What did wooden castles look like and how were they built?
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- Опубліковано 27 вер 2024
- Because none the wood castles of the medieval period have survived, what they looked like and how they were built is a mystery, so in this video I try and figure it out.
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Music track "Castle" by kevin macleod
You have a ton of quality presentations, but when it's on the subject of medieval architecture, it's really on a different level. I really hope the academic historians are taking notice, and that they give more recognition some of the channels on YT, who research their subjects thoroughly and not just make simplified history.
Shad woke me up when he screamed "Machicolation" scared the shit out of me. here i am falling into a light sleep all of the sudden...MACHICOLATIONS!!! oh shit.
What does it have to do with academic historians tho ?
One of two things, or medieval log builders were simple minded or this is a simplified view of log building. Long before rotting wood dries out and shrinks massively in diameter, so stacking logs to a tower works, but mostly for the enemy.
Pata Crepe I basis in real world building experience or experimentation answers a lot of questions pure academics seem to get wrong or have trouble working out. Roman and Greek building technology attempted reconstructions explained passages in Vitruvius that translators had great trouble.Re-enactors worked out why there was a big demand for animal grease by legionaries. The plate lorica armour they wore chaffed in areas of the upper arms and neck. Auxiliaries wore chainmail over jackets and didn't need it. Previously academics thought it was just better rations for legionaries who used it for cooking.
yeah that's just called archeology y'know
You have created what is quite literally one of the only pieces of well defined content on wooden castles on the entirety of the free internet. Feel proud.
The key word is "well-defined"; there's stuff on the internet about wooden castles all over the place, but they don't go ANYWHERE NEAR the level of detail and definition that we're seeing here. Well done, Shad!
Yeah, I am excited I found a video that goes into the level of detail I've been wanting to learn about this at in order to write a novel I'm working on!
Also something to consider, as in with log cabins etc. the logs are almost always raised from the ground to prevent rotting, so they might have made a low stone section of wall on which they build the wooden walls.
Japanese did this with their castles to great effect, however not all did. Don't think the pagan Lithuanians did that with their wooden forts and they were build pretty much the same as a log cabin.
In a Russian museum there were modells of forts and fortifications of the Rus from the 10th to 12th century. They stated that the wooden walls had to be weatherproofed with plaster and straw. Numerous forts along the river routes consisted of wooden walls above earth ramparts reinforced with logs. This proofs your assumptions.
Before the siege of Kazan, Russians had built a wooden fortress, disassembled it, spilt down by the river and assembled log by log near the Kazan to have a siege base.
There are still the whole sections of original wooden fortresses (Ostrogs) remaining in Siberia (Il'imskii ostrog, for example). They are 17th century, but nevertheless show the real examples of building walls and towers from old times.
Filling the space between two vertically standing walls with dirt makes the most sense to me. The dirt can come from a few yards outside of the castle wall, effectively making a moat. So you get a 2-for-1 benefit of a moat and a reinforced castle wall. The moat will aid against seize ladders, rams, etc. The thicker wall will help against bombardment. Your biggest challenge and greatest expense will be conveying logs and moving earth... the logs especially since they have to be moved as a whole unlike earth.
"rammed earth" look it up ;) (as in: you don't even need the wood, besides the formwork and falsework "molds", that is)
Spy: *takes rock and chips coating*
“It’s wooden!”
Imagine if people actually did that
I'm fascinated that the secret to optimal wooden castle design is giving it a makeover. This is super cool, like you said, we're discovering something here!
-B
It's a very cool possibility. Thanks heaps mate, I really appreciate the support.
Next collab when?
Two of my favorite UA-camrs noice!
Hello Blue.
Damn you guys watch Shad too~!?
Plain wooden walls would have been incredibly cold and drafty. Rendering would have been an effective way to insulate the wall.
I don't think they had they ability to render 3D objects during that period of time
Easier than shaping logs to fit perfectly together.
@@AlcerusOfficial Yea sadly they were stuck using MS paint
@@quazznorm1777 had they waited a week or so, they could've used Adobe Photoshop...
@Voltaic Fire only in certain regions. They were a tad miffed over the thought of Adobe in other regions, which i presume was a major factor in the start of the crusades.
Now you're really getting me thinking about the half-stone-half-wood design: make a really strong base out of stone to hold the supporting and holding beams and then everything else out of wood, it makes for a good hybrid and, if someone ever knocks down a wall you could always get the broken log out of the socket and throw in a new one.
Or rebuild sections in stone whenever you or your descendants can afford to do so.
isn't that what the Japanese did for their castles, half stone (base)-half wood (structure on top)? Mainly to deal with earthquakes? :)
This opens up some interesting options for constructions over long periods of time. The slow replacement of wood and whatnot or alternatively make the wood castle just a bit bigger than the final stone design so later on you could just build a stone castle inside the wood one!
@@fionafiona1146 I can't imagine how tedious it would be to do that sort of swap bit by bit, it'd honestly be more sensitive to either expand the wooden fortifications or raze the keep to the ground once you saved up enough to build on top of the foundations that way. Either you think far ahead and build your wooden castle accordingly so you can fit the stone walls or make new.
