So funny, I was just talking about this concept earlier and happened to see this video. I currently use Black & Decker tools and have the 20V system including a Drill, Sawzall, Saber Saw, Circular Saw, Weed trimmer and Leaf blower that all use the same batteries. I was thinking if I can hook 2 in series and two in parallel, I'd have 40V and 8 Amp hour for an E-bike and can still use them for all my tools. Nice that you guys have tested some of these concepts. Makes me think I'm not too far off.
I'd suggest modifying a battery adaptor - they sell on Amazon for ~$13 - instead of chopping the bottoms of tools off. If you want to monitor the voltage you'll have to dermal in the extra connection points and figure out the connectors, but it should be loads cheaper. www.amazon.com/Battery-Adapter-Connector-Converter-Robotics/dp/B094FKCG9K/ref=sr_1_2_sspa?dchild=1&keywords=black+and+decker+power+tool+battery+adapter&qid=1626218112&sr=8-2-spons&psc=1&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUFVMU5HMzg1VExXMkEmZW5jcnlwdGVkSWQ9QTAyNDQ4OTQxR1VBWTdKNlY1U01IJmVuY3J5cHRlZEFkSWQ9QTA3MTgxNTEzN0RHTlQwVTNCRVc1JndpZGdldE5hbWU9c3BfYXRmJmFjdGlvbj1jbGlja1JlZGlyZWN0JmRvTm90TG9nQ2xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==
Andy, you need to make a "carriage" that you can slide the batteries on to, then slide and slot the carriage onto the bike. this gives you battery freedom when charging and changing.
I am thinking about making my Chinese gs moon buggy into an electric beast im told a warp 9 with the right battery and controller would help me achieve that kind of power would I be able to use these batteries as they look like the perfect option for putting alot of power in a small box or if you could recommend the best motor for a two wheel drive buggy with enough power to drift as I have one sitting on my drive with a knackered gsxr engine in and was thinking of what my options are? Thanks for your time tony
+Ringway Manchester thanks mate, it's interesting how things have got to a stage where you can purchase batteries off the shelf of a tool shop that have enough power to run small electric vehicles. Hope you are doing well.
I'd been trying to figure out ways to make battery boxes for the pannier rack of my ebike, something removable that didn't look obviously like a battery box, but I never thought of a pelican case. Just mod the back so that it can be locked to the rack, a fuse to prevent the worst sparking, and a selector switch letting it switch between battery packs. I might cut fans into the backs of the cases for ventilation. I could probably fit four to a side, with an arduino for GPS/theft prevention.
+mr melody Hi, that's a good question, the thing you need to be careful of is blowing the capacitors and mosfets in the controller, usually they are rated above the maximum voltage written on the controller but there might not be a lot of tolerance. You could Google the brand name to see if there's a teardown where you could see the Insides without having to take it apart. Or just take it apart and see!
Probably not - the mosfets or internal capacitors are probably rated up to 63V - not a big deal to repair if those are the only things that blow, but still a pain to fix. Possibly good for 14S, or 58V though.
Thank you very much for this video.Any concern about bypassing the battery management system in the packs? How much can they be discharged before damage? I intend to do the same with my 18V Milwaukee packs in a 36V, 1000 watt ebike, and I don't want to hurt the packs. Any way to add a BMS to the rig?
What kind of electric four-wheelers at and how much do you pay for it where can I find and thanks for your help appreciate shoutouts from Chicago Illinois
Have a 36 volt Razor dirt bike and I'm trying to use a ryboi 40 volt 2.6 ah lithium battery pack when I hook it up to the bike it will run forever without a load on it when somebody gets on it it will go 3 feet and the battery will shut off is there anyway to bypass this
I have had 7 of those 6 amp batteries on my Nano kitted Brompton, ALL went wrong on the charging after being used once from new. These have been replaced by Bosch but they are not going to keep doing it. My drill with the same battery has had no trouble but it hasn't been on the bike but the tool has four contacts because of the charging controller in the charger. Any ideas as to why the failures, the batteries have plenty of power in them still, but will not charge on the new charger after a couple of charges, the red light comes on and nothing goes into them.Any ideas from you experimenters. I am a bit Pxxxed off as they were £220 each and the 2 x chargers were £70each.
This is a great idea , it I bet they cost alot more than building your own , but I love the safety and reliability aspect . I have an old peddle assist Panasonic based ebike which is running at 24 v, I wander if it can Handel one of these lack?
+supernova1976 hey, well the popular drill batteries seem to be 14V, 18V or 36V for the powerful stuff so it's just a matter of getting as close to your 24V as possible, things to consider would be what is the voltage of your 24V battery hot off the charger, also try researching what voltage rating the capacitors are inside your controller as that's usually the main limiting factor to determing how much you can push the voltage up.
I set my ebike up on Bosch 18v battery’s in series to make 52v for my setup. It works well ..... but it’s a MASSIVE faff! You have to secure every battery so it doesn’t rattle and when one starts to go off or get old all the other packs follow suit and become the same quality as the half knackered one. In short they do work and are a good gimmick but are not a reliable long term solution for ebike battery’s! Good video though Andy I really enjoy your channel :)
andy kirby yeah I had 6 in total 2 sets of 3 Bosch 18v 5AH packs connected in series and then in parallel as they joined the controller if you get what I mean? Perhaps it was all to much because technically there were 6 BMS all trying to work against each other? But it did get me into series ebike stuff so was a good laugh :)
Just thought I’d comment again and say the way you have them set up seems to work great! Perhaps I should have used all brand new battery’s and not connected in series and parallel! Good job Andy!
