorer..
I was involved with a girl who was into paint horses. I got an interesting look into the world of show horses. The biggest take away from all the time Inwas involved? There are very few people who mess with horses who make money at it. Vices fund animals that cost a fortune to maintain and own.
@@BlueDually4x4 I've never seen tandom drives, but I have seen that set up with a single drive. However, I used the word "usually" in my original comment for that reason.
I’m pretty sure that the Allison 3200 and 3300 HD transmissions are actually a 10 speed transmission with it being displayed as a 6. Gears 1 and 2 have multiple gears in them, but aren’t noticeable when unladen or at higher accelerations. We run Peterbilt and Kenworth medium duty (337 and T370’s) with these transmissions, and you can feel some shifting in those gears when “crawling” (33K pound GVWR, running around 32K loaded weight driving up snowy driveways with chains on with the transmission locked in second gear) The regen switch is used when the truck needs to do a regen. You should get an alert on the dash when it needs one, then you pull over and switch it on. It should also do a passive regen when running down the highway, or even when stopped depending on exhaust temperatures. We ran a couple of M2’s back in the day. They were reliable mechanically. Electronics were garbage, interior fitment was poor at best and they were loud as all getup. Good to see that nothing has changed with them. Still even using the same gauges as our even older FL70 and FL80’s!
@ 16:00 Axle ratios. You can't consider axle ratios in isolation. The FL has much bigger tires on it. It needs a 4.33 axle to compensate for that alone. And the ISL revs out at 2,000 RPM whereas the Duramax revs out at 3500 RPM. The 4.33 axle ratio in the FL doesn't give it any sort of towing advantage, if that is what you are trying to infer.
R22.5 on the tyre means the rim size is 22.5inch not the overall tyre size. The overall tyre size would be 38.6 inches overall tyre size. :) Great video !!! Keep it up guys
They know that. What he meant by his "big truck size " comments was that the 22.5 nominal wheel diameter is the same as typical Class 6 and many heavy (Class 7 and Class 8) trucks.
There's just a few pre production models right now. The duallys aren't being mass produced yet so it doesn't suprize me that they couldn't get their hands on one.
They did in a video I just watched. The GMC got shamed by a Ford and Ram. Ford came in 1st, Ram 2nd and GM last. Ford for heavy hauling and GMC for little lawn mower trailers.
👏👏 for the GMC. Probably better fuel consumption empty, lower empty weight, best truck as a daily truck and 4WD. Could be interesting to know maintenance costs between both trucks.
Love my M2 even though it’s a standard cab, flatbed.... it does everything you need it to do. Dependable as can be. If running a company that pushes the ratings of F450-550, just make the jump and go with a real medium duty rig. I feel they’re more dependable than the offerings in lighter duty trucks.
I have heard that your standard cab will actually do more than a 4 door due to less weight on a shorter frame, shorter frame less likely to stress crack over time. Also you probably have allot better turning radius.?
@@neilhoogendoorn8045 it turns like my crew cab f450 which is definitely enough. You can turn around in a typical subdivision culdesac towing a 24’ tag trailer. It’s hard to beat that. My F250 doesn’t come close to a wide track steering system.
So I would need a CDL, have almost 30% more engine for hardly any more torque and less horsepwer, and not be able to park it as easily at the homestead when im home. Another thing they kind of glanced over was the fuel economy. They didn't seem to want to stay and how much fuel the Freightliner used to climb up that hill. I'm going to guarantee you it's a lot more than the GMC did and that's why it wasn't brought up. I think the Freightliner is a nice truck but I think the GMC honestly outclassed it as a working man's truck. Not to mention if you have a CDL you're going to drive a full-size truck and not a toy. If you don't have a CDL then you're going to need something like the GMC anyway. So it's sort of a stupid competition. And I really couldn't get over the fact that the GMC was a three-year-old model and they changed so much in 3 years. I don't think that was an accident. What I would like to see is that same Freightliner truck with the Detroit Diesel being compared to the Cummins version. That would be interesting to me.
@@ZachsAdventures290 Thats what I would have tbought. It's scary to think that just any weekend warrior would be out there Towing that kind of weight around.
I'll write the down... Just as soon as im done parking this medium class rig at Wal-Mart and walking to my home because it doesnt fit in my driveway. But, hey, I tow horses so I needed a plush Freightliner.
I think that part of the reason that the Freightliner held that hill going down a little better (0 brake application) than the GMC (one brake application) was that 4.33:1 rear end in the Freightliner VS the taller 3.73:1 GMC rear end. The shorter geared rear end of the Freightliner gives that drive train a better mechanical advantage.
Also, i bet the Freightliner is set up to kick in the JackBrake as soon as he let off the accelerator. Combine that with the Allison automatic downshifting to 4th on it's own, he didnt need to apply the service brake.
This is an add for a truck and trailer. By the way these combinations are in the commercial vehicle range. So one should have a CDL to operate. Might as well compare an ecoboost to a Peterbilt.
The gearing comparison is meaningless without also considering transmission gearing and tire diameter. The Freightliner's tires were taller, so it needs more rear axle gear reduction to get the same effect.
16:12 The difference may not be that great when you take into account the diameter of the tires, larger diameter tires on the freightliner will bring the effective drive ratio, engine speed at the same mph, closer together given the same transmission ratios.
Joel387 suzuki the 2020 duramax,in a regular cab,long bed, 2 wheel drive can pull 35,500 lbs. They have the highest available towing capacity in a 1 ton truck for the first time since the duramax was released. The brakes,suspension, and frame design was holding them back. The duramax has always been tit for tat, power wise,with dodge and Ford.
Joel387 suzuki the 2020 duramax,in a regular cab,long bed, 2 wheel drive can pull 35,500 lbs. They have the highest available towing capacity in a 1 ton truck for the first time since the duramax was released. The brakes,suspension, and frame design was holding them back. The duramax has always been tit for tat, power wise,with dodge and Ford.
Doug Deshawn just because the chevy doesn't have air brakes,doesn't mean it cant stop with a heavy load. I've driven medium duty trucks like the freightliner that had hydraulic, power assisted brakes,just like the GMC. The GMC brake system is not a typical hydraulic brake system, like a half ton truck has. They use hydraulic pressure, supplied by the power steering pump,to boost the brake pressure. A car or light duty pickup uses a vacuum operated booster. If a vehicle has a 35,000 tow capacity, it must be able to stop within a certain distance at the advertised load. Manufacturers dont just slap a number on a tag and say"this is what it will tow" they have to be able to comply with DOT regulations
@@andrewfarrell4312 yes but for how long being able to pull that much weight and being able to pull that much weight for two three four hundred thousand miles is two totally different things the old F250 could pull something like 15,000 pounds but after a while you got a death wobble I'm not condoning this overpriced Freightliner would you can get a truck that is built to pull 60000 pounds for $80,000 and still have two hundred and something thousand miles before you need to put any serious work into it and if you're going to be doing any really serious Long Haul your not sleeping legally in a dually unless you get a sleeper added
In heavy duty trucks, you never go uphill, pedal to the floor at a low rpm, you reduce speed to downshift and run high rpm at a slower speed for cooling purposes. And 22.5 represents a 22 inch rim , the .5 signifies tubeless. Same for 19.5 and 24.5.
