Professor Morris, we will happily absorb any and all knowledge you are willing to impart to the class. If school had been this interesting, a lot of us would've done much better. Another wonderful lesson, thank you.
I remember doing the math back around 1990. After 6000 rpms the stresses blew my mind. I always tried to build bigger cube engines that peak around 6-6500. I love the sound of 8000+ but it's hard to keep that stuff alive for long intervals. Keep showing this kind of stuff, it's eye opening to most people.
That’s very true. With modern low displacement engines revving to the moon it’s hard to get a sense of a big block over 450ci doing that kind of rpm. That’s a lot of big parts moving very quickly lol
This is exactly why I watch this channel. I always though it was the compression stroke that broke the little end of a connecting rod, but this makes so much more sense! I agree that even touching the high side rev limiter is catastrophic, but I wasn't factoring in the weight of the piston, just the violence of the spark cut and the chaos that it creates. Thank you Steve for the lesson! Keep them rolling.
Can Steve apply boost techniques and methods to the carpentry arena?! Imagine a nail gun ran by a compressor with an SMX! Some serious Rambo action for the average framer. 🤣😂🤣😂
I remember a bunch of this from the mid 80's in college, now that you bring it back up. At that same time Indy cars were experimenting with ceramic pistons, ceramic pins (or ceramic composites )and magnesium rods. I seem to remember that the failures were because of harmonics, not just the pressures. Now to start with, we're also talking about 3-4 liter 10-16 cylinder engines running 10000+ RPM VS 500+ Cubic inch V8's. So pistons are gonna be much smaller... I'd love to hear your take on this...
Great video Steve; I turned wrenches most of my adult life and still learn something new with almost every video you put out; IMHO, you're among the best of the best in the world of engine building, and your willingness to share it with us, makes you one awsome dude. God Speed, Mr Morris.
Thank you Steve, man, it’s so cool learning some of this stuff. That’s why engines cost the prices they do. You’re paying for a lifetime’s worth of experience
As a mechanical engineer, I love this math and real-life examples! You have tested (blown up) more engines than most and done forensics to understand where safety margins come into play. Thank you for sharing your hard-earned wisdom!
Love it. I’m a cross over from Clay Millican’s channel, and this is almost as good. I’m a techie. Love and appreciate all of this, make the videos as long as you want.
The dynamic loads in an engine are truly amazing, not only on the rod piston combination but also the valve spring, rocker arm and pushrod setup. Cam followers can leave the cam profile at max lift and valves can bounce off of the seats as the cam loses control of the follower when closing. Pushrods can bend and flex adding more dynamic forces to the valve, follower, spring combination also. It's amazing that these high performance engines can even get down the track.
Stuff like this would be for a number cruncher math whiz. At 150 RPS, figure out how much a single oil ring weighs, the top ring, and then the wrist pin. I just askefdy, but I'll do it again. At 150 revs per second, how many miles per hour is a piston traveling in a mile. .......I can divide by four, do I'll do that part of the equation 😁
The ramp rates on modern roller cams are insane and never would have been possible without improvements in spring technology and metallurgy in general and the rates still produce enough force to clean break massive aluminum rockers with enough passes. Nothing quite like the exponential curve of going towards near infinite dynamic loads mathematically and then figuring out just how far you have to back the ramp off to keep things alive. Pushing limits is an understatement!
@@ElliHarper I tried it a few different ways, all wild math and doubt my math is remotely close. I was encouraging some math braniac to do it correctly. I guessed 4.5 inches stroke at 150 strokes per second. There's 60 seconds in a minute, 60 minutes in an hour and there is 5280 feet in a mile Somewhere in there, there must be an equation. I can't wrap my brain around it. The piston is also traveling at zero mph at one point...... but don't blink. 😁 I tried again and came up with 460 mph. ......you don't want to have me as your accountant. 😁
@@randywl8925 with those figures its more like 76 MPH mean piston speed, 4.5 x 300 (150 strokes per second means it doers a full rotation 150 times per second which means it travels the stroke distance twice that number) times that number by 60 and 60 again to get inches per hour travelled, then divide by 12 to get feet per hour, then by 5280 to get MPH
ABSOLUTELY LOVE this kind of technical information. I am a total gearhead, and this is the meat of my spiritual food! Keep up the great work, Steve. You are a blessing to all of us that love engines but can't afford to play with them to this degree. Thank you and may His face continue to smile on you!
My dad was a math guy. He would show me this kind of stuff when I was a kid so when things broke, I understood why. Thanks Steve, for bringing back memories of the greatest man I ever knew.
Thank you Steve for taking the time out of your busy schedule to share your knowledge and help others. You Sir are a genius when it comes to drag racing. Once again thank you for sharing your time with all of us. 💪👍
This is an OUTSTANDING video, Steve!! Everything is math, including the physics. Some people clearly don't get why quality engines cost like they do. There's also a reason why F1 pistons are exotic aluminum alloys and cost $50K each to make less than 1/4 of the HP in a SMX while being able to accelerate like a rocket.
To be fair to those F1 guys, they are making their thousand-ish horsepower out of less than 100 ci (1.6l), which is a restriction Steve doesn't have to fight against
Excellent lesson Steve. I always learn something from your videos. It is just amazing that any engine can contain the forces that take place internally, let alone produce 5000+ hp.
