1. I'm with you on motor cooling: ua-cam.com/video/WRtArow2UMU/v-deo.html 2. An advantage of running remote cooling through a duct or hose is that it seals up the brush end of the motor, which really does not like dirt or swarf getting into it 3. You are correct about the tradeoff between low torque/high RPM and high torque/low RPM - and you are quite right that the motor manufacturers overstate the HP numbers on these motors. However, higher speeds have a use all their own, especially on cutting tools like lathes and mills. Being able to drive the tool faster opens up the door to carbide tooling (which likes high SFM) which can often be more productive than a speed-limited, higher torque motor. Your typical hobby lathe 100mm chuck is frequently rated for 3500-4500 RPM, and spinning it that fast (with the commiserate feed speed) can generate a much higher MRR than a lower speed, even if the lower speed can take a heavier depth of cut. Within limits, RPM is king!
Good info I appreciate you sharing it. The one thing I caution people when it comes to hobby lathes and RPM speed is to do one of two things. Either maintain the OEM speed max, in other words don't drive the spindle faster than its max speed from the factory OR do your due diligence and make sure the bearings are up to the task. This involves getting the bearing part numbers and then trying to find the speed specs. Unless the manufacturer is clearly marked on it you can only get a range. If I was wanting to overdrive my spindle I would simply replace the bearings so I was absolutely sure the bearings were up to the speeds I planned on running it at. Lastly the further you go from the original max speed the the higher the risk of the structural integrity of the spindle not being up to the task especially if you have upgraded to a bigger chuck with more mass. I am sure a typical import spindle with correctly rated bearings can handle quite a bit more speed but the faster you go the more cautious a person needs to be.
maybe. a 3 phase motor is by its very nature is AC HOWEVER there are some DC motors that are referred to as 3 phase even though they are not a true 3 phase but that is how they are labeled. Can you email me through my website and send me pix of the motor, pix of any tags or stickers and any wire labelings. I may be able to clear it up for you.
@@dazecars I really appreciate that! Do you have your email address? I looked at your web page and couldn’t find anything regarding a contact email or web address.
Have you messed around with any 3 phase AC drive motors? You can find them in almost all Life Fitness commercial treadmills. Matrix treadmills probably have the most powerful commonly seen treadmill motor(made by Johnson Controls) out for the past ten years. Cybex is owned by Life Fitness so their stuff is cross compatible sometimes. And Precor and Startrac commercial treadmills also have some of the most powerful motors out there. Most are AC motors though… there are two Precor treadmill models called the 932i or 946i that is about 20 years old now. If you come across one of those, they have Massive DC drive motors made by Leeson. Very rare to see one of those motors ever fail and the bearings are easy to service/replace.
I did scrap one Life fitness treadmill with an AC motor but was not sure what I was looking at other than an AC motor so I didn't do anything with it. I know now a VFD would have been an outstanding option for that motor but some times you just don't know what you don't know.
The other reason to gear them down aside from torque is cooling. A DC motor turning at 100 rpm isn't going to last too well. I've used these motors a lot but find they tend to vibrate too much, especially without the flywheel. I guess in things like treadmills they're built to a price.
Two years ago you inspired me to convert two wood lathes to variable speed, Daze. Then you helped fine tune them with the proper gearing, a cooling fan, a quick start bypass switch (disabled safe start), a tachometer and a reverse switch. The speed control has made a huge difference in tooling a fine wood finish instead of using 80 grit sandpaper. I rarely touched the four gang pulleys before knowing you and now speed changes are made 10-20 times each project. If you come to east coast Canada (New Brunswick), Daze, you have a place to stay. Thanks for sharing your knowledge. Salute! 👍👍
Glad I could help and thanks for the generous offer. I will likely not ever be in your area but anything is possible. If you ever have the opportunity to share my channel with other groups and individuals it would really be appreciated. I am one channel among thousands and it can be hard for people to find my videos.
At 1:05 and later you say the green wire is for electrical short circuit protection. That is just 1 aspect of safety that it can provide. It is also for static electric charge dissipation. A tread mill is a great Van de Graaff generator and could kill you with static electric charge buildup suddenly discharging through your body! I know you are not building tread mills in this video presentation, but talking about treadmill repair or repurposing requires additional non-traditional safety concerns to be considered. Be safe! Good luck! Wear safety glasses!