@@truckerjoey407 "Semi" is a class designation for vehicle that is a tractor trailer combination vehicle. A cab and chasis can be a "Semi" from class 3 to class 8. The Freightliner and similar tractors are a different beast than a pickup. And will go a million or 2 miles in better shape than the Chevy. My people tow trailers way toooooo fast. The Freightliner will tow your 5th wheel "Mega" trailer more comfortably. But will not fit in the drive thru at Starbucks or McDonalds like a SRW Chevy, Ford , or Ram will.
ZXEJ Lol, all of the new OTR trucks start falling apart at 350K. Freightliners are the most reliable, then Volvo, then the Paccars, then International. You must not have much experience with a large fleet, body/interior wise they are all very chintzy.
@@BC08 All depends on what the fleet orders. Drove for C.R. England in 1994. Have driven various trucks since 1973 when I worked at a plant for truck bodies, roll offs, and trailers. Currently work for a City/County. Drive various trucks when the regular drivers are not a available. My pay class is 50% higher than a driver. I am still qualified as a driver. But certified in technical skills as my primary job. I had a 2006 Ford pickup throw a serpentine belt on Christmas Eve night. The vehicle had only 29k miles. But things rot from age. When I worked for CalTrans. My crew washed and checked all the trucks once a month. That way, the trucks used only on occasion. Were just as loved as the frequently used trucks. Take pride in your ride. Even if it belongs to someone else.
But let's be honest, the average guy/girl probably wouldn't get a brand new truck for work because they can pay off a used truck faster than a newer one
At 9:40 ish he talks about air density,and the air being thinner to where the engine does not make as much power. In a NA engine yes this is true,but this is a turbo engine,and at 11k feet this thing has no problem supplying the same amount of air as if it were at sea level. You will only start to see a diminish in power around 17k feet which we dont have mt. That high in the USA
So for 120,000 your telling me i can buy 2 chevy silverados i mean 2 silverados can tow as much as 50,000 pounds of cargo tpgeather witch means more towing then the one freight liner
Nobody turns around when you are driving the cheapo chevrolet,. they all turn around when you pull in with a freightliner, probably the biggest reason to get on is penis envy.
These GM 6.6 liter diesels are bulletproof! I saw a Gale Banks video where he pushed a stock engine with upgraded Turbos and software to over 1000 hp! Regarding the tow rating, the Toy hauler must be a "baby" big-rig, Freight-liner name and all. I remember asking the Trucking Manager at the company I used to work in many years ago (80's) what the max tow rating was. He said whatever the trailer would hold!, i.e. he towed oversize/permit loads etc some weighing 80,000 to 100,000 lbs, depending on the route and axle load limits. I doubt if they went even 65 mph dues to safety with those loads. 40,000 lbs was a "normal" non permit load. The most powerful big rig engines are 13 liters (and up, not 9 liters) as this video and have 2200 to 2500 ft-lbs of torque at 2,000 rpm!
You don't have to worry about burning that engine up with exhaust temps. In stock form the computer won't let it happen, I hate all the computer on newer diesels, but they needed them do to dumb asses that don't know how to drive and only know foot to the floor or idle.
I’ve put a LOT of miles on a freight shaker 😎. Of course a lot bigger than this one. It had a hole in the exhaust and when you flipped the jake brake it sounded like a machine gun going off. Lots of fun! I miss driving rigs
I tow a bumper hitch travel trailer with my 2000 international 4700. Oh so nice to drive. Rock solid, the only downside is the suspension is stiff. I just completed a cross country trip with my car. Hands down the International is more comfortable to drive. The down side my car was about 20 mph gas the international is 8 mpg diesel pulling a 10,000 lb. trailer. . My next cross country trip will be with the International.
Why not take something with more power for the 1 ton comparison, like the 1000 torque Ram 3500? i think then it would be neck and neck competition rather than an old GMC. But i guess the sponsor has to sell those big haulers right?!
Ok, you guys did a great job and made a great video, but you forgot to mention the mpg of the Freightliner M2 going uphill, and no comparison of the times were made. I believe the GMC had a better time going uphill, although it only got 3 MPG. I like the Freightliner better as well.
The Freightliner probably could have done noticeably better, but because of the custom grill, the air to air was starving for air, thus robbing it of power.
Just a heads up, those dual tank GMCs/Chevys have been having issues with their fuel tanks. For some reason, the truck at times will only take fuel from one tank and not the other. You could be going down the road and showing a half a tank on your gauge but your truck will still shut down. My company has had fuel issues with every dual tank Chevy that it has.
I think that if there is going to be a fair comparison. It should be with the same class trucks that are all the same year. GM has rereleased the 4500-6500 cab and chassis trucks. Compare that to the Ram 5500 and Ford F550. I understand that with a longer and wider wheel base, it will improve the handling and stability when towing. I enjoy the video reviews. Keep them coming.
Overall I think this was a valid comparison. I know you're trying to keep a consistent standard, but I own and tow with a very similar GMC 3500, Cruise control is your friend. No brake application required down hill and no fighting to maintain speed up hill (which both happened in this video). All the modern 1 ton trucks are designed with cruise control in mind to be used while towing. In my opinion your testing would better reflect real world and intended usage better if you would allow for cruise control to be used.
JMO but I tow with a "modern" truck (2016 F350 dually, 6.7, 3:73) ... cruise control going up the hill would have the engine screaming trying to keep 60 mph, it would probably go down to 3rd or 2nd!!. I go manual up a 7% grade and climb in 4th (sometimes 3rd) but mindful of keeping my RPMs no higher than 3500. Same going downhill ... manual and usually in 3rd or 4th at 3500 RPM. I have pulled the IKE and it's a tough pull, but I never "floor it" to climb any hill, that's too hard on MY EQUIPMENT.
These towing videos are the best. No one else comes even close!
Thanks
They have really improved, I enjoy them now.
@@kfstreich4787 Thanks
Agreed!
I agree but the guys voice is slowly braking me. Is he polish or somthing 😩
The Freightliner even though is 2020 model looks like it's 1998
Especially the gauge cluster. Frieghtliner has been using that gauge cluster since the early 2000s. Amazing how the small pickup truck companies get picked on about that s*** but the big truck companies haven't changed them in decades. That interior is outright outdated. Can we please get some new gauges?
Us truck drivers do not want anymore fancy electronic’s than we already have, for two reasons 1 the fancy shit breaks and is expensive to repair and takes far too long to repair ( wheels aren’t turning we’re not making money). We don’t care too much about looks, we need aerodynamics to get the best mpg we can get, everything else is second and third thought.
That dash isn’t Freightliner, at least not that Autozone lick and stick fake ass “ Wood” . That company bought what is called a “ rolling chassis”.
@@ashes2ashes863 dont change what's not broken right? If it works, it works.
