Me too, I had it on good authority. Some church people are only concerned with getting to heaven. Never mind about all that help your fellow man stuff. Some are not even friendly.
Good for you. It took me over 20 years before I finally had to leave. The gossip in church is horrendous. What makes it worse is that they disguise it under the topic of 'prayer requests'.
I didn’t become a Christian until I was 68. I thought the church women were so great. I thought finally I had found some truly nice people. Wow! Nice people on the surface can hurt you the most.
So true! My religious experience growing up was so traumatizing because of how nasty some church people were. They would shame you if you aren't active in the church or have mental health issues. But would turn a blind eye to abusers in the church. I haven't been back to church in 15 years. I do still believe in God but I just don't trust people in the church.
Even though I am not a mom and still single, I grew up in church since birth, and let me tell you, every single word you said is SPOT ON, even for the young people and children. So many groups based on popularity. As an adult now, and having gone through so many rejections because I was so unattractive, I now care more about getting closer to God and hearing His voice, than about the people and their groups. I've had moments when I would weep and ask God why He never gave me any friends or boyfriend, and He spoke very clearly to me and told me it was so that I would draw closer to Him. I'm grateful for that, even though life was so painful for me. Jesus is the only one who will NEVER abandon us or betray us, EVER!!!
Or like me, by not having a great career. People don't even speak with you if you are not influential. I am a made, that it was heartbreaking to learn you only is good to clean the church, but not be invited for other functions at people's house. Coming from church folks was embarrassing. Life moves on, but it is hard, though.
I’m so sorry you experienced this. May I challenge your reason for being rejected? Was it really bc you were “unattractive”? How do you know this is true? So all “unattractive” ppl are socially rejected, and all attractive ppl are accepted? Sometimes we tell ourselves stories that may not completely be true.❤️🩹
@Runner8617 Amen @Runner8617 I've only been to a couple for long periods of time though. One very large. I loved it because the presence of God wad so strong there. I've grown & do hear him on my own. But a corporate anointing is awesome! As far as friends. I have 1 good friend who has many herself. So I don't get alot of time there. But that's ok. Like you, God wants me alone at this time in my life as well. I also have a mentor, God is very prophetic thru her & I get alot of wisdom from her wkly teachings. I would nit have gotten this far without her. God is good. If you ask him for friends but the right ppl. He will eventually put them in your life. We are bot ment to be alone for ever. We are the body. He made us to work together, sit together & eat together. I know after your experience the thought must not sound good. He will heal your past & give you the right friends! God bless
Hi Runner? ❤ It can be really hard when people are repeatedly not kind 😢😭😡 Maybe you could try out the idea that the way they choose to behave towards you says more about their character than yours? ie it's their personalities that are so unattractive? All the best ❤️ Love Theresa
Well.... as they say " you can park yourself in the garage, but that doesn't make you a car." I quit going to church quite a few years ago. We are living in end times when the church is totally compromised and has let the world come into it. I had so many negative experiences in church and with fellow women and even leaders that I had enough. My faith is in CHRIST and NOT the church. My husband and I do Bible study every Sunday together, watch sermons online and pray together. That is fine with me! By the way, we are both 65!
I’ve been know to say, “Sometimes the worst advertisement for Christianity is the so-called Christians themselves!” However, I’d never “throw the baby out with the bath water,” because I realize many use church more as a social club, than a place to learn, grow, and mature to be more like Jesus, the ultimate “best friend” who won’t let us down. You are the type of person that I’d totally gravitate to in a group, not the “popular girls.” Thanks for being transparent and vulnerable by sharing your life stories. I’d rather have one or two loyal friends than a group of superficial women. Just keep being your authentic self! 🥰
I'm 70 now, and have participated in all sorts of girl groups throughout my life, some good some bad--with church "friends" being the most disappointing. Fortunately, my husband is my best friend. 😍
All of my 66 years I have been involved in different churches. We moved a lot both growing up and during my married life. So I have much to say about this topic and many sad stories similar to yours. Primarily, I haven't quit going to church, but I DON'T attend any women's group. I will not participate in malicious gossip (prayer request time), listening to the boasting (latest trips, purchases, children's achievements, etc...), fitness activities, denigrating husbands...on and on. Gee, no difference than "worldly" views and behaviors. No thanks, I deal with enough at work. Oh, one other thing, the competitiveness in appearance.
I have a very similar story. I agree. I was a Christian teachers daughter and we moved a lot. I go to church but don’t get involved because of the clique culture, it is not for me.
Wow, this is sad. In a strange way I kind of hoped I was just too weird for church women’s groups, and that other people had better experiences. I now see that my experience is not unique. I never had problems making friends in school but never at church. The only place I was ever bullied was church. Like you, I still go to church but I stopped going to women’s groups decades ago-especially if it was a church we really liked. I didn’t want to spoil it.
@@lindaburns9762 Unfortunately women's groups not bad if it works out for you. I go to a big church and everyone's spiritual level is different. So I feel like there's not a good conversation because everybody's theological knowledge and spiritual knowledge are different. In a way, if you are in the small or medium church, they all have same beliefs. I never thought much about it until now.
I live in a Moslem country as an American Christian-born woman, I find the women open, warm, giving, helpful, and ready to be your friend. Very inclusive. I think it’s the way our culture with its competitive and individualistic bent ruins chances for real friends. Your value only goes as far as what others can get from you. We need to change the culture.
Can’t imagine exchanging my experience of individualism for a non-competitive country. Bet that nation does not have a Peace Corps or agency like USAID by which we aid, heal, teach, and feed the world. Right? Competitive individualism built those. Americans may wonder about friends, but we’ve also made disease, hunger, and ignorance our enemies and competed the hell out of those. If the cost for being who we are collectively makes personal friendship an issue, so be it. Had we not embarked on this path of individualism, neither that Moslem country nor our world at large would be where we are today. We’d all still be lighting candles and carrying water on our heads and burying our children before they’re five. So, yeah. I can stand a lifetime with few, well-chosen friends for the sake of a competitive, individualistic spirit that has changed the world.
Growing up it was a must to go to church every Sunday, and I waited silently to be over 18 . And as soon as I turned 19 I stopped going to church because my parents behaviour at home didn't match with the way how they behaved outside the home. I pray a lot for myself .
Thank you for posting this Amy. I try so hard not to be bitter, and listening to others talk about their horrible experiences in church sometimes upsets me so much I feel shaky. I no longer go to church and after 20 years, still have terrible memories of some of the things I went through while there. However I have had to admit to myself that a lot of the treatment I received was because I was too naive and trusting and too open with my feelings. I am more guarded now.
Don't blame yourself for being a nice person. I know, because I am the same way. I have to consciously reel back my politeness/ generosity/ overall niceness. It's a very weird world for sure.
This is so sad to hear. What I used to think was “real church” was not real at all. And learning to survive in church is learning to be superficial. We learn to say we are genuine, we hear sermons about it, but we are corrected for being it. Here’s a hug and a cup of coffee ☕️ I like to think when we get to heaven it will be that simple.
Ever since I can remember I was part of a church community. My parents found wonderful friends within the church; most of their friends were found by volunteering within the church. They were part of the council, the prayer chain, and often helped with communion clean up, counting the offerings, Easter breakfast etc. If we were not at church we had people calling to see if we were okay. By doing all the above they found people with similar interests. It was a smaller church too. Then I got married, joined a large church that had a school where I enrolled our kids. I became friends with some of the moms, but really the only thing we had in common were the kids. I didn’t find true friendships there. Now I am 63 years old and am planning on again volunteering at the church. We shall see how it goes. I had two good friends die of cancer, and my other “best friend” has 5 kids and is very involved with her grandkids. After Covid I have found people to be very selfish. I think that is what isolation does. We need more compassion and compromise in this world. Don’t give up on God. Just because people are at church doesn’t mean they are better. We are all sinners. Have faith!
At 56 years of age, my life experience has shown me that no matter what you do or look like, other women get threatened and competitive. Women are grown-up mean girls. I flat out refuse to engage in that dynamic. I'm my own best friend. I have friends that are more surface level. I won't open up to another human ever again. People always have an agenda. If they can gain something from me, then they pretend to accept me. Not going to play on that low vibe level.
Once you leave a church most people shun you. Sad, but true. Lots of clicks in a church family. I’ve never fit in a click, praise God for that! My click is my immediate family.
I have serious health issues - in a small village My husband and I had garden parties, dinners and I was very outgoing. I also had to give up a Christian course because I became too ill. Haven’t heard a word of concern or interest from any of them.
Thank you for your refreshing honesty. You are a treasure- and remember that great women are fine being alone, and they certainly don’t run in groups. One or two good friends is enough, even if they live far away. The rest are acquaintances.
Narcissism and lack of compassion can lead to exclusion. Many of these people don’t care or know what they’re doing- just going after what satisfies them.
I saw your title and had to click on this to see your point of view. I believe in Jesus and I don’t go to church. I personally struggle with church people a good amount of the time. Not all are so terrible but I often felt weirdly judged. You tackle some serious topics on your channel. I admire your bravery. You get a lot of people chatting in comments and this is exciting. I’ve experienced this clicky part. So sad. You know your Bible too. This is why I love Jesus because he was welcoming to ALL and some churches seem to forget this. Let’s keep being US. Thanks for candid talk Amy❤
I used to play guitar in the church band for years and didn't have any close friends. When I felt God telling me to leave that church, no one tried to contact me after I left. Used up and spat out. The story that I think of is Noah and his family. They were the only people that got on the ark. They only had each other. We are living in the last days. Jesus is coming back soon. Matt 24:37-40. God bless you ❤
Yes! Sad truth. I can validate what you’re saying. The climate in the church has changed. I also see it as climbing on the ark, “Go my people into your Chambers and shut the doors behind you.” Isaiah 20, is it? Hearts have grown cold. No fruit, only the language remains. God help us.
@@meleshenko3767 Oh wow, that's a good verse too. It really does feel like that. Although we want fellowship.. at what cost. I think at the end of the day, it's mostly the Pastors fault. If they are not teaching and preaching the whole counsel of God, then people in the church are not going to feel convicted of their sins. They need to preach things people don't want to hear. Not just about money and getting rich in this life.
@@rockclimberErin Spot on!! It feels strange, but it’s the sifting. There are so many of us out here. Just pray for others to wake up. God’s blessings to you, friend.
You just described my mother to the T. She thinks she's saved, sanctified, and Holy because she's active in church. Yet she also thinks it absolves her of accountability for being nasty and shady towards people.
To be happy with others you have to be happy with yourself. When I was young I had one or two close friends, I was never involved in cliques. I lived single for 10 years before being married. I love solitude and I learned how to be happy on my own. We have four children, I homeschool them. I have never felt lonely for friends. I met friends who homeschooled but a lot of socializing can become a distraction to getting work done. We attend Church weekly, I have friends I talk to sometimes, but I absolutely do not need Moms' groups. Honestly I feel like they're a waste of time. I'd rather spend time in prayer, walk, listen to music and spend time with my family.
I am in my mid sixties now. Since I was a young child I have attended various churches here and there. I was molested by a lay minister while I was underage. Ive been told I had a demon in me (probably because of my red hair - yeah, that was the thought of one preacher). He wanted to put on a show for the congregants and "exercise the demon out of me". He whispered in my ear to fall backwards into the arms of a man when he touched my forehead! I did not comply. Most recently was when the adults were asked to help make the desert scenery for the Bible school skit. A lot of the ladies painted paper Agave plants and other such items. I used different shades of green to make it look real. I received several compliments on my artistry. One woman whom I thought was my friend apparently became jealous and began loudly putting me down. I was hurt, and finished my one agave plant, and left, never to return again. She never apologized or attempted contact again. I dont know why she attacked me. Who needs church or friends like that?
That was very unfortunate and rude AND weird. We all know that there is a lit of mental illness out there. That person is a prime example of that. Please do not allow that unimportant perdon ruin it for you.
Wow, that’s painful to hear. And you managed to keep your faith? I hope so, friend. The agenda against us is not Christ’s. Bottom line: he’s still nice! But the church is dangerously messed up and not getting better. I’m so so sorry. Hugs
I once heard, "Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any more than standing in a garage makes you a car." I don't know who first said it. Those people are there for show, but the veneer has worn thin and most of us see through them now.
People don't go to church, Christians are the Church. Your analogy needs a bit of tweaking, therefore. Attending a Christan congregation is rather like opening a garage, only to find it filled with junk. Sometimes you might find the odd car is some of them, but mostly not. The true Christian congregation would need to look more like a dealer's showroom - full of cars and nothing else, but more often than not, these days, the cars that form the church are scattered all about, some parked on roadsides, some in car parks, some in parking bays at home.
I an 57 with a past full of “friendship” created hurts. I’m pretty much at the point where I have no friends for the past ten or so years. I’ve made peace with it and am actually happier and more at peace doing my own thing. My husband, however says that we are lacking community, and we need to find a church so we can “develop relationships” with other believers. While I understand the principle of this, I find that I no longer want to put in the effort to develop friendships, even on a superficial level. It’s all just too much work! We will be moving soon to a new state and his hope is that we will find a neighborhood and a church where we can do things with other people and make friends. I only see this as another potential source of drama and hurt. I’m not sure how to balance my needs with his needs and hopes. Maybe you can talk about the differences in friendship needs in spousal or S/O relationships and how to navigate those differences.
