Broken SG and a Norman 12 String

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  • Опубліковано 22 лип 2022
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КОМЕНТАРІ • 477

  • @TheDirtyyoungman1
    @TheDirtyyoungman1 Рік тому +13

    "Elks and Moose come out in the winter to lick at this thing" BWAAAHAHAHAHAHA.. That made my day.. 😆😁👍

    • @goodun2974
      @goodun2974 Рік тому +1

      I'm surprised all the hardware hadn't turned green.

    • @dragonlordskater5028
      @dragonlordskater5028 Рік тому

      @@goodun2974 it looks like the hardware is looked after, there's just no time/desire to do cosmetic repairs

  • @garywhitt98
    @garywhitt98 Рік тому +24

    So, Ted has taught me, I aspire to a Norman build: “the belly is there but it’s not excessive”.

  • @jamesfetherston1190
    @jamesfetherston1190 Рік тому +85

    Love how you always use appropriate style of playing when demonstrating the guitars.

  • @scottbrower9052
    @scottbrower9052 Рік тому +10

    Woodford Instruments videos are tonic for my overwhelmed mind & troubled soul.

  • @ThomasHope73
    @ThomasHope73 Рік тому +40

    Inherited my Dad’s 1990 Norman, I was 17 when he bought it new. Now I’m 48 and have been playing that guitar for 32 years, for the last 20 being it’s custodian. I think of how my old man put off buying a decent guitar until he was the age I am now, because he prioritised his family responsibilities and made do with an old 12 string with two screws to fix a broken neck and terrible action. When he finally got a new guitar, he didn’t splash out but he chose wisely; he bought that Norman. It resonates in more ways than one for me.

  • @C0urne
    @C0urne Рік тому +8

    I lost it at elks and moose. 🤣

  • @stevem.1853
    @stevem.1853 Рік тому +29

    Who in the heck thought that patching a gap in the stage with tape was ok?? Glad the SG was the only casualty

    • @goodun2974
      @goodun2974 Рік тому +3

      Pete Townshend said that the first time he broke a guitar it was by accident, jumping while onstage at the Marquee Club, which had a low ceiling. I have to wonder if it was a Gibson! A Fender headstock would likely have broken the ceiling instead.

    • @guyincognito1423
      @guyincognito1423 Рік тому +2

      @@goodun2974 The guitar you're thinking of was a Rickenbacker, and it was at a place called The Railway Tavern, not the Marquee Club. There's a Who website that has most of Pete's smashing incidents documented.

    • @goodun2974
      @goodun2974 Рік тому +2

      @@guyincognito1423 ,, I was working from the memory of a Townsend interview I read probably at least 30 years ago. Thanks for the clarification. I'm so old I had an early vinyl LP of the Who Live at Leeds that came with not only the famous "maximum R and B" poster from the Marquee club but also photocopies of financial statements for the band, listing the gigs they played and how much they got paid, as well as their bills from music shops for equipment. BTW, in Richard Thompson's biography "BeesWing", covering his years with Fairport Convention and early solo career, Thompson (one of my long-time favorite guitarists and singer-songwriters) writes of seeing the Who and the Yardbirds numerous times at the Marquee; staying through intermission to see the 2nd set meant that all the busses and trains would have ceased running that late at night, and he would have to walk many miles to get home. Fairport sometimes shared stages or played festivals with Pink Floyd, Tull, the Soft Machine etc, and once participated in an after hour's jam session with Led Zeppelin that was definitely recorded but nobody seems to know where the tapes are!

    • @qua7771
      @qua7771 3 місяці тому

      Duct tape in a stage hole? Someone has some splaining to do.

  • @michaeldorman
    @michaeldorman Рік тому +14

    The “annoyance curve” may be my new favorite phrase.

    • @that_thing_I_do
      @that_thing_I_do Рік тому

      Penetration is paramount.

    • @that_thing_I_do
      @that_thing_I_do Рік тому +5

      Polishing....polishing....polishing....

    • @goodun2974
      @goodun2974 Рік тому +1

      @@that_thing_I_do , I'm an amp-repair guy, so for me it's desoldering....desoldering.....desoldering....

