Martin Liquid Metal Bridge Pins! Are they worth it?
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- Опубліковано 20 вер 2024
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From the comparison at 9 minutes I can definitely say that the liquid metal pins makes you play a G chord at slightly slower tempo
Agreed, must have more sustain.
I have a tendency to rush, so it looks like I need to get the metal ones.
Ha!
Lol I was gonna say the same
So many tasty voicings and harmonies in that intro! Proper good job chaps.
I actually prefer the warmer sound of the regular end pins.
Me too, all day. Sounds like he’s strumming with a metal coin or something. Not for me.
We need a bridge pins comparison video:
Brass
Ebony
Titanium
Maple
Steel
Etc.
Just test them all on the same guitar.
+1
Very vibrant sound that comes from both of them on both acoustics! Each notes taken with care and respect because of it! Awesome work indeed my man!
Sam hit the pin on the head with the oscillation in the sustain. I also heard more high end presence and a less dull low end with the metal pins. Both sound like Martins
I liked that characteristic.
My loudest steel string acoustic guitar is a little Eastman E20P with flat wound light gauge D’Addario Chrome strings. It’s the size of a Martin 00 style. I tested it with a SPLnFFT digital decibel meter from the Apple App Store. All tests done at the same distance. With ebony pins, 72 db average, strumming with short nails. With a flat pick, 80 db strumming average, with a max of 84 db if I played hard. With Martin Liquid Metal Bridge Pins, still 72 db average fingerpicking with short nails, using the pads of my fingers, but 82db strumming with fingers max. With a flat pick, 82 db average with a max of 84. So that seems to be as loud as that guitar can go. On a Martin 000-28VS with new Martin Monel 0.012 strings and Fossil Walrus Ivory pins, 70 db average with fingers, and 80 average with a flatpick, with a max of 84 db. My 1954 Martin D-18 SEEMS the loudest because of its tone, but it isn’t really. Average with fingers of only 68 db. With a flatpick, 77 average with a max of 81 db. There is more to playing than volume, but sometimes volume matters. My Altamira N600 classical guitar gets 79 db with my fingers! However, I tested a couple banjos and got 79-81 db with my fingers and 90-91 db max with picks. My Gibson mandolin will also hit a max of 90 db. Remember, an increase of 3 decibels is a doubling of sound intensity. The Liquid Metal bridge pins are indeed somewhat louder with standard strumming, but a guitar’s maximum volume possible is not increased. It is what it is.
Brighter for sure, but that 0.6 db is nothing and most likely in the hands.
What about using the liquid metal on the bass strings and the regular pins on the G,B and high E.
And that right there is why I put arm rests on all my guitars. When Pete does the chord ring challenge, he lifts his strumming arm off the guitar at 12:23. To hear that go back and play from 12:18. The volume immediately increases and the tone opens up as the soundboard is freed of the arm weight. The difference is more obvious than the difference between bone and liquid metal pins. Resting an arm on top is like laying a bone-in ham on the soundboard. It mutes the top whereas an armrest keeps the arm off the top providing more volume, sustain and tone.
For those simply wanting to make your acoustics louder, removing the pick guard from the top of any acoustic will give you a larger volume boost than these end pins. Don’t believe it? Give it a go, it works 🤘🏼
I've thought about doing that. But you need a heat gun, don't you?
I just received mine and my ears can hear the difference. More sustain and a bit brighter. I didn't think originally they would make a big difference, but there is.
Best demonstration for the Liquid Metal pins
Nothing better than playing in a room with these improvements working for you, gigging may be less able to notice any difference. But the room is the thing of beauty.
Just changed my new 00028 pins from stock to Liquidmetal, and the sustain and richness of the guitar has improved. Very helpful test gentlemen!
Great job guys. I got liquid pins for my D28 a couple months ago(they were on the Martin sight under "1833 Shop" for $100). I just wasn't satisfied with the volume and sustain and no strings I tried made any difference. So, even though I was told it was a gimmick, I put the metal pins in and, WOW! On my guitar, it added tons of volume and sustain. I can even feel the difference when I sit and play. It is a real thing at least on some guitars. I absolutely love my D28 now and I'll never sell it.
I just bought and installed them on my 2017 D-28 and myself and others noticed the immense improvement. I too tried many different string guages, materials, makers etc. My D-28 always seemed like something was lacking after installing the pickup system (anthem). These pins woke the guitar up and kept me from sticking it on reverb,
@sean munns: That is awesome to hear. I can understand why people are skeptical, and it may not be right for every guitar, but I know 100% from experience what they did for mine. I posted my comment hoping someone else would benefit from such an unsuspected blessing. I can't put my Martin down now and my other guitars are just sitting in the case.
