On one hand, it pains me to see them taking so much abuse without any maintenance, but on the other hand, that's pretty much the point, innit? To see how much abuse the system can take before failure.
Mr Hambini I am curious. In your review of aero wheels you highlight the aero benefits of a NACA profile as used by Mavic, but I note you purchased the Dura-ace C60 wheels for your own use. What was your rationale for selecting the Dura-ace over the Mavic or other similarly priced wheels?
Christopher Hanson the main reason is that shimano wheels can take the abuse that i throw at them. I'm not totally bothered about 10w of drag versus striping down the hubs every 3 months.
Thanks Mr Hambini for the rapid reply. Yes, your response makes good sense. I have got the DA C24's on my favourite bike and they have been pretty much bomb proof. In real world riding, particularly if you are paying for the stuff yourself, I think durability eclipses marginal aero gain. Have you been pleased with the C60's?
Christopher Hanson yes. they have been completely faultless. they are a bit slower to accelerate but that's the only negative. but like you say bomb proof
I have the C24 9100 and have been very impressed. I had a set of Fulcrum (campy) Racing Zeros on my last bike that also used cup and cone bearings. Cup and cones systems are really only seen on top end fulcrum/campy and shimano wheelsets cause they have better performance as long as you maintain them but it looks like in this video the maintenance in low:). Great long term review.
Shimano hubs, cup and cone system, are still great. The main advantage its that if owner maintain them correctly, they last indefinitely. Low end hubs need to add grease and adjust preload properly and last many years without problems too. (however, old low end hubs from shimano are better cuality than now, but DuraAce are still great)
2 years ago I bought a Scott Addict with the kind of discount I couldn't ignore. I absolutely love the bike but at 80 plus kilos I was getting a bit of flex from the C24 wheelset and having become totally sold on tubless recently was keen to upgrade. Replacing the rims didn't appear to be an option so after much research I purchased a set of ENVE 3.4 ses wheels. In my humble opinion and limited experience I have to say that I feel they have made the bike more complete. And undoubtedly faster. And now I finally reach my point. The other area that I have noticed an improvement over the alloy rimmed C24s is braking. I haven't really tried them in the wet as yet but in the dry they are quite incredible! Add to this the brilliant noise they make and I am absolutely delighted with my albeit large investment. Coincidentally I went for the ENVE hubs. I have a pair of Chris Kings on another bike that I love but the maintenance free aspect of the ENVE hubs appealed. PS The flange on my Chris King rear hub fractured after 4.5 years all condition hard UK use and it was replaced under warranty with no receipt. No questions asked.
I have just worn out my C24, well there is still some small amount of rim wear to go, but not as thin as Hambini's. Not as many miles either but the Hubs are the lick, buy Shimano Dura Ace wheels but wait for the big online sellers to put them in the sale.
Thanks for this video. Impressive durability you got. How do you manage drivetrain to las so long ? How many kilometers do you get from the chain, cassette and cogs? How often do you swap chains? And how often the cassette and crankset cogs? Do you rotate several pairs ? How much stretch of the chain before you get a new one? Thanks for the videos !
I've just discovered your channel and I wish I had done earlier! Love your engineering explanations; takes me right back to my apprenticeship. I've forgotten a lot.... I'm not a Shimano fan in terms of function, but the quality is impressive. I have an old pair of Mavic Open 4 CDs with 600 (pre Ultegra) hubs. Still beautifully smooth. My best hubs are on a pair of Spinergy Stealth carbon tubs that I use for CX. Perpetual motion
hi there! i have shimano 9000, c50(cl). this wheel is nice for me, why you said shimano original rim tape is gabage? and what do you think of duration of mine? (i think 110,000~120,00km) also you can use c35 now well?
Shimano had the same bearing design in the original Dura Ace 7400 series freehub back around 1985. I had 10 years on that freehub and only stopped using it because I needed a rear wheel with a 130mm spacing rather than the 126mm of that hub. That was before the NOS craze that we seem to have now and those wheels ended up on a friends old Peugeot bike with the less than gas pipe quality Carboshite 103 frame. I can just imagine a bunch of Japanese engineers sitting around a table figuring out how to design things that just don't suck. Their designs are never overly complicated and especially with the Dura Ace kit, it's always a pleasure to pull apart, clean and rebuild. While I traded shit British winters for Northern California heat and dust, the kit still needs to be cleaned and made to look spiffy every once in a while.