4 years later. Im trying to power a small 36v ebike with 2 bosch 18v packs in series, does the BMS is any problem or can just connect them in series and fivenit a go? Thanks.
Did you just guess that these batteries have a bms? Theres some teardown video on here that show that they have NO bms which is pretty crap tbh but you should do proper research
Hi Andy, I have a question for you please, nothing to do with this post though? I have a key switch supplied with my ebike frame with a red and a black wire coming out of it, can you tell me how I wire it up please? Is it a case of just wiring it to the plus and minus of the battery?
+Gary Cheese Cheese hey Gary no don't wire it to the battery or there will be smoke! Your controller should have an ignition wire (maybe a smaller red wire) you take this and connect it to one side of your key switch and the other usually goes to the batter negative. Check your controller manual if there is one.
This is a good deal. I spend 3x$400=$1200 for 39 Ah at 52 volt 6 HOUR charge time 20 amp discharge rate. I ride 100 miles a day and I could ride even more sometimes. My bike makes about 400 eMPG, so it paid itself already, not even the best gas moped comes close. 2 went bad already and they have poor connectors. Herein you can do a lot better 35 amp discharge rate, 72 volts 24 Ah with 6 batteries and 6 chargers under 1 hour charge time! (6 AH is not available in the USA so I use 4 Ah) If the day only has 24 hours and I recharge 4 and use 2 at the time as I do short trips which is a cheaper and lighter system which can do a lot more because of the 8x faster charge time and warranty!!!
@ andy kirby Why don't you buy another 2 battery packs, another charger, that way when you go out you can go take 2 or 4 batteries depending on your whim at the time.
+Solar Function I beat you to it! And I've already made the mounts to fit the batteries on the frame where they can easily be swapped. I'll do another video showing it shortly!
I’m not an expert but I’m learning... so usually a controller that handles 48v can handle 52v ... idk but maybe you would be okay at 54 I’m thinking but not 100% sure. Monitor temp for sure and be careful with the battery that it doesn’t overcharge or become unbalanced.... keep eye on it when charging ... idk what kind of bms dewalt uses
It’s a little Chinese one, didn’t have a brand. There was one on AliExpress or banggood I think a while ago. They pop up from time to time. They usually have SLA batteries in and they are a bit slow. But if you carefully up the voltage you can get about 20mph out of them😁
A=P/V so 2000/72 is 28 amps so yes you can. I would make 36Ah with 6 batteries so you can do a ridiculous 105 amps. your batteries will always be cool and last a lot longer.
can you please explain to me how parallel and series are different and the better or safer way ect i kinDA GET IT BUT I WAS PLAYING WITH MY ELECTRIC QAUD N IT NOW WORKS WITH OLD SNAP-ON BATTERIES ALSO WERE CAN I BUY THESE BMS YOU CONVERT ALL YOUR BIKES BECAUSE IM 33 AND YEA I FALL ASLEEP DRIVING MY VEHICLES NEED MY GURU KIRBY #NOVACUUMS #YTUBEGURU #KIRBYNOTFERBI
Thanks Andy, one question though, Aren't you into Lipo at all ? I bought 2 12000Ah 22.2v batteries and I'm going to try them on my home-made ebike. They're a little swollen but will try and see.
Yeah i ran a lipo company for some years, lipos are great for quick discharge not for reliability. If their puffed up be careful, don’t charge them unattended and make sure you keep an eye on them when your flying down the road or you could get badly burnt!
@@andykirby Thanks for the advice. I store them outside and charge them outside too, always attended. I've had them for 2 weeks. But I'm not planning to use the motor at full throttle, just a helper when it gets hard, so I won't stress the batteries a lot. Thanks for your videos, it's really inspiring and helping. Shame my island won't let Li-ion batteries to be imported that easily. I have to count on getting them from laptops...
@@DaVid-kc3qz You need to check the C RATINGs on lithium batteries. Plus you CANT dis charge LIPO below 3.6..if he wasnt using a low lipo setting alarm and has CRAPPY C rating on crappy LIPO...it'll puff all day long.... I have 50C LIPO...It'll out run the Li on all day long.. They dont puff becuase they're 50C ( more expensive) They make 65c now for decent price. The 18650 cells in LAPTOPS are only 10-15C.... So dont expect the same performance..or add more cells... 8s = 36V ( 16s total)..try add 2 more to 18S total or make bigger mah from 6600 to 8800 or 11000mah so the discharge rate will raise to 20-25 c...if your ESC cant handle 18S In power drills are 20-30c..2200 mah...at best The 18650 cells will CRAP OUT alot sooner than 50C LIpo...FFS How do you think I get recycle Li On cells??? yank then out of power drill battery pack becuase 1-2 cell crapped out from over heating. i make Im own LIon Battery packs i use laptop batteries...but I add extra voltage to cover for less performance... I use them on Powerwheel....6s laptop batteries barely has the same power as my 4s 50C 6s 30c 18650 Sanyo at 6600 mah....barely has the same power as 5s 50 c i can run 8s lipo in electric wheelschairs :-p The ESC i have for it can take 8S lipo..eventhou it's on a 24V 200watt X2 model..it use the same ESC as the 500watt x 2 model The Lion packs barely turns it on..at 12s..lmao
@@oneeyemonster3262 what can I do to make my 36 volt 6ah 450 watt electric scooter top speed increase? Thinking of upgrading the controller to interchangeable volt like 24 36 48 60 1000plus watts..then two 36 volt 4ah or better power tool batteries..my motor stated 450 watts but 36 volt times 6ah isnt 450??I need more advice and input