This day and time I see most church friendships as superficial like you said. And even in smaller churches where they claim to not have cliques, they do. Church isn’t the same. Years ago in the 80s/90s, while there were some smaller cliques, but not to the point of totally excluding anyone, most people at the church we attended were extremely close. I still have some good friends from that time period but we don’t get to spend time together in person very often. As a 65 year old who is raising 2 adopted grandkids (one from 6 months and the other from birth) (they are now 12 and 14) I feel very lonely as I don’t have in person connections. I miss that.
I’m so sorry this happened to you, I totally understand because I share your story ❤Thanks for sharing and being so honest, we all need a friend like you!
This is what I dealt with. Especially now that I am single, it’s even worse. You go completely unnoticed. Churches are suited for married people with kids. Not singles.
I agree. When I was in high school, my church was all over me and acting like I hung the moon…even thru my college years. But the day I graduated college and came home, a switch flipped because I wasn’t able to find a great paying job and struggling being poor…and I didn’t date or get married so whenever I stopped by the church on a weekday, they started basically telling me to get lost (I was lonely and wanting human connection and struggling with severe depression). One elder’s wife who was all over me in my high school days wrote me a letter telling me I just needed Jebus and that I need to go fix things with abusive family that I stay away from because they didn’t want to be bothered by me. This same elder took me aside after Wed evening service and told me for an hour that I’m the unloved woman in proverbs and that I cause problems wherever I go and that I don’t need any friends, I just need Jebus. That was the last time I ever set foot in a church again. I don’t even really believe in religion anymore since it’s for those who are coupled up or married with kids.
@ wow that’s just messed up! They groom you to be a baby maker and servant to a man. That’s so wrong and anti biblical. I’m sorry that happened to you. I’m so fed up with it myself.
@ and that is what I find stupid! Just because I’m single doesn’t mean that I have to be paired up! What if I just want friends? Such discrimination to form singles groups because you need to be put into a category.
I enjoyed you video. I have had similar experiences. I am a quiet person and I dislike cliques and gossip. I like to help out but not engage in gossip and competition. I find it a sort of bullying. In my fifties I’ve found that it’s better to be a loner than to always wonder who’s talking about you behind your back and other nonsense. I’m just over that high school stuff! Thinks for the video.
Same here...gossiping & spreading malicious rumors is so destructive to the person who is not present to defend him/herself...better to exclude yourself from THAT club...PEACE rules. 🌻☮️
Growing up in the Bible Belt , I learned some words that raise flags ( after attending w/ an open heart): non-denominational, a little bible study, fellowship etc. Once in, there are pecking orders, negative gossip, judgment & cliques. . Like many older women, who comment on your channel, I have found peace through controlling my space.& time. It’s great you’ve tried! When you have children, it’s natural to wish a community for them, and extend yourself toward that end.
Thank you so much for talking about this issue as this is sadly in all churches. I've recently stepped right back from a church and now I'm just reflecting and contemplating at the moment. I still have my faith in Jesus and funnily enough, I've got to know Him far better by listening to an audio Bible app at home than I ever did in that church. Will I go back to that church? No! At least not for now if ever! Will I consider another church? I'm looking at another church at the moment...
Church friends will drop you like a hott potato, if you stop going to Church. I stayed at this church for 20 years even though I had problems. I told my friends I was leaving and I hope we can still be close. I live in a very small town takes 10 minutes to drive to each others houses. They said we will always be friends. Didn’t happen.😢
I'm in my early 60's now and can look back at multiple churches and women's groups I tried to penetrate throughout the years. In my 20's I learned the hard way that I needed to lower my expectations of Christians - male and female. I was high maintenance back then and assumed they would accept me anyway because Christians were supposed to accept people. They didn't. I learned that great friendships take time to develop. Unfortunately, the dynamics between Christian women can create a false intimacy since the context is personal growth, and a lot of sharing is encouraged. Friendships are rushed in that context and don't get rooted in the right soil. I think good soil is your willingness to open yourself in increments over time, but there's also an element of mystery in the people we choose. Sometimes she's just the right one for reasons you can't explain. Accept her and the season she's in. Support her. Be her safe place. If she's the right one, she'll put roots down in that same soil. If she doesn't, she's not your friend.
I grew up Evangelical and always attended church with my family as a kid, grew up, went to bible college and continued participating in my local church until age 40 when I stopped going and haven't been back since (almost 9 years ago). I'm single with no kids and I don't think a lot of churches are welcoming to people like me. They seem to cater to families. I got tired of feeling alone in a room full of people so I just left and maintain my own private study and worship. I consider myself part of the global church but don't feel like I belong anywhere locally. 😢
I had a similar experience when I was younger. Churches want the traditional family. As a single person, they do not really recognize you nor welcome you into the congregation…
At one point in my life when I was a church goer, It struck me how judgmental I was being about something, and I was appalled at myself. I felt quite bad about it. I think I had learned what I had been indoctrinated to believe, and it rubbed off on my attitudes... I didn't like that either. Now, I kept going to church for quite some time after that, and what finally did me in at a rather large church in Redmond, Washington was feeling like a number there. I went to one of their little booths one Sunday to ask about volunteering and I must have stood there for five minutes without being addressed. Needless to say I never went back. I don't go to church anymore because I haven't learned anything new or different that nurtures me in any significant way. I'm tired of the same old message,and I feel like I had to retrain my thinking on certain things that I think the church ruined for me. I agree with others here that if your single with no kids your not really there? Like... what's wrong with you. I have found healthier connections elsewhere.
I’m at the point where I’ve just given up on meeting people through church. It’s just such a self righteous environment with leaders that are usually on a power trip. It’s the farthest thing from being spiritual.
I recently discovered your channel and I enjoy your posts so very much! You have an excellent personality and approach. I find myself saying 'YES!!! That is it exactly. Amy is 100 percent on target!" I find your posts to be grounded, sincere, relatable, and authentic. I wish you continued success, Amy.
The Episcopal Church I went to in Portland Oregon was too much manipulation and control behaviors so I didn’t care that they rejected me. The men were nasty and so were the women except for one lady that I liked and she was very kind to me. I’ve been the target of a narcissist who claimed to be my friend only for me to find out what he was doing what’s called character assassination in regards to me. Everything that’s said about what these evil people do is absolutely on point. I had everything done to me including my little dog getting emotionally and physically abused. She passed away a couple years ago and I’m still dealing with it. As for the narcissists that were in my life I moved away went no contact and blocked. Best thing to ever happen. I'm on my healing journey now and it's one day at a time.
My mother passed away a few years ago, and I had so much trouble with her church folk. They had used her, put her under pressure for doing things for the church she didn't like. They had interfered so much in the funeral it was crazy and felt so self-righteous. I am not in a church and will not attend. I believe in god, and I don't need the kind of people around me.
By the fruit we will know them. We protect our eyes and ears from these UN-Christ like behaviors. We let our own words praise Him and in doing so it shines a light into the darkness. Darkness does not like the light and obviously these ladies are in darkness and probably not even aware of it. Bless you, Carol 🙏
Oh man, I talk about this with my husband all time. We don’t go to church because I don’t find the people “genuinely friendly “. These same people will see you at the grocery store and not wave. Sunday morning they act like you hung the moon.
@kash7585 That is how my prayer life deepened, I focused on our Lord and prayed for them. Difficult, yes. Lonely, yes. The Church is filled with those with sickness of the soul.
I can relate to what you are saying. When I experienced this behavior myself, I complained to another woman in the church. She responded by telling me that people are like that because when they are in church they are more friendly because they are 'under the anointing''. How ridiculous.
Superficial friendships are underrated. I actually think they are healthier, and what I am seeking from this point on. In the past, people had larger families with siblings and cousins they could confide in and lean on for support. Now, we have to seek those things outside the home, but it just isn't natural.
I went to a church that was very much like that group. I went for a whole year, and my husband said the same thing "why do you go? You come home so miserable?" And I realised that after a whole year I didn't really have any connections to anyone and I felt like an alien 👽. The congregation was full of doctors and lawyers etc and I was a middle class woman who was married, but my husband isn't a Christian so I guess they assumed I was a single person as well. It was awful. I left there and went to a small country church about 20mins away and it feels so comfortable and it has a great sense of community. Night and day difference! It baffles me how uncaring/cliquey some churches can be. It's like an exclusive club which is not how it's meant to be.
That wasn't a christian group. That was a "networking" hive. We have those big churches here and it's where the upper crust go to network; boost each others kids up the corporate ladder; find jobs; find employees and locate the best housekeeper. 😅😅
And the more devoted, the more committed they are to that church, the more vicious they can be. If you want a group, look for one where you can give and steadfastly ignore what you do or don’t receive back-like President Carter building houses in Habitat for Humanity. Stacking cans and boxes in the food bank is great. They never talk back.
Yep! I took a small job, retail. Customers come in and they go out. I have a few minutes to connect, plant seeds of Gospel maybe follow them outside and pray on the sidewalk. But, sad to say, so that I can stay at arms length from people. And they are secular people for the most part. Safe.
@@meleshenko3767 I believe it's insulting for you to tell a captive audience--a customer--that they are lacking something you, with your "small job" have. If I were you, I would be kind to everyone, offer them extra assistance if your boss allows, work extremely hard at your job, and wear a small cross, barely visible, around your neck. In other words, live it, don't TALK it. And the praying outside where the public can see you will not help you spread Christianity, in my opinion. Live it.
@@meleshenko3767 Helping that lady with the house sounds like God's work. "Planting the seed" in the few moments someone is in the store and then praying for them publicly sounds like you working for you. Also "my boss called 200 former customers" to decide whether I should keep my job. And my boss's business has grown since he decided to keep me on. Wow!! Matthew 6:5-8 Jesus' Teaching on Prayer 5 "And when you pray, you shall not be like the hypocrites. For they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the corners of the streets, that they may be seen by men. Assuredly, I say to you, they have their reward. 6 But you, when you pray, go into your room, and when you have shut your door, pray to your Father who is in the secret place; and your Father who sees in secret will reward you openly. 7 And when you pray, do not use vain repetitions as the heathen do. For they think that they will be heard for their many words. 8 Therefore do not be like them. For your Father knows the things you have need of before you ask Him.
"All the sinners are in the pews " another Rev. Sam McPeek wisdom gem. We actually quit our last church because the minister suddenly died and several "chiefs/queen bees " thought that they were in charge. One Q.B. abusive narcissistic person started in on me after volunteering for a free food pastry, she lied and was gossipy, and influenced others in the church negativity towards me. 😮. Eventually a new minister arrived at the church and I wrote a kindly letter, without naming names (But positively promoting the honest parishioners) explaining why I/my family were leaving. 😢
I'm so sorry you had that experience. I am a pastor's wife and it breaks my heart that you had to go through this. I as a pastor's wife do not have hardly any friends either. I tend to stay guarded to reduce heartache.
I have friends (up north) that are both pastors and pastor's wives. It's a unique situation. You never know who you can truly trust. I'm glad you found my channel.
I'm 52, raised in the "church", and quite a few of my birth family members are ministers (the men are, women teach women& kids). So I'm well versed on this subject, and have seen first hand repeatedly how vicious, and ugly supposed women of God can be, and ARE. They're no better than non believers, and it's truly disgusting. I left the "church" many yrs ago, for many reasons, and haven't been back, no interest. Why bother. The majority are self righteous and judgmental, as you described. It's really sad. No wonder non believers don't trust us, or want to be part of us, when we don't, and many times can't, be in that toxic environment. I think it may be a good idea to just start our own small womens groups where ACTIONS are highly regarded, and not just talking the Christian talk. I wish I lived closer to you. You seem like a sweet, genuine, kind person, worthy of healthy Christian women friends.
I am Christian, a Catholic, and I will tell you that I got involved. I was a Catechism teacher for 5th grade, a Eucharistic minister, a lector, the teen youth group, helped with the decorations committee, and finally, I got involved in the music ministry. This is where I found my people. But the more I was involved the more people I met in a 1500 family parish and they knew me, it felt more like home. I’m not sure why you kept getting involved in “mom” groups. Now, I don’t know evangelical churches except that they are more entertainment and Bible teaching, mostly gospel or New Testament teaching. But, I have been in a Lutheran Bible group that was clickish. It wasn’t for me. I never bad mouthed them or gossiped about them though. In the Catholic Church I didn’t experience this. I found that I made the most friends in music ministry because I was a singer and I’m a flutist and harpist, so being a musician was something I had in common. We would go out to dinner after mass, and we hung out together making music. I think the best way to find friends is to get involved in volunteering until you find your niche. But one thing I will say is that I see a pattern of negativity and gossip about these people. If they find you on;one that will hurt your chances at making friends as well.