Dont vorry sooner or later some good people come around and burn it down ;-)
Man. Watching these makes me want to actually build one. An accurate one.
Join the club lol
*Cracks Knuckles and boots up Minecraft*
I'm from Poland . In the mountains we have living in skansen museum where many log homes are 400 years old and oldest church build with no nails from wood in Poland is 600 years old . Yea logs last long if properly build !
As an aspiring author who wants to feature wooden castles in my own writing, this video is an undoubtably valuable resource, as always!
Awesome. You done with it, still working on it, or stopped working on it? I’m interested
How’s the book coming?
Your use of visual aids through Sketch Up make these videos so much more effective than if you used only stock image backgrounds. It really feels like watching you build and experiment with castle design in real time. Thanks for another great video!
I doubt you'll see this but putting pebbles or stones between dirt elevation and wooden wall, helps a lot to prevent rotting.
Dave Moon, yep. This is how my relatives' house in Eastern Poland was built. Same system was used extensively in Russia.
It is called rubble fill. It is also used in stone walls to prevent rising damp knocking the plaster off the walls.
If there's anything a lord would better not go cheap on is having a good stone foundation. Don't know how effective it would be to have that spacing since it would add some air pockets but ultimately I imagine you could also just avoid that to be a problem by building a platform on top of the filling, instead of using the dirt rise as floor for the armaments, less constant pressure which would eventually push the dirt in those pockets and still get contact with the wood.
This double-walled design was actually used extensively by the Romans for their more permanent wilderness forts. Essentially the soldier would go in and make a camp, with low-tier defenses: trenches, pleachered shrub fencing, pallisades. If a camp was chosen to be a permanent settlement for trade or governance, the engineers would come in and construct the double-walled, rammed-earth walls. This was to provide a more robust defensive capability which could be defended by fewer soldiers, while the engineers finished the main buildings, which would have been stone. After the main buildings of the fort were completed, engineers would then build another exterior bailey out of stone, while still having the wood/earth walls to retreat behind if attacked.
I'm a couple of years late, but hats off for making all these Google Sketchup models. They really help in visualizing what you're explaining, and they're super satisfying!
Yeah, I’m sold. Makes sense, and combining these ideas with the motte and Bailey and wood+earthen ramparts for the walls lends to a very realistic sense of defence that I couldn’t wrap my mind around before. 👍
And actually, rather cheap. In Spain we built more with stone because we had fewer trees and VERY determined enemies. We built A LOT of castles of all sizes. We REALLY had a lot of VERY determined enemies.
The idea that many castles were made of wood makes total sense, but when you pointed out that it's possible that many of the castles we see in medieval artwork may have just been wooden castles with a render it totally blew my mind! I called my wife into the room, knowing that she doesn't care at all about such things, and excitedly explained it to her. She still didn't care, but the fact that I even tried to explain it to her says a lot about how excited I am about this theory lol! GREAT VIDEO!
That's awesome, thanks heaps for sharing, lol
Your wife doesn't fucking care, dude. :)
Ha. Me losing my shit to the wife every day. You have just summed up my life.
Lol ! I told my wife and my 10 week old Labrador Retriever puppy...the puppy ( Sugar ) seemed somewhat interested.
Vaenn No, those were not wooden Castles as those were temporary structures.
I would really like to gather a few castle enthusiasts and build a wooden castle in some forgotten forest on a hill here in Europe.
There is a project like this in france:
www.guedelon.fr/en/
...they are building a stone castle though
Why stop with the castle? Build a whole village and live there!
@@Ersa0431 i like the idea
SironNFuries AND CONQUER THE WORLD
“What did wooden castles look like-“
My first thought:
ASHES
Hobbyists who instantly think about matchstick castle recreations didn’t like that.
O no my Castle is in wood and might not look like as rich as the others what to do? I know I'll cover it in shit! Splendid!
Yes but it's white painted shit so it's ok. Maybe keep some seagulls on retainer?
If it looks stupid but works it ain't stupid
So could one say that rendering is a "shitty waterproofing"????
You would also have to dig a trench around the walls then fill it with stones then put the logs on top to act as natural drainage. If you just sink the logs into the ground they would start to rot because the soil is high in moisture.
Just as important as keeping the foundations dry would be a roof keeping water out at the top.
You can actually keep wooden foundations pretty reasonably dry by adding a drainage ditch around them, just a dry depression that can run off so whenever it rains most of the moisture runs off and the elevated foundations stay dry.
Though this is 2 weeks old, you could also burn the end of the logs that you put into the ground to assist in keeping it from rotting.
You can also dump ash into the hole you're seating them in and the alkali will reduce rot.
Wood ash is an amazing preservative, the alkalinity makes it quite hostile to bacteria, fungi and insects. I have personally dug organic material out of a pit of wood ash that would normally have rotten away, I'm sure our ancestors knew this, after all they did use it to make soap. Ash also drains better than the heavy clay soils across most of the UK.
Something else people are not talking about is wood worm, where I live in the UK we have woodland and any timber left outdoors without some sort of protection will turned into Swiss cheese in a few years. Thoroughly daubing timbers is a simple cheap way to protect from the worm.