@@treach5196 amp hours = size of gas tank NOT cranking power. ( octane) drill batteries are LiON 18650 cells...rated at 25C ( discharge/cranking power). You can get LIPO Batteries 50C-100C discharge. it'll basically discharge 2-4 times more electrons through. so you'll want an ESC with higher AMPS ( discharge)..such as 36v at 1000-1500 watt..or 42-48V 1500-2000watt..so it can handle the discharge (HEAT) 10s = 42.2 V when fully charged. Youre motor might not be able to handle that for long... due to over heating ( there;s DIFFERENT wire GUAGE winding in different motors.)..too much heat will fry the Copper wire's COATING.. Create LEAKING and lost of power...at the very least... You might try 9s LIPO or 10S LION You can get BRUSHLESS 1800-2000w motors ( it's the same size as 1000Watt brushed motor.) for $100-$120..through a 2500 watt esc.... 1000watt BRUSHED are only $65 Or Keep an eye out for USED Treadmills...i found one on side of road for FREE..The motors in them are 2 H.P - 3 H.P..BRUSHED D.C. ...2000watt at 96V @ 4500-5000 rpm. It;s LONGER than the 500watt motor on my MX 500 ( 3000 rpm)...but not as big in diameter as my 1000watt brushed motor ( 3500 rpm) I can run 48V at half the RPM and H.P....or 60V through it 1500watt. around 25 mph but it's wahzooo more than the 300watt 24v stock s300 motor 12 mph My schwin gose slightly faster 350watt on 24V..mostly likely with a 500 watt ecs... it's kind of confusing...because MFG over rate and label things different watt = H.P.....550watt = 1 hp. there about. Not all motors has the same WINNING ( number of winning/truns..and WIRE GAUGE....hence they'll have dfferent RPM..verse TORQUE ratings. My mx 500 is 36V at 500watt RATING..Id feel safe at 42V ( fully charge) it'll run at 40V average..but with a 1000 watt or higher ESC. 12v Lead acid when fully charge are around 13.7 V...x 3 around 40V at the top end...but NOT as high DISCHARGE as the LIPO.lol scrape the PAINT off the motor mount and scooter frame...so the heat will transfer to the frame better...to help lower temperature.
Yeah you can, they are bigger and most likely have lead acid batteries which isn’t the end of the world because you could do with a bit of weight on a quad.
andy kirby think it would be intresting an e quad on road to get back on for places like around town sort of think but still staying legal i know alibaba sell alot of quads and ebikes ect
If cost isn't an issue, you could get 4 chargers, rip out the guts and wire up the connectors and mount on the bike for quick release. Have to make sure any batteries in parallel are very similarly charged (< 0.1V difference), or bad things can happen! I like the modular approach too - I harvest laptop batteries, and made a bunch of 1S modules with 2x8 cells with around 35 Ah each - I can use 14 of these strung together with split HXT connectors for the ebike or connect many more in parallel for any configuration for a ups or home inverter. Just like lego!
+Andy Lee Robinson cool about the cell harvesting! I actually found some USB chargers that fit on the top of these batteries, perfect for ripping apart giving you a nice flat battery mount which can just be screwed to any flat surface. Regarding paralleling batteries I've been reading some info about dangers when paralling batteries together that have in built BMS' apparently the full voltage of the series banks presents itself on the mosfets of a tripped BMS therefore if the mosfets are not capable of handling this voltage you may blow them and find yourself stranded. Do you know anything about this?
Yes, it's important that the contacts mate as perfectly as possible or they could melt, or with your experiment, solder the cables to the contacts! If the contacts for the USB chargers are meaty enough then would save having to hack the batteries with XT90s or similar and still keep them usable with the drill. I haven't done any work with BMSs yet, but there may be gotchas. AIUI, a tripped bms should go open circuit, and yes, in a single string, the voltage across it would be the number of Ss minus 1, if the controller doesn't also notice and shut down too. However, in a parallel string, the controller can't notice a failed BMS because of its other still-working sibling cell(s). I wouldn't worry about this because these cells will keep the voltage drop across the failed pack fixed to their own voltages because they are hard wired. The issue here then becomes less severe - the remaining siblings just become more vulnerable to overdischarging early as their combined capacity is reduced compared to other packs in the chain, and a master BMS would not be able to keep these balanced!
Without sounding like a stalker lol, is there a way of contacting you by phone to ask you some questions I’d find it easier than messages. And just started watching your vids and there top watch matey
Do you guys have Echo Tools over there in UK? I've got an electric BMX bike running off these Echo Tools 58v (52v nominal) 4Ah batteries. They barely get warm at 40A discharge. I've got two paralleled for 8Ah and I get around an hour of messing around the neighborhood and I"ve hit a top speed of 42mph. ua-cam.com/video/GA6HvPu6OSY/v-deo.html I really like the tool battery idea. I'd love to try to run mine in series, but I'm real worried I'll burn the mosfets in the BMS at 100v+
I use ten 6S 5200Ah Hobbyking lipos with my magic pie V for the last 2 years and have babied them by keeping between 30-90% charge, and their capacity has not declined noticeably. Have done at least 5000 miles on it.
+Andy Lee Robinson yeah this is what I'm talking about, if you treat them well they will be great. You also need to weed out the bad packs right in the beginning. To give you an idea I ordered 5 multistar packs at the begining of my ebike journey and 2 turned out to be bad right out of the box. Hobbyking were great at replacing them but it was just a pain. I also had 18S in the quad, balanced every charge and only run at 35A max. They were fine until left at 3.8v a cell over a few months without use outside in the quad until one day I came down and found one pack had puffed. Babying them is definitely necessary.
