After trying both Flutter and React Native, I give my take on whether Flutter will kill React Native. ---- Follow me online: voidpet.com/be... #benawad
I think they will keep both angular and flutter. Using angular when you only need a website + PWA. And flutter for mobile (mostly) and desktop. Just like React and RN
@@yeicore the thing is that the code you write in react native is similar to normal react, flutter uses dart and from what i've seen in every code snippet, dart is a clusterfuck
@@succatash React native already has 4 years of life, jquery exists until today. In 5 years, technology can change everything, it can kill to react native, flutter. We need to be open to how the market moves, and how we adopt the best solution.
@@eligrandnezerwa4541 I had previous knowledge of working with Java, C++ and JavaScript. So some of the things in dart seemed familiar to me. So I understood dart much faster.
One other factor that prevented me from switching to Flutter is that Google just drops projects if there's not a wide adaptation of the community. I still use React Native for now but watch closely.
@@YoungDen I'm not actually referring to a language but some Google projects I used in the past. I had used github.com/google/material-design-lite then they suddenly dropped it (change to a different implementation), we're an early adopter so we had to change a lot. Also, I'm a fan of Google Inbox which they dropped 5 months ago. Thankfully before I've implemented Google Maps API the announce the changes so we were not affected. geoawesomeness.com/developers-up-in-arms-over-google-maps-api-insane-price-hike/. In general, I like Google products I use them over native iOS / macOS apps.
Fuchsia OS alone is a reason to learn it and mess around, Google wants ambient computing to be key since write once, use anywhere seems to be a key to community adoption, there will be 2 main ecosystems it seems React/JS/NodeJs and Flutter/Dart
As far as I completely agree with the first 2 points i feel like bringing up the 3rd one was bad. As you said we're debating whether flutter *will* kill RN. We should be focusing on the future not on what we currently have. Its like saying Java is good because of the abundance of jobs available. Thanks!
As a .Net developer (who knows Xamarin as well), I've chosen Flutter and very happy with that :) I dedicate myself completely to flutter and invest all time to flutter :) I may be like react native but architecture of flutter comes to me really great, smooth, easy :) especially If you come from .net backgroung and using Xamarin :) I believe that Flutter will be one of the best mobile development frameworks
No one is talking about maintaining code base. A company with a dart will always employ a dart programmer FOREVER. And a RN app needs to employ a Javascript FOREVER which is more feasible
@@manfredadams3252 I totally agree. When it comes to picking up languages. People pick it up with different speeds, there are design patterns introduced, tips and tricks that can only be gotten with experience. C'mon Man. 😂😂
I'm a Flutter developer and a 2 years experienced JavaScript Dev, I'm a lot more comfortable with JavaScript, I hate Dart, the best thing in JavaScript is it's huge community. Dart has a very very small community when compared to JS. The documentation of Dart is way more worse than mdn JavaScript. But my advise for you is, Dart is not hard if you're good in JavaScript, you can learn all of Dart in 5 hours.
stressing on your first point about hot reloading in react native, yes it is a pain now but react-native team has upgraded hot reload to work seamlessly now. they even renamed it as fast reload. I havent tried it yet but people who have are saying it's flawless
Learn both frameworks, leave it to the companies to decide what to use, but i have to say, there are only two reason RN developers do not switch to flutter 1. react web framework 2. useState hook
Personal points, still developing in native for clients though. 1) React native still has no v1.0 open sourced. And hearing from people that have connection to inner facebook teams it's still more like inner project that happens to update it's OS counterpart from time to time. 2) React native developer will be able to write flutter apps within days learning flutter(dart language is what JS should look like, tbh :) ), converting in reverse will lead to week(or even weeks) of work to achieve the same result. 3) Flutter comes from google. Even if it is not the team behind android itself, i would still trust them a little more in terms of developing framework for mobile platforms when they de-facto own one the 2 major platforms. Yea, i know about the graveyard. But considering Nubank and Yandex picking up on flutter in their critical-mission apps give me some hope. 4) Flutter is not for you if you want your app to be 100% platform native UI, iOS widgets are just not gona cut it. 5) Most of the react devs don't want to transition to mobile development. It's easier to cenvert native devs to flutter rather than react devs.
If you are one of the few who has time, doing Flutter now can work well if Flutter jobs take off in two years, because they will only want Flutter developers with 5 years experience.
The worst thing about flutter is the huge garbage code that you walk through every day. In Flutter we mix styling, widgets, logical code.. everything in one place which makes the whole development process like sh!t. We have A LOT of built in classes, we can't do something simple in flutter, for a very simple app that prints hello world you'll write a class with 10 lines of code. Coding with Flutter is letrally impossible without the help of VScode and the flutter extension. I don't know about your react native, tell us about your daily life..
bro, sounds like u just try to step into flutter and got some issues. u could break down huge widget to ur customlize components. everything depends on ur option. but for sure i could understand ur headache-wrapped style is the first and hard step for flutter learning.