I knew this Christian woman for ten years and we were friends.All the hallmarks of toxicity was there. She would never come to me, I would have to come to her. The friendship ended when I met someone and was ready to settle down. She invited me over to her place, as she had just given birth. (she moved to a different state) and I bought my new then “boyfriend” along and she made him sleep in the living room because, we weren’t married, so we couldn’t stay in the same room. Given, this woman used to date older men for money (Please note, the last statement is not meant to sound jaded) it is what it is. This is my experience with Christian women
God doesn't need tithes. God respects those who make decisions on their own, even if it means they must learn from their mistakes. God is everywhere in our daily lives. He is within us, a true guiding hand, and being within us we should be our own best friend. Be open to his love, and you will love yourself. Respect him and respect yourself.❤
Really enjoying your videos- they were just randomly suggested by YT on a morning home with my kiddos today. I have to say, between this video and the mom groups one, we may have the same life 😂 I went into Christian circles feeling so confident and expectant that I’d be forming lifelong bonds of sisterhood- only to find they have been more disappointing than my secular friendship experiences! I give up. I can’t crack the friendship code. Just living for Him and open to whatever He has for me….
Facebook has RUINED going to church. The Noise in churches makes it almost impossible to hear the sermon. People used to take their babies to the nursery so that the congregation could hear the sermon it is just not the same church going experience as 50 yrs ago. The church auditorium or sanctuary as is referred to by some used to be a place you could go before church started and meditate on God's word and no one was talking it was Quite. If someone had to talk they stood outside or in the foyer or the nursery. We have a fellowship hall where if you have to talk you should go there to have your conversations. Worship Service is to give Worship to the most high God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit. People have made church a social Social Gathering instead if a Worship Service. Jesus is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow. People have changed things, but God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit have not. How are the Spiritually sick supposed to be fed if you can't hear the Sermon due to all the Noise?
Thanks for sharing this Amy, I’m an atheist myself but yeah the one thing I don’t get about religious people is their lack of empathy kindness and compassion towards others, not all of course, but you’ve only to see what its doing to your country especially they way things are going at the moment, anyway it’s very sad, love your videos 👍Eileen from Ireland 🇮🇪💚💚💚💚
I have been to many different churches and womens groups. I went there to find a safe community to be a part of. I was really surprised to find so many narcissists, jezebels and noone spoke about Jesus. I dont go to church or church groups anymore.
I do attend church. I found a new church and am happy there. It did take awhile to find the right church. I encountered some toxic churches until I found my current church.
I knew a family where the parents went to church every sunday without fail.... they show their niceness to the outside world but behind closed doors at their home, its a totally different story... most of us found this out, they are also very judgemental...
❤New sub❤ i'm not a really religious person, but even when I did go I never found God in church found him in the people. And the situations you find yourself in.
I learnt about 'church people ' mostly Born Again Christians btw. I am an Anglican so its not like I'm jaded against Christians. I run a business and I was opening my first Shop. I sent out an invite to just a few people, 2 of them were Born again Christians. It really shocked me that the other non Christians did come to support my venture, but these 2 'supportive' Christians did not bother to turn up, after telling me they would!
I choose not to be in a religion so much as I choose to be spiritual. I was baptized catholic, receiving most of the churches sacraments, the last being marriage. I had chosen to excommunicate myself from the church and, frankly, all organized religion simply out of disillusionment. I find “religious” people to be most judgmental and hypocritical than agnostics and atheists. And, as I matured, I discovered marriage, in the traditional sense, no longer resonated with my core values. I learned to respect myself and in doing so am learning how to love myself..I said “learning” because I’m still trying to understand it without feeling arrogant. Today, I find joy knowing the spirit inside me wants what is best for each of us, as individuals. I learn so much more about people when there are no religious barriers. Thank you for listening. ~Nine
I totally agree. "Religous ppl" are like pharisees. They can relight the Bible & know the traditions. Buy aren't really Christian. Being Christian "christ like" you truly get transformed by God & want to serve him & become obedient to God. Walk in the steps he has for you. I have just a few very close woman from my church as well. But I didn't go to church looking for friends. I was seeking the lord. When you seek God 1st & pray for the right ppl to be put in your life! He is faithful and will do that. God is so good! Not ppl. Without God we are all messes up!
I agree about 'religious' people being really judgmental and hypocritical, much more so than agnostics. I"m spiritual also. I agree, I learn a lot about people and enjoy being with people when religion or their Bible doesn't come up. I don't especially like being around most Christians.
Yep! This is why I worship on my own. I love people but I am incapable of having superficial relationships. And many people are not authentic in their walk. The best connection I ever had with people was in celebrate recovery. People were in a rock bottom place in their lives, felt like outcasts in society and in their lives, fighting some sort of addiction or struggle and admitting this and they were raw and vulnerable and honest. I loved hearing their testimonies and felt uplifted by that. Try a CR women’s group. That to me is true church.
This is a great topic. I left a church that didn’t care about the poor or widows, and I run into some of the women and they give me dirty looks. Most have been women who do not have Christian love.
As a pastor's wife, I was taught and learned very early not to have friends in the congregation. It was wise advice on many levels. I am everyone's friend and confidant, but Jesus is mine. I enjoy being a pastor's wife much more this way.
I enjoyed your talk. I too feel disconnected from the people that I worship with. I really love our priest, who lives his gospel not just preaches it. I go to church to hear the word preached and interpreted. It reinforces my faith.
Ouch. I am a Christian and it hurts me to read of all these negative experiences on this thread. Please don't give up on learning & practicing your faith. Keep Church shopping until you find one that you are confortable in. Don't give up. No Church is perfect as it is filled with fallen men & women, ourselves included.
The people you were talking to probably already know that. We know to keep trying. We know to hold out hope for God’s people. We know that no one is perfect. I have been involved in the church 40 years, but for the last 20, I’ve lived in a city, where I am absolutely unable to find one. They are so unfriendly, no exaggeration! I look for the kindest, most loving spiritual group - only to find out it’s a façade. They have, for instance, a small group, that studies, Israel, and I ask “may I attend“ and the person looks across the room to another person, they both look me up and down and judge me and the answer is “no.“ No explanation no reason. They all ask for your phone number the first time you go and no one ever calls. I am sadly convinced they simply want to know what neighborhood you live in, how you have money, how much do you have, what can you do for the church. No one ever cares if you have a need, or you’re lonely. And the truth is my friend, in the last days, the hearts of many will grow cold. And there are actually places in the world where no good group can be found. There’s a church on every corner so to speak, and they know how to dress the part, and talk the part, but there is no fruit. I’ve given so much grace and wiggle room. But I honestly will not go anymore. I have searched this town from one end to the other. I had a breakdown not long ago, crippling, anxiety, and depression. There was no one to call. So I went to a doctor and she asked me “what about going to church“ and I just said “church people are mean.” This doctor was an unbeliever, but she laughed, and she sat with me and watched my blood pressure for two hours. Debating whether to send me to the hospital. I had a two hour panic attack which isn’t even possible according to some. But I lived like that for three years. And that doctor was the kindest person I have met in the city. I have found that secular people are kinder than church people anymore. How sad is that? Come Lord Jesus.
Have you ever been through a divorce while in church? Are you very physically attractive? Things like this make it very hard for people in church to befriend you.
Why do so many Christians want to validate their sinful behavior and the terrible way they treat people with “nobody’s perfect” and “we are all just fallen”. That’s that Christianese you have been taught to tell people who you’ve hurt and been awful to. Own up to your sin instead of making a damn excuse! Disgusting!!
In a prayer meeting a fellow believer mentioned that despite how I look (he thought I was ugly) he still loves me. I've learned that some Christians have a certain 'edge' to their behavior that I've had to guard against. But that's true with people in general. We're a fallen race.
My experience with church women, simple I rarely do. As Christian women this is how our relationships should be prioritized: God, husband, children, family (I would include strong like minded Christians in this category), and friends. Sadly, too many Christians fall into the trap of worldview of which relationships are more important.
I was a soloist for several years in church. Then a new music minister arrived and told me he didn’t need me but I could join the choir if I wanted to. 🙄 I quit the entire church because he was a phony. His wife couldn’t sing but they replaced me with her. After 1 1/2 years he was fired. Doesn’t take me long to discern a nasty person.
I was thinking of going to a church group...glad i am watching this video... no matter if you go to church or not...we should always treat others The way we want to be treated...my mom always told me that...i am still looking for my peeps but very aware and eyes open now...i just started watching your videos and as a matter of fact the first one i just watched today was the one about the moms group...I do pray that you find your people...sometimes we just need to let go...🙋♀🤗💚💜🙏
If you feel a calling from God for ministry in groups, and if you have strong leadership skills and VERY thick skin, I would suggest that you pray about it and ask God to guide you to where He want to lead you. Spend time alone with God and ask for guidance. Some people ARE meant to lead and maybe there is a small church that really is in need of group leaders.
@@VMR8648 thank you...i do feel there is a need for a group my age...i just am not a senior nor am i a 20 year old new mom...i feel in-between so you got something there! I will be praying about this.
I have just come across your channel, and listened to 2 of your posts....those friendship groups with preschool children and having no friends. I was an army kid, always moving so made no friends. Quite honestly I have no idea what constitutes friendship. I have made friends but I catch up sometimes. I am not endlessly texting or calling...life is too busy. The last church I was in was similar to what you described...awful group. I gave it a year...11 months too long. I was always sad God has used my pain around (lack of) friendship and toxicity to bring healing, and continues to do so. We created beautiful groups in previous churches.....sharing good values, especially around not gossiping and the tongue. But failed in that last church of wealthy, high achieving women. Currently not in a church but making efforts to see friends, also reaching out to a lonely woman I met recently
I do attend church. I found a new church and am happy there. It did take awhile to find the right church. I experienced a toxic church right after I moved. That's a future video. Thank you for reaching out to a lonely woman. THAT is being the hands and feet of Jesus.
Christian is not synonymous with 'good' . Fortunately I learned this watching the adult women's behaviour when I was a kid . This is sometimes discussed at our house . We think it goes like this - "Oh welcome to our church . I'll find a seat for you right here in the back . Keep your wallet open and if we want your opinion we'll give it to you " .
Ok I’m here having been commenting on your video “Never Again” about best friends. I was glad to hear you mention Paul’s writings. As I listened and prior to hearing that, I was thinking about Romans 8 and 2 Peter 1:3-11. And I thought about something I heard back in the early 90’s about church going, which had risen with the arrival of parents wanting their children to have that … affiliation? Nothing was said about “why” a (Christian) church would be necessary to one’s faith. It was more like a status of “we go to church”. If you look at all the giant “churches” who feed what people want (Paul said those with itching ears), it starts to make sense as to what’s happened to churches, people “professing” (some form of) Christianity and not truly believers in Christ being who He is and what He has done for “all have sinned and come short of the glory of God”. Where the wages of sin is death. (Romans 6). And then there are true Christians who slip and slide all over the place. 👋 yeah, me. Until I truly began to make headway in my faith by studying God’s Word diligently. I will add here that I am back to King James Version after having truly understood “why” the other translations are indeed messed up. Lots of fingers in the pie, so to speak, who altered things by removing one or another thing and thus degrading what was originally said. And that’s a heated topic. I had to work my way through that stuff bc not that long ago I didn’t know “why”. Just heard people blast one another about translations. Anyway, that “is” part of the problem - much bigger than we might realize. Anywho, yes, a Christian should be known by their love and yes, “fruit”. I had a lot of false teaching which blinded me and sent me slipping and sliding. And like you mentioned in the other video, failure to see (God’s) red flags. Or bc of my life - such confusion thinking on my own bc I wasn’t allowed or supposed to do that, according to some close relations. So, being a Christian is instantaneous by believing but it’s a journey, step-by-step and learning what we need to in order to become mature Christians. What I saw at smaller denominations and this huge one - friendliness is sometimes difficult to come by. At the smaller one it was women around my age above and below. It was slow getting into the group. At the other, it was flashy and chatty and kinda wild in beliefs and actions. Whut? It happens. It is very important for the Christian to study the Word and grow and I think then you see original, sincere Christians. I too struggle about friends and church people (from the pulpit to the back row). And there’s so much going on in this world. It’s certainly been changing leaps and bounds in some bad directions. Well, I hope there aren’t typos (I call them textos). I will read through probably and check. But I also hope this is helpful. (KJV) Isaiah 26:3 - Thou wilt keep him in perfect peace, whose mind is stayed on thee: because he trusteth in thee. I was pondering this earlier today. Getting the junk out of my head/life and as Proverbs 3:5-6 says, not leaning on my own understanding… ❤❤❤
You are just a wonderful person. I know how you feel as well! It sounds to me like you would be the BEST women's group leader!! You should find a church you like and see if they need a ladies group leader.