While the mortar would keep the water out it is worth noting that it would also keep water in so it would be pretty important to make sure that water either gets drained extremely effectively or doesn't get in at all to begin with. From the looks of it your tower and wall design seems pretty much like rain catchers so they might need some design adjustments so water doesn't get in from the top. Just roofs on everything might not be a bad idea and would also hold true to the last painting.
This is also my main concern with this design. It seems that with all that dirt behind the logs, every time it rains you would get some amount of mud. During a rainy season, quite a bit of it. I am not sure how much sod would help in this circumstance. The roots might even start to eat away at the timbers. But I imagine the ancient engineers knew how to keep timbers lasting. I suppose drainage would be am important park of design.
Put gravel over the dirt to prevent erosion, then put planks as a floor to prevent pressure and a roof to prevent rain, 500-year wall right there.
If you tamp down the dirt in a very compact manner it should not get much if any water deep down, whitewashing the inner side as well or adding some more gravel as a spacer can also help preventing contact with moisture. Even something like a thin clay layer would do which you just harden on the spot pitching a fire at the foot.
Not sure if that’s the case, the presenter at the Rideau canal booth on a civic holiday a few years ago said that it was the fluctuation between wet and dry that caused the rot, if it was always wet or always dry it wouldn’t. Not sure if some water is different than other places but in some time team episodes they dig lake houses that were from the Bronze Age. Might be about oxygen content or acidity or temperature of the water as well, not sure. Needs further research.
Mortar is porus, and acts equal to wood in moisture. It doesn't seal the wooden surface, coats it, and gives protection from the elements that would eventually damage the wood. The important part is that there is no consistent source of moisture to the wood, as microbe life, mold and eventually rot will begin at temperatus of +5°C and and 80% moisture. Outdoors dry wood will always have around 12% - 20% moisture in them. Depending on the relative moisture level of the current weather. Indoors dry will settle around 6%-8% moisture level. This level will always fluctuate between the indoor and outdoor surface of a log wall. The mortaring on the outside wall will lessen that level greatly and protect the wood from the suns burning effect. But it has to be a mineral mixture of sand, clay and limestone. other biodegradable materials would not work on the outside under those elements as sufficiently. Todays cement being equal to those lesser materials and unusable with direct contact to wooden materials...
Good point. Also, end-grain would have to be properly treated with pitch or other waterproofing, otherwise it would wick water into the log.
I work in construction too, Journeyman Carpenter here who primarily works in heavy lead-bearing structural construction, and I plan to get into structural engineering. I loved your presentation and how much thought you put into designing these buildings from the ground up. Also really cool to know and even almost prove that many castles were in fact wooden underneath their rendered layer.
I’m world building a fantasy world and to get advise and thoughts for the cultures, military’s and architecture your channel is always my go to place keep up the awesome work we want more shad
Remember the true enemy is within the walls already, if anything the outside force should be a logical ally to the people inside yet the real enemy casts them as the villian.
15:26
The moment we have all been waiting for. You are all welcome.
Shad, you're better at this than any History teacher could ever be, because you're a fan of them, just like all the rest of us nerds.
BUT:
WHAT ABOUT DRAGONS????
Dragon wouldn't be able to tell i it's a stone or wooden castle. That's why they - historically - whitewashed it.
I think all history teachers should have Shads passion. Or they shouldn't be teaching history.
History teacher here;
Most history teachers are just as passionate about castles, wars and all that cool stuff. However, most of that is, let's be honest, fairly irrelevant in the subject itself. You're in school to learn, not for fun. Most of history as a subject is more about properly reading and understanding why things happened, although we try to sneak in a war here or a castle there. (the kids think it's to relieve THEM of the "boring" material, but truly it is a present to ourselves)
History classes in schools are about feeding you certain dates & events. & then you regurgitating those stats & facts back. If you are a person that is really into researching history, don't expect to find anything of real substance in a school history class, unless you're taking advanced college/university courses. In the modern day & age we have the internet, things like UA-cam, & people like Shad. Way more & better resources than sitting in a classroom.
"History classes in schools are about feeding you certain dates & events. & then you regurgitating those stats & facts back." that is simply not true. The most important things we teach are the how and why, the when and who (dates and names) are also thought, but only because they are fundamental before you can start other questions. As said before; history as highschool subject is more about properly reading texts and understanding connections and explanations. Just because people don't remember what they actually learned in history class and think it was all about dates and names, doesn't mean that that is true
I don't think there will be a day where I get tired of listening to you talking about castles, so much insight to be had from it which I can use again in my writing, so thank you.
Amazing video, thank you. I'm for sure an amateur castle enthusiast and Ive reached similar conclusions about the log/earth combo for the walls but never even considered the putting something over the logs. It's so simple and makes perfect sense, I think you are very close to the mentality they had back then when making castles and defenses with wood.
"Hey run up and go knock on that wall and tell me what you hear"
I could look at your SketchUp models all day, gotta love that program!
Don't love the program, love the artist!
(if I was tasked with making a castle in SketchUp, it would probably take me forever and end up horrendous...)