While I agree with this in theory (the market is big and there's room for many solutions), I really can't think of a single app that would be better to do with RN than Flutter. I can't imagine a scenario where I would deliberately endure such a huge drop in developer productivity. Once Flutter fully supports the web, I will be very happy knowing that I never have to write another line of HTML/CSS/JS.
@Mozzo Axe -- Well, I was just saying that when you develop a web app with Flutter, you don't have to write HTML/CSS/JS. The Flutter compilation process does it for you!
Just a quick note about hot reloading. You're right, there can be times when it can be buggy, what I usually do is start the metro bundler ("yarn start") and then start the device("yarn ios", "yarn tvOS", etc ) as opposed to just starting the device from the onset - the same goes for Expo apps..
I used to watch your videos on React Native and you actually did a great job introducing it to me, I've just gotten very fatigued regarding the amount of different frameworks there are for JavaScript, maybe as I get older it just seems a bit silly. I'd rather just build projects in Go or some other type safe language, even though JavaScript is EVERYWHERE. Then again I am not a mobile developer or UI expert.
Just choose one, you don't need to know them all. You'll find that jumping into a new framework or library is easy. Also, like the other guy said, use typescript. It's made daily work easier in every way and my apps are much better.
Wait for sometime, it will definitely kill react native. The developer experience for flutter is much much better and the speed achieved when writing flutter apps is much higher than writing a react native app.
I used react native for a year and a half. Then i met flutter. I only knew javascript. No typescript. No java. No flow. So... i naturally hated flutter and i missed xml so much. Then someday it clicked. Dart languaje. Flutter widgets. Animations. Navigation.... all fell in place. Now i can't program in javascript. It feels wrong 😔
I've been a fan of javascript for a while. I am developing an idea called Processing Pulse and wanted to find a tool like React Native. Was not attracted to it for some reason. After seeing Flutter, I instantly was attracted to it because of it's similarity to Processing code which is a derivative of java. I agree Flutter will force React Native to improve. I also believe that your pre-disposed favour of React Native is based on 'existence' vs the fact that Flutter does have huge potential. I believe that in 2 years we will see a shift once Flutter still exists. A shift always creates opportunity and developers go with opportunity wherever it is. React Native or Flutter. Whoever creates the shift of technology is the one who lives. So I believe its all up to which of the two is seeking to shift the paradigm instead of doing what is doing a little better than the competition. Flutter has no competition , React Native clearly does.
This is good to hear because literally the only reason I am learning react is because I'm interested in react native. And pretty much for the reasons you mentioned.
Doubt it. React native is so easy to integrate into existing codebase with 1000s SLOC. Most developers integrating react native on a screen by screen basis because of how well it works with native code. Flutter on the other hand in my experience is a nightmare to write into an existing codebase and the last time I remember this feature was limited. Flutter is good for Android development IMO but for iOS it’s lacking. Material widgets work perfectly but Cupertino widgets not so much. Default flutter apps don’t native to iOS partly because how flutter handles rendering in comparison to react native. Flutter is just going to make react native better. Not replace it Those two things are a huge drawback for me anwyays. Not to mention the ugly syntax
ugly syntax? you can split the widgets. and flutter works with exisiting code too thanks to platform channels. you are misleading. and dart is the better language 100%
ijaz khan yeah the syntax of flutter puts me off. It’s no where near as friendly neat or clean as JSX for one and I hate how Every single thing is a widget.
I was a python dev before learning flutter so dart vs JS is assumed to be an equal learning curve. Hopefully i can find a job once i build a couple more apps.
Just use Flutter and you wont regret it, the dev experience > job offers (also, Flutter is becoming highly requested :D since this video was posted) . Love yourself, use flutter
Good piece, but remember once a development tech reaches a certain rate of adoption the whole concept of it "dying" is an Internet myth. Case in point, due to legacy architectures, PHP is still the most widely used server side language on the web.(With WordPress its 83%! take WordPress away and it's 54%) However it sits behind NodeJS and Ruby for projects started from scratch. Point is Instagram, Facebook Ads manager, Tesla, Discord, Pinterest, Walmart, Uber Eats, Wix, Bloomberg and more have invested tons in terms of money, code and contributing to open source, that alone makes React Native the better choice for longevity.(Outside of Alibaba and Google apps, Flutter doesn't have near this level of adoption, moreover Google has a long history of abandoning projects. While Flutter is new, the Dart language is over 8 years old, originally it was supposed to replace JavaScript in the Chromium engine and beyond)....................... As a developer, JSX, access to the JavaScript eco-sysytem, React's functional flavor combined with Dart's poor approach to concurrency, odd syntax and Flutter's opinionated Material UI building approach make React Native a no-brainier for me. While Flutter/Dart does have advantages such as static typing as a core feature and has demonstrated performance advantages, projects like the Hermes engine show that the latter's advantage may be short lived. If Flutter interests someoe they should learn it, but if you are betting on one or the other I would recommend React Native
we can compare react native with flutter only after react native re-architecture. then we can have better idea. who is performing better. currently flutter is better in performance. i am a react native developer but i just gave a try to flutter and was very much impressed.