I have been living in Japan for 12 years now, and things that are made in Japan for Japanese customers are simply top notch. Japanese customers overall have very high expectations and a very expensive taste. Engineers here work more on durability and function as opposed to planned obsolescence. It's a great system that really benefits customers because once you get a reputation here for fucking something up your business will get washed out with the trash.
You didn't mention that the rear wheel is spoked in a 2-cross pattern on the drive side (14 spokes) and radial on the other side (7 spokes) for a total of 21. I've noticed the same spoking pattern on a front disc wheel (Mavic??): x2 on the disc side to cope with the asymmetric torque of the single disc, radial on the other side.
Hi Hambini. An interesting video and thank you for making it. Could you clarify what you mean by the run out for testing please? It is a new term for me I haven't come across. Also, I heard from a few shimano wheel reviews that there is a tendency for the aluminum rim join to be slightly faulty, uneven or unsmooth. Any experience there?
Hi, thanks for the comments. Run out is how much deviation there is on the wheel from being perfectly round or perfectly straight. Measured on the braking track, the run out is a measure of how straight the wheel is. Measured on the bead set is a measure of how round the wheel is. 0.3mm for a wheel that has done 100,000km is very good. If you are in the US 0.3mm is 12/1000 of a inch. Most new wheels are accurate to 0.5mm The aluminium joint on this wheel was good, nothing to report there. On my new c60 it is slightly rough. Aluminium is soft so you can sand it down but you should have to do that on an expensive set of wheels.
HI, thanks also for the quick reply. The next question I didn't ask for brevity is could run out and wheel trueness be used interchangeably? That is to say, just by looking at the numbers on the device, could you tell the difference if a wheel was either out of true or had considerable deviation in run out? I suspect not because trueness can be measured in 1-4mm deviance while you are referring to 0.3mm for run out. Lastly, looking forward to your c60 review as well as enjoy watching your channel grow. best wishes there.
Hi there, Yes, the run out and the wheel trueness are effectively the same measure. A perfectly true wheel would have zero runout on the brake track (axial runout). No runout on the radial surface (tyre bead) would mean the wheel was perfectly round as well. Thankyou for the feedback as well. Hambini
Hi Hambini what do you think about there new cheaper version WH-RS770-C30 (disc) does it have the same hub design ? 100.000 km its really impressive, most of the wheels I have owned from fulcrum the "outer" bearing in the free hub last only about 5-6000 km.
jacob mortensen Shimano hubs are pretty much universal across their range for the mechanics of how they work. The general difference is in materials and hence weight. The key advantage is they can be adjusted as they wear. On other wheels this simply have to change the bearing.
Worth mentioning the titanium free hub body - most wheels use aluminum, which is soft & gets chewed up by the cassette. Love my C-35’s - they’re the perfect rim brake clincher. The alloy rim bead really grabs the tire with an iron grip & cuts down on flats.
Why have you chosen C35 instead of C24? I do love my Dura Ace C24 (using them for racing since years). I'm ignoring the aerodynamic disadvantages of the shallow rim, it does not hinder me from winning races. However, what makes things worse in this respect is the behaviour of some spokes: they constantly tend to get out of normal straight forward position, so without doubt those blades are slowing me down a lot; I'm not able to solve this problem. (I had to true the wheels some times because of unfriendly contact while racing.)
Bruno Nogueira they will take 25 and 28 but i would not recommend you go past 25 as they will balloon. they are not tubeless compatible. hope that helps hambini
great review, with normal carbon wheels they would have given up many km's ago. Carbon rims cannot withstand the impacts of day to day training and riding, they delaminate. Hence why i'm going back to aluminum rims... too expensive and time consuming replacing carbon wheels.
