Honestly as bad as Dutch was he was still small fries compared to how big he could have been had he actually cared about the causes he claimed to. Ultimately he just wanted a life of luxury free of rules. He wanted to be Cornwall or Bronte but in another country
That last bit, I’d probably consider Self-defence because the army , Ross & Archer, arguably attacked the Marston Ranch unlawfully. They went back on their word to let John go free by helping them, and in doing so the government was also recklessly endangering Jack & Abigail, who are arguably a lot more innocent compared to that of John & Uncle to be fair. (Yeah, Abigail has some crimes on her rap sheet during her time in the Van De Lynde gang, mostly theft or accessory to certain things, the only major crime she did was kill Agent Milton, whilst Jack was completely innocent, well until Ross shot his father like a dog, leading him to exact revenge.)
Well, if Ross done it because of his meanness, then yea, we can't charge John for self-defense. But maybe government ordered Ross to kill John, and in this case, John can be charged, no?
@@apololo7360im gonna look at this realistically And its alot bare with me Ross is a crooked cop, we have evidence of that from the fact he shot the corpse of dutch after he jumped off a cliff because “it looks better that way in the papers” Realistically i think considering how much of a wanted man John really is his bounty for the time would be wanted Dead or Alive with proper procedures being to try and convince him to turn himself in Ross gave no fucks about proper procedures and maybe would be slightly penalized if found out but considering John is likely wanted dead or alive Regardless of the outcome whether they did it properly or not, Ross would either have gotten a slap on the wrist or nothing at all After all 1914 its very easy to fake a story and he couldve easily said that John resisted and he had no choice but to use lethal force I would also like to point out that even tho they fired shots first, john had his gun ready with no intention of surrendering Now new austin i believe is meant to be the games version of New mexico if im not mistaken, either that or texas (correction is based on both plus Arizona) All states of which follow Castle Doctrine which is the right to defend ones homestead from intruders Given the fact Ross and the officers were at a distance with a ton of armed men you could argue the case that he saw a horde of men and was simply defending his home and family under the confines of that doctrine because Ross didnt use proper procedure when attempting to arrest him and gave no warnings or commands telling him to come quietly and since they opened fire first John returned it Which given the unlawful circumstances would be considered self defense because of an unlawful act and excessive use of force But considering the timeframe like i said, he held all the cards because almost anyone in a police precinct is gonna take the word of an officer over a most wanted criminal Its one of those cases where if he did survive, he’d need a damn good lawful for those charges to be dropped especially considering everything he has done Even then hes still doing life, still likely getting a death sentence anyway because of the times
@@apololo7360well Ross is breaking up Norwin when comes to Javier because Javier is Mexican and going into another country to catch someone without a war from the Mexican government is trespassing and catching someone or killing them is murder they have no right to determine the fate of a Mexican in Mexico
I'm pretty sure every instance of Ross using the army was a violation of the Posse Comitatus Act of 1878, though the exact boundaries of what military personnel are allowed to participate in domestically are still disputed to this day. I highly doubt Edgar went through congress for permission and, seeing as how he was working to benefit Nate Johns' campaign for governor - and the unnamed incumbent is never mentioned declaring any state of emergency regarding Williamson, Van Der Linde, or Marston through ambient dialogue or the newspapers - I think there may be coercion and exploitation of ignorance at work. Remember, he's a senior agent in the newly minted Bureau of Investigation, predecessor to the modern FBI, after the government effectively put him out of work with the Anti-Pinkerton Act of 1893, which already put him and his mentor on borrowed time like the Van Der Linde gang. Even back then, there was a lengthy history of corruption and overreach among that organization, and it only got worse in the 1920's when J. Edgar Hoover was appointed as its director. I'm gonna' argue that the raid on Beecher's Hope was a violation on his part and Marston acted in self-defense.
Considering the coverups of back then(ex: Ma Barker), I’m not surprised that he ended up permanently fishing. No doubt about him using his connections unlawfully. I wonder if the content creator will do a video on Milton and Ross.
5:27 - self-defense here is a very arguable matter, even considering morality and the background of this situation. Accounting the fact that the Braithwaite estate is the property of the Braithwaites (you don't say), it looks much more like the Braitwaites being the self-defending party here. Not to mention Dutch started firing first.
