If Evan was bottom floor and they wiped quick Hal would of said why aren’t you roof. Poor Evan can’t win, raven speaks to softly. He needs to shout ahah
Big E is right on this one hes doing what hes supposed to do preventing anyone from taking taking height and was able to beam players from height.but with hals and and reps on low ground they would have finished the teams aping each other or stop a team from ressing a knock, but I felt like hal should have played it slow on bottom and let the team in building ape more
That team isnt just gonna sit upstairs and take a nap while 2 teams fight below. Evan kept them from 3rding. and got 2 knocks. They shouldve fought that other team instead of running out into no cover. if they tried to valk ult there, they wouldve been cancelled
Exactly what I was thinking. No way a team would just be jerking off in the building while shit was happening outside. They would be looking for angles and would quickly get info of whats happening. Even then they start running away a little early the team behind them is gon look from height or from outside and see that tsm is climbing up a hill and shoot em and then chase them with their valk ult and land ahead in their pathway. I don't think they would get far to pull a successful valk ult especially when they are late in rotating. They either get shit on by other teams when they land or shot by the valk ult. The other team in the building would prob notice that tsm are also trying to run and valk ult too and they potentially just not valk ult and chase them. The whole situation is just assumptions of what would have happened.
Hal is one of the most accomplished IGLs but he still suffers from not being able to talk without cussing out his team mates and insulting them. They easily could have killed that team instead and still Valk ulted. Evan was frying them easy.
just wait until all is said and done and hal ends up wondering why certain people wont keep in contact with him in the future, he can look back on these fond memories to remind himself
@@perzeus115 L take, for the most part Hal is a respectful and genuine guy. Don’t take his attitude during games as his attitude outside. There is a reason they’re the best of friends irl… and there’s a reason Jordan has stuck around for all this time.
Hal is overestimating the other team too much, teams wouldnt always do what u think they would do, as raven said putting ur game in the hands of what another team would do would be crazy
I think Verhulst was making the right call because he was forced the team in the building to stay inside while his team could take a fight without being 3rded. If he was with Reps and Hal the team inside could have just swung out and then TSM would have had to fight 2 mediocre fights. The other option is that because the two teams are already preoccupied they play the rocks, don't force the call to clear out their side and valk ult when the building teams are forced to fight.
I don’t appreciate Hal talking to Evan like that. Strat all you want, but cussing the guy out and calling him stupid isn’t it. Like a few other people here are saying, Evan putting pressure on the other team was the right call.
I mean, this is just a healthy conversation in stressful situations. The insults he throws are pretty empty overall and they’re all incredibly close and considered best friends outside of Apex.
Yeah the reason they died was because they left,they were at advantage after they wiped first team I’m sure they would have died circle like Hal says but they would have took the KP from both teams at least, Evan is so good at first people thought he wasn’t cut out for it but he is such a good player that the small mistakes mean nothing when he can clutch up 1 v 3’s consistently.
you can literally watch it back and see Evan was ready to dip for Valk halt as soon as Hal mentions it. The immediate pressure after that would have come a whole lot sooner if Big E wasn’t holding them off while Hal n Reps cleared bottom floor. They just didn’t clear fast enough to hit the next squad before Zone
How they left the top team get everything after Evan knocked down one, like wtf????? I knew Hal was wrong but seeing the whole clip seems just way to stupid to not contest that fight 3v2 when Evan has high also... I know ring is closing but they would be death anyways if they used valk ult there.
I see both perspectives. Hal's saying they had to wipe that bottom team, it would've been an easy way to pick up kills in a 3v2. But I also see where Verhulst is coming from. He got climbed on twice there, if he hadn't held roof, then the other team takes height and they die anyway. I think Reps had it right though, it was just a bad call to make. They never should have went down to third that fight. Could have let those two teams fight then gatekept the surviving team who be in the storm.
Seer was a dead man worth saving. Valkyrie had the right idea to play on other side of wall while Catalyst( Imperial Hal) stayed while a full team of 3 pushed the downed seer ...dude tryed to blame Valkyrie for his option of staying. Like dude wasn't thinking straight himself and he's trying to call his teammate out for what. Making the right choice of playing strategically...
No honestly Evan made a good decision but if ur igl is comming smth for that long then u listen to the call cuz if it doesn't go well then it's his fault because it's his call. If the team doesn't play tgt then it's naturally not gonna work.
