But the real question stays the same as always... how do you get the message to those that have been indocrinated with neoliberal thinking for years and understand the idea.. they are the ones that make the rules...
if only arguments could be convincing... But the decisive factor is the wisdom people were taught in their youth. This generates a biochemistry and physiology of world views that stand like bouncers in front of the gate of arguments and do not even let foreign thoughts in. Emotions triumph. The only hope is then the next generation.
"Den of vipers. /spit" Whether we like it or not, the science is clear: Unless we shrink economies and simplify the lifestyles of people in wealthy nations, worsening ecological and societal breakdown is inevitable. As dying oceans, disappearing forests, mass crop failures and livestock deaths, millions of species go extinct, and billions of people die off.
The tiresome mantra against GDP growth. Wealth is everything. Growth generates greater wealth. Environmental stewardship, healthcare, well being, shelter, food production and on and on all require wealth.
And hete we are... The insight of economists who beleave what we want just has to be possible against the laws of physics and alll knowledge of öcologie and biologie.. Guess wich real science wins... 😂
@@tomschuelke7955 Rationality always wins and you won't find an ounce of rationality within socialist or environmental circles. These are emotional thinkers. Socialism and environmentalism are both authoritarian and anti human. They both profess that humans are a problem, flawed, evil, greedy, destructive and you all spend your days self loathing and demanding everyone else repent and self flagellate.
so north Europe has to become poor in order to stop hurting the environment but in the same time south should get rich and in that process ignore the environment? Wow. this speech is a lot of nonsense
@@nivillanueva LOL Thank you for giving everyone an example of Rule #2. "Tell anyone who disagrees with you that "you don't understand what is being said." This BS technique is also called "Appeal to Authority" meaning that "only the anointed few can understand the topic so shut up and don't ask questions." Again, thank you for your example.
The idea is for the economies of the global north to temporarily degrow, so that countries in the global south can satisfy their basic needs. Collectively we need to avoid ecological breakdown and create well-being that is not relying on material excess, right? :)
@@Kuna33_ must be nice to have those rose coloured glasses on. So you gonna temporarily degrow west?How exactly? Economies dont care for your noble reasons. if economy is going down hill it is going down hill. You get poor people, shitty infrastructure and corruption(like in a third world countries) very fast. Ask anybody from ex eastern european block how great it was to live in planned economy and why people got ecstatic when capitalism came. 3/4 of the world is poor and fighting with coming out of it, boosting and bleeding for their economy. Maybe it would be a good lesson to the rich kids to go and really live in that environment. Without dad credit card :)
@@conticonti1363 I don't agree that "if the economy is going downhill it is going down hill". Costa Rica has 0.2 of GDP per Capita compared to the US yet they outperfom the states in all main social factors including life expectancy and mental health (happiness), similar with dozens of other countries like fe Spain. Other than that, the economy is made up of people. And people would rather save nature than the economy (last question in the video) in their core, so education about the dissonance of prioritising consumerism is key. And people would also like to work less and spend more time in leisure, so fe the mandatory 4 day work week is becoming really popular in so many countries in Europe right now. There are other powerful political policy instruments like green job guarantees, so that workers from destructive sectors can jump to another boat. Culturally, you can definitely see a growing eco awareness and I personally have faith in the rise of healing practices like yoga and meditation, legalising weed and psychedelic therapy. Where does your hope for the future lie?
I wished we had comparable people in germany... i just saw an AI Tool that transcribes your talk to what ever language you want, than takes your voice, recreates the talk in that other language, rewrites it to the film and at last sychronizes your lips with it.. this would multiply the size of his talks to a far bigger audience... of course this is troue for other great thinkers. like prof william e rees or nathe hagens and many others
“It feels irresponsibly foolish to bet the survival of humanity on a highly improbably miracle predicted by the obscure models of a handful of economists.” Well put. Thanks.
it's even more irresponsibly foolish to assume that narratives coming from Far-Left activists and TRUTH are one and the same thing. So called "social-scientists" have no real expertise on Economy or Environment.
we have to come to a social tippingpoint and not to blame it on others. But as thrue as it is we have to shrink ... i am not yet convinced that it is possible to construct a peacful , fairly distributed shrinkage...
Absolutely wrong.. an ever growing economy is physicaly impossible.. only neoliberal economists on this planet beleave in it.. at least our economys have fluctuated around ner zero developement for some thousend years.. because they where held in check from natural negative feedbacks.. our current state of growth is the result of a one time aboundance of energy 100 time bigger as ever before. this will come to en end in few decades... and we will fall back to a much lower level of consuming if we want it or not.. its only in the overshoot we are allready in for decades, that you can beleave in the impossible.. so planed degrowth is the only viable option.. i am sure this will hurt if ever society will decide to go this way, (which i doubht) , but if we dont go this path, the brutal crash of a global Zivilasation of this szice will be unprecedented. Yes and of course a steady state economy isnt perfect possible.. as stated it will fluctuate around a certain level.
@@tomschuelke7955Socialists and environmentalists are the most myopic and pessimistic people on Earth. Since the first human began to walk upright, life for humanity has done nothing but improve. Today we are safer, healthier and more prosperous than at any time in history. Humans are problem solvers.
Awesome
I LOVE his work - always worth listening to
Wonderful talk.
But the real question stays the same as always... how do you get the message to those that have been indocrinated with neoliberal thinking for years and understand the idea.. they are the ones that make the rules...
Brilliant, inspiring and to the point. Bravo.
Fantastic contribution. Well done Tim.
Great as always !