Excellent information I will add it to a future video!! I have watched several UA-cam videos where the presenter said of green wires on treadmill motors "you don't need it, don't use it, just cut it off" I was beyond horrified
So uh question for the expert in the field, I just salvaged a commercial 220 volt treadmill and pulled a 3phase motor, I can tell that the VFD is on the control board but am helpless as far as figuring out what to do to get it turning. Have you messed with these? Do I just need to bite the bullet and purchase a new VFD?
Okay I know this is an older video and I don't know if you'll get this but can you take a treadmill motor and hook it up to a solar controller like a 60 amp for a 100 amp
Is the solar controller also adjusting voltage? Those amps would power a treadmill motor no problem but you won't get variable speed without varying the voltage, and what are your max volts. Most treadmill motors are 90-180 volts.
@@dazecars bud i dont know if it would power a solar charger i was seeing if u could do a video on it like make the treadmill motor power the solar charger please let me know
Dude your'e like the treadmill motor master.. hahahaha.. just found your channel looking for answers on how to disable the time out limit on a weslo cadence G40.. it shuts off after 1 hr and 40 mins. Would you know how to bypass that feature. ?
I built a trike with a treadmill motor belt drive with pulley on rear wheel. I cut the flywheel and used the threaded part, and attached it to my 36v ebike battery with an intermittent push button on the bars. It goes about 18mph, as fast as a trike can be safely ridden.
These are all great lessons and you offer the correct solution for this application (machine power conversion). Almost any application really. There is another solution for some applications, although cooling and gearing is applicable to every electric motor application. Specifically, when electric motors are used as traction motors which will require the motor to run from 0 RPM through the max RPM, using two of the smaller motors might be a better option. In the early 2000's my tiny business built high performance stand up scooters before it became the thing it has now become. We had limited resources to source our products from. To keep costs down it made sense to use the standard Chinese scooter parts, but simply installing a 300 Amp (golf cart) controller would ignite the brush housing in the first ten feet. Likewise, any attempt to modify existing controllers resulted in MOSFET fires. Now you know why we call them Metal Oxide Smoke & Fire Emitting Transistors. What did work in this application was to run 2 of the best cheap China motors available which were rated at 800 watts. Since the entire vehicle and rider only weighed 300lbs, we could dump stupid amounts of current into two motors for just a few seconds and get away with it. All we were really trying to do was teach the gasoline scooter people a lesson about electricity in a short drag race. It worked.
Thinking on building a liam f type wind turbine power regerator using any kind of motor, which motor model would you recomend? And material for the wind turbine? Fiberglass maybe?
Thanks for this video , I just finished a wood lathe conversion , on a cheap mechanical variable speed lathe . Love the power and speed control , one more thing to complete is a dual resistor as I’m getting a small lag at the start of the speed control . Thanks for the help .
Most but not all treadmill motors are DC and require an ac to dc converter. Most ac units are 3 phase requiring a 3 phase hook up and a VFD for variable speed.
I have not tried it but you would think it would help some. The important thing would be to make sure the EMI filter has the correct amp rating. Being undersized at the very least would reduce motor torque but more likely would burn out the filter.
@@tiggerkzn In most cases an EMI filter is designed to eliminate electromagnetic interference from this device to other devices so it probably won't do much for the motor but would reduce the interference other devices in the area experience.
Take the specs on the original AC motor and calculate the torque. This is a good starting number but more is better so from there you can increase torque with gearing assuming the new motor has more RPM
I don't care about any of this. I just want to use it as a winch to occasionally help me bring appliances up the stairs. Do you have any practical suggestions for that?
A treadmill motor is not a good candidate for a wench. It will not have the torque. maybe if you used in in conjunction with a hand crank wench and geared it way down but a that point a cheap wench from HF would likely work better.
What would be your advice if I wanted to make a chicken & turkey plucker? I am a new subscriber and have not gone through your playlist yet and I have no knowledge in this area....yet.