Not always the IGL is right. Yes, he gives the final move to play, but in this case Hal had the information from Evan but disregarded completely by second guessing. That was simply bad IGL. Evan made the best play possible as a Valk.
They went in to the fight early in my opinion they could have waited for a wipe then kill people on one shot or as they are resing. Hal could have also cat walled but he didn’t cat wall for some reason
big E beamed that second team. after wiping 1st team, they should've just wiped the 2nd team. would've taken 30 seconds to kill them with enuf time to valk ult
Hal said Evan shot the wrong team on top, but opened with shots on bang…who wasn’t on the bottom floor. So Evan is literally following up on Hal's shot and then Hal went to focus on another team
verhulst is right, the thing is jordan didnt do anything when they down 1 , when they down 1 if jordan and hal go tgt at the same time, they can wipe them in 5sec. and jordan didnt shot with hal actually
I disagree with Raven at the end. It’s “up to the other team” if they want to GRIEF. The other team’s correct play is to Valk ult. otherwise they have to jump down in which case they probably die trying to grief by getting beamed by the guys below.
Big E had like two knocks on the other team he was doing what he was supposed to do not allow the other team to ape or take height Hopefully hal went back and saw what was going on Big E had a knock they should have fight instead of running away
Hal is wrong. Verhulst actually pinned that team down by himself. They would have won that fight easily. His calls have been pretty bad ever since he hopped on catalyst tbh
best part is evan was fucking up the top team as well when hal and reps were fine to fight the team below themselves, hal legit thinks giving the roof and all the height is the better play just to kill one team
Yeah they were fine honestly Hal threw hard calling to back out of a fight with 1 knock and letting them take height for free they should’ve cleared that team take their meds then valk ult on top to zone.
Hal is such a cringey guy. He has to be right, even if he's wrong and cries about everything that doesn't go his way. This is where ego ruins something that's supposed to be enjoyable.
Big E didn't choke shit, he was trying to follow Hal's IGL at all times. Hal was the one who actually choked second guessing what to do when they already had the advantage to win the fight bc it was a 2v3.
I don't understand why Hal thought they needed to valk ult after killing the bottom floor team. Like Verhulst is destroying the other team on his own, just heal then take the 3v2 (one of them is down) and win. Absolutely zero reason to run away. Even funnier when Hal gets mad when Verhulst follows Hal's call and they lose because of it. Negative self awareness. Ngl I would either want a different teammate or to play on a different team if I had to listen to Hal doing that the entire time. No one should be getting yeld at regardless of whether what they did was right or wrong. Watch the different perspectives first, identify the things that were done well and the things that weren't, reinforce the positives and reduce the negatives. No reason to be acting like that as a professional.
all they enemy would need to do is just shoot straight up the ult as tsm ran through it. its a vertical line not horizontal. They only had one way to run
@@yourlocalhuman3526 I get you. I still think, if hal knew they had to escape out in the open, he could have just positioned outside the building, and create the horizontal wall right in front of the building window.. I cant see any reason why he couldnt do that knowing the bad situation they were in, to cover the enemy LOS. When hal said 'we cant kill them I dont think' he was in a perfect position to horizontall wall off that building from the electric gate. Again, not saying it would 100% have worked, but he had something he could have done to at least make it harder for the enemy
hals fault hes the CEO lol fight took way to long should watch the time for next one comes in he just likes pointing fingers at others not himself lol 🤡 seer did amazing hal said get involved he did if they didn't go roof he would of been ages ago.
Evan shit on that team if they stayed they could’ve wiped that team easy. Issue is that Evan didn’t speak up during that so Hal’s not gonna call to push the top team while they could be full health for all he knows.
What u mean he didn't gave the callouts? Evan clearly said when he got knocks that why he started arguing right when he jumped down from roof. Hal simply didn't listen at all and was second guessing wether or not to push. He chicken out at the worst time possible and that's why they died.
I'm usually on Verhulst's side cause I'm a fanboy, but in this case, it shouldn't matter whether he's right or not, in the moment you should listen to your IGL.
I thought tsm did the right thing, Evan made a executive decision and took the heat off the boys underneath while they were fighting, what should of happened is as soon as hal was done fighting he and the other teammate should of supported Evan they would of wiped both squads low diff if hal just supported Evan for 20 seconds.