I seriously hope experimental archeologists are paying attention. This sort of thing is what they *live* for and the great thing about building a wooden castle is that it would be *so* much cheaper than stone, they wouldn't even need absurdly rich or state backers
If you watch the various videos on youtube about the American frigates of the Constitution class from the early 19th century, you would also see that wood, even supported by wood, could be tremendously strong and resilient. So would wooden structures supported by dirt. Wood isn't necessarily prone to burning down if they are thick enough. They would have to be doused in long-lasting oil to catch fire, if they were even slightly skidded, much less so when they were rendered. Even if large sections of rendering fell off ... and it would probably fall in sections, the wooden structure would be little exposed and not spread the fire to still rendered sections of the wall.
Great vid.
If I remember right, unless the wood is particularly dry, it take great effort to set timber pieces on fire. Especially while attacking said wooden fortification.
as a firefighter i know my fair share of things about how well certain materials put up with fire and wood is actually better than steel even.
you see a steel beam looses about half of it's carrying capacity at arround 500°c and looses 2/3 of it at 700°C, this is not even the main problem though, the main problem is that steel conducts heat very well which causes the entire beam to loose it's structual strength almost at once and can cause a fire to spread from one part of teh building to another as any flamable material in contact with that beam can also catch fire.
wood has a variety of properties that make it preferable in case of a fire.
first off wood doesn't conduct heat very well, the fire can onyl spread through the beam at the same rate at which the beam burns down, which is rather slowly for a substential support beam.
secondly wood charrs, if the heat applied isn't strong enough to set the wood ablaze it will charr the wood instead, forming a layer of charrcoal which both isolates the remaining wood from teh outside, but is also even more difficult to set on fire, also the wooden beam only looses strength in that part that is exposed to the fire, it will continue to provide support to other parts of the building.
last, but certainly not least, wood has the neat and very usefull property that wood cracks and splinters slowly, meaning that you can heare that the structure is about to give, before it actually happens, giving you time to get outa there (and again only the section of te building that is exposed to the fire will collapse), when a steel beam reaches it's limit the whole building comes down on you in an isntant.
+Windhelm Guard That's cool, thanks for that.
This reminds me of a video I saw refuting the 9/11 claim that "jet fuel can't melt steel beams." The person in the video heated a steel beam to about the temperature that jet fuel burns at, and then bent it. Easily. It doesn't need to melt to lose its structural integrity.
Now I'm curious, though: how does stone compare to wood and steel when it comes to fire? I feel like stone would be something in between, with a bit of the properties of each.
that depends on the type of stone in question, most don't really mind fire, i have seen chimney fires (when a chimney isn't properly cleaned periodically or can't be cleaned properly because of the owner burning fuell with too much moisture in it, soot builds up in there and that soot can ignite, this is called a chimney fire) often times a chimney fire happens with no further damage to the structure.
the things that do not like heat are the mortar between the bricks and concrete because both are based on calcium carbonate which breaks apart into calcium oxide whe nexposed to intense heat.
Instant subscribe, this is exactly the infromation i've been looking for my novel work and i shall be using this exact castle tecquie for my big castle build in my minecraft work, thank you so much and look forward to checking out more of your channel :)
There is a church in Kiev, which was built somewhere in the 1300's. It's completely made out of wood, standing on a massive stone base. It looks like a massive fortress, though, because it's rendered/whitewashed in it's entirety. There is one spot on an outer wall where a big chunk of the coating has fallen off, and you can see the timbers that are underneath. Unfortunately I can't remember the name of that church now, I visited there in 2011 :(
I'd love to see your fortified manor house design redone the way you would make it if you and your family lived there.
I'd personally build a wall to enclose the garden and make a "gatehouse" which is really a playhouse for the kids but built to fullfil the purpose of a gatehouse. You could even have a workshop for your DIY weapons and a UA-cam studio in one of the Towers.
Tell you this much, You wouldn't have any issues with door to door sales and their ilk lol.
I'd apply for a guard position.
I'm watching this at work, and I need to leave in 20 minutes, so I'm watching it at 1.5 x speed. I think I might be addicted.
i'm doing that with 2x speed
now always when it's normal it feels like 0,5x to me
Yeah, but are you doing it because you need to finish watching it instead of working while you're at work? xD
I watch everything on 2x speed. You finish everything so much faster
i've got the same problem lol
If you're a student, recording a lecture while you work on other assignments and then cutting out the near-silence and playing it back faster is a great way to get everything you need from the lecture in a very compressed amount of time.
Shad, you are an absolute wizard with that software you use to show us everything and it makes it so easy to visualize and understand
Which software is it?
@@TheMrAlesT SketchUp, if I remember correctly.
@@peeblekitty5780 Thank you
As a historian, teacher, amateur archaeologist, and fantasy writer, I swear to God, someone needs to give you an award for cracking the wooden castle code (it is the soundest theory I have ever heard on a subject we have a lack of evidence for...it gets very tiring to hear supposed experts tag everything as being "for religious reasons" or "just symbolic in the artwork and couldn't possibly be done in real life"...or, if you're an expert talking on the 'History' Channel, "the aliens did it"). Plus, on a personal note, I want to thank you for giving me a new appreciation for castles and Medieval culture, as I have been binge-watching your videos while imprisoned during COVID-19. My forte has mostly been Classical Studies and the ancient world until recently, but, as I've developed a broader interest in more modern history, these videos have really opened my eyes to just how much more there is to learn.