I am saddened to hear of your experience but I admit your not the first I’ve heard this from. I agree; I expect more out of my church family, in that all should be welcomed and cared for, and it’s disappointing when that doesn’t happen. I have a Christian church home, and my experience has been that higher leadership is very Christ-like in word and action, but others have their moments. I do have some very nice, true friends there, which I am glad for. But, I find I don’t go every Sunday like I used to because I am single, never married, and no children, so sometimes I find it difficult. I go when I feel up to it because I don’t want to let others impede my spiritual journey. ❤️🌹🙏🏻
Hebrews 10:24-25 And let us consider how to stir one another up to love and good work, not neglecting to meet together, as is the habit of some, but encouraging one another, and all the more as you see the Day drawing near.
Thank you Amy for this topic. As a Christian I tried church after church in my small town and it was always the same. I went to the church my grandma did at one point and though the people were nice, I never seemed to make close connections. Which is very strange because the pastor and his wife became some of my very good friends. I even remember telling them I don’t like church people and they got it. But it was like in any church I went if you weren’t raised there and had a homeschooling church camp background, you must not be a true believer. I was asked by the pastors wife to do a segment at our local women’s retreat and afterwards a woman who I thought we were friends came up to me and was like oh I didn’t know you read the Bible and thought about God or anything. I was like I’ve been coming here for quite a few years and all this time you thought I wasn’t a true believer? I left. I’m still friends with the pastor and his wife but I just can’t do church people.
I don't especially like some Christians or churches because they all seem to say or preach that you need to forgive bad or abusive treatment from someone right away and keep letting that abuser back into your life and love him/her or you're not a good person/Christian. Well, I'm not willing to 'forgive' abusive behavior right way and let them hurt me again. That idea doesn't even make sense, but plenty of Christians have done that because they think they have to. Crazy!
SImply put, the people in church are shit! Unfortunately a newcomer will let their guard down thinking people would act better than the secular, but it is just the opposite! I have been in the church for 35 years. I have seen pride, jealously, clicks, and judgments made on various criteria. It's a rogue business with the pastor's having no accountability that would be the norm in the business world. I still go to use my talents however I pray each time against the evil that lies within. If you look at Jesus' ministry, he confronted the demons inside the church in many examples. Fact is, we live in the end of the age and in the book of Revelation, only 2 out of 7 churches were not called out for bad behavior.
At 55 years old, l only go to church and stay away from the clicky, judgmental, competitive, gossiping and mean girl attitude events . They never change, but l did. I have enjoyed my solitude and the Bible says thou shalt not covet the neighbor...envy or jealousy brings out the worst in humans.
My grandkids are grown now but when they were in elementary school, I went on most of their field trips with them to assure they were safe. Their stepmom didn’t like for them to go without either me or her being there. Anyway, the parents in my granddaughter’s class were very cliquish. (And it was the same group of parents year after year) One time we went to a place where the parents did not get to eat much with their child due to space. So we had to grab lunch at a restaurant. The group of parents decided where to go but totally ignore me. I ended up going across the street (in a BIG city which is sometimes not so safe) alone to eat. I still don’t know why no one talked to me or ever included me. They were stuck up rich folks I think. The parents in my grandson’s class weren’t like that tho.
Those women are running (and drinking) as fast as they can… to get away from their problems and unhappiness. But it’s not working. Can’t blame you for trying to connect. ❤ Better to make real connections through authentic volunteer work… That’s a Christian value for ya…
❤Iam sad for you that you had a bad church experience. I dont have anything against churches or religion either as I think they can be great experiences for some people. My experience was with my sisters church. My sister was having a lot of problems in her life and with her family but when she went to church she gossiped about me and my life problems that had nothing to with her. I did not attend her church nor had connections with the members. I was very sad when I found out what was happening. Herself and her church friends and her family always put their digs in any ocaissional family events instead of expressing any compassion or concern towards me. It was very cruel and it destroyed the relationship with I had with my sister and we no longer speak. I would caution anyone going to church to avoid gossiping about non church family members. I am not a lesser person for not going to church and also I could not defend myself i my absence.😢
Amy! How dare you expect to find Love and inclusion in a Christian group? That is so old school! Christians today don’t care about that stuff. I’m being sarcastic. Really I’m sorry you went through this tough learning experience and I sincerely hope you find friends worthy of your warm, honest, exceptional character. ❤
As an introvert it is difficult for me to make friends or even want to make friends. I go to church to fulfill the commandment of not forsaking to gather with other brethren. I go in with a servants heart, how can I contribute? I always join in the kitchen work, clean up crew or decorating committee . That is where the good people are 😉. It allows me to feel like I have something to offer the body of Christ and fit in to the family. I don’t go in expecting anything in return. I have made some really great friends despite my own self sabotaging efforts to remain an introvert. It turns out that if you go in with the mindset of loving God and loving your neighbour, God will then bless you with relationships. Always be the person you want to have in your life and you will attract that. If someone doesn’t like me I take a good look in the mirror and ask myself if their is a valid reason for them not to like me( am I the gossip, the one running late, the one changing plans last minute, always asking for something and never repaying the favor, do I talk to much or not enough, do I have poor boundaries???) sometimes it turns out I am the problem. Lol
One time I heard a pastor say that some people are hard to love. So I asked God, “What was wrong with me that I was not loved?” What I heard God answer back to me was, “What was wrong with you was that you were not loved.” Sometimes, we are just the victims.
Yes, churches can be surprisingly cliquey and mean. Back when I was a young mom I tried to get to know the other moms in my church and no one was interested. One woman even told me "I have enough friends." But I also worked full time outside the home so that counted against me with some. I do have a small tribe now.
I find church people are very much about showing off, judging others, networking for their benefit and not really interested in practicing what they preach- hence the title of “hypocrites”. It’s all left me willing to live without religion necessary in my life.
I have some of the best friends I have ever met from church. My church is a Bible believing church not a mega church. Maybe that’s the difference, if you are really following the word of God then friendships won’t be perfect but they will be Godly and supportive.
I've been attending MOPS 3 years now. To be honest, I have not made any close friendships (disappointing), but I *do* get the couple hours of adult conversation, and that's all I can hope for as a stay at home mom lol. These groups can be beneficial and it's all about expectation management. I've resigned myself to most likely not finding lasting friendship or "meaning" at these types of church gatherings.
I found church to be the place with the least vulnerability and genuine connection unless it was under the umbrella of “God saved me from (some horrible struggle) but now I’m amazing, hallelujah!” Start to express any doubt or slightly dark feeling and everybody suddenly gets super uncomfortable. Not to mention being ghosted by them if you don’t go to every activity. It is so cliquey. Church is not a conducive environment for real and deep relationships in my opinion.
Ah church. Where I was both shredded by a Jezebel narc mentor and where the most pain I ever had in my life happened. Idk. But as it goes, it all started with the toxic childhood grooming and later in life I just kept falling for the same kind of bs. Work also. It was like a curse wherever I went. Been working on breaking that off of me for 10 years now and I find myself avoiding church and being alone a lot. First thing that came to mind for me about scripture was the verses about factions such as “I am of Paul” and “I am of Apollo.” So stupid tho. It was more like you can’t sit at our table or you can’t disagree with the toxic leaders. What it felt like to me was so much like my mother. “They love me. They love me not.” There was a lot of favoritism and ostracizing and competition and being denied opportunities Bcuz of envy (in volunteer land). Politics. Pet doctrines and so on. Want to please God yes I do but good grief I feel like Moses did I think. “But….Those people.” I’m not really happy in spiritual no man’s land and also no friends, but idk if I can be happy there either. I also don’t know where to move to. Want to get out of user land here but just don’t know where to go. Everywhere seems like I’m just a misfit and a vagabond and a stranger. Granted I have had some good church experiences but I gotta say that they were quite rare compared to all the crappy ones around. But alas. I finally did learn that labels don’t mean anything. The bigger the Bible and the fish sign, the more some “title” is lauded, the more likely the bigger the wanker hypocrite child of Beelzebub envious, backstabbing Pharisee they prob are. I do also tent to identify with Nathaniel. You know the one that said “(Bah!) Is there anything good in Israel?”
Hello fellow misfit, vagabond, and stranger! I have a suggestion for you, and you're not going to like it. I have found the Jehovah's Witnesses to be very Christian in their teachings and in their friendly congregations.
I noticed the things you mention in protestant churches. I had to leave all that. I’m now Episcopalian. The one I attend have many church events in their own homes. I’ve really enjoyed their own homes, the fancy foods and fancy home environments. They are very educated and I learn a lot from them from their creativity. I’ve been treated well and honored even thought not their social class. They don’t chum around with me in a personal way and I don’t live in their community. So that’s ok. My feelings were hurt during Covid lock down because I’d email them occasionally or call and was dissed and the two times I was called I felt like it was their church assignment. That smarted. But if I’ve emailed them concerning a need or help with something they’ve always obliged. Usually small request like help finding quality spice blends without chemical additives when I had a health issue to the proper way to trim my roses. I just decided to enjoy their delightful homes and use it as a respite from my less than desirable environment. They didn’t clutch their purses or act weird. They treated me nicely and served me with fine crystal, China and real solid silver. What I did do was send beautiful uplifting emails when they had their own crises and they seemed to appreciate it. So perhaps we have to lead by example. Most people are very self absorbed. It’s human nature and people are not observant or paying attention to others at all unless it is their own family or friends they had since first grade. I cure my lonely spells with outings to regular community events where I know people by first names. To have good camaraderie with them I remember to ask out their latest projects or things that pertain to them and make the conversation about them because that’s what everyone wants. Everyone wants to be remembered, noticed, made to feel loved and special. When you do that they then come up to talk to you first when they see you out somewhere and make conversation. If I ever was stranded somewhere or in dire straights they probably would help me. I just don’t ask for help as so far I’ve managed to always find my own way. God usually seems to send a homeless man in a dumpster to change my flat at 11 pm at night. Somehow the help shows up on its own. God thing I guess.
Thanks for sharing your story. I especially like the part where God seems to send a homeless man to change your flat at 11pm at night. Yes, a God thing!
Going to church doesn’t make you a nice person. I’m glad I figured this out at a young age.
Me too!!!
Me too, I had it on good authority. Some church people are only concerned with getting to heaven. Never mind about all that help your fellow man stuff. Some are not even friendly.
Good for you. It took me over 20 years before I finally had to leave. The gossip in church is horrendous. What makes it worse is that they disguise it under the topic of 'prayer requests'.
I didn’t become a Christian until I was 68. I thought the church women were so great. I thought finally I had found some truly nice people. Wow! Nice people on the surface can hurt you the most.
So true! My religious experience growing up was so traumatizing because of how nasty some church people were. They would shame you if you aren't active in the church or have mental health issues. But would turn a blind eye to abusers in the church. I haven't been back to church in 15 years. I do still believe in God but I just don't trust people in the church.
Even though I am not a mom and still single, I grew up in church since birth, and let me tell you, every single word you said is SPOT ON, even for the young people and children. So many groups based on popularity. As an adult now, and having gone through so many rejections because I was so unattractive, I now care more about getting closer to God and hearing His voice, than about the people and their groups. I've had moments when I would weep and ask God why He never gave me any friends or boyfriend, and He spoke very clearly to me and told me it was so that I would draw closer to Him. I'm grateful for that, even though life was so painful for me. Jesus is the only one who will NEVER abandon us or betray us, EVER!!!
Unattractive or like me, not having a great career. People will not even speak with you if you are a made. I got sick of that behavior.
Or like me, by not having a great career. People don't even speak with you if you are not influential. I am a made, that it was heartbreaking to learn you only is good to clean the church, but not be invited for other functions at people's house. Coming from church folks was embarrassing. Life moves on, but it is hard, though.
I’m so sorry you experienced this. May I challenge your reason for being rejected? Was it really bc you were “unattractive”? How do you know this is true? So all “unattractive” ppl are socially rejected, and all attractive ppl are accepted? Sometimes we tell ourselves stories that may not completely be true.❤️🩹
@Runner8617 Amen @Runner8617 I've only been to a couple for long periods of time though. One very large. I loved it because the presence of God wad so strong there. I've grown & do hear him on my own. But a corporate anointing is awesome! As far as friends. I have 1 good friend who has many herself. So I don't get alot of time there. But that's ok. Like you, God wants me alone at this time in my life as well. I also have a mentor, God is very prophetic thru her & I get alot of wisdom from her wkly teachings. I would nit have gotten this far without her. God is good. If you ask him for friends but the right ppl. He will eventually put them in your life. We are bot ment to be alone for ever. We are the body. He made us to work together, sit together & eat together. I know after your experience the thought must not sound good. He will heal your past & give you the right friends! God bless
Hi Runner? ❤ It can be really hard when people are repeatedly not kind 😢😭😡 Maybe you could try out the idea that the way they choose to behave towards you says more about their character than yours? ie it's their personalities that are so unattractive? All the best ❤️ Love Theresa
Finally someone honestly talks about these tabu topics
Well.... as they say " you can park yourself in the garage, but that doesn't make you a car." I quit going to church quite a few years ago. We are living in end times when the church is totally compromised and has let the world come into it. I had so many negative experiences in church and with fellow women and even leaders that I had enough. My faith is in CHRIST and NOT the church. My husband and I do Bible study every Sunday together, watch sermons online and pray together. That is fine with me! By the way, we are both 65!