@@ALMX5DP yeah I'm all for that generally speaking, and I do like Freightliners trucks a lot. They really are a good all-around product for a good price. It's just amazing to me that they literally haven't changed those in so long. Even if they just change the background color or something. It's almost like they're going for a record and not admitting it.
Kacper B that's why I hate them freightliners never update the inside
This was a great test guys. I own both a 1 ton diesel pickup, and a Freightliner like the one in the test. I have owned the FL (Freightliner) since 2001, and have worn out 4 pickups in that same amount of time. I can tow 900 miles before I need to refuel, the cab is a lot quieter then a pickup, there is so much more elbow room. The combination of air-ride suspension-cab-& seats lets you drive a lot further before you need a rest. There's no bucking or jerking motions while tow with the FL. On one trip, my trailer brakes were not working....I didn't even realize til the trip was over cause the truck could handle it! I'm on my 4th set of tires, but still on the OEM brakes. I have never had a "white-knuckle" ride, even driving in heavy downpours the truck feels planted to the ground. I set the cruise control at 1800RPM in 6th (about 62/63 MPH) and it holds it's speed even on the 7% climbs. Anyone on the fence with deciding between a pickup or an FL....The FL is well worth owning, cause besides many other reasons it will last you 20+ years!
Thanks, the M2 better insulated and much quieter than the old FL50 and 60
A 1-ton DRW is enough capability for the vast majority. A bigger medium duty hauler makes sense if you spend a lot of time on the road to where long haul comfort becomes a bigger deal. Driving all over the country in a pickup truck cab is a little tough to stay comfortable.
I think its a fair comparison. With trucks now up into the 20-30000lb capacities, if you're needing to regularly tow that weight, you should consider a true medium/heavy duty solution.
Everyone talking bout the freightliner being 180k, I'm looking at a motor less trailer thinking...how is that worth 162k?
RVs are usually cheap because they’re garbage. Properly fitting a space like that and installing technical components is expensive
That’s what I’m saying. I drive truck for a living. Mine peterbilt 579 80” bunk price $159k. Has bed refrigerator inverter for coffee pot. microwave. And I’ll yank that little trailer up that with my 565 hp Cummins 2250 torque. In other words kiss my butt freightliner
180K buy's you a million mile motor and a heaver truck. Heavy towing requires a heavy truck. It's not about towing but about stopping all that weight.
And you can sell/own them separately vs a motor home where you just take a beating
Ok, next do a video of the Ford F-650. VS the new Chevrolet 650.
I second that
Or either of those against the Freightliner. Be a more direct competitor that way.
Sooo shit vs shit?
@@mikeytoporchak3608 dodge fan i take it or aka CUMMINS which is not dodge lol take that away and nothing left of your junky dodge
Yes the new 2020 chevy medium duty trucks are wicked.
A 2020 loaded 180k Freightliner vs. a 5 year old stripped GMC. Might have been worthwhile using the new HD which can tow 10k more lbs.
G Man 2017 GMC wouldn't that be 3 years old fanboy 10 speed Is not going to make that big of a difference.
@@davidharris9259 yep my math was off, but it's a completely new truck. And the 10 spd would make a world of difference
@Mr Sunshines actually dummy, my point went right over your head. Using the completely redesigned 2020 HD would have been much more valid comparison. The latest Freightliner has to offer vs the latest GMC, is the extra 100k worth what you get out of a something specifically designed for hauling.
Y'all must forgot that Chevy makes a medium duty 5500 & up Silverado (KODIAK replacement) with live front axle and manual locking hubs but the DuraMax is detuned for longevity and you can look it up.
@@davidharris9259 are you slow? The 10 speed makes a major difference for towing, why do you think most semis have a 10 or 13 speed.
So what did we learn? Yes the 1 ton will tow and stop the load in relative comfort and ease. Yes the 1 ton cost less. Yes the 1 ton is simpler to drive and dont require a CDL. No it wont pull the same weight as the freightliner. No it wont do it day in and day out for 10 years. So if you are planning on pulling heavy very frequently over medium to long distances a TRUE medium duty truck is the ONLY way to go. Awesome video. Would love to see more medium duty stuff.
Thanks
He's right, the price here doesn't mean much if you're towing really heavy stuff all the time. The confidence he mentioned cannot be overstated. The Freightliner will hold a grade better, won't break down after 20 steep grades, has MUCH better brakes, air ride (it's not a luxury item if you're doing long haul, it's mandatory), and likely get better fuel mileage.
You could very likely spec out one of these M2s with less luxury for a lot less money. Just be careful of the CDL requirement, laws (and tickets) are much more strict for CDL holders.
What this test really shows is that the newer one ton dually trucks are capable of medium duty level work when needed. An actual medium duty does the job better overall, but the daily driver one ton can do it. Running a 6.6L with a 3.73 gear against a 9L with a 4.33 gear and the 6.6L handles the job well. Cool video to watch. Thank you.
I would have lost the bet cuz I would have bet on the FL.
You gotta consider the difference in weight and tire sizes between the two. People get stuck on 4.33 vs 3.73. You’d have to consider the final ratio of all of that to the ground. In the end, I’d take the FL. The handling, braking, and interior space is a major plus for me.
It is pointless to compare axle ratios without also comparing transmission ratios (different, because they are different transmissions) and tire diameters.
Freightliner and luxury should never be used in the same sentence...
That's a custom high end conversion on the FL. They start around 75K.
A truck is destined to work, haul sh#t, move sh#t, and shouldn’t cost a sh#t ton of money up front.
Michael Benoit you’re allowed to curse in the internet buddy
although Pete and KW truly are.
Have you ever heard of Western Star?
You guys really should use the cruise control. That's factored into the engine's algorithm to make sure the driving experience is optimized. If you want to stay at 50, set it to 50 and see what happens with the exhaust brake and the grade shifting. The trucks aren't designed to guess, so when you press the brake it's going to keep slowing until you have to step on it again just like the GMC did. If you tell it what to maintain, it'll maintain it. I think using the cruise control down the mountain would change the scoring technique completely. Don't use it uphill because you have to navigate traffic and stay safe, but nobody will complain about somebody going 50-ish down the mountain with a giant trailer. Everybody likes safety.
Heck even my 1/2 ton pickup knows to downshift itself going down a hill with the cruise control set, it just does what it needs to maintain whatever speed you tell it to maintain, rather than riding the brakes down the hill the truck maintains speed with the transmission like its designed to do....and my truck is a 2008 Toyota Tundra. I think even my grandfather's 2005 Tundra does that as well, I haven't towed with it so I'm not sure how responsive it is compared to the 08.
@@wildbill23c heck, even late 80's and early 90's Toyota's do this.
when you test the 10 speed diesels plz keep a camera constant on the gauges when you start up the hill, even if its a 1/4 size in the corner
I'll take the FLD with the Cummins Jake brake 10 speed roadRanger 390 rears on air ride. Low pro 22.5 tires on Alcoa aluminum. All around even trailer.
