God Of War Ragnarok Is Not A Masterpiece... And That's Okay
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- Опубліковано 1 жов 2024
- Man, it's already been a year since God of War Ragnarok released. How time flies. A year filled with terrifying lows, dizzying highs, and creamy middles. So I think it's worth it now to examine how God of War Ragnarok holds up now that the hype is died down. Because there's no doubt that the general Hype surrounding a big releases perhaps makes you miss things that would otherwise be more apparent. I think there's a decent amount of things about God of War Ragnarok that I noticed after my initial playthrough. I feel like it's one of those games where in the moment, while you're playing it, it's an enthralling experience. But I feel like cracks start to show up when you've left it to simmer for a while. Well, sort of. Seems like God of War Ragnarok is another one of those games where there is absolutely no middle ground as far as opinions are concerned. It's either amazing, or it's everything wrong with modern video games. With no apparent middle ground. But I think a lot of that comes down to these days anyway, some people not viewing media through the lens of what they do and don't like, but rather whether or not they do or don't represent everything they like or dislike about the larger media landscape. But I've been banging that drum for so long I wouldn't be surprised if it technically classifieds as an antique. I just wish there was more space for nuance in game discussion. So here I am to hopefully readdress the balance somewhat, as I attempt to explain why in hindsight I don't think that God of War Ragnarok is a masterpiece… but it didn't need to be.
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Add credit to the Unversed Cast for the Ragnarok episode I appeared on. (Taken without permission)
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Thanks for that recommendation👍🏼 He deserves like 100x more subscribers, just amazing covers! 🤘
How do you feel about Fat Brett videos on God of War?
UA-camr FatBrett made some great videos surrounding Norse Characters, Freya and other characters from the Norse God of War Games. You should give them a watch and maybe you can make a video expressing your thoughts on those videos that FatBrett made.
People need to learn that a game doesn’t have to be perfect to be enjoyable. A lot of people think that a game is flawless simply because they like it, but it’s ok to like a game whether it’s perfect or not
I enjoy plenty of films, games and shows, that I know aren’t perfect, but I still like them, simply because i like engaging with them.
This has been common sense with Palliser99
Ye, Skyrim is very flawed, but people still play it till this day.
I must the biggest fan of Homefront the revolution
Hardly anything in this universe can be considered Perfect and that's fine. There are also Objective flaws and Subjective Flaws.
A game doesn’t need to be a masterpiece, it just needs to be enjoyable
Well said 👏 👌
Too bad gow fails at both.😊
@@leonardfabian8942what are you smoking? Can I have some?🥺
And Pokemon ScVi horrifically fails at both
NGL I think it’s a masterpiece 🤷🏾♂️ I found it much more enjoyable than the first game except the Atreus missions
A year already ? Damn Time flies by and i agree that its still a extremely good game but not a masterpiece
What games do you think deserve that title
@@quandaledingle9735I guess… nothing.
A masterpiece could be something that has no flaws; maybe it could be something that stands the rest of time; maybe it could be something that sparked a new era or revolutionized an idea.
Regardless, what matters is if a game is enjoyable. Doesn’t have to be a “masterpiece” to be enjoyable.
@@Dr.Oofers this seems ai generated, but anyways why is that word even a thing then? Surely it has a purpose. Oh wait, it does. I just searched it up and you should too. And by it’s literal definition I’m 100% sure god of war ragnarok is a masterpiece
@@Dr.Oofers A masterpiece doesn't have to be perfect. The word is not synonymous with "flawless"
@@quandaledingle9735 The Witcher 3
If this game was split into two games, that of course means the second game would need some kind of final boss of its own, and I feel that Heimdall would have been a great fit, since a big portion of the game is centered around gaining the ability to defeat him. They would probably have to make some adjustments to the story such as having the fight take place a bit later and making it more grand and epic, but I'm sure they could have definitely pulled it off. Then you could have the Tyr/Odin reveal in the epilogue as normal, and finally end on a cliffhanger with Kratos officially declaring war, leading up to the hypothetical third game.
Plus, both Heimdall and Baldur share similarities in that their deaths ultimately trigger the events of the next game. Baldur's death of course triggers Fimbulwinter, the premise of the second game, and Heimdall's death triggers Ragnarok, the premise of the third game. It would have been nicely poetic in a way.
I also would include Atreus in the fight as well, as it would be genuinely satisfying to see him get some actual payback against Heimdall for all the torment he put him through.
Man I would of loved for the game to have done what you just described
The game was too focused on tugging at emotions instead of building a grand story that surpasses the first in spectacle power scale and lore. Things like fimbulwinter and Ragnarok an epic boss fight with Thor in the end instead of the arena trash we got. They shouldn't have changed directors coz this is 2 different visions. Many characters wasted as well
Definitely, this game really suffered from trying to cover too much in one game and, to me, the ragnarok section suffered the most. It felt so fast. Like, we’ve been leading up to this cataclysmic event to determine the control of the 9 realms and then, bam, we done in like 20 or 30 min. I have put over 500 hours into this game but man, the subsequent playthroughs really highlighted how this game covers sooooo much in comparison to gow2018.
Omg that would have been amazing and might have given them the time to actually expand on stuff. Heck then the third game would be you building up the army for the war gaining allies throughout the story with Sutr being one of the first you meet only to leave him alone maybe to go seek Sigmarin for help for both to well either decide to work together, change fate by having one sacrifice themself for the the other or just not joining and sharing the secret to Kratos and Atreus for Kratos to exploit. Asgard could have also been built up more to make it worth being the second half of the game as you go through the industry of the Aesir destroying their weapons and tools along the way to further weaken them while fighting some Aesir especially Thor a few times before defeating and turning them to our side or killing them.
Great video, but one point I disagree on is how quickly Freya changes her opinion on Kratos. She has him travel to Vanaheim to free her from her curse, and throughout the journey, they talk about family and their struggles. Kratos even talks about killing his wife and daughter. Freya feels sorry for him and even a bit apologetic, as she now knows he understands her pain. At the end of the mission, after she frees herself from Odin's curse, she admits that she can't forgive him, but she also can't kill him either. I think that writers did a fantastic job on that character arc, making it believable and real.
