"If you have a system that is constantly trying to manage the world by reading data from your behaviour in the past, what it can't imagine is a kind of future that has never existed before". Can't help but feel this really is the most succinct phrasing of the central issue with todays society an it's total stagnation and inability to progress.
This social behavior is not new, look up what the Renaissance was. I find that Adam does not study a lot of history or ignores so it does not defeat his argument.
technological progress grows geometrically, human progress is non linear. Prosperity breeds moral decay, in turn brings ruin, reconstruction, and the cycle is repeated. there is a creative plateau we've hit
Fast forward 4 years, we have seen the deliberate undermining of the individual and an attempt to form mass consciousness through the BBC propaganda machine and using the Pandemic as a tool to do that. That's not great either.
Trying to make the future look like something is the problem--not the solution. Fix the fundamentals, such as a critical mass becoming the best version of themselves, and whatever evolves ... will be great because it will have outcompeted all the other innovations, which were themselves healthy because they were the products of healthy minds.
But isn’t this „critical mass becoming the best versions of themselves“ something that is currently not the case, therefore in the future and therefore a positive vision of a possible future?
He's very very right that collective action was abandoned by the left, but it seems it's somewhat been revived at the moment. It's sad but, you commit to activism and sometimes you get burned out, and if you're committed to it, you just do it like a compulsion. But that's what activism is - not by changing what I buy, but by devoting, or has he says much better - subsuming - a part of my life into something with no expected end date, just simply because it's the right thing to do.
Radical individualism makes collective action difficult if not impossible. Most of those people from Europe who are going to Aleppo, Syria are doing it as Jihadist with an AK-47, a car bomb, and a big knife. They too think they are helping people. The Islamists have a picture of the future, which is rather terrifying. The Chinese and the Russians also have a picture of the future, which is a lot more optimistic. There is one man in the West I know of who has an optimistic vision for the future. He says "Make America Great Again !"
@@mountainman6172 The vast majority of those people who traveled to Aleppo around 2014~15 to fight Assad and of whom Adam Curtis speaks so approvingly are now in the ground or in prison. A few like Sharmeena Begum survived and now want back in. Do you want her back in ? The Caliphate is an optimistic collective vision for the future, at least for the Islamists. Assad may be bad, that doesn't make the people fighting him good. Is your Yorkshire tea and black pudding Halal ?
And he uses the example of the Civil Rights movement compared to the anti Iraqi war movement to show how individualism leads to protests failing. What he fails to realise is that the Civil Rights movement was about Americans advocating for other Americans within America so it had a whole different energy than protesting a war against foreigners that was seen by many at the time as justified. Apples and Oranges. A better comparison would be the Vietnam anti war movement, and once again, that movement only took off when the war became unpopular with a majority and only then in a large part because Americans boys were dying in unacceptable numbers.
Ruby Skip Curtis uses the example of the civil rights protests in the mid 60’s as a successful movement because people were united in a cause to help others. He then goes on to say that since the individualism of the hippy era in the late 60’s that movements have failed because people aren’t motivated to help others because they can’t submit their egos to the group. That’s demonstrably false and you just have to look at the anti-Vietnam movement of the early 70’s for a successful people power. Hope that helps
@@zachariahwade8482 The anti-Vietnam rallys of the '70s were really anti-draft-lottery rallies. Individuals against being forced to save their individual lives.
What nonsense !! The vast majority of those opposing Homophobia, Islamophobia etc in our society aren’t Gay or Islamic. You can see yourself as an individual and still be part of a movement for change.
Ruby Skip I understand that but issues like Gay Marriage are recent and have shown that straight people can be united against discrimination against minorities. And I’d argue the anti- Islamaphobic narrative of the Left has been reasonably effective.
"... but this, of course, was just a fantasy."
haha- and at the same time in another part of the world...
@@zompor " but what most people didn't realize.... "
I feel like this is one of adams ism's like attenborough's "for now......."
im so glad that adam cutis makes films instead of writing books, makes his ideas 100 times more accessible to the modern person
"If you have a system that is constantly trying to manage the world by reading data from your behaviour in the past, what it can't imagine is a kind of future that has never existed before".
Can't help but feel this really is the most succinct phrasing of the central issue with todays society an it's total stagnation and inability to progress.
This social behavior is not new, look up what the Renaissance was. I find that Adam does not study a lot of history or ignores so it does not defeat his argument.
"Librarians become Kings" is such a fantastic analogy.