  • @frankfarklesberry
    @frankfarklesberry Рік тому +5

    I thought for sure Orville was gonna be defaced at some point to make that right. 😆

  • @spikesguitarcamp
    @spikesguitarcamp Рік тому +3

    That SG definitely took a beating long before the break. As you said, touring musicians guitar. I bet he's happy you brought it back from the dead! ☠

  • @scottdunbar4898
    @scottdunbar4898 Рік тому +12

    2 Odford for the win!
    That SG looked a bit......septic.

    • @weschilton
      @weschilton Рік тому

      It could use a bath for sure!

    • @seanj3667
      @seanj3667 Рік тому

      You misspelled "metal". The break repair just ads character.

    • @ileutur6863
      @ileutur6863 Рік тому

      Yeah its a typical metalhead owned guitar. I know cause I bought and sold 2 just like it

  • @jimcates4114
    @jimcates4114 Рік тому +15

    I’ve had a Norman S30 since 1979. It’s been everywhere, and I’ve had very few issues until this past spring, when the neck block let go. I thought it was the end of the world, but a local guy did a fine repair at a very reasonable price. It’s now as good as ever. Can’t beat these old Normans for value and quality.

  • @kennogawa6638
    @kennogawa6638 Рік тому +27

    That Norman guitar for a beginners guitar sounds great. I can see why the owner wanted it fixed.

  • @dooleyfan
    @dooleyfan Рік тому +6

    It is such a treat to watch someone with a mastery of their craft treat guitars with so much respect.

  • @InfinityEnterprises
    @InfinityEnterprises Рік тому +19

    Awesome video. Love it when you talk about things like your philosophy towards elements of the craft that aren’t so cut-and-dry, more like a healthy balance. Reminding us evermore that ultimately these things we love so much are bound by the limitations of wood, wire, and human craftsmanship. Keep ‘em coming!

  • @SxSxG666
    @SxSxG666 Рік тому +4

    Handing over the guitar this dirty to you is like going to the dentist without brushing your teeth.

  • @stellingbanjodude
    @stellingbanjodude Рік тому +2

    “Shade tree luthing” I like that phrase, maybe not the practice of it, but definitely the connotations

  • @grocker7683
    @grocker7683 Рік тому +5

    I always look forward to your videos. At 67 I enjoy watching your craftmanship & the stories are just wonderful. You Rock on that SG. :)

  • @turnsufficient4971
    @turnsufficient4971 11 місяців тому +1

    Nice polar opposite guitar repairs - loved it Ted. ❤

  • @Mudder1310
    @Mudder1310 Рік тому +54

    I’ve owned a couple Seagull acoustics and the description of “solid quality at a low price” nails it. I’d buy another without hesitation. My experience with Godin electrics have been similar.

    • @skakid0
      @skakid0 Рік тому +2

      I've got a Seagull entourage and no other acoustic has even come close to the tone and feel of that guitar for me. And it's still going strong after a decade of hard use. Such an amazing instrument.

    • @johnsonguitarstudio
      @johnsonguitarstudio Рік тому +1

      See also: La Patrie. I don't think you can really call Godin "low price", but I think "solid quality" still applies

    • @bigtoelittlefinger6133
      @bigtoelittlefinger6133 Рік тому +1

      Mr segull

    • @TheNaKio
      @TheNaKio Рік тому +4

      The owner of the sg also owns a couple of seagulls, actual seagulls that constantly shit on top of the guitar.

    • @benjohnson1670
      @benjohnson1670 Рік тому +1

      I found a Godin SD in a thrift shop and took a chance. After a good clean and a rudimentary setup it's fantastc!

  • @brianwaldo2642
    @brianwaldo2642 Рік тому +8

    Yep, that Norman is definitely made in Canada… Robertson screws. The US has Henry Ford to thank for being stuck with the dreaded Phillips screw head.

    • @markbernier8434
      @markbernier8434 Рік тому +1

      And in QC as the etiquette interior has francais first.

    • @that_thing_I_do
      @that_thing_I_do Рік тому +1

      Could be worse...imagine having to use standard slotted screws.

  • @leftienigeblank4320
    @leftienigeblank4320 Рік тому +4

    HEY THERE TED . In the mid-70's I bought a used Yamaha acoustic 12 . It had a slotted headstock ,
    a-la classical . Can you imagine the HOURS of fun I had changing the strings every few weeks ?