Also, from now on, every time I write about a castle, I will always, always mention...wait for it...wait for it...MACHICOLATIONS!
I doubt this will be seen, but I just want to say thank you for this series of videos on medieval architecture and castles. I came here around a year ago from Metatron because of sword stuff, but ended up staying and regularly watching because of the castle stuff, especially the historical architectural analyses which is so much more rare to find any kind of good information on in a readily shareable format.
Shad Fact: Shad has tamed a massive wolf like creature named "Fenrir". A woman keeps trying to steal her "brother" from shad but she is regularly theater.
That wolf died during the big battle for Midgård.
Feffnirsbane Hel if we know how it works.
Which of the Shad's brothers sacrificed their arm to allow him to capture Fenrir?
Shad: "But I do think we're missing something rather significant"
Me: "Go on..."
Shad: "and this is the same thing that is missing from many of the experimental wooden castles that are being built in the modern day"
Me: "Say it."
Shad: "What am I talking about?"
me: _lowers headphones_
Shad: "wood burns"
Me: "wait... what? but what about Machicolations?!"
But what about dragons?
Olav Hansen Machicolations have feelings too people, we can't forget the Machicolations!
Look at the pictures of said modern experimental wooden castles. What do you see?
A severe lack of machicolations.... and you?
Wow, did you even watch the video? Literally *all* of them have machiculations even if not on all of the towers.
Brilliantly done as always Shad, this video has made me re-imagine how castles of the middle ages were constructed and why wooden castles are never "seen" in artwork of the period. It turns out that they were indeed seen, but were not recognised for what they actually were. Bravo my friend!
I've been on a binge of shadiversity for the last few days while playing crusader kings 3. It's a great way to spend a day.
Can we crowdfund Shad to design and oversee the construction of a big beautiful timber castle here in Australia?
In Australia a bush fire will take out that bad boy in one summer
I have one word for ya - termites
He has a small one in his backyard
YES
If you live in australia, have you ever see an medieval castle ? Real question
17:00: You forgot to mention that the large picture window shown on the front would be much more expensive and difficult to make if the top were made out of stone. Wood has decent tensile strength, and a square windows are more natural for wood construction than arched windows.
The amount of effort you put into this, from the information to the 3D buildings is just incredibly impressive. Thank you for this and everything you post - you’ve taught me a lot.
One of my favorite books as a kid was David Macaulay's "Castle". Videos like this bring back some of that same wonder that made me check that book out from the library dozens of times.
Thanks for continually giving me new ideas for D&D campaigns
Obiously wooden castles did not survives because of... DRAGONS... Dragon breathe fire, wood burns; hence, no wooden castles survived.
You clearly are a man of culture.
But what about whitewash? Whitewash doesn't burn.
It all makes sense.
Well, a friend's grandmother said there were no castles in America because they have hurricanes all the time. So, yeah... dragons seems plausible.
palmieres when America was colonised the time of castles was gone, it was more about cabins and general houses. I believe anyways, I don’t have any knowledge on this subject, correct me if wrong.
A truly impenetrable castle would have been built out of stale fruitcake. That stuff could survive a meteorite strike.
DesolatorMagic
Wouldn't resist my munchies tho. Bloody _love_ fruitcake.
*Meteor strike. Meteorite is just a fragment left over from an asteroid, comet, or meteoroid.
@@DinnerForkTongue Even stale fruitcake, presumably rendered and whitewashed on the primary surface to look good?
@@tpotshax8703
You kidding? That makes for the best taste.
Ahh yiss... now we are talking about war! How about loading a catapult with those bad boys? How about a war hammer with a fruitcake head? Feeling really festive? Try out our specially shaped and aged fruitcake ballista bolts?
this is really well-reasoned, thanks for the vid
Shad makes learning fun. Great content as per usual. I've actually got my 13 year old nephew watching your channel now, he loves it.
Everybody looked me like I was a freak when I shouted in the bus route : Machicolatioooooons !
lol, I love it!
@@shadiversity great video
My bus route from Shoreham to Brighton has no Machiolations :( Bodiam castle does. Carisbrooke castle on the Isle of Wight, too. Nice. There a plenty in the UK, too.
Shad, you need to do another collab with your brother where you draw stuff, only this time it has to include dragons, Machicolations, swords, and castles. Or draw something using swords (foam can be substituted for real swords.) at least try and. Do something of the like.
Grounds for divorce, I'd say.
Your architectural videos are my favorite .
That type of construction needs far less nails too! Remember they needed to be made one by one.
That is exactly why wood shingles is rediculusly expensive and not something people would do in medieval times. 20:10
@@TheNorwegianSergeant You don't need a single nail for wooden shingles.
There's a Dutch phrase for being a stingy nitpicker..
Translated it says: "You're searching for nails in shallow waters" which referred to shipbuilders that searched for nails in the docks to avoid any extra costs.
Yeah ... They were scarce and expensive.