Thanks for sharing. Take care
Where 2 or more...❤
Thus, church on Sundays, eating pork,,,on and on.. love
your post
@@meleshenko3767 Bless your heart! Prayers!
@@daynapeterson9033 thank you 🙏
I’ve been know to say, “Sometimes the worst advertisement for Christianity is the so-called Christians themselves!” However, I’d never “throw the baby out with the bath water,” because I realize many use church more as a social club, than a place to learn, grow, and mature to be more like Jesus, the ultimate “best friend” who won’t let us down. You are the type of person that I’d totally gravitate to in a group, not the “popular girls.” Thanks for being transparent and vulnerable by sharing your life stories. I’d rather have one or two loyal friends than a group of superficial women. Just keep being your authentic self! 🥰
I would love one or two loyal friends versus a group of superficial women. Thanks for sharing!
I'm 70 now, and have participated in all sorts of girl groups throughout my life, some good some bad--with church "friends" being the most disappointing. Fortunately, my husband is my best friend. 😍
Same
My husband is my best friend to.
All of my 66 years I have been involved in different churches. We moved a lot both growing up and during my married life. So I have much to say about this topic and many sad stories similar to yours. Primarily, I haven't quit going to church, but I DON'T attend any women's group. I will not participate in malicious gossip (prayer request time), listening to the boasting (latest trips, purchases, children's achievements, etc...), fitness activities, denigrating husbands...on and on. Gee, no difference than "worldly" views and behaviors. No thanks, I deal with enough at work. Oh, one other thing, the competitiveness in appearance.
You are right on!
I have a very similar story. I agree. I was a Christian teachers daughter and we moved a lot. I go to church but don’t get involved because of the clique culture, it is not for me.
Wow, this is sad. In a strange way I kind of hoped I was just too weird for church women’s groups, and that other people had better experiences. I now see that my experience is not unique. I never had problems making friends in school but never at church. The only place I was ever bullied was church.
Like you, I still go to church but I stopped going to women’s groups decades ago-especially if it was a church we really liked. I didn’t want to spoil it.
@@lindaburns9762 Unfortunately women's groups not bad if it works out for you. I go to a big church and everyone's spiritual level is different. So I feel like there's not a good conversation because everybody's theological knowledge and spiritual knowledge are different. In a way, if you are in the small or medium church, they all have same beliefs. I never thought much about it until now.
@@eneecie Your last sentence is very powerful. So many people have similar experiences.
I live in a Moslem country as an American Christian-born woman, I find the women open, warm, giving, helpful, and ready to be your friend. Very inclusive. I think it’s the way our culture with its competitive and individualistic bent ruins chances for real friends. Your value only goes as far as what others can get from you. We need to change the culture.
Can’t imagine exchanging my experience of individualism for a non-competitive country. Bet that nation does not have a Peace Corps or agency like USAID by which we aid, heal, teach, and feed the world. Right? Competitive individualism built those. Americans may wonder about friends, but we’ve also made disease, hunger, and ignorance our enemies and competed the hell out of those. If the cost for being who we are collectively makes personal friendship an issue, so be it. Had we not embarked on this path of individualism, neither that Moslem country nor our world at large would be where we are today. We’d all still be lighting candles and carrying water on our heads and burying our children before they’re five. So, yeah. I can stand a lifetime with few, well-chosen friends for the sake of a competitive, individualistic spirit that has changed the world.
@@alainaaugust1932funny, you dont sound like an individual.
Spot on!
For sure @fashehc...
@@alainaaugust1932its gone too far, thats the problem. We are now destroying ourselves from within...
Growing up it was a must to go to church every Sunday, and I waited silently to be over 18 . And as soon as I turned 19 I stopped going to church because my parents behaviour at home didn't match with the way how they behaved outside the home. I pray a lot for myself .
Same story here.
Thank you for posting this Amy. I try so hard not to be bitter, and listening to others talk about their horrible experiences in church sometimes upsets me so much I feel shaky. I no longer go to church and after 20 years, still have terrible memories of some of the things I went through while there. However I have had to admit to myself that a lot of the treatment I received was because I was too naive and trusting and too open with my feelings. I am more guarded now.
Don't blame yourself for being a nice person. I know, because I am the same way. I have to consciously reel back my politeness/ generosity/ overall niceness. It's a very weird world for sure.
This is so sad to hear. What I used to think was “real church” was not real at all. And learning to survive in church is learning to be superficial. We learn to say we are genuine, we hear sermons about it, but we are corrected for being it.
Here’s a hug and a cup of coffee ☕️
I like to think when we get to heaven it will be that simple.
Thank you for your kind comment.
Thanks for sharing. Take care
Yes, it is a very weird world. Take care
Ever since I can remember I was part of a church community. My parents found wonderful friends within the church; most of their friends were found by volunteering within the church. They were part of the council, the prayer chain, and often helped with communion clean up, counting the offerings, Easter breakfast etc. If we were not at church we had people calling to see if we were okay. By doing all the above they found people with similar interests. It was a smaller church too. Then I got married, joined a large church that had a school where I enrolled our kids. I became friends with some of the moms, but really the only thing we had in common were the kids. I didn’t find true friendships there. Now I am 63 years old and am planning on again volunteering at the church. We shall see how it goes. I had two good friends die of cancer, and my other “best friend” has 5 kids and is very involved with her grandkids. After Covid I have found people to be very selfish. I think that is what isolation does. We need more compassion and compromise in this world. Don’t give up on God. Just because people are at church doesn’t mean they are better. We are all sinners. Have faith!
I have found a solid church. It did take me awhile.
At 56 years of age, my life experience has shown me that no matter what you do or look like, other women get threatened and competitive. Women are grown-up mean girls. I flat out refuse to engage in that dynamic. I'm my own best friend. I have friends that are more surface level. I won't open up to another human ever again. People always have an agenda. If they can gain something from me, then they pretend to accept me. Not going to play on that low vibe level.
Thanks for sharing. Take care
100% agree 👍
Oh my goodness. I could have written this myself. Every single word! So much peace knowing others out there feel like me. Continued peace for you!
They want to suck your energy and leave you empty…just say no once and see…
"If they can gain something from me, then they pretend to accept me."
💯💯💯
Once you leave a church most people shun you. Sad, but true. Lots of clicks in a church family. I’ve never fit in a click, praise God for that! My click is my immediate family.
I have serious health issues - in a small village My husband and I had garden parties, dinners and I was very outgoing. I also had to give up a Christian course because I became too ill. Haven’t heard a word of concern or interest from any of them.
I'm so sorry. That's terrible.
So sorry to hear that. Hugs prayers for you.
Sorry you had to go through that. People can be awful. Hope you get well soon. Prayers are with you.
🙏 sorry you suffered that. It’s heartbreaking.
😢😢😢
Thank you for your refreshing honesty. You are a treasure- and remember that great women are fine being alone, and they certainly don’t run in groups. One or two good friends is enough, even if they live far away. The rest are acquaintances.
Thank you so much!
Narcissism and lack of compassion can lead to exclusion. Many of these people don’t care or know what they’re doing- just going after what satisfies them.
I saw your title and had to click on this to see your point of view.
I believe in Jesus and I don’t go to church. I personally struggle with church people a good amount of the time. Not all are so terrible but I often felt weirdly judged.
You tackle some serious topics on your channel. I admire your bravery.
You get a lot of people chatting in comments and this is exciting.
I’ve experienced this clicky part. So sad.
You know your Bible too. This is why I love Jesus because he was welcoming to ALL and some churches seem to forget this.
Let’s keep being US.
Thanks for candid talk Amy❤
Thank you for your comments. I appreciate it.
I used to play guitar in the church band for years and didn't have any close friends. When I felt God telling me to leave that church, no one tried to contact me after I left. Used up and spat out. The story that I think of is Noah and his family. They were the only people that got on the ark. They only had each other. We are living in the last days. Jesus is coming back soon. Matt 24:37-40.
God bless you ❤
Yes! Sad truth. I can validate what you’re saying. The climate in the church has changed. I also see it as climbing on the ark, “Go my people into your Chambers and shut the doors behind you.” Isaiah 20, is it?
Hearts have grown cold. No fruit, only the language remains. God help us.
@@meleshenko3767 Oh wow, that's a good verse too. It really does feel like that. Although we want fellowship.. at what cost. I think at the end of the day, it's mostly the Pastors fault. If they are not teaching and preaching the whole counsel of God, then people in the church are not going to feel convicted of their sins. They need to preach things people don't want to hear. Not just about money and getting rich in this life.
@@rockclimberErin Spot on!! It feels strange, but it’s the sifting. There are so many of us out here. Just pray for others to wake up. God’s blessings to you, friend.
@@meleshenko3767 God bless you too
I live in a culture where religious people are uncommon, but oh man is it easy to spot the few that are! Always mean and holier than thou.
If you don’t mind me asking, where do you live? I would love to live in a place where people mind their own spiritual business.
@@almas2423 Canada
@@chillymilly7005same thoughts here 🦘
@@almas2423move to a more secular part of the US. The majority of people I know don’t go to church.
You just described my mother to the T. She thinks she's saved, sanctified, and Holy because she's active in church. Yet she also thinks it absolves her of accountability for being nasty and shady towards people.
To be happy with others you have to be happy with yourself. When I was young I had one or two close friends, I was never involved in cliques. I lived single for 10 years before being married. I love solitude and I learned how to be happy on my own. We have four children, I homeschool them. I have never felt lonely for friends. I met friends who homeschooled but a lot of socializing can become a distraction to getting work done. We attend Church weekly, I have friends I talk to sometimes, but I absolutely do not need Moms' groups. Honestly I feel like they're a waste of time. I'd rather spend time in prayer, walk, listen to music and spend time with my family.
Thanks for sharing. Take care
I am in my mid sixties now. Since I was a young child I have attended various churches here and there. I was molested by a lay minister while I was underage. Ive been told I had a demon in me (probably because of my red hair - yeah, that was the thought of one preacher). He wanted to put on a show for the congregants and "exercise the demon out of me". He whispered in my ear to fall backwards into the arms of a man when he touched my forehead! I did not comply. Most recently was when the adults were asked to help make the desert scenery for the Bible school skit. A lot of the ladies painted paper Agave plants and other such items. I used different shades of green to make it look real. I received several compliments on my artistry. One woman whom I thought was my friend apparently became jealous and began loudly putting me down. I was hurt, and finished my one agave plant, and left, never to return again. She never apologized or attempted contact again. I dont know why she attacked me. Who needs church or friends like that?
That's so horrible
That was very unfortunate and rude AND weird. We all know that there is a lit of mental illness out there. That person is a prime example of that. Please do not allow that unimportant perdon ruin it for you.
Wow, that’s painful to hear. And you managed to keep your faith? I hope so, friend. The agenda against us is not Christ’s. Bottom line: he’s still nice! But the church is dangerously messed up and not getting better. I’m so so sorry. Hugs
Jealousy. 💔
I’m so glad I found your videos today Amy ! You are so friendly and cheerful. I don’t understand why anyone would be rude to you!
I'm so glad you found my channel. Welcome!
I once heard, "Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any more than standing in a garage makes you a car." I don't know who first said it. Those people are there for show, but the veneer has worn thin and most of us see through them now.
People don't go to church, Christians are the Church. Your analogy needs a bit of tweaking, therefore.
Attending a Christan congregation is rather like opening a garage, only to find it filled with junk. Sometimes you might find the odd car is some of them, but mostly not. The true Christian congregation would need to look more like a dealer's showroom - full of cars and nothing else, but more often than not, these days, the cars that form the church are scattered all about, some parked on roadsides, some in car parks, some in parking bays at home.
I an 57 with a past full of “friendship” created hurts. I’m pretty much at the point where I have no friends for the past ten or so years. I’ve made peace with it and am actually happier and more at peace doing my own thing. My husband, however says that we are lacking community, and we need to find a church so we can “develop relationships” with other believers. While I understand the principle of this, I find that I no longer want to put in the effort to develop friendships, even on a superficial level. It’s all just too much work! We will be moving soon to a new state and his hope is that we will find a neighborhood and a church where we can do things with other people and make friends. I only see this as another potential source of drama and hurt. I’m not sure how to balance my needs with his needs and hopes. Maybe you can talk about the differences in friendship needs in spousal or S/O relationships and how to navigate those differences.
Great future video topic. My husband does not have the need for friends like I do.
This day and time I see most church friendships as superficial like you said. And even in smaller churches where they claim to not have cliques, they do. Church isn’t the same. Years ago in the 80s/90s, while there were some smaller cliques, but not to the point of totally excluding anyone, most people at the church we attended were extremely close. I still have some good friends from that time period but we don’t get to spend time together in person very often. As a 65 year old who is raising 2 adopted grandkids (one from 6 months and the other from birth) (they are now 12 and 14) I feel very lonely as I don’t have in person connections. I miss that.