Absolutely, self-defense was way off the table here in this case, even if it was in furtherance of saving a young child later down the line. Dutch and his men intruded on another's property, refused to leave when ordered, then begun shooting. First-degree murders all the way there, not to mention the gang's prior crimes against the family.
The people he killed were U.S military personnel acting on a government order. John was never officially given a pardon so the soldiers were most likely told that John was armed and dangerous and their orders were most likely to kill or capture him by any means necessary. If John was given an official pardon by the president, then it would have been considered self-defense.
Short Wishlist: Vito Scaletta in Mafia 2 and 3 Joe Barbaro in Mafia 2 and Joes Adventures DLC Mark Hammond in The Getaway The Boss in Saints Row (I know it'll probably be a big ask to do all 4 of the original series so might be better doing game by game)
Did they just forget that in the same chapter as they have John helping to throw bodies into the swamp and commenting that the "gators will be eating well today", they have him outraged that Dutch did it to Bronte?
John is well regarded being hypocritical he wants a normal life yet ruins people's normal life by having an all out shootout in cities robbing banks of people's uninured money killing innocent lawmen(don't tell me they're all corrupt, that's utter bullshit) destruction of property he wants his family back yet like ross mentions "and i'm sure all the people you killed wanted there's too" and im sure there's more example.
In Mexico, every crime John does is either against the Sanchez government (which lost power and thus he wouldnt be tried) or against the rebels (which was done under orders of Allende, and was forgiven by Reyes)
Jimmy Hopkins from Bully/Wei Shen from Sleeping Dogs next please I know Wei is an undercover cop and all of the crime he did would just be waived off, but it's still interesting to see if he's actually charged
For Felony Murders, In the United States, Canada, Australia, United Kingdom and Ireland, The rule of felony murder is a legal doctrine in some common law jurisdictions that broadens the crime of murder: when someone is killed (regardless of intent to kill) in the commission of a dangerous or enumerated crime (called a felony in some jurisdictions), the offender, and also the offender's accomplices or co-conspirators, may be found guilty of murder. However, most countries across Europe and Asia don’t charge an accomplice for Felony Murders committed by a Murder.
If ace attorney villans were charged for their crimes Edit: I have some questions 1: Does it count as treason if it is not your country? Since John is an American but they gave him treason in Mexico 2: in the end, when they raid John's farm Why do you count it as first degree if John didn't know they were going to attack him? I know that since they are all police it is still the death penalty but I think the term is strange 3: WHERE IS THE UNDEAD NIGHTMARE
Undead Nightmare is either not canon at all or just John's dream. Why would he be charged for things he did in his dream? And i don't even remember him doing anything illegal in it anyway but i'm not law expert so maybe i just don't know something about something
@@DutchPlanDerLinde-se9fk If it was a dream then why does he revive as a zombie after his own death, did he predict his own death? Besides, it doesn't matter if it's canon or not, I would like the channel to make the secondary missions and extras too
I doubt it would count as treason, it would count as something closer to espionage due to him being a non-citizen working for a foreign government. But regardless, the mexican government attempted to summary execute him for treason, probably because for them was easier to summary execute him than opening the can of worms that would be putting on trial an american citizen for espionage.
Undead Nightmare is not canon and these crimes John committed during the events of Undead Nightmare will not be applied, as these creatures are a threat to human society.
To answer your questions: 1. I want to say yes because John, despite not being a Mexican citizen, was technically under the employ of the Mexican government as a mercenary. Plus, John committed crimes against the Mexican government under his own free will, not as a member of the United States Military. 2. John was never officially pardoned for his crimes. The soldiers were most likely under orders to kill/capture John for treason against the United States government back in 1899. 3. I suggest sleeping on it.
If he’s being charged for his crimes in Mexico during rdr1 since he’s under government orders from the United States would it still add to his total amount of crimes
John wasn't acting on a bounty or under orders from any law enforcement agency. He was the aggressor in that situation and neither Dutch nor Micah had been officially found guilty of anything.
Felony murder may be seen as a step below first-degree murder. Most often it's levied against a defendant that assisted in or otherwise allowed a murder to occur, despite not committing it themselves.