This is why I love your channel if my wife doesn’t understand something I tell her I have her watch your videos because you make it easy for someone that doesn’t understand engines to understand what you are trying to explain to them and for that I thank you
Very interesting. The extreme forces at play are amazing. I think it would also be interesting to compare the numbers on the parts it takes for different engines to live at different power levels. This might help put in perspective the extreme nature your engines. Thanks
Definitely good to have these more in depth videos on the engineering side of engine building. For me, the piston weight during operation was one of the first things taught. I'm a little surprised you didn't mention pre-detonation with this. Sprinkle some pre-det and maybe jumped timing for good measure, and maybe I won't be the only one twitching from bad memories of bone headed mistakes, lol.
I love the knowledge you share. As a heavy equipment mechanic that works on diesel engines, I knew there was a lot of stress on the rotating group, but I did not think it was that much. Now I'm going to do the math on a 13.5 liter.
Thanks Steve for taking the time to go over this type of data. Just wondering about coatings and how much they help in the life of the piston. Again thank you.
Steve your information is very interesting and every time I watch one of your videos, I learn something. I am not a hot rod guy, but I am an Engineer and I have interest in your designing engines. Keep up the good work.
Fascinating stuff. How ANY of this works is truly amazing to me. Please keep sharing and educating all of us. Maybe a collab sometime with Engineering Explained? He could maybe fill in some of the gaps in math/equations, but I still feel like some of this is just pure magic 😆
Love your videos Steve. You mentioned the lack of countering forces at TDC on exhaust causing greater stress. I am trying to model this in my mind and I think that the greatest stresses on the rod are at about 90 degrees past TDC on intake stroke. I believe the greatest rate of change of velocity per degree of crank angle (acceleration) would occur at about 90 degrees past TDC (with possibly some correction for errors due to rod length and stroke). However, none of this really changes the forces the math is showing.
I believe you are correct in terms of stresses on the shank of the rod- tension vs compression and leverage is greatest at 90* thereby having the highest difference in tension and compression loads on the rod shank (but during the combustion cycle, not intake). Steve is bringing to light the force that most people don’t think about- inertia weight of a piston not under compression and how much energy the pin and rod are overcoming to keep the piston in a cozy warm block. At 90* ATDC the piston weight acting on the rod is much lower than the force it takes to stop and reverse the piston. The high RPM changes things- inertia weight. In the engines I work with, large bore industrial diesel, the highest forces and wear spots are on the opposite side of the wrist pin bore but these engines don’t even see 2K RPMs.
Keep it coming Steve. 3500 hp dyno pulls are sweet but stuff like this sets you apart from other automotive channels. Is there any way to calculate how much it takes to spool a turbo based on engine size and turbo combinations ?
My oldest brother was an engine builder before he passed away. He had is own shop in Douglasville GA, Hurricane performance. Thank you Steve for this useful knowledge.
Steve, I'm interested in the loads placed on the crankshaft during the gear change and what the difference is between a wide ratio gear set and a close ratio set. I greatly appreciate your knowledge and willingness to share.
I have been contemplating the idea of de-stroking my SBC just so I can rev it a bit higher and make more power and this video helped me a lot in making that decision. Very informative. Please keep them coming and thanks for all this informative videos. You are the man!!!!
I was thinking same thing and looking for others to say same thing but so far you are the only one. (2 minutes later) I just did the math... and the number was the same. So...never mind. We thought too much about it.
Because it is all multiplication, you can swap the order as you wish and it will give the same results. This is called associativity. Not true if you mix in + and -.
I would love to see a video on how many pounds of cylinder pressure is pushing on the bottom of a cylinder head on a boosted application! I’ve lifted the head on a couple of engines under boost and just the thought of it stretching the head studs is mind boggling to me.
Mr Steve, I have been a diesel mechanic for 14 years now. I’m 32 from Ga., I’ve been watching your channel for the past few years and I absolutely enjoy your videos especially the informative ones. “Caution, you may learn something from watching this channel” I remember when you started putting this in your videos and it is always absolutely true. I know a good bit, but knowledge is amazing and power. Keep doing you man. Btw I would love to see a SMF “ford big block your design and improvements”. Wish I could afford either one even the SML even though I’m not a fan of them even with their name and support. I enjoy quality but more so I enjoy good people in this crazy ass world, and I believe you are one of those good people, simply because you help others and share knowledge, “maybe not secrets, but that’s ok lol”, so I do thank you sir and I thank all of those who read this and fall in the same good people category.
Is valve train still the limiting factor, or is it normally piston speed when your setting a rpm limit? Or a factor of both? Love the knowledge Steve. I’m a carpenter but cars have been my passion from before I had a license. Been messing with them just as long 😂
Great question. I often wonder whether using a big block billet bottom end plus an overhead cam design would live longer. 4 valves would certainly be lighter rotational mass on the valve train.
@@skeetamacgyver1821Yes, it would live longer and flow better, but the 3 extra cams and wider and higher engine means you could just increase displacement instead. The ls has a much bigger displacement while being lighter and more compact than a coyote, so in case of a v8 it may just not be worth it.
I love watching you explain the nerdy side of engine building one thing I would love to see is a sit down video again just talking about your life when you started building engines and how it's advanced over the years to where your business is now
As i was following along, it became very clear to me exactly what causes a crankshaft to break and also why mains develope cracks or blow out the bottom completely.
Steve, this one of the best ever you tube's have seen. As someone who as studied engineering and built few engines this spoke volumes to me, and confirmed your wonderful experience. Thank you from Australia.