And iron was expensive! Maybe they could use pegs? Wooden pegs, that is.
been a fan for years, but i think this is your best video to date. you really have an impressive amount of knowledge in medieval history. keep up the good work mate!
Your videos are getting more and more useful for my role playing game mastering.
Can't thank you enough on the culture side, either.
I actually watch your videos for d&d
no one let's me DM anymore...
@@TomDrake1989 feels bad man
Interesting. But I'm certain a well placed pommel throw could damage it.
In seriousness, this was a video I was secretly hoping you would make. I feel wooden fortifications would have been far more common than stone during the time of the Roman or Greek empire, or with Viking settlements and I've been curious as to how they would do so
This will definitely help my writing. Thank you Sir Shad!
In theory, you could take that down with a pommel. Get it up to relativistic speeds and it can destroy anything short of a black hole.
Thank you for actually putting in the work to do in-depth-videos rather than producing another "simplified history" video!
In Lithuania castles were first built as a stone base with a wooden frame on top. In between the frames were laid horizontal logs keyed into the vertical frame members. The wood was later replaced with brick as seen on Trakia Castle. The stone base remained largely untouched. This construction method was and is still used in houses across the Baltic and Scandinavia particularly Finland.
You actualy might be on to something right now. This solution is both logical and acessable for the time i do think you are right on this one.
But I just wonder, wouldn't the logs rot more easily, when they were coated? I can imagine that there will be a lot of Moisture trapped inside the coating which would speed up the rotting (also the ideal place for fungi or bacteria, because it's moist, dark and warm). Also imagine the pain of checking if the logs inside the wall/coating are still good and then, if they aren't, replacing them.
I like the idea of coated wooden castles, but I think there might be a few problems with it.
But I like the Idea of putting dirt behind the wall. Imagine hacking through the timber and then getting sweept away by a large wave of dirt. It would also be cost effective, which is why, if I recall correcly, they filled the stonewalls of medieval castles with just rocks. That way they could beef the wall up, in a cheap and effective way.
Technically you could check the moisture by simply drills a small hole (entirely possible with the tools of the time) You are somewhat correct about the moister from the rendering but it pretty likely that it dried quickly enough for the moisture content to be low. In any case, the first layer of rendering would most likely of been thin to ensure it dried in good time then I imagine it would have been layered on thick this approach would all but eliminate the problem of moisture :)
Type of wood also is key.some woods are drier than others.
It's interesting to think about: Wooden castles probably looked just like stone castles on the outside.
it's more that I think one could not completly eliminate wetness inside the wall and I believe that even a bit of moisture could be fatal in the long run.
But nobody is arguing that the wall will work better or longer than a wall thats made from stone, so I shouldn't hold it up to that standart. I do however believe that even very dry wood will start to rot in these conditions, because there will be a build up of fungi between the coating and the wood, that will slowly penetrate the wood, thus weakening it. I would assume that the wood on the inside could be rotten to a large extend within under 10 years if the castle is build in a humid enviroment and that constant checking would really be a hustle, at least compaired to a stone wall that will last centuries.
Shad, thanks a thousand for this! I have often wondered about those towers in AoE2 and this may have helped answer the mystery of why those were in the game.
Your speculation has some solid evidence and I think our Castle Experts in Archaeology should investigate this hypothesis!
Since I am earlier than Shad facts, I will do his honors,
Shad fact 7569 B verse 88:
Shad actually has a secret underwater Machicolation production facility, this facility had been passed on from generations till it ended up in shad's hands, the founder of this facility was Charlemagne himself. Shad is plotting ma secret plan to take over the world with millions of Machicolations one day!
This is honestly the best channel on youtube
I always thought of repairing walls as an important factor. Your design would be fairly simple to repair. I think a skeleton for the non dirt wall would help though, instead of relying on the defense face. The dirt reinforced wall would be perfect though, especially if they used something to reinforce the dirt itself. Like they did for the house walls.
Realizing that I watch his channel so much that when he was talking about his other videos I had already seen them all several times
Recently I stumbled on something interesting in an e-book called The Chronicle of Prussia, where the author described how the brothers of the teutonic order built a castle by fortifying an oak tree on the top of a hill and digging a moat around it. There were around 8 soldiers stationed in there. It's a very interesting read and many pages are free to read on google. It was called Thorn
so it creates the question, did medevial children build tree castles insted of tree houses
what
I have a weapon for your Underappreciated Historical Weapons series: The quarter staff.
This came up on your discord when I asked for a weapon to give to my second protagonist of a story I am currently writing.
But how where those used and who used them in which situation. I still going to use it in my story regardless just to show: There are more weapons than: Sword, axe and bow.
Still swords are awsome.
Glory to Arstotzka!
Lindybeige has a video all about the quarter staff. Actually, he has three.
More quarter staff videos are great, but Solo Sulla is right. If you don't feel like waiting, paying, or begging, you can always go to his channel. :-P
watch the Lindybeige's video about spears. That's what it's about!
Very well thought out! One thing I was thinking was that if cost was the primary consideration when deciding whether to build the castle out of wood or stone, then perhaps it would make sense for some nobles to build the keep out of stone and the rest of the castle out of wood. Or perhaps the gatehouse. Picking and choosing very specific spots to use stone to maximum effect, using a cost/benefit analysis.