Thank you Wang!! I have a D28 and don't want to waste money on a gimmic.
Yea without metal bridge pins Martin's sounds like shit. Facepalms
Blakers: What an ignorant and rude comment. Maybe the most obvious strawman argument I've ever seen. NOBODY said a Martin HAS to have liquid metal bridge pins to sound good. Are you that bored or just a grunt troll? Face plant...
I agree it does resonate better I hear more sustain as well. I mean if they're not that expensive it's a worthwhile endeavor.
Definitely the sustain is effected the most... which adds more overtones.... and also adds just the right amount of compression... makes it sound smooth as glass!!!
I like them only because of their build quality. Having cheap plastic bridge pins was always weird to me. My new Yamaha came standard with brass.
I can definitely tell the difference in resonance. Great vid boys, im loving sams chill vibes he brings but we need MORE ACOUSTIC PARADISO!!!!!!!!
The titanium pins gave the guitar a brighter sound in the highs and high midrange and cut the dullness in the bass.
Just installed on my D-28. Can’t totally comment on more volume but there is definitely some sort of compression effect happening with the liquid metal pins. Especially with fingerpicking, each string has become much more individual instead of a giant resonant cluster. Interesting effect.
I tried them a few years ago and they sucked the tone from my D28 so I switched immediately to camel bone.
I replaced my plastic D28 pins with bone pins. I noticed a significant difference, was brighter in tone. They’re definitely worth it in terms of hardness and durability; sound is subjective. Would I buy these over bone? I don’t think I would with mine but I’m happy to see Martin trying new tech in some models.
The liquid metal are definitely brighter with more full spectrum sustain. The standard pins sustain drops off much quicker on most frequencies, where all frequencies on liquid metal hung on longer.
I'm hearing the same difference as another comparison. I didn't expect to hear a difference but its fairly apparent. The sound is notably sharper with the liquid bridge pins, especially in the attack. The pick hitting the string is more metallic and pokey. Theres an upper midrange clarity with the liquidmetal pins. I suppose from a sound physics perspective that could make sense, as having a denser/harder material supporting the string could cause less de-coupling. If I wanted a more aggressive sound I'd go for the liquidmetal pins. If I wanted sweeter and more subdued, I'd go with the original plastic. Very interesting. Well done video - thank you!
My Martin liquid metal chrome pins ($99) arrive today! 🤠
I purchase them in the hope that they give me 3-5 years of failure-free service as my plastic and ebony pins in my Martin OMC-15 crack, slip, and fail too often.
If these metal pins last 3-5 years, the $99 price tag, to me, is well worth the investment.
Thank you for the great video gentlemen, keep rocking! 🫵🤠🤚
All Hail the return of Euron Honore' and the scar-less Hound! Liquid metal pins made from the carcass of the latest Terminator... you guys should do "Game of Strums"
David Albert Pins forged from Valyrian Steel with dragonfire
Ive been using brass pins for years now. At first it was just because i was tired of breaking plastic ones, but once i realized how much more i like the tone it was just a win-win!
Metal pins vs. Plastic/Bone almost seems like you clicked on a really nice smooth compressor or something. Just evens everything out so nicely!
This is the best option for budget guitars with thin tops, it'll make the low end a bit clearer.
There are other, more affordable alternatives out there, such as bone, ebony, tusq, brass, etc. that you might choose as an upgrade to the standard plastic pins.
about a year ago i did a youtube comparison between standard bridge pin VS Brass bridge pin, i think this is near identical with Martin Liquid Metal.
my conclusion is : brighter tone, longer sustain but lack of bass, and its perfect for my guitar and my ear, you should buy and try.. maybe it's perfect for you too
It's an imagined difference. The strings transfer their vibrations to the body via the 'saddle', not the pins. The Pins are just anchors.
(I've been there, done that)
Steve I changed to liquid metal on my D28 and the difference is undeniable. I could even hear a bit of difference on this video also, especially with headphones but on my guitar it was a huge difference.
I changed on my 000 MMV Martin. A definite difference but more in definition and mid range. I was working on some solo riffs and noticed the sustain. For me worth the money. I am curious what the difference will be with my K&K pickup at a gig thru a PA.
You can tell a minor difference but I think I like the less tinny, more natural sound of the normal pins. But different strings could make more of a difference in my opinion.