I'm not the best with numbers but you always have a knack at explaining in a way that makes it easy to digest. Thanks again for another video, Steve. God bless!
EVERYONE! BIG APPRECIATIONS FOR STEVE MORRIS!!! SM Shines a huge spotlight on a normally "semisecret sauce" of a self gain sport! AWESOME, for young GEAR-HEADS, to have the opportunity to peer inside the inner workings of STEVE'S speed freak creations, mechanical machinations and DOMINATING motivations!!! He is a driving, ploughing force full speed ahead illuminating the way like a virulent global pandemic...for the next GENERATION!!! GOD BLESS STEVE MORRIS!!!
I fell asleep listening to this last night, we had a really interesting conversation about how often you have to fix overrevved toys in my dreams. It was awesomely hilarious. Yes do more of these.
This is a knockout presentation of the loads on the piston/rod combo. Don't stop making these informative vids! I am using a lot of your info in the building and observation of my pulling tractor engine.
I love stuff like this because it can help me avoid breaking stuff or at least be aware of the signs of something about to fail. I do find it somewhat funny how you say, "Have a great day" even though this was published around 7 in the evening. I can't remember ever watching your videos during the day lol. Equally, I will do my best to have a great day tomorrow, as well as every day thereafter.
I love this channel because you never know what your going to learn. This blows my mind and I understand math just the sheer numbers of actual piston weight is crazy
Love how you explain how things on / how an engine works. Thanks for sharing your knowledge it is very enlightening. Best channel on you tube. Can’t hardly wait for the next video
Great stuff Steve, I had a Lotus twin cam built here in the UK 40 odd years ago by a respected engine builder, and the one thing he said to me and I will never forget it was "the only thing that will kill this engine is over revving it, it will rev and rev and then fly to bits" I never revved it past 7k and it stayed together, and the piston/rod combo was probably half the weight of your stuff.
Steve. Please keep your very very informative videos coming. I found your channel about 6 months ago. I have found that I have learned so much. Even things I thought was right but turned out to be wrong. I’m no pro racer or dragger. I just mess with a 12 car collection of classic Muscle cars. I still have my first car my father co-signed so I could buy. A 1970 nova. 350 punched out .030 over. With lots of goodies. So please I know it takes up your time but you are helping a lot of us home garage mechanics. Love your channel.
I own and drive a 7 sec Honda civic fwd. This video is just full of proper answers to my questions with knowledge. Is just music to my ears the understanding I just received of basic engine wear and tear when pushing this 4cyl to the limit reving 11,000 plus. Thanks!
All that info is priceless, to enjoy watching the racing. To understand what is going on in those few seconds of pedal to the metal. The forces are mind boggling 😎👍
You talked about how many times a second the pistons are at TDC - BDC at different rpms, what's equally mind blowing is when you go a step further. (I know you know and understand this better than I ever will!!! This is for others) Think about the speed of the pistons, they have to go from a dead stop, start to move, mid stroke they will be traveling at the highest speed, then they needs to slow down, come to a complete stop, then do the same thing in the other direction. When I'm on the highway and the tack is around 3,000 rpms, there's times I think about the pistons being at TDC 50 times every second; sometimes for hours. It really shows how important the lubrication and cooling systems are!!! AWESOME VIDEO!!!
Heck yeah Steve!! That is awesome that you are educating. Like your warning says. You did a awesome job of showing just some of the forces on a piston. Keep up the good work!!!
It’s was a very good video explanation of the pressure developed during the piston cycle and strokes and speeds it’s traveling. Very good explanation of where rods fail at the connecting points between the caps and crank and at the wrist pins and piston.
Good info to get the mind thinking… couple of other dynamics that were sort of touched on is the angular velocity of acceleration and deceleration that is determined by rod stroke ratio. Short rods increase side thrust and increase piston acceleration and deceleration speeds and hence the peak load on the conrods/bearing/ fasteners and pin/piston at those instants where direction changes.. the long rod significantly slows both acceleration and deceleration instants and angular thrust on the piston skirt… the piston is in a “softer” deceleration mode as it approaches tic, and a “softer” acceleration mode after tdc. Simarly for the bottom of the stroke on both sides of bdc. Why a long rod engine can make use with a lighter piston as the vertical and lateral loads on the piston decrease. It’s amazing the engineering calculation that goes into designing parts that can not only survive but last as long as they do. Thanks for the video👍
30 years in mechanics and I dont think I've ever seen these calculations. Absolutely fascinating! It ALWAYS blew my mind how many times a plug fires at 6000 RPM and there is a fire and exhaust. Still cant make that compute in my head that it works. Love these vids...!
I love this technical information Steve keep it coming. I was extremely surprised when you touch the rpm limit and the subsequent reduction of component life.
Excellent analogy of what it takes to keep these things alive. The forces inside racing engines is phenomenal. Lightened parts get Quickly into the "Area of negative returns" lol
!!!!AWESOME information Steve...THANKS!!!! The piston setup you used as your 2.51Lb example is nearly identical to mine...as is the weight. Only the crown of the piston is different. I knew the inertial weight was high at 7,000 to 9,000 RPM. But I NEVER imagined it would be as extreme as your equation presents. When building an engine that'll hold together at 8,000+ RPM, this is a critically important factor to consider. My engine often sees 8,000 to 8,500 RPM...!!!!YIKES!!!! 🙂 YES...PLEASE make more of this type of video; as your time allows. Best regards, Ben
Love the math stuff! It blows my mind to try and wrap my head around the times per second the piston travels up and down. Thanks Steve, for taking the time to make the great content...