  • @ronwheeler1400
    @ronwheeler1400 Рік тому +4

    Love it. My favorite Luther and a linguistic lesson on Canadian French

    • @goodun2974
      @goodun2974 Рік тому +1

      I am part French-Canadian myself, and lthough my spoken French is limited to a few catch-all phrases, the pronunciation of certain French words that I've heard all my life comes easy to me. Anglicizing them in print is another matter. My wife's family in New Brunswick makes a delicious pate' or "head cheese", pronounced something like "Kuh-toh", and I have no idea how it's actually spelled.

  • @ByronAgain
    @ByronAgain Рік тому +23

    Thanks, Ted. I'm not a luthier, and I'm not much of a guitar player - I can play 3, maybe 4 chords if I make funny faces and grunt a bit; where's the Dan Reeder reference? Well, there, that's where. Anyhow, I've been watching your work for years now; I started when I was living in China in 2018 and have made it a weekly thing. I appreciate your candor, workmanship and the little things that make what you do art and a craft. Watching your videos is somewhere between entertainment, learning and meditation. I really appreciate the time you you take to make them. All the best, Byron

  • @butchlauer
    @butchlauer Рік тому +4

    Both Orville and Norman mended in one episode. You can't beat that content.

  • @sc0ss3tt3
    @sc0ss3tt3 Рік тому +11

    I love that you did a little history of Norman. I'm from Quebec and have almost the same guitar you repaired. But as a matter of fact, Norman was founded by Normand Boucher, who than became associate with Godin, than sold the Norman line. Nice job as always!

    • @MegaTubescreamer
      @MegaTubescreamer Рік тому

      then became,,,,then sold,,,,simon! if i may assist ,😇

  • @tbonky
    @tbonky Рік тому +7

    I bought my first Seagull 25 years ago from a friend, an S6 Folk . Another friend was selling a Maritime CH SWS this year and I grabbed it. You’re right, I really love their feel and tone! Hail Canada!

  • @thebonebox488
    @thebonebox488 Рік тому +1

    Nice work on the SG! I can't believe how many used Gibsons I see with the head stock "professionally repaired" and it looks like a kindergartner took Elmers and masking tape to make it happen. Probably not the work of a pro at all, but it's nice to see the process and what it should look like when done correctly.

  • @picksalot1
    @picksalot1 Рік тому +7

    Gibson would do themselves a favor by flipping the truss rod around so the adjustment access is by the neck pickup. That might let them keep the original (though excessive) headstock angle. Interesting history about Norman Guitars and all the offshoots. The 12-string sounded very good. Thanks

  • @GahMehGrrrr
    @GahMehGrrrr Рік тому

    love watching you work. Thank you

  • @jimmythecricket25
    @jimmythecricket25 Рік тому +3

    Great video as always. Thanks for sharing your talents. 👍

  • @larrysawchuk370
    @larrysawchuk370 Рік тому +2

    Awesome video. As usual. Makes me happy just to see one of your videos pop up in my notifications before I even watch them.

  • @chrisfarrugia5397
    @chrisfarrugia5397 Рік тому

    That SG repair worked out fantatstic !!

  • @JP-jy7sk
    @JP-jy7sk Рік тому

    You sir, are the guitar whisperer, and I enjoy every moment!

  • @NKBobcat
    @NKBobcat Рік тому +1

    I liked that last tune on the SG. Great work!

  • @mikenixon4637
    @mikenixon4637 Рік тому +2

    You Ted are an encouragement to do great work.

  • @beytone
    @beytone Рік тому +11

    Ted, I admire your adaptability when it comes to playing the repaired instruments. Tony Iommi would be proud. Another lovely video!! Thanks

  • @Kafrifelle
    @Kafrifelle Рік тому +3

    Hey Ted, I’m really happy to see that you’re working on the Norman guitar. It was my first 12 strings. You made it sound really good

  • @adammono1839
    @adammono1839 Рік тому +5

    What a nice early treat ted! I like the pairing videos. Nice to see how you maximise your time on 2 jobs

  • @Blitterbug
    @Blitterbug Рік тому

    Fantastic work and hugely entertaining narrative & camerawork.

  • @sneakerhead6184
    @sneakerhead6184 Рік тому

    You Sir do the most incredible work I have ever seen!! You have a talent that you just don't see these days! Once again, well done man!!

  • @Samalyzer45
    @Samalyzer45 Рік тому +1

    Fantastic episode! Really informative.