They worked for me. More sustain, more vol and highs on my OM28 Martin
I would be interested in seeing this pins contrasted with brass pins - I have brass in my own acoustic, and they make it brighter and more even across the strings, which is quite important for fingerstyle guitar.
The ones I got didn't have such a hefty price tag either, so a comparison between them would be lovely!
They sound a bit louder and brighter, but for OM guitars i think ebony pins sounds best. Try these metal pins on a dreadnought or a jumbo and you will get a much better sound.
Lol watching Pete listening to the sustain, at my end, in silence cos his channel was gated. (i.e. cutting the tails off)
With the new pins I heard more lower mids.
Better/Worse ? Not sure.
Gerry Rosa (who knows a thing or two about building stringed instruments)! says he does not like metal down at the bridge end of instruments (although I`m certain he was talking about the saddle not the pins) said they sounded tinny, my acoustic has a brass saddle & it sounds exactly as he described, tinny, I think these pins make the sound more `tinny` to my ears! BTW those guitars sound absolutely beautiful!
There is a difference, its has more upper presence and linear decay, but ask yourself, is that always good thing? and does your acoustic need it or your playing style for that matter? for me personally they sounded a little too bright for my taste
I like what these do for darker guitars like mahogany or something like a D-35 that may need a bit of a lift in the upper midrange to balance out the big low end. I like the plastic pins on these guitars..they do not need brightening and can even sound a little on the thin side IMHO.
It's not louder just brighter (5kHz)
i got brass pins in my acoustic since years. forget plastic, ebony, bone...metal pins really enhance the guitar. the top and the whole instrument resonate better and a more balanced sound coming out, seems all frequencies are enhanced. the sustain get better and the strings ring more constant out. another positive aspect is the pins are much more easy to loose for string replacement but same time they hold better in the wholes as plastic ones when strings under tension after replacement.
this video is nice made and show the positive aspects of metal pins. the best and easiest update u can do for an acoustic guitar after using fresh strings from quality. must try!
my brass ones was a bit cheaper as the martin ones...dont remember exact but 25-30Euros i think. meanwhile u can buy them bit cheaper from göldo or so. the martin ones are great looking, specially the black ones. they use a "liquid" metal, what ever metal this might be. there is nothing similar on the market as i know so that might be a strong argument for the price.
but be careful by buying low cost metal pins on ebay and amazon and so, they are often fake and made from any white metal and not brass or what they promise.
greetings! :)
I find the sound with metal pins more trebly and abrasive. The normal ones sound more natural and warmer.
I would say the same, it's bright (metal) versus warmth (standard). Both sound great but I think I prefer the warmth of the standard..
I will have to agree. I think I like the normal ones better. But I think the metal pins look cool.
It like the difference between phosphor bronze and 80/20 in tone. You can definitely hear it
Very bright! Thanks guys for making this vid.love listening to you guy play.pete's my guitar hero of all times!he's the best in my book,and very inspiring. Sounds a little brighter
Was not a big fan since playing a few guitars with them. They did carry a bit more sustain, however they seemed really "tinny". Im sticking with real bone, especially for OM/000 models
You could also compare the cheapest plastic pins vs. ivoroid , then plastic vs liquid metal, then throw in ebony pins for good measure.
I've got brass pins in my cheap parlour guitar. Dunno if they sound different or better but they sure look nice(!)
I like the natural sound of the standard pins.
the titanium pins do have a little more of "something" going on. perhaps smoother and brighter.
Amazingly. There IS a difference!
I like the difference, to me it seems that it bring out more of everything across the board sonically
Did it really take 20+ minutes to answer "no"?
I just got a Martin that comes standard with these pins. They look great with the red (on white in my case). I wouldn't pay $200 for a set for my other Martin, but I really do like them.
Metal pins sound cleaner and brighter with more sustain but will they suit different strings
Interestingly enough, I found the standard pins sustained longer than the liquid metal pins. I also preferred the sound of the standard pins as they seemed to have a richer tone. LM pins sounded good, though. I would use pins like that on my all mahogany guitar to give it a bit more shimmer.
This is what I was thinking.
These may not be necessary on a brighter guitar with brighter sounding Tonewoods but would be interesting to hear on a darker sounding tonewood like Mahogany.
Mahogany can often sound dull to me but this might change that.
I like the power pins from big enginering. They also make the string change much easier.
The tone definitely changed (for the better imo), but the volume difference was so small it was definitely just variations in the playing
Wouldn’t the variations in playing also be the reason why the tone was different?