Steve, thanks for sharing and educating! Being a Nerd (and proud of it) I love stuff like this, more please! This is a just a question (please don't think it's a criticism) do you, or have you thought about, engaging with a mechanical engineer to do FEA and the really mind blowing calculations on your engine parts? To calculate in detail the stresses and strains involved and to maybe see how you could safely reduce weight and/or make things even stronger. Just curious 🙂😎🤓
I was a kid of 16 when my education on building 10K RPM small block Chevy motors began. After more than 50 yrs, I'm still amazed the pile of cast iron, steel & aluminum we call engines don't turn into scrap every time the throttle gets mashed. (Not entirely sure there's no black magic, voodoo or alien influence involved.) When you pay for & build your own engines, you have to force the knowledge of the tremendous stresses put on engine components out of your mind. Otherwise, you'd never be able to wind one up to 7,500 & dump the clutch, (for all you youngsters, think release the little button.) To anyone who's never built an engine, brought it to life & abused the hell out of it racing, it's a mind boggling experience & hard to explain. It's also hard to explain the depths of despair you feel when you break one, too! LOL Love when you geek out on the science, Steve; it's hard not to be giddy, when a guy thinks about this chit. GeoD
Absolutely love it Steve. These videos are awesome. Built engines since I was a clueless kid. I learned by blowing things up and seeing what went wrong, where I messed up. I’d kill to work in your shop. The things I could learn and pass on would be worth their weight in gold.
Anyone ever heard of a money shift? That’s where you miss a gear or downshift by accident and you over rev the engine and it sounds real expensive and starts spitting parts on the ground. Over revving is bad.
Great video, Steve. Why wouldn't you add the pin end weight of the rod? When I balance a V-Twin engine that rod weight is added to the reciprocating weight when calculating the Bob weight... Great channel!
I'm no good at math at all! But I shared this with a friend and this is what he just said. Somebody, please tell me he's wrong. "His math is off. Instead of figuring the RPM squared, he's taking the whole equation times the RPM twice."
I am always here for the tech, definitely keep it coming. I’d love to see something about cylinder pressure from combustion. I would imagine comparing idle combustion to peak torque would be as crazy as when you added little bits of RPM above 8500 with the piston weight.
Steve does a great job of explaining why a rod will be more likely to brake during the exhaust stroke. I would like to see him address why the piston speed is not linear.
Well explained Steve, people don't generally understand what weight does when it's moving. Sidenote, i used to sell drain manhole covers and I've had so many people trying to buy a 2.5 ton rated cover to go in their driveway. After explaining to them that a car can put way more that 2.5 ton through a cover when moving and especially braking and them still insisting to buy it(because it was cheaper) I'd refuse to sell it to them because it wasn't fit for purpose and dangerous.
Absolutely Steve, that is amazing information. We never stop to think about those things we tend to just take it for granted. Very good info. Love it Steve. Keep on bringing that hi tech stuff. Very interesting
Professor Morris, we will happily absorb any and all knowledge you are willing to impart to the class. If school had been this interesting, a lot of us would've done much better. Another wonderful lesson, thank you.
As an engineer that does stress analysis this is great stuff. Keep making videos like this!
I remember doing the math back around 1990. After 6000 rpms the stresses blew my mind. I always tried to build bigger cube engines that peak around 6-6500. I love the sound of 8000+ but it's hard to keep that stuff alive for long intervals. Keep showing this kind of stuff, it's eye opening to most people.
That’s very true. With modern low displacement engines revving to the moon it’s hard to get a sense of a big block over 450ci doing that kind of rpm. That’s a lot of big parts moving very quickly lol
I have always dreamed of building a large displacement motor that would spin to the moon … my wallet would never allow me to though
Nerdy stuff for sure. But still enjoyed it
@@peteward8125- 959 nitrous Pro Mod engines spin over 8000 RPM’s. Put those numbers into the calculations!
Back in the late 60's early 70's Hot Rod magazine published an article with all those math equations in it. Wish I still had it.
This is exactly why I watch this channel. I always though it was the compression stroke that broke the little end of a connecting rod, but this makes so much more sense! I agree that even touching the high side rev limiter is catastrophic, but I wasn't factoring in the weight of the piston, just the violence of the spark cut and the chaos that it creates.
Thank you Steve for the lesson! Keep them rolling.
Thank you for that informative
I'm a carpenter by trade and find your channel just packed full of knowledge. "Knowledge is power" and you Steve have an abundance of both.
And power = strength x speed
Can Steve apply boost techniques and methods to the carpentry arena?! Imagine a nail gun ran by a compressor with an SMX! Some serious Rambo action for the average framer. 🤣😂🤣😂
I remember a bunch of this from the mid 80's in college, now that you bring it back up. At that same time Indy cars were experimenting with ceramic pistons, ceramic pins (or ceramic composites )and magnesium rods. I seem to remember that the failures were because of harmonics, not just the pressures. Now to start with, we're also talking about 3-4 liter 10-16 cylinder engines running 10000+ RPM VS 500+ Cubic inch V8's. So pistons are gonna be much smaller... I'd love to hear your take on this...
Great video Steve; I turned wrenches most of my adult life and still learn something new with almost every video you put out; IMHO, you're among the best of the best in the world of engine building, and your willingness to share it with us, makes you one awsome dude.