True. Even at the end she really hasn't forgiven him for it. Tho the shippers definitely do ignore it.
Is it my idea or do people always forget about the Svartalheim tunnel section in the mission to create the spear? In that part she is technically confessing that she is using Kratos for her personal benefit, that the "I forgive you" thing is a 50/50 where in part she understands Kratos and wants to have an alliance with him and on the other hand she knows that Kratos is a very useful card that she could take advantage of in her deck for her objective, which is basically to kill Odin, and what It's even more curious that after that, when you finish the mission and get on the train, Freya mentions that a disagreement of opinions will not be enough to end this alliance, and shortly after the girl leaves the house when she realizes that Kratos is no longer going to follow the plan to kill Heimdall, something that would obviously screw up Odin, I don't know, those actions, at least to me, show that if Kratos doesn't agree with her personal interests, then he simply leaves it aside. because he is no longer useful to her, but not in such a bad way, because she partly respects him, both him and Atreus.
It's always the shippers fr XD@@Comicbroe405
There was nothing realistic about that. You don't go from murderous rampage to extremely friendly wanting the man who killed your son to be the new GOW. It didn't fit her character which has been established as stubborn and extremely protective over her son. She then switched to agreeing he needed to DIE, which was insane.
The Vanaheim section is what turned me off completely from the game. It was so incredibly robotic, "kill some enemies, climb while Freya and Kratos talk and Kratos makes Freya less angry, walk a bit, repeat" and then after doing that 3 times, boom, boss fight and the conflict is resolved. I couldn't believe THAT'S what they decided to do with her character, it's such a step down from 2018's unbelievably natural dialogue and character progression
Honestly, Ragnarok is one of the few games where I think I would actually love a Director's Cut. More room to grow and time to repolish or tweak some things would do wonders. I agree with the video 100% though that the greater gaming landscape should be more accepting of games that are just great. So much is put into the GOTY discussion that we often lose sight of all the fun the runner ups gave us.
If this comment is meant to say elden ring is a more quality game I have to disagree
@@enol1466 maybe you replied to the wrong comment lol, I haven't even played Elden Ring
@@NigelMelanisticSmithExactly The Ragnarök Fanboys Have Only 1 Explanation And That’s Your An Elden Ring Fan! Lol They Need To Come Up With Something Sensible.
@@SICKHYPERI am an elden ring fan, I used to enjoy gow so much and was biased for it and I wanted ragnarok so bad to be what elden ring was to me but I was completely let down and I didn't enjoy the game at all I wanted more from it. Elden ring brought me back to gaming I thought I just didn't like video games anymore but no I just don't like the new era of video games and the paths they're taking, elden ring felt different and actually enjoyable to me vs ragnarok which felt like watching a movie that was kinda nice but too long and where the gameplay was too controlled or closed off to a very strict path. Being a fan of elden ring isnt what made me dislike this game so much since I disliked it way before playing elden ring but then I played elden ring and it reinforced the why I didn't like ragnarok because it was what I had hoped to get out of ragnarok
@@dylan6996 that seems like an issue on your expectations tbh.
Ironwood is definitely that Sweet Baby Inc. writing rearing it's ugly head to meet that ESG score.
I hate it to the core.
Yea ironwood isn’t fun. But keep in mind it’s only 45 minutes of 25 hours. Also ironwood was shorter than the atrocity of alfiem in 2018
Yeah, they just shoe horned it in to shut up the Sony California people
Completely meaningless to the plot aside from one or two things
@@MW_Asura it literally served a major point to Atreus’ story. I’d rather speedrun ironwood than gow4 alfeim due to it being shorter and had a fun boss at the end
The game isn't perfect, but I still love it unconditionally.
pathetic
For what ? Dosn't make no sense
@@DarkKing-z6bwhat about it specifically makes no sense
@@DarkKing-z6bCry harder 😢 😂
I'm with you
Now I get the same opinion about this game as spiderman 2- it's not perfect and could've done several things otherwise, but that doesn't mean for a moment the game isn't good. It has many strengths
"No amount of severed heads or women slept with will ever be as brave or as manly as admitting to your faults and doing better."
LOUDER FOR THE ANDREW TATES AND SNEAKOS IN THE BACK
Thank you my manz was cooking
On the topic of the 9 Realms seemingly not being populated:
Midgard: apart from Raiders, who are "savage enough to survive" the Fimbulwinter, the rest of Midgardians have either died or were "rescued" by Odin - and you can see them in Asgard on multiple occasions;
Svartalfheim: densely populated by Dwarves, but when you arrive there they all hide in their houses (so the number od buildings in Nidavellir is roughly how many Dwarves live in the city). You can hear some of them though when approaching the closed doors;
Alfheim: since the Elves are in a constant state of war, the realm's population consists entirely of warriors. And all of them attack you on sight. Yes, we all hate Alfheim.
Vanaheim: shortly after getting there for the 1st time you get a line from Freya about how the Vanir commonfolk went into hiding in the woods to survive the Aesir invasion;
Asgard: after meeting Heimdall, you can see the inside of the walls of Asgard; so, again, the number of houses somewhat gives you an idea of how many people live there. You can see some of them while riding Gulltopr.
Not talking about Jotunheim, Helheim, Niflheim and Muspelheim for obvious reasons.
Your points about lack of nuance and maturity in video game discourse is spot on! I'm so glad you get it because it really is a concerning and increasing trend nowadays. It's always in extremes. Too high or too low. So many great moments go unspoken about games which ruins the growth and understanding of video games as a medium or even an artform. Ironically, sometimes, people who preach about modern games killing the industry are the ones who kill it, by blocking valuable and nuanced discourse. The video game discourse overall is still quite young, video essay trend on the internet hasn't really helped much to develop it apart from a few individuals. Once again thank you so much for mentioning about it because it's a much needed discussion.
They need to improve the quality of the writing with the Egyptian saga onwards. Imagine the Egyptian gods with animal appearances dropping curse words and modern day language like the Norse pantheon. Greek GOW games had great writing.