The way you pace your videos come a long way, giving each crime a bit of context goes a long way in the watchability, the old cutting to every crime gave me a headache
I guess besides like 2 instances he wouldn’t be charged for anything as he is a bounty hunter for the whole game and just trying to hunt down the guy who killed his family
Who wins in a 1v1 - Arthur Morgan or John Marston? 😳
1911 John Marston would win, 1899 or 1907 John Marston would be cooked.
Jim Milton solos both
@@mindkiller10000 nah Rip Van Winkle would win
Negative scar face would win@@puzzle_girl47
john 1911 vs arthur no tb john wins his deadeye is op
John didn't get ONE cutscene and he's already put away for life😂
Ironically he caused more chaos while working for the government than he had when he was working for Dutch
Honestly as bad as Dutch was he was still small fries compared to how big he could have been had he actually cared about the causes he claimed to. Ultimately he just wanted a life of luxury free of rules. He wanted to be Cornwall or Bronte but in another country
@SeahawkGaming-xp7bl that's the first game
@SeahawkGaming-xp7bl he went to Mexico in the first game
@SeahawkGaming-xp7bl but you said in your first comment he caused more chaos and went to Mexico in the second game
We only saw one part of him in Dutchs’ gang while he was in it for 20+years
146 Death sentences, nice one John.
Just a little Tom Foolery
Arthur Morgan has 420 death sentences
@TrystonJackson2005 He has 194 life sentences not death sentences. His actual death sentence is 420 years
It just happened
@@BlacklungBadass Oh yeah thanks I remember that
"Rip Van Winkle" lol and right off the bat a death sentence 😂
John's death is basically death by firing squad
That last bit, I’d probably consider Self-defence because the army
, Ross & Archer, arguably attacked the Marston Ranch unlawfully. They went back on their word to let John go free by helping them, and in doing so the government was also recklessly endangering Jack & Abigail, who are arguably a lot more innocent compared to that of John & Uncle to be fair. (Yeah, Abigail has some crimes on her rap sheet during her time in the Van De Lynde gang, mostly theft or accessory to certain things, the only major crime she did was kill Agent Milton, whilst Jack was completely innocent, well until Ross shot his father like a dog, leading him to exact revenge.)
Well, if Ross done it because of his meanness, then yea, we can't charge John for self-defense. But maybe government ordered Ross to kill John, and in this case, John can be charged, no?
@@apololo7360im gonna look at this realistically
And its alot bare with me
Ross is a crooked cop, we have evidence of that from the fact he shot the corpse of dutch after he jumped off a cliff because “it looks better that way in the papers”
Realistically i think considering how much of a wanted man John really is his bounty for the time would be wanted Dead or Alive with proper procedures being to try and convince him to turn himself in
Ross gave no fucks about proper procedures and maybe would be slightly penalized if found out but considering John is likely wanted dead or alive
Regardless of the outcome whether they did it properly or not, Ross would either have gotten a slap on the wrist or nothing at all
After all 1914 its very easy to fake a story and he couldve easily said that John resisted and he had no choice but to use lethal force
I would also like to point out that even tho they fired shots first, john had his gun ready with no intention of surrendering
Now new austin i believe is meant to be the games version of New mexico if im not mistaken, either that or texas (correction is based on both plus Arizona)
All states of which follow Castle Doctrine which is the right to defend ones homestead from intruders
Given the fact Ross and the officers were at a distance with a ton of armed men you could argue the case that he saw a horde of men and was simply defending his home and family under the confines of that doctrine because Ross didnt use proper procedure when attempting to arrest him and gave no warnings or commands telling him to come quietly and since they opened fire first John returned it
Which given the unlawful circumstances would be considered self defense because of an unlawful act and excessive use of force
But considering the timeframe like i said, he held all the cards because almost anyone in a police precinct is gonna take the word of an officer over a most wanted criminal
Its one of those cases where if he did survive, he’d need a damn good lawful for those charges to be dropped especially considering everything he has done
Even then hes still doing life, still likely getting a death sentence anyway because of the times
Anything’s self defence unless it’s to the government.