God Speed, Mr Morris.
Same here!
Thank you Steve, man, it’s so cool learning some of this stuff. That’s why engines cost the prices they do. You’re paying for a lifetime’s worth of experience
As a mechanical engineer, I love this math and real-life examples! You have tested (blown up) more engines than most and done forensics to understand where safety margins come into play. Thank you for sharing your hard-earned wisdom!
That was some mind-blowing stuff. I had no idea the pressures that we are putting on the pistons. Thanks Steve. I do feel a little smarter.
7.5 tons of force at 10,000 rpm going up and down 166 times per second on the wrist pin. Strongest part in the motor, can see why. Great video Steve.
@@ajk374 i agree. Its holding together Steve’s math in 8 different locations at different times across one shaft.
Love it. I’m a cross over from Clay Millican’s channel, and this is almost as good. I’m a techie. Love and appreciate all of this, make the videos as long as you want.
Thank Mr. Morris much blessings to you and yours!!!
The dynamic loads in an engine are truly amazing, not only on the rod piston combination but also the valve spring, rocker arm and pushrod setup. Cam followers can leave the cam profile at max lift and valves can bounce off of the seats as the cam loses control of the follower when closing. Pushrods can bend and flex adding more dynamic forces to the valve, follower, spring combination also. It's amazing that these high performance engines can even get down the track.
Stuff like this would be for a number cruncher math whiz.
At 150 RPS, figure out how much a single oil ring weighs, the top ring, and then the wrist pin.
I just askefdy, but I'll do it again.
At 150 revs per second, how many miles per hour is a piston traveling in a mile.
.......I can divide by four, do I'll do that part of the equation 😁
Are you familiar with valve loft?
The ramp rates on modern roller cams are insane and never would have been possible without improvements in spring technology and metallurgy in general and the rates still produce enough force to clean break massive aluminum rockers with enough passes.
Nothing quite like the exponential curve of going towards near infinite dynamic loads mathematically and then figuring out just how far you have to back the ramp off to keep things alive.
Pushing limits is an understatement!
@@ElliHarper I tried it a few different ways, all wild math and doubt my math is remotely close. I was encouraging some math braniac to do it correctly.
I guessed 4.5 inches stroke at 150 strokes per second. There's 60 seconds in a minute, 60 minutes in an hour and there is 5280 feet in a mile
Somewhere in there, there must be an equation. I can't wrap my brain around it.
The piston is also traveling at zero mph at one point...... but don't blink. 😁
I tried again and came up with 460 mph.
......you don't want to have me as your accountant. 😁
@@randywl8925 with those figures its more like 76 MPH mean piston speed, 4.5 x 300 (150 strokes per second means it doers a full rotation 150 times per second which means it travels the stroke distance twice that number) times that number by 60 and 60 again to get inches per hour travelled, then divide by 12 to get feet per hour, then by 5280 to get MPH
ABSOLUTELY LOVE this kind of technical information. I am a total gearhead, and this is the meat of my spiritual food! Keep up the great work, Steve. You are a blessing to all of us that love engines but can't afford to play with them to this degree. Thank you and may His face continue to smile on you!
The forces on the parts inside an engine spinning fast are absolutely insane. Hard to believe it actually stays together as long as they do.
Jet engines spinning so fast that the inertia distorts parts. Crazy G-forces. I guarantee you the smx rod is longer during the 9,000 rpm than at rest.
The mind boggles everytime I learn something about serious horsepower engines. Love the videos. Happy to see whatever you come up with.
My dad was a math guy. He would show me this kind of stuff when I was a kid so when things broke, I understood why. Thanks Steve, for bringing back memories of the greatest man I ever knew.
Thank you Steve for taking the time out of your busy schedule to share your knowledge and help others. You Sir are a genius when it comes to drag racing. Once again thank you for sharing your time with all of us. 💪👍
This is an OUTSTANDING video, Steve!! Everything is math, including the physics. Some people clearly don't get why quality engines cost like they do. There's also a reason why F1 pistons are exotic aluminum alloys and cost $50K each to make less than 1/4 of the HP in a SMX while being able to accelerate like a rocket.
Lots of physics, chemistry, thermodynamics, and materials science. Each with loads of math.
To be fair to those F1 guys, they are making their thousand-ish horsepower out of less than 100 ci (1.6l), which is a restriction Steve doesn't have to fight against
Excellent lesson Steve. I always learn something from your videos. It is just amazing that any engine can contain the forces that take place internally, let alone produce 5000+ hp.
These tech vids are amazing.
Knew there was some serious stress inside of an engine but, damn! That’s incredible.
This is why I love your channel if my wife doesn’t understand something I tell her I have her watch your videos because you make it easy for someone that doesn’t understand engines to understand what you are trying to explain to them and for that I thank you
That's absolutely incredible. Mind blowing that it's even mechanically possible. Love your videos I always learn something.
Very interesting. The extreme forces at play are amazing. I think it would also be interesting to compare the numbers on the parts it takes for different engines to live at different power levels. This might help put in perspective the extreme nature your engines. Thanks
How to send a piston to the moon ? Cleeter : hold my Dew.
Apparently this video was changed after it was uploaded, this comment is no longer relevant.
Definitely good to have these more in depth videos on the engineering side of engine building. For me, the piston weight during operation was one of the first things taught. I'm a little surprised you didn't mention pre-detonation with this. Sprinkle some pre-det and maybe jumped timing for good measure, and maybe I won't be the only one twitching from bad memories of bone headed mistakes, lol.