I feel your pain there, but replacing one lipo is getting off lightly! Still, 3.8V is optimum storage voltage and it should have lasted relatively indefinitely in a cool place. I was very lucky - they mailed me a deal at €26 each so I got 6 and they were fine, and for that price ordered another 4 because I had a feeling demand and price would soon increase rapidly. They've performed flawlessly (you can see them here being charged with my home made folding solar panels: ua-cam.com/video/c64cdfHuuiQ/v-deo.html ) Definitely got to look after them though, unplug when not in use and keep indoors away from anything flammable. Can't afford any more for a while though, but have collected hundreds of laptop cells to assemble into bigger packs which will do hundreds of kilometers. Few months ago I rode it from Budapest to Lake Balaton and back over two days, charging using the solar panels in a field, and once in a coffee shop. 340km!
+Andy Lee Robinson wow 340km that's awesome! I love long range test runs! You've definitely been lucky with the lipos I also think the trick is keeping them active and make sure they don't get too Hot when in use. Sounds like you've got it nailed!
Yes, they did get used almost daily - lots of small mountains here to explore.... :-) That trip was great apart from the headwind, so just took it about half speed to conserve energy and enjoy the ride. Went to visit another ebike youtuber, whom you probably already know of - ua-cam.com/video/agGzT8TgXcw/v-deo.html - I think he's now building a 60kW bike... argh! Check out Vortecks too with his adventures: ua-cam.com/play/PL3Rqaj8tXgriU-y1gIiZb22lj0LHdCG7S.html - so much talent here! I'm not always lucky though! A week after that trip, a taxi turned across me and I ended up on my back for a month with a broken pelvis, collar bone and various ribs and couldn't ride for a couple of months. Not fun at all. Hope to ride the 2000km back to England all on solar power when the sun comes back!
good idea if your going to use /buy the tools that take the batterys then u get more use out of them tbh for price id go mikita sony vtc cells 30 amps vs 15 percell and the tool are far far better bosh =diy tho some of there new stuff look ok like there getting back in the game either way buy the tools too you never know when thay will come in handy and u can swap batterys between devices ebike drills etc 1 type of charger job done www.milwaukeepowertools.co.uk/milwaukee-m18b9 these guys do a 18v 9ah good cells too look at ave on you tube for tear down of all these packs
Fun video, lots of folks have used power tool batteries over the years, people on the ES forum used to buy the A123 packs and strip them to make bigger packs, Hobbyking Lipo is fine, I have been using it for 10 years or so, someone technical like you can use them with no issues, its normally battery monitoring or BMS systems that kill those batteries. Using power tool batteries is a very expensive way for a technical chap like yourself to build a battery, you would be better off with a system like this fella has done here if you dont like using hobby lipo. ua-cam.com/video/PPyHvkypKjo/v-deo.htmlm55s
Hi, I’ve taken them apart and there is a balancing board in there and some sort of system for telling the charger and power tool if there’s a problem with the battery.
@@andykirby so why did it happen to me ? Why did a lot of people made videos on the subject ? Why did bosh not make soldered connection but brass or copper ones ? Go find the proper plate to stuck in this hole please.
Using power tool batteries is a very expensive way for someone technical to build a battery when you could buy 2 of these with over double the capacity, 3 times the performance at half the price. hobbyking.com/en_us/turnigy-graphene-professional-12000mah-6s-15c-lipo-pack-w-xt90.html
So funny, I was just talking about this concept earlier and happened to see this video. I currently use Black & Decker tools and have the 20V system including a Drill, Sawzall, Saber Saw, Circular Saw, Weed trimmer and Leaf blower that all use the same batteries. I was thinking if I can hook 2 in series and two in parallel, I'd have 40V and 8 Amp hour for an E-bike and can still use them for all my tools. Nice that you guys have tested some of these concepts. Makes me think I'm not too far off.
I'd suggest modifying a battery adaptor - they sell on Amazon for ~$13 - instead of chopping the bottoms of tools off. If you want to monitor the voltage you'll have to dermal in the extra connection points and figure out the connectors, but it should be loads cheaper.
www.amazon.com/Battery-Adapter-Connector-Converter-Robotics/dp/B094FKCG9K/ref=sr_1_2_sspa?dchild=1&keywords=black+and+decker+power+tool+battery+adapter&qid=1626218112&sr=8-2-spons&psc=1&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUFVMU5HMzg1VExXMkEmZW5jcnlwdGVkSWQ9QTAyNDQ4OTQxR1VBWTdKNlY1U01IJmVuY3J5cHRlZEFkSWQ9QTA3MTgxNTEzN0RHTlQwVTNCRVc1JndpZGdldE5hbWU9c3BfYXRmJmFjdGlvbj1jbGlja1JlZGlyZWN0JmRvTm90TG9nQ2xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==
Any chance you still have them batteries and don't use or want them anymore?
Andy, you need to make a "carriage" that you can slide the batteries on to, then slide and slot the carriage onto the bike. this gives you battery freedom when charging and changing.
Hi Andy any chance you could make a video of making of the 4 batterys wired up for 72 v pack
Mike
How did I miss this vid ? I have 4 of these with 2 triangle shaped chargers ... thought I may use for EV Global 36V folding mini e
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I am thinking about making my Chinese gs moon buggy into an electric beast im told a warp 9 with the right battery and controller would help me achieve that kind of power would I be able to use these batteries as they look like the perfect option for putting alot of power in a small box or if you could recommend the best motor for a two wheel drive buggy with enough power to drift as I have one sitting on my drive with a knackered gsxr engine in and was thinking of what my options are? Thanks for your time tony
Worked really well mate! nice one
+Ringway Manchester thanks mate, it's interesting how things have got to a stage where you can purchase batteries off the shelf of a tool shop that have enough power to run small electric vehicles. Hope you are doing well.