Liquid metal bridge pins? So they're smelted and molded? or casted?
I use Brass pins😊 they are wonderful on my Martin
Great job, guys! Love this kind of more serious vids on Andertons, especially with Pete. Was wondering about this some time ago and you gave me the answer. The metal bridge pins seem to really improve the tone imo, to me they sound a little richer and more vocal.
I heard a brighter sound with the liquid pins. A well done comparison. Very well done!!!
It seems like these pins would most benefit a guitar with a TON of low end bass, like a Martin D-35, which some critics have said has too much low end, to the point of sounding a little muddy and overpowering in the low end. The liquid metal bridge pins would enhance the higher end and make it sound brighter, thus making the D-35/HD-35 series guitars perhaps the best sounding Martin guitars ever.
This was a fun jam!
the decibel scale is a nonlinear, logarithmic scale. So .6 db may be a sizeable difference in terms of volume
The ear hears non-linearly too though, so it won’t be noticeable unless the volume was very low; and 0.6 dB is WAY below the error in Pete just strumming especially since he’s not even blinded, let alone double-blinded, and went in both with an expectation and a desire to sell them.
guys, I've had about 7 different sets of bridge pins on my Martin. Heed these words well - THE (THE! single most important thing) IS the ''FIT''. If you google very carefully you'll find the exact dimension of the 'cut' of your bridge pin hole - not just the diameter but the angle. The second most important thing is the material.
so what brand FITs Taylor the best?
yeah you could notice the difference in the sustain with the liquid metal end pins with the standard ones there was a strange effect when listening to it to the end of the sustain also I am sure I noticed the strings where loser when the standard end pins where in when you was playing
To me I heard it, but I thought it was a little shrill sounding, like a harsh edge on it, almost like adi tops often have
In the comparison around 13ish minutes after you strummed the metal pin version, about halfway through the sustain you removed your arm from the body where as in the stock version which you said didn’t sustain as consistently you left your arm on the body the entire time. Not sure what you thought might happen but yes, if you remove your body from a resonating membrane it’s going to change the sound so the result you got is in no way a surprise. You need to operationally define every detail of what it mean to strum in order to have any remote chance of getting a consistent result. What you really need to control experimenter bias and placebo effect is 1) a strumming robot that applies the same force and speed every time 2) a double blind trial, and 3) the tests performed on the exact same guitar (because of course there’s going to be a certain amount of variability from one guitar to another in terms of sound quality unless the cuts of wood from both guitars came from pretty much the exact same spot on the exact same tree, and both were built by the exact same luthier (in this case something built by a robot would be an advantage, but using the same instrument eliminates that variable)).
the medal is brighter like you would expect from metal, the other is warmer and would this would be preference an style choice not which is better I like brass myself..
Pete! I just saw this! How did the pins work in your OM-28V? I’ve got the same guitar and have been trying for years to find something that will bring out the top end a bit better. It’s a beautiful guitar but has always sounded a bit muddy. Maybe the liquid metal pins are just what is needs.
Can you ask Martin to produce liquid metal bridge and nut pieces as replacements for their normal bone ones?
I heard a minor difference, with a smoother sound and wider frequency response, more low end, and a little bit more high on top. You will get a bigger difference from changing brands of strings though.
Thank you.
I think they're all the same, ones look nice though, there might be a difference if you choose another material for the bridge nut, transfer of the sound will be different on glass, metal, brass, steel, wood, plastic, etc it will affect the resonance I think!
More bass and midrange than the stock pins. I can’t perceive a difference in volume.
What I’d be curious about is that there’s another metal/brass end pin option that includes a metal resonator plate, and it converts the strings to end loaded instead of pulling the pins. I’d put those against the pins used in this video.
Please don’t put liquid metal pins on that cap. The cap is already way too loud without them.
I use brass pins on my all mahogony acoustic and it definitely brightens things up
Clearly a noticeable difference tonally, on the video at least, but I prefer the normal pins.
It's going to change things a little, it's a different material in a tone sensitive spot. I have an all mahogany Guild and an older Yamaha from the 70's that I use bell brass pins in and it does help liven things up on two darker guitars. I wouldn't use them on a brighter guitar. Can I change things cheaper like strings and especially picks, you betcha. Now, I kinda like using the same pick for everything, so between the brass pins and strings I use, I have found the sound. I would be curious to try these, but at the $99 USD price I have seen so far, I'll wait.
I think I hear a bit more definition between the individual strings, but that is later in the video where they are switching between the two guitars, which could be a bigger difference than the pins. Regardless, I just ordered a set for my D-28.
what is this liquid metal made of?