Excellent speech
Great speech. If anyone still needed to be convinced
if only arguments could be convincing... But the decisive factor is the wisdom people were taught in their youth. This generates a biochemistry and physiology of world views that stand like bouncers in front of the gate of arguments and do not even let foreign thoughts in. Emotions triumph. The only hope is then the next generation.
Den of vipers. /spit
"Den of vipers. /spit" Whether we like it or not, the science is clear: Unless we shrink economies and simplify the lifestyles of people in wealthy nations, worsening ecological and societal breakdown is inevitable. As dying oceans, disappearing forests, mass crop failures and livestock deaths, millions of species go extinct, and billions of people die off.
nice! that was fast
The tiresome mantra against GDP growth. Wealth is everything. Growth generates greater wealth. Environmental stewardship, healthcare, well being, shelter, food production and on and on all require wealth.
And hete we are... The insight of economists who beleave what we want just has to be possible against the laws of physics and alll knowledge of öcologie and biologie..
Guess wich real science wins... 😂
@@tomschuelke7955 Rationality always wins and you won't find an ounce of rationality within socialist or environmental circles. These are emotional thinkers. Socialism and environmentalism are both authoritarian and anti human. They both profess that humans are a problem, flawed, evil, greedy, destructive and you all spend your days self loathing and demanding everyone else repent and self flagellate.
so north Europe has to become poor in order to stop hurting the environment but in the same time south should get rich and in that process ignore the environment? Wow. this speech is a lot of nonsense
You didn't understand at all.
@@nivillanueva LOL Thank you for giving everyone an example of Rule #2.
"Tell anyone who disagrees with you that "you don't understand what is being said." This BS technique is also called "Appeal to Authority" meaning that "only the anointed few can understand the topic so shut up and don't ask questions." Again, thank you for your example.
The idea is for the economies of the global north to temporarily degrow, so that countries in the global south can satisfy their basic needs. Collectively we need to avoid ecological breakdown and create well-being that is not relying on material excess, right? :)
@@Kuna33_ must be nice to have those rose coloured glasses on. So you gonna temporarily degrow west?How exactly? Economies dont care for your noble reasons. if economy is going down hill it is going down hill. You get poor people, shitty infrastructure and corruption(like in a third world countries) very fast. Ask anybody from ex eastern european block how great it was to live in planned economy and why people got ecstatic when capitalism came. 3/4 of the world is poor and fighting with coming out of it, boosting and bleeding for their economy. Maybe it would be a good lesson to the rich kids to go and really live in that environment. Without dad credit card :)
@@conticonti1363 I don't agree that "if the economy is going downhill it is going down hill". Costa Rica has 0.2 of GDP per Capita compared to the US yet they outperfom the states in all main social factors including life expectancy and mental health (happiness), similar with dozens of other countries like fe Spain.
Other than that, the economy is made up of people. And people would rather save nature than the economy (last question in the video) in their core, so education about the dissonance of prioritising consumerism is key. And people would also like to work less and spend more time in leisure, so fe the mandatory 4 day work week is becoming really popular in so many countries in Europe right now. There are other powerful political policy instruments like green job guarantees, so that workers from destructive sectors can jump to another boat. Culturally, you can definitely see a growing eco awareness and I personally have faith in the rise of healing practices like yoga and meditation, legalising weed and psychedelic therapy. Where does your hope for the future lie?
I wished we had comparable people in germany... i just saw an AI Tool that transcribes your talk to what ever language you want, than takes your voice, recreates the talk in that other language, rewrites it to the film and at last sychronizes your lips with it..
this would multiply the size of his talks to a far bigger audience... of course this is troue for other great thinkers. like prof william e rees or nathe hagens and many others
Decoupling wellbeing from environmental pressures - very good point!
GDP is the problem that measure is not accurate and we base our economics tied to it
I am Rita Solari Inko-Tariah from Nigeria
“It feels irresponsibly foolish to bet the survival of humanity on a highly improbably miracle predicted by the obscure models of a handful of economists.” Well put. Thanks.
it's even more irresponsibly foolish to assume that narratives coming from Far-Left activists and TRUTH are one and the same thing. So called "social-scientists" have no real expertise on Economy or Environment.
Magic!
Useless for those who decide, for they are not listening/ don't care at all. But if it can touch one or more "common" people, why not.
we have to come to a social tippingpoint and not to blame it on others. But as thrue as it is we have to shrink ... i am not yet convinced that it is possible to construct a peacful , fairly distributed shrinkage...
@@tomschuelke7955 For some people to stop, some need to stop them.
Pure wishful thinking. A steady state economy ist not possible.
Absolutely wrong.. an ever growing economy is physicaly impossible.. only neoliberal economists on this planet beleave in it..
at least our economys have fluctuated around ner zero developement for some thousend years.. because they where held in check from natural negative feedbacks.. our current state of growth is the result of a one time aboundance of energy 100 time bigger as ever before. this will come to en end in few decades...
and we will fall back to a much lower level of consuming if we want it or not.. its only in the overshoot we are allready in for decades, that you can beleave in the impossible..
so planed degrowth is the only viable option.. i am sure this will hurt if ever society will decide to go this way, (which i doubht) , but if we dont go this path, the brutal crash of a global Zivilasation of this szice will be unprecedented.
Yes and of course a steady state economy isnt perfect possible.. as stated it will fluctuate around a certain level.
@@tomschuelke7955Socialists and environmentalists are the most myopic and pessimistic people on Earth. Since the first human began to walk upright, life for humanity has done nothing but improve. Today we are safer, healthier and more prosperous than at any time in history. Humans are problem solvers.
"Pure wishful thinking. A steady state economy ist not possible." Humans had steady state economies for most of their history.
quelle masterclass !!