I like how now Verhulst is confident to say that Hal is wrong, a year ago he would have just been silent about it, this is prime Verbussy
I can’t wait for him to fold Hal like a chair
Verhulst was 100% right there Hal just doesn’t wanna be wrong
Hal stupid they not flying bro they gonna ape you 😭😭😭😭
i love how raven and evan are saying hal is wrong here but he cant admit it
Yeah something’s wrong with hal recently, he probably needs a break or something
@@Aaronxxi yep probably be burnt out for a month after he quits
If Evan was bottom floor and they wiped quick Hal would of said why aren’t you roof. Poor Evan can’t win, raven speaks to softly. He needs to shout ahah
nah evan was frying the team on top, they couldve easily wiped them after hal and reps finshed the other team
Big E is right on this one hes doing what hes supposed to do preventing anyone from taking taking height and was able to beam players from height.but with hals and and reps on low ground they would have finished the teams aping each other or stop a team from ressing a knock, but I felt like hal should have played it slow on bottom and let the team in building ape more
That team isnt just gonna sit upstairs and take a nap while 2 teams fight below. Evan kept them from 3rding. and got 2 knocks. They shouldve fought that other team instead of running out into no cover. if they tried to valk ult there, they wouldve been cancelled
Exactly what I was thinking. No way a team would just be jerking off in the building while shit was happening outside. They would be looking for angles and would quickly get info of whats happening. Even then they start running away a little early the team behind them is gon look from height or from outside and see that tsm is climbing up a hill and shoot em and then chase them with their valk ult and land ahead in their pathway. I don't think they would get far to pull a successful valk ult especially when they are late in rotating. They either get shit on by other teams when they land or shot by the valk ult. The other team in the building would prob notice that tsm are also trying to run and valk ult too and they potentially just not valk ult and chase them. The whole situation is just assumptions of what would have happened.
They also didn't gibby bub cuz evan was putting too much pressure on them.
CEO of never admitting his fault
big hal supporter, but he was 100% wrong here. evan played it perfectly. and he needs to accept he made the wrong call and he's the reason they died.
Yea I think the best play is to wipe the team inside the building since they have one knocked. but what do I know..
Evan literally been carrying tsm for majority of the teamfights since this last algs they won .
Oh my god somebody said it finally !!!
Big facts
Hal is one of the most accomplished IGLs but he still suffers from not being able to talk without cussing out his team mates and insulting them.
They easily could have killed that team instead and still Valk ulted. Evan was frying them easy.
just wait until all is said and done and hal ends up wondering why certain people wont keep in contact with him in the future, he can look back on these fond memories to remind himself
@@perzeus115 L take, for the most part Hal is a respectful and genuine guy. Don’t take his attitude during games as his attitude outside. There is a reason they’re the best of friends irl… and there’s a reason Jordan has stuck around for all this time.
@@sirbomboclaat6927 respectful and genuine you reckon?
@@perzeus115 reckon, i know, guys a genuine fella irl. Every interaction i’ve had & seen him have with fans has been absolutely phenomenal.
@@sirbomboclaat6927 this aged horribly, even now doesnt even consider hal a friend lmao
I’m no pro but I agree with Evan, taking height there was the smartest thing to do
Hal is overestimating the other team too much, teams wouldnt always do what u think they would do, as raven said putting ur game in the hands of what another team would do would be crazy
I think Verhulst was making the right call because he was forced the team in the building to stay inside while his team could take a fight without being 3rded. If he was with Reps and Hal the team inside could have just swung out and then TSM would have had to fight 2 mediocre fights. The other option is that because the two teams are already preoccupied they play the rocks, don't force the call to clear out their side and valk ult when the building teams are forced to fight.
This must be covered in Sky Sports news 🤣
Hal is not being reasonable. Big E clearly held the tean inside single handedly when they were trying to take roof. Verl was right all the way
I’m glad this is a clip that gives the entirety of the debate.
I like how hal say evan always "assume anything" and straightly says the other team dont have knowledge about the down team LMAO
I don’t appreciate Hal talking to Evan like that. Strat all you want, but cussing the guy out and calling him stupid isn’t it. Like a few other people here are saying, Evan putting pressure on the other team was the right call.