Should get 10 mpg.needs 2 100 gal fuel tank. full fithwheel hitch. Standard 7way trailer plug. True air disc brakes all around .
I love that you guys get your hands on these things for real world tests and actually show us. Unlike TV and magazines which are like "here's the technical specs and our biased opinion based only on the specs and politics." I'm waiting patiently for 6.6 gas vs. 7.3 gas, and if it happened with like a big truckbed camper, that'd be pretty cool. Like a "Payload Ike"
This is like comparing a ford ranger to a duramax
The idea of it was to see if you needed such overkill.
@@cameron-w you don't "need" overkill so that statement doesn't really make sense.
tyler bonser True. I was just trying to have it make more sense.
It's nice to see you guys reviewing bigger trucks now. I know it wasn't a super ike test but I'd like to see that someday soon. I'd also like to see what this fancy m2 would be like compared to a used semi truck. Figure a 60k used semi with double bunks, an automatic just to keep things equal (although I'd prefer the semi to have a manual). If you want give me a holler and I'll drive my combination unit out to test against
We had a FL Sports Chassis back in 2007 and just loved it. Wish we still had it!! Definitely effortless towing!
If you cruize control down the ike in the Duramax, it will keep you at 50mph exactly the whole way.
Trevor Story The test here seems to suggest other than what you claimed. My guess is that the exhaust brake is not strong enough to regulate the downhill speed in 5th gear. But when it downshifted to 4th, the engine RPM at 50 mph was higher than GM wants the engine to experience. So, the speed the Duramax maintained here was a bit slower than the target 50 (~45mph). For 2020, this issue might be largely remedied by the new 10 speed transmission.
@18:45 The re-gen has absolutely nothing to do with DEF fluid. Re-gen is part of the particulate filter. Normally the heat of highway driving keeps the filter clean, but if you do a lot of in-town driving or low speed driving the filter might not ever get hot enough and it will start to clog. The regen button starts a manual cleaning cycle. It takes around 45 minutes and the vehicle can't be driven while the regen is running.
And DEF is consumed during the Regen
Chris Conway Yes, anytime the engine is running DEF is being dosed into the exhaust stream.
A 1 ton pickup should have no problem towing 23k BUT the people that are asking the question you’re referring to want to know, will a 1 ton tow these 35k lbs trailers manufacturers are rating these days. The answer is yes BUT it’s not going to last long and without air brakes, there’s a safety factor
The huge difference is that the Freightliner will to 20k all day everyday for 1 million miles and isn’t due for a major maintenance until 500k miles. The pickup will be in junkyard by 200k doing that same, all day everyday
This is also big on the price difference. Yes you will pay more now for that Freightliner, but when you think about the fact that the GMC will have to be replaced every few hundred thousand miles you'll save money with the bigger truck in the long run. $180,000 for I million miles
$60,000 for 200,000 miles= $300,000 for I million.
Sure if you're doing it all day every day and not just a hobby/seasonal thing. Realistically a well equipped dually would be more than enough for the daily activities and how often out of all the miles you drive will it be in this extreme of a situation. I'll pocket the extra $100k+
Maybe if that pickup is a 6.0 or 6.4 but most other diesel pickups will go 3-400k before the junkyard. Rolling over 340k on my detroit and pops at 500k on his durumax. Price diff isn't worth it
I have to agree with the people saying their trucks are lasting 400k even when regularly hauling loads near their max. I’ve seen several survive that long myself. I haven’t owned one that long personally though, just acquaintances. 200k probably isn’t even the max for a gas truck now. Maybe 300k. Take care of them and they last a long, long time nowadays.
Andra and Mr. Truck work well together, You could even say they have some "chemistry" on camera. Great vid guys. Even though I will likely never want or need either of these trucks for myself I found the video interesting. Thanks for the great job.
Thanks
Who is this Andra? It's Andre.
You guys didn’t say anything about the fuel mileage on the Freightliner going up the hill. What’s up with that?
That over expensive basic ass luxury truck doesn't have any kind of info display on the dash only a trip meter for miles driven 🤨.
@@MrChevystroker383 Yes, it does have an MPG readout. Fuel flow has been built into the engine electronics since the early 2000's. They probably didn't know how to access it. "Mr Truck" didn't even know what the regen button does since he gave some false "explanation" @18:45 about it having to do with the DEF fluid.
@@xNYCMarc well I've driven several recent model m2's and they dont have that feature. I own a 06 Columbia and it doesn't have that feature. So how do you access it? I've driven a 2018 cascadia day cab with the same cluster and it's not available on the cluster. There is a whole separate device for it on that truck that sits by the radio.
Mr Chevy Nova 6.0 Its accessed by pressing the trip button multiple times until “LEG” appears on the screen, then it will show MPG since the truck was last started. It only works on the rectangular, green dot-matrix displays and the new Cascadia grey screens. If your truck has the 7-segment lcd display, then it won’t work.
@@MrChevystroker383 Here is a video of a piece of shit 1998 Freightliner Century. You can see the MPG when the guy gets in the cab. ua-cam.com/video/3kEtBeECX8A/v-deo.html
Towing is the main reason I got the Eaton 10 speed on my new Pete 337. The Alison are great for dump trucks and around town trips but running down the road the 10 speed is king.
Such a shame you guys couldn’t get the new GMC 3500 with the 10 speed
We will later this year!
a Ford F450 would have been a better comparison with the Freightliner. The Duramax is "the War on Terror" engine going on since the 1980s tho but especially the last few years. Hard to beat a GM product at the moment tho I would agree.
Really glad yall compared the 2 trucks. To me is not worth spending 100k more when it cant perform any better than a regular 1 ton.
And it's 4WD which you can go off roading and camping, and it's small enough to use it as a daily driver and go to downtown and shopping centers!
I like my M2 over my old 1ton hot shot, the difference in pulling and stopping is unbelievable, only thing better is my new T680
I don’t know jack about towing but I’ve driven heavy duty pickups and freight liner M2s as ambulances and the freight liners are a dream to drive. They handle so much better, have better visibility, better turning radius, more realible, and more comfortable to drive.
It's not about paying for a more luxurious, more comfortable hauler; it's about how many times would you have to replace the GMC before having to replace the Freightliner.
Great review totally enjoyed it. I could never justify the money for the Freightliner. I had a heck of time getting the wife to let me upgrade to my GMC 1 ton SRW truck to tow our 5th wheel. Thanks for sharing Andre, Kent and TFL.
You're welcome
Maybe a lottery win would help you out and convince the wife to let you go bigger for better ride and handling and longer time on the road. But I should add your better of going with the more luxurious SportChassis over the commercial grade Summit Hauler trying to be a SC, both are around the same price and you get more with the SportChassis
So, the GMC was faster up the hill and only needed one brake application coming back down? Gotta say, a loaded dually pick-up makes more sense $ for $. Shoot, you could replace it three times before costing as much as that freightliner...
But you could get a used class 8 that will tow 60,000lb for around $80,000
FL Mark 2 106's start around 75000...pretty close to an F550 or Silverado 5500. No RV conversion at that price.