@@apololo7360well Ross is breaking up Norwin when comes to Javier because Javier is Mexican and going into another country to catch someone without a war from the Mexican government is trespassing and catching someone or killing them is murder they have no right to determine the fate of a Mexican in Mexico
This guy is pumping out videos like crazy
If Jon Bernthal’s Punisher was charged for his crimes.
I already suggested that one a while ago😉
Work is in progress
Oh wait thats a different guy who does this stuff
Nevermind
Fictionall felonies is gonna do him in the future
he had to go to prison. john marston because he is very evil and a killer. one day they killed john marston
I've been waiting for this one and as you would expect it's a long one!
Been waiting for this right here🫡🔥
Capital punishment in Mexico has been abolished since December 2005. RDR1 took place in 1911.
He’s most likely going off of modern day laws, considering the troubled climate in the early 1910’s.
@@yaboinamedblank76 It said that he's going with the 1900s law
I like how the length of this video is almost perfectly even in the amount of time it dedicates to the first and second RDR games.
If jack marston was charged for his crimes
Jack only committed 1 crime, Murdering Edgar Ross.
Edit: also added Felony Murders.
Shhhhh
@@RinOtonashi i beleve when the officer attacks The Marston farm Jack and john were defended there farm
You forgot the over 40 bank robberies
They told him there was a prize when you got to 50
If Eric Cartman was charged for his crimes
Too NSFW. Eric would receive the Homelander treatment.
I'm pretty sure every instance of Ross using the army was a violation of the Posse Comitatus Act of 1878, though the exact boundaries of what military personnel are allowed to participate in domestically are still disputed to this day. I highly doubt Edgar went through congress for permission and, seeing as how he was working to benefit Nate Johns' campaign for governor - and the unnamed incumbent is never mentioned declaring any state of emergency regarding Williamson, Van Der Linde, or Marston through ambient dialogue or the newspapers - I think there may be coercion and exploitation of ignorance at work. Remember, he's a senior agent in the newly minted Bureau of Investigation, predecessor to the modern FBI, after the government effectively put him out of work with the Anti-Pinkerton Act of 1893, which already put him and his mentor on borrowed time like the Van Der Linde gang. Even back then, there was a lengthy history of corruption and overreach among that organization, and it only got worse in the 1920's when J. Edgar Hoover was appointed as its director.
I'm gonna' argue that the raid on Beecher's Hope was a violation on his part and Marston acted in self-defense.
Considering the coverups of back then(ex: Ma Barker), I’m not surprised that he ended up permanently fishing. No doubt about him using his connections unlawfully. I wonder if the content creator will do a video on Milton and Ross.
"Folks swing for rustling lifestock"
Sheep rustling 2+ years.
Bro counted killing Micah as a crime😭
Cause it is
5:27 - self-defense here is a very arguable matter, even considering morality and the background of this situation. Accounting the fact that the Braithwaite estate is the property of the Braithwaites (you don't say), it looks much more like the Braitwaites being the self-defending party here. Not to mention Dutch started firing first.
Absolutely, self-defense was way off the table here in this case, even if it was in furtherance of saving a young child later down the line. Dutch and his men intruded on another's property, refused to leave when ordered, then begun shooting. First-degree murders all the way there, not to mention the gang's prior crimes against the family.
"I've changed, Abigail!"
33:27 that was self-defense
He was fighting the U.S. Army
The people he killed were U.S military personnel acting on a government order. John was never officially given a pardon so the soldiers were most likely told that John was armed and dangerous and their orders were most likely to kill or capture him by any means necessary. If John was given an official pardon by the president, then it would have been considered self-defense.
They unlawfully attacked his ranch after promising to leave them alone.
If johnny klebitz was charged for his crimes
He got death sentences in GTA 5.
Pls do If Toni Cipriani was charged for his crimes
If Dexter Morgan was charged for his crimes
John’s horse theft with Seth was pardoned as Seth gave him a pardon card
if la noire and bully carachters got charged for their crimes next?