I live mostly in a flat area so makes sense I guess, think im focusing too much on the weight difference. Im replacing a set of RS31s, so anything is an upgrade! Thanks for replying
The problem is that living in England, the weather is crap all year round so water and grit get in and destroy everything. However if it survives a Hambini test, it should be good for 95% of the population
It is certainly interesting to see one of those bling bikes being treated like a real utilitarian machine.
On one hand, it pains me to see them taking so much abuse without any maintenance, but on the other hand, that's pretty much the point, innit? To see how much abuse the system can take before failure.
S5 as a means of transport. Nice life. 👍
Just watched your video on aero wheels and now your review of Shimano DA C35 wheels, both absolutely excellent, many thanks.
Christopher Hanson you are welcome!
Mr Hambini I am curious. In your review of aero wheels you highlight the aero benefits of a NACA profile as used by Mavic, but I note you purchased the Dura-ace C60 wheels for your own use. What was your rationale for selecting the Dura-ace over the Mavic or other similarly priced wheels?
Christopher Hanson the main reason is that shimano wheels can take the abuse that i throw at them. I'm not totally bothered about 10w of drag versus striping down the hubs every 3 months.
Thanks Mr Hambini for the rapid reply. Yes, your response makes good sense. I have got the DA C24's on my favourite bike and they have been pretty much bomb proof. In real world riding, particularly if you are paying for the stuff yourself, I think durability eclipses marginal aero gain. Have you been pleased with the C60's?
Christopher Hanson yes. they have been completely faultless. they are a bit slower to accelerate but that's the only negative. but like you say bomb proof
I have the C24 9100 and have been very impressed. I had a set of Fulcrum (campy) Racing Zeros on my last bike that also used cup and cone bearings. Cup and cones systems are really only seen on top end fulcrum/campy and shimano wheelsets cause they have better performance as long as you maintain them but it looks like in this video the maintenance in low:). Great long term review.
Thankyou for the feedback.
Shimano hubs, cup and cone system, are still great. The main advantage its that if owner maintain them correctly, they last indefinitely. Low end hubs need to add grease and adjust preload properly and last many years without problems too.
(however, old low end hubs from shimano are better cuality than now, but DuraAce are still great)
I agree, they are very robust and will withstand a certain amount of neglect. I totally neglect mine.
2 years ago I bought a Scott Addict with the kind of discount I couldn't ignore. I absolutely love the bike but at 80 plus kilos I was getting a bit of flex from the C24 wheelset and having become totally sold on tubless recently was keen to upgrade. Replacing the rims didn't appear to be an option so after much research I purchased a set of ENVE 3.4 ses wheels. In my humble opinion and limited experience I have to say that I feel they have made the bike more complete. And undoubtedly faster. And now I finally reach my point. The other area that I have noticed an improvement over the alloy rimmed C24s is braking. I haven't really tried them in the wet as yet but in the dry they are quite incredible! Add to this the brilliant noise they make and I am absolutely delighted with my albeit large investment. Coincidentally I went for the ENVE hubs. I have a pair of Chris Kings on another bike that I love but the maintenance free aspect of the ENVE hubs appealed. PS The flange on my Chris King rear hub fractured after 4.5 years all condition hard UK use and it was replaced under warranty with no receipt. No questions asked.
I have just worn out my C24, well there is still some small amount of rim wear to go, but not as thin as Hambini's. Not as many miles either but the Hubs are the lick, buy Shimano Dura Ace wheels but wait for the big online sellers to put them in the sale.
Thanks for this video. Impressive durability you got. How do you manage drivetrain to las so long ? How many kilometers do you get from the chain, cassette and cogs? How often do you swap chains? And how often the cassette and crankset cogs? Do you rotate several pairs ? How much stretch of the chain before you get a new one?
Thanks for the videos !
That is insanely impressive that they have never been trued up
i have a bontrager select set (heavy stuff) with 50 thousand kilometres which have never been trued either
Great videos. Very informative and well explained. I'm trying to improve my bike mechanic skills, and you've helped alot
Shimano:What happens an actual serious professional company makes cycling components.
Hahaha yes...the 9100 C40s are so smooth and amazing on climbs.
Hi, could you make a video on chain,casette wear.