Couldn’t agree more.
Yeah, Thor saying "dumbass" felt off, not even MCU Thor did that
To be fair, profanity fits viking gods
@@My6119 I don't think profanity is the problem
@@My6119
That’s the issue with this kind of thinking. The language fits the characters. Kratos isn’t super casual now, and neither are people like Freya who REALLY should not be so lax. The Aesir, though, do two things: drink, and fight. Of COURSE they’d talk like frat boys who just got back to their home to play FIFA and pass out.
Enemies not flenching on GGOW is my only issue with the game otherwise it’s one of my favorites
Really good video. I love this game and you managed to express what I think about it. It's true some parts aren't on par with the rest, mainly the ending as you said, but it still is a really good game that I enjoyed thoroughly. Kratos' evolution is well made and I loved to see it unfold throughout these 2 games. I don't know what'll become of him but god I want to play the next game quick
Yeah I agree. While I do think that the Norse saga did not need to be a trilogy, my mind has changed knowing the fact the only Norse gods we fought were 3 of them While there are PLENTY of Norse gods who would have been perfect bosses (kinda like Forsetti). So yes, the game has a pacing issue and if the pacing were to be done differently, then we would have gotten that cut story mission where we recruit Sinmara. Regardless, God Of War RAGNARÖK was awesome. Flawed, but awesome non the less.
6 gods* Atreus, Freya, Thor, Heimdall, Odin and Gná (Mimir at the end tells you to your face that Gná, despite having a Valkyrie design, is a Vanir goddess)
Yeah I think we should have had more varied boss fights instead of the same 6 random animals that are just boring. Also I think GOW 2018 had much better gameplay for combat the bosses were better and weren’t just HP tanks like ragnarok where everything has too much health for no reason and just makes combat 10x less enjoyable
@@mrfilmreviewcriticman4110 What are you saying? Literally in Ragnarok that problem of recycling bosses was reduced considerably, as well as the life bars, the fights last the typical of a boss fight, between 5 or 6 minutes, it's just your nostalgia hitting harder than usual, it's like the complaint of runic attacks, which in theory in Ragnarok do less damage. Or maybe it's just my experience... even though I always played it on the highest difficulty.
@@mrfilmreviewcriticman4110 by bosses you mean the 163 trolls?
@@martinc8965just compared the Norse Sega to Greek era kratos. You can see the Greeks had way more list of bosses over Norse. I truly didn't care about Buldur being a main boss nor Heimdall.
If you deserve a reward you should get a reward. If you are the best at something and you win an award it's yours. This idea that you should be limited on the amount of rewards you get is a crazy take. (assuming all competition is fair) If you win you win that's it.
Winning an award or more is great, winning ALL of the awards just raises plenty of questions...
@@theotherohlourdespadua1131 again I'm not saying one game should win an award just because. I'm saying if all things are fair In competition if a game deserves to win an award give it that award, simple. I'm saying if it's deserved then it's deserved.
@@josephmarshall2295In general, what you said is true. In the context of the Video Game Awards? Not really convinced their methodology is impartial...
I guess it depends on your definition of the word masterpiece. A game that made me cry, feel a ton of feels and have epic gameplay for hours on end is a rare thing now days. Sure there were some let downs but overall i would still clasify it as a masterpiece :)
Completely agree! Only game that´s ever made me cry, gotta count for something I quess!
Just as long as you don't make that claim objectively, or try to cram it down other peoples' throats. I love Final Fantasy VII, and Nier Automata. But unlike the rest of those fanbases, I'm not going to make any "masterpiece" claims about those games, because I know its highly subjective.
Wrong as he said just because you liked it doesn’t mean it’s a master piece
No
I remember being turned off from GOW 2018, because I heard everybody call it a movie game. I just took what other people said at face value and didn't decide for myself.
Then I later played the game and really enjoyed it.
It’s funny because I had the opposite experience. I heard the game was a 10/10 so I tried it out. It’s a very good game and really technically impressive but I really didn’t have a good time with it and I don’t really know why. Just didn’t click with me I guess, glad others love it though!
@@PointlesslyNecessaryConvosjust say you have no taste.
@@johnpantag472let's be honest gow 3 is still a lot better than gow 2018. I'll say Ragnarok was better than 2018
Gow 2018 set the bar for expectations for Gow R. Unfortunately it did not meet them from what was implied
Probably the biggest dissappintment for me. Loki sucked character wise; hell almost all his sections aren't good at all from what I saw.
So much Norse mythology was barely used and Surtr was completely wasted character wise. Says a lot that Fire Emblem Heroes, a gacha game with an okay story at best and bad at worst, did Surtr leagues better and the whole Muspell mythology way better and more creatively than GoWRagnarok.
The biggest disappointment for me is not seeing through the rift and no Artemis to hunt down Kratos
Do you realize that you're basically asking for the game to explain the meaning of life itself?
@@buckyhurdle4776Tell me! What happens next?!?
@@buckyhurdle4776they shouldn’t have made it so important then. Quite frankly the story of ragnarok was the weakest point, gameplay goes hard though
I'm totally in agreement that Ragnarök should've been split into two games, cutting off at around the Tyr/Odin reveal. However, I have my own idea for how it'd ideally go.
Odin would still be the final boss, but you'd instead battle him directly after he kills Brok and he attempts to make off with the mask. The fight starts off outside Sindri's home, and as the phases progress, the battle gets taken all over the roots of Yggdrasil as both sides get more and more desperate to win, in a battle so intense that it shakes the very roots of the world tree and makes all of the realms tremble. It'd provide a very strong spectacle as well as give us a taste of just how dangerous Odin is when he's forced to get his hands dirty. In the end, Kratos would prevent Odin from taking the mask, but Odin manages to kidnap Atreus and teleport back to Asgard to use as leverage. The ending would give Kratos a lot to think about, dealing with his failure to keep Atreus safe but remaining resolute in his quest to bring him back, as well as preparing for Ragnarök.