@@themorbidhero2987 because of the same thing happen as with the gif codex just 1M time more .. you will need to pay to release to the platform .. you will need to a big cut like 70% of your profit ... That kind of stuff ... A bad future....
Agree most but your second point is invalid. 1. Learning new language nowadays? For professional developers this isn't gonna be a problem at all, learning a new framework is usually far more tedious. 2. Dart's syntax is very similar to most of the modern languages like Java, Kotlin, C# and even now Typescript. So no, even for newcomers from javascript background it's not gonna be a real problem.
While everyone says all good things about hot reload, I have to disable it. I am too aggressive about saving the file, like I constantly saving it. Some times, I just want to save the file, but do not want to reload the application, it becomes really annoying.
VMiXEZ this doesn’t make much sense to me, because it doesn’t auto reload unless you type “r” in the command line... saving doesn’t do anything on its own
Flutter/Dart just seems to have been designed for smoothness, speed, simplicity, to get to the point. While React Native relies on Javascript which started 24 years ago so it may perhaps just not be as optimized. We want to have the least bloatware going on, right? I am no expert.
@@coherentpanda7115 my understanding is that the geniuses who made the open source V8 engine of Chrome which dramatically increased Javascript performance by 100x on the web of all the web browsers on the market, that they created Dart because they thought Javascript wasn't optimized enough or containing too much bloat. That for anyone starting out with programming, Dart is an easier language to learn and use and the way they designed Dart is to be more efficient and less bloated. Am I wrong? I understand that there is 100x more developers out there who know Javascript than Dart today, but we're talking about what's going to happen in the future here. And which platform people should use when considering developing a new app today.. It seems that the momentum for Flutter is growing rapidly..
Learning a new programming language like Dart is really easy if you know Java or Javascript. And IMO Javascript ist one of the worst programming languages I have ever worked with.
Can't believe how many Flutter fanboys there are in the comments. Nobody defends a computer language or framework more than Flutter fanatics. Ben made some really great points. Flutter will be popular with those beginning to creating apps on the web, or looking for something fresh and new, and I imagine quite a few startups will jump on the bandwagon. However, expect very slow adoption from major development companies, as React and JS are a surefire method to write code quickly and make it work on the web. Flutter will have it's place eventually, if Google shows support for it adoption will grow, especially if the new Android replacement supports Dart closely much like Apple does with Swift.
Monty Rasmussen You really need to work with React Native someday. Try keeping your Js bias aside while doing it. I have worked more with Flutter than RN and I can't objectively decide which one is better.
@@ijazkhan3335 -- Just as liking something doesn't automatically make one a fanboy, disliking something doesn't necessarily represent any kind of unfair bias. JavaScript has earned its reputation as a pile of crap, and that should never be discounted when making decisions about how to build software. JS wasn't designed to do what people are doing with it now, and all its new features to cope with that have just created a bad language covered in bandages. That said, I think React itself is great. It's done a good job of showing everyone that reactive programming on the client is a cleaner, faster way to code, and produces fewer bugs. Flutter was directly inspired by this paradigm, but in my opinion, it just does it better.
For some reason flutter is unable to meet my needs. But let me say I feel like react native is easier to understand and others. I have been using Java for Android apps but now starting to go to cross platform
Flutter is just objectively better in mobile environment if the hype of flutter web is true, it will be the better platform but, Are these differences worth rewriting in Flutter?
@@tuananhdo1870 Well after 8 months since I ask the question I can confirm that, most of JS APIs for acessing mobile phone sensors and notificacions are still raw compared to the native options.
couldn't agree more with you, flutter has so many good things, and react native has seen this and is starting to improve a lot of stuff, now with skia in alpha, i can start to think the same, react native won't even drop in hype, although flutter has increase in popularity these days, react native still up there too
A video or a series of video on how to do proper styling(best practices, structuring the project) REACT.JS app with a UI framework like Ant.design, semantic-UI
very poor review. I usually like your reviews for being objective, but I think this should be renamed as In defense of react-native. Your opinion about javascript having less boilerplate than java - sure thats why dynamic languages exist, they have no boilerplate, no typechecking, all on runtime and slowness that come with it. Very few (Rust comes to mind) languages allow safety of JVM and comparable speeds of C. javascript, python are easy, but often that matters less for seasoned engineers. I am disappointed that you never go into technical details about why flutter v why react-native. we need details sir, not some glib opinions or how many jobs exist for flutter. Sure those matter but lets not pretend then that we have captured all other details already. I understand you have limited time for videos but please I'd appreciate if you can make up some effort to do technical analysis.