You were a hair closer to the mic while playing with the liquidmetal ones
I feel like if you did a tone test but lied about which pins were being demo’d, people would still think there’s a difference.
I can definitely hear a difference through the headphones. The liquid metal pins are brighter and more midrange
Will any appreciable difference in sound & sustain make it worth the extra stress and wear on the bridge plate? If it was a great difference I could see the advantage but with what I heard in the vid, I can't see it being worth it for me and what in the hell is a "liquid metal end pin"? Does that mean it was cast and not machined or ???
I know this comment is 2 years old, but just wanted to address your question. The pins are made of Zirconium, which is an extremely hard metal. Zirconium is used in abrasive products to cut steel, titanium, and other extremely hard metals. It’s only surpassed in hardness by Tungsten which has a Mohs hardness of 8-9 whereas Zirconium has a Mohs hardness rating of ~7. By overviewing Zirconium’s materialistic properties we can see that it is both extremely hard and abrasion resistant, meaning machining of Zirconium is extremely inefficient and expensive, hence the use of casting instead. Casting can cause issues in metal due to carbide formation and grain growth causing brittleness, however this isn’t as much of an issue with using Zirconium for this application.
Martin should experiment with a metal Bridge and string saddle along side these end pins. Hell may as well also try metal bracings.
I purchased metal pins off of amazon and I found more volume. They weren't the Martin pins but metal, and they cost me 10$
So it’s like 1 dB but dB’s go up logarithmically so that’s pretty substantial actually
The metal bridge pins were definitely brighter, but when dealing with electric acoustic guitars you could just turn the treble knob up slightly and achieve the same effect in a live setting so it seems kind of limiting in the realistic applications. It's definitely cool that they're looking to innovate, but this one seems to be a bit more specialized in practical use.
Or you could just get some cheap brass bridge pins. Or use a brass or steel nut.
Superb opening song (too good to call it a 'jam'). Definitely sounds different with the metal pins. Are they going to wear the bridge more?
Definitely a difference IMO, but I wonder if the whole "liquid metal" thing is really necessary. It would be interesting to see a comparison of these against ones made of brass or even silver - if ya wanna go for the world's most expensive set of bridge pins.
I think they sound great. It’s another colour.. The bone pins sound the way you are used to hear the acoustic guitar, but the metal pins made the sound more even and direct, and a bit louder and they gave a longer sustain. And also, the new pins made both of you play a bit slower. And thats the really interesting part. Did the new feel and sound get your attention in a way that made you listen more closely perhaps? Thats a fun conundrum.
Thank you for doing this comparison.
I’m definitely going to try them out.
You guys have to compare low end full solid acoustic guitars like Sire R7 vs Faith Hi gloss (they have nearly the same woods)
Do a comparison where you use elbow grease with one guitar and without elbow grease with another guitar.
They sound tinny . I didn't think they would make any difference .
I hear the same thing. It's marginal. But the tone after changing to the metal saddles sounds a tiny bit brighter and more metallic. Could be the newer strings. Either way, I would pick the mellower tone over the more metallic, but if I am honest, I doubt whether I would notice except in a direct A/B comparison
Yes I too would go for the mellow tone .
I spoke to a Martin tech rep on the phone, years ago, about bone bridge pins VS their stock soft plastic pins. I told him there was a noticeable, positive, difference, with the bone pins. I followed with, “Why would C.F. Martin cut corners when it clearly sacrificed sound quality?”
His response was, “Your bone bridge pins couldn’t possibly make a difference. The sound pressure as we see it is transferred from the vibration of the string at the BRIDGE. It all stops there. So your bone pins have no effect one way or another. “
I thanked him. Hung up. And said out loud, “Well that dumbass is full of shit !”
JJZ…(°¿.°`)
That zingy resonance thing with the Liquid Metal pins is kind of annoying; sounds like a synth. I don't want my guitar buzzing when it rings out.
I'd be more interested to hear a comparison between Liquid Metal and brass pins.
I own a dcpa4 and love it!
I’ve recently acquired a 00028MD. Had it about a week . I didn’t buy it for the LM bridge pins but rather for other innovations that make a significant difference from the standard 00028. The “cooked” top and graphite bridge plate combined with the titanium truss rod results in a light, played-in, responsive, super resonant guitar.the bridge pins are just icing on the cake. Do they work? I dunno but the end result of all the changes is spectacular!
The metal Pins make the acoustic guitar Sound digital!? do we want that? Linear???