I love the knowledge you share.
As a heavy equipment mechanic that works on diesel engines, I knew there was a lot of stress on the rotating group, but I did not think it was that much. Now I'm going to do the math on a 13.5 liter.
Thanks Steve for taking the time to go over this type of data. Just wondering about coatings and how much they help in the life of the piston. Again thank you.
Steve your information is very interesting and every time I watch one of your videos, I learn something. I am not a hot rod guy, but I am an Engineer and I have interest in your designing engines. Keep up the good work.
That is mind blowing info, and super cool to know, these videos are very interesting to mix in with your regular builds and dyno sessions.
I love the knowledge that Steve shares!!! Crazy when you break down the pressure, forces, and speeds of all the moving parts i freaking love it!!!
All the more important proper balance is, as well as a strong crank and block. All those forces are working to blow expensive shit apart.
Fascinating stuff. How ANY of this works is truly amazing to me. Please keep sharing and educating all of us. Maybe a collab sometime with Engineering Explained? He could maybe fill in some of the gaps in math/equations, but I still feel like some of this is just pure magic 😆
I really like these short technical videos that explain exactly what the engine is going through. Mind blowing
Love your videos Steve. You mentioned the lack of countering forces at TDC on exhaust causing greater stress. I am trying to model this in my mind and I think that the greatest stresses on the rod are at about 90 degrees past TDC on intake stroke. I believe the greatest rate of change of velocity per degree of crank angle (acceleration) would occur at about 90 degrees past TDC (with possibly some correction for errors due to rod length and stroke). However, none of this really changes the forces the math is showing.
I believe you are correct in terms of stresses on the shank of the rod- tension vs compression and leverage is greatest at 90* thereby having the highest difference in tension and compression loads on the rod shank (but during the combustion cycle, not intake). Steve is bringing to light the force that most people don’t think about- inertia weight of a piston not under compression and how much energy the pin and rod are overcoming to keep the piston in a cozy warm block. At 90* ATDC the piston weight acting on the rod is much lower than the force it takes to stop and reverse the piston.
The high RPM changes things- inertia weight. In the engines I work with, large bore industrial diesel, the highest forces and wear spots are on the opposite side of the wrist pin bore but these engines don’t even see 2K RPMs.
I've admired your engines for a while, but watching you explain the design concepts and wear tendencies is priceless!!!
Keep it coming Steve. 3500 hp dyno pulls are sweet but stuff like this sets you apart from other automotive channels. Is there any way to calculate how much it takes to spool a turbo based on engine size and turbo combinations ?
My oldest brother was an engine builder before he passed away. He had is own shop in Douglasville GA, Hurricane performance. Thank you Steve for this useful knowledge.
Steve, I'm interested in the loads placed on the crankshaft during the gear change and what the difference is between a wide ratio gear set and a close ratio set. I greatly appreciate your knowledge and willingness to share.
I have been contemplating the idea of de-stroking my SBC just so I can rev it a bit higher and make more power and this video helped me a lot in making that decision. Very informative. Please keep them coming and thanks for all this informative videos. You are the man!!!!
Great video! I think you need to square the rpm number before multiplying it to the other numbers.
I was thinking same thing and looking for others to say same thing but so far you are the only one. (2 minutes later) I just did the math... and the number was the same. So...never mind. We thought too much about it.
Because it is all multiplication, you can swap the order as you wish and it will give the same results. This is called associativity. Not true if you mix in + and -.
@@SilverFlint247 agreed, just something about a number being squared makes you think you need another step.
Love these types of videos you make like talking about the valves going up and down on the viper. Its amazing.
I would love to see a video on how many pounds of cylinder pressure is pushing on the bottom of a cylinder head on a boosted application! I’ve lifted the head on a couple of engines under boost and just the thought of it stretching the head studs is mind boggling to me.
That would be a neat experiment.
Someone has probably put a pressure transducer in a combustion chamber before. Could use that info and the cylinder size to calculate the forces.
According to banks power, each cylinder pressure sensor is 4000usd lol
Mr Steve, I have been a diesel mechanic for 14 years now. I’m 32 from Ga., I’ve been watching your channel for the past few years and I absolutely enjoy your videos especially the informative ones. “Caution, you may learn something from watching this channel” I remember when you started putting this in your videos and it is always absolutely true. I know a good bit, but knowledge is amazing and power. Keep doing you man. Btw I would love to see a SMF “ford big block your design and improvements”. Wish I could afford either one even the SML even though I’m not a fan of them even with their name and support. I enjoy quality but more so I enjoy good people in this crazy ass world, and I believe you are one of those good people, simply because you help others and share knowledge, “maybe not secrets, but that’s ok lol”, so I do thank you sir and I thank all of those who read this and fall in the same good people category.
P.S. I would love to learn more about cylinder pressures and any other unique information you may provide us with. Thanks again.
Is valve train still the limiting factor, or is it normally piston speed when your setting a rpm limit? Or a factor of both? Love the knowledge Steve. I’m a carpenter but cars have been my passion from before I had a license. Been messing with them just as long 😂
Great question. I often wonder whether using a big block billet bottom end plus an overhead cam design would live longer. 4 valves would certainly be lighter rotational mass on the valve train.
@@skeetamacgyver1821Yes, it would live longer and flow better, but the 3 extra cams and wider and higher engine means you could just increase displacement instead. The ls has a much bigger displacement while being lighter and more compact than a coyote, so in case of a v8 it may just not be worth it.