It was easier for me to learn flutter than react. State is managed better in flutter plus since it is multithreaded like java dealing with all that promise silliness is gone. It is strongly typed too.
I think u have to write more boilerplate on react native because there is too much effort for basic stuff such as theme manager or global state manager and etc which you can get them out of the box in flutter .
Also in my experience RN doesnt have good profiling tools. For instance in flutter u can see how much each widget or component re render which u have to do it manualy in RN and memory leak testing and stuff like that
I love ReactNative, it took me 10 days to be productive with it without any knowledge of ReactJS, just by knowing VueJS. IMO I would need more than that to be productive in Flutter.
Flutter won't "kill" react native, but it will become the predominant framework for cross-platform app development. I understand the points he tries to make, but they don't square up against reality. Flutter makes a lot of business sense, and it will continue to boom. Choices are good, but if I'm starting today, it certainly isn't on Javascript. He sort of undermines his own arguments with the last point. Go search "java" jobs. Big number, right?
Thanks for your transparency on this Ben. Good to know that RN constantly crashing is a universal issue. Hopefully one they will fix now flutter is competition.
If google is releasing flutter web, what will happen to angular?
Only bad things
Everyone but JS devs: "Electron can finally fucking die!"
I think they will keep both angular and flutter. Using angular when you only need a website + PWA. And flutter for mobile (mostly) and desktop. Just like React and RN
@@yeicore the thing is that the code you write in react native is similar to normal react, flutter uses dart and from what i've seen in every code snippet, dart is a clusterfuck
Nah flutter web is slower than nextJS
React native will not die because it is React.
In 5years lets revisit this comment
@@succatash React native already has 4 years of life, jquery exists until today. In 5 years, technology can change everything, it can kill to react native, flutter. We need to be open to how the market moves, and how we adopt the best solution.
@@thakaxp1 that was the point of my comment
@@succatash jquery said the same thing 5 years ago
@@maxclifford937 Is Jquery still alive?
Flutter is so smooth, react native is definately gonna face hard time
lol
Nah m8. I disagree
I disagree with this statement. Flutter is shit
@@jasonpraful Tell that to the 1000 npm/yarn errors you’re facing. RN is a nightmare
naah. community size alone should tell you that.
I learned JS in 1998 (yep, it was a toy language at that time). But I must say, I am loving Dart! Regards!
Infact dart is so much easier to learn. It just took me three days to get started on making a Fully functional app
can't believe
@@eligrandnezerwa4541 I had previous knowledge of working with Java, C++ and JavaScript. So some of the things in dart seemed familiar to me. So I understood dart much faster.
You are amazing man🔥
For me I’m struggling to learn it because I’m new to code
@@poujhit can i get your contact so i can dm you?
One other factor that prevented me from switching to Flutter is that Google just drops projects if there's not a wide adaptation of the community. I still use React Native for now but watch closely.
That's dummies reason to not learn Flutter. You should have considered how quickly it is growing.
Plus what language have they dropped that they created.
@@YoungDen I'm not actually referring to a language but some Google projects I used in the past. I had used github.com/google/material-design-lite then they suddenly dropped it (change to a different implementation), we're an early adopter so we had to change a lot. Also, I'm a fan of Google Inbox which they dropped 5 months ago. Thankfully before I've implemented Google Maps API the announce the changes so we were not affected. geoawesomeness.com/developers-up-in-arms-over-google-maps-api-insane-price-hike/.
In general, I like Google products I use them over native iOS / macOS apps.
Fuchsia OS alone is a reason to learn it and mess around, Google wants ambient computing to be key since write once, use anywhere seems to be a key to community adoption, there will be 2 main ecosystems it seems React/JS/NodeJs and Flutter/Dart
Dart is not a barrier, its actually a fresh modern language. Its just amazing.
Ben, put an another video for 2022 on React Native or Flutter?
I don't think React Native will die, but it doesn't have anything on Flutter, and I'm a React lover
I really want to know your opinion about this today (March, 2021), Greetings :D
If you need to get hired anytime soon, start RN and learn flutter making money :)
As far as I completely agree with the first 2 points i feel like bringing up the 3rd one was bad. As you said we're debating whether flutter *will* kill RN. We should be focusing on the future not on what we currently have. Its like saying Java is good because of the abundance of jobs available. Thanks!
But it is good >:(
and once again, i agree. and Angular it's a superb example: there's a very large group of developers that avoids it due to TypeScript.
As a .Net developer (who knows Xamarin as well), I've chosen Flutter and very happy with that :) I dedicate myself completely to flutter and invest all time to flutter :) I may be like react native but architecture of flutter comes to me really great, smooth, easy :) especially If you come from .net backgroung and using Xamarin :) I believe that Flutter will be one of the best mobile development frameworks
I really wished, I could use ReactJS Web Components in React Native without compromising performance or without using Webview.