I mean, this is just a healthy conversation in stressful situations. The insults he throws are pretty empty overall and they’re all incredibly close and considered best friends outside of Apex.
Yeah the reason they died was because they left,they were at advantage after they wiped first team I’m sure they would have died circle like Hal says but they would have took the KP from both teams at least, Evan is so good at first people thought he wasn’t cut out for it but he is such a good player that the small mistakes mean nothing when he can clutch up 1 v 3’s consistently.
you can literally watch it back and see Evan was ready to dip for Valk halt as soon as Hal mentions it. The immediate pressure after that would have come a whole lot sooner if Big E wasn’t holding them off while Hal n Reps cleared bottom floor. They just didn’t clear fast enough to hit the next squad before Zone
How they left the top team get everything after Evan knocked down one, like wtf????? I knew Hal was wrong but seeing the whole clip seems just way to stupid to not contest that fight 3v2 when Evan has high also... I know ring is closing but they would be death anyways if they used valk ult there.
This is why they need Coach like Raven.
He can talk to Hal when Hal was wrong.
Hope they learn from this
I see both perspectives. Hal's saying they had to wipe that bottom team, it would've been an easy way to pick up kills in a 3v2. But I also see where Verhulst is coming from. He got climbed on twice there, if he hadn't held roof, then the other team takes height and they die anyway. I think Reps had it right though, it was just a bad call to make. They never should have went down to third that fight. Could have let those two teams fight then gatekept the surviving team who be in the storm.
Seer was a dead man worth saving. Valkyrie had the right idea to play on other side of wall while Catalyst( Imperial Hal) stayed while a full team of 3 pushed the downed seer ...dude tryed to blame Valkyrie for his option of staying. Like dude wasn't thinking straight himself and he's trying to call his teammate out for what. Making the right choice of playing strategically...
No honestly Evan made a good decision but if ur igl is comming smth for that long then u listen to the call cuz if it doesn't go well then it's his fault because it's his call. If the team doesn't play tgt then it's naturally not gonna work.
Not always the IGL is right. Yes, he gives the final move to play, but in this case Hal had the information from Evan but disregarded completely by second guessing. That was simply bad IGL. Evan made the best play possible as a Valk.
They went in to the fight early in my opinion they could have waited for a wipe then kill people on one shot or as they are resing. Hal could have also cat walled but he didn’t cat wall for some reason
big E beamed that second team. after wiping 1st team, they should've just wiped the 2nd team. would've taken 30 seconds to kill them with enuf time to valk ult
Evan did so much damage they shoulda killed the other squad. He held his own against a 3 man squad by holding top. Hal fucked up there
Hal said Evan shot the wrong team on top, but opened with shots on bang…who wasn’t on the bottom floor. So Evan is literally following up on Hal's shot and then Hal went to focus on another team
Horrible call by Hal they had a huge advantage on the second team. If they would've finished that team they could've Valk ult freely like he wanted
verhulst is right, the thing is jordan didnt do anything when they down 1 , when they down 1 if jordan and hal go tgt at the same time, they can wipe them in 5sec. and jordan didnt shot with hal actually
E was about to wipe that team solo
I disagree with Raven at the end. It’s “up to the other team” if they want to GRIEF. The other team’s correct play is to Valk ult. otherwise they have to jump down in which case they probably die trying to grief by getting beamed by the guys below.
Always grab high ground no matter what.
Big E had like two knocks on the other team he was doing what he was supposed to do not allow the other team to ape or take height
Hopefully hal went back and saw what was going on
Big E had a knock they should have fight instead of running away
if evan is not there holding that team they just look over the ground floor fight(hal n reps) and kill everyone
Evan should have listened to comms if its a bad call then its concrete it was hals fault instead of arguing what ifs
Hal is wrong. Verhulst actually pinned that team down by himself. They would have won that fight easily. His calls have been pretty bad ever since he hopped on catalyst tbh
Why would they bubble Evan if Evan knocked 2 on roof 😂
best part is evan was fucking up the top team as well when hal and reps were fine to fight the team below themselves, hal legit thinks giving the roof and all the height is the better play just to kill one team
Yeah they were fine honestly Hal threw hard calling to back out of a fight with 1 knock and letting them take height for free they should’ve cleared that team take their meds then valk ult on top to zone.
