This is very instructive. In the final variation, I suspect I would automatically cut at N17 when white hanes (kiai!) and gotten into a big fight that isn't necessarily advantageous for me. Whereas in the final diagram you give, black's stone at M17 ends up looking like a nice efficient peep.
Just for fun, I decided to follow the move flow to see what AI said. With the whole board position it followed with some of the board positions Mr.Redmond showed us. The last one in particular. Very cool joseki I will try out in some games if I notice this type of approach
Interestingly, Katago prefers to simply fill at the P17 rather than playing O18. I guess that way if black goes down with S16 you can just bump against black stone and go underneath
Is it essentially guaranteed that white would respond to the peep? If instead white plays at N16, I assume pushing through at the peep is the follow up for black?
@@christophe7519 Not necessarily, both alphago and katago prefer white P17 instead of O18. Also black might not want to play P17 because his wall would lose a liberty.
I never played this. And this position happens to me all the time....very valuable and teaches me what is important. Thank you!!!
Holy bananas! Thanks for actually making the video I requested!
This is very instructive. In the final variation, I suspect I would automatically cut at N17 when white hanes (kiai!) and gotten into a big fight that isn't necessarily advantageous for me. Whereas in the final diagram you give, black's stone at M17 ends up looking like a nice efficient peep.
Thank you.
Thank you for the video!
Just for fun, I decided to follow the move flow to see what AI said. With the whole board position it followed with some of the board positions Mr.Redmond showed us. The last one in particular.
Very cool joseki I will try out in some games if I notice this type of approach
Interestingly, Katago prefers to simply fill at the P17 rather than playing O18. I guess that way if black goes down with S16 you can just bump against black stone and go underneath
Ah K16 makes sense. I need to get used to thinking about moves other than the "obvious" ones like cut at N17.
As frugal and inspiring as possible!
Is it essentially guaranteed that white would respond to the peep? If instead white plays at N16, I assume pushing through at the peep is the follow up for black?
Thank you very much, I always played this completely wrong.
DDK question: why does white almost always follow with O18, instead of P17, to black's peep?
If P17 was a good move, black would certainly take it first instead of P16.
Dance Dance Kyuvolution?
@@christophe7519 Not necessarily, both alphago and katago prefer white P17 instead of O18. Also black might not want to play P17 because his wall would lose a liberty.
@@srki22 all great points. It would be interesting to hear from Michael about the AI preference and the trade-off.
As white I would not want to play N16 immediately after Q11. How about if W plays R9 or R8 instead of N16?
goooooooo000d