And now all of a sudden, I'm huge fan of wooden castles! Excellent video!
...now I wanna build myself a castle. THEN we'll see if those pesky kids will dare step on my lawn >:)
"you damn kids get off my property!" *aims long bow*
end up making the most awesome lawn that ALL the kids want to play on
Also in the illumination of the possible wooden castle the dry moat could be to further reduce the risk of the bottom half rotting. Just a thought
Shad, you have continued to justify my Patreon subscription. I'm really impressed by your knowledge (and skill with sketch-up!)
Obviously this comment is two years after the video was originally posted, but I’d say it’s more educated guess than speculation- by saying you’re speculating, you’re underselling yourself, your research, and your expertise. This is a very well done video, and very entertaining to watch as well. I love it
Quick-lime mortar has other properties :
-it's a strong base, so it keeps out mold and parasites that might damage the wall,
-it drains humidity out of the wall, another way to make it more durable
However, it's vulnerable to wind and rain, so you'd want to make the walls vertical instead of inclined, and extend the roofs further to keep rain away
They all burned down, fell over and sank into the swamp. Why? BECAUSE DRAGONS!
But the fourth one stayed up!
Well, of course - the fourth one was built out of stone!
Was waiting for an outraged PROPAH CASTLE.....
Our daddy taught us not to be ashamed of our wood
Especially if it's of such a good size and all
yeah I see that! Your daddy gave you good advice.
This video is the first time I actually got excited about construction methods.
Clickspring.
One issue I see with rendering the outside of a wooden structure is that due to the natural movement of wood the facade may increase maintenance load to prevent fissures.
Inadequately insulated wood also tend to store moisture, adding to the risk of rot and mould expansion within the structure.
If built on a good foundation away from excess moisture and with proper care in construction I do see this design to be a solid and cost effective option especially in areas where importing stone could become unreasonably costly.
Great video, keep it up.
I think this is your best video to date.
That's awesome to hear because it took a lot of work ^_^
Castle videos in general really. Probably because I don´t think any of the big channels do it.
It shows!
Shad's castle videos are definitely his best!
I agree !
Shad, one of the shortcomings of your argumentation is that you overlook that there are reasons beyond wealth why a castle would be made out of wood instead of stone, much like there are reasons why castles and city walls along the North and Baltic Sea coast are often built with brick: When there's no stone to quarry anywhere near, you take what you can get. On a wide, sandy plain, an attacker would not be under any doubt that the castle in front of him was not built out of stone because there'd be no stone to build it with.
It can be transported, though
rasput1n6
Yes, but given the distances often involved, that's not always practical. All the more through soft terrain. The city of Lübeck or the Teutonic Knights certainly weren't poor when they decided to use brick rather than natural stones. But the sheer amount of stones you needed for, be it for a monumental castle or the walls and churches of a city, is just so huge that bringing the stone over long distances would be folly if you have an alternative (clay) that works on location. What they did bring in was brickmaking knowledge from Lombardy, though...
@@ohauss There is however a question why use wood instead of brick if you are short of stone, as brick is much more durable and easier to maintain.
@@mancubwwa Local supply abundance. Clay poor forested regions with no access to quarries have a lot of incentive to build castles out of wood. In addition, a wooden castle can be built with a far lesser degree of skilled labor than brickmaking or laying would require. Cutting and dressing suitable stone for a castle is an even greater skill deficit.
In addition, a wooden castle requires the least degree of maintenance.
@@TheBoldImperator That kind of certainty would require intelligence resources unavailable to medieval armies.
I’m skeptical of covered wood looking so similar to whitewashed stone that it would fool attackers for any length of time. The patterns on the corners and the texture and the bare wood beams and roof shape would give it away, and it would be pretty easy to ask someone who knew beforehand. The preservation and showing off seem more likely. Apart from that, it’s a really great video!
Shad, I know this is an older video but I would like to hear your answer to Alex Middleton, as I thought the same thing when I just watched this video. Especially given that most wars in the period were local, when a Lord was attacked it was most likely by a neighbor or somebody who knew his neighbors. They would undoubtedly know if the lord had built a wooden or a stone castle. What do you think, Shad?
Loved the video!
@@txgunslinger9390 I think the material itself could be extremely convincing. Could be flattened out on a rounded surface not too much problem. Your point about local wars is very good though, the weakness is the likelihood that your enemies already know it’s wood. I imagine there were plenty situations where that wasn’t the case though
This was a fascinating video. Excellent work.
Growing up here in England, we were taught that the first castles built by William were all initially wooden.
They were invading, and BROUGHT defensive structures that were essentially flat-packed IKEA castles.
They would have really just been relatively small enclosures that would offer an area that could be defended whilst clearing nearby woodland
1) to provide a clear space between the castle wall and the edge of the wood/forest.
2) because it's free when you're invading, you're either going to die or become an overlord.
7:39 isn't this observed in US Revolutionary/Civil War era forts? The wood/dirt combination was a fantastic defense against cannon fire.
Even earlier than that. Once cannon balls started being flung a hard stone wall would eventually shatter. A dirt backed one had to be slowly dug out by hitting it with round balls.