@@ianholt5138
Put a fresh water tank and chemical toilet in a semi, license it as an RV, done. I know many horse people who do it because it's much cheaper buying a 10 year old semi than a dually, and they cost less to run up and down the road.
And it's 4WD which you can go off roading and camping, and it's small enough to use it as a daily driver and go to downtown and shopping centers!
Your videos and reviews are great. I liked how you called out the actual temperatures on the Freightliner. Please call out the actual temperatures of ALL the trucks you review. I have had my eyes on a Freightliner M2 for a while and will begin working on the Wife to get one.
Not understanding the purpose of trying a 2020 Freightliner vs not even best in class for 2017 Class 3 truck. Seems like a Ford F550 or Ram 5500 would have been a better comparison. Or, maybe the purpose was to sell trailers. ;)
I will also say that I think you guys did an honest review and a good job. Even though some of the commentary was from a lack of experience and actual knowledge or so it may seem. Sorry if I seem a bit harsh but I am a long haul truck driver (27+ years). I see to many people with these medium duty trucks that shouldn't be driving them. Not saying you guys. They have made this to of truck to drivable for the average person that doesn't have knowledge and skills to handle something of this size and the same applies to new or modern 18 wheelers. Just my opinion.
Overall, good video.
You've had some great reviews and comparisons of specialty vehicles. Like to see how the Freight Shaker compares to an International like the 7400 4x4 with a Cummins. 7400 4x4 is used as a platform for overland builds in the US like the Unicat comfort and GVX. MAN TGM and Mercedes Benz Unimog aren't sold here so the 7400 fills in.
I love TFL truck. You guys give us such great content! Thanks
That Freightliner would be a sweet daily driver!
I think you gentleman are responsible for many M2 sales. Great work!
I wish you could get a 6.7 Cummins with an Allison transmission in a 2500 or 3500 truck from a dealership. That is the perfect combo!
You can but it's spelled Aisin =P
Why when a duramax an allison always win
Trucks don’t interest me. Diesel trucks don’t interest me. Towing doesn’t interest me but I love watching your videos towing up & down Ike! It’s cool seeing trucks do what they’re designed to do.
You drive a Prius?
Redo this again with a 2020 GMC dually and see how it goes. The tow ratings on the truck and semi then are basically the same then
Power and tow rating might be the same but not the stoping slower , stoping power is as important as anything
@@hihaveaniceday9386 absolutely. I'd just like to see how the test would be when 2 trucks with virtually the same ratings but from different classes handle the loads. Of course the GMC would be pushing the limits of itself, and the Freightliner is probably under rated and under stressed, it would just be cool to see. I'm a big believer in buying a little more truck than you need, matching your ratings is one thing but having a truck that can do more than you need gives you more confidence and stops the white knuckle driving
Love these towing reviews. Andre and Mr. Truck make a great team!
Thanks
I wonder what the fuel economy on the big Freightliner was
Tyler Proud agree, wish they would of said
The truck more than likely didn't have that information to show on the dash like the gmc did. Mpg was probably worse than the gmc though
Not good.
@@matsherwood6277 actually if you think about the power each truck has and the engine size it's not bad. My semi would probably be 1mpg up that hill with a full load on
@@danatkinson6698 I don't consider anything down there to be real good fuel economy haha. Our sterling dump truck has a c12 cat. Gets like 4mpg pretty much regardless of the load I've heard. I guess it's all relative but I don't consider low single digits to be good fuel economy. Haha
The reason that the Freightliner is rated with less horsepower and not substantially more towing capacity than the Chevy is because its built to be worked at near 100% of its rating all day every day. The engine output and towing rating on modern "heavy duty" passenger trucks (really light duty in the grand scheme of things) are just advertising and penis measuring between the big 3 and are not really indicative of what the truck should be used for on a daily basis. Ratings on medium and heavy duty trucks are usually much more conservative since they may be loaded at or near those limits for most of the truck's life. I haven't looked recently, but I know that older versions of the Ford, Chevy and Cummins diesels were rated for lower output in the medium duty trucks than in the passenger trucks. I remember back when the Ford/Navistar 6.0L was still being used, the reliability of that engine in (unmodified) medium duty trucks was much better than in the F-series trucks, because they had a lower output rating. Durability is also a necessity since any breakdown or repair not only costs money to fix but will usually cost income due to the truck's downtime. Bigger displacement diesels (any many other that are for industrial use) are built for torque at low RPM, since that is what is needed to get a heavy load moving from a stop. Top speed and acceleration aren't as important, and keeping the engine speed low helps with durability. Are 1-ton passenger trucks technically capable of dragging that much weight up and down a hill? Yes. Should they be used for that purpose often? Certainly not. In perfect circumstances where everything is ideal, it will technically complete the task for life of the truck, although using it like that will make for a pretty short lifetime. In less than ideal circumstances or emergency situations, it will fail horribly. A trailer that size on a 1-ton truck will bully the truck all over the place. High wind? You're going on a white-knuckle ride all over the highway. Need to stop fast? Hope your trailer brakes are in amazing shape, because the truck isn't going to stop that much weight. Trailer brakes failed or just not that great? Hope there is a runaway truck ramp nearby. A medium or heavy duty truck will do fine under those circumstances, even when loaded to their rated limit. People seem to think that just because their truck has enough power to pull a load up to a certain speed that it is totally fine at that speed, but they don't seem to take into account what will happen when something unexpected occurs or how much stress they are really putting on the components of the truck by doing that.
If you're only going to tow that much weight very occasionally, stick with a passenger truck. If you need to tow that much regularly, get a medium duty truck and tow that load safely and reliably.
To the person who was comparing V8 vs I6 diesels, the I6 is probably a better choice for most truck applications since you want a lot of displacement per cylinder for low end torque. It also simplifies the intake, exhaust and turbo design. Most passenger truck diesels are V-engines for packaging reasons. I6 engines are hard to fit in a truck (or any other vehicle) unless it was designed for it (like the Dodges that put the radiator much further forward and have clearance specifically made in the firewall and cowling) In most cases, if a truck will fit a V8 gas engine lengthwise, it will fit a V8 diesel too.
Mr. Truck keep your rig within the white lines. You were swerving all over the place!
Indeed...
That brings up a good point..
Which felt more stable..
With the Much wider stance on the frightliner as well as being a good deal heavier... is then the Frightliner ( or class 5 truck in general ) better and safter for heavier hawling..especially on long distances ??
MrBOB39 class 5 and up feel less stable then 1 Tontrucks because of the air ride cabs.
@@curtisnoble. Nah air ride cab (and seat) just means you and your coffee are bouncing. The chassis is still planted on the ground and stable.
I believe it's because he's driving with both hands on the wheel. In my experience, it causes the driver to constantly. correct back and forth.