@@dazecars a plucker doesn't need to have high rpms but it does need torque which is why I'm interested in your expertise. Do I still need the circuit board if all I need is an on/off switch without a potentiometer? Also, can it be run off of a battery off-grid?
@@snowdragon930 It can be run directly off of batteries. Just keep in mind that voltage effects speed. I would try and run it as close to the motors's max RPMs. that would be at the voltage listed on the motor and then gear it down to the RPMS you want, this will maximize torque.
Horsepower is for braggin’ & torque is for draggin’. You can have all the horsepower you want but you ain’t going anywhere without torque.
agreed!!
I like to use vacuum motors with my projects , they are nice and small and they are universal.
good option. One of many sources to up cycle things and get free parts
1. I'm with you on motor cooling: ua-cam.com/video/WRtArow2UMU/v-deo.html
2. An advantage of running remote cooling through a duct or hose is that it seals up the brush end of the motor, which really does not like dirt or swarf getting into it
3. You are correct about the tradeoff between low torque/high RPM and high torque/low RPM - and you are quite right that the motor manufacturers overstate the HP numbers on these motors. However, higher speeds have a use all their own, especially on cutting tools like lathes and mills. Being able to drive the tool faster opens up the door to carbide tooling (which likes high SFM) which can often be more productive than a speed-limited, higher torque motor. Your typical hobby lathe 100mm chuck is frequently rated for 3500-4500 RPM, and spinning it that fast (with the commiserate feed speed) can generate a much higher MRR than a lower speed, even if the lower speed can take a heavier depth of cut. Within limits, RPM is king!
Good info I appreciate you sharing it. The one thing I caution people when it comes to hobby lathes and RPM speed is to do one of two things. Either maintain the OEM speed max, in other words don't drive the spindle faster than its max speed from the factory OR do your due diligence and make sure the bearings are up to the task. This involves getting the bearing part numbers and then trying to find the speed specs. Unless the manufacturer is clearly marked on it you can only get a range. If I was wanting to overdrive my spindle I would simply replace the bearings so I was absolutely sure the bearings were up to the speeds I planned on running it at. Lastly the further you go from the original max speed the the higher the risk of the structural integrity of the spindle not being up to the task especially if you have upgraded to a bigger chuck with more mass. I am sure a typical import spindle with correctly rated bearings can handle quite a bit more speed but the faster you go the more cautious a person needs to be.
great explanation
keep up the great videos.
Thanks, will do!!
If my treadmill has 3 wires of 3 separate phases does that make it an AC motor? The label doesn’t say what it is
maybe. a 3 phase motor is by its very nature is AC HOWEVER there are some DC motors that are referred to as 3 phase even though they are not a true 3 phase but that is how they are labeled. Can you email me through my website and send me pix of the motor, pix of any tags or stickers and any wire labelings. I may be able to clear it up for you.
@@dazecars I really appreciate that! Do you have your email address? I looked at your web page and couldn’t find anything regarding a contact email or web address.
About/contact is in the menu bar at the top of the website. A lot of my other pages have it as well and it’s part of my “about” information on UA-cam.
Have you messed around with any 3 phase AC drive motors? You can find them in almost all Life Fitness commercial treadmills. Matrix treadmills probably have the most powerful commonly seen treadmill motor(made by Johnson Controls) out for the past ten years. Cybex is owned by Life Fitness so their stuff is cross compatible sometimes. And Precor and Startrac commercial treadmills also have some of the most powerful motors out there. Most are AC motors though… there are two Precor treadmill models called the 932i or 946i that is about 20 years old now. If you come across one of those, they have Massive DC drive motors made by Leeson. Very rare to see one of those motors ever fail and the bearings are easy to service/replace.
I did scrap one Life fitness treadmill with an AC motor but was not sure what I was looking at other than an AC motor so I didn't do anything with it. I know now a VFD would have been an outstanding option for that motor but some times you just don't know what you don't know.
The other reason to gear them down aside from torque is cooling. A DC motor turning at 100 rpm isn't going to last too well. I've used these motors a lot but find they tend to vibrate too much, especially without the flywheel. I guess in things like treadmills they're built to a price.
excelent point. there is an RPM range where cooling is most efficient.
