Very interesting perspective. This feels like a case of "be careful what you wish for." For people to be paid fairly (as they are in some other individual sports like golf or tennis) you will need bigger crowds, TV exposure, merchandise, concessions, etc. There's no way to create revenue without turning climbing into a circus, supported by a huge infrastructure capable of hosting dozens of world cup events every year. The PGA has roughly 48 major tour events per year. IFSC has what - 8? Not to mention those two examples (golf and tennis) cater to the rich, and are able to create huge amounts of revenue on corporate ticket sales, secondary events, hotel kickbacks, etc. If you ask me, the best thing for the sport is to stay manageable, mostly non-professional (like skateboarding or surfing), and to be supported largely by climbers and gear/apparel sponsorship, subscriptions (like Reel Rock), etc. rather than "the public". It's unfortunate that it would limit the ability of many talented climbers to totally dedicate themselves to the sport, but this is the situation in many olympic sports.
Totally agree (and this is a bit beyond what Stasa is speaking to) can’t fault climbing as it’s going down the path many sports do at some point - into growth and mass consumption. Many upside but downsides are maybe not always considered realistically as money speaks more loudly.
@@lilianhayes3955 Water seeks equilibrium and money seeks profit. I think the thing that limits (saves?) climbing will be the expense and difficulty of moving infrastructure. You can play American football, soccer, baseball and hold rock concerts all in the same venue (a big "bowl" of stadium seats with a field of grass or astroturf in the middle). For climbing, everyone needs to face a wall, which can be 60+ feet high, only hold 2 competitors at a time, the movement is less obvious than guys chasing a ball, and I imagine it would be quite an ordeal to set up and take down in any particular venue. For a soccer/football match you've got 22 players, they can be seen from all angles, and the only infrastructure is a couple of goals and a ball. It's just not a sport that lends itself to large crowds, it's expensive, there's no teamwork, the difficulty of the sport is not always apparent to casual observers, etc. I think for the same reason there are no professional gymnasts (other than coaches, gym owners, etc.) climbing will never be profitable enough to be a top-level spectator sport.
I think this notion of being paid „fairly“ is problematic in terms of professional sports. When does it go from a hobby to professional athlete? Does society have an obligation to pay you for a hobby that you happen to be pretty good at? And why only sports? Should dedicated stamp collectors or people who stream on twitch to one viewer also be „fairly compensated“? (And while we are at it, Tennis is certainly more than „fairly compensated“). In the end, the money meeds to come from somewhere, and beyond basic support from national federations that is going to be sponsors. Bouldering itself is certainly popular enough, but the ISCF isn’t great at marketing it. But it’s up to the athletes as well to market themselves better.
Stasa is one of my faves. She and Matt Groom are the coolest and they are the best climbing commentators. Although that means Stasa didn't make the next round. I feel sorry for that event but the audience benefits. 😄
Ever since the first comp final I watched where she was commenting I felt how real she actually is. The sport in general not only climbing desperately needs people like her to return some of the original ideas of why there are competitions and communities. Way to go Stasa! ❤
Great interview. Stasa's so down to earth. It's clear that money's a big problem in the sport, especially in terms of how little everyone gets paid. But the path to increasing revenue has some potential pitfalls.
I love how on the wall she has such an intense determined serious personality, yet off the field she's always so jolly and cheerful and upbeat. Her kind personality and thoughtfulness is probably what makes me root for her the hardest
I watch all available comps and whenever season starts I buy subscriptions. In the past all of them were out there for free but I don't mind paying as long as I know money is put to a good use. I love climbing and watching competitions gives me such thrill that I feel like an unattended child who has had too much sugar. It's the best entertainment and I feel more and more people notice it. I'm sure it will change for better. It is just a matter of time :) Looking forward to watching Stasa's performance this year. She's such a feisty fighter! Good luck!