No one is talking about maintaining code base. A company with a dart will always employ a dart programmer FOREVER. And a RN app needs to employ a Javascript FOREVER which is more feasible
@Malik Bagwala Well, he said something about the friction. And how it reminded him of Java. Everyone may not take it as smoothly as you did
@@jerrynwaeze9269 A programmer can pick up any language. People sure use words like 'developer' and 'engineer' quite loosely these days.
@@manfredadams3252 I totally agree. When it comes to picking up languages. People pick it up with different speeds, there are design patterns introduced, tips and tricks that can only be gotten with experience. C'mon Man. 😂😂
@@jerrynwaeze9269 Don't hire anyone who doesn't know c. All your future headaches solved.
@@manfredadams3252 🤣🤣🤣🤣
6:29 Flutter Flamework?
I'm a Flutter developer and a 2 years experienced JavaScript Dev,
I'm a lot more comfortable with JavaScript, I hate Dart, the best thing in JavaScript is it's huge community.
Dart has a very very small community when compared to JS.
The documentation of Dart is way more worse than mdn JavaScript.
But my advise for you is, Dart is not hard if you're good in JavaScript, you can learn all of Dart in 5 hours.
stressing on your first point about hot reloading in react native, yes it is a pain now but react-native team has upgraded hot reload to work seamlessly now. they even renamed it as fast reload. I havent tried it yet but people who have are saying it's flawless
Learn both frameworks, leave it to the companies to decide what to use, but i have to say, there are only two reason RN developers do not switch to flutter
1. react web framework
2. useState hook
Dude. You are reading my mind. I was desperately thinking same, since a day.
Resume: React Native is better cause u already know javascript, dart is so hard 😥😥😭😭😭😭😭
Personal points, still developing in native for clients though.
1) React native still has no v1.0 open sourced. And hearing from people that have connection to inner facebook teams it's still more like inner project that happens to update it's OS counterpart from time to time.
2) React native developer will be able to write flutter apps within days learning flutter(dart language is what JS should look like, tbh :) ), converting in reverse will lead to week(or even weeks) of work to achieve the same result.
3) Flutter comes from google. Even if it is not the team behind android itself, i would still trust them a little more in terms of developing framework for mobile platforms when they de-facto own one the 2 major platforms. Yea, i know about the graveyard. But considering Nubank and Yandex picking up on flutter in their critical-mission apps give me some hope.
4) Flutter is not for you if you want your app to be 100% platform native UI, iOS widgets are just not gona cut it.
5) Most of the react devs don't want to transition to mobile development. It's easier to cenvert native devs to flutter rather than react devs.
If you are one of the few who has time, doing Flutter now can work well if Flutter jobs take off in two years, because they will only want Flutter developers with 5 years experience.
The worst thing about flutter is the huge garbage code that you walk through every day.
In Flutter we mix styling, widgets, logical code.. everything in one place which makes the whole development process like sh!t.
We have A LOT of built in classes, we can't do something simple in flutter, for a very simple app that prints hello world you'll write a class with 10 lines of code.
Coding with Flutter is letrally impossible without the help of VScode and the flutter extension.
I don't know about your react native, tell us about your daily life..
bro, sounds like u just try to step into flutter and got some issues. u could break down huge widget to ur customlize components. everything depends on ur option. but for sure i could understand ur headache-wrapped style is the first and hard step for flutter learning.
I love React Native!
I believe that the two can live together, depending on what type of app you should develop, one should choose one or the other
While I agree with this in theory (the market is big and there's room for many solutions), I really can't think of a single app that would be better to do with RN than Flutter. I can't imagine a scenario where I would deliberately endure such a huge drop in developer productivity. Once Flutter fully supports the web, I will be very happy knowing that I never have to write another line of HTML/CSS/JS.
@Mozzo Axe -- The chances of what? Flutter web support is in beta right now. It's coming soon...
@Mozzo Axe -- Well, I was just saying that when you develop a web app with Flutter, you don't have to write HTML/CSS/JS. The Flutter compilation process does it for you!
now thats the shii right there
@Mozzo Axe Yes it will if flutter web project takes off
Just a quick note about hot reloading. You're right, there can be times when it can be buggy, what I usually do is start the metro bundler ("yarn start") and then start the device("yarn ios", "yarn tvOS", etc ) as opposed to just starting the device from the onset - the same goes for Expo apps..
That's interesting. I actually found Dart to be somewhat like C#
more like typescript except for the *semicolon*
React is the biggest framework (*library).
Its big but trust me it will change soon. This framework is going to be a titan.
Better use native this framework making a bug can't handle all phone
It’s definitely a framework.
