Great episode. Really great to see you guys taking on Caniff. It's hard to overestimate his impact on comics. While the obvious stylistic stuff (the chiaroscuro lighting he developed with Noel Sickles, the reformulation of images not in terms of outlines but in term of splotches of black on white) get a lot of attention, I think an equally big legacy is panel-to-panel transitions. Caniff really was a storyteller and not just an illustrator. He thought, for want of a better term, cinematically, in terms of images flowing from panel to panel, with the panel borders as a camera, rather than characters acting out on a theatrical stage or proscenium. This really distinguished him not just from earlier cartoonists but also his great peers Raymond and Foster, who (at least in their early work before they paid attention to Caniff) were still working as illustrators. Almost all the great comic book artists of the 1940s to the 1960s had at least a touch of Caniff or more than a touch -- with Toth being the one who really refined the Caniff/Sickles approach to its essence. In terms of Kirby, if you read his work in the 1940s you see a progression: the early stuff was heavily influence by Raymond/Foster. By 1946 or 1947 he's paying much more attention to Caniff, which really informs the crime/romance work that Kirby does from then on. And again, it's not just the surface style he's paying attention to but also the panel-to-panel transitions and the thinking-like-a-film-maker. If you want to see Kirby really channeling Caniff, the place to look is "Link Thorne, The Flying Fool" -- an aviation strip Simon & Kirby (mostly Kirby I think) did for Airboy from June to December 1947. 8 stories making up 64 pages. The characters and setting are borrowed heavily from Terry & Steve Canyon, but the stories become Kirby-style fantasies as they progress. But in the series you see Kirby really trying to figure out what makes Caniff tick and how he can use it. It's not swiping so much as a a careful analysis. Worth an episode on its own right (some of the stories have been reprinted in the Kirby Collector and their is a kind of cheapish public domain book)
Hugo Pratt considered Caniff as his main influence, and through him, Caniff's influence reached deep and far both in Europe and South America (specially Argentina) since pretty much everyone that came up after Pratt was influenced by him in one way or another.
What a phenomenal artist. Almost all the Golden Age artists pulled from him. Dean Mullaney is just knocking them out of the park with every book he puts together.
Great job--as anyone familiar with my work knows, Milton Caniff is one of my biggest influences. I appreciate your knowledge of his career and reputation. If you read his biography by R.C. Harvey, you'll see, as you note in your video, that Caniff had tons of irons in the fire, which included his theater work, working on the newspaper and being a full time student and member of Sigma Chi. I don't know how he did it! He really was the quintessential All-American boy, having also been in the Boy Scouts-and he knew how to network and leverage these connections throughout his life. Regarding Steve Canyon and his 1960s/Vietnam War era work-what influenced his strip in this era more than his political leanings was simply his close relationship and ties with the U.S. military (and particularly the Air Force) dating back to World War II. As long as our soldiers were there fighting the fight, he would remain loyal to the military and the personnel. But for better or worse, since he was seen as a hawk with close military ties during an unpopular war, it contributed to the loss of readership and newspapers.
I’m pretty certain those blue washes were ‘engraved’ on the plates using the old-school , original Ben Day process. More of an etch than engraving, really.
That's right. Ben Day was a lithographic process where a Ben Day artist adds the dot tone to the zinc plate before it is etched. Those artists did amazing work especially for color.
37:45 They used the name Paul Arthur decades earlier, when they were working on advertising strips like "Mr Coffee-Nerves". Anyway- what was that about Joe Matt? ;)
As a child in the 70s, doing a daily strip was my life’s goal, so the library’s Caniff reprints were Bibles to me. (Grew up in Toledo, which was a cartoonist hotbed in the mid-20th century.) My favorite strip was Steve Roper & Mike Nomad, drawn by Bill Overgard, who had mentored under Caniff and drew the Steve Canyon comics for Dell. So many cartoonists I’ve admired are of the Caniff School, like Lee Elias, Frank Robbins, Ray Bailey, and Overgard. The Kitchen Sink Canyon mags from the 80s/90s included lots of photos from the era where Caniff (and lots of other daily strip creators, like Al Capp, Walt Kelly, Allen Saunders, etc) were recognizable as celebrities like movie stars. Had to watch this one twice to absorb the greatness from that book. Just love these historical deep dives, guys!👍🏻👍🏻
When I graduated from Archie and Harvey comics to Marvel and DC (aside from prior exposure from comics bought for me, rather than those bought by me with allowance change) one of the first I really got into was The Invaders by Roy Thomas, Frank Robbins and Frank Springer. I later recognized Caniff's influence on Robbin's work, probably through a newsprint zine that reprinted a lot of classic comic strips (don't recall the name) and included both Johnny Hazard and probably Steve Canyon. I'd also see bits of Terry and the Pirates in the Comics Journal. Never got too deep into Caniff, though. I stopped reading The Invaders about an issue after Robbins left. Stuck around for that one issue because Hitler conjuring up Thor (during WWII) was too interesting to pass up, but somehow still underwhelming.