In the hypothetical third game, we'd be assembling allies for the battle. Kratos and Freya have further bonded by this point (to what extent, who can say). But intermixed with the adventures on Kratos' side of things, we'd also get perspective changes to Atreus every now and again, living as a prisoner in Asgard and trying to cope with his own failures, blaming himself for everything that's happened. Odin, meanwhile, fully realizing that he's instigated the very thing he's been trying so hard to avoid, has become increasingly paranoid and neurotic, forcefully silencing any questioning or disapproval of his actions and motives through vicious punishment or death, as well as laying out abuse on Atreus and blaming him for the way things are now. His appearance may even become more haggard and disheveled as a result of his slipping sanity. Atreus would be able to tap into his "Loki" persona and use his wits and cunning to escape Asgard, eventually reuniting with Kratos. From there, the stage would be set for the final battle.
I'm happy about the ending with DID get, but I'll concede that the third act feels like a chunk of a different game was just grafted onto an already finished product. It's like someone gave you a five-star full course meal for dinner and randomly hands you a slice of pizza to finish it all off. Yeah, it's good. But somehow it lessens the overall experience in a way that's kinda hard to articulate.
Love it!
If they do fight in the roots I would love it if Odin almost kills Kratos only for the lindwyrms to rip him a new one and summon enemies to attack Odin mostly as some retribution for that whole mess
Definitely not a masterpiece but dang is it still incredibly great. The team who works on these games just make such incredible works of art
It was the 2nd biggest candidate in GOTY, almost won game of the year when there were so many good games released at that time. Your saying its not a masterpeice, okay tell me what is a masterpeice and how it is created, GOWR got beautiful and phenomenal storywriting, character development, open world, side quests, characters, details, graphics, dialogues AND A HELLA DAMN LENGTHY game. IGN gave it a 10 by 10 and so did other major review channels.
The only thing which is not a masterpiece is your opinion which 99.21 of the human population disagrees with
@@AgentPrine chill is just a game
@@AgentPrinedude chill out. It's my personal favourite game of all time but that doesn't mean it's everyone's, everyone is entitled to an opinion. Don't be a dick :)
agreed@@finger3306
Honestly, really appreciate you making this video. It’s nice to hear someone talk about a game being great despite its flaws, and talking about how a game can still be good even with flaws. You don’t hear that kind of thing from many people. Like you said yourself, you usually either hear pure positivity, or pure negativity more often than not, so it’s nice to hear someone talk about both the positives and the negatives. It’s also nice hearing you talk about things not being perfect not meaning they’re bad. Perfection is a subjective topic, and there’s always gonna be someone who thinks something isn’t “perfect” because it doesn’t fit their idea of what the term means. Just because something isn’t “perfect” doesn’t mean it can’t be enjoyed, or that it’s bad. And hey, even if you think something is “perfect” doesn’t mean you shouldn’t be open to other people’s opinions, within reason of course. Anyways, really enjoyed the video.
Also just wanted to say I loved that bit you did with sonic frontiers and players choice. As a fan of the game, it was absolutely hilarious watching all that shit go down before the game awards and it makes me so glad I left the community long ago and just enjoy the games without having to deal with the crazy fans.
It lived up to the hype. That's all it needed to do
Mfs with an xbox be like " ragnarok was just a movie!! I could only watch it bro!" 🤤
I genuinely loved your take on what ragnarök could’ve been. Having the finale being split between 2 games kinda like GOW 2 & 3. I very much agree.
your idea of kratos getting near death against odin and atreus taking over and then kratos taking over was literally what happened in the spiderman 2 venom.boss..And people hated it. lol
To be honest for me this is the worst God of war game I have ever had the displeasure of playing because it has no soul, it feels life less all the characters are hollow caricatures of what their meant to be and Odin is so boring I forgot what his mine plot was while trying to finish the game
"The worst in the franchise" people always say this whenever a new sequel comes out.
To be honest before this one i have never not liked a God of war game
I think your standard of what makes something a masterpiece is far too high. Masterpieces aren't supposed to be a rarity or anything like that, and calling all great games masterpieces doesn't somehow devalue the word. There are hundreds of thousands of games that are considered masterpieces, and there are more masterpieces being made every year in every entertainment industry. Masterpiece is not synonymous with perfection by any means. A masterpiece would be similar to a musician putting on a virtuoso performance, or writing a great song that affects the listener on a deeper level, whether that song is very complex (like Final Fantasy 7), or very simple (like Mario). By that standard, all of the mainline God Of War games are masterpieces in their own right because they are each special for their own reasons just like a great song that stands the test of time, and left it's mark on people. Also, the Resident Evil remakes, Alien Isolation, and both TLOU games are masterpieces as well, flaws and all. Basically, it would take nothing short of a top level team of devs (top level virtuoso's in game development) to create such games of that quality, and if those developers weren't recognized as virtuoso's before, they are now after the games release. It's all art, so part of the way we judge video games, and films are subjective, but it's pretty obvious when something is a masterpiece, and God of War Ragnarok fits that description, as do many other games.
I hated God of War Ragnarok because of the writing. It barely resambles what god of war used to be. People say „the series matured and grew up“ but that’s not the case with Ragnarok. It absolutely was with 2018 where it matured and grew up, but Ragnarok‘s only resemblance to OG God of War are Kratos‘ design and the Blades of Chaos, but even then, the Blades don’t have any of the significance it had in 2018
Its generic. Has almost no new ideas. Its characters and their relationships are like something out of a middle brow tv show. I can only imagine that people praise it because it's a video game and for some reason aping film/television is seen as progress? Nevermind that they just give you answers to puzzles.
The best thing one can say about these games is that they're exceptionally well made on a technical level.
Something not having new ideas is not really a bad thing, though.
Not everything needs to be revolutionary, or even should be, trying to make something for the simple purpose of making something new is like reinventing the wheel, there's no need for it.
@@nattythepanda4692But if something is supposed to be a masterpiece being excellent it's not enough
I mean, that really shouldn't surprise you given that you're just following the game just for the story. The original Call of Duty Modern Warfare 3 was said to be "middling and derivative" by critics despite the fact its purpose of existence is to follow through the story of the last game...