I used to drive these M2's for work. You constantly battle the wheel. It feels like you're driving on marshmallow. Lol
I have owned both and though the 3500's run strong and do everything very well..... The sense of security and braking power of the M2 alone is a world of difference in the two. The M2 with all the air ride equipment is a false sense of ride comfort because the trucks weight and rigid 110psi tires offer a harsh ride so the air ride has to absorb a lot of garbage thus making things feel "mushy" is a sense. If you absolutely need an M2 then it's a wise choice. Personally I prefer my 3500's for most basic 20k and under towing. Keep up the great videos!
I would like to have known with the fuel mileage was on the m2..
Also the price comparison is not really fair..
You got a base model 3500 dually up against a luxury model class 5.
I'm certain you could get a cheaper version of that and you could probably pick one up used.
and we all know which one is going to last longer and be easier to service out on the roads.
Full access to all of the semi based truck stops and servicing for tires etc.
I think if you were going to tow that trailer every once in a while you buy the 3500 Dually and if you're going to do it day-in and day-out you get the class 5.
Great video guys
Andre is one of my favorite reviewers on TFL. I’m glad TFL doesn’t pretend he doesn’t speak English.
I will never understand horse people. That trailer costs more than my house.
Edit: Thanks to everyone who chimed in to correct me. I used to haul horses for a breeder who was nothing but a rich kid playing with daddy's money. And I know a local guy who plays at being a rancher. He's actually a doctor who plays polo on the weekends. I guess I've just had bad luck meeting owners with less sense than their horses
It is millionaires that own these not normal people like myself with horses as not very many are going to have $250,000 for a truck/trailer.
It's a tax deduction. The horse activities are owned by a business that operates at a loss. Horse people pretty much exclusively do business with other horse people where/when they can. These trailers and trucks are baller for capital depreciation. If you want a solid truck, get a used horse trailer tow rig. They never mess with them and buy/sell often.
Luke NOPE !! ! Not all horse people, just a few that want a write off for a business !!!! You can get a good 3 horse trailer that will get the job done for 10 grand and you sure as hell do not need a 160,000 truck to pull em.......and REAL horse people would not drag that thing up a forest service road to ride in the mountains !!! That rig won;t fit in 99% of mountain campsites in a HORSE camp !!! Spent 30 years riding the mountains and never had a rig like that !!! Seen some idiots try to drag those up into a mountain camp and get hung up !! ! Those rigs are for the show snobs that "camp" in a flat parking lot at a horse show !!!
My house is $1,600,000.....Depends where you live in the Country and even so what type of house you have..people are all different income brackets..
Don't worry,I don't even own a new truck,nor a personal truck of my own(business has a few trucks I use when needed)..I do have 3 cars that are 2017 to current year but also 24 cars 1956-1972 (do own one 1978 one 1979).Car collector and restorer..
I was involved with a girl who was into paint horses. I got an interesting look into the world of show horses. The biggest take away from all the time Inwas involved? There are very few people who mess with horses who make money at it. Vices fund animals that cost a fortune to maintain and own.
Just drove down the Ike in a 28 foot Class A RV. It was fun. Got to experience the terror.
Can we stop calling that freightliner a semi. It's not. It's a medium duty truck usually used at a box truck by companies like Ryder or Penske.
Actually you can get the M2 cab with tandem drives and a 5th wheel hitch rated at 80,000 pounds.
@@BlueDually4x4 I've never seen tandom drives, but I have seen that set up with a single drive. However, I used the word "usually" in my original comment for that reason.
BlueDually4x4 yup that was my first truck at my current job m2 with 3 axels
Nate Quickmire I’ve seen many M2s 3 axles. Usually for local deliveries. Or regional,
But its got a semi body
I’m pretty sure that the Allison 3200 and 3300 HD transmissions are actually a 10 speed transmission with it being displayed as a 6. Gears 1 and 2 have multiple gears in them, but aren’t noticeable when unladen or at higher accelerations. We run Peterbilt and Kenworth medium duty (337 and T370’s) with these transmissions, and you can feel some shifting in those gears when “crawling” (33K pound GVWR, running around 32K loaded weight driving up snowy driveways with chains on with the transmission locked in second gear)
The regen switch is used when the truck needs to do a regen. You should get an alert on the dash when it needs one, then you pull over and switch it on. It should also do a passive regen when running down the highway, or even when stopped depending on exhaust temperatures.
We ran a couple of M2’s back in the day. They were reliable mechanically. Electronics were garbage, interior fitment was poor at best and they were loud as all getup. Good to see that nothing has changed with them. Still even using the same gauges as our even older FL70 and FL80’s!
The hat rack sold me! 😂
@ 16:00 Axle ratios. You can't consider axle ratios in isolation. The FL has much bigger tires on it. It needs a 4.33 axle to compensate for that alone. And the ISL revs out at 2,000 RPM whereas the Duramax revs out at 3500 RPM. The 4.33 axle ratio in the FL doesn't give it any sort of towing advantage, if that is what you are trying to infer.
I want to see more medium duty truck videos. Some of them in the used market are really close to a heavy duty pickup in price.
Mr Truck is BACK
What an awesome comparison! Maybe for a future shootout you could do a Cushman Truckster against a Kenworth W900.
So a Cushman Truckster has a 35-ton GCWR, to compare against the 40-ton W900? No, didn't think so. These trucks are reasonably close in capacity.
These towing videos are the best. No one comes close
I like the bed in the back of that Freightliner.
R22.5 on the tyre means the rim size is 22.5inch not the overall tyre size. The overall tyre size would be 38.6 inches overall tyre size. :) Great video !!! Keep it up guys
They know that. What he meant by his "big truck size " comments was that the 22.5 nominal wheel diameter is the same as typical Class 6 and many heavy (Class 7 and Class 8) trucks.
You seriously couldn’t use the brand new gmc dually with the 10 speed!!!
There's just a few pre production models right now. The duallys aren't being mass produced yet so it doesn't suprize me that they couldn't get their hands on one.
NicT09 they are not available for any one to test yet
They did in a video I just watched. The GMC got shamed by a Ford and Ram. Ford came in 1st, Ram 2nd and GM last. Ford for heavy hauling and GMC for little lawn mower trailers.
The 9L is a nice options for the Freightliner. Most non commercial M series come with a 6.7L Cummins.
👏👏 for the GMC. Probably better fuel consumption empty, lower empty weight, best truck as a daily truck and 4WD. Could be interesting to know maintenance costs between both trucks.
Best channel in the world ⛽️⛽️⛽️
Finally a dually vs semi ⛽️
SUMMARY-= THE 200K TRUCK SUMMITED AT 35MPH AND THE CHEAP CHEVY SUMMITED AT 43MPH. !!!!!!!!!!!!!! GOOOOOO CHEVY
Gooo Chevyyyy!
Straight to the junkyaaaaard!
@@calculator5909 thats because the medium duty and heavy duty trucks are Derated in HP to improve longevity of the engines. 500k to 1 million miles.
@@southpaw9339 The ISL in the frieghtliner was rated at 350/1150. You can get 450/1250. The GM was 445/910.
Calculator ew confederate flag 🤮
I've never seen someone so excited making a circle before.