I remember the NBM collections of "Terry and the Pirates" I couldn't afford at the time. I was getting Kitchen Sink's "Steve Canyon" reprints until those ended. So was glad when LOAC did their first Terry reprint and got them, and when they started their Steve Canyon reprint, go that as well. Sad they ended it recently without finishing it. LOAC did a new reprint of Terry, but I passed on. OH, and I got Caniff's first series, Dickie Dare, that was reprinted by Fantagraphics years ago. And one of the Male Call collections.
I have one of his high school year books with lots of great art. I do not remember what year I have. If I can dig it up , I will let you know! Payed 1 hundred at a con long back.
Great episode. Really great to see you guys taking on Caniff. It's hard to overestimate his impact on comics. While the obvious stylistic stuff (the chiaroscuro lighting he developed with Noel Sickles, the reformulation of images not in terms of outlines but in term of splotches of black on white) get a lot of attention, I think an equally big legacy is panel-to-panel transitions. Caniff really was a storyteller and not just an illustrator. He thought, for want of a better term, cinematically, in terms of images flowing from panel to panel, with the panel borders as a camera, rather than characters acting out on a theatrical stage or proscenium. This really distinguished him not just from earlier cartoonists but also his great peers Raymond and Foster, who (at least in their early work before they paid attention to Caniff) were still working as illustrators.
Almost all the great comic book artists of the 1940s to the 1960s had at least a touch of Caniff or more than a touch -- with Toth being the one who really refined the Caniff/Sickles approach to its essence.
In terms of Kirby, if you read his work in the 1940s you see a progression: the early stuff was heavily influence by Raymond/Foster. By 1946 or 1947 he's paying much more attention to Caniff, which really informs the crime/romance work that Kirby does from then on. And again, it's not just the surface style he's paying attention to but also the panel-to-panel transitions and the thinking-like-a-film-maker.
If you want to see Kirby really channeling Caniff, the place to look is "Link Thorne, The Flying Fool" -- an aviation strip Simon & Kirby (mostly Kirby I think) did for Airboy from June to December 1947. 8 stories making up 64 pages. The characters and setting are borrowed heavily from Terry & Steve Canyon, but the stories become Kirby-style fantasies as they progress. But in the series you see Kirby really trying to figure out what makes Caniff tick and how he can use it. It's not swiping so much as a a careful analysis. Worth an episode on its own right (some of the stories have been reprinted in the Kirby Collector and their is a kind of cheapish public domain book)
Hugo Pratt considered Caniff as his main influence, and through him, Caniff's influence reached deep and far both in Europe and South America (specially Argentina) since pretty much everyone that came up after Pratt was influenced by him in one way or another.
FYI- I believe LOAC is no longer connected to IDW. Probably good as IDW seems to be going down. They are part of Clover Books.
Who is considered the most influential? Kirby? Not arguing, just curious what the popular opinion is on that.
Hal Foster
What a phenomenal artist. Almost all the Golden Age artists pulled from him. Dean Mullaney is just knocking them out of the park with every book he puts together.