I’m so sorry this happened to you, I totally understand because I share your story ❤Thanks for sharing and being so honest, we all need a friend like you!
This is what I dealt with. Especially now that I am single, it’s even worse. You go completely unnoticed. Churches are suited for married people with kids. Not singles.
I’ve found that to be true as well.
I agree. When I was in high school, my church was all over me and acting like I hung the moon…even thru my college years. But the day I graduated college and came home, a switch flipped because I wasn’t able to find a great paying job and struggling being poor…and I didn’t date or get married so whenever I stopped by the church on a weekday, they started basically telling me to get lost (I was lonely and wanting human connection and struggling with severe depression). One elder’s wife who was all over me in my high school days wrote me a letter telling me I just needed Jebus and that I need to go fix things with abusive family that I stay away from because they didn’t want to be bothered by me. This same elder took me aside after Wed evening service and told me for an hour that I’m the unloved woman in proverbs and that I cause problems wherever I go and that I don’t need any friends, I just need Jebus. That was the last time I ever set foot in a church again. I don’t even really believe in religion anymore since it’s for those who are coupled up or married with kids.
@ wow that’s just messed up! They groom you to be a baby maker and servant to a man. That’s so wrong and anti biblical. I’m sorry that happened to you. I’m so fed up with it myself.
A lot of churches started creating "20-30+ year old singles groups" because if this, but I don't even go to those, even though I'm single.
@ and that is what I find stupid! Just because I’m single doesn’t mean that I have to be paired up! What if I just want friends? Such discrimination to form singles groups because you need to be put into a category.
AMEN HALLELUJAH, my love, you have spoken the truth😇🤗😀
I enjoyed you video. I have had similar experiences.
I am a quiet person and I dislike cliques and gossip. I like to help out but not engage in gossip and competition. I find it a sort of bullying. In my fifties I’ve found that it’s better to be a loner than to always wonder who’s talking about you behind your back and other nonsense. I’m just over that high school stuff! Thinks for the video.
Same here...gossiping & spreading malicious rumors is so destructive to the person who is not present to defend him/herself...better to exclude yourself from THAT club...PEACE rules. 🌻☮️
I concur ❤
Thanks for sharing. Take care
Growing up in the Bible Belt , I learned some words that raise flags ( after attending w/ an open heart): non-denominational, a little bible study, fellowship etc. Once in, there are pecking orders, negative gossip, judgment & cliques. . Like many older women, who comment on your channel, I have found peace through controlling my space.& time. It’s great you’ve tried! When you have children, it’s natural to wish a community for them, and extend yourself toward that end.
Thanks for sharing. Take care
Thank you so much for talking about this issue as this is sadly in all churches.
I've recently stepped right back from a church and now I'm just reflecting and contemplating at the moment.
I still have my faith in Jesus and funnily enough, I've got to know Him far better by listening to an audio Bible app at home than I ever did in that church.
Will I go back to that church?
No! At least not for now if ever!
Will I consider another church?
I'm looking at another church at the moment...
I can relate to you. I have found a solid church but I visited several awful churches before finding the good church.
Church friends will drop you like a hott potato, if you stop going to Church. I stayed at this church for 20 years even though I had problems. I told my friends I was leaving and I hope we can still be close. I live in a very small town takes 10 minutes to drive to each others houses. They said we will always be friends. Didn’t happen.😢
That's so sad. I'm sorry
Same thing happened here and it hurts to the core. 😢
I'm in my early 60's now and can look back at multiple churches and women's groups I tried to penetrate throughout the years. In my 20's I learned the hard way that I needed to lower my expectations of Christians - male and female. I was high maintenance back then and assumed they would accept me anyway because Christians were supposed to accept people. They didn't.
I learned that great friendships take time to develop. Unfortunately, the dynamics between Christian women can create a false intimacy since the context is personal growth, and a lot of sharing is encouraged. Friendships are rushed in that context and don't get rooted in the right soil. I think good soil is your willingness to open yourself in increments over time, but there's also an element of mystery in the people we choose. Sometimes she's just the right one for reasons you can't explain. Accept her and the season she's in. Support her. Be her safe place. If she's the right one, she'll put roots down in that same soil. If she doesn't, she's not your friend.
Thanks for sharing. Take care
I grew up Evangelical and always attended church with my family as a kid, grew up, went to bible college and continued participating in my local church until age 40 when I stopped going and haven't been back since (almost 9 years ago). I'm single with no kids and I don't think a lot of churches are welcoming to people like me. They seem to cater to families. I got tired of feeling alone in a room full of people so I just left and maintain my own private study and worship. I consider myself part of the global church but don't feel like I belong anywhere locally. 😢
I had a similar experience when I was younger. Churches want the traditional family. As a single person, they do not really recognize you nor welcome you into the congregation…
I know.. It is disgusting how singles are treated. Like people with kids are better somehow. Makes me angry!
At one point in my life when I was a church goer, It struck me how judgmental I was being about something, and I was appalled at myself. I felt quite bad about it. I think I had learned what I had been indoctrinated to believe, and it rubbed off on my attitudes... I didn't like that either. Now, I kept going to church for quite some time after that, and what finally did me in at a rather large church in Redmond, Washington was feeling like a number there. I went to one of their little booths one Sunday to ask about volunteering and I must have stood there for five minutes without being addressed. Needless to say I never went back. I don't go to church anymore because I haven't learned anything new or different that nurtures me in any significant way. I'm tired of the same old message,and I feel like I had to retrain my thinking on certain things that I think the church ruined for me. I agree with others here that if your single with no kids your not really there? Like... what's wrong with you. I have found healthier connections elsewhere.
I’m at the point where I’ve just given up on meeting people through church. It’s just such a self righteous environment with leaders that are usually on a power trip. It’s the farthest thing from being spiritual.
Great topic Amy!! Growing up in church seeing how my mom was treated I knew.
Thanks for watching.Take care
I recently discovered your channel and I enjoy your posts so very much! You have an excellent personality and approach. I find myself saying 'YES!!! That is it exactly. Amy is 100 percent on target!" I find your posts to be grounded, sincere, relatable, and authentic. I wish you continued success, Amy.
Thank you for your kind words. I'm so glad you found my channel.
The Episcopal Church I went to in Portland Oregon was too much manipulation and control behaviors so I didn’t care that they rejected me. The men were nasty and so were the women except for one lady that I liked and she was very kind to me. I’ve been the target of a narcissist who claimed to be my friend only for me to find out what he was doing what’s called character assassination in regards to me. Everything that’s said about what these evil people do is absolutely on point. I had everything done to me including my little dog getting emotionally and physically abused. She passed away a couple years ago and I’m still dealing with it. As for the narcissists that were in my life I moved away went no contact and blocked. Best thing to ever happen. I'm on my healing journey now and it's one day at a time.
Thanks for sharing. Take care
My mother passed away a few years ago, and I had so much trouble with her church folk. They had used her, put her under pressure for doing things for the church she didn't like. They had interfered so much in the funeral it was crazy and felt so self-righteous. I am not in a church and will not attend. I believe in god, and I don't need the kind of people around me.
By the fruit we will know them. We protect our eyes and ears from these UN-Christ like behaviors. We let our own words praise Him and in doing so it shines a light into the darkness. Darkness does not like the light and obviously these ladies are in darkness and probably not even aware of it. Bless you, Carol 🙏
yep
Oh man, I talk about this with my husband all time. We don’t go to church because I don’t find the people “genuinely friendly “. These same people will see you at the grocery store and not wave. Sunday morning they act like you hung the moon.
You are spot on!
One goes to church to honor or Lord and full us with His word.
@@AndreaWanting Honor our Lord and fill us with his word. Correct. It’s difficult when you’re not around kind people.
@kash7585 That is how my prayer life deepened, I focused on our Lord and prayed for them. Difficult, yes. Lonely, yes.
The Church is filled with those with sickness of the soul.
I can relate to what you are saying. When I experienced this behavior myself, I complained to another woman in the church. She responded by telling me that people are like that because when they are in church they are more friendly because they are 'under the anointing''. How ridiculous.
Superficial friendships are underrated. I actually think they are healthier, and what I am seeking from this point on. In the past, people had larger families with siblings and cousins they could confide in and lean on for support. Now, we have to seek those things outside the home, but it just isn't natural.
I went to a church that was very much like that group. I went for a whole year, and my husband said the same thing "why do you go? You come home so miserable?" And I realised that after a whole year I didn't really have any connections to anyone and I felt like an alien 👽. The congregation was full of doctors and lawyers etc and I was a middle class woman who was married, but my husband isn't a Christian so I guess they assumed I was a single person as well. It was awful.
I left there and went to a small country church about 20mins away and it feels so comfortable and it has a great sense of community. Night and day difference!
It baffles me how uncaring/cliquey some churches can be. It's like an exclusive club which is not how it's meant to be.
I'm so glad you found a good church. I have also found a good church but I briefly attended a toxic church - upcoming video topic.
That wasn't a christian group. That was a "networking" hive. We have those big churches here and it's where the upper crust go to network; boost each others kids up the corporate ladder; find jobs; find employees and locate the best housekeeper. 😅😅
100% yessssss
Some of the worst betrayals, terrible leadership, and worldly people I’ve ever witnessed were in churches.
And the more devoted, the more committed they are to that church, the more vicious they can be. If you want a group, look for one where you can give and steadfastly ignore what you do or don’t receive back-like President Carter building houses in Habitat for Humanity. Stacking cans and boxes in the food bank is great. They never talk back.
EXACTLY
Yep! I took a small job, retail. Customers come in and they go out. I have a few minutes to connect, plant seeds of Gospel maybe follow them outside and pray on the sidewalk. But, sad to say, so that I can stay at arms length from people. And they are secular people for the most part. Safe.
@@meleshenko3767 I believe it's insulting for you to tell a captive audience--a customer--that they are lacking something you, with your "small job" have. If I were you, I would be kind to everyone, offer them extra assistance if your boss allows, work extremely hard at your job, and wear a small cross, barely visible, around your neck. In other words, live it, don't TALK it. And the praying outside where the public can see you will not help you spread Christianity, in my opinion. Live it.
@@meleshenko3767 Helping that lady with the house sounds like God's work. "Planting the seed" in the few moments someone is in the store and then praying for them publicly sounds like you working for you. Also "my boss called 200 former customers" to decide whether I should keep my job. And my boss's business has grown since he decided to keep me on. Wow!!
Matthew 6:5-8
Jesus' Teaching on Prayer
5 "And when you pray, you shall not be like the hypocrites. For they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the corners of the streets, that they may be seen by men. Assuredly, I say to you, they have their reward. 6 But you, when you pray, go into your room, and when you have shut your door, pray to your Father who is in the secret place; and your Father who sees in secret will reward you openly. 7 And when you pray, do not use vain repetitions as the heathen do. For they think that they will be heard for their many words. 8 Therefore do not be like them. For your Father knows the things you have need of before you ask Him.
@@TaxTheChurches. Really stop judging and trolling. Not interested.
Dust.
"All the sinners are in the pews " another Rev. Sam McPeek wisdom gem. We actually quit our last church because the minister suddenly died and several "chiefs/queen bees " thought that they were in charge. One Q.B. abusive narcissistic person started in on me after volunteering for a free food pastry, she lied and was gossipy, and influenced others in the church negativity towards me. 😮. Eventually a new minister arrived at the church and I wrote a kindly letter, without naming names (But positively promoting the honest parishioners) explaining why I/my family were leaving. 😢
That's awful. I'm sorry.
I’m scared to go to church now. I see no point because I will not make any connections.
I do attend church. I found a new church and am happy there. It did take awhile to find the right church.
I'm so sorry you had that experience. I am a pastor's wife and it breaks my heart that you had to go through this. I as a pastor's wife do not have hardly any friends either. I tend to stay guarded to reduce heartache.
I have friends (up north) that are both pastors and pastor's wives. It's a unique situation. You never know who you can truly trust. I'm glad you found my channel.
I'm 52, raised in the "church", and quite a few of my birth family members are ministers (the men are, women teach women& kids). So I'm well versed on this subject, and have seen first hand repeatedly how vicious, and ugly supposed women of God can be, and ARE. They're no better than non believers, and it's truly disgusting. I left the "church" many yrs ago, for many reasons, and haven't been back, no interest. Why bother. The majority are self righteous and judgmental, as you described. It's really sad. No wonder non believers don't trust us, or want to be part of us, when we don't, and many times can't, be in that toxic environment. I think it may be a good idea to just start our own small womens groups where ACTIONS are highly regarded, and not just talking the Christian talk. I wish I lived closer to you. You seem like a sweet, genuine, kind person, worthy of healthy Christian women friends.
Thanks for sharing. Take care
I am Christian, a Catholic, and I will tell you that I got involved. I was a Catechism teacher for 5th grade, a Eucharistic minister, a lector, the teen youth group, helped with the decorations committee, and finally, I got involved in the music ministry. This is where I found my people. But the more I was involved the more people I met in a 1500 family parish and they knew me, it felt more like home. I’m not sure why you kept getting involved in “mom” groups.