I'd been trying to figure out ways to make battery boxes for the pannier rack of my ebike, something removable that didn't look obviously like a battery box, but I never thought of a pelican case. Just mod the back so that it can be locked to the rack, a fuse to prevent the worst sparking, and a selector switch letting it switch between battery packs. I might cut fans into the backs of the cases for ventilation. I could probably fit four to a side, with an arduino for GPS/theft prevention.
I know its my late reaction but I need something like that 36v for my Escooter if its cheaper compare to Escoot battery with same range
Can this be done with dewalt batteries?
Thats a awesome playground you have. Is that what they call hedgerow? Cool how there are trails inside, makes for fun videos !
Andy I have a 48v 1000w rear hub motor eBay kit.
What would happen if I tried 72v on it would the kit controler handle it?
+mr melody Hi, that's a good question, the thing you need to be careful of is blowing the capacitors and mosfets in the controller, usually they are rated above the maximum voltage written on the controller but there might not be a lot of tolerance. You could Google the brand name to see if there's a teardown where you could see the Insides without having to take it apart. Or just take it apart and see!
Probably not - the mosfets or internal capacitors are probably rated up to 63V - not a big deal to repair if those are the only things that blow, but still a pain to fix. Possibly good for 14S, or 58V though.
Thank you very much for this video.Any concern about bypassing the battery management system in the packs? How much can they be discharged before damage? I intend to do the same with my 18V Milwaukee packs in a 36V, 1000 watt ebike, and I don't want to hurt the packs. Any way to add a BMS to the rig?
What kind of electric four-wheelers at and how much do you pay for it where can I find and thanks for your help appreciate shoutouts from Chicago Illinois
Have a 36 volt Razor dirt bike and I'm trying to use a ryboi 40 volt 2.6 ah lithium battery pack when I hook it up to the bike it will run forever without a load on it when somebody gets on it it will go 3 feet and the battery will shut off is there anyway to bypass this
As a test try 2 batteries in parallel.
I have had 7 of those 6 amp batteries on my Nano kitted Brompton, ALL went wrong on the charging after being used once from new. These have been replaced by Bosch but they are not going to keep doing it. My drill with the same battery has had no trouble but it hasn't been on the bike but the tool has four contacts because of the charging controller in the charger. Any ideas as to why the failures, the batteries have plenty of power in them still, but will not charge on the new charger after a couple of charges, the red light comes on and nothing goes into them.Any ideas from you experimenters. I am a bit Pxxxed off as they were £220 each and the 2 x chargers were £70each.
How well did the solder connections between the batteries.
This is a great idea , it I bet they cost alot more than building your own , but I love the safety and reliability aspect . I have an old peddle assist Panasonic based ebike which is running at 24 v, I wander if it can Handel one of these lack?
+supernova1976 hey, well the popular drill batteries seem to be 14V, 18V or 36V for the powerful stuff so it's just a matter of getting as close to your 24V as possible, things to consider would be what is the voltage of your 24V battery hot off the charger, also try researching what voltage rating the capacitors are inside your controller as that's usually the main limiting factor to determing how much you can push the voltage up.
andy kirby thanks mate didn't know what to check , I have to open it all up and have a look.
+supernova1976 👍
@@andykirby Milwaukee m12 line might be the right setup, 2 of them should get you close to 24v
Thanks for the weather box idea.
i recommend the dewalt flex volt system 56 volt if i remember right
I set my ebike up on Bosch 18v battery’s in series to make 52v for my setup. It works well ..... but it’s a MASSIVE faff! You have to secure every battery so it doesn’t rattle and when one starts to go off or get old all the other packs follow suit and become the same quality as the half knackered one. In short they do work and are a good gimmick but are not a reliable long term solution for ebike battery’s! Good video though Andy I really enjoy your channel :)
+Toby Walker Interesting, regarding the issues you had, were they linked in parallel as well as series?
andy kirby yeah I had 6 in total 2 sets of 3 Bosch 18v 5AH packs connected in series and then in parallel as they joined the controller if you get what I mean? Perhaps it was all to much because technically there were 6 BMS all trying to work against each other? But it did get me into series ebike stuff so was a good laugh :)
Just thought I’d comment again and say the way you have them set up seems to work great! Perhaps I should have used all brand new battery’s and not connected in series and parallel!
Good job Andy!
4 years later. Im trying to power a small 36v ebike with 2 bosch 18v packs in series, does the BMS is any problem or can just connect them in series and fivenit a go? Thanks.
Did you just guess that these batteries have a bms?
Theres some teardown video on here that show that they have NO bms which is pretty crap tbh but you should do proper research
Hi Andy, I have a question for you please, nothing to do with this post though? I have a key switch supplied with my ebike frame with a red and a black wire coming out of it, can you tell me how I wire it up please? Is it a case of just wiring it to the plus and minus of the battery?
+Gary Cheese Cheese hey Gary no don't wire it to the battery or there will be smoke! Your controller should have an ignition wire (maybe a smaller red wire) you take this and connect it to one side of your key switch and the other usually goes to the batter negative. Check your controller manual if there is one.
andy kirby cheers your a star.
Thanks Andy, food for thought.
Whats the run time when you have the batteries fully charged ?