I beg to differ, it is a masterpiece. But you not finding it a masterpiece is okay.
Not a masterpiece. Its a fine game, i have like 150 hours in it but the story feels rushed, like them resolving the freya conflict with a few lines of dialogue just feels goofy. They trauma dump each other for like 15 minutes then theyre all good again. They also brush off the jormangandurr thing so lazily. They make him recognizing atreus in 2018 seem so significant, then in ragnarok he just shows up, slithers away, makes it to ragnarok, then is gone in a 5 second fight scene with thor.
Game had so much potential but them making it into 2 games instead of a trilogy really messed the pacing and story up.
@@doot7427I wouldn't say that being a duology messed up the story. Yeah a few things could've been fleshed out more but the story itself is still solid.
If it is a masterpiece then why does Reddit seem so insecure about criticism? They keep taking down posts that gives even the slightest criticism. There was a post about this video and they almost immediately took it down.
@@JV-km9xkThat's fanboyism, nothing to do with the game.
fanboy like you are the reason people with brain silent to let you enjoy your delusions
Honestly this is the best review of the game ive seen, i agree, its not the best thing ever, but i still did really like this game, even if it wasnt the masterpiece i was expecting, and i think the future of the series is really bright for this series.
It helps when you remain objective during a first viewing/reading/playthrough, etc. Odin's identity was entirely possible to see, but that's just for a minority of people, like me. People with the eye for detail with writing.
Too many details pointed in the direction of Tyr's identity being Odin for it to be a coincidence, and became outright guaranteed for me as time went on. We never see Tyr and Odin together, for starters. One of Odin's ravens was watching the door to Tyr's cell. Tyr always kept to his closet, and that made less sense as time went on, as did his pacifism. Nobody can be a pure pacifist in this setting and still be alive, not without heavy accomodations to their lifestyle to accomodate it, and so on.
Tyr was ultra-sus by mid-game.
I personally agree with everything you said in this video, mainly about how it could've been split into 3 games to flesh out the story more and how things could've been done differently (looking at YOU Ironwood 😮💨). To me, nothing will top the original game in terms of it's story because we're immediately put in control of this badass warrior whom we know nothing about and gradually learn more about who he is and why everyone was so afraid of him and follow him all the way down his path of revenge. However, GOW 2018 absolutely blew me away with it's story and still does today. Seeing just how much Kratos has changed since the old games truly was a sight to behold. Not only that but seeing him actually get the chance at being the father he never got to be was an emotional rollercoaster full of ups, downs, twists and feels. Been a die hard fan of these games since childhood and will continue to be well into the future
Legitimately my least favourite GoW game ever but its still good.
As good as it was TECHNICALLY i just didnt get a good feeling from it,left a bitter taste for some reason
One of the biggest setbacks ive seen for this game is the companion backseating, the atreus sections being incredibly long and uneventful, and the walk and talk story twlling moments being more like multi hour podcasts that youll have to sit in a boat forever to hear the whole thing.
I really hated the story and writing of this game. Only liked the game up to the first Thor fight.
same with me and the first game , first Baldur fight was awesome...the rest...it bored me to be honest
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It’s a good story arc, the game took like almost zero risks with gameplay however and the fighting system was pretty weak outmatched by Evil West which was a AA game at best, not AAA. The puzzles were pretty weak as well, not helped by that ‘the protagonist tells you the solution 60 seconds in because game must go oooonnn’ system.
I've played evil west and the gameplay isn't even close to ragnorak you end up doing the exact same combo multiple timed and there's not any depth the shooting is good tho
@@redninja3056 for Ragnarok, basically I just cycled through each of the three weapons until whatever I was fighting died. In some cases being limited to 2 weapons in the event the enemy was fire/ice resistant or some such. Very limiting especially that it takes quite a while to even get the 3rd weapon. Evil west had so many weapons and routes I was spoiled for choice. Did I use repetitive combos? Yeah probably because both games have certain combos that are stupid good.
Yea Atreus telling us the puzzles was annoying
The gameplay was awesome though imo
I thought it was a masterpiece when I played it and it has declined in no way shape or form for me since.
Huh
The game has overall aged kinda bad for me due to the pacing mainly. However Kratos' arc & the combat just keep me coming back. EDIT: The DLC is peak tho wow
Ending a story is very difficult and, for me, that's the problem with Ragnarok. Few days ago I explain to a friend why I don't like this game very much and I just keep in memory those "flaws"(In my opinion, of course) and now watching your video I could remeber some of great moments this game have. And I agree with you about the third act. For me it's very rushed and the wasted plot of the mask was very disapointing. Agreeing with you again, 3 games would work very much. And, for me, Thor should die after Brokk in a moment of pure rage from Kratos... And that's for my personal desire: You should play with Mjolnir...
Recency bias and just players jumping the hype wagon really clouded this game’s flaws, the problem with this is that when developers just see positive feedback they’ll have no incentive to fix the problems with the game
It's not even close to a masterpiece. It is a seriously flawed game in a ton of ways, and has woke shit filling in the cracks.
Go outside, stop worrying about "woke" shit. What are you even talking about?
So you do know that angrboda is Loki's wife in Norse lore, right?
And yet you could write a book on all the liberties they took with Norse mythology otherwise.
@@TBP no but I doubt Loki getting with thor's daughter would go over well in the family
@@chrisjacobsen7265 *remembers last game were both her brothers were killed by kratos and one by atreus.*
I agree... its partialy wierd
👈😲 look at the norse lore loooooook 👈👈👈👈👈😲😲😲😲😲 still sucks
My deepest condolences for the loss of your cat. *virtual hugs* 🤗
I'll be honest my problem with 2018 and Ragnarok is they aren't good games, to me. The story is what does all the heavy lifting. To the point I'd recommend people just watch the story and not "play" the game. They wanted to make a movie but shoved it though a game shaped hole. And even now it's like the story has a missing piece. And on the game awards thing. It's become about fellating the big new game from big publisher. The last of us 2 year is what finally broke me.