Love my M2 even though it’s a standard cab, flatbed.... it does everything you need it to do. Dependable as can be. If running a company that pushes the ratings of F450-550, just make the jump and go with a real medium duty rig. I feel they’re more dependable than the offerings in lighter duty trucks.
I have heard that your standard cab will actually do more than a 4 door due to less weight on a shorter frame, shorter frame less likely to stress crack over time. Also you probably have allot better turning radius.?
@@neilhoogendoorn8045 it turns like my crew cab f450 which is definitely enough. You can turn around in a typical subdivision culdesac towing a 24’ tag trailer. It’s hard to beat that. My F250 doesn’t come close to a wide track steering system.
You guys are the biggest names in truck reviews
So I would need a CDL, have almost 30% more engine for hardly any more torque and less horsepwer, and not be able to park it as easily at the homestead when im home. Another thing they kind of glanced over was the fuel economy. They didn't seem to want to stay and how much fuel the Freightliner used to climb up that hill. I'm going to guarantee you it's a lot more than the GMC did and that's why it wasn't brought up. I think the Freightliner is a nice truck but I think the GMC honestly outclassed it as a working man's truck. Not to mention if you have a CDL you're going to drive a full-size truck and not a toy. If you don't have a CDL then you're going to need something like the GMC anyway. So it's sort of a stupid competition. And I really couldn't get over the fact that the GMC was a three-year-old model and they changed so much in 3 years. I don't think that was an accident. What I would like to see is that same Freightliner truck with the Detroit Diesel being compared to the Cummins version. That would be interesting to me.
You need a CDL to drive the Sierra in that setup.
Not to mention an extra $100,000
@@ZachsAdventures290 Thats what I would have tbought. It's scary to think that just any weekend warrior would be out there Towing that kind of weight around.
I'll write the down... Just as soon as im done parking this medium class rig at Wal-Mart and walking to my home because it doesnt fit in my driveway. But, hey, I tow horses so I needed a plush Freightliner.
@Mr Sunshines you must be jobless worthless hill Billy all you do is comment on everyone else's shit get a damn job erka durka
I think that part of the reason that the Freightliner held that hill going down a little better (0 brake application) than the GMC (one brake application) was that 4.33:1 rear end in the Freightliner VS the taller 3.73:1 GMC rear end. The shorter geared rear end of the Freightliner gives that drive train a better mechanical advantage.
Also, i bet the Freightliner is set up to kick in the JackBrake as soon as he let off the accelerator. Combine that with the Allison automatic downshifting to 4th on it's own, he didnt need to apply the service brake.
This is an add for a truck and trailer. By the way these combinations are in the commercial vehicle range. So one should have a CDL to operate. Might as well compare an ecoboost to a Peterbilt.
Yeah but the gearing in the Trans makes up for it. I feel like the higher ratio rear ends only benefit from stop starts
The gearing comparison is meaningless without also considering transmission gearing and tire diameter. The Freightliner's tires were taller, so it needs more rear axle gear reduction to get the same effect.
@@crazyeyez1502 he manually turned on the compression-release ("Jake") brake.
I mistaken this as a comparison but it was an advertisement. :-(
16:12
The difference may not be that great when you take into account the diameter of the tires, larger diameter tires on the freightliner will bring the effective drive ratio, engine speed at the same mph, closer together given the same transmission ratios.
Not so far. If they used a 2020 GMC Sierra 3500 it can actually tow more then the freightliner at 35,000 lbs. Re do this one with the new 3500.
lol really bud get your facts straight
Joel387 suzuki the 2020 duramax,in a regular cab,long bed, 2 wheel drive can pull 35,500 lbs. They have the highest available towing capacity in a 1 ton truck for the first time since the duramax was released. The brakes,suspension, and frame design was holding them back. The duramax has always been tit for tat, power wise,with dodge and Ford.
Joel387 suzuki the 2020 duramax,in a regular cab,long bed, 2 wheel drive can pull 35,500 lbs. They have the highest available towing capacity in a 1 ton truck for the first time since the duramax was released. The brakes,suspension, and frame design was holding them back. The duramax has always been tit for tat, power wise,with dodge and Ford.
Doug Deshawn just because the chevy doesn't have air brakes,doesn't mean it cant stop with a heavy load. I've driven medium duty trucks like the freightliner that had hydraulic, power assisted brakes,just like the GMC. The GMC brake system is not a typical hydraulic brake system, like a half ton truck has. They use hydraulic pressure, supplied by the power steering pump,to boost the brake pressure. A car or light duty pickup uses a vacuum operated booster.
If a vehicle has a 35,000 tow capacity, it must be able to stop within a certain distance at the advertised load. Manufacturers dont just slap a number on a tag and say"this is what it will tow" they have to be able to comply with DOT regulations
@@andrewfarrell4312 yes but for how long being able to pull that much weight and being able to pull that much weight for two three four hundred thousand miles is two totally different things the old F250 could pull something like 15,000 pounds but after a while you got a death wobble I'm not condoning this overpriced Freightliner would you can get a truck that is built to pull 60000 pounds for $80,000 and still have two hundred and something thousand miles before you need to put any serious work into it and if you're going to be doing any really serious Long Haul your not sleeping legally in a dually unless you get a sleeper added
Great videos! Love the straight forward head to head tests! Thanks for sharing
Love your videos. Question though, aren't the big three's offerings of chassis cab configurations equipped with de-rated engines?
Only ford and ram detunes their chassis cab. The chevy and GMC retain full power.
No they don't. GM retains full power in the 3500 chassis cab.
All class 4,5, and 6 trucks from all 3 manufacturers are detuned
In heavy duty trucks, you never go uphill, pedal to the floor at a low rpm, you reduce speed to downshift and run high rpm at a slower speed for cooling purposes. And 22.5 represents a 22 inch rim , the .5 signifies tubeless. Same for 19.5 and 24.5.
Why is the comparison done between a 2020 Freightliner a 2017 duramax? Why can’t it be down with a 2020 Duramax.
Why are we comparing a Class 5 Truck vs Class 3? One clearly is better. It's like comparing a freaking Semi to a Ford Ranger.
It is not a semi
@@truckerjoey407 "Semi" is a class designation for vehicle that is a tractor trailer combination vehicle. A cab and chasis can be a "Semi" from class 3 to class 8. The Freightliner and similar tractors are a different beast than a pickup. And will go a million or 2 miles in better shape than the Chevy. My people tow trailers way toooooo fast. The Freightliner will tow your 5th wheel "Mega" trailer more comfortably. But will not fit in the drive thru at Starbucks or McDonalds like a SRW Chevy, Ford , or Ram will.
ZXEJ Lol, all of the new OTR trucks start falling apart at 350K. Freightliners are the most reliable, then Volvo, then the Paccars, then International. You must not have much experience with a large fleet, body/interior wise they are all very chintzy.