Two years ago you inspired me to convert two wood lathes to variable speed, Daze. Then you helped fine tune them with the proper gearing, a cooling fan, a quick start bypass switch (disabled safe start), a tachometer and a reverse switch. The speed control has made a huge difference in tooling a fine wood finish instead of using 80 grit sandpaper. I rarely touched the four gang pulleys before knowing you and now speed changes are made 10-20 times each project.
If you come to east coast Canada (New Brunswick), Daze, you have a place to stay. Thanks for sharing your knowledge. Salute! 👍👍
Garson,
I'm in the process of doing the same conversion. Any chance I could see a few pics of your setup?
Glad I could help and thanks for the generous offer. I will likely not ever be in your area but anything is possible. If you ever have the opportunity to share my channel with other groups and individuals it would really be appreciated. I am one channel among thousands and it can be hard for people to find my videos.
At 1:05 and later you say the green wire is for electrical short circuit protection. That is just 1 aspect of safety that it can provide. It is also for static electric charge dissipation. A tread mill is a great Van de Graaff generator and could kill you with static electric charge buildup suddenly discharging through your body! I know you are not building tread mills in this video presentation, but talking about treadmill repair or repurposing requires additional non-traditional safety concerns to be considered. Be safe! Good luck! Wear safety glasses!
Excellent information I will add it to a future video!! I have watched several UA-cam videos where the presenter said of green wires on treadmill motors "you don't need it, don't use it, just cut it off" I was beyond horrified
I’m sure there’s a guy out there about to screw up his treadmill motor powered whatever, all because he hasn’t watch any of your awesome videos.
High praise, thank you!!
Thank you! really enjoy your channel.
Glad you like it!!
So uh question for the expert in the field, I just salvaged a commercial 220 volt treadmill and pulled a 3phase motor, I can tell that the VFD is on the control board but am helpless as far as figuring out what to do to get it turning. Have you messed with these? Do I just need to bite the bullet and purchase a new VFD?
I have not messed with getting any 3 phase AC motors from treadmill working.
@@dazecars Drat foiled again!
👍
Okay I know this is an older video and I don't know if you'll get this but can you take a treadmill motor and hook it up to a solar controller like a 60 amp for a 100 amp
Is the solar controller also adjusting voltage? Those amps would power a treadmill motor no problem but you won't get variable speed without varying the voltage, and what are your max volts. Most treadmill motors are 90-180 volts.
@@dazecars bud i dont know if it would power a solar charger i was seeing if u could do a video on it like make the treadmill motor power the solar charger please let me know
so you are wanting to use a treadmill motor as a generator?
@@dazecars yes
thats not the kind of videos i do but thanks for the comment
Dude your'e like the treadmill motor master.. hahahaha.. just found your channel looking for answers on how to disable the time out limit on a weslo cadence G40.. it shuts off after 1 hr and 40 mins. Would you know how to bypass that feature. ?
The only way I know to bypass those types of integrated treadmill functions is to ditch the treadmill controls.
@@dazecars that's what I was thinking.. thanks so much for responding. I subbed and I'll be watching more of your vids fo sure..
👍
I built a trike with a treadmill motor belt drive with pulley on rear wheel. I cut the flywheel and used the threaded part, and attached it to my 36v ebike battery with an intermittent push button on the bars. It goes about 18mph, as fast as a trike can be safely ridden.
sounds like a fun project
Another great easy to understand simple explanation. Thanks for taking the time to educate all of us.
My pleasure
These are all great lessons and you offer the correct solution for this application (machine power conversion). Almost any application really.
There is another solution for some applications, although cooling and gearing is applicable to every electric motor application.
Specifically, when electric motors are used as traction motors which will require the motor to run from 0 RPM through the max RPM, using two of the smaller motors might be a better option.
In the early 2000's my tiny business built high performance stand up scooters before it became the thing it has now become.
We had limited resources to source our products from. To keep costs down it made sense to use the standard Chinese scooter parts, but simply installing a 300 Amp (golf cart) controller would ignite the brush housing in the first ten feet. Likewise, any attempt to modify existing controllers resulted in MOSFET fires. Now you know why we call them Metal Oxide Smoke & Fire Emitting Transistors.