The bully characters are children
@@Micah-Bell-1860 I'm talking about the teachers and townsfolk imao
@@TordaiJenoArthurJenci there teachers all teachers commit child abuse
@@Micah-Bell-1860jimmy has commited vandalism all over the place
6:14 - that wording "Improper disposal of a body" 💀
Short Wishlist:
Vito Scaletta in Mafia 2 and 3
Joe Barbaro in Mafia 2 and Joes Adventures DLC
Mark Hammond in The Getaway
The Boss in Saints Row (I know it'll probably be a big ask to do all 4 of the original series so might be better doing game by game)
awesome content! the red dead franchise is my all-time favourite, keep it up! ^_^
fun fact: both rdr and demon slayer were set in the same time period.
i know its irrelevant, but its just something i discovered
That would explain undead nightmare.
15:23 he says "I cant do it". So its a crime of sadie's.
Yes, but he was acting as an accomplice to Sadie, therefore John would still be charged with felony murder, despite not shooting the man himself.
John didn't try to stop Sadie, nor did he notify law enforcement at any point.
"not like this"
Yes!!!!!!! My wish has been answered!
Did they just forget that in the same chapter as they have John helping to throw bodies into the swamp and commenting that the "gators will be eating well today", they have him outraged that Dutch did it to Bronte?
John is well regarded being hypocritical
he wants a normal life yet ruins people's normal life by having an all out shootout in cities
robbing banks of people's uninured money
killing innocent lawmen(don't tell me they're all corrupt, that's utter bullshit)
destruction of property
he wants his family back yet like ross mentions "and i'm sure all the people you killed wanted there's too"
and im sure there's more example.
If Captain Walker from Spec Ops: The Line was charged for his crimes.
He might bring help the rook there ol pal. - Outlaws.
I wouldn’t really count John taking Kirean as Kidnapping
You forgot the two kills He gets before He gets gunned down.
In Mexico, every crime John does is either against the Sanchez government (which lost power and thus he wouldnt be tried) or against the rebels (which was done under orders of Allende, and was forgiven by Reyes)
Why does that matter,Imo He still has crimes in America.
Jimmy Hopkins from Bully/Wei Shen from Sleeping Dogs next please
I know Wei is an undercover cop and all of the crime he did would just be waived off, but it's still interesting to see if he's actually charged
Why did you count it for John when Arthur killed people?
It’s felony murder.
For Felony Murders, In the United States, Canada, Australia, United Kingdom and Ireland, The rule of felony murder is a legal doctrine in some common law jurisdictions that broadens the crime of murder: when someone is killed (regardless of intent to kill) in the commission of a dangerous or enumerated crime (called a felony in some jurisdictions), the offender, and also the offender's accomplices or co-conspirators, may be found guilty of murder. However, most countries across Europe and Asia don’t charge an accomplice for Felony Murders committed by a Murder.
@@RinOtonashi oh alr thanks, I didn’t know that lol
John is an accomplice, even if he didn't directly murder.
John was involved in the murders, even though he personally didn’t kill some of the people.
If Marcus Holloway was charged for his crimes in watch dogs 2
If Trevor Reznik was charged for his crimes ( The Machinist 2004)
If Dominic Toretto was charged for his crimes
I love your videos @cinemacop 😊👍👏
Love the channel
If ace attorney villans were charged for their crimes
Edit:
I have some questions
1: Does it count as treason if it is not your country? Since John is an American but they gave him treason in Mexico
2: in the end, when they raid John's farm
Why do you count it as first degree if John didn't know they were going to attack him? I know that since they are all police it is still the death penalty but I think the term is strange
3: WHERE IS THE UNDEAD NIGHTMARE
Undead Nightmare is either not canon at all or just John's dream. Why would he be charged for things he did in his dream? And i don't even remember him doing anything illegal in it anyway but i'm not law expert so maybe i just don't know something about something
@@DutchPlanDerLinde-se9fk If it was a dream then why does he revive as a zombie after his own death, did he predict his own death?
Besides, it doesn't matter if it's canon or not, I would like the channel to make the secondary missions and extras too
I doubt it would count as treason, it would count as something closer to espionage due to him being a non-citizen working for a foreign government.
But regardless, the mexican government attempted to summary execute him for treason, probably because for them was easier to summary execute him than opening the can of worms that would be putting on trial an american citizen for espionage.
Undead Nightmare is not canon and these crimes John committed during the events of Undead Nightmare will not be applied, as these creatures are a threat to human society.