I love the content on your channel, technical and clear.
Thanks for the feedback. I'll put it on my to do list.
I've just discovered your channel and I wish I had done earlier! Love your engineering explanations; takes me right back to my apprenticeship. I've forgotten a lot.... I'm not a Shimano fan in terms of function, but the quality is impressive. I have an old pair of Mavic Open 4 CDs with 600 (pre Ultegra) hubs. Still beautifully smooth. My best hubs are on a pair of Spinergy Stealth carbon tubs that I use for CX. Perpetual motion
hi there! i have shimano 9000, c50(cl). this wheel is nice for me, why you said shimano original rim tape is gabage? and what do you think of duration of mine? (i think 110,000~120,00km) also you can use c35 now well?
Shimano had the same bearing design in the original Dura Ace 7400 series freehub back around 1985. I had 10 years on that freehub and only stopped using it because I needed a rear wheel with a 130mm spacing rather than the 126mm of that hub. That was before the NOS craze that we seem to have now and those wheels ended up on a friends old Peugeot bike with the less than gas pipe quality Carboshite 103 frame.
I can just imagine a bunch of Japanese engineers sitting around a table figuring out how to design things that just don't suck. Their designs are never overly complicated and especially with the Dura Ace kit, it's always a pleasure to pull apart, clean and rebuild. While I traded shit British winters for Northern California heat and dust, the kit still needs to be cleaned and made to look spiffy every once in a while.
I have been living in Japan for 12 years now, and things that are made in Japan for Japanese customers are simply top notch. Japanese customers overall have very high expectations and a very expensive taste. Engineers here work more on durability and function as opposed to planned obsolescence. It's a great system that really benefits customers because once you get a reputation here for fucking something up your business will get washed out with the trash.
And it appears you have never cleaned those wheels either 😀
I use ultegra 6700 24 mm wheels and they are absolutely perfect. So was old c80s.
You didn't mention that the rear wheel is spoked in a 2-cross pattern on the drive side (14 spokes) and radial on the other side (7 spokes) for a total of 21. I've noticed the same spoking pattern on a front disc wheel (Mavic??): x2 on the disc side to cope with the asymmetric torque of the single disc, radial on the other side.
Do you think their new wheels are just as good or even better?
Hi Hambini. An interesting video and thank you for making it. Could you clarify what you mean by the run out for testing please? It is a new term for me I haven't come across. Also, I heard from a few shimano wheel reviews that there is a tendency for the aluminum rim join to be slightly faulty, uneven or unsmooth. Any experience there?
Hi, thanks for the comments. Run out is how much deviation there is on the wheel from being perfectly round or perfectly straight. Measured on the braking track, the run out is a measure of how straight the wheel is. Measured on the bead set is a measure of how round the wheel is. 0.3mm for a wheel that has done 100,000km is very good. If you are in the US 0.3mm is 12/1000 of a inch.
Most new wheels are accurate to 0.5mm
The aluminium joint on this wheel was good, nothing to report there. On my new c60 it is slightly rough. Aluminium is soft so you can sand it down but you should have to do that on an expensive set of wheels.
HI, thanks also for the quick reply. The next question I didn't ask for brevity is could run out and wheel trueness be used interchangeably? That is to say, just by looking at the numbers on the device, could you tell the difference if a wheel was either out of true or had considerable deviation in run out? I suspect not because trueness can be measured in 1-4mm deviance while you are referring to 0.3mm for run out. Lastly, looking forward to your c60 review as well as enjoy watching your channel grow. best wishes there.
Hi there, Yes, the run out and the wheel trueness are effectively the same measure. A perfectly true wheel would have zero runout on the brake track (axial runout). No runout on the radial surface (tyre bead) would mean the wheel was perfectly round as well. Thankyou for the feedback as well. Hambini
Hi Hambini what do you think about there new cheaper version WH-RS770-C30 (disc) does it have the same hub design ? 100.000 km its really impressive, most of the wheels I have owned from fulcrum the "outer" bearing in the free hub last only about 5-6000 km.
jacob mortensen Shimano hubs are pretty much universal across their range for the mechanics of how they work. The general difference is in materials and hence weight. The key advantage is they can be adjusted as they wear. On other wheels this simply have to change the bearing.