2018 GoW > GoWR, but GoWR is still very good.
15:55
I’d honestly split the Iron wood section into 2-3 separate visits so the attraction and dynamic between Atreus and Angraboda has time to develop and stew in the background between several hour long gaps of gameplay. Instead of several events happening back to back all in one visit.
I just replayed it last week and the section feels like it has a few different stopping points that were all smushed together into one long event.
I honestly thought it was gonna be a repeat visit thing which scared me cause I didn’t want to spend another several hours at a time back there. But yes if it was more split it would have been better.
i havent played god of war Ragnarok atall i've watched a friend play it and i've watched walkthroughs and to me it's a good game don't get me wrong just from what i have seen i do not own a ps4 or a ps5 i am currently waiting for it to come to steam so i can play it on pc instead with my pc controller and mouse and keyboard, from what i have seen i see it as a game that's very good don't get me wrong but i do agree they could have done more for the final battle with Ragnarok and Odin especially Odin, how thor was killed i will never agree with i would have been happier if he tried to fight Odin to stop the madness and was killed that way, and Kratos would get angry and show Odin the true god of war he was in the old days just this once but Atraus would manage to calm him down at the end just before he kills him and the whole marble thing the boy does would still happen but on the version of Odin that you described the super Odin idea and then Sindri would do what he does, this is the only opinion i will give untill i have played it myself i have thought extensively on this coming up with my own reasons and such on what i think should have been different and i have played every god of war game but this 1 and the phone game personally i prefer the OG god of wars but i will never condem the modern 1's all because they are so different in alot of ways, thats just stupid and people who are willing to do such a thing without even giving it a chance have no right to do such a thing to begin with and need to shut up go play the games in question and have thier OWN opinions and thoughts on the games NOT REPEATING OTHERS all because they are fans of the person and worship the ground they walk on
I may be in the minority here but I actually thought ragnarok was a masterpiece sure there are something’s that could’ve been better but overall it was such an amazing game
Imagine if Odin got the mask, put in on, changed into The Mask and pulled Kartos' and Atreus' pants over their heads 😂
Jokes aside, you made an interesting point about lack of people in the realms. I remember noticing that when playing 2018 while going to Freya's place. I thought "this place is so colourful and pretty, but it seems like all the humans died without a trace or got draugrfied... That being said, I think it's down to the design of the world that is so full of climbing contraptions, temples, bridges, secret areas with chests that devs couldn't realy put in a farm or a town anywhere and make it believable without remaking the game levels drastically. Despite that, Midgard could use some civilians. And I forgot where that dwarf town is located, but I think at first you see dwarfs hiding away and never showing up again🤷♂️
They didn’t want a third game so bad they rushed tf outta this
Yeah Balrog admitted as much. Dude looked at his work and went “Nah I am not spending 10 more years on this as director” like fair enough but at the same time at that point and especially since they really didn’t care about respecting GoW 2018’s story (Faye being a major point of this) and the retreading of Gow 4’s themes
@@victory8928 yeah it’s beautiful and wonderful game but it’s lackluster
I feel called out here with that ending soapbox bit on opinions and let's plays vs. actually playing, because I'm ashamed to admit that I've done that very same thing more times in my 20s after college than I thought
I was also hit really hard by Fenrir’s death. I lost my dog just a month prior to the game’s release, and it was still fresh on my mind
Good until the plot twist could not be more true, story wise the ending shat the bed, gameplay wise is better than 2018, didnt you notice that there are enemies in this game? And not wood enemy number 1 and 2, solid 6 game and a 8 without the ending, cant wait for god of war 202? To see yelllow kratos from the simpsons, sad they didnt do anything big with helheim, maybe next time
i rated this mess of a game 6/10 when i first played it, two points lower than the 2018 game.
one year later it's a 4.5/10 and completely forgettable.
the game is absolute garbage. i have ZERO interest of ever playing this pos again.
story is trash, kratos has become kastratos, atreus is awful, freya and faye are bitter old women and i don't care about dogs at all.
the little twist in the story and aesir were the only positive thing in the game and we're playing the bad guys without even knowing it.
How can you say a game is "absolute garbage" and still give it a grade that's 0.5 short of average? That objectively doesn't make any sense.
@@HopefulNihilist imagine an average person and realize how stupid that person is.
that's why average is garbage. you don't want an average car, average job, average girlfriend, live in an average country, etc.
and when the game was overhyped and highly anticipated and fails to deliver on all levels, i cannot rate it more than average. if it wasn't built on a game that was good, it would be rated much lower.
God of War ragnarok has become my 2 favourite games of all time. Even though it does have issues, i would personally call it a masterpiece.
I call it that not because it flawless (no game really is imo), but because all of the positives outweigh the Negatives wayy out the park for me. The negatives never really hindered my experience, but i acknowledge them.
And i agree with everything u said about "experience something before making an opinion", perfectly said
The only issue with the Mask part was Directly reintroducing Athena and the Higher Plane of Existence earlier. Atreus darker aspects going unexplored is a big issue. I would have kept both romantic options open
I still haven't finished it yet because I found Atreus too profoundly annoying. I plan on playing through the game in its entirety at some point, but the writing really dragged it down for me. Aside from playing the original for a few minutes back in the 2000's this was my entry point to the series and I really want to like it but just thinking about Atreus makes me frustrated. I might go back and play the original trilogy instead first.
Could you say with story games like alot of sony's catalogue its easier for someone to speak with authority despite not playing it due to the fact alot of time is put into the non playable segments like dialogue, cutscenes and the art design of the gameplay (seeing kratos slam an axe to cause an explosion feels good just by watching) are designed so particularly and with care for an observer to enjoy as much as a player.
Like for instance, Spiderman 2 you can't really comment on without playing it for yourself as the gameplay, side quests, community, innovations in traversal (the wing suit and that portal mission) and the power the symbiote gives you contributes to the feelings of being spiderman and Peter or miles on their respective journeys
But with a very story centric game with hours upon hours of cinematic triple AAA cutscenes like God of war ragnarok or the last of us 2 which seek to emulate film media and television through their live actionesque graphics and dialgoue and camera direction are made for widespread discussion and dissection which is made easier as some of the strongest parts of both games are in situations where the player isnt directly involved.