To answer your questions:
1. I want to say yes because John, despite not being a Mexican citizen, was technically under the employ of the Mexican government as a mercenary. Plus, John committed crimes against the Mexican government under his own free will, not as a member of the United States Military.
2. John was never officially pardoned for his crimes. The soldiers were most likely under orders to kill/capture John for treason against the United States government back in 1899.
3. I suggest sleeping on it.
If Michael Schofield was charged for his crimes
If CoD Villains were charged for their crimes
If the courier was charged for his crimes FNV
You should do if Wei Shen was charged for his crimes
If Vic Mackey was charged for his crimes.
A lot of these could be considered self defense AND the government didn't care about gang on gang violence for the most part back then
i was hoping aliases would be scarface
Rd1 John : under government orders
AYE AYE HIS ALIASES IS NOT JUST RIP VAN WINKLE THERES ANOTHER ONE JIM MILTON ALSO SCAR FACE
Good video
John Marston’s sentence was carried out in the end.
Hopefully you bring in Toni Cipriani and Nathan Drake in the future.
Love the red dead crime series
Edgar Ross next
If William Joseph Blazkowicz was punished for his crimes
I wonder what Dominic from godfather 2 game would be doing for his escapades
Well to be fair, John did get charged for his crimes and well, you know his fate.
He TECHNICALLY died by firing squad
John didnt kill the 18 people at the cabin it was arthur
It was him Arthur and Bill. And Kieran cause of when he saves Arthur at the end
Appreciate the RDR love
I played RDR way more than I played RDR2
What about if Rambo was charged for his crimes?
Clementine from the walking dead
?
If the salamanca twins were Charged for Their crimes
If he’s being charged for his crimes in Mexico during rdr1 since he’s under government orders from the United States would it still add to his total amount of crimes
Most of these crimes are committed by author
John was involved, he would still receive punishment.
John is crazy
If Jack Marston was Charged for his crimes
I mean he did carry out that death sentence
Do if The Gang from Always Sunny was charged for there crimes
Jack should be next
I wouldn't say killing a illegal gang should be listed as a crime as Micah and Dutch has done some illegal stuff when the gang split apart.
John wasn't acting on a bounty or under orders from any law enforcement agency. He was the aggressor in that situation and neither Dutch nor Micah had been officially found guilty of anything.
@@PewPewBeets ah, ok
John Marston sounds like Engineer from TF2!
Is Grand Goodeve the Voice of John?
No. He's voiced by Rob Wiethoff.
@@PewPewBeets Oh.
That's Disappointing.
Now do rip wan winkle
Plz do if D-Fens was charged for his crimes
What is a "felony murder" and what makes it a punishable crime?
Felony murder may be seen as a step below first-degree murder. Most often it's levied against a defendant that assisted in or otherwise allowed a murder to occur, despite not committing it themselves.
Under ten minutes gang
The way you pace your videos come a long way, giving each crime a bit of context goes a long way in the watchability, the old cutting to every crime gave me a headache
Train robbery is still a crime?
Do Micah
If Alex Mercer Was Charged For His Crimes.
Should that be self-defence because they stole the boy?
Do Bill Williamson from Rampage.
U should do bill our Javier Escuela our Charles smith or others
Rip van winkle
I mean John *Was* charged with his crimes
Can u do one with family matters characters
If Jax Teller from Sons of Anarchy was charged for his crimes
Btw why is John charged for Arthur's kills? He didn't kill them, Arthur did
felony murder
I want to see Javier, Bill, Charles, and Sean at some point.
Now Red Harlow
Who?!
@@Fugitive685he is from the first red dead game. Red dead revolver
@frameratereel8531 That game is older than me
I guess besides like 2 instances he wouldn’t be charged for anything as he is a bounty hunter for the whole game and just trying to hunt down the guy who killed his family
17:43 That’s being blackmailed.
What you call blackmail, the Federal Government calls justification.
@@PewPewBeets Yeah. It could’ve been “under duress” instead.
If Sadie Adler was charge for her crimes
What if Edgar Ross was charged for his crimes
you missed a lot of missions be but I understand if you did everything author did that would be like a 50 billion year sentence