It’s more about distance, it has about 10 miles range with 4 of these batteries.
They use this set up on brompton nano kits and they have a dock for the battery on the bike.
Would this work 🤔 in a powered wheelchair..
I want to go faster than 32kph
This is a good deal. I spend 3x$400=$1200 for 39 Ah at 52 volt 6 HOUR charge time 20 amp discharge rate. I ride 100 miles a day and I could ride even more sometimes.
My bike makes about 400 eMPG, so it paid itself already, not even the best gas moped comes close. 2 went bad already and they have poor connectors.
Herein you can do a lot better 35 amp discharge rate, 72 volts 24 Ah with 6 batteries and 6 chargers under 1 hour charge time! (6 AH is not available in the USA so I use 4 Ah)
If the day only has 24 hours and I recharge 4 and use 2 at the time as I do short trips which is a cheaper and lighter system which can do a lot more because of the 8x faster charge time and warranty!!!
What is this quad bike man?
Is it just electric or is it on petrol?
How do i do this?? :)
Looks fun
How many miles could you travel?
.3
@ andy kirby
Why don't you buy another 2 battery packs, another charger, that way when you go out you can go take 2 or 4 batteries depending on your whim at the time.
+Solar Function I beat you to it! And I've already made the mounts to fit the batteries on the frame where they can easily be swapped. I'll do another video showing it shortly!
@@andykirby any chance you can show this video of mounts and wiring.
Thanks
Could you let the Bosch batteries stay in series and charge the with a 84v custom charger or is it some protection in the bms?
Hi I'm currently building a bike I have ordered a 48v 1000 motor would my dewalt battery 54v work fine with the standard controller
I’m not an expert but I’m learning... so usually a controller that handles 48v can handle 52v ... idk but maybe you would be okay at 54 I’m thinking but not 100% sure. Monitor temp for sure and be careful with the battery that it doesn’t overcharge or become unbalanced.... keep eye on it when charging ... idk what kind of bms dewalt uses
Yes as most go to 63v max even cheap Chinese do
Can I use a 60v battery in a 36 v bike.
Hi Andy
What quad is this you have?
Thanks
It’s a little Chinese one, didn’t have a brand. There was one on AliExpress or banggood I think a while ago. They pop up from time to time. They usually have SLA batteries in and they are a bit slow. But if you carefully up the voltage you can get about 20mph out of them😁
I need to make a 72v30ah battery to power my 2000w brushless motorcycle would I be able to use this same method
A=P/V so 2000/72 is 28 amps so yes you can. I would make 36Ah with 6 batteries so you can do a ridiculous 105 amps. your batteries will always be cool and last a lot longer.
my ebike is a craftman 2ah and a dewalt 6ah both 60volts, short range but it perfect
How long does it run the bike
can you please explain to me how parallel and series are different and the better or safer way ect i kinDA GET IT BUT I WAS PLAYING WITH MY ELECTRIC QAUD N IT NOW WORKS WITH OLD SNAP-ON BATTERIES ALSO WERE CAN I BUY THESE BMS YOU CONVERT ALL YOUR BIKES BECAUSE IM 33 AND YEA I FALL ASLEEP DRIVING MY VEHICLES NEED MY GURU KIRBY #NOVACUUMS #YTUBEGURU #KIRBYNOTFERBI
Thanks Andy, one question though, Aren't you into Lipo at all ? I bought 2 12000Ah 22.2v batteries and I'm going to try them on my home-made ebike. They're a little swollen but will try and see.
Yeah i ran a lipo company for some years, lipos are great for quick discharge not for reliability. If their puffed up be careful, don’t charge them unattended and make sure you keep an eye on them when your flying down the road or you could get badly burnt!
@@andykirby Thanks for the advice. I store them outside and charge them outside too, always attended. I've had them for 2 weeks. But I'm not planning to use the motor at full throttle, just a helper when it gets hard, so I won't stress the batteries a lot. Thanks for your videos, it's really inspiring and helping. Shame my island won't let Li-ion batteries to be imported that easily. I have to count on getting them from laptops...
@@DaVid-kc3qz You need to check the C RATINGs on lithium batteries.
Plus you CANT dis charge LIPO below 3.6..if he wasnt using a low
lipo setting alarm and has CRAPPY C rating on crappy LIPO...it'll puff
all day long....
I have 50C LIPO...It'll out run the Li on all day long..
They dont puff becuase they're 50C ( more expensive)
They make 65c now for decent price.
The 18650 cells in LAPTOPS are only 10-15C....
So dont expect the same performance..or add more cells...
8s = 36V ( 16s total)..try add 2 more to 18S total
or make bigger mah from 6600 to 8800 or 11000mah
so the discharge rate will raise to 20-25 c...if your ESC cant handle 18S
In power drills are 20-30c..2200 mah...at best
The 18650 cells will CRAP OUT alot sooner than 50C LIpo...FFS
How do you think I get recycle Li On cells???
yank then out of power drill battery pack becuase 1-2 cell
crapped out from over heating.
i make Im own LIon Battery packs
i use laptop batteries...but I add extra voltage to cover for less
performance...