Longwinded question aside what i mean is do you think that with games trying so hard to emulate other mediums like film and then to be watched and dissected online that the importance of independent opinion and investment in a game through gameplay isn't as valued as it used to be (in the west at least) as games like that seem to win more awards and liked by critics which seems to be the only thing that matters nowadays.
Do 100% agree with you authority point, as playing the last of us 1 finally instead of just watching it gave me a completely new experience and love for the game as well as helping me find new things that i found on my own and loved (like Ellies letter from her mum which made me cry)
I was so damn disappointed with this game. The gameplay, the story, Atreus, the fact that the Norse saga ends with 2 games instead of 3, that god-forsaken Angarboda section. I was expecting so much but I got so little.
GOW Ragnarok is a good game but a rather underwhelming conclusion to the Norse saga
Midgard is empty because before the events of the first game, there was an apocalyptic event that killed everyone. just fyi
This applies to the first game as well
The only problems I have with the game is that some of the non-human boss fights don't feel that interesting and feel unimaginative and repetitive (e.g. the dragons, the giant wolves), the way the giant wolf and dragon attack you feel very derpy and awkward, also the way tyr was used in the game felt kinda disappointing or like the writers were trolling us cos the real tyr was alive the whole time and just chilling out in a cell doing yoga. Also faye felt like a very bland character and I didn't really feel the chemistry between her and kratos and when you consider how much they talked about faye in GOW 4, it felt kinda anticlimactic to only have her in a few flashbacks. Angrboda felt kinda bland too cos she didn't even seem that upset about basically having no family left & we barely knew anything about her outside of her relationship with grandmother which didn't even feel that fleshed out (which could've been helped by some giants flashbacks). I have a strong suspicion that the writers changed the idea they had for the story halfway through development, cos a lot of the stuff they set up in the previous game felt like it got sidelined or glossed over, e.g. the jormungandr time travel plot thread, the helheim Eagle plot thread, how Surtr was teased by Mimir in GOW 4 but only appeared in this game for a few minutes and cos there were no flashbacks with the giants every reference to them felt shallow and one dimensional. Also the boss fight with angrbodas grandmother Gryla was terrible. The thor boss fights tho were great in my opinion. Also the elves felt underused in this game and the previous cos we still barely knew anything about the elf war and had no reason to care about the elves, and almost the all the elves in the previous game and this one didn't talk or spoke a completely different language or we didn't know anything about apart from the 2 elves working for freyas brother.
I think it nailed everything except for Ragnarök itself being rushed and not getting to visit Valhalla
It is alright not every Game is a masterpiece although personally I loved it and I am happy with it and it delivered for me
Great video 👍
The story, presentation, voice acting, emotional depth, and design (both character and world) are the best I’ve seen in my 40 years as a gamer, by FAR. Recycling some enemies and gameplay is the game’s main flaw as far as I know
A game doesn't have to be perfect to be a masterpiece.
One of two gow games I haven't replayed because it sucked, Ragnarok and ascension, all the hype and momentum this game had and it was such a disappointment with the boring gameplay sections and some of the worst crappy writing
Great video, but, GOW 2018 is so much better than Ragnarok
So wiki lore says Thrud is like 14 to 16 which is close to age appropriate. I completely agree on who should have been Atreus love interest since him and Agrnbota just seem like elementary school kids being forced to like one another.
But i do feel Ironwood was necessary since it showed Atreus how to be Loki and harness his powers. How the giants work as a society and their history. Atreus also shows Agrnbota how everything's not written in stone.
However, the walking sim part was definitely unnecessary they could have cut those parts in half or just left it to you picking in two areas.
This is not a game that carries on with the first one in mind. It's two different visions. The first being more mature and darker, built up the villians to be unstoppable forces which are evil and was about prophecies. The second game was MCU movie with lighter tone, unesseccary American culture and accents, walkie talkie that's too much, forgets the prophecies, forgets kratos needs that fear of death or challenge, weakens the gods like Thor and so on. It's more about relationship and tugging on emotion than making a game that fulfills the first with even bigger spectacles and power scaling and fulfilment of prophecy. It's a good game on its own but a dissapointment otherwise. Wasted my time.
Lighter tone doesn't mean MCU, only Odin's dialogue feels modern, the prophecy is literally the backbone of the game, Thor defeats us in the first fight so he's weakened & why does Kratos need to fear death??
@@Comicbroe405 no it doesn't but the way it was written spells it. The prophecy was used as a background instead of the main focus. Thor was not weakened. Kratos clearly doesn't want to die but at no point was I, the player worried for safety which was the point of the prophecy.
I would consider it a masterpiece, but not flawless. Nothing is without flaws but it can still be a masterpiece.
I think in terms of gameplay Ragnarok is ten times better than GOW4 but 4 had the better story. 4 plays like dog though especially on Give Me God Of War where everything one taps Kratos like he's the punching sack in Smash.
Edit to last bit. I figured out that on my ng+ of gow4 i was actually underleveled. I'm kinda shitting on the game now. Almost broke a monitor by accident raging out and clipping my knee on my desk.
In addition I really do wish they would've split the game in two like they wanted initially. Some of the weirder choices in telling the story would have more time to expand with two parts. But they didn't want people to have to wait for the end. If the game was gonna be at the same quality it would've hit the level somewhat of the greek trilogy.
God of war 2018 kratos: modi and magni are grown now, they have no excuse to follow their familys ways.
God of war ragnarok kratos: tHoR yOu cAn cHaNgE! ItS nOt yOuR fAUlT iTs oDiNs fAuLt
I said that back then but nobody was listening to me. Joking aside, I really never had the impression that it was a masterpiece. For me it had one or two flaws (for lack of a better word) too many. 2018 fitted the description of a masterpiece much better for me. Ragnarok is still a great game though and has some moments that are worthy of being called a masterpiece. And now I'll watch the video 😅
It's just another hyped up Sony movie game.
well for some people it is and for some it is not, thats fine. I still love it absolutely and its fine if someone else dont. In my opinion Yak section was pure trash, Atreus sections overstayed their welcome and the ending was rushed (kinda) easily destroying the war machines with a simple hammer strike and the bosses could have been more of a spectacle kinda like GOW3
My friend and I never even finished it because it is so bland and uninteresting. The writing is way different in this one and much worse.