It's interesting to see the opposition between the "fun side" and the competitive side of a sport that's not competitive by nature, and how it may impede the competition side, in training, in discovering talents etc
Staša is, bar none, my favourite to watch. High hopes for her in the qualifiers this year. She absolutely has what it takes, but it's a hard sport. I have the same ambivalence toward the entertainment aspect of climbing. It matters and has its place. Bringing in new viewers and new climbers matters. But it would be sad to see the sport lose itself in the process of trying to expand. I'm not anti-comp-style climbing, but there is a balance to be struck between testing skill and putting on a show for an audience that will ooh and ah at a lache more readily than more conventional techniques. But hey, nothing stays the same forever. Sports change.
Really interesting interview and lots to consider and parallels to other sports. In its simplest form, the need is only for a bit of rock, calories, protein, hydration etc. and the activity of choice can theoretically be undertaken. Ofcourse there are additional equipment, transportation and medical costs associated with being a pro. I would hate to see climbing go the way of football where a lot is stuck behind a paywall and the scheduling is driven by the broadcaster - it is no longer a working class game. Indoor climbing seems to be the huge growth area right now and has always struck me as being largely inaccessible to those on lower incomes so maybe climbing is a good candidate for commercialisation. Would add that parkour probably does provide a greater spectacle than nasty crimps but ofcourse entirely subjective.
A lot of good points. However, I don't like this money issue. Sometimes the scene is complaining that values deteriorate with climbing becoming more and more professional and other times there is not enough money. So, what is it?... Of course, I don't see all sides of it, but coming from a potential sponsoring side, I saw a couple of sides and there is really no one either that gets totally rich in this industry. I mean, climbing comes from a dirt bag culture and that's what we are dealing with on all ends. People who spend more money on a t-shirt than a harness... People who with their fitness club cards enter gyms for almost nothing. Where should the money come from? I get that it sucks, but everyone is responsible for it. And yes, for sponsoring competition athletes? What is the benefit for a sponsor? You almost get zero exposure or how many people could tell me Janja's harness sponsor (and there is not more exposure then from someone winning every comp)? And helping pushing limits? That's happening outdoors I am afraid...
The main problem in terms of monetization is that most people who climb don't even follow the competitive scene. Compare that to football ⚽, where you have tons of people who watch professional football, but don't even play themselfs. There isn't too much incentive for brands to invest in sponsorships.
find here some core values and potentials of climbing: ua-cam.com/video/4r4XIcd1CAs/v-deo.htmlsi=rWyEyBPir2mkyPSw "What The Hands Do | How Climbing Can Shape the World", Mariana Mendoza and Miguel Casar
There is not that much money in the sport. Yep. Has been that way since mid 80s. Many comp climbers only relax and become happy when they go outdoors and climb in nature. The best sequences and friends are outdoors.
As a finance/commercial person on sports industry... i will offer myself and volunteer with insights and information and workforce to make the sport bigger and better, but the sport itself needs to create revenue... without that... you cant ask for stuff sadly...
honestly its ridiculous how poor professional climbers are. in every country commercial gyms pop out of nowhere and people buying shoes and climbing stuff but la sportiva, scarpa, madrock... they all seem to keep it for themselfs.
Formula 1 is a good example in how to leverage modern platforms to gain traction and enhance engagement. I think there's a lot to gain from adding subscription based platforms, if the money ends up in the athlete's pocket. It's harmful if the climbers don't have a say. So I advocate for power to the people. In such case, yes, please, take my money.
Stasa is such a good ambassador for the sport. She's so real and positive
Agreed. I always stick around to watch a comp if I see that she's in it just because I'm always rooting for her.
Very impressed by her nuanced thoughts.
This girl is gold.
Very interesting perspective. This feels like a case of "be careful what you wish for." For people to be paid fairly (as they are in some other individual sports like golf or tennis) you will need bigger crowds, TV exposure, merchandise, concessions, etc. There's no way to create revenue without turning climbing into a circus, supported by a huge infrastructure capable of hosting dozens of world cup events every year. The PGA has roughly 48 major tour events per year. IFSC has what - 8? Not to mention those two examples (golf and tennis) cater to the rich, and are able to create huge amounts of revenue on corporate ticket sales, secondary events, hotel kickbacks, etc.