  • @straight8ight
    @straight8ight Рік тому

    Well done as usual. I wish I still had the finesse and stability as you express. Thanks for sharing your pure talent. I've learned many things from watching your videos. Have a blessed day.

  • @BudgetRC_Channel
    @BudgetRC_Channel Рік тому

    Love the metal chops!

  • @reefe5657
    @reefe5657 Рік тому +1

    Thank you for taking time to film. I watch often. I have no guitars. Just enjoy craftsmanship.

  • @f1s2hg3
    @f1s2hg3 Рік тому

    Great job great show!

  • @mightyluv
    @mightyluv Рік тому +1

    Loved today’s jump from 12 string jangle to Black Death grind. Black tee and apron, too! Represent!

  • @karst41
    @karst41 Рік тому +1

    love the tuner tray compliments the screw block and fret wire block

  • @nerfnerfification
    @nerfnerfification Рік тому

    I have really enjoyed yoiur repair vids - many thanks

  • @MLoerAudio
    @MLoerAudio Рік тому

    Beautiful work as always, Ted!

  • @bulldrumm
    @bulldrumm Рік тому

    I've seen a dozen of your videos so far, even though i am not a luthier, nor do i play vintages or acoustics.
    It's a joy watching a craftsman of your skill and experience. Real good stuff.

  • @Csjustice72
    @Csjustice72 Рік тому

    Always amazing!

  • @firsteerr
    @firsteerr Рік тому +1

    great advice , its all about the glue in any woodworking , and the RIGHT glue for the timber and the job its expected to do

  • @salvadortenorio9789
    @salvadortenorio9789 Рік тому

    Well done, I loved. You are the 1.

  • @seanj3667
    @seanj3667 Рік тому +5

    I repaired a break like this on the Epiphone SG I bought for my nephew a few months ago. It was a clean overlap break and held very nicely with Tightbond. I would not have attempted splines though, because I know I would have made it worse.

  • @Schizmatizmify
    @Schizmatizmify Рік тому +1

    I use that exact set of strings for drop C tuning. Love the feel, and they do still tune up to standard well enough on the occasions it's needed.

  • @mattbridges8908
    @mattbridges8908 4 місяці тому

    Thanks for showing us the Norman! I'd love to see more on your channel. My Norman B18 6 string turns 24 this year. I adore this guitar. I know it's inexpensive, but it really does sound great. Mine is a solid cedar top with laminated cherry back and sides. I find this guitar has a unique sound, very loud (like, surprisingly loud) but also very warm and round sounding, even with new strings it produces a very thick tone across the strings without ever sounding dull or lifeless. I can't really explain it, but I haven't heard it in other guitars. With its sentimental value and unique sound I will keep this thing forever and spend whatever it takes to keep it playing condition. Thanks again for sharing your work with us!

  • @adamrasmussen9939
    @adamrasmussen9939 Рік тому +1

    I love Normann guitars. My first 'real' guitar was a matte finished Normann (did they add a second N to the end of their name sometime along the way? I could swear mine was spelled that way) I left it for my brothers to play after I finished college, but I'm not even sure if it's still in one piece anymore. It was a beach guitar the last time I used it. My Dad picked it out for me as my 'big' gift that Christmas, when I was 15 in grade 10. I was totally caught by surprise and blown away, because I was really wanting an acoustic, as I was progressing well with my electric, and wanted to expand my musical horizons....
    It was about $600-ish at the time. My Dad never played guitar, himself. He once had a $30 Sears classical when he was a kid, but never really picked it up. He told me he had the music store salesperson just chord and pick around on a few different guitars, and just said the Norman sounded the 'warmest' to his ear. I assume he was hearing the bottom end coming through well. He said when the guy played the $1000 or $1200 Takemine it sounded very 'tinny', but it also had a pickup to cover that up, and I think he heard a Yamaha (prob FG-400 series), and an Epiphone, too. He said he just felt the Norman had the best sound, and it was almost the cheapest of the ones he listened to. The Yamaha, was prob. 450-500 at the time. It was also in Nova Scotia, around the year 2000. There weren't any $150 Chinese specials knocking everyone's socks off at that point yet, so a guitar sounding as great as that one did for $600 was a killer deal, looking back.
    My stepmother's sister also found an old Norman with a bolt-on electric style neck in their attic. The bolts were different looking than this one though. They didn't have any obvious way of removing them from the outside, as there was just two rounded, hemispherically shaped heads on the bolts, no way to use any kind of screwdriver bit on it. It's been well over a decade, so I might not be remembering that detail correctly. Perhaps there was an Allen key slot on them that I just forgot seeing, but whatever the setup was, they definitely weren't set deep down into the holes like these were, the head of the bolts raised up a mm or two in that small circular 'bump' shape. It dated back to the late 70s, or maybe early 80s. I really wish I could have refurbed that one...or even hung onto it until now, but I was a teenager with no idea where to even start, and the guy I took it to told me it would only be worth prob $150 or $200 AFTER fixing up, so prob wasn't actually worth it.....but I always got a raised eyebrow when people heard the brand of my guitar back then. No one I knew, including myself had heard of Norman, and at first I was a little disappointed at the thought I missed out on a Takemine, but I think Dad prob made the right choice, and I was especially happy to know it was made in Canada too.