Extremely important insights here!!!!!!!!!!!!
We need this guy right now
@@richiedon9133 which point
I'd love to hear a debate between Adam Curtis and Mark Lilla on individualism. Or a debate between Adam Curtis and John Grey on progress.
We absolutely do!
technological progress grows geometrically, human progress is non linear. Prosperity breeds moral decay, in turn brings ruin, reconstruction, and the cycle is repeated.
there is a creative plateau we've hit
1min - Love the comment on individualism and that it haven't helped people to group up and support social change.
Fast forward 4 years, we have seen the deliberate undermining of the individual and an attempt to form mass consciousness through the BBC propaganda machine and using the Pandemic as a tool to do that. That's not great either.
Trying to make the future look like something is the problem--not the solution. Fix the fundamentals, such as a critical mass becoming the best version of themselves, and whatever evolves ... will be great because it will have outcompeted all the other innovations, which were themselves healthy because they were the products of healthy minds.
But isn’t this „critical mass becoming the best versions of themselves“ something that is currently not the case, therefore in the future and therefore a positive vision of a possible future?
First bit I heard last night! It's from his interview with jarvis cocker. Available on YT it's great.
Curious for the source of the second part.
For sure
Did you find out?
I think it's his interview with jarvis cocker from 2016. It's on YT.
we are heading for something horendous glad i am old
He's very very right that collective action was abandoned by the left, but it seems it's somewhat been revived at the moment. It's sad but, you commit to activism and sometimes you get burned out, and if you're committed to it, you just do it like a compulsion. But that's what activism is - not by changing what I buy, but by devoting, or has he says much better - subsuming - a part of my life into something with no expected end date, just simply because it's the right thing to do.
Yeah but a classic is a classic
protest is to agree to what your pro-test is against
Bit like Michel Foucault's governmentalite.
Radical individualism makes collective action difficult if not impossible.
Most of those people from Europe who are going to Aleppo, Syria are doing it as Jihadist with an AK-47, a car bomb, and a big knife. They too think they are helping people. The Islamists have a picture of the future, which is rather terrifying. The Chinese and the Russians also have a picture of the future, which is a lot more optimistic. There is one man in the West I know of who has an optimistic vision for the future. He says "Make America Great Again !"
Spilt me lovely Yorkshire tea reading your half-baked coffee!
@@mountainman6172 The vast majority of those people who traveled to Aleppo around 2014~15 to fight Assad and of whom Adam Curtis speaks so approvingly are now in the ground or in prison. A few like Sharmeena Begum survived and now want back in. Do you want her back in ?
The Caliphate is an optimistic collective vision for the future, at least for the Islamists. Assad may be bad, that doesn't make the people fighting him good.
Is your Yorkshire tea and black pudding Halal ?
"But Then..."
"It all starts with"
4:56
And he uses the example of the Civil Rights movement compared to the anti Iraqi war movement to show how individualism leads to protests failing. What he fails to realise is that the Civil Rights movement was about Americans advocating for other Americans within America so it had a whole different energy than protesting a war against foreigners that was seen by many at the time as justified. Apples and Oranges.
A better comparison would be the Vietnam anti war movement, and once again, that movement only took off when the war became unpopular with a majority and only then in a large part because Americans boys were dying in unacceptable numbers.
I don't understand your reasoning behind the Vietnam war & why that's relevant
The reasoning behind the reason they began protesting
Ruby Skip
Why do you think people protested the Vietnam war ??
Ruby Skip
Curtis uses the example of the civil rights protests in the mid 60’s as a successful movement because people were united in a cause to help others.
He then goes on to say that since the individualism of the hippy era in the late 60’s that movements have failed because people aren’t motivated to help others because they can’t submit their egos to the group. That’s demonstrably false and you just have to look at the anti-Vietnam movement of the early 70’s for a successful people power.
Hope that helps
@@zachariahwade8482 The anti-Vietnam rallys of the '70s were really anti-draft-lottery rallies. Individuals against being forced to save their individual lives.
What nonsense !! The vast majority of those opposing Homophobia, Islamophobia etc in our society aren’t Gay or Islamic. You can see yourself as an individual and still be part of a movement for change.
The homosexuality issue was bubbling away for half a century & the Islam issue isn't effective
Ruby Skip
I understand that but issues like Gay Marriage are recent and have shown that straight people can be united against discrimination against minorities.
And I’d argue the anti- Islamaphobic narrative of the Left has been reasonably effective.