Indeed, if you didnt have a quarry near by. If you did, stone would make a better wall with dirt behind and wouldnt rot. Like the Dannevirke fortification from 500 A.D, which was last used in 1864..with some additions and modifications ofc. They had stone in front of the dirt and wooden battlements untop. And if you dig the dirt from in front of the wall, you have a moat. Win-win.
No argument here man. Untreated wood also rots. Rendering it with mortar and whitewash would prevent that from happening.
Not really, good timber will survive 300+ years.
IF it is dried properly to the correct percentage of water weight.
Konrad Eklund its amazing imo, my parents were renovating a timber house that was some 100-150 years old, they had to cut open a wall for a new door, the smell from the cut timber was like they cut fresh wood.
I mean... my grandpa made a small wooden bridge like 70 years ago. My uncle only replaced the wooden planks 3 years ago cuz they got rotten and weak.
(The bridge leads to my uncles inherited farm land and hangs very close to the water
Shad woke me up when he screamed "Machicolation" scared the shit out of me
I've visiting the Kiev rus fort shown in your pictures. It's amazing inside. Most of the fixings are hand made, including the windows.
@Shadiversity I think you overlooked a way in which the logs could have been placed for walls, could they not have placed logs horizontally for walls and had them interlock at corners similar to a log cabin? This would have made it incredibly difficult for an enemy to make isolated attacks against a single log to gain entry
The trouble is, that would work well for towers (square) but not for walls (long segments).
Nothing beats sand castles. So take your morning wood and go home!
Maybe we should start rendering sand castles to make them look like stone ones?
Some walls in Africa and the Middle East were made of sand stone
Amazing...I am interested in environment design and concept design generally (for games and movie industry), I was looking for a good source of information about medieval architecture for a long time to better understand it so I can design something what looks more functional and believable... finally I found you few days ago! Great work, I really appreciate your effort
Ye gads, I love this channel...
Excellent points, all, sir!
(And I can tell you this: Even if it's not 100% perfect in historical accuracy, I am most *definitely* using this methodology as part of my home-brewed world's games!! You will be credited, excitedly, in all references to this application.) >; )
Principal: your son is being bullied
Me: he needs a sword
Principal: what no that would...
Me: *pulls out a sword*
Principal: woah hold on i don’t want any problems
Me: *to son* see what i mean
I'm really glad you've talked about wooden castles, here and in a previous video. I didn't even know they were a thing until I started following your channel. I knew about wooden forts, since those were used in the frontier days in the US, but not castles. Thanks for the video!
Dang, you're good with that 3D program.
One of the few times you tube recommend me something wholesome. Very interesting video and channel!
Another indication that the superstructure of the castle at 16: 48 is wooden, is the width of the window with the two ladies. A flat stone beam cannot withstand such a horizontal span.
Hi, great video!
I got at least 3 comments that might give even more credence to your theories:
-First off, that technique of having two wooden walls and then putting in packed dirt in between has been around since roman times(if not earlier)! It's basically what they used to make fortified camps on the frontier (atleast here in germany). They would basically dig up a "moat" and pack the dirt inbetween some wooden walls they build behind it. put a wooden top on it and you got yourself walkways to work with.
-Secondly, packed dirt actually should have some advantages as opposed to stone ones. In one of your previous videos you mentioned that those smooth castlewalls were only smooth on the outside with rough stone packed in between that were mortared up to hold together. That means that ture the individual stones are far stronger then packed dirt but if one gets shacken loose you will lose chunk from the wall that has been supposeting the remainder..... with packed earth that doesnt really work that way, so long as you dont loose the back wall the only thing that could happen is the earth sagging some (if it isnt build from quicksand XD ) (and if you got the material you could build the whole inner part out of clay .... but then you would probably build a brig castle)
-The Third point is that dirt is CHEAP so long as you have the work force you could make the walls massive! Heck you could simply multilayer them. You're wall isnt thick enough, why not put another one around it? lay some logs in between to keep the dirt from shifting to much and the dirt would mostly protect the wood from the weather. Good luck getting through that 10m thick wall.
Now a point where I dont fully agree: The Keep
True laying the wood like log cabin would work for the towers but you would need lots of massively tall trees to build a keep, since the ground space would be limited by the size of the trees you can harvest. True the same could (and you have) be said about putting in the logs vertically only in hight. So I would propose a mixture of the two techniques to get the maximum of both.
Build a shell of vertical logs, lay interlocking logs behind it, not interlocking from corner to corner but piecing it together like they did for the stone walls, maybe fill the empty spaces with dirt and use the whole layer as the anchor and foundation for the one above it.
Basically making the whole keep into a giant puzzle. It would be a difficult job, but since it is the keep it would probably be a good investment.
Granted this is all speculation on my part.
Agree. The keep you describe is like the medieval stave churches we have in Norway. This one is in my town: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gol_Stave_Church
DO NOT watch this video at 2am. Or else your apartment neighbours will call and ask if you are alright and about what you were yelling. Try to explain "Machicolations" to them. Go ahead and see if you don't get carted off to the funny farm! (personal experience)