  • @RushGuitarMan
    @RushGuitarMan Рік тому

    Mr. Woodford, great video as always. I love my Gibson guitars despite the ever easy to break headstock. I have a Gibson Les Paul Studio and a Gibson SG Standard with the batwing pick guard.

  • @chrisbeall5702
    @chrisbeall5702 Рік тому

    Loved the “chugging” bit at the end. Didn’t see that coming!

  • @markdoyle9642
    @markdoyle9642 Рік тому +1

    thank you Ted.......just thought... each of your videos are like Luthier TED Talks (Huge Smile)

  • @Sopidex
    @Sopidex Рік тому +1

    As far as I know, Normand Boucher founded his company (Norman Guitar) making a Martin like guitar (same internal structure), but with a bolt on neck. Later, Godin start distributing the guitars. Eventually, Godin started making his own guitars in Montreal, and later bought Norman Guitars. Simon and Patrick are the names of Godin's sons.

  • @iamastifter
    @iamastifter Рік тому +1

    You inspired me to dress the frets of my new American Performer Stratocaster properly and I got rid of all the string buzzing. (I should have taken it to the shop for a proper setup under warranty but I really try to fix things myself.) The 19th fret was something like 0.4mm above all others but now its playing beautifully. Thanks!

  • @ShannonFerguson
    @ShannonFerguson Рік тому

    Wow that Norman sounded amazing.

  • @dlunsford1980
    @dlunsford1980 Рік тому +3

    I'm an amp tech for a local store here in town who also happen to be a Godin dealer. I picked up a Seagull S6 about a year ago from them, and was astonished at the quality for the price.

  • @MegaTubescreamer
    @MegaTubescreamer Рік тому

    i really enjoy the `work` you do,though i see it more as a process of
    redemption than a repair, its good to see how you breath life
    back into every instrument with no nonsense competence, 😊

  • @cccimusicstudiobuenosaires
    @cccimusicstudiobuenosaires Рік тому

    great metal stuff at the end!!!

  • @marcbouchard5041
    @marcbouchard5041 Рік тому

    Thanks Ted! This is my favorite video, as I own a Lys L-5 for many years and a Norman B20-12 with the same bolt on neck. I am trying to improve the set up of the B20-12 and happy to see the video.

  • @umapessoa6051
    @umapessoa6051 Рік тому +2

    Another great video!

  • @jamiemclean4555
    @jamiemclean4555 Рік тому

    I appreciate that the “shade tree luthier” used good quality, Canadian standard Robertson screws to apply extra down pressure on the strings.

  • @rankenfile
    @rankenfile Рік тому

    I've had a modest Simon & Patrick acoustic for about 35 years and enjoy its sound quite a bit. Nice to learn a bit more about it's founder.

  • @shinnim7865
    @shinnim7865 Рік тому

    I REALLY LOVE WATCHING HEADSTOCK BREAK REPAIR VID PLEASE DO MORE

  • @scottreynolds4252
    @scottreynolds4252 Рік тому

    The Norman sounds great. I pleased that Titebond is up to the task for the headstock repair. I would probably trust epoxy without that information. Have a great week!

  • @kevinchamberlain7928
    @kevinchamberlain7928 Рік тому +1

    Love that Norman!