@@saucykb4758 evan had 2 knocked at once then hals like "youre 1v3ing up there come back to help" or whatever but evan was legit 1v3ing the team 🤣🤣🤣
If they stayed they won! Hal is wrong!
Hal could’ve wall there as well when he calls to run back to nut, that’s another mistake on his part
Hal obviously wrong here and cant admit it. shame. however if E played on Hal when they pushed they prob couldve wiped but he inted and got charged
if they all jump down to bottom and leave team up top they 3rd party and kill everyone lmao
If they just ape building and kill that team in under 10 seconds they’re fine
Hal is such a cringey guy. He has to be right, even if he's wrong and cries about everything that doesn't go his way. This is where ego ruins something that's supposed to be enjoyable.
At the end evan choked but he played perfectly in the fight on the building, they just had to finish that team when evan got a knock
Big E didn't choke shit, he was trying to follow Hal's IGL at all times. Hal was the one who actually choked second guessing what to do when they already had the advantage to win the fight bc it was a 2v3.
I don't understand why Hal thought they needed to valk ult after killing the bottom floor team. Like Verhulst is destroying the other team on his own, just heal then take the 3v2 (one of them is down) and win. Absolutely zero reason to run away. Even funnier when Hal gets mad when Verhulst follows Hal's call and they lose because of it. Negative self awareness.
Ngl I would either want a different teammate or to play on a different team if I had to listen to Hal doing that the entire time. No one should be getting yeld at regardless of whether what they did was right or wrong. Watch the different perspectives first, identify the things that were done well and the things that weren't, reinforce the positives and reduce the negatives. No reason to be acting like that as a professional.
drop hal.
1v3 and evens got 3 knocks lol and Hal and raps 2v2 lol took them hella long seems interesting
BIG E 😂 I LIKE THAT NAME
hal has one of the biggest egos and thinks he knows it all because hes to use to leading
Yeah Hal is 100% wrong here.
crazy
hal could use his ult to cover the escape no?
all they enemy would need to do is just shoot straight up the ult as tsm ran through it. its a vertical line not horizontal. They only had one way to run
@@yourlocalhuman3526 I get you. I still think, if hal knew they had to escape out in the open, he could have just positioned outside the building, and create the horizontal wall right in front of the building window.. I cant see any reason why he couldnt do that knowing the bad situation they were in, to cover the enemy LOS. When hal said 'we cant kill them I dont think' he was in a perfect position to horizontall wall off that building from the electric gate. Again, not saying it would 100% have worked, but he had something he could have done to at least make it harder for the enemy
@@PP-ss3zf good point
The preds on mobile fly all over the place I'm not used to this sit and fighting lol
I’m calling it .. tsm win lan again lol.
hals fault hes the CEO lol fight took way to long should watch the time for next one comes in he just likes pointing fingers at others not himself lol 🤡 seer did amazing hal said get involved he did if they didn't go roof he would of been ages ago.
Hal complains a lot lol
Yep hal is in the wrong here
Hal is a terrible IGL.
Evan shit on that team if they stayed they could’ve wiped that team easy. Issue is that Evan didn’t speak up during that so Hal’s not gonna call to push the top team while they could be full health for all he knows.
What u mean he didn't gave the callouts? Evan clearly said when he got knocks that why he started arguing right when he jumped down from roof. Hal simply didn't listen at all and was second guessing wether or not to push. He chicken out at the worst time possible and that's why they died.
bruh old hal coming back, Dont like it, I want the split 1 hal.
Hal is wrong
hal is always right
They honestly both had great points while both arguments were relying on a bit of luck no matter what
What lol, hal is the one depending on luck
😅
You Think You Can Use My Song In Your Next Montage 🔥 Liked and subbed w/notis!!
I'm usually on Verhulst's side cause I'm a fanboy, but in this case, it shouldn't matter whether he's right or not, in the moment you should listen to your IGL.
Evan played it right up until the end
Yea he had no choice Hal was screaming in his ear to run away
I thought tsm did the right thing, Evan made a executive decision and took the heat off the boys underneath while they were fighting, what should of happened is as soon as hal was done fighting he and the other teammate should of supported Evan they would of wiped both squads low diff if hal just supported Evan for 20 seconds.
Hal had a bad call they should have ult on roof
I’m glad this is a clip that gives the entirety of the debate.