What did work in this application was to run 2 of the best cheap China motors available which were rated at 800 watts.
Since the entire vehicle and rider only weighed 300lbs, we could dump stupid amounts of current into two motors for just a few seconds and get away with it.
All we were really trying to do was teach the gasoline scooter people a lesson about electricity in a short drag race. It worked.
Interesting concept, I had not thought of running two motors but assuming they were the same I could totally see the benefit.
Thinking on building a liam f type wind turbine power regerator using any kind of motor, which motor model would you recomend? And material for the wind turbine? Fiberglass maybe?
Not sure I have not done anything with wind turbines
very good information - thanks
glad it helped!!
Great info!
Glad it was helpful!
Nice explanation. I would have fallen for that horsepower trap if I didn't see this video.
That is exactly why I made the other video I referenced in this video, easy mistake to make.
Thanks for this video , I just finished a wood lathe conversion , on a cheap mechanical variable speed lathe .
Love the power and speed control , one more thing to complete is a dual resistor as I’m getting a small lag at the start of the speed control . Thanks for the help .
Are you saying that when you turn the nob it turns a bit before the motor comes on? if so take a look at this ua-cam.com/video/04d0u1RJyXw/v-deo.html
I have one of this 4.25 hp can i connect it direct to a 120 line?
Most but not all treadmill motors are DC and require an ac to dc converter. Most ac units are 3 phase requiring a 3 phase hook up and a VFD for variable speed.
@@dazecars thank you so much
my pleasure
New subscriber here. Thanks for the vids. Quick question, can an EMI filter be used in place of a choke on a TM motor?
I have not tried it but you would think it would help some. The important thing would be to make sure the EMI filter has the correct amp rating. Being undersized at the very least would reduce motor torque but more likely would burn out the filter.
@@dazecars The emi filter i have came with the same tredmill. Its rated to 2250vdc. Curious as to why it would have had a choke and an EMI
@@tiggerkzn In most cases an EMI filter is designed to eliminate electromagnetic interference from this device to other devices so it probably won't do much for the motor but would reduce the interference other devices in the area experience.
How do you determine the torque needed for a particular machine to tool?
Take the specs on the original AC motor and calculate the torque. This is a good starting number but more is better so from there you can increase torque with gearing assuming the new motor has more RPM
I don't care about any of this. I just want to use it as a winch to occasionally help me bring appliances up the stairs. Do you have any practical suggestions for that?
A treadmill motor is not a good candidate for a wench. It will not have the torque. maybe if you used in in conjunction with a hand crank wench and geared it way down but a that point a cheap wench from HF would likely work better.
@@dazecars, I just noticed that. Thank you.🙂
👍
Terimakasih
You are welcome!!
Cut the red wire!
👍
What would be your advice if I wanted to make a chicken & turkey plucker? I am a new subscriber and have not gone through your playlist yet and I have no knowledge in this area....yet.
Not sure, I know lots about treadmill motor conversions and almost nothing about chicken pluckers, what questions do you have?
@@dazecars a plucker doesn't need to have high rpms but it does need torque which is why I'm interested in your expertise. Do I still need the circuit board if all I need is an on/off switch without a potentiometer? Also, can it be run off of a battery off-grid?
@@snowdragon930 It can be run directly off of batteries. Just keep in mind that voltage effects speed. I would try and run it as close to the motors's max RPMs. that would be at the voltage listed on the motor and then gear it down to the RPMS you want, this will maximize torque.
On mc80 I got 1 red-light on and motor won't start
usualy its one of the switching transisters attached to the heat sink side of the board that need to be replaced.
Can we use water pump motors as replacement for treadmills?
It all depends on the motor specs
Link me the blue wire video I can’t find it
Here you go: Hooking Treadmill Motor Blue Wires: SCR, MC60 and MC-2100 Treadmill Motor Controller Power Supply
ua-cam.com/video/Mx4022PbHO4/v-deo.html
Thanx a stack 👍🏻 Very helpfull.
my pleasure
Nice vid. Thanks.
👍👍👍
Thanks
😍😍🤩🤩
👍