I use them on Powerwheel....6s laptop batteries barely
has the same power as my 4s 50C
6s 30c 18650 Sanyo at 6600 mah....barely has the same power
as 5s 50 c
i can run 8s lipo in electric wheelschairs :-p
The ESC i have for it can take 8S lipo..eventhou it's on
a 24V 200watt X2 model..it use the same ESC as the 500watt x 2 model
The Lion packs barely turns it on..at 12s..lmao
@@oneeyemonster3262 what can I do to make my 36 volt 6ah 450 watt electric scooter top speed increase? Thinking of upgrading the controller to interchangeable volt like 24 36 48 60 1000plus watts..then two 36 volt 4ah or better power tool batteries..my motor stated 450 watts but 36 volt times 6ah isnt 450??I need more advice and input
@@treach5196 amp hours = size of gas tank NOT cranking power. ( octane)
drill batteries are LiON 18650 cells...rated at 25C ( discharge/cranking power). You can get LIPO Batteries 50C-100C discharge.
it'll basically discharge 2-4 times more electrons through.
so you'll want an ESC with higher AMPS ( discharge)..such as
36v at 1000-1500 watt..or 42-48V 1500-2000watt..so it can handle
the discharge (HEAT) 10s = 42.2 V when fully charged.
Youre motor might not be able to handle that for long...
due to over heating ( there;s DIFFERENT wire GUAGE winding in
different motors.)..too much heat will fry the Copper wire's COATING..
Create LEAKING and lost of power...at the very least...
You might try 9s LIPO or 10S LION
You can get BRUSHLESS 1800-2000w motors ( it's the same size
as 1000Watt brushed motor.) for $100-$120..through a 2500 watt
esc....
1000watt BRUSHED are only $65
Or Keep an eye out for USED Treadmills...i found one on side
of road for FREE..The motors in them are 2 H.P - 3 H.P..BRUSHED
D.C. ...2000watt at 96V @ 4500-5000 rpm.
It;s LONGER than the 500watt motor on my MX 500 ( 3000 rpm)...but
not as big in diameter as my 1000watt brushed motor ( 3500 rpm)
I can run 48V at half the RPM and H.P....or 60V through it 1500watt.
around 25 mph
but it's wahzooo more than the 300watt 24v stock s300 motor 12 mph
My schwin gose slightly faster 350watt on 24V..mostly likely with
a 500 watt ecs...
it's kind of confusing...because MFG over rate and label things different
watt = H.P.....550watt = 1 hp. there about.
Not all motors has the same WINNING ( number of winning/truns..and WIRE
GAUGE....hence they'll have dfferent RPM..verse TORQUE ratings.
My mx 500 is 36V at 500watt RATING..Id feel safe at 42V ( fully charge)
it'll run at 40V average..but with a 1000 watt or higher ESC.
12v Lead acid when fully charge are around 13.7 V...x 3 around 40V
at the top end...but NOT as high DISCHARGE as the LIPO.lol
scrape the PAINT off the motor mount and scooter frame...so
the heat will transfer to the frame better...to help lower temperature.
This is fist time I have ever wanted any sort of EV.
I have ask you this batteries!will it work for e bike?How long range?
Hey andy is it possible to find a road legal electric quad just out of curiosity ?
Yeah you can, they are bigger and most likely have lead acid batteries which isn’t the end of the world because you could do with a bit of weight on a quad.
andy kirby think it would be intresting an e quad on road to get back on for places like around town sort of think but still staying legal i know alibaba sell alot of quads and ebikes ect
Yeah it would be great, this is why I just bought a Renault Twizy (see my latest video!)
If cost isn't an issue, you could get 4 chargers, rip out the guts and wire up the connectors and mount on the bike for quick release.
Have to make sure any batteries in parallel are very similarly charged (< 0.1V difference), or bad things can happen!
I like the modular approach too - I harvest laptop batteries, and made a bunch of 1S modules with 2x8 cells with around 35 Ah each - I can use 14 of these strung together with split HXT connectors for the ebike or connect many more in parallel for any configuration for a ups or home inverter.
Just like lego!
+Andy Lee Robinson cool about the cell harvesting! I actually found some USB chargers that fit on the top of these batteries, perfect for ripping apart giving you a nice flat battery mount which can just be screwed to any flat surface. Regarding paralleling batteries I've been reading some info about dangers when paralling batteries together that have in built BMS' apparently the full voltage of the series banks presents itself on the mosfets of a tripped BMS therefore if the mosfets are not capable of handling this voltage you may blow them and find yourself stranded. Do you know anything about this?
Yes, it's important that the contacts mate as perfectly as possible or they could melt, or with your experiment, solder the cables to the contacts! If the contacts for the USB chargers are meaty enough then would save having to hack the batteries with XT90s or similar and still keep them usable with the drill.
I haven't done any work with BMSs yet, but there may be gotchas. AIUI, a tripped bms should go open circuit, and yes, in a single string, the voltage across it would be the number of Ss minus 1, if the controller doesn't also notice and shut down too.
However, in a parallel string, the controller can't notice a failed BMS because of its other still-working sibling cell(s).
I wouldn't worry about this because these cells will keep the voltage drop across the failed pack fixed to their own voltages because they are hard wired.
The issue here then becomes less severe - the remaining siblings just become more vulnerable to overdischarging early as their combined capacity is reduced compared to other packs in the chain, and a master BMS would not be able to keep these balanced!
Andy Lee Robinson 9
Can I put these on my grandads tricycle?
3:38 I didn't see that hat off, Andy? :D
Without sounding like a stalker lol, is there a way of contacting you by phone to ask you some questions I’d find it easier than messages. And just started watching your vids and there top watch matey
Cool video man liked and subscribed. I run my Ebike off 3 20v Hercules batteries from harbor freight.