If you ask me, the best thing for the sport is to stay manageable, mostly non-professional (like skateboarding or surfing), and to be supported largely by climbers and gear/apparel sponsorship, subscriptions (like Reel Rock), etc. rather than "the public". It's unfortunate that it would limit the ability of many talented climbers to totally dedicate themselves to the sport, but this is the situation in many olympic sports.
Totally agree (and this is a bit beyond what Stasa is speaking to) can’t fault climbing as it’s going down the path many sports do at some point - into growth and mass consumption. Many upside but downsides are maybe not always considered realistically as money speaks more loudly.
@@lilianhayes3955 Water seeks equilibrium and money seeks profit. I think the thing that limits (saves?) climbing will be the expense and difficulty of moving infrastructure.
You can play American football, soccer, baseball and hold rock concerts all in the same venue (a big "bowl" of stadium seats with a field of grass or astroturf in the middle). For climbing, everyone needs to face a wall, which can be 60+ feet high, only hold 2 competitors at a time, the movement is less obvious than guys chasing a ball, and I imagine it would be quite an ordeal to set up and take down in any particular venue. For a soccer/football match you've got 22 players, they can be seen from all angles, and the only infrastructure is a couple of goals and a ball.
It's just not a sport that lends itself to large crowds, it's expensive, there's no teamwork, the difficulty of the sport is not always apparent to casual observers, etc. I think for the same reason there are no professional gymnasts (other than coaches, gym owners, etc.) climbing will never be profitable enough to be a top-level spectator sport.
I think this notion of being paid „fairly“ is problematic in terms of professional sports. When does it go from a hobby to professional athlete? Does society have an obligation to pay you for a hobby that you happen to be pretty good at? And why only sports? Should dedicated stamp collectors or people who stream on twitch to one viewer also be „fairly compensated“? (And while we are at it, Tennis is certainly more than „fairly compensated“).
In the end, the money meeds to come from somewhere, and beyond basic support from national federations that is going to be sponsors. Bouldering itself is certainly popular enough, but the ISCF isn’t great at marketing it. But it’s up to the athletes as well to market themselves better.
Stasa is one of my faves. She and Matt Groom are the coolest and they are the best climbing commentators. Although that means Stasa didn't make the next round. I feel sorry for that event but the audience benefits. 😄
Stasa is great, she is also a great commentator of the climbing competitions, which is a separate skill ❤
This is excellent! Good format, interesting questions and answers, I love love to see more like this.
I love watching interviews with Staša; always so eloquent and honest. Thanks for an engaging video!
Could listen to her for hours. What a beautiful mind & heart!
Stasha is an awesome personality. And she is very smart, you can tell from the interview. Oh yeah, she also climbs well :)
Always great to get a peak into Stasa's mind. Such an interesting thinker.
Ever since the first comp final I watched where she was commenting I felt how real she actually is. The sport in general not only climbing desperately needs people like her to return some of the original ideas of why there are competitions and communities. Way to go Stasa! ❤
Great interview. Stasa's so down to earth.
It's clear that money's a big problem in the sport, especially in terms of how little everyone gets paid.
But the path to increasing revenue has some potential pitfalls.
I love how on the wall she has such an intense determined serious personality, yet off the field she's always so jolly and cheerful and upbeat. Her kind personality and thoughtfulness is probably what makes me root for her the hardest
I watch all available comps and whenever season starts I buy subscriptions. In the past all of them were out there for free but I don't mind paying as long as I know money is put to a good use. I love climbing and watching competitions gives me such thrill that I feel like an unattended child who has had too much sugar. It's the best entertainment and I feel more and more people notice it. I'm sure it will change for better. It is just a matter of time :) Looking forward to watching Stasa's performance this year. She's such a feisty fighter! Good luck!
Tolles Interview!
Staša 🙌 True words.
Stasa is the best!
It's interesting to see the opposition between the "fun side" and the competitive side of a sport that's not competitive by nature, and how it may impede the competition side, in training, in discovering talents etc
Stasa, svaka cast!!!