Flutter already killed RN, see the charts boy
I used to watch your videos on React Native and you actually did a great job introducing it to me, I've just gotten very fatigued regarding the amount of different frameworks there are for JavaScript, maybe as I get older it just seems a bit silly. I'd rather just build projects in Go or some other type safe language, even though JavaScript is EVERYWHERE. Then again I am not a mobile developer or UI expert.
Have you considered Typescript? Set it to strict and boom you have a typed language 😊
Just choose one, you don't need to know them all. You'll find that jumping into a new framework or library is easy. Also, like the other guy said, use typescript. It's made daily work easier in every way and my apps are much better.
Wait for sometime, it will definitely kill react native. The developer experience for flutter is much much better and the speed achieved when writing flutter apps is much higher than writing a react native app.
I used react native for a year and a half.
Then i met flutter. I only knew javascript. No typescript. No java. No flow. So... i naturally hated flutter and i missed xml so much.
Then someday it clicked. Dart languaje. Flutter widgets. Animations. Navigation.... all fell in place.
Now i can't program in javascript. It feels wrong 😔
I've been a fan of javascript for a while. I am developing an idea called Processing Pulse and wanted to find a tool like React Native. Was not attracted to it for some reason. After seeing Flutter, I instantly was attracted to it because of it's similarity to Processing code which is a derivative of java. I agree Flutter will force React Native to improve. I also believe that your pre-disposed favour of React Native is based on 'existence' vs the fact that Flutter does have huge potential. I believe that in 2 years we will see a shift once Flutter still exists. A shift always creates opportunity and developers go with opportunity wherever it is. React Native or Flutter. Whoever creates the shift of technology is the one who lives. So I believe its all up to which of the two is seeking to shift the paradigm instead of doing what is doing a little better than the competition. Flutter has no competition , React Native clearly does.
right.... that's why there are still job openings for COBOL... because developers "go with opportunity wherever it is"
Once you go flutter you don't go back
Sadly react native is still at 0.61, a new minor version after this video 😑
patience
0.62.0 will release soon...
github.com/facebook/react-native/releases
10 months later RN is at 0.63 😑
Flutter 2 is great, my go-to mobile framework these days.
in 2021
flutter is way far better
This is good to hear because literally the only reason I am learning react is because I'm interested in react native. And pretty much for the reasons you mentioned.
Doubt it. React native is so easy to integrate into existing codebase with 1000s SLOC. Most developers integrating react native on a screen by screen basis because of how well it works with native code. Flutter on the other hand in my experience is a nightmare to write into an existing codebase and the last time I remember this feature was limited.
Flutter is good for Android development IMO but for iOS it’s lacking. Material widgets work perfectly but Cupertino widgets not so much. Default flutter apps don’t native to iOS partly because how flutter handles rendering in comparison to react native.
Flutter is just going to make react native better. Not replace it
Those two things are a huge drawback for me anwyays. Not to mention the ugly syntax
ugly syntax? you can split the widgets. and flutter works with exisiting code too thanks to platform channels. you are misleading. and dart is the better language 100%
I actually love Dart as a language. I wish we could use a language like it for React or React Native. I did not really like the syntax of Flutter.
And yeah I agree. Flutter hands down beats RN in terms of developing for Android. For IOS, I still like RN
ijaz khan yeah the syntax of flutter puts me off. It’s no where near as friendly neat or clean as JSX for one and I hate how Every single thing is a widget.
My friend flutter is now way way better than RN. iOS is just so impressive. These guys at google really know what they are doing.
I was a python dev before learning flutter so dart vs JS is assumed to be an equal learning curve. Hopefully i can find a job once i build a couple more apps.
I think the no.of jobs are now equal for both, but knowing react-native you can also search for react jobs.
The last time i checked, RN had way more jobs than flutter.
For a beginner like me it doesn’t matter if it’s dart or JavaScript. So I would rather chose flutter.
flutter write once truly run everywhere ( ios, android, desktop, web) it's coming just learn it : ).
Completely agree. Flutter can run in Smart-TVs/Wacth.