Now, I don’t know evangelical churches except that they are more entertainment and Bible teaching, mostly gospel or New Testament teaching. But, I have been in a Lutheran Bible group that was clickish. It wasn’t for me. I never bad mouthed them or gossiped about them though.
In the Catholic Church I didn’t experience this. I found that I made the most friends in music ministry because I was a singer and I’m a flutist and harpist, so being a musician was something I had in common. We would go out to dinner after mass, and we hung out together making music. I think the best way to find friends is to get involved in volunteering until you find your niche. But one thing I will say is that I see a pattern of negativity and gossip about these people. If they find you on;one that will hurt your chances at making friends as well.
Thanks for sharing. Take care
I knew this Christian woman for ten years and we were friends.All the hallmarks of toxicity was there. She would never come to me, I would have to come to her. The friendship ended when I met someone and was ready to settle down. She invited me over to her place, as she had just given birth. (she moved to a different state) and I bought my new then “boyfriend” along and she made him sleep in the living room because, we weren’t married, so we couldn’t stay in the same room. Given, this woman used to date older men for money (Please note, the last statement is not meant to sound jaded) it is what it is. This is my experience with Christian women
Thanks for sharing. Take care
God doesn't need tithes. God respects those who make decisions on their own, even if it means they must learn from their mistakes. God is everywhere in our daily lives. He is within us, a true guiding hand, and being within us we should be our own best friend. Be open to his love, and you will love yourself. Respect him and respect yourself.❤
Really enjoying your videos- they were just randomly suggested by YT on a morning home with my kiddos today. I have to say, between this video and the mom groups one, we may have the same life 😂 I went into Christian circles feeling so confident and expectant that I’d be forming lifelong bonds of sisterhood- only to find they have been more disappointing than my secular friendship experiences! I give up. I can’t crack the friendship code. Just living for Him and open to whatever He has for me….
We do sound so similar! I can't crack the friendship code.
Facebook has RUINED going to church. The Noise in churches makes it almost impossible to hear the sermon. People used to take their babies to the nursery so that the congregation could hear the sermon it is just not the same church going experience as 50 yrs ago. The church auditorium or sanctuary as is referred to by some used to be a place you could go before church started and meditate on God's word and no one was talking it was Quite.
If someone had to talk they stood outside or in the foyer or the nursery. We have a fellowship hall where if you have to talk you should go there to have your conversations.
Worship Service is to give Worship to the most high God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit. People have made church a social Social Gathering instead if a Worship Service. Jesus is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow. People have changed things, but God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit have not. How are the Spiritually sick supposed to be fed if you can't hear the Sermon due to all the Noise?
Thanks for sharing this Amy, I’m an atheist myself but yeah the one thing I don’t get about religious people is their lack of empathy kindness and compassion towards others, not all of course, but you’ve only to see what its doing to your country especially they way things are going at the moment, anyway it’s very sad, love your videos 👍Eileen from Ireland 🇮🇪💚💚💚💚
I have been to many different churches and womens groups. I went there to find a safe community to be a part of. I was really surprised to find so many narcissists, jezebels and noone spoke about Jesus. I dont go to church or church groups anymore.
I met the most judgemental humans in church. There are a few gems but overall, in my experience it was a toxic environment.
I do attend church. I found a new church and am happy there. It did take awhile to find the right church. I encountered some toxic churches until I found my current church.
@amybrownmidlife that's wonderful!
I knew a family where the parents went to church every sunday without fail.... they show their niceness to the outside world but behind closed doors at their home, its a totally different story... most of us found this out, they are also very judgemental...
❤New sub❤ i'm not a really religious person, but even when I did go I never found God in church found him in the people.
And the situations you find yourself in.
I'm so glad you found my channel. Take care
I learnt about 'church people ' mostly Born Again Christians btw. I am an Anglican so its not like I'm jaded against Christians.
I run a business and I was opening my first Shop. I sent out an invite to just a few people, 2 of them were Born again Christians.
It really shocked me that the other non Christians did come to support my venture, but these 2 'supportive' Christians did not bother to turn up, after telling me they would!
That's awful that these people didn't show up to support you after telling you they would.
Wow Amy. I’m surprised by your topics! You’re quite enlightened.
I choose not to be in a religion so much as I choose to be spiritual. I was baptized catholic, receiving most of the churches sacraments, the last being marriage. I had chosen to excommunicate myself from the church and, frankly, all organized religion simply out of disillusionment. I find “religious” people to be most judgmental and hypocritical than agnostics and atheists. And, as I matured, I discovered marriage, in the traditional sense, no longer resonated with my core values. I learned to respect myself and in doing so am learning how to love myself..I said “learning” because I’m still trying to understand it without feeling arrogant. Today, I find joy knowing the spirit inside me wants what is best for each of us, as individuals. I learn so much more about people when there are no religious barriers. Thank you for listening. ~Nine
Relatable ❤
Yo igualmente bautizada católica y me salí de esa institución que deja mucho que desear. Me gusta la ciencia y la psicología pero no las religiones.
I totally agree. "Religous ppl" are like pharisees. They can relight the Bible & know the traditions. Buy aren't really Christian. Being Christian "christ like" you truly get transformed by God & want to serve him & become obedient to God. Walk in the steps he has for you. I have just a few very close woman from my church as well. But I didn't go to church looking for friends. I was seeking the lord. When you seek God 1st & pray for the right ppl to be put in your life! He is faithful and will do that. God is so good! Not ppl. Without God we are all messes up!
I agree about 'religious' people being really judgmental and hypocritical, much more so than agnostics. I"m spiritual also. I agree, I learn a lot about people and enjoy being with people when religion or their Bible doesn't come up. I don't especially like being around most Christians.
@@VanessaWasham When you said ''relight' did you mean 'recite'? Just trying to understand your post.
Yep! This is why I worship on my own. I love people but I am incapable of having superficial relationships. And many people are not authentic in their walk. The best connection I ever had with people was in celebrate recovery. People were in a rock bottom place in their lives, felt like outcasts in society and in their lives, fighting some sort of addiction or struggle and admitting this and they were raw and vulnerable and honest. I loved hearing their testimonies and felt uplifted by that. Try a CR women’s group. That to me is true church.
I love this already
I was looking forward to this!! 💕
I'm so glad! I'll be making more videos on this topic.
This is a great topic. I left a church that didn’t care about the poor or widows, and I run into some of the women and they give me dirty looks.
Most have been women who do not have Christian love.
Awful!
As a pastor's wife, I was taught and learned very early not to have friends in the congregation. It was wise advice on many levels. I am everyone's friend and confidant, but Jesus is mine. I enjoy being a pastor's wife much more this way.
I'm doing a future video about this very topic. I have many pastor friends (in other states) and they have been betrayed many times. It's awful.
@@amybrownmidlifeI'm very much looking forward to this video.
This is why a lot of us older guys do our own thing . We cant be bothered with the head trouble.
MGTOW.
I enjoyed your talk. I too feel disconnected from the people that I worship with. I really love our priest, who lives his gospel not just preaches it. I go to church to hear the word preached and interpreted. It reinforces my faith.
I attend church also but it's hard finding a church with kind people.
You should see the comedy series Flea Bag about a secular woman who falls in love with a priest. It’s The Thorn Birds meets I Love Lucy.
Look at the light colored wall in the video. See the blue and yellow.? So awesome.
Thank you Amy for this video, I went through something similar and felt so alone.
Glad it was helpful!
Ouch. I am a Christian and it hurts me to read of all these negative experiences on this thread. Please don't give up on learning & practicing your faith. Keep Church shopping until you find one that you are confortable in. Don't give up. No Church is perfect as it is filled with fallen men & women, ourselves included.
The people you were talking to probably already know that. We know to keep trying. We know to hold out hope for God’s people. We know that no one is perfect.
I have been involved in the church 40 years, but for the last 20, I’ve lived in a city, where I am absolutely unable to find one. They are so unfriendly, no exaggeration! I look for the kindest, most loving spiritual group - only to find out it’s a façade. They have, for instance, a small group, that studies, Israel, and I ask “may I attend“ and the person looks across the room to another person, they both look me up and down and judge me and the answer is “no.“ No explanation no reason. They all ask for your phone number the first time you go and no one ever calls. I am sadly convinced they simply want to know what neighborhood you live in, how you have money, how much do you have, what can you do for the church. No one ever cares if you have a need, or you’re lonely. And the truth is my friend, in the last days, the hearts of many will grow cold. And there are actually places in the world where no good group can be found. There’s a church on every corner so to speak, and they know how to dress the part, and talk the part, but there is no fruit. I’ve given so much grace and wiggle room. But I honestly will not go anymore. I have searched this town from one end to the other. I had a breakdown not long ago, crippling, anxiety, and depression. There was no one to call. So I went to a doctor and she asked me “what about going to church“ and I just said “church people are mean.” This doctor was an unbeliever, but she laughed, and she sat with me and watched my blood pressure for two hours. Debating whether to send me to the hospital. I had a two hour panic attack which isn’t even possible according to some. But I lived like that for three years. And that doctor was the kindest person I have met in the city. I have found that secular people are kinder than church people anymore. How sad is that? Come Lord Jesus.
Well.... I am 65 and I have "shopped around" until we have been disappointed in every church for miles around. It was useless.
Have you ever been through a divorce while in church? Are you very physically attractive? Things like this make it very hard for people in church to befriend you.
Why do so many Christians want to validate their sinful behavior and the terrible way they treat people with “nobody’s perfect” and “we are all just fallen”. That’s that Christianese you have been taught to tell people who you’ve hurt and been awful to. Own up to your sin instead of making a damn excuse! Disgusting!!
I have heard this advice a lot. God is everywhere. I don’t need to attend church to be close to God.
In a prayer meeting a fellow believer mentioned that despite how I look (he thought I was ugly) he still loves me. I've learned that some Christians have a certain 'edge' to their behavior that I've had to guard against. But that's true with people in general. We're a fallen race.
So sorry you had to listen to that. That was uncalled for.
Wow! That is so disrespectful. I'm so sorry he said that to you.
My experience with church women, simple I rarely do. As Christian women this is how our relationships should be prioritized: God, husband, children, family (I would include strong like minded Christians in this category), and friends. Sadly, too many Christians fall into the trap of worldview of which relationships are more important.
I was a soloist for several years in church. Then a new music minister arrived and told me he didn’t need me but I could join the choir if I wanted to. 🙄 I quit the entire church because he was a phony. His wife couldn’t sing but they replaced me with her. After 1 1/2 years he was fired. Doesn’t take me long to discern a nasty person.
Thanks for sharing. Take care
I was thinking of going to a church group...glad i am watching this video... no matter if you go to church or not...we should always treat others The way we want to be treated...my mom always told me that...i am still looking for my peeps but very aware and eyes open now...i just started watching your videos and as a matter of fact the first one i just watched today was the one about the moms group...I do pray that you find your people...sometimes we just need to let go...🙋♀🤗💚💜🙏
If you feel a calling from God for ministry in groups, and if you have strong leadership skills and VERY thick skin, I would suggest that you pray about it and ask God to guide you to where He want to lead you. Spend time alone with God and ask for guidance. Some people ARE meant to lead and maybe there is a small church that really is in need of group leaders.
@@VMR8648 thank you...i do feel there is a need for a group my age...i just am not a senior nor am i a 20 year old new mom...i feel in-between so you got something there! I will be praying about this.
Wise words - sometimes we just need to let go.
I have just come across your channel, and listened to 2 of your posts....those friendship groups with preschool children and having no friends.
I was an army kid, always moving so made no friends. Quite honestly I have no idea what constitutes friendship. I have made friends but I catch up sometimes. I am not endlessly texting or calling...life is too busy.
The last church I was in was similar to what you described...awful group. I gave it a year...11 months too long. I was always sad
God has used my pain around (lack of) friendship and toxicity to bring healing, and continues to do so.
We created beautiful groups in previous churches.....sharing good values, especially around not gossiping and the tongue. But failed in that last church of wealthy, high achieving women. Currently not in a church but making efforts to see friends, also reaching out to a lonely woman I met recently
I do attend church. I found a new church and am happy there. It did take awhile to find the right church. I experienced a toxic church right after I moved. That's a future video. Thank you for reaching out to a lonely woman. THAT is being the hands and feet of Jesus.
Christian is not synonymous with 'good' . Fortunately I learned this watching the adult women's behaviour when I was a kid . This is sometimes discussed at our house . We think it goes like this - "Oh welcome to our church . I'll find a seat for you right here in the back . Keep your wallet open and if we want your opinion we'll give it to you " .
Great summary 😂.
Ok I’m here having been commenting on your video “Never Again” about best friends.
I was glad to hear you mention Paul’s writings. As I listened and prior to hearing that, I was thinking about Romans 8 and 2 Peter 1:3-11.
And I thought about something I heard back in the early 90’s about church going, which had risen with the arrival of parents wanting their children to have that … affiliation? Nothing was said about “why” a (Christian) church would be necessary to one’s faith. It was more like a status of “we go to church”.