@@Hambini the lowest end hubs lack contact seals, and the MTB hubs also use labyrinth seals
100.000 km is A LOT. How many years have you been riding them?
Worth mentioning the titanium free hub body - most wheels use aluminum, which is soft & gets chewed up by the cassette. Love my C-35’s - they’re the perfect rim brake clincher. The alloy rim bead really grabs the tire with an iron grip & cuts down on flats.
Hi, May I know how this can be compared with Deep section rims!!!
Why have you chosen C35 instead of C24? I do love my Dura Ace C24 (using them for racing since years). I'm ignoring the aerodynamic disadvantages of the shallow rim, it does not hinder me from winning races. However, what makes things worse in this respect is the behaviour of some spokes: they constantly tend to get out of normal straight forward position, so without doubt those blades are slowing me down a lot; I'm not able to solve this problem. (I had to true the wheels some times because of unfriendly contact while racing.)
The best wheel ever made.
How did you do 100.000km in 4 (?) years (as the wheels were introduced 2013)? Impressive.
Beaver i ride to work every day on my cervelo s5 and these wheels were attached to it. they are essentially commuting wheels!
??? 25,000/365 is 68.5 km. And it is not a lot for a day. (it is still impressive tho)
How do you get 100k out of a rim? I burn through a rim in about 15k
How do you make this video and not include how the freehub sounds? ☹️
Did you ever wash your bike?
What size and brand of tyre and inner tubes do you recommend for the Shimano C35/C40 wheels?
The wheel is not really going to work as the run is not deep enough. You could put any sort of tyre. It won't make much difference
Do you repack your hubs?
Jay Santos not really very often. in the case of these wheels it was only to adjust the preload
ld still rather have sealed bearings in my shimano wheels
what if you wash the bike?
correlation of never cleaning the wheels and brake track wear ?
doesn't matter if you don't use the brakes!
Liked your video so you recommend now buying this wheelset?
yes I would. It's not the fastest wheelset but it will last and take the abuse.
Hambini Performance Engineering and they fit well 28mm tyres or just 25mm? Can they be tubeless thanks in advance for your help
Bruno Nogueira they will take 25 and 28 but i would not recommend you go past 25 as they will balloon. they are not tubeless compatible. hope that helps hambini
The C50 are very fast
great review, with normal carbon wheels they would have given up many km's ago. Carbon rims cannot withstand the impacts of day to day training and riding, they delaminate. Hence why i'm going back to aluminum rims... too expensive and time consuming replacing carbon wheels.
A carbon wheel is stronger and would have never bend like his wheel, carbon is pretty good and durable.
@@egonzalez4294 carbon wheel are durable, but they consume brake pads quickly...and I worry about them when go downhill
Can I run tubeless tires on these rims? If so any experience with any particular tires? Thanks
Nope they won't take tubeless
Do you commute with ur bike ?
yes I do
@@Hambini How far do you have to travel ?
@@mrGTD170 50k round trip
@@Hambini My round trip would be 160 km, not commutable by bike. Köln-Duisburg :D
E-Bike? I am often in Duisburg at Siemens. My first occasion I got lost in the red light area.
Hi, Did you replace balls or cup&cone system ever in this period ?
No, i just kept them well lubricated
6:55...should this be "km"...?
Thanks for video, I'm trying to make my mind up between c40 and c60 for Giant Propel bike.... Aside from acceleration, there doesnt seem much in it !
unless you are going up hill I would go for the C60's
I live mostly in a flat area so makes sense I guess, think im focusing too much on the weight difference. Im replacing a set of RS31s, so anything is an upgrade!
Thanks for replying
lorde66ex I just got the C40s . They are a very fast wheel- we have a few hills around here so I like him for that too
i will report the abuse :v
I use my bikes as well but I have never trashed my bikes
The problem is that living in England, the weather is crap all year round so water and grit get in and destroy everything. However if it survives a Hambini test, it should be good for 95% of the population
Your seat is jacked and your stem is slammed. That can't be comfortable.