Do you guys have Echo Tools over there in UK? I've got an electric BMX bike running off these Echo Tools 58v (52v nominal) 4Ah batteries. They barely get warm at 40A discharge. I've got two paralleled for 8Ah and I get around an hour of messing around the neighborhood and I"ve hit a top speed of 42mph.
ua-cam.com/video/GA6HvPu6OSY/v-deo.html
I really like the tool battery idea. I'd love to try to run mine in series, but I'm real worried I'll burn the mosfets in the BMS at 100v+
I am looking for a non-shitty Electric throttle for ebike. Does someone know were to find it? Thx
+Anton Npn search domino electric throttle it's the best there is and higher quality than some real motorcycle ones.
I use ten 6S 5200Ah Hobbyking lipos with my magic pie V for the last 2 years and have babied them by keeping between 30-90% charge, and their capacity has not declined noticeably. Have done at least 5000 miles on it.
+Andy Lee Robinson yeah this is what I'm talking about, if you treat them well they will be great. You also need to weed out the bad packs right in the beginning. To give you an idea I ordered 5 multistar packs at the begining of my ebike journey and 2 turned out to be bad right out of the box. Hobbyking were great at replacing them but it was just a pain. I also had 18S in the quad, balanced every charge and only run at 35A max. They were fine until left at 3.8v a cell over a few months without use outside in the quad until one day I came down and found one pack had puffed. Babying them is definitely necessary.
I feel your pain there, but replacing one lipo is getting off lightly! Still, 3.8V is optimum storage voltage and it should have lasted relatively indefinitely in a cool place.
I was very lucky - they mailed me a deal at €26 each so I got 6 and they were fine, and for that price ordered another 4 because I had a feeling demand and price would soon increase rapidly.
They've performed flawlessly (you can see them here being charged with my home made folding solar panels: ua-cam.com/video/c64cdfHuuiQ/v-deo.html ) Definitely got to look after them though, unplug when not in use and keep indoors away from anything flammable.
Can't afford any more for a while though, but have collected hundreds of laptop cells to assemble into bigger packs which will do hundreds of kilometers. Few months ago I rode it from Budapest to Lake Balaton and back over two days, charging using the solar panels in a field, and once in a coffee shop. 340km!
+Andy Lee Robinson wow 340km that's awesome! I love long range test runs! You've definitely been lucky with the lipos I also think the trick is keeping them active and make sure they don't get too Hot when in use. Sounds like you've got it nailed!
Yes, they did get used almost daily - lots of small mountains here to explore.... :-)
That trip was great apart from the headwind, so just took it about half speed to conserve energy and enjoy the ride.
Went to visit another ebike youtuber, whom you probably already know of - ua-cam.com/video/agGzT8TgXcw/v-deo.html - I think he's now building a 60kW bike... argh!
Check out Vortecks too with his adventures: ua-cam.com/play/PL3Rqaj8tXgriU-y1gIiZb22lj0LHdCG7S.html - so much talent here!
I'm not always lucky though! A week after that trip, a taxi turned across me and I ended up on my back for a month with a broken pelvis, collar bone and various ribs and couldn't ride for a couple of months. Not fun at all.
Hope to ride the 2000km back to England all on solar power when the sun comes back!
is that youtuber vuaeco?
good idea if your going to use /buy the tools that take the batterys then u get more use out of them tbh for price id go mikita sony vtc cells 30 amps vs 15 percell and the tool are far far better bosh =diy tho some of there new stuff look ok like there getting back in the game either way buy the tools too you never know when thay will come in handy and u can swap batterys between devices ebike drills etc 1 type of charger job done www.milwaukeepowertools.co.uk/milwaukee-m18b9 these guys do a 18v 9ah good cells too look at ave on you tube for tear down of all these packs
Fun video, lots of folks have used power tool batteries over the years, people on the ES forum used to buy the A123 packs and strip them to make bigger packs, Hobbyking Lipo is fine, I have been using it for 10 years or so, someone technical like you can use them with no issues, its normally battery monitoring or BMS systems that kill those batteries.
Using power tool batteries is a very expensive way for a technical chap like yourself to build a battery, you would be better off with a system like this fella has done here if you dont like using hobby lipo.
ua-cam.com/video/PPyHvkypKjo/v-deo.htmlm55s
So I can take 2 24v drill batteries to make a 48v 1000 watt ebike
hi from Italy
Andy there is No BMS in theese 36 volt batteries
Hi, I’ve taken them apart and there is a balancing board in there and some sort of system for telling the charger and power tool if there’s a problem with the battery.
A BMS with cell level balancing connection to each cell or just the voltage meter like in mine 2.6 amp pack for my bosch rotak
Do you have a email i can send picture to ?
Yes andy@cloudsto.com
@@andykirby Do these 36v packs automatically cut-out and prevent over discharge or is down the to the appliance to do that ?
DO NOT SOLDER WIRES WITH CRIMPING OR CLAMPING CONNECTOR IT WIIL MELT
It won’t.
@@andykirby so why did it happen to me ? Why did a lot of people made videos on the subject ? Why did bosh not make soldered connection but brass or copper ones ? Go find the proper plate to stuck in this hole please.
Didny know that exist quad bikes electric
id put 4 on the inside for 24 amps
$179.00 each at wal mart USA.
+HypasMusic that's cheaper than the UK price 😣
That's only for the 4.0Ah pack. Apparently the 6.0Ah is EU, UK only? Seems weird. Maybe its a shipping restriction...?
Using power tool batteries is a very expensive way for someone technical to build a battery when you could buy 2 of these with over double the capacity, 3 times the performance at half the price.
hobbyking.com/en_us/turnigy-graphene-professional-12000mah-6s-15c-lipo-pack-w-xt90.html
ooh
Less face and more project shots pls...