If you look at all the giant “churches” who feed what people want (Paul said those with itching ears), it starts to make sense as to what’s happened to churches, people “professing” (some form of) Christianity and not truly believers in Christ being who He is and what He has done for “all have sinned and come short of the glory of God”. Where the wages of sin is death. (Romans 6).
And then there are true Christians who slip and slide all over the place. 👋 yeah, me. Until I truly began to make headway in my faith by studying God’s Word diligently. I will add here that I am back to King James Version after having truly understood “why” the other translations are indeed messed up. Lots of fingers in the pie, so to speak, who altered things by removing one or another thing and thus degrading what was originally said. And that’s a heated topic. I had to work my way through that stuff bc not that long ago I didn’t know “why”. Just heard people blast one another about translations. Anyway, that “is” part of the problem - much bigger than we might realize.
Anywho, yes, a Christian should be known by their love and yes, “fruit”.
I had a lot of false teaching which blinded me and sent me slipping and sliding. And like you mentioned in the other video, failure to see (God’s) red flags. Or bc of my life - such confusion thinking on my own bc I wasn’t allowed or supposed to do that, according to some close relations.
So, being a Christian is instantaneous by believing but it’s a journey, step-by-step and learning what we need to in order to become mature Christians.
What I saw at smaller denominations and this huge one - friendliness is sometimes difficult to come by. At the smaller one it was women around my age above and below. It was slow getting into the group. At the other, it was flashy and chatty and kinda wild in beliefs and actions. Whut? It happens.
It is very important for the Christian to study the Word and grow and I think then you see original, sincere Christians.
I too struggle about friends and church people (from the pulpit to the back row). And there’s so much going on in this world. It’s certainly been changing leaps and bounds in some bad directions.
Well, I hope there aren’t typos (I call them textos). I will read through probably and check. But I also hope this is helpful.
(KJV) Isaiah 26:3 - Thou wilt keep him in perfect peace, whose mind is stayed on thee: because he trusteth in thee.
I was pondering this earlier today. Getting the junk out of my head/life and as Proverbs 3:5-6 says, not leaning on my own understanding…
❤❤❤
Thanks for sharing. Take care
You are just a wonderful person. I know how you feel as well! It sounds to me like you would be the BEST women's group leader!! You should find a church you like and see if they need a ladies group leader.
Luckily, I have found a good church where I am involved but I had to visit some awful churches first.
I am saddened to hear of your experience but I admit your not the first I’ve heard this from. I agree; I expect more out of my church family, in that all should be welcomed and cared for, and it’s disappointing when that doesn’t happen. I have a Christian church home, and my experience has been that higher leadership is very Christ-like in word and action, but others have their moments. I do have some very nice, true friends there, which I am glad for. But, I find I don’t go every Sunday like I used to because I am single, never married, and no children, so sometimes I find it difficult. I go when I feel up to it because I don’t want to let others impede my spiritual journey. ❤️🌹🙏🏻
Thanks for sharing. Take care
Hebrews 10:24-25 And let us consider how to stir one another up to love and good work, not neglecting to meet together, as is the habit of some, but encouraging one another, and all the more as you see the Day drawing near.
You should listen to your gut feeling. Thats what its there for!❤
Thank you Amy for this topic. As a Christian I tried church after church in my small town and it was always the same. I went to the church my grandma did at one point and though the people were nice, I never seemed to make close connections. Which is very strange because the pastor and his wife became some of my very good friends. I even remember telling them I don’t like church people and they got it. But it was like in any church I went if you weren’t raised there and had a homeschooling church camp background, you must not be a true believer. I was asked by the pastors wife to do a segment at our local women’s retreat and afterwards a woman who I thought we were friends came up to me and was like oh I didn’t know you read the Bible and thought about God or anything. I was like I’ve been coming here for quite a few years and all this time you thought I wasn’t a true believer? I left. I’m still friends with the pastor and his wife but I just can’t do church people.
What an awful thing that person said to you. Ugh!
I don't especially like some Christians or churches because they all seem to say or preach that you need to forgive bad or abusive treatment from someone right away and keep letting that abuser back into your life and love him/her or you're not a good person/Christian. Well, I'm not willing to 'forgive' abusive behavior right way and let them hurt me again. That idea doesn't even make sense, but plenty of Christians have done that because they think they have to. Crazy!
SImply put, the people in church are shit! Unfortunately a newcomer will let their guard down thinking people would act better than the secular, but it is just the opposite! I have been in the church for 35 years. I have seen pride, jealously, clicks, and judgments made on various criteria. It's a rogue business with the pastor's having no accountability that would be the norm in the business world. I still go to use my talents however I pray each time against the evil that lies within. If you look at Jesus' ministry, he confronted the demons inside the church in many examples. Fact is, we live in the end of the age and in the book of Revelation, only 2 out of 7 churches were not called out for bad behavior.
Wise words! Thanks for sharing
At 55 years old, l only go to church and stay away from the clicky, judgmental, competitive, gossiping and mean girl attitude events . They never change, but l did. I have enjoyed my solitude and the Bible says thou shalt not covet the neighbor...envy or jealousy brings out the worst in humans.
My grandkids are grown now but when they were in elementary school, I went on most of their field trips with them to assure they were safe. Their stepmom didn’t like for them to go without either me or her being there.
Anyway, the parents in my granddaughter’s class were very cliquish. (And it was the same group of parents year after year)
One time we went to a place where the parents did not get to eat much with their child due to space. So we had to grab lunch at a restaurant. The group of parents decided where to go but totally ignore me. I ended up going across the street (in a BIG city which is sometimes not so safe) alone to eat. I still don’t know why no one talked to me or ever included me. They were stuck up rich folks I think. The parents in my grandson’s class weren’t like that tho.
Those women are running (and drinking) as fast as they can… to get away from their problems and unhappiness. But it’s not working. Can’t blame you for trying to connect. ❤ Better to make real connections through authentic volunteer work… That’s a Christian value for ya…
❤Iam sad for you that you had a bad church experience. I dont have anything against churches or religion either as I think they can be great experiences for some people. My experience was with my sisters church. My sister was having a lot of problems in her life and with her family but when she went to church she gossiped about me and my life problems that had nothing to with her. I did not attend her church nor had connections with the members. I was very sad when I found out what was happening. Herself and her church friends and her family always put their digs in any ocaissional family events instead of expressing any compassion or concern towards me. It was very cruel and it destroyed the relationship with I had with my sister and we no longer speak. I would caution anyone going to church to avoid gossiping about non church family members. I am not a lesser person for not going to church and also I could not defend myself i my absence.😢
There is fitting in and then there is belonging. I don't fit or belong. And I'm good with that. I am comfortable with my beliefs.
Amy! How dare you expect to find Love and inclusion in a Christian group? That is so old school! Christians today don’t care about that stuff. I’m being sarcastic. Really I’m sorry you went through this tough learning experience and I sincerely hope you find friends worthy of your warm, honest, exceptional character. ❤
Yes, old school for sure!
How kind of you. My sentiments exactly.
As an introvert it is difficult for me to make friends or even want to make friends. I go to church to fulfill the commandment of not forsaking to gather with other brethren. I go in with a servants heart, how can I contribute? I always join in the kitchen work, clean up crew or decorating committee . That is where the good people are 😉. It allows me to feel like I have something to offer the body of Christ and fit in to the family. I don’t go in expecting anything in return. I have made some really great friends despite my own self sabotaging efforts to remain an introvert. It turns out that if you go in with the mindset of loving God and loving your neighbour, God will then bless you with relationships. Always be the person you want to have in your life and you will attract that. If someone doesn’t like me I take a good look in the mirror and ask myself if their is a valid reason for them not to like me( am I the gossip, the one running late, the one changing plans last minute, always asking for something and never repaying the favor, do I talk to much or not enough, do I have poor boundaries???) sometimes it turns out I am the problem. Lol
One time I heard a pastor say that some people are hard to love. So I asked God, “What was wrong with me that I was not loved?” What I heard God answer back to me was, “What was wrong with you was that you were not loved.” Sometimes, we are just the victims.
When you said “self sabotage efforts to remain an introvert” I was like “that’s what I do!” Related to everything you said!
Valid point!
Your words are so powerful. Sometimes, we are just the victims.
Yes, churches can be surprisingly cliquey and mean. Back when I was a young mom I tried to get to know the other moms in my church and no one was interested. One woman even told me "I have enough friends." But I also worked full time outside the home so that counted against me with some. I do have a small tribe now.
Does anyone have enough friends? Who says that? smh
I find church people are very much about showing off, judging others, networking for their benefit and not really interested in practicing what they preach- hence the title of “hypocrites”. It’s all left me willing to live without religion necessary in my life.
I have some of the best friends I have ever met from church. My church is a Bible believing church not a mega church. Maybe that’s the difference, if you are really following the word of God then friendships won’t be perfect but they will be Godly and supportive.
I've been attending MOPS 3 years now. To be honest, I have not made any close friendships (disappointing), but I *do* get the couple hours of adult conversation, and that's all I can hope for as a stay at home mom lol. These groups can be beneficial and it's all about expectation management. I've resigned myself to most likely not finding lasting friendship or "meaning" at these types of church gatherings.
That's a healthy perspective.
I found church to be the place with the least vulnerability and genuine connection unless it was under the umbrella of “God saved me from (some horrible struggle) but now I’m amazing, hallelujah!” Start to express any doubt or slightly dark feeling and everybody suddenly gets super uncomfortable. Not to mention being ghosted by them if you don’t go to every activity. It is so cliquey. Church is not a conducive environment for real and deep relationships in my opinion.
Agreed
Ah church. Where I was both shredded by a Jezebel narc mentor and where the most pain I ever had in my life happened. Idk. But as it goes, it all started with the toxic childhood grooming and later in life I just kept falling for the same kind of bs. Work also. It was like a curse wherever I went. Been working on breaking that off of me for 10 years now and I find myself avoiding church and being alone a lot.
First thing that came to mind for me about scripture was the verses about factions such as “I am of Paul” and “I am of Apollo.” So stupid tho. It was more like you can’t sit at our table or you can’t disagree with the toxic leaders. What it felt like to me was so much like my mother. “They love me. They love me not.” There was a lot of favoritism and ostracizing and competition and being denied opportunities Bcuz of envy (in volunteer land). Politics. Pet doctrines and so on. Want to please God yes I do but good grief I feel like Moses did I think. “But….Those people.” I’m not really happy in spiritual no man’s land and also no friends, but idk if I can be happy there either. I also don’t know where to move to. Want to get out of user land here but just don’t know where to go. Everywhere seems like I’m just a misfit and a vagabond and a stranger.
Granted I have had some good church experiences but I gotta say that they were quite rare compared to all the crappy ones around. But alas. I finally did learn that labels don’t mean anything. The bigger the Bible and the fish sign, the more some “title” is lauded, the more likely the bigger the wanker hypocrite child of Beelzebub envious, backstabbing Pharisee they prob are. I do also tent to identify with Nathaniel. You know the one that said “(Bah!) Is there anything good in Israel?”
Hello fellow misfit, vagabond, and stranger! I have a suggestion for you, and you're not going to like it. I have found the Jehovah's Witnesses to be very Christian in their teachings and in their friendly congregations.
Thanks for sharing. Take care
I noticed the things you mention in protestant churches. I had to leave all that. I’m now Episcopalian. The one I attend have many church events in their own homes. I’ve really enjoyed their own homes, the fancy foods and fancy home environments. They are very educated and I learn a lot from them from their creativity. I’ve been treated well and honored even thought not their social class. They don’t chum around with me in a personal way and I don’t live in their community. So that’s ok. My feelings were hurt during Covid lock down because I’d email them occasionally or call and was dissed and the two times I was called I felt like it was their church assignment. That smarted. But if I’ve emailed them concerning a need or help with something they’ve always obliged. Usually small request like help finding quality spice blends without chemical additives when I had a health issue to the proper way to trim my roses. I just decided to enjoy their delightful homes and use it as a respite from my less than desirable environment. They didn’t clutch their purses or act weird. They treated me nicely and served me with fine crystal, China and real solid silver. What I did do was send beautiful uplifting emails when they had their own crises and they seemed to appreciate it. So perhaps we have to lead by example. Most people are very self absorbed. It’s human nature and people are not observant or paying attention to others at all unless it is their own family or friends they had since first grade. I cure my lonely spells with outings to regular community events where I know people by first names. To have good camaraderie with them I remember to ask out their latest projects or things that pertain to them and make the conversation about them because that’s what everyone wants. Everyone wants to be remembered, noticed, made to feel loved and special. When you do that they then come up to talk to you first when they see you out somewhere and make conversation. If I ever was stranded somewhere or in dire straights they probably would help me. I just don’t ask for help as so far I’ve managed to always find my own way. God usually seems to send a homeless man in a dumpster to change my flat at 11 pm at night. Somehow the help shows up on its own. God thing I guess.
Thanks for sharing your story. I especially like the part where God seems to send a homeless man to change your flat at 11pm at night. Yes, a God thing!