I love watching you explain the nerdy side of engine building one thing I would love to see is a sit down video again just talking about your life when you started building engines and how it's advanced over the years to where your business is now
As i was following along, it became very clear to me exactly what causes a crankshaft to break and also why mains develope cracks or blow out the bottom completely.
Thanks for always sharing your knowledge
Steve, this one of the best ever you tube's have seen. As someone who as studied engineering and built few engines this spoke volumes to me, and confirmed your wonderful experience. Thank you from Australia.
I'm not the best with numbers but you always have a knack at explaining in a way that makes it easy to digest. Thanks again for another video, Steve. God bless!
EVERYONE! BIG APPRECIATIONS FOR STEVE MORRIS!!!
SM Shines a huge spotlight on a normally "semisecret sauce" of a self gain sport!
AWESOME, for young GEAR-HEADS, to have the opportunity to peer inside the inner workings of STEVE'S speed freak creations, mechanical machinations and DOMINATING motivations!!!
He is a driving, ploughing force full speed ahead illuminating the way like a virulent global pandemic...for the next
GENERATION!!!
GOD BLESS STEVE MORRIS!!!
Absolutely awesome information!!! I'm an automation guy and these numbers are just the coolest measuring points of what is really happening!!
Love it Steve...great tech....let's do some compression/ exhaust...firing ....Rev limiter ...two step what is actually taking place internally
Thanks!
Thanks for the lesson. I really appreciate learning moments as I get older. 💯👍
I fell asleep listening to this last night, we had a really interesting conversation about how often you have to fix overrevved toys in my dreams.
It was awesomely hilarious.
Yes do more of these.
This is a knockout presentation of the loads on the piston/rod combo. Don't stop making these informative vids! I am using a lot of your info in the building and observation of my pulling tractor engine.
These in depth technical videos are great! Reminds me of the older Steve Tech videos.
Bring on more!
Absolute wealth of knowledge. It is appreciated more than I can say the way you take such a complicated subject and make it understandable. Thank you
Thank you, Steve, for taking the time to make informative videos like this. Keep them coming !
I love stuff like this because it can help me avoid breaking stuff or at least be aware of the signs of something about to fail. I do find it somewhat funny how you say, "Have a great day" even though this was published around 7 in the evening. I can't remember ever watching your videos during the day lol. Equally, I will do my best to have a great day tomorrow, as well as every day thereafter.
I love this channel because you never know what your going to learn. This blows my mind and I understand math just the sheer numbers of actual piston weight is crazy
I love seeing the technical stuff, and especially why things are done in certain ways.
Love how you explain how things on / how an engine works. Thanks for sharing your knowledge it is very enlightening. Best channel on you tube. Can’t hardly wait for the next video
GREAT TECH INFO AS USUAL KEEP IT COMING 👍
Great stuff Steve, I had a Lotus twin cam built here in the UK 40 odd years ago by a respected engine builder, and the one thing he said to me and I will never forget it was "the only thing that will kill this engine is over revving it, it will rev and rev and then fly to bits" I never revved it past 7k and it stayed together, and the piston/rod combo was probably half the weight of your stuff.
Steve. Please keep your very very informative videos coming. I found your channel about 6 months ago. I have found that I have learned so much. Even things I thought was right but turned out to be wrong. I’m no pro racer or dragger. I just mess with a 12 car collection of classic Muscle cars. I still have my first car my father co-signed so I could buy. A 1970 nova. 350 punched out .030 over. With lots of goodies. So please I know it takes up your time but you are helping a lot of us home garage mechanics. Love your channel.
This is great information! Keep it coming. Thanks Steve.
I own and drive a 7 sec Honda civic fwd. This video is just full of proper answers to my questions with knowledge. Is just music to my ears the understanding I just received of basic engine wear and tear when pushing this 4cyl to the limit reving 11,000 plus. Thanks!
I would definitely would like to see more , you teach very well and have great insight and information thank you .I try not to miss any post .
Absolutely love these videos. Thank you for taking the time to make these.
All that info is priceless, to enjoy watching the racing. To understand what is going on in those few seconds of pedal to the metal. The forces are mind boggling 😎👍
You talked about how many times a second the pistons are at TDC - BDC at different rpms, what's equally mind blowing is when you go a step further. (I know you know and understand this better than I ever will!!! This is for others) Think about the speed of the pistons, they have to go from a dead stop, start to move, mid stroke they will be traveling at the highest speed, then they needs to slow down, come to a complete stop, then do the same thing in the other direction. When I'm on the highway and the tack is around 3,000 rpms, there's times I think about the pistons being at TDC 50 times every second; sometimes for hours. It really shows how important the lubrication and cooling systems are!!! AWESOME VIDEO!!!
Heck yeah Steve!! That is awesome that you are educating. Like your warning says. You did a awesome job of showing just some of the forces on a piston. Keep up the good work!!!
It’s was a very good video explanation of the pressure developed during the piston cycle and strokes and speeds it’s traveling. Very good explanation of where rods fail at the connecting points between the caps and crank and at the wrist pins and piston.