Just use Flutter and you wont regret it, the dev experience > job offers (also, Flutter is becoming highly requested :D since this video was posted) . Love yourself, use flutter
My only worry with flutter is google dropping it. Otherwise its Just Perfect
make a updated version
Good piece, but remember once a development tech reaches a certain rate of adoption the whole concept of it "dying" is an Internet myth. Case in point, due to legacy architectures, PHP is still the most widely used server side language on the web.(With WordPress its 83%! take WordPress away and it's 54%) However it sits behind NodeJS and Ruby for projects started from scratch. Point is Instagram, Facebook Ads manager, Tesla, Discord, Pinterest, Walmart, Uber Eats, Wix, Bloomberg and more have invested tons in terms of money, code and contributing to open source, that alone makes React Native the better choice for longevity.(Outside of Alibaba and Google apps, Flutter doesn't have near this level of adoption, moreover Google has a long history of abandoning projects. While Flutter is new, the Dart language is over 8 years old, originally it was supposed to replace JavaScript in the Chromium engine and beyond)....................... As a developer, JSX, access to the JavaScript eco-sysytem, React's functional flavor combined with Dart's poor approach to concurrency, odd syntax and Flutter's opinionated Material UI building approach make React Native a no-brainier for me. While Flutter/Dart does have advantages such as static typing as a core feature and has demonstrated performance advantages, projects like the Hermes engine show that the latter's advantage may be short lived. If Flutter interests someoe they should learn it, but if you are betting on one or the other I would recommend React Native
What do you mean by "odd syntax" in Dart?
well in the modern react native the hot reload is freaking smooth too
It will not die unless React native stops improving.
Flutter has the inside track on Android which is an insurmountable advantage. Come over to the Dart side...
Android is ugly and poorly made.
@@Etienne_H like you
we can compare react native with flutter only after react native re-architecture. then we can have better idea. who is performing better. currently flutter is better in performance. i am a react native developer but i just gave a try to flutter and was very much impressed.
Any current news on RN re-architecture? Is it in beta yet?
Angular is still alive, so i am very sure RN is not going to die.
That being said, Flutter in 2020 is really hitting it out of the park
All great points, Ben...and I 100% agree.
As Java programmer i find it usefull the Dart.
I had the same exact reaction when I saw Dart had syntax similar to Java :X
Ofc React Native will prevail, react web devs do not want it to die
i DO not like flutter, it is google trying to move the devs to a new platform for the new OS that is a close black box, it will be a Bad future.
Why would it be a bad future
@@themorbidhero2987 because of the same thing happen as with the gif codex just 1M time more .. you will need to pay to release to the platform .. you will need to a big cut like 70% of your profit ... That kind of stuff ... A bad future....
Agree most but your second point is invalid.
1. Learning new language nowadays? For professional developers this isn't gonna be a problem at all, learning a new framework is usually far more tedious.
2. Dart's syntax is very similar to most of the modern languages like Java, Kotlin, C# and even now Typescript. So no, even for newcomers from javascript background it's not gonna be a real problem.
"WILL POWERADE KILL GATORADE??!!!??@??@?@?@??111""
Never expected to see a clickbait title coming from you, man...
While everyone says all good things about hot reload, I have to disable it. I am too aggressive about saving the file, like I constantly saving it. Some times, I just want to save the file, but do not want to reload the application, it becomes really annoying.
VMiXEZ this doesn’t make much sense to me, because it doesn’t auto reload unless you type “r” in the command line... saving doesn’t do anything on its own
So after two years , did it kill react.js?
Flutter/Dart just seems to have been designed for smoothness, speed, simplicity, to get to the point. While React Native relies on Javascript which started 24 years ago so it may perhaps just not be as optimized. We want to have the least bloatware going on, right? I am no expert.
JS is anything but bloatware. It's consistently updated and greatly improved upon in recent years, and still the fastest language for the web.
@@coherentpanda7115 my understanding is that the geniuses who made the open source V8 engine of Chrome which dramatically increased Javascript performance by 100x on the web of all the web browsers on the market, that they created Dart because they thought Javascript wasn't optimized enough or containing too much bloat. That for anyone starting out with programming, Dart is an easier language to learn and use and the way they designed Dart is to be more efficient and less bloated. Am I wrong? I understand that there is 100x more developers out there who know Javascript than Dart today, but we're talking about what's going to happen in the future here. And which platform people should use when considering developing a new app today.. It seems that the momentum for Flutter is growing rapidly..
@@charbax - Using both I will say Dart is less buggy and time consuming by a mile
Learning a new programming language like Dart is really easy if you know Java or Javascript. And IMO Javascript ist one of the worst programming languages I have ever worked with.
In this video, there are many points correct but many point no correct too!
Sorry Ben you really failed to defend React Native. If someone is completely new just go with Flutter.
I tried flutter its so fast and less error encountered
"So fast" ? Okay.
Nyquiiist yea like compiled to machine code fast :)
Thanks for uploading this. I will no longer get slam
by flutter devs
First video ever where I don't agree with any of his points. I am not even going to debunk him.
Flutter is not even competing with React Native...
Can't believe how many Flutter fanboys there are in the comments. Nobody defends a computer language or framework more than Flutter fanatics. Ben made some really great points. Flutter will be popular with those beginning to creating apps on the web, or looking for something fresh and new, and I imagine quite a few startups will jump on the bandwagon. However, expect very slow adoption from major development companies, as React and JS are a surefire method to write code quickly and make it work on the web. Flutter will have it's place eventually, if Google shows support for it adoption will grow, especially if the new Android replacement supports Dart closely much like Apple does with Swift.