@@BC08 All depends on what the fleet orders. Drove for C.R. England in 1994. Have driven various trucks since 1973 when I worked at a plant for truck bodies, roll offs, and trailers. Currently work for a City/County. Drive various trucks when the regular drivers are not a available. My pay class is 50% higher than a driver. I am still qualified as a driver. But certified in technical skills as my primary job. I had a 2006 Ford pickup throw a serpentine belt on Christmas Eve night. The vehicle had only 29k miles. But things rot from age. When I worked for CalTrans. My crew washed and checked all the trucks once a month. That way, the trucks used only on occasion. Were just as loved as the frequently used trucks. Take pride in your ride. Even if it belongs to someone else.
For someone from Blighty 🇬🇧 can I add, the scenery was stunningly amazing 😉 👍👍👍👍
Did I hear him say 2017 GMC. A lot changed since then.
Don't think that much would have changed for the chassis cab
@@minhajsyed9874 10 speed
Really? The inside looks the same, power is the same just I diff tranny and sheet metal
But let's be honest, the average guy/girl probably wouldn't get a brand new truck for work because they can pay off a used truck faster than a newer one
Michael Teeple kind of a low budget whatever we could get to test to show off their new 2000
Good to see our Freightliner truck on there. We build it. And the Mount Holly plant in North Carolina.
I'd take the gmc
At 9:40 ish he talks about air density,and the air being thinner to where the engine does not make as much power. In a NA engine yes this is true,but this is a turbo engine,and at 11k feet this thing has no problem supplying the same amount of air as if it were at sea level. You will only start to see a diminish in power around 17k feet which we dont have mt. That high in the USA
MPG on the 9.0 Cummins ? The hill climb speeds were basically equal. I'd spend the $60,000 vs. $170,000. Maybe no MPG on the trucks computer? LOL
So for 120,000 your telling me i can buy 2 chevy silverados i mean 2 silverados can tow as much as 50,000 pounds of cargo tpgeather witch means more towing then the one freight liner
@@jackdaniels2657 no a freightliner can haul over 80k
@@codyceynar2041 but he said this one in particular wasnt able to tow 80,000
@@codyceynar2041 im comparing price for price. If u bought 2 silverados for 160,000 you will be able to tow 60 thousand pounds combined.
Nobody turns around when you are driving the cheapo chevrolet,. they all turn around when you pull in with a freightliner, probably the biggest reason to get on is penis envy.
These GM 6.6 liter diesels are bulletproof! I saw a Gale Banks video where he pushed a stock engine with upgraded Turbos and software to over 1000 hp! Regarding the tow rating, the Toy hauler must be a "baby" big-rig, Freight-liner name and all. I remember asking the Trucking Manager at the company I used to work in many years ago (80's) what the max tow rating was. He said whatever the trailer would hold!, i.e. he towed oversize/permit loads etc some weighing 80,000 to 100,000 lbs, depending on the route and axle load limits. I doubt if they went even 65 mph dues to safety with those loads. 40,000 lbs was a "normal" non permit load.
The most powerful big rig engines are 13 liters (and up, not 9 liters) as this video and have 2200 to 2500 ft-lbs of torque at 2,000 rpm!
- "How are your temps?"
- "Everything is nominal."
- *Actual EGTs: 2000+ melting aluminum pistons and everything else*************
You don't have to worry about burning that engine up with exhaust temps. In stock form the computer won't let it happen, I hate all the computer on newer diesels, but they needed them do to dumb asses that don't know how to drive and only know foot to the floor or idle.
I’ve put a LOT of miles on a freight shaker 😎. Of course a lot bigger than this one. It had a hole in the exhaust and when you flipped the jake brake it sounded like a machine gun going off. Lots of fun! I miss driving rigs
What year was yours? What was the max fifth wheel capacity? GCWR?
Another great video with my favorite Russian and of course mr truck
Thanks
You are one cool cowboy 🤠 great video as always would love to see more mr truck rescues save those fast lane boys lol
@@deltadcrouse Thanks
@Mitch09 Thanks
I tow a bumper hitch travel trailer with my 2000 international 4700. Oh so nice to drive. Rock solid, the only downside is the suspension is stiff. I just completed a cross country trip with my car. Hands down the International is more comfortable to drive. The down side my car was about 20 mph gas the international is 8 mpg diesel pulling a 10,000 lb. trailer. . My next cross country trip will be with the International.
Why not take something with more power for the 1 ton comparison, like the 1000 torque Ram 3500? i think then it would be neck and neck competition rather than an old GMC. But i guess the sponsor has to sell those big haulers right?!
The Freightliner has an available 500 hp 1800 ft lb Detroit Diesel.
Ok, you guys did a great job and made a great video, but you forgot to mention the mpg of the Freightliner M2 going uphill, and no comparison of the times were made. I believe the GMC had a better time going uphill, although it only got 3 MPG. I like the Freightliner better as well.
I got bored with all the jumping around, brake test, trailer, brake test, trailer, engine, brake test, trailer
Can't wait to see you re do this test with the 2020 GMC where the toeing ratings are similar to the Freightliner.
why didnt you use the 5500 or 6500 (Kodiak) to compare with Freightliner
Because that's not what they're trying to compare
@@kylesonsalla7620 ? so what they trying to compare? 18 wheeler to a pickup? thats what i saw
@@derekcomingo2197
How a dually can do it, but a medium duty does it better.
This was an AWESOME comparison, fellas! That Freightliner is a beauty!
Thanks
The Freightliner probably could have done noticeably better, but because of the custom grill, the air to air was starving for air, thus robbing it of power.
Just a heads up, those dual tank GMCs/Chevys have been having issues with their fuel tanks. For some reason, the truck at times will only take fuel from one tank and not the other. You could be going down the road and showing a half a tank on your gauge but your truck will still shut down. My company has had fuel issues with every dual tank Chevy that it has.
Please do this but with a Silverado 4500 or 5500! I wanna see how it does
I think that if there is going to be a fair comparison. It should be with the same class trucks that are all the same year. GM has rereleased the 4500-6500 cab and chassis trucks. Compare that to the Ram 5500 and Ford F550. I understand that with a longer and wider wheel base, it will improve the handling and stability when towing.
I enjoy the video reviews. Keep them coming.
i agree...try using the new 4500 or 5500 medium duty chevy
Thanks
How that CDL coming Andre?
Overall I think this was a valid comparison. I know you're trying to keep a consistent standard, but I own and tow with a very similar GMC 3500, Cruise control is your friend. No brake application required down hill and no fighting to maintain speed up hill (which both happened in this video). All the modern 1 ton trucks are designed with cruise control in mind to be used while towing. In my opinion your testing would better reflect real world and intended usage better if you would allow for cruise control to be used.
JMO but I tow with a "modern" truck (2016 F350 dually, 6.7, 3:73) ... cruise control going up the hill would have the engine screaming trying to keep 60 mph, it would probably go down to 3rd or 2nd!!. I go manual up a 7% grade and climb in 4th (sometimes 3rd) but mindful of keeping my RPMs no higher than 3500. Same going downhill ... manual and usually in 3rd or 4th at 3500 RPM. I have pulled the IKE and it's a tough pull, but I never "floor it" to climb any hill, that's too hard on MY EQUIPMENT.