Great interview!!! Interesting questions for an interesting climber.
I LOVE STASA!!!!
Yes, shes a great genuine person.
Well spoken 👌
totally agree! i want my spraywall at my hometown! i want to train properly...
Staša is, bar none, my favourite to watch. High hopes for her in the qualifiers this year. She absolutely has what it takes, but it's a hard sport.
I have the same ambivalence toward the entertainment aspect of climbing. It matters and has its place. Bringing in new viewers and new climbers matters. But it would be sad to see the sport lose itself in the process of trying to expand. I'm not anti-comp-style climbing, but there is a balance to be struck between testing skill and putting on a show for an audience that will ooh and ah at a lache more readily than more conventional techniques. But hey, nothing stays the same forever. Sports change.
She should be somehow part of the ifsc. Go Stasa!!!
I would've listened to her explanation for her words about "French climbing mafia", which she wrote after not getting an Olympic ticket at the EU Cup.
Really interesting interview and lots to consider and parallels to other sports.
In its simplest form, the need is only for a bit of rock, calories, protein, hydration etc. and the activity of choice can theoretically be undertaken. Ofcourse there are additional equipment, transportation and medical costs associated with being a pro.
I would hate to see climbing go the way of football where a lot is stuck behind a paywall and the scheduling is driven by the broadcaster - it is no longer a working class game.
Indoor climbing seems to be the huge growth area right now and has always struck me as being largely inaccessible to those on lower incomes so maybe climbing is a good candidate for commercialisation.
Would add that parkour probably does provide a greater spectacle than nasty crimps but ofcourse entirely subjective.
audio quality is really bad, but nevertheless I enjoyed the interview
A lot of good points. However, I don't like this money issue. Sometimes the scene is complaining that values deteriorate with climbing becoming more and more professional and other times there is not enough money. So, what is it?... Of course, I don't see all sides of it, but coming from a potential sponsoring side, I saw a couple of sides and there is really no one either that gets totally rich in this industry. I mean, climbing comes from a dirt bag culture and that's what we are dealing with on all ends. People who spend more money on a t-shirt than a harness... People who with their fitness club cards enter gyms for almost nothing. Where should the money come from? I get that it sucks, but everyone is responsible for it.
And yes, for sponsoring competition athletes? What is the benefit for a sponsor? You almost get zero exposure or how many people could tell me Janja's harness sponsor (and there is not more exposure then from someone winning every comp)? And helping pushing limits? That's happening outdoors I am afraid...
The main problem in terms of monetization is that most people who climb don't even follow the competitive scene. Compare that to football ⚽, where you have tons of people who watch professional football, but don't even play themselfs. There isn't too much incentive for brands to invest in sponsorships.
👌
find here some core values and potentials of climbing: ua-cam.com/video/4r4XIcd1CAs/v-deo.htmlsi=rWyEyBPir2mkyPSw
"What The Hands Do | How Climbing Can Shape the World", Mariana Mendoza and Miguel Casar
Yeah the winner of a World Cup getting that amount of money is ridiculous. Especially with what we see in other sports.
There is not that much money in the sport. Yep. Has been that way since mid 80s. Many comp climbers only relax and become happy when they go outdoors and climb in nature. The best sequences and friends are outdoors.
As a finance/commercial person on sports industry... i will offer myself and volunteer with insights and information and workforce to make the sport bigger and better, but the sport itself needs to create revenue... without that... you cant ask for stuff sadly...
I imagine that pro climbers are among the lowest-paid full-time athletes in the world. The question is whether or not that's what gives the sport soul
honestly its ridiculous how poor professional climbers are. in every country commercial gyms pop out of nowhere and people buying shoes and climbing stuff but la sportiva, scarpa, madrock... they all seem to keep it for themselfs.
Formula 1 is a good example in how to leverage modern platforms to gain traction and enhance engagement. I think there's a lot to gain from adding subscription based platforms, if the money ends up in the athlete's pocket. It's harmful if the climbers don't have a say. So I advocate for power to the people. In such case, yes, please, take my money.
Why is she talking to a pallet?
😂