Good info to get the mind thinking… couple of other dynamics that were sort of touched on is the angular velocity of acceleration and deceleration that is determined by rod stroke ratio. Short rods increase side thrust and increase piston acceleration and deceleration speeds and hence the peak load on the conrods/bearing/ fasteners and pin/piston at those instants where direction changes.. the long rod significantly slows both acceleration and deceleration instants and angular thrust on the piston skirt… the piston is in a “softer” deceleration mode as it approaches tic, and a “softer” acceleration mode after tdc. Simarly for the bottom of the stroke on both sides of bdc. Why a long rod engine can make use with a lighter piston as the vertical and lateral loads on the piston decrease.
It’s amazing the engineering calculation that goes into designing parts that can not only survive but last as long as they do.
Thanks for the video👍
Great stuff man. I like the fact that you take the time to write explain exactly what’s going on inside of an engine.
30 years in mechanics and I dont think I've ever seen these calculations. Absolutely fascinating! It ALWAYS blew my mind how many times a plug fires at 6000 RPM and there is a fire and exhaust. Still cant make that compute in my head that it works. Love these vids...!
I love this technical information Steve keep it coming. I was extremely surprised when you touch the rpm limit and the subsequent reduction of component life.
Excellent analogy of what it takes to keep these things alive. The forces inside racing engines is phenomenal. Lightened parts get Quickly into the "Area of negative returns" lol
Love the technical videos Steve, keep them coming.
!!!!AWESOME information Steve...THANKS!!!!
The piston setup you used as your 2.51Lb example is nearly identical to mine...as is the weight. Only the crown of the piston is different.
I knew the inertial weight was high at 7,000 to 9,000 RPM. But I NEVER imagined it would
be as extreme as your equation presents. When building an engine that'll hold together at
8,000+ RPM, this is a critically important factor to consider. My engine often sees 8,000
to 8,500 RPM...!!!!YIKES!!!! 🙂
YES...PLEASE make more of this type of video; as your time allows.
Best regards,
Ben
Love the math stuff! It blows my mind to try and wrap my head around the times per second the piston travels up and down. Thanks Steve, for taking the time to make the great content...
A snowmobile engine will grenade if you whack throttle without the belt on there to keep it from running over itself
Love all the knowledge from a fellow Michigander that is into the car industry keep the rad knowledge flowing steve
Steve, thanks for sharing and educating! Being a Nerd (and proud of it) I love stuff like this, more please!
This is a just a question (please don't think it's a criticism) do you, or have you thought about, engaging with a mechanical engineer to do FEA and the really mind blowing calculations on your engine parts? To calculate in detail the stresses and strains involved and to maybe see how you could safely reduce weight and/or make things even stronger. Just curious 🙂😎🤓
I was a kid of 16 when my education on building 10K RPM small block Chevy motors began.
After more than 50 yrs, I'm still amazed the pile of cast iron, steel & aluminum we call engines don't turn into scrap every time the throttle gets mashed. (Not entirely sure there's no black magic, voodoo or alien influence involved.)
When you pay for & build your own engines, you have to force the knowledge of the tremendous stresses put on engine components out of your mind.
Otherwise, you'd never be able to wind one up to 7,500 & dump the clutch, (for all you youngsters, think release the little button.)
To anyone who's never built an engine, brought it to life & abused the hell out of it racing, it's a mind boggling experience & hard to explain.
It's also hard to explain the depths of despair you feel when you break one, too! LOL
Love when you geek out on the science, Steve; it's hard not to be giddy, when a guy thinks about this chit.
GeoD
Absolutely love it Steve. These videos are awesome. Built engines since I was a clueless kid. I learned by blowing things up and seeing what went wrong, where I messed up. I’d kill to work in your shop. The things I could learn and pass on would be worth their weight in gold.
Anyone ever heard of a money shift? That’s where you miss a gear or downshift by accident and you over rev the engine and it sounds real expensive and starts spitting parts on the ground. Over revving is bad.
Great explanation! I guess that is one reason so many engine catastrophically expire on the topend when people get off the throttle.
Great video, Steve. Why wouldn't you add the pin end weight of the rod? When I balance a V-Twin engine that rod weight is added to the reciprocating weight when calculating the Bob weight...
Great channel!
Keep showing this kind of stuff. I love learning off beat stuff like this. This channel has a lil bit of everything.
I'm no good at math at all! But I shared this with a friend and this is what he just said. Somebody, please tell me he's wrong. "His math
is off. Instead of figuring the RPM squared, he's taking the whole equation times the RPM twice."
Yes I used wrong terminology
But it is not my math equation
You did it wrong you should have done the square root separately then added that to the equation
I am always here for the tech, definitely keep it coming. I’d love to see something about cylinder pressure from combustion. I would imagine comparing idle combustion to peak torque would be as crazy as when you added little bits of RPM above 8500 with the piston weight.
Loved this video.... thanks, learned so much and those numbers blow my mind...
Steve does a great job of explaining why a rod will be more likely to brake during the exhaust stroke. I would like to see him address why the piston speed is not linear.
I enjoy all of the info you provide. Its very good info and have us looking at things we didn't understand..................thank you
Well explained Steve, people don't generally understand what weight does when it's moving. Sidenote, i used to sell drain manhole covers and I've had so many people trying to buy a 2.5 ton rated cover to go in their driveway. After explaining to them that a car can put way more that 2.5 ton through a cover when moving and especially braking and them still insisting to buy it(because it was cheaper) I'd refuse to sell it to them because it wasn't fit for purpose and dangerous.
Absolutely Steve, that is amazing information. We never stop to think about those things we tend to just take it for granted. Very good info. Love it Steve. Keep on bringing that hi tech stuff. Very interesting