  • @andrewsaldivar2112
    @andrewsaldivar2112 Рік тому

    Great show

  • @joelnakasone
    @joelnakasone Рік тому

    Music is a full contact endeavor. Thanks Dr Ted for the careful reconstruction and wisdom. Btw that wobbling headstock made me a bit queasy.

  • @thomasbarker642
    @thomasbarker642 Рік тому

    Top job again Ted

  • @limpindug
    @limpindug Рік тому +1

    I enjoyed your video mate, thanks for taking the time to share, all good stuff and helpful. 👍🥃Respect to you mate.

  • @mrkkitson
    @mrkkitson Рік тому

    Awesome as always!

  • @paulolopes3726
    @paulolopes3726 Рік тому

    Great job 😁👍👏

  • @contrabandjoe7974
    @contrabandjoe7974 Рік тому +2

    I've been trying to convince my wife for years how important "waxing off the rod" is......

  • @diabolictom
    @diabolictom Рік тому

    I have the same model SG... gave me a real pucker looking at that break.

  • @dantesunofsparda9962
    @dantesunofsparda9962 Рік тому +1

    Wow
    Perfect your job
    Nice

  • @familyengineering5591
    @familyengineering5591 Рік тому

    Headstock repairs are my favorite

  • @peterresetz5072
    @peterresetz5072 Рік тому

    That is by far the groggiest SG I’ve ever seen. The letting moose's lick it looks true.

  • @mojorocketman
    @mojorocketman Рік тому

    I have a Norman 6 string with the same style bolt on neck. I believe it was 70's before Godin bought them out. Gives a beautiful sound.

  • @jondeth298
    @jondeth298 Рік тому +1

    About 14 years ago I did my first headstock break and figured why not give the repair a shot.
    I had 3 dozen guitars at the time, surely still have at least that many, and after a ton of labor due to work environment and living conditions, thought the ever so slight twist in it as it set wouldn't be an issue.
    *It's an issue! lol*
    I might finally get to it this year, heat it, reset it, and revive it. I have 3 of these guitars. Neck through no branders made in China but they played so nicely.

  • @ParaBellum2024
    @ParaBellum2024 Рік тому

    Regarding adhesive, I was taught to avoid glue that might 'creep' under string tension. I repaired a heel on a Hofner bass a few years ago and used hide glue, plus I added a couple of dowels. It's still intact.

  • @channelsixtysix066
    @channelsixtysix066 Рік тому +1

    Phew, that was close! At least that SG neck break missed Orville. What a beautiful accoustic guitar and 50 years old, no less.

  • @RedLittleBee
    @RedLittleBee Рік тому

    Thank you Sir! 🔥👍

  • @the_hippykiller22
    @the_hippykiller22 Рік тому

    Owning a 1978 B30 in its original case (as well as a Seagull S12) it was nice to see some love for them, it's very hard to get info on them and they're not really well known guitars

  • @PageMarker1
    @PageMarker1 5 місяців тому

    Patience & persistence are commendable traits, Gentle Giant...)

  • @DavidBrown-it9ig
    @DavidBrown-it9ig Рік тому

    Another great vid!

  • @daiganzen7794
    @daiganzen7794 Рік тому +2

    As a giging musician I tend to play fenders or thru neck guitars. (not that they don’t break) but their stability and ease of repair kept me playing them. I do own a beautiful gibson Les Paul that never leaves home due to these issues. I am so paranoid that one wrong move and it’s sad times

  • @J.C...
    @J.C... Рік тому +2

    Thanks, Ted!

  • @kryptichands968
    @kryptichands968 Рік тому +1

    Gibson : keeping luthiers working since 1902

  • @stimpsonjcat67
    @stimpsonjcat67 Рік тому

    I have a Seagull S12 with fairly severe deck dive.
    I admit I butchered the saddle to get the action back down to functional.
    But I was happy to hear you think re-profiling the bridge to a back angle is a good solution, as it was something that occurred to me as well.

  • @JudyAndRonRants
    @JudyAndRonRants Рік тому

    "...when the person playing it fell into a hole." Thanks, now I have to clean up the coffee that just flew out of my nose.

  • @drummerhammar
    @drummerhammar Рік тому

    Great once again!

  • @WutipongWongsakuldej
    @WutipongWongsakuldej Рік тому +1

    I've rented out a Simon&Patrick from L&M one time in my business trip. Sounds good, smell nice. I really like it. If I didn't buy a Fender already I might get that one.