Great job--as anyone familiar with my work knows, Milton Caniff is one of my biggest influences. I appreciate your knowledge of his career and reputation. If you read his biography by R.C. Harvey, you'll see, as you note in your video, that Caniff had tons of irons in the fire, which included his theater work, working on the newspaper and being a full time student and member of Sigma Chi. I don't know how he did it! He really was the quintessential All-American boy, having also been in the Boy Scouts-and he knew how to network and leverage these connections throughout his life. Regarding Steve Canyon and his 1960s/Vietnam War era work-what influenced his strip in this era more than his political leanings was simply his close relationship and ties with the U.S. military (and particularly the Air Force) dating back to World War II. As long as our soldiers were there fighting the fight, he would remain loyal to the military and the personnel. But for better or worse, since he was seen as a hawk with close military ties during an unpopular war, it contributed to the loss of readership and newspapers.
31:00 Not gonna lie. You guys self editing with puns are commentary highlights. Lol
His influence was huge, even outside of the US. Pratt and Jijé and all the artists that followed them...
26.40 - 4-F - Disabled and Unfit for Military Service
What an amazing body of work! What an amazing life! I've been sleeping on Caniff and I feel like I just woke up
I’m pretty certain those blue washes were ‘engraved’ on the plates using the old-school , original Ben Day process.
More of an etch than engraving, really.
That's right. Ben Day was a lithographic process where a Ben Day artist adds the dot tone to the zinc plate before it is etched. Those artists did amazing work especially for color.
Holy shit what an actual genius
From his mind to the modern day. I took that Navy Night Fighter Squadron Pin-up/Emblem and made her in the Superhero MMORPG "City of Heroes."
37:45 They used the name Paul Arthur decades earlier, when they were working on advertising strips like "Mr Coffee-Nerves". Anyway- what was that about Joe Matt? ;)
As a child in the 70s, doing a daily strip was my life’s goal, so the library’s Caniff reprints were Bibles to me. (Grew up in Toledo, which was a cartoonist hotbed in the mid-20th century.) My favorite strip was Steve Roper & Mike Nomad, drawn by Bill Overgard, who had mentored under Caniff and drew the Steve Canyon comics for Dell. So many cartoonists I’ve admired are of the Caniff School, like Lee Elias, Frank Robbins, Ray Bailey, and Overgard.
The Kitchen Sink Canyon mags from the 80s/90s included lots of photos from the era where Caniff (and lots of other daily strip creators, like Al Capp, Walt Kelly, Allen Saunders, etc) were recognizable as celebrities like movie stars.
Had to watch this one twice to absorb the greatness from that book. Just love these historical deep dives, guys!👍🏻👍🏻
You should do an interview with Underground Comics Legend Larry Welz. The Cherry Omnibus is final dropping and is up for preorder all summer!
👍👍👍
29:27 is the Steve Canyon strip with that big ol' "Kirby Fist" which was later feature on the Steve Canyon book cover 39:15.
When I graduated from Archie and Harvey comics to Marvel and DC (aside from prior exposure from comics bought for me, rather than those bought by me with allowance change) one of the first I really got into was The Invaders by Roy Thomas, Frank Robbins and Frank Springer. I later recognized Caniff's influence on Robbin's work, probably through a newsprint zine that reprinted a lot of classic comic strips (don't recall the name) and included both Johnny Hazard and probably Steve Canyon. I'd also see bits of Terry and the Pirates in the Comics Journal. Never got too deep into Caniff, though. I stopped reading The Invaders about an issue after Robbins left. Stuck around for that one issue because Hitler conjuring up Thor (during WWII) was too interesting to pass up, but somehow still underwhelming.
So happy you all are covering some comic strips! One of the best artists! Sadly, IDW lost all those strip rights.
Spotted some Hernandez brothers panels in there.
Inside bottom right at 11:19 for example - but more as it goes on
I lived in Columbus for a while.
That museum is amazing!!
I need that Omnibust
Great stuff guys
I remember the NBM collections of "Terry and the Pirates" I couldn't afford at the time. I was getting Kitchen Sink's "Steve Canyon" reprints until those ended. So was glad when LOAC did their first Terry reprint and got them, and when they started their Steve Canyon reprint, go that as well. Sad they ended it recently without finishing it. LOAC did a new reprint of Terry, but I passed on.
OH, and I got Caniff's first series, Dickie Dare, that was reprinted by Fantagraphics years ago. And one of the Male Call collections.
I have one of his high school year books with lots of great art. I do not remember what year I have. If I can dig it up , I will let you know! Payed 1 hundred at a con long back.