I know it's hard for React Native fanboy to accept that Flutter is going to crush them.
@@akash-kumar737 Using bold words like crush makes you a total noob.
Liking something does not make one a fanboy, especially when one framework is objectively superior, as Flutter is. ;)
Monty Rasmussen You really need to work with React Native someday. Try keeping your Js bias aside while doing it. I have worked more with Flutter than RN and I can't objectively decide which one is better.
@@ijazkhan3335 -- Just as liking something doesn't automatically make one a fanboy, disliking something doesn't necessarily represent any kind of unfair bias. JavaScript has earned its reputation as a pile of crap, and that should never be discounted when making decisions about how to build software. JS wasn't designed to do what people are doing with it now, and all its new features to cope with that have just created a bad language covered in bandages.
That said, I think React itself is great. It's done a good job of showing everyone that reactive programming on the client is a cleaner, faster way to code, and produces fewer bugs. Flutter was directly inspired by this paradigm, but in my opinion, it just does it better.
For some reason flutter is unable to meet my needs. But let me say I feel like react native is easier to understand and others. I have been using Java for Android apps but now starting to go to cross platform
Flutter is just objectively better in mobile environment if the hype of flutter web is true, it will be the better platform but,
Are these differences worth rewriting in Flutter?
What about PWAs? What do you thing about it?
PWA is still web, not mobile
@@tuananhdo1870 Well after 8 months since I ask the question I can confirm that, most of JS APIs for acessing mobile phone sensors and notificacions are still raw compared to the native options.
RN it's consuming all of 16gb ram that really hurt I don't know why but will move to Flutter imidialty
couldn't agree more with you, flutter has so many good things, and react native has seen this and is starting to improve a lot of stuff, now with skia in alpha, i can start to think the same, react native won't even drop in hype, although flutter has increase in popularity these days, react native still up there too
React-native-web is also not there yet. Lots of setup steps, very messy to work with I prefer to just share components
A video or a series of video on how to do proper styling(best practices, structuring the project) REACT.JS app with a UI framework like Ant.design, semantic-UI
Learn both:p
very poor review. I usually like your reviews for being objective, but I think this should be renamed as In defense of react-native. Your opinion about javascript having less boilerplate than java - sure thats why dynamic languages exist, they have no boilerplate, no typechecking, all on runtime and slowness that come with it. Very few (Rust comes to mind) languages allow safety of JVM and comparable speeds of C. javascript, python are easy, but often that matters less for seasoned engineers. I am disappointed that you never go into technical details about why flutter v why react-native. we need details sir, not some glib opinions or how many jobs exist for flutter. Sure those matter but lets not pretend then that we have captured all other details already. I understand you have limited time for videos but please I'd appreciate if you can make up some effort to do technical analysis.
It was easier for me to learn flutter than react. State is managed better in flutter plus since it is multithreaded like java dealing with all that promise silliness is gone. It is strongly typed too.
Competition is key to positive technological change. When we only had Microsoft progress was slowish, with competition progress greatly increased
Still using jquery makes people use it not to worry about front end
I think the future is with flutter because of fuchasi os.
Short answer: No
Long answer: Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
Javascript is garbage and react native also.
Hi.. Now that the Flutter Web stable release and new Flutter desktop are out which is the best option.
UPDATE PLEASE
I think u have to write more boilerplate on react native because there is too much effort for basic stuff such as theme manager or global state manager and etc which you can get them out of the box in flutter .
Also in my experience RN doesnt have good profiling tools. For instance in flutter u can see how much each widget or component re render which u have to do it manualy in RN and memory leak testing and stuff like that
Writing more gives you a lot more control. Something I felt quite a lot coding in both RN and flutter.
I am Ionic Developer, and I could find a decent job. Hahaha
I really hate to say this, but I like Flutter.
The thing that annoys me most about flutter is that you can’t use Go or you can’t do so easily.
I was compromised to try flutter but for me react native seemed simple. Doesn't know why 😁 ?
I love ReactNative, it took me 10 days to be productive with it without any knowledge of ReactJS, just by knowing VueJS.
IMO I would need more than that to be productive in Flutter.
Flutter won't "kill" react native, but it will become the predominant framework for cross-platform app development. I understand the points he tries to make, but they don't square up against reality. Flutter makes a lot of business sense, and it will continue to boom. Choices are good, but if I'm starting today, it certainly isn't on Javascript. He sort of undermines his own arguments with the last point. Go search "java" jobs. Big number, right?
what do u think now
Thanks for your transparency on this Ben. Good to know that RN constantly crashing is a universal issue. Hopefully one they will fix now flutter is competition.
CodePush with Flutter?
You finally speak about flutter
Hey man, great vid, why not use notion desktop app, simplifies thing sthe more.
So anyone else interested in what notion does? Lol