In my opinion the addition of the Valhalla DLC (which obviously came out after this video), makes this game a narrative masterpiece. The closure it provides for Kratos’ story and the way they addressed his past while providing a much better ending makes Kratos one of the best written characters in gaming ever.
Thank you for giving a different perspective on things Kris P Bacon, because I tried playing the previous God of War game before Ragnarok: but then angrily put it down due to not looking beyond Yahtzee Croshaw's opinion, and then didn't even try God of War Ragnarok for that very reason. But watching your video here has helped prove how wrong I was for doing so, so thank you😄💖
I would’ve liked to see Thor FINNISH turning a new leaf and fight against Odin alongside Kratos and Atreus and in the process sacrificing his life while his daughter watches her dad finally stand up to Odin.
I miss Thor
"I love all these games, except Ascension"
The correct opinion.
I fuckin loved Ragnarok. It has its issues but it's a damn good time throughout.
Ascension being "bad' is such an npc take
Ok, before you read my comment spoilers for the base game and the valhalla dlc
This game should have been split into two games
This is gonna sound like fanfiction. As much as my dream came true for Heilos and the blade of olympus to be in the game, I really wish they were in the base game. Just imagine helios and Mimir bantering with each other and sindri freaking out about another head
I had this idea where alfiem is Pitched black and you need to bring helios back to life at freyas and and revive him the same way she revived mimir
I can’t really disagree with any of what you said. I loved both games they both have their flaws and that’s perfectly okay. I do wished the third act had more time to it, but it is what it is. Hopefully sony and santa monica learns and grows from this to produce an even better game whether it be gow or another ip. A much bigger and more drawn out with odin fight was what I expected hands down. They led me to believe the whole game I’m about to get the best boss fight I’ve ever had when I got to him. When I didn’t I was genuinely disappointed at that point.
I still listen to the soundtrack, it hold up the other games music. It’s not my favourite, I’m still hopeful for a better follow up, that hopefully ditches the behind the shoulder. It’s not great and it’s unpopular.
It's greatest strength is it's pacing and crunchy combat and characters.
It has to improve the balance of budget between story and gameplay. Spiritually and monetarily, I could use less dialogue and more gameplay loops in exploration and a fisticuffs skill tree like 2018. And while I love the side missions, some of the MAIN QUEST feels like a SIDE QUEST, and these moments could've been swapped with pure puzzle and combat loops.
With that being said, I think this has the same influence Elden Ring will have on the gaming industry on what "open world fantasy quests" can be. Take me on a linear loop de loop rollercoaster (GOWR) or don't hold my hand and throw me in the wilderness (Elden Ring).
GOWR needs a longer intro and conclusion where Kratos and Atreus are "out in the woods to fend for themselves". Literally and metaphorically. The final part didn't feel like the characters were grinded to the bone, the beginning felt more so but not enough. The middle journey is where I think the pieces of mastery lie.
I’m not sure putting an Atreus section and a walking section in the final boss would be a good idea
You mean like what God of War 3 did?
@@TBP there’s no pandora section and ragnarok is already filled with both of those things
It probably would have been a masterpiece by the release date if sweet baby inc wasn’t apart of it
Well kiddo, since you seem so confident in that fact, why don't you go down a list of everything you would have changed that you think sweet baby inc had a say in.
@@TBP the cast and design of the characters would have probably been more accurate or at least more interesting in their personalities like Angreboda I don’t really see a problem with her being black just her personality is shit . They most likely would of made her more confident and less of a shut in constantly apologizing and constantly a downer with no hope in her own legacy no matter what is written the culture back then would have made her more stronger willed and they might have made Asgard more exploratory and let you have a more relatable experience with the people he interacted with there the original three games were more creative in the visual storytelling in that sense. And ya I am not a kiddo I’m most likely older than you I’m almost 40 but thank you for hearing me out. I see the original writing staff of the first 3 games as master storytellers similar to Shakespeare that part in God of war 2 when Kratos made a false surrender saying I lay down my arms Zeus release me from this torment of mine was beautifully written like a Shakespearean play
Many of Ragnakor problems would be avoided if they made it into 2 games
This Game Is A Disappointment For Me The Story Line Felt Rushed No Forward Momentem The Story Is So Crap That We Are Reminded To Do Side Quests They Made This Only For GOTY Making It Like A Movie Game And Norse Gods Speak Like Their Morden American People One Of The Things I Like About The Greek Games Are That They Took Risks Call Me Nostalgic Fan Or A Hater Of This Sony Movie Game I Am Making Sense 2018 Story Felt More Better.
They ruined the game when they decided that no matter what he won’t go ballistic against the gods anymore . This game could have had a fantastic climax but it’s just forgettable overall
To me this game is perfect, and the platinum was suprisingly easy
I walked away from Ragnarok satisfied. Maybe its because I didn't have any expectations, (I willingly avoid hype trains so as to avoid disappointment). It wasn't perfect, as nothing made by man is. Sure I wish the actual Ragnarok event had been longer and we got to see more of Jormy and Thor's battle, and some of the dialogue felt much too modern and killed my immersion at times. But I felt the gameplay was a step up over 2018, seeing more of the realms was cool, and the emotional beats resonated with me so in short it was a great experience for me. As for being a masterpiece, I won't comment on that as I don't think of games in an artistic sense like many others do. But to each their own.
How is IT not masterpiece?!
There’s a lot of issues I have with Ragnarok but I think the biggest one for me is it’s “replay ability” problem, I think @theIJPmexican said it the best. I genuinely enjoy the combat and exploration in this game and me getting the platinum is proof of that, but the plethora of walking sections that are in